>> good evening and welcome to ayman. tonight the chaos calls. house republicans are days away from causing and unnecessary and avoidable government shutdown. and breaking news around house majority leader kevin mccarthy, who is now threatening members of his own party. plus, pitiful priorities. i'll speak with congressman jimmy gomez of the house oversight committee as the gop focus is on impeachment instead of keeping the government open. and later on, new obstruction allegations.

will the former aide says donald trump told her just as a classified documents investigation was heating up. i'm charles coleman jr, in for ayman mohyeldin. let's get started, we've got a lot to talk about. but first, breaking news. time is running out with just seven days away from a government shutdown. most house republicans or nowhere to be found. literally. they have left washington to go home with no resolution insight. on thursday, for the second time this week, house republicans failed to stop debate on a bill to fund the defense department after five far-right members of speaker mccarthy's own caucus blocked the measure and demand additional spending cuts. this marks yet another embarrassing moment for mccarthy, with the defeated theory telling members to go home, canceling all votes for the weekend. on friday, mccarthy told reporters that the next bullet could be held on tuesday. this time to take up a rule of

a series of appropriations known as a mini bus. he says they believe they have made problems with the conservative holdouts, but with this kind of optimism from the speaker before and look towards darkness. pretty much nowhere. breaking news, a few hours ago, we got word that house republicans have a conference what call were mccarthy told ha-lers and his caucus that, quote, now is not the time to work against him. ll, when? is four weeks, house republicans have been infighting, and that infighting has parallels, rather, paralyzed, the house. preventing them from pausing the short term funding bill which is necessary to get the government's doors open beyond september 30th when the funding is set to run out. this looming shutdown has most americans on edge. in fact, according to a new survey, more than half of americans say the shutdown of the federal government would affect them personally. and 68% of those say the threat

of a government shutdown decreases their trust in how we run our government institutions. this isn't a question who will be the responsibility for that lost trust. as bill scheer points out and a new piece from washington monthly, if the gop fails to avoid a shutdown, they'll be, quote, we are in the proverbial don's cap. ch he goes on to, right, quote there should be no confusion about who is to blame. the republican extremists who are okay with furloughing made inspectors and the speaker, too afraid of losing his job to put them in the replay swiftly. and quote. but don't just take his work for it. here is what republican congressman and bastion of civility matt gaetz told reporters this week, pending a shut down on one man and one man alone. quote, we will have a government shutdown and it's absolutely speaker mccarthy's fault. we cannot blame joe biden for not haven't moved our

individual spending bills. we cannot blame house democrats. we can't even blame chuck schumer in the senate. and quote. now if you're like me, you probably didn't have occurring with matt gaetz on your weekly bingo card. trust me. i'm just as surprised as anyone out there. but the truth is the truth. and with that, let's get started with our sights a donut panel. joining me is kurt bardella, democratic religious. also a former spokesperson for republicans on the house oversight committee. in studio, i have danny cevallos, my friend, criminal defense attorney, and msnbc legal analyst and paola ramos, a journalist and msnbc contributor joins us as well. to begin, kurt, let's talk. mccarthy can't even get his own caucus together to pass a procedural vote. we saw that this week. now since 1995, the house has only failed to pass a rules resolution a total of eight

times. all of those times or under republican control. now three of those times have come just within the last eight months under mccarthy's leadership. why does he keep embarrassing himself publicly like this? >> yeah, charles, this is republicans in disarray all over again. and it's a script we're becoming all too familiar with. and i think if anything, i hope this makes everybody appreciate the leadership that nancy pelosi demonstrates when she was facing a very similar narrow margins in her majority, was able to ship right through monumental election time and time again. she was able to keep her caucus and won because she possessed legitimate leadership skills. kevin mccarthy is a leader and speaker in name only. he's not in charge of this caucus, they run roughshod over him. he's created a tournament result of the most extreme, lunatic, fringe, conspiracy driven more runs in his caucus to type the entire effect of

the floor of the house of representatives. that's one of the most abject failures of leadership we are ever seen in the history of the united states congress. i can't imagine other republicans back in the day, people like tom delay, people even like newt gingrich pushing up with this type of insubordination, lunacy, and strategic moronic playbook that the matt gaetz's of the world are trying to play. it's a losing hand, everyone knows it. mccarthy's illusion speak right. now asked the question, how much longer as you can if you are malcolm self to be limited -- >> good point. hard to me i mentioned to imagine a new drug which went house that we have this level of insubordination from his own party, no less. i'll give you a cultural tip. it certainly basis you may hear, intellectuals for example, someone saying everything is a setup for a come back. what it seems like in the case of kevin mccarthy, his election as speaker was just a set up for a fall back.

paola, it's the chaos a side effect of how he came to power? is at the fact he's beholden to too many masters, in essence, and can't really correct a hold of his party and move forward? >> of course. at the end of the day, this is his doing. but i think it's important, to kurt's point, he's missing some of the most fundamental characteristics that nancy pelosi had. that was courage, integrity, which he doesn't have. and morals. he has a lot of. that he wants to govern, if you want to be speaker of the house, if he wants to really lean into the power that roll necessary tights, you need these characteristics. the only reason we are we are is because he emboldened the maga republicans. he gave him that power, why? because he himself went to power. he doesn't even have power. he doesn't have power when he's at the top of the power structure. again, how long can we go with this? at the end of the day, it's not

just the american people that will suffer from this. it's also our democracy. what we are seeing truly is the slow decline of the erosion of this democracy. ask any american right now, two in ten americans right now actually believes the american government is doing the right thing. that is a very dangerous thing. >> danny, i want to talk to you about what seems to be the most placed focus of republicans. this week we had merrick garland and others testify in front of a house committee basically around this gearing up for the impeachment conversation. that hearing was wrought with a lot of misinformation, and that's something that has been peddled throughout the party. and one of the things that the shutdown is the notion that somehow, if we pull the plug unfortunately government, that's going to defund or stop the prosecution by the doj of donald trump in d.c. and southern florida. can you speak to that? a lot of people are confused and don't know what the effect,

if any, will be. >> even if it's a total government shutdown, the criminal courts and the government, by government i made the u.s. attorneys and the eighth usa who are prosecuting cases, those continue. the government shutdown shuts down nonessential work. that has been for sometime now considered essential work of the government, to continue precedent criminals. and you can imagine, charles, what it would be like if that was an area or an agency that did shut down. if doj and fbi and everyone else, it we'll, government shut down, we are not working. imagine if the bureau of persons simply didn't come to work. there are folks living at those facilities. so they have to move on. there are essential workers, certainly for a long time, criminal prosecution has been concerted within that essentially kind of work. that goes on no matter what shutdown happens. so that means, at least in the two federal prosecutions of donald trump, this will

continue. shut down, partial done, no shutdown at all. >> thank you. kurt, i want your reaction to the survey i was just talking about. more than half of the market has issued from a federal government would affect him personally. 68% say the threat of one just decreases their trust in the government. so, with the gop knowing this, how worried should they be about those numbers and what a pull up and tells us in terms of where america stands around the shutdown? >> yeah, i mean, when you think about the fundamental description function of congress, it's to pass laws, pass a budget, keep the government running and keep the government funded. when you fail at your most basic job description and responsibility, you're basically taking a billboard to the american public saying were unfair to serve, were unfit to be representatives, were unfit

to hold the reins of power. at the same time, somehow, you found the time to hold a bogus impeachment proceeding and witch hunts targeting your political effort yours and the biden family. it's reconcilable. you can't say we're doing it for the people that prosecuting joe biden, but we're also going to shut down the government because we can't even get a majority of our own conference together on the senate to do the basic perfunctory job description. there is no reason why anyone in america should have confidence in this republican majority. >> paula, speaking of polling which we were just talking about, the public's approval of the republican party has hit record lows in october of 2013 after the shutdown at that point. so at this place again, and it seems as though we're headed for another crash course with the government closing. why is it that some of these republicans actually believe that a shutdown would be to their benefit politically?

help me understand that because all the signs of what we know before says that, when this happens, the polls go down. so what does it make them think that they can afford to have this happen now? >> i don't think i can answer this question because i truly do not understand. what i do understand are those polls. why they're declining, why trust is declining, why? because they're so hypocritical. let's just take what's happening at the southern border. this is an issue that republicans claim that they care so much about. if the government shuts down, the u.s. southern border will effectively be less safe. right? as we're talking right now, there is a massive humanitarian crisis happening there. 7000 migrants are apprehended every single day. two migrants died just last week border patrol agents, law enforcement agents, that these maga republicans come to defend, they will continue to work if the government is shut down, but they will not be paid. if we know from previous shutdowns is that, if that happens, that does cause filmed

abilities. and that will make law enforcement agents less safe. test your question, i don't know, but i do understand why the public does not trust them. >> donny, you and i talk notes on both a lot, when it comes to indictments and what it means for what this motion signifies. i want to talk theory really quickly. there's all this information being put out about the doj about -- and how that's moving. is there any concern as lawyers who practice in this space, that by vilifying the doj that there is the potential through this misinformation campaign to decrease public confidence in our legal system, in our criminal justice system, and the people who are responsible for holding accountable folks who do wrong? >> criminal defense attorneys have been criticizing the doj's since time immemorial. it's something that happens. it is something that trump, for example, seems to have a lot more hot spot to do. he's a lot more fearless then i would be. i have plenty of criticisms. i don't voice them like that.

and i hope that mine are more substantive than donald trump 's. his idea that the doj is a puppet of a president is just not how the doj works. when you think of the cabinet members of the cabinet, the doj, the attorney general, is different from other members of the cabinet because he as an attorney, as the head of the justice department, exercises his own discretion. now, is there is some degree of alliance and that they work together and they know each other and merrick garland serves at the pleasure of the president? sure. but, doj is an independent engine nc. so charles, as much as i criticize a usa's who prosecutes my cases, i understand that they act independently. and if they're loyal to any, think they're loyal, not to the president, but to the system itself. they are all -- and i think you probably would agree with me, when you deal with a usa, is in your cases, they are loyal to --

they believe in the system, they believe in the justice system, irrespective of who sitting in the white house. >> as a former prosecutor, this is criticism that i do not miss. paulo ramos, thank you so much. curt and danny, stick around. you guys are staying with. me we'll come back to you later in the hour. but, after the break, i will be speaking with congressman jimmy gomez about republicans being more focused where the evidence free impeachment inquiry than keeping the government open. you're watching a man on msnbc. i am charles coleman jr, stay tuned. an jr, sta tuned. ♪ you can make it happen ♪ ♪ yeah oh ♪ now, try new dietary supplements from voltaren for healthy joints. (fisher investments) it's easy to think that all money managers now, try new dietary supplements from voltaren are pretty much the same, but at fisher investments we're clearly different. (other money manager) different how? you sell high commission investment products, right? (fisher investments) nope. fisher avoids them. (other money manager) well, you must earn commissions on trades. (fisher investments) never at fisher investments. (other money manager) ok, then you probably sneak in

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you're watching a man on msnbc. i am charles coleman jr, in for him and tonight. the government can shut down in just seven days and four hours. and republicans are laser focused not on keeping doors of the government open, but rather on expanding their evidence free impeachment inquiry into president joe biden. in fact, just days before a possible shutdown, the house oversight committee is scheduled to hold its first hearing related to that very inquiry. there's some new reporting that suggest some republicans already fear the committee's handling of that matter before we have even had the hearing. according to axios, colleagues of chairman james comer have become so fed up with his exaggerations and distortions about that investigation, that they are worried about him being the public face of the inquiry. they are praying he will adopt a much more measured approach. joining me now is democratic

congressman jimmy gomez of california, he's a member of that very house oversight committee. so glad to have you here with us, congressman. let's talk about what we have to look forward to going forward. what do you think should be made of republicans who appear more concerned about this inquiry than they are the actual shutdown of the house? >> well, there are demonstrating what they've demonstrated in the past. [inaudible] conspiracy that [inaudible] they had zero evidence that show them that president biden has done anything wrong. or that [inaudible] [inaudible]

[inaudible] americans without childcare. that's a big deal. that's going to impact people's ability to take their kids to childcare, to get to work, to get to school. it's going to have a ripple effect that is going to impact every state, not just the blue states, but every single state. so it just shows that they have no interest in doing peoples work. they're interested in [inaudible] donald j trump. >> congressman gomez, we're having a few audio issues, but we appreciate you coming weather, as for gonna try to make this as smooth as we can for the audience out there. i want to talk about for a moment about your colleague james comer. they're some republicans that are very concerned about the way that he is overselling the case against the president. there is a concern within that party that these exaggerations could ultimately come to bite the party politically.

how much of that should be an issue for the country, and also, with this wave of misinformation, carrying the day, what is that that we can do to fight back and make this picture clearer about what has and has not been going on with respect to this administration and the alleged biden crime family that they keep trying to advance? >> yes, one of the things we've seen when it comes to cameras that he throws out some wild accusations, and many has to go and apologize. republicans should be very [inaudible] if he continues doing that performance, he's gonna say write one thing, and you'll have to apologize for it. at the same time, it's been a hot mess after another. we have marjorie taylor greene showing a [bleep] pick of hunter biden which is offensive and appalling. but that's what they're trying to do, they're trying to misguided the american people. they're trying to say don't

look over, there where we can't govern. the whole system is gonna shut down. they continue to spew conspiracy theories, putin comes to ukraine, when it comes to biden. here's the thing, there is zero evidence implicating joe biden is implicated in any sort of crime. plain and some people. and there is nothing [inaudible] >> i appreciate your reference to the picket scene around the house. congressman gomez, i want to ask you flat out, let's call it what it is and find out the truth, from your perspective, at this moment, how likely is it that the government avoid shutting down in just over seven days? >> i think it's not very likely that the republicans are gonna be able to get their act together and keep the government open. they're gonna most likely have a shut down. [inaudible] not a long period of time and we hope that the [inaudible] doesn't packs everybody. like i said, it [inaudible]

this impacts essentially hundreds of billions that work in [inaudible] this will have a ripple effect for a lot of our [inaudible] we don't to see that. we don't want to see [inaudible] [inaudible] [inaudible] when that happens, you undermine the peoples faith that congress can do their job. and maybe that's what the republicans want to do. they want to continue eroding [inaudible] not only an hour progress but our system of government as a whole. >> congressman jimmy gomez, thank you so much for your time. after the break, bombshell revelations in the trump classified documents case. did prosecutors just find their star witness? stay tuned, you're watching ayman on msnbc. i am charles coleman jr. wow charles coleman jr. wo tourists photographing thousands of miles of remote coral reefs.

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you're watching ayman on msnbc. i am charles coleman jr., in for ayman. the mishandling of donald trump's -- has been rocked with a new bombshell with revelations from someone very close to the former president. molly michael, rmer assistant to donald trump, has reportedly informed vestigators that the ex president told her that she shld say she didn't know anything about the boxes containing classified documents that he had stashed at r-a-lago after leaving the white house. according to michael, trump told her, quote, you don't know anything about the boxes. end quote. when lauren forsman wanted to talk to, or that's what he said. this is originally reported by abc news. trump also repeatedly wrote to do lists for michael on documents from the white house that were marked as classified. including no cards that were used to brief him for phone calls with foreign leaders or other international related matters.

to discuss this, let's bring back kurt bardella and danny cevallos, also joining me is reena shaw, former republican and founder of relax tragedies. danny, so, what -- was michael's is describing, it's unbelievable but it also seems like a textbook case of obstruction. am i missing something, how significant of a revelation is this? >> as to all these trump indictments, you often hear people say, well wait until his codefendants turn on him. wait until his codefendant walt naughton, the documents case, cooperates with the government and comes and testify against trump. the government will probably be happy to hear from walton nauta, but they did not indict donald trump planning on needing walt nauta to turn on donald trump. for more useful to them are people like molly michael, because she has absolutely -- she appears to have zero criminal exposure whatsoever.

the government loves people like that who come in and talk to them. i always believe, and many folks would agree, i think you might agree with me, charles, that when these people in trump's orbit -- when trump got indicted, they're a lot of people who are in the administration, there are people that were just doing their job. and they don't want to get in trouble, they may not have done anything criminal, and these are the kind of people that probably rushed to the government to say, whoa, if you're looking into this, i will tell you everything you want to know. according to reports, that's exactly what mueller michael did. she came to a dusk, something for government missed, and reportedly said, hey, you guys missed every something. here's everything you need. this is what the government needs, even more than cooperators. because cooperators have criminal exposure, and they know they will get screwed on the stand. someone with no criminal exposure, like molly, michael is a fantastic witness for the government because she's there, the government will put on the stand, and essentially paying her as some one who's there out of the goodness of the heart,

and not because they're cooperating for some deal on sentencing down the road. >> reena, what we're learning now really could mean that molly michael becomes the prosecution star witness. i want you to think back for a moment about what we saw what the january 6th commission in front of the house and the testimony of cassidy hutchison. are we looking at another situation where this relatively unknown figure could potentially become a household name for essentially talking about, within proximity, what you learned being around donald trump? >> you described is not too farfetched. cassidy hutchinson has a book out -- coming out. and the reality is, you could go on and tell your story and be construed as someone who is standing up for the country, doing the right thing. but we know what mike is gonna say about this, right? they're gonna say that these people from the deep state. and now they're part of the conspiracy to take down the former president of the united states, because they don't like

him anymore, and he's not useful anymore to them. what i say about this moment is that we have to be careful. because it's still somebody that was part of trump's orbit, and is coming out now of course pointing out these more than discrepancies, she's doing something that ought to be done. and it's something to be believed in the law taking good people to do the right thing. yeah, this is a woman that should be celebrated. but also what i saw happen with the select committee is that people went on to not only villainized these figures that came forward and offer what they knew, they went on to make their lives incredibly tough. so that's really part of the look towards the future administration. for 13 months away from what will be potentially a game changing situation where biden is no longer in power. and that changes everything for how trump world sees, again. again, the government and how it treats us and sees us is -- and that's what we hear anymore.

from maga [inaudible] on trump. >> what rina, i have to follow up with, you your former republican, i have to, ask for hard-line republicans, to someone like molly michael or cassidy hutchinson, for that matter, are they a villain, are they a patriot, are they a hero? what is the narrative around them in terms of coming forward with this kind of information if it is true? >> these people are absolute villains. on the one hand, again, as i described, it they've done the right thing. but, look, i'm somebody that believes that if you went into the trump administration, you knew what you are signing up for. and you can't be that surprised. when you come out and tell the tale, sure, i feel for you, but i also don't feel that bed. because this is a situation which this administration operated under its own rules. they didn't seem to have care for how things worked down through before them, they don't even care about how things go after them. they know that things changed fundamentally. there's been a seismic shift in

the republican party. people don't talk about that enough. not only are they in different factions right now, but the shift in how we view who to trust, the crisis of trust is manifesting. and so into the republican party actively, and we don't know how that's gonna play out, charles. it's something that is happening right now. and these figures that come forward, good on them, but it's a moment of which i say [inaudible] put dogs, you wake up with. please >> that you make a point, this is something you had to be aware you signed up for. kurt, i want to get your reaction to the reaction time. here it came after donald trump, the instruction it is, of the instruction tamale, michael came after donald trump learned that there were going to be federal investigators who were really going to pursue this and going to be president at mar-a-lago. what is your reaction to that? from an obstruction standpoint, the fact that this is when he decided to say, hey, you don't know new thing about those boxes. ay, hey, you don't know n>> i mean it's textbook, t

like bad version of the soprano's playing out here. it's not that it's so blatant that donald trump allegedly continually trust obstruct justice, it's how blatantly bad he is at it. and i think danny was right that for a lot of observers have what's been going on with the former presidents legal troubles, the issue of when his own people start turning on him, when his own people start flipping on him, that's the most revealing element of all of this. i want to remind everybody, when you hear republicans go out there and say that these are witchhunts, these are partisan, this is the biden administration going after the political adversaries. remember, every one of these cases, every single one of them is built on evidence from trump's own people. from his own employees, from his own campaign workers, from his own white house officials. testimony, depositions, witnesses, firsthand accounts, are all from people within trump's orbit. they're not from partisan

democrats. >> i'm so glad you brought that up because now i'm going to switch focus and talk about fulton county and that little r.i.c.o. case going on there with 19 codefendants that fani willis is bringing. you talked about the fact that so many of these cases are being brought, not only by trump's lawyers but also by the people around him. this week we learned that lynne wood has been named as a witness. i want you to sort of talk -- i'm gonna get denny to weigh in as well. how significant is that that pro trump attorney lin wood is being named as a witness for the prosecution? that seems to be in line with just but you are making the point around in terms of the people closest to him being the same foundation upon which these cases are being built. what's your reaction to that as we look forward to what fani willis is doing in georgia? >> i think that's important, i think that's why the potential televising of that proceeding can be very important because right now, most americans don't

know about this case, that's fine and that's expected. but if this is on television, and everyone in america tunes, an and they don't see a partisan democrat, not a progressive activist, but donald trump's own people testifying against him, i think that could be incredibly damaging for him. this is a thing republicans need to be worried about as we go to 2024, frankly. they're gonna try to run for president to get the majority in the, house to keep the senate. all the while this is not unfolding on national television and the star witnesses and the key testimonies are going to be from full-fledged republican trump maga sympathizers. they're gonna be the ones about the dagger and donald trump. it's not gonna be the justice department, the bureaucracy, the deep state, all the conspiracy theories we hear from republicans all the time. it's gonna be from donald trump's own people. >> danny, really quickly, a lot of has been made about mode is a prosecution witness. but also he says, i looked on them. trump how do you reconcile? that your defense attorney. can you explain what are the

different reasons they could be looking to calwood? >> he might not be formally cooperating, and otherwise, he may not be entering into an agreement with the government or with state prosecutors to not be prosecuted in exchange for his testimony. but that doesn't mean that testimony won't be damaging. thanks for example, that, say then what is still a trooper lever that the election was stolen and that if the government or the state possum to come in, he'll testify he'll testify consistently with what he thinks was righteous. how good is that going to be for trump when there's all this evidence that they were flat out wrong? so even if linwood is not a co-operator in the traditional sense that he's entered into a bargain but the government, he's still could be damaging for trump and exhibit a to that is fulton county, the prosecutors, are putting him on the witness list. he has something that they want, they put him on the stand, and he'll give it. maybe in his mind, he's not telling of trump. but obviously, if he has information that helps the state, that's where they're calling him. >> we kurt bardella, danny

cevallos, and rina shah, thank you to you all. coming, up as united autoworkers expand their strike, president biden is about to do something that no sitting president has ever done before. you'll find out what that is after we come back after the break. you are watching ayman on msnbc. o msnbc. ...because t-mobile helps pano ai innovate, so they can stop the spread of wildfires. now's the time to see what america's largest 5g network can do for your business. as the world keeps changing, so does covid-19. that's why this season's covid-19 shots have been updated. they're one of the best ways to help protect yourself against covid-19. learn more and schedule at vaccines.gov

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chase. make more of what's yours. mlb chooses t-mobile for business for 5g solutions... ...to not only enhance the fan experience, but to advance how the game is played. now's the time to see what america's largest 5g network can do for your business. >> welcome back, you are watching ayman on msnbc. i am charles coleman jr.. the auto strike is getting bigger. on friday, thousands of workers a general workers -- walked off the job. they joined nearly 13,000 workers who were already on strike. the ex disbanded walkout did not include four due to the progress that they are making at the negotiation table. all the workers have been on strike over one week since the uaw's previous crossfire with the three major auto makers

expire. the union is seeking wage increases of 36% over four, years cost of living adjustments, and a 32-hour work week among other goals. earlier this week, general motors i don't plan in kansas -- idled a plant, in kansas, and laid off almost 2000 workers athavery plant. and now, present biden is set to visit miigan on tuesday to show support for the strike. one day before donald trump is scheduled to be there. joining me now to discuss is tiffany simmons of uaw local 900 in michigan, as well as bob kaine, former president of the uaw. tiffany, i want to start with you. talk to us about your experience on the picket line. why were you all striking along your fellow uaw members? >> well, the experience so far along the picket line,

everyone's adrenaline still running, everyone is still in good spirits, everyone is still hopeful. we are striking right now because we've asked for change. we ask nicely, we've asked not so nicely, and now we're demanding it. it was a long time coming. >> bob, i want to bring you in and ask about your reaction to president biden announcing that he's coming to michigan. i mean, this calling in the big guns and then there's calling in the president of the united states. how significant is it to organized labor that is sitting president which has never happened in history before is coming to michigan to stand with you all? how big of a deal is that? >> i think it's an extremely big deal. i think everybody in the labor book is really excited about this, as you said, no sitting president in history has done this. i think it also demonstrates how strong public support is

behind the uaw members on strike. the public wants our membership to get the good fair contract. they realized the unfairness are members made huge sacrifices so that these companies could be profitable, and now they've hoarded the profitability without sharing it fairly with its members. it's a big deal, it's a big step, i, think in the right direction. >> i really want to stay with you for a moment because as we are talking about the significance of the marriage between politics and political power and organized labor, this is very interesting to me. so we have seen an unprecedented, over the past few elections, split, a fracture that has begun to occur within the organized labor movement where for example, we have organized labor leaders who are actually endorsing a particular candidate for president. in most cases, it's the

democratic candidate. but over the course of the last two elections and going back to 2016, we've seen a split and more and more of the actual members of different unions signing with republican candidates who have typically not championed the issues of organized labor. is where we are currently in effect of that fracture, that split? or is it simply unrelated from your perspective? >> well, i guess my perspective is different than yours, and you've got some different data than i do. but there is always been a significant portion of the uw members who have voted for republican candidates. and really what makes a difference in elections is how hard the local union, the national, the regional level really -- talking to members, talking about why it's so important to support the candidate, to support why they're so good at labor issues. when we do that one-on-one work, we get really strong turnout.

it really helps good progressive democrats, good progressive candidates get elected. >> tiffanie, the union points off thatceoseceived 40% of pay raises over the past four compared to 6% and pay increases for regular workers during that same time. how do you react to that stark difference? is that part of the motivation to while you all are right now on the picket line? >> we react, with all due respect, is laughter. it's completely ridiculous. these ceos, they're calling but were being offered generous. meanwhile, they're making salaries that can probably provide for an entire assembly plant. everyone makes money except for the people who are actually doing the work. they claim that these are performance based bonuses. we have yet to see the

performance. the people that are performing are on these assembly lines and in these manufacturing facilities. we create the status quo. everybody has profited from the auto industry except for the people who are actually building the vehicles. people vehicles every day that literally carry lives. and, while the whole economy is evolving, our wages are still archaic. >> bob, we've talked about president biden tom coming in and standing with autoworkers. but let's shift our conversation a little bit to president trump, there is a pretty clear message set by uaw president around donald trump before his trip where he said, quote, every fiber of our union is being poured into fighting the billionaire class, in an economy that in rich is people like donald trump at the expense of workers. what are your thoughts about that quote from the current president of the union?

>> i think that quote is right on the mark. our automakers in ohio will never forget, he came to [inaudible] as you remember the last campaigns, don't sell your home, don't move. i'm gonna save this plant. he didn't lift a baby finger to hope any of the uaw members in lords town. we're starting to see more and more wet a charlatan he is. and that he's not been a friend or ally to any working person. so sean is exactly right. >> tiffanie simmons and bob kink, we will be watching the strict with great interest. thank you both for your time. coming up next, i will give my take on american teachers that are caught in the crosshairs of our culture war. you are watching ayman on msnbc, and i am charles coleman jr.. we will be right back. my skin and joints, i'm feeling this moment. along with clearer skin skyrizi helps me move with less joint pain, stiffness, swelling, and fatigue.

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we see it every day involves and policies and playing out in realtime in our schools. according to the washgton post, in recent, years 25 states, that's half the country, have passed 64 laws reshaping what students can learn and do at school. these laws limit instruction on race, history,, sex or gender identity. but a key component that gets lost and all of this is the impact that it has on educators. and the threats they face due to teaching curriculums that challenge the status quo. one such educator's merrywood, a high school english teacher in south carolina where students reported her last year for listen on race. it's a case that drew national attention. what had to -- from ta-nehisi coats, between the world and me. an award-winning book written as a letter from the author to her son about what it means to be black in america. but mere days after student and

parent complaints, school administrators ordered wood to stop teaching lessons on coates's book. the predicament invited her particarly conservative town of taping, and as the academic year came, underway for the first time in 14 years of teaching, what was scared to go back to school. she told the washington post, trust, it's fundamental to the classroom. a big part of that trust is teaching authentically. and for would, that means teaching writers like coats, voices that are unfamiliar and even perhaps disconcerting to students. but because of what happened last year, she was worried that anything might be resisted, reported, and reported by the children she was supposed to be teaching. we marry woods is not alone. educators from across the country, from wisconsin to texas have been punished or reprimanded for their desire simply to exposed to their

students the minds they are interested with, to a world that's diverse and evolving. the backlash that teachers are facing for trying to thoughtfully educate and inform their students is not a problem that we can overlook. because when we put the power in the hands of students to say what they will and won't be taught, we place our teachers in an untenable position. we're doing a disservice to both them and their students. that's gonna do it for me. thank you so much for making time for us. i'm charles coleman jr. in four ayman mohyeldin. ayman we'll be back next week. if you want more of me, you can tune back here one of a legal analyst. we will see you soon and goodnight. ook at all those! what'd you find? lorraine banks, look, county of macomb, michigan? oh my goodness... this whole journey has been such a huge gift for our family. as the world keeps changing, so does covid-19.

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