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thank you for being with us on this second hour of "chris jansing reports." roughly 50,000 people are on lockdown right now across the state of maine as police continue their intense search for the man behind a shooting rampage that left 18 people dead and 13 others injured. these are the photos police want you to see because they are frantically searching for 40-year-old robert card, an army reservist with a history of mental illness. police say he killed his first seven victims at a bowling alley. then he drove across town to a bar where the rampage continued. eight more people were killed right away, three later died at the hospital. the suspect's car tracked to a nearby town where it had been abandoned by a boat dock.

>> our small state of just 1.3 million people has long been known as one of the safest states in the nation. this attack strikes at the very heart of who we are and the values we hold dear for this precious place we call home. >> a local maine resident telling nbc news that it was known in town to, quote, stay away from card. he and his family would, quote, shoot guns all the time. you could hear them every day after school. it was like clock work. witnesses of the attack and those with missing loved ones describe the pain and horror of what unfolded last night. >> we were inside and just bowling, and out of nowhere, he just came in, and there was a loud pop. thought it was a balloon. i had my back turned to the door, and as soon as i turned and saw, it was not a balloon, he was holding a weapon, i just booked it down the lane, and i

slid basically into where the pins are and climbed up the machine and was on top of the machines for about ten minutes until the cops got there. >> my ex-husband and my son were playing pool, and next thing i know, i saw on facebook that there was a shooting at schemengees where they were playing, and then nobody would tell us anything. we were all waiting and we heard nothing. they won't tell us if he's alive, if he's in critical condition, if he's passed. they won't tell us anything. i'm a little freaked out. i want to know, you know what i mean. he's a young man. they shouldn't leave us hanging like this. >> i was working at enterprise foundry and the shooting took place on the street behind us, and immediately we locked down and closed the doors and closed the shop. >> reporter: what did you hear? what happened? >> just the gunshots. saw people screaming. >> i want to bring in nbc's

antonia hylton who is on the ground in lewiston, and nbc news intelligence and justice correspondent, ken dilanian. this has been called an all hands on deck approach to find this suspect, robert card. no surprise there. but what more do we know about him, and what details do we have about what's being done to find him? >> chris, a senior law enforcement official just told nbc news that tips and sightings are pouring in but none of them have been deemed credible as of yet. the u.s. marshals have their main regional task force deployed to try to help state and local officials hunt for this suspect, robert card. the fbi has a host of teams deployed including one devoted to exploiting social media, and another that specializes in behavioral analysis. federal officials are looking for electronic signals that could potentially point to where this person could be. they're canvassing the area. they are working as hard as they possibly could. in terms of the suspect, we are

learning that he purchased an assault style rifle legally this ye, and one of the biggest questions that's unanswered, chris, is this reporting that we have that while he was in the army reserve, he was referred to inpatien mental health treatment. so people were concerned enough about his behavior. he said he was hearing voices, allegedly, and had even made threats to shoot up a national guard base, concerned enough that they referred him to treatment. the question is did they report that to the fbi where that would have been put in a national database that could have prevented him from purchasing a weapon. we have not gotten answers to that question which we put to many federal agencies, chris. >> we're also learning more about the weapon that was used in this shooting. what can you tell us about that? >> yeah, just that it's an assault style rifle that was purchased legally. we all saw the photo. there it is right there of him holding that weapon with the appearance of someone who's used it many times before, and we

know that he was a firearms instructor in the army reserves. so a man with training tragically using it to ill effect there. >> we're starting what is such a heartbreaking part of all of these stories, which is we're starting to hear from some family members, we're starting to hear from people who were there or who knew folks. what do we know about the victims and what can you tell us about what you're hearing on the ground overall? >> reporter: well, chris, we have some new information about victims, but we're waiting on a lot. we know that it's a mix of men and women. we're hearing from members of the community that minors were involved. that has not been confirmed. authorities will not comment on how many minors may have been affected. although, what i have been told from people here on the ground is that there were many youth gathered at the bowling alley last night for an event, and i have messaged with one resident whose cousin passed away. several people have walked by and spoken with me here, and

described how eerie it feels to be out of school for all the businesses to be closed, for them to have this knowledge that someone is out there right now, and, you know, just as, you know, you and ken were just mentioned there, someone with deep knowledge and training in the use of firearms. not just anybody on the run, somebody if they were to come across locals or in a stand off with police officers would be well trained and good at what they were trying to do. that has added an additional layer of fear here. it's made it heard for people to even start gathering and talking about the victims because they have to shelter in place at home right now. in fact, we just all got alerts to our phones, notifying everybody in this county that the shelter in place order has been extended, and even though this shelter many place order is focussed around the area o lewiston, lisbon, we're heari people as far as portland are staying at home or not going to businesses today because there's anxiety. he left this car that was found

by water, and we don't know wher he's on foot, if he's found another way out of the state. there is a fear that people don't know where he's going to pop up next. and it is just really compounding the grief already that people are experiencing, knowing that 18 people's lives have been lost. several people are in critical condition who have been receiving care around the clock at the medical facility behind me here. doctors have described the scene here as one in which they had a flood of people come in off duty, trying to save lives, actively still doing that work right now. so there's really two stories here, the story about the community that's kind of been changed forever, and the loss of loved ones in such a tight knit place where people know each other, they know these venues, and also this larger story and fear of what happens if this becomes like what we saw in pennsylvania, this stretches on for days or weeks. when will this community get any bit of peace, and you know, that is really what's most pressing issue on everyone's minds right

now, chris. >> antonia hylton and ken dilanian, thank you both so much. earlier on this network. we did hear firsthand from one of the victim's family members. leroy walker is a city counselor in auburn, maine, the father of a man who was killed last night, the owner of the bar. he's what he told my colleague. >> 14 plus hours to tell us and notify us of this, which is just totally a nightmare. none of us slept. we were up all night. we didn't know where to go, who to turn to. the state police took over the crime scene. they didn't notify any of us people that are waiting to hear about something or anything. i guess the fbi got involved. they were there by 11:00 or 12:00. again, they didn't notify

anybody or reach out to anybody, and they knew we were all looking for our loved ones because the hospital had all of our names, everybody that was looking for a loved one, the hospital had our names. all they had to do was check in with the hospital. they knew that's where we were all sent, but these dabados, whatever they call it, sweep the place and this and that, and they can't touch the bodies, they can't do this, while we're all suffering and dying in a nightmare, that we don't understand. my youngest son actually called me and said, dad, i just heard that joey was shot at schemengees and might be dead. i almost fell to my knees and everything. don't tell me that because i just brought back my daughter, i got that phone call saying that your daughter has just been killed.

it just brought it all back, and i just fell apart. i'd just like to finish by saying my love goes out to all the other families. i'm so sorry. i'm just sorry. >> leroy walker who lost his son. for more on how this violence has rattled the usually safe community, we're joined by marla hoffman, managing editor of "the sun journal," someone who intimately knows this community. first of all, i'm so sorry for what you all are going through, and i understand that you have a 9-year-old son, and after working all night, you went home. he was waiting up. he was scared. he was wondering what happened, and i think a lot of people can relate to that. you just heard what one dad went through. first of all, how are you and your son doing? what's your impression of how the community is even processing

this? >> oh, gosh. this community is incredibly resilient. we've been through a lot as a community. unfortunately lewiston is not unfamiliar with crime, but never to this scale. this is something none of us have ever dealt with firsthand. it's all very brand new as we process everything. in terms of my family, i think it's a lot like all the other families in this town and in this county and in the region. you know, we're just giving each other big hugs. my son is okay. he didn't get a lot of sleep last night. when i left the house about 10:00 this morning, he was finally asleep, which i was glad for, but he was up most of the night. so therefore i was too. but i'm happy, too, if that helps make him feel safer, and i think every parent is saying the same thing. my daughter, she works at a local business not far from my house, and the business closed

almost right away, as soon as word got out, but they didn't let their employees leave until about midnight last night. and then she finally got home. it's all still pretty crazy now, and even though we're getting more information in every minute, it feels like it's a lot to process, and we've got our entire organization, the main trust for local news on this, and trying to get information out as accurately and as fast as possible because i know we all know that people are looking to us for information. and a lot of them know us, so it's a big responsibility, but we're up to the challenge. >> i think one of the things that is always so shocking and it's happening at places where we all go just to have our every day lives, you know, we're going to school, we go to church, we go to the grocery store, we go to a concert, in this case, and i know you wrote about this, it

was just a fun night playing corn hole. it's the last thing you're expecting, right. >> yeah. >> in some places, i think, unfortunately, off and on college and high school campuses, a lot of us this is something that's a reality in modern day life, but it doesn't feel like that in maine. >> right. >> it feels like the shock of this is exponential. >> absolutely. i mean, we hear a lot of the times these things happen either on big college campuses and big cities, but this stuff does happen in rural communities, rural states like maine. maine, it's a big state, but it's a big family. and everybody, it's almost cliche now, but everybody at

this point is going to know somebody that knows somebody that was involved in this, and that's pretty shocking. you know, we've heard unofficial word about victims, even related to our company, our news organization that had either loved ones that passed away or had friends that passed away. so, you know, we're no different than anybody else in these towns. i mean, we're getting news as it comes in, just like everybody else, just like your organization. but when it's your own people, it's much different to report about, you know, trying to be objective as a reporter but then also it's hard not to feel for what's going on. >> and we feel for what all of you are going through, but let me ask you to put your reporter hat on for a minute, which is based on for reporting, was this suspect, robert card, known to the community? was he someone that people were aware of, or do you think this

violence came completely out of nowhere? >> i mean, i don't know if it came completely out of nowhere. it appears that people that knew him know that he struggled with some mental health issues. that's been widely reported that he had -- that he was admitted into a facility over the summer. he lives in boden, which is just a couple of towns away from here. i don't know how well known he was here in lewiston, but in boden, lisbon, he might be well known this those towns. we're hearing from people possibly who knew him, people leaving tips. we're trying to put it together now. we know he has a criminal record. we're still trying to get that information in. >> marla hoffman, i know you didn't get any sleep, and you still have much work to do, but

we thank you for taking the time to talk to us. we're sending a big hug to your little boy. thank you so much. >> thank you. i appreciate it. a trained firearms instructor listed in the army reserve, how the suspect's background and experience could complicate the massive manhunt. we're back in 60 seconds. me adjust the base, add more guitar, maybe some drums. -wow. so many choices. -yeah. like schwab. i can get full service wealth management, advice, invest on my own, and trade on thinkorswim. you know carl is the only front man you need. (phone rings) oh, i gotta take this, carl. it's schwab. schwab. (feedback rings) have a choice in how you invest with schwab. (sean) i wish for the amazing new iphone 15 pro! have a choice in how you invest (jason) sean! do you mean this one - the one with titanium? switch to verizon, and get iphone 15 pro on them. (sean) wow! (vo) get iphone15 pro, apple tv 4k and 6 months of apple one. all three on us. only on verizon. with nurtec odt,

i can treat a migraine when it strikes and prevent migraine attacks, all in one. don't take if allergic to nurtec. allergic reactions can occur, even days after using. most common side effects were nausea, indigestion, and stomach pain. ask about nurtec odt. . this is the scene on a main road in lewiston told, a giant light up sign warning people to shelter in place after shootings at a bar and a bowling alley. people living nearby now forced to face their grief while hiding from a mass murderer on the loose. >> like, who's going to come around that, you know, who's going to knock at my door. and that's an awful way to live. you know, knowing that you're not even safe in your own homes. >> federal agents from the fbi, atf, dhs, they have all now joined the man hunt for

40-year-old robert card, and we're learning more today about his background, a bulletin issued by maine law enforcement says card is a trained firearms instructor, an army spokesperson confirming today he's also a long time member of the army reserve, a sergeant first class, a petroleum supply specialist who enlisted in december 2022, although was never deployed for combat. he has earned multiple awards, including the army achievement medal and national defense service medal, and army service ribbon. joining me now, carmen best, retired seattle police chief and msnbc law enforcement analyst. carmen, look, when you look at that background, and obviously we know he not only was trained using arms, but he was an instructor, how does his background impact the man hunt if at all? >> good afternoon, chris. yeah, his background complicates things for certain. excuse me, his background in that he's been a firearms instructor, and in all

likelihood is very particular and probably has a lot of expertise around utilizing his weapons. we know from the pictures that he had a lot of ammunition. so as the officers on the ground looking for him, all the law enforcement that's there, there's potential that he has even better skills than some of them that are looking for him. also, we do have our most elite as well out there. >> for many people watching, the way that they know about how investigations are done is from police procedurals, right, and i was thinking about how one of the things we often hear police say to witnesses or somebody who thinks they might have information is something you may have seen that may not seem important to you could actually be important to this investigation. so when police are asking people to call in tips, to give them information, what kinds of useful things, carmen, are they looking for? >> well, certainly they're going to be looking for anything that

they can collectively put together as if a number of people called in with the potential sighting or some suspicious activity, you know, multiple calls, then that would be something you would want to look at first. you're also going to be looking at, you know, anybody who knew him, knew of a place he frequented, somebody who had an association, more information than others, because certainly right now everybody is gripped by fear is going to be highly anxious and may misinterpret things, but they need one, the police, that is, need just one verifiable piece of information to give them a good starting point to look at where he might be at this time. >> yeah, and it obviously becomes incredibly important as we saw, for example, in the man hunt for the guy who escaped from a prison in pennsylvania. but card's car was found at a boat landing. the longer this search goes on, and we know how rural it is, we know that there aren't cameras in the ways that we saw in some

other investigations, what's the likelihood he might be moving beyond the city, even the state, and how does law enforcement even start to track that? >> yeah, honestly, it's like 50/50. it could go either way. we don't know yet where he is. that's why the tips and tracking it so important. there will be investigations and talking to family members and associates, what things he hikes to do, where he's frequented, where he's most comfortable. where he may have traveled before. that type of information may help. in all honesty, until we get a good piece of verifiable information, you just don't know. he may have decided to take his own life. we don't know what his mental state is at this point. >> carmen best, it's always good to have your expertise on the program. thank you so much. still ahead, as we learn about the suspect's mental

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a senior law enforcement official tells nbc news tips are pouring in as the public tries to help them track down robert card, the 40-year-old army reservist suspected in two mass shootings in maine last night. so far, though, none have been deemed crediblement meanwhile, the community is grieving the loss of 18 members of that community. one man says his brother was working at the bowling alley in

lewiston when the shots rang out. >> you hear the shot, hear the pop, and he turned around and saw what was happening, so he turned to the kids and said active shooter, and he was right near an emergency exit, so i believe he herded them out that door, but as far as i know, he doesn't know how he's going to unsee some of the things that he saw. >> well, that man confirmed his son's youth bowling league typically practices at that bowling alley on wednesday nights. he said they decided to skip it on a whim that night, a choice his father says probably saved their lives. i want to bring in rahema, i wonder what you're seeing and

hearing on the ground since you got there? >> reporter: i can tell you that bowling alley that gentleman just spoke of is about an eighth of a mile down the road behind me. it's a building with a gray top to it. i must tell you, there is a real sense of fear in this town. if people thought that this was going to end quickly, that they would find the suspect by now, apparently not because just a few moments ago another alert went out to secure in place. you go down this main street here in lewiston, while there's some traffic, there are no businesses open. the restaurants, the fast food places, the coffee shops, supermarkets, they're all closed, chris, and that's because people are heeding this warning. there is a sense of a clear and potentially present danger as a result of what happened here last night and just four minutes from what happened here, 4 miles down the road, 12 minutes after, the horror continued, and it is hanging over this town right now like the gray sky that we have.

and it's something that you not only see because there are shelter in place signs in the community, you can feel it. i'm just a visitor, and i feel it. i felt it when i drove into the city this morning. but this is a group of people, this town is filled with people who are resilient, but first they are going to have to take care of what has happened here, and then rebound and rebuild the sense of community, i think and the sense of trust, and maybe at some point, they will be able to get over this fear. chris. >> rehema ellis, thank you very much. one of the first questions in the q&a portion of the update in maine is the suspect robert card's mental health. according to a bulletin put out, a database for officials, card reported mental health issues of

hearing voices and threats to shoot up the national guard base. we have not at nbc news independently confirmed that, but the family of the army reservist who is accused here, robert card, we spoke with him. katie card is married to his brother, and she tells nbc news this. he was picking up voices that he had never heard. his mind was twisting them around. he was humiliated by the things that he thought were being said. katie card said the family did their best to reassure robert card the comments were not real, including verifying with some of the people he claimed had made the remarks, but she said it turned into a manic belief on his part, and she added he was very set in his believes that everyone was against him all of a sudden. i want to bring in the director of the violence project, julien

peterson, that literally just came into us, that interview with the sister-in-law, but we often hear from politicians, often republicans, that these mass shootings are a public health problem, mental health problem. not a gun problem, but you have led large scale research studies on mental illness and crime, mass shootings, school shootings, so help us put this into the proper perspective. what do we know about the links? >> yeah, we know that this is complicated and anytime someone says it's just this and not this, that's not the answer. so we have studied mass shootings, they have these consistent pathways to violence, often starting with childhoods that are full of violence and abuse building to a crisis point where they are acting differently. they're hopeless, they're angry, they're actively suicidal. sometimes that can involve mental health, sometimes it doesn't. it can involve psychosis,

usually it doesn't, though. they study other perpetrators, many are looking for fame and notoriety in doing this, and then they have access to the guns they need to carry it out. we can think about intervention and prevention at many points along that pathway. >> so i would say, listening to you that this sense that people have that we should immediately conclude that just because someone might have had mental health problems that that was the precipitating factor, that's why they carried out a his or her -- horrendous attack. >> we looked specifically at hearing voices, delusions, that motivates around 10% of the mass shootings we studied. for those 10%, that is a real conversation. for 90%, though, of mass shootings, it's a much more complicated story, and in many of those cases, there is no mental health diagnosis. it's not something where we can point and say mental health is the root cause here. >> well, you have studied actual

data-driven solutions for what must be done, right, and i mean, everybody's looking for an answer or at least i should say if you go into any of these communities, you've clearly done it, i've done it. that's the first thing people say. this has got to stop. what has your research told you? >> yeah, we build a database of 200 mass shooters. we also interviewed about seven perpetrators, the family members about what is that path of violence, and how can we interrupt it. we published the findings in a book called the violence project. we came up with 30 potential solutions, none of them perfect. we used the swiss cheese model. when you layer solutions, they have holes. when you start layering them, that's where you get somewhere. anything from early childhood trauma, mentorship, crisis intervention, suicide prevention, anonymous reporting systems when people leak their plans to let the police know,

things like not giving perpetrators the fame and notoriety they're looking for, and limiting access to guns, especially for people who are a danger to themselves and others and in an active crisis. >> i want to play for you a bit of what the governor of maine said this morning. here it is. >> this city did not deserve this terrible assault on its citizens, on his peace of mind, on his sense of security. >> this attack happened in places we can all imagine, a local bar known for corn hole, a bowling alley. i just got a list of places that are going to be in lock down tomorrow, they include bates college, the university of new england, the university of main, bowdoin college, there are lots of local schools in lockdown. we talked to a local reporter whose son couldn't sleep last night. he was afraid, and knowing that you've talked to family members and the extent of your research, do you have a sense of what mass

shootings do to a collective community's understanding of safety in their own homes? >> that's a good question. yeah, the ripple effects of these shootings are so massive, and that is what they do. they underscore our feeling of safety and security anywhere. it feels like you can be killed at the grocery store, at school, and there's nothing you can do about it. this shooting in particular is particularly traumatic because the shooter is still not in custody. this is a prolonged period of being in that kind of heightened sense of fear and unsafety. we know this community will feel this for years, generations, really. still there's communities associated with mass shootings that happened 30, 40 years ago, that becomes the legacy. it is something that this community is going to need a lot of support, and a lot of sort of connecting with each other to pull through this.

>> julian peterson, thank you so much. that research is fascinating. i'm going to pick up the book. it really is something i think we all need to try to understand a little better in this country. appreciate your time today. thank you. >> thank you so much. >> mass shootings and what to do about them is never ending on capitol hill, chris coons of delaware who has led efforts in the past to find common sense gun safety reforms joins me next. but first, the mass shooting in maine triggered frustration, raw emotion, far and wide, including more than 2,000 miles away. this is what will the coach of the sacramento kings basketball team said after his team won last night. >> it's a sad day. it's a sad day for our country. it's a sad day in this world. until we decide to do something about it, the powers that be, this is going to keep happening. and our kids aren't going to be able to enjoy what the united

states is about because we don't know how to fix a problem that's right in front of us. sad. i feel for the families. i don't know what else to say. i don't even want to talk basketball, i'm sorry. we played a game. it was fun. obviously we won, but if we can't do anything to fix this, it's over. it's over. it's over for our country, for this to happen time after time. e

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in new york today, the united nations held an emergency meeting on gaza with israeli and palestinian diplomats in the same room, delivering emotional accusations of crimes against humanity. >> this is not a war with the palestinians. israel is at war with the genocide hamas terror organization. only nothing can change a genocide ideology. nothing. >> 70% of all of those killed are women and children. almost all killed are civilians. is this the war some of you are

defending? these are crimes. this is barbarism. >> those impassioned pleas coming as aid trickles in, desperately needed food, water, medical supplies, but no fuel. the u.n. says without fuel, their humanitarian operations could end entirely today. nbc's josh lederman is following this story from tel aviv. josh, a press conference of families of israeli hostages also just wrapped up had washington, d.c. bring us up to speed on all the latest. >> reporter: well, chris, there has been some hope for those families given that over the last week we've seen two tranches of hostages released. those first two, the american citizens, and then two more just a few days ago, and there have been hopes for a larger release of civilian prisoners from the gaza strip. so far, we have not seen that, even though we are told by diplomats who are working on these negotiations that those

talks behind the scenes involving the qataris, the egyptians, the israelis and of course hamas are continuing. but for those families, this is an agonizing wait as today ids israel said that the number of hostages they believe are in the gaza strip have increased to 224. as they are able to identify the bodies of those who were found after the terror attacks, they're able to figure out who is still missing and presumed to be in gaza. i want you to hear what some of the families of the missing hostages had to say today about their loved ones. watch. >> we now have become family. we live in this bizarre universe of not knowing if our loved one is alive, dead, being taken care of, what did he eat, where did he sleep. >> we, the families, will not stop until everybody is back. >> the united states is the only one who can lead this

international effort to make our loved ones come back safely. >> reporter: and here in israel, chris, there are also about 130,000 people who are now living away from their homes, evacuated from some hundred communities, split about equally between the south of israel near the gaza strip and the north. and today, we went and visited a tent city being erected in the suburbs of tel aviv where i am, expected to house israelis to flee their homes. they are afraid of additional incursions of terrorists from the gaza strip or rockets over the border from hezbollah in lebanon. these israelis say they are desperate to get back to their homes, they are no other place to go. for now, it is simply not safe. there are 130,000 displaced people in israel, it is a far larger number who have been

displaced, according to u.n. officials in the gaza strip. many of them have fled from the north to the south, following the instructions from israel's military to evacuate the northern gaza strip. israel's military releasing audio hamas is refusing to allow civilians in the north to flea to the south. >> thank you so much for that. we have more breaking news on the mass shooting in maine. new reporting on the suspect's mental health treatment. we'll have that for you after this short break. chewy has great prices. spoiler, his father's half man, half cyborg. hank! i'm just happy we're watching a movie instead of a baking show. shh! hope you like plaid. i do. who wants popcorn? not it. not it. pets aren't just pets. they're more. he's going to miss the best part. shop and get a $30 egift card through november 5th. at chewy. ♪ limu emu & doug ♪

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we have more breaking news regarding the mental health history of the man suspected of killing 18 people in maine. i want to bring in ken dilanian, nbc news justice and intelligence correspondent. what have you learned? >> it's becoming increasingly clear that there was major concerns about robert card's mental health this summer and in recent weeks from military commanders and members of his family. two senior law enforcement officials tell me that card's army reserve commanders referred him to in-patient psychiatric treatment over the summer after they became concerned about his comments he had been hearing voices and about threats he made to the base. we're told he spent about two weeks inside a psychiatric facility, was treated there, released. it's unclear what happened after that. but his sister-in-law said his

family was raising concerns with the army reserve about what they viewed as card's increasingly concerning mental status. she said we reached out to make sure everyone was on the same page because he is someone who does gun training. we were concerned about his mental state. she said her husband went back and forth with the army, but it's unclear what actions were taken. she said they were following up on it, but he's never been someone we thought would actually do anything. so significant concerns, and maine does have a yellow flag law that allows police to go to a job and ask that a subject's guns be taken away if a mental health professional deems that person is a threat. obviously that didn't happen in this case. the gun used was known as a 308 sniper rifle, a very very lethal military style weapon, chris. >> ken dilanian, thank you for that important information. joining us now democratic

senator chris coons of delaware. senator, thank you for being here. this is not the first time you and i have spoken after a mass shooting, and you are deeply steeped in this issue, which is why i want to ask you hearing ken's report just now, what questions does that raise for you? >> well, as you know, chris, one of the most deadly shootings in american history in a house of worship happened back in 2017 at the sutherland springs baptist church where i think 26 people were killed. he was court martialed by a member of the air force in a domestic violence related incident. that record didn't get uploaded until the next database. he was not prevented from purchasing the weapons used to carry out the mass shooting. senator cornyn of texas, worked with senator murphy and me and others on a bill called fix nix, that dealt with that issue. the mental health evaluation

that you just described that was just reported on your show about this shooter in maine suggests there are lots more areas where we need to do a better job. i'm encouraged to hear that maine has a yellow flag law. that means it requires both a court order and a determination by a medical professional that someone is a danger to himself and others. to have someone who was a trained military shooting expert, hearing voices, telling his family that he was considering shooting up an army reserve center, and then have his own military unit refer him for in-patient treatment should have been the sort of red flag that resulted in more active engagement and supervision. look, chris, there's tens of millions of americans who are living with mental health challenges. under president biden, we invested $30 billion more in community mental health care. we need to be careful to not conflate mental health issues

with the sort of fact pattern that led to this particular shooting. but it is demonstrably the case that we don't provide enough support and enough training for local law enforcement, for families, and for those going through mental health incidents in order to secure our communities against gun violence. this is a truly tragic incident in lewiston, and the reporting you shared suggests it could have been avoided. >> i think it's important about not conflating these things. we had an expert on who has done extensive studying of mental health issues, and there isn't always a direct through line to a mass shooting like this. we're going to be careful and i'm glad you made that statement. you have led efforts to pass, what most people consider common sense gun safety reforms. the polls show it, and it includes cosponsoring legislation to ban high capacity magazines. we learned this afternoon, the

suspect's firearm in maine was legally purchased this year. when you look at the laws we have and that we don't have, and we don't have all the facts, but can shootings like this be prevented, senator? >> look, i think we can be doing more. we are the only advanced, developed nation that has anything like the number of shootings that we have. we have way too many suicides by gun, and way too many burglaries and robberies and assaults by weapons of war. weapons that were denied by the military to be highly lethal. this particular weapon used in the shooting in maine is exactly one such type of weapon, and they are very broadly owned and used throughout the united states. we have countries that have legal systems, cultural heritage similar to ours, like australia or the united kingdom that have quite different practices in terms of supervision for mental health, background checks for gun ownership, a training

required to own weapons. i do think we could do a better job. the second amendment is a foundational right, now critical to our understanding of the relationship between individuals and government and our society, and i respect and understand that. we could still do more and we could still do a better job of protecting our communities and our children. >> you are also on the foreign relations committee so i want to for just a moment, turn to the israel-hamas war because also you just got back with a congressional delegation to israel where not only did you meet with israeli officials but also with the family of a 23-year-old israeli american who was abducted by hamas. what message did you bring, and what did you learn about the situation there that we might not know? >> the picture you just showed is of john and rachel and their son hersh poland was at the music festival in the desert

when hamas attacked. he and a friend, along with dozens of others, went to a bunker, a security bunker, and think about the fact that throughout israel there are bomb shelters all over the country because of the frequency of rocket attacks by hamas and hezbollah and others. their son hersh was in that bunker. his friend was throwing out grenades as hamas was trying to throw them in and the hamas terrorist that kept throwing in grenade after grenade after grenade got two past his friend, killed his friend. hersh put a tourniquet on himself, and his father showed the video of hamas terrorists hustling him into a van, a small cart and driving him off towards gaza where they believe he's being held hostage. a part of the purpose of our bipartisan trip to israel was to deter iran and its proxies like

hamas, hezbollah, the houthis and others, but also to stand strongly with israel, to press for the release of hostages by hamas, to call for humanitarian relief for the palestinians who are being held hostage by hamas. and to engage with regional leaders. we met with president in cairo and crown prince mohammed ben salmon in riyadh to talk through what happens after this stage in the conflict with hamas. i completely understand why the israeli people, angry and scared after this brutal attack by hamas, want to take the fight to hamas as quickly and decisively as they can. but hamas is not going anywhere. they are trapped in gaza, they are surrounded, and we urge the israelis to take the time to think through what is the best strategic approach to eliminate hamas while protecting innocent civilians, and we talked to president sisi, and crown prince

ben salman about the possibilities for a two-state solution, and a path forward that would invest in the palestinians and find enduring peace for this region. that may seem like a distant dream right now as the conflict is stepping up in gaza but we have to keep a vision of the possibility of peace on the table at the same time we are pressing for both humanitarian relief and to provide critically needed supplies from israel as it takes up this fight against hamas. >> senator chris coons, thank you for taking the time on what we know is always a busy time on the capitol. thank you so much. appreciate it. >> thank you. that's going to do it for us this hour. our breaking news coverage will continue with "katy tur reports" after a very short break. after a very short break a replt we could trust. that's service the way we want it. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪

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