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>> good evening team from new york. i'm chris hayes, here for a special second hour of all in. president joe biden is navigating extremely tense difficult international crisis, in the war with israel and hamas enters its 12-day. they believe 340 hostages remain in hamas custody. from gaza rockets continue to fly, roughly 250,000 israelis have been evacuated in the areas near gaza, and israel's border with lebanon. nearly 1 million residents of gaza have been displaced or told to leave their homes. the israeli war on hamas has led to destruction across gaza, not just in the north. right now, the palestinian ministry of health estimates that more than 8500 people have been killed in gaza, including more than 3500 children. the palestinian ministry of health is controlled by hamas, but in the past, it's statistics about death during these sorts of conflicts have been broadly accurate. international child wealth organization save the children is now warning the [inaudible] just children kill igaza in justast ree weeks is greater than the total n

of children killed in all global conflicts each year since 2019. it is, by all accounts, anyone looking at it, then enormous humanitarian crisis. -- an enormous domestic political challenge. in the aftermath of the october 7th terror attack, the worst atrocity committed against jews since the holocaust, the u.s. saw a largely unanimous outpouring of grief, rage, and empathy towards the victims of that horrific attack. now, prior to october 7th, american voters in the democratic party had become more skeptical of the current israeli government, which is the most right-wing government in israel's history. and americans, particularly progressives, watch as the center left israelis flooded the streets to protest that governments anti-democratic judicial reforms. they witnessed the acutely

familiar spectacle of prime minister benjamin netanyahu being criminally charged with fraud and seeking to escape accountability. the weeks since october 7th, as the death toll has climbed in gaza, protests calling for a cease-fire have spread, both internationally and in the u. s.. in new york and washington, d. c., hundreds of american jews have been arrested, calling for a cease-fire in nonviolent demonstrations. holding signs with messages like, not in our name and, my grief is not your weapon. others have been more direct -- senate hearing at which secretary of state anthony blinken and defense secretary lloyd austin were testifying protesters painted their hands red to symbolize what they say was blood on america's hands. >> committee will suspend [inaudible] >> why aren't they at the table? cease-fire now. i beg you. cease-fire now. >> right now, calling for a cease-fire is still a distinctly minority opinion inside congress, as a whole. there's not a single senator, i think, who's calling for it and

within the democratic caucus, there's only 18 members of congress that have signed on to a resolution calling for a cease-fire. all of them are democrats, there are the ones you see there. the calls for a cease-fire are, it appears, to the polling we have and again, this is coming -- in it does seem at least more popular with the american public than members of congress. one recent poll from data for progress found 66% of all americans support the u.s. calling for a cease-fire, with 80% of democrats supporting the cease-fire, along with 57% of independents and 56% of republicans. political reports today that former aides to kamala harris's 2020 presidential campaign are collecting signatures for a letter urging the vice president to seek an immediate ceasefire between israel and hamas. the biden administration, for its part, has consistently pushed back on calls for a cease-fire. it's also clear that either because of the domestic politics or, i think, obviously more likely, the sheer spectacle and scope of the destruction in gaza, or both, the line from the white house, from the biden administration, has changed notably and considerably since the very

start of the conflict, back on october 7th. as the new york times writes, in the first days after the hamas attacks, mr. biden dw praise for his unreserved support for israel, but is israel began pounding gaza from the air in preparation for a ground invasion that began in earnest overeekend, biden settled into a pattern of delivering increasingly critical msages to the israelis, in private first, and then in public. in an oval office address, biden warned that while he understood israel's need for justice, it should not let -- be, quote, blinded by rage. last week, president biden called for a temporary humanitarian pause to allow more aid into the gaza strip. over the weekend, u.s. national security adviser jake sullivan stressed that hamas is practice of hiding behind civilian populations does not absolve israeli defense forces from the duty to protect those same civilians. >> hamas is using civilians as human shields. that creates an added burden for the israeli defense forces,

but it does not lessen their responsibility to distinguish between terrorists and innocent civilians, and to protect the lives of innocent civilians as they conduct this military operation. >> just today amid the protests inside the senate hearing, secretary of state anthony blinken offered this message. >> i also hear, very much, the passions expressed in this room and outside this room. all of us are committed to the protection of civilian life. all of us know the suffering that is taking place, as we speak. all of us are determined to see it end. >> joining me now is democratic congressman, dan goldman of new york. congressman, i believe i'm not mistaken, i think you were in israel when the actual attack happened. you've been very vocal in your support of israel's objective of eradicating hamas or getting rid of leadership and then defending themselves. you've also called for, i believe, a humanitarian pause. i'm curious how you think of

what that is and what it means. >> well look, i think a cease-fire is misapplied here. i don't actually quite know what it means. certainly, hamas, as you mentioned, continues to fire rockets. they continue to hold 240 hostages, including 31 children as young as nine months. they have done nothing other than to butcher and slaughter and rape and torture israelis, to indicate that there is any reason, any interests of theirs in peace or a cease-fire. and let's remember there have been many ceasefires between israel and hamas over the years, and there was one on october 6th. and on october 7th, hamas broke that cease-fire. and what is important about that is that you have to recognize that hamas is a terrorist organization, it does not represent the values and

the freedoms of the palestinian people who live in gaza. so, hamas is not only a threat to israel's peace and security, it's a threat to the gazans'peace, security, and prosperity. and so, the need to eradicate hamas is there not only for israel, it's there not only for the world, as a terrorist organization, but we need to do it also for the palestinian people. and that is why we have to recognize this is a war against hamas, it's not a war against the palestinian people. >> so, i guess the next question is, what level of destruction and death makes that calculation change? i mean, i understand lots of folks are understandably skeptical of any hamas lead agency that does administrative health, but i think all indications we have so far is that there's just enormous human suffering in gaza. thousands of civilians have

died. today, the strike at the refugee camp seems sort of like a perfect example of precisely the sort of situation. the idf says there were tunnels underneath a top hamas commander. in fact, someone active in planning october 7th. they struck, they say they struck that complex, and struck the tunnels beneath it. but there were buildings above it and there were clearly civilians in those buildings, clearly some of them are injured and some of them died. is there some level at which it becomes untenable to continue at this pace, if another 10,000 people lose their lives or 20? is there a limiting condition? >> it's absolutely devastating and heartbreaking to see the innocent lives that are perishing. all lives are equal and it's as devastating to see the palestinian deaths as it is the israeli deaths. we have to look at what the rules are for armed conflict. hamas does not play by the rules. they obviously put their

military structures and infrastructure under hospitals within the civilian population. when israel warns palestinians to leave particular targets, or to evacuate, hamas is well known to discourage them or even prevent them from doing it because their strategy is this propaganda strategy to use the civilians as human shields. and i agree though with jake sullivan that that is not sufficient to absolve israel of its obligations, to do everything it can to protect the innocent civilians. and you know, a lot of it comes down to the fog of war. if it is true, as israel claims, that there are those were military targets, that they were masterminds behind it, if israel did provide some degree of warning and they have been pretty consistently doing that, even though it's to their military strategic detriment, then they are abiding by the laws of our conflict.

and this is a war that hamas started, so there are, unfortunately, going to be deaths. the question is, what efforts is israel taking to do everything that it can to protect innocent civilians while also executing its military strategy? and that is where we really need to focus. >> yeah and again, it's a grim calculus here and it's a hypothetical, but i do just want to push on this because i think it's actually relevant to broadly domestic u.s. public opinion, broadly opinion across the world, the way that international actors will work, which is, if there is a process here that appears defensible to your mind, and i'm not saying whether it is or not, but a process that's defensible, i still wonder, is there some limiting condition, right? like, if this goes another six months at this pace, like, is there some point at which it just seems that the costs can't be supported? because it seems to me in the abstract there must be, right?

can you imagine coming to that point? >> well, i think part of the problem is that you're looking at the calculus from the wrong way. if hamas does not want its citizens or itself to die anymore, then it should turn over the hostages and it should surrender its weapons. no one's asking or calling on hamas to do much of anything to help the palestinian people and i think that the responsibility goes far beyond israel. it does include israel, but it also goes far beyond israel and it goes to egypt, and it goes to hamas, itself, which siphons off fuel and electricity, food, and water from its own people. and that is a very important aspect of this because my sense is this would be over a lot faster if hamas would give over the hostages. why are we not talking about the fact that there are 240 hostages that they continue to hold? >> no, i mean, i couldn't agree more. i think morally, there's just no question. i mean, they just slaughtered

men, women, and children in their sleep, so i don't think like anyone has any delusions about them as an entity, right? to me, the more the question is the leverage, right? i mean, if the u.s. had leverage to get hamas to release the hostages, it would be insane for us not to use that, obviously. it's just that it doesn't seem like we have a ton of that, right? i mean, the asymmetry here isn't so much a moral asymmetry, as just an asymmetry of other relationships are with the two combatants in this war. whatever you think about the do combatants, like i don't disagree with you. i am just saying yeah, if we could control what hamas did. that would be a very different world. but that is not the world we live in, right? >> yeah, but we can't just accept that as a given and therefore put all the responsibility on israel to do everything, many things that hamas should be doing. and israel absolutely must abide by the laws of our conflict.

they must abide by international humanitarian law, they must ensure that food, water, and medical supplies, and shelter, gets to those people who have been evacuated. because of israel's war effort. but hamas also needs to take responsibility for its own people. unfortunately, it has siphoned away billions of dollars designed for the gazan people for its own terror network and intricate tunnels where they are now keeping the hostages, and now using the fuel and the electricity that is much needed by the civilians. so, i'm not saying israel can do whatever it wants. obviously, it has to abide by the laws of armed conflict, but there is no metric here where you say, oh, the laws of armed conflict only apply of until 10,000 deaths. after that, you know, and so we really do need to look at the facts on the ground and make sure that israel is providing, is allowing that humanitarian aid to get in, is doing what it can to warn and protect the civilians, and that is what their obligation is. if hamas persuades the

civilians to stay and not to evacuate areas that israel has told them that they will be bombing, well, that's not israel's fault. and so, part of this is yes, there is an asymmetrical moral high ground here, a moral clarity as to who is willing to do what, and obviously, hamas is at the, very bottom. they are subhuman, what they did to the israeli civilians. but that has to also factor into the calculus. so, when you are seeing israel has a right to defend themselves but we need a cease fire, well, how are they able to then defend themselves? they've declared war because hamas started this war. how can israel defend itself if you're saying oh no, no, you know, you can't possibly continue a military operation to get your own hostages back? certainly, no one said that after 9/11. no one said that after pearl harbor. and i think that's important to keep in mind. >> all right, congressman dan goldman, the congressman from new york, thank you so much for your time tonight sir, appreciate it. >> thank you.

>> joining me now is waleed shahid, democratic and progressive strategist, he's he's worked for the justice democrats and been working with people in that caucus of house democrats calling for a cease-fire. tell me first of all about what the status of that is within the democratic party right now, how would you characterize it? >> i think the movement is growing in the public and there are a number of sponsors, 18 sponsors for the cease-fire now resolution, the collision coalition is growing, it's a multi-faith and multi generational movement. we also have a number of people such as the congressman calling for a humanitarian pause, which i think is a step forward in a step closer to cease fire. i think in a couple days, couple of weeks, you will start to see more members of congress calling for both humanitarian pause and the cease-fire. but yeah, i think the vast majority of democrats are still stuck on representative goldman 's talking points, which are essentially an argument for war. i was very disappointed to hear

the representative comments just, now these are the same comments made about why the u.s. had to occupy afghanistan, occupy iraq, with no endgame insight. in sight. there is no plan for what to do after hamas is obliterated at all. and i think comments like the one the representative just made, there is no plan and no end to how many palestinian civilians or israeli civilians have to die, or until democrats start to, say members of congress or to say, it it's enough. and everyone know there is going to be a point where we will say it's enough, because every time the israeli, says as the israeli government says, not -- gaza is the longest -- in gaza, there is a cease-fire in gaza, is just a matter of how many people die until nine. then. >> i think the stated goal of the israeli defense forces in this is not to quote unquote mow the lawn, but get rid of hamas, they viewed in those terms.

yeah, sorry. so, first of all, and second of all, it seems like the lack of a plan sort of goes in both directions, which is to say a cease-fire is a thing you do tomorrow. but two people that say hamas needs to -- it is intolerable to allow them to continue to go as they are right now, what is the response to that? >> i think it's a great question. i think we have a government and a partner in israel that has never empowered the palestinian leadership in the west bank to actually reach a settlement, a final status settlement about what to do with the two state solution. we have a far-right israeli government that opposes palestinian statehood very openly. so the united states must use it's diplomatic and financial leverage with our ally, the ally we fund militarily, to put pressure on them to empower the secular authorities in the west bank who have been the

leadership of the palestinian people, but have never been empowered to actually be at the same table and negotiate in recent years with the israelis. we've gone further and further from a two state solution, as netanyahu and this government expands settlements. i don't think hamas should be empowered to come back with any armed capability in gaza. but there does need to be a diplomatic settlement. the idea that there is a military solution to hamas and to the israeli palestinian conflict is absurd. we have tried that, every four years of the past two decades, we have tried a military solution to hamas's rise in gaza. and it has never worked. we have actually -- in afghanistan just recently, we've had the previous, this president, president biden, and president trump negotiate with the taliban, who are equally if not more horrendous than hamas. but because we saw that there was no military solution to what was happening in afghanistan, we have empowered diplomatic efforts to try to

end violence. that said, i just don't think that member some congress, many of them, don't see our accountability greater than the country we find in the military we fund. >> we'll lead shaheed waleed shaheed, thank you for your time tonight. -- trump family and business. what kind of information might they be compelled to share? that is next. re that is next what if we need to see a doctor away from home? ucard gets you in with medicare advantage's largest national provider network. how 'bout using it at the pharmacy? yes - your ucard is all you need. huh - that's easy! can it help keep my smile looking good? yep! use your ucard at the dentist. say cheese! get access to what matters with the ucard only from unitedhealthcare.

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doing, you see the checks, you see the wire transfer, you wonder why the grandchildren are getting checks in the chinese government. those are all reasonable questions. and yet, no one asks them. our mainstream media, the people in d. c. unwilling to ask it, but they want to throw trump in jail for thousand years, and or the death penalty. it's truly sick, but this is why we fight. >> that was donald trump's son, don jr., giving his attempt at a rendition of a coherent argument last night on newsmax, having a little trouble, -- death of donald trump, he said. but there's no evidence of secret tracks, wire transfers to biden's grandchildren, patently false. the claim that the -- presumably prosecutors trying don't trump various criminal cases went in the form president didn't president the death penalty. not true. nevertheless, that guy, that incredibly adapt but

rhetorician, don junior, who's been making the rounds on media, spewing false claims rather incoherently, that dude is scheduled to take the witness stand tomorrow in manhattan in a courtroom. sworn to tell the whole truth as part of a 250 million dollar civil fraud trial lawyer he, his father, brother, and other trump executives were already found i believe finally inflating the value of assets. the non jury bench trial will determine the amount of the damages. donald junior's brother eric will also take the witness stand likely on thursday, but it could happen as soon as tomorrow. next week, donald trump himself is set to appear on the witness stand, as well as his daughter ivanka. barbara mcquade is a former u.s. attorney for the new york eastern district, msnbc legal analyst, and she joins me now. let's start here. it's sort of while the family is going to sit for this. i guess the first question is obviously given the absolute constitutional right against self incrimination under the fifth amendment, that can be invoked at anytime, even in

civil impeding's. we saw it during some of the questioning of the general january sixth committee testimony. do we have any anticipation that any of them will invoke that right in their testimony in this civil trial? >> yeah, chris, i think it's quite possible during their depositions, donald trump in eric trump invoked their fifth amendment rights against self incrimination in this case 400 or 500 times. >> right. >> as you point, out there is no criminal exposure in this case because it's a civil case. but of course, anytime you see some thing under oath in court, it can be used against you anywhere, including any subsequent criminal prosecution. so that's why it might be something that they want to do rather than the line to commit perjury or say something that might expose themselves to criminal prosecution. but one thing that's really different in a civil case from a criminal case, where the fact finders instructed that you may not use against a person in any way the fact that they've

invoked their fifth amendment right against self incrimination. in a civil case like this one, the fact finder, judge engoron, can use the fact of the invocation of the fifth amendment as an adverse inference against the person who cited it. so if someone says a question, and they say i invoke my fifth amendment, the judge can say no, i guess that answer would've been pretty bad. so that's the consequence in a civil case like this. so a lot of strategic decision-making that will need to take place by the trump children. >> yeah, that's a cruel -- that's a crucial difference i want to stay on it for a second. in a criminal trial, you cannot and its bedrock important part of american jurisprudence, you can't put someone on the stage, and be like, did you do it? and they say i take the fifth, we'll, see, you must have been behind. to hide. in a civil context where there is not the states criminal apparatus hanging over someone, the invocation of the fifth can be understood as an adverse admission of something or at least taken as --

you can make an inference about what the answer would've been. in this case, it's the judge would do so. >> yeah, that's right, because there's no jury in this case. it's a judge, just a fact finder. and sometimes judges are able to compartmentalize a little better than juries are so maybe this judge just disregards it. but in a criminal case, all that invocation of the fifth amendment is done offstage, outside the presence of the jury, a defendant's asked whether he plans to testify or not testify so that the jury doesn't see that awkward moment where the defendant invokes the fifth amendment right against self incrimination, they simply don't take the stand, and they're instructed to not hold it against the defendant in any way. in a civil case, not so much. the person comes on the stand, they may answer a handful of questions, they may invoke the fifth against a handful of questions. it may be one question, it may be many. but the judge is free to draw the difference. inference. >> yeah, our understanding is that don junior is expected to be grilled by lawyers from state attorney general letitia

james office in his involvement in and knowledge of financial statements the attorney general says were grossly inflated. that's the topic of that question, and we're going to have to all stay tuned to see how they handle it, whether he tries to defend himself, whether he pleads the fifth or does some combination of the two, it'll be very interesting to see how they make those decisions. barbara mcquade as always, thank you very much. >> thanks, chris. >> when we come, back hamas says it may release more foreign hostages in the coming, days even as it continues to release videos of those held captive for propaganda purposes. the man who until last month lead u.s. hostage rescue efforts for the u.s. government joins us next to discuss. every day, more dog people, and more vets are deciding

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today that the number of hostages remain in gaza after hamas's deadly attack rose to 230. 240. 33 those hostages are children, like these three-year-old twins, emma and julie ranaan who were captured with their parents and other relatives on october 7th. one of those relatives, danielle aloni, is the woman speaking in this propaganda video that hamas released this week, calling on israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu to secure their release. it's not clear if her remarks or coerced to whether we shoes allowed to speak freely, although obviously she's under hamas's hostage. that video comes as hamas indicated today that would free some hostages in the coming weeks.

days. a spokesperson for the group said the group will release a number oforeign nationals is holding hostage but it's not clear when or how many people will be free. that comes amid news that idea idea soldier ori megidish has reunited with her family. she was rescued by the israeli military during that ground operation in gaza that's hard five days ago. she is one of a handful of people that's free since the start of the conflict. judith renaan and daughter natalie were the first israeli americans released, after qatar broke or no negotiations. three days leader, nourit cooper and yocheved lifshitz lipschitz was released in a prison -- qatar is in a position to lead these negotiations as it closes hosts hamas's political bureau and a u.s. political base. and assigned that negons could be reaching another phase, israel said the head of the mossad, its national intelligence agency, to qatar to meet with senior security qatari officials to secure the

release of more hostages. chris o'leary is the former directly of u.s. hostage rescue, and he joins me now. it's great to have you here in new york. >> good to be here, chris. >> so, just take me through, a ground level, because you've got the israeli government saying hamas is equivalent to i. s. i. s. and the nazis and reeling from this brutal murder of its citizens. they have 248 israelis and other nationals. the head of mossad is in doha, and he is not going to negotiate with them? like, how does that work? >> well, they have to do, because they have limited options otherwise. although they did have a successful rescue as parlor part of their ground operations, i think as we get the full story on that is probably not one of the hostages held by hamas, but more likely either palestinian islamic jihad, which i still don't think that would've been the case or maybe one of the disparate affiliates.

hamas has been trying to seize control of all the hostages. so as the ground operation was ongoing, there are opportunities to maybe get some of the folks that are more accessible. >> that is interesting, okay. >> but that's not to say they won't continue to try to collect intelligence, illuminating the network, try to find where the hostages are and seek opportunities to recover. at the end of the day, the special operations and intelligence forces that do the hostage rescue and recovery of the top here. to your. they are problem solvers. they are not wishing for an environment that is ideal. they are working within the confines of what they've been. given and they will try to find solutions. and i have every confidence that they will continue to work on this. but what the mature approach is to also try negotiate at the same time, understanding that you don't have a legitimate partner in the negotiations, it's hamas, they are a terrorist organization. palestinian islamic jihad is a terrorist organization, which

many people don't know is borne out of egyptian islamic jihad, where al-zawahiri is one of the founding members of. so understand what we're dealing with. these are islamists who just carried out on october 7th a horrific attack. they are not rational actors in this negotiations. they are taking steps to be manipulative. each and every member that they may, releasing the video of the hostages yesterday for propaganda was to pool leverage back to their side. >> yeah, it also strikes me that you can be manipulative and rational. there is some back and forth here where for the negotiations even to exist, there is some conception that the other side has some interest and you have some interest, and you can find some way that they're mutually recognizable, such that peoples lives are spared. that's basically the goal here. but in terms of how they actually, happen the head of mossad isn't sitting down with someone with hamas, right?

>> i would find a very unlikely, although there have been times in the past were israeli intelligence has been face to face with members of hamas and other palestinian groups. so it wouldn't be out of the question. i'd say it's most likely they are not to use the qataris as an intermediary. i have been involved in talks in doha where all parties have sat around the table, but with the current situation insensitivity, i think it would be unusual where we would see the actual head of the mossad across the table with -- or somebody else. >> and someone who has done this kind of work, i guess it's a such a subjective question. but i think it's so critical to think about those folks being held captive, like, what hope do you have for more hostages being released? >> i think it's very likely. i think it's going to be done overtime. hamas is not going to just open up the gates and let everybody free. hamas will likely, as is being reported, released some of the

international victims, but not all of them. anybody who is a dual passport holder from certain countries, my assessment is they would hold on to them, because again, it gives them leverage, they're able to manipulate the environment later for longer. but i do think that getting more international support and some of the leverage back on their side, they will release some. but this is going to drag out overtime. and those israeli military members in uniform could be held for years. >> the idf soldier gilad shalit was taken by hamas and held for many years before he was released in that prisoner swap. >> 2011. >> chris o'leary, thanks for being here. >> coming up, stars of david graffitied on the streets of paris, disturbing pogrom-like scenes in russia, the disturbing spike in anti-semitic scenes around the world, that's next.

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holocaust the nazi party ordered graffiti like this. what you see there is the jewish symbol star of david be plastered over jewish shops and homes, singling our jewsih people to terrify them. these photos are from 1930. 1938. and now this is footage out of paris, france, overnight, around 60 stars of david spray painted around buildings in the southern district of paris.

authorities in france do not know who is responsible or what their motives were, but given the history of the symbol, the act is being investigated as a potential hate crime. since hamas's attack on israel october 7th, some 850 antisemitic acts have been reported to the authities in france. as of this sunday, france has made more than 400 arrests for antisemitic acts. the rise in antisemitism around the world since hamas's attack on israel is undeniable. we have seen synagogues defaced. antisemitic graffiti. just tonight a cnell university student was arrested, charged after dly posting threats online that he would shoot up the university's kosher dining hall. patrick dai i-21 year old junior at cornell,lledly posted messages online threatening to stab the throat of jews on campus, amg other threats. scheduled to appear in court tomorrow and faces up to five years in prison. the october 7th attack itself was the worst massacre of jewish people since the holocaust.

the terror inflicted from that attack is not just the barbarism that happened that day, but the reawakening of the deep cultural trauma of the kinds of attacks jewish people have faced for centuries. this weekend hundreds of people stormed an airport in dagestan, in southern russia, and they held signs that reportedly said things like we are against jewish refugees, and there is no place for child killers in dagestan. this is after reports of an inbound flight from israel. they pushed past security, they went on to the tarmac, they were looking what they believed to be was a plane filled with jews from israel, plane that social media posts -- full mob scene. thankfully, they did not find what they were looking for, but still at least 20 people were injured. dozens more were arrested. this event in dagestan has been called a lot of different things, but a protest riot, a mob, but there is the specific word for exactly this kind of

ethnically targeted violent mob behavior, particularly against jews, particularly again jews in russia, a pogrom. before the holocaust, the worst massacre of jewish people was a series of hu of massacres or pogrom -- pogroms some of the images we are about to show you are disturbing. so, if you would like to turn away now you can do so. we've also played some of the faces to make these images last graphic. -- we don't want to obscure that. like what happened in dagestan this weekend. pogroms we're often mobs of civilians, jim ginned up -- for decades, jewish people had their homes destroyed, property, stolen families moved murdered, just because they were jewish. there was always some

conspiracy tied to it all, like when russians blamed the jews for the assassination of the russian czar in 1881. there's also a deep-seated prejudice against jewish people that makes scapegoating light like that tragically easy. there is now a tragic and and raging surf fight surfeit of evidence -- but chasing and harassing jewish people for any reason in support of any alleged cause is, and it's -- d it's - it's lying dormant, waiting... and could reactivate. shingles strikes as a painful, blistering rash that can last for weeks. and it could wake at any time. think you're not at risk for shingles? it's time to wake up. because shingles could wake up in you. if you're over 50, talk to your doctor or pharmacist about shingles prevention.

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requested 105 billion former aide foreign aid package for congress, newly minted republican house speaker mike johnson came back with the stand-alone measure to provide funding just for israel, tony totally spl offkraine, even taking a step further by flying back that same amount for irs funding provided by a landmark isa biden legislation,

the inflation reduction act. speaker johnson promoted that planned interview with fox news today. >> do you think that will drive away some democrats in the senate even? or here in the house? >> it may, but my intention is to co-leader schumer over there and have a very direct and thoughtful conversation about this. i understand their priority is to bulk up the irs. but i think if you put this to the american people and they weigh the two needs, i think they are going to say, standing with israel and protecting the innocent over their easy in our national interest and is a more immediate need than irs agents. >> as you might expect, leader schumer's not having that. as for senate republican leader mitch mcconnell, so far, he's not giving speaker johnson stand-alone plan much encouragement either. >> their price for helping israel and abandoning americas responsibilities around the globe? making it much easier for the ultrarich to cheat on their taxes. how the heck could that be their highest priority? it's only when the hard right

governs the republican caucus. >> in order to make a law you have to pass both -- and we will see if the bill comes out of the house and if so what kind of a margin it has. >> this is speaker johnson's first major legislative move -- govern honestly should, not be a difficult one. and yet charlie dense, former republican congressman from pennsylvania. he served six terms in the house from 2005 to 2018. he joins me now. first, what do you think about -- there is a lot here that is wild to me. number one that usually emergency spending like this you don't offset or have pay force for. secondly, this isn't a pay forward, is gonna cost deficit more because you get back last text tax revenue. and furthermore, it just seems like delay. doa. what do you think of this is a first deal from speaker mike johnson? >> a simple sop to the hard-liners within the conference. so the attempt to passable a vote like, this they're going

to the senate, they will strip it out it will strip out the pay for. and then the live funding for ukraine, the border, and disaster assistance in all likelihood. that's what will happen, i suspect. i would not have launched this way. they don't have a lot of time to be messing around with these things. i was on the appropriations committee, and you need a bipartisan consensus in the bill. -- and certainly the senate will need 60 votes to pass. but it's going to pass. so, the house will probably get jammed at the end of the process. >> that's what i think, as well. here's my thing. so they pass this, they send it to the senate, they get jammed by the senate. at some point, then what happens? does mike johnson bill bring that bill to the floor? and you're just going to pass it by and house republicans say that's fine, we knew where this would end up? or is there another rebellion? >> look, i suspect speaker

johnson is going to have to bring up the senate bill. if he doesn't bring up the senate bill, you'll have to shut down. you'll have a shutdown. i also get the sense that many of the hard-liners who took out kevin mccarthy might be willing to give mike johnson some slack on his first continued resolution to fund the government. what i'm curious to see is just how long they want to pass this continuing resolution for. i suspect the senate would like to pass it into december. i get the sense that speaker johnson is talking about passing it into january or maybe even to april. so that's another bone of contention. but bottom line is, i think speaker johnson's going to be given some slack from his the hard-liners, who took out kevin mccarthy, i think, more for personal reasons than any particular policyatter. >> that's what politico is reporting today that most are drmember say they're willing to give johnson to remove maneuver on a continual resolution. but given the short timeline its own history as a quote,

conservative eyeliner. i want to ask you about of another bit of news that developed over the weekend. it's funny because i think in an alternate universe it would've been a huge deal that we would be covering a lot, which is mike pence's announcement that he's dropping out of the race for president. he was at a republican event in vegas over the weekend. here's what he had to say. >> this is not my time. so after much prayer in deliberation, i have decided to suspend my campaign for president, effective today. >> were you surprised by that? what do you think of it? >> i'm not at all surprised >> i think he's right. this was not his time. and frankly, it's not his party anymore, either. nor mine, i should note. mike pence has run as more of a traditional socially conservative candidate in a party that really is very much more populist these days. when mike pence was at his prime, he was one of the leaders of the ideological

purity police, who wanted to enforce certain amount of doctrine here thinking within the republican party, whether it was on abortion or gun rights or the economy. but since trump came on the scene, trump, we can say what we will about him, he was not ideological or doctrine air. he was pragmatic to a fault. he had an fixed policy decisions and they shifted all the time. of course mike pence is just the opposite. very fixed and rigid positions. that's not where this party is anymore. it's populist. and it's really more about anger than it is about any particular policy positions. it's more about eight outrage and grievance, frankly. it has been almost a policy free zone under trump. i think pence and some other candidates are trying to bring it back to policy. whether you agree with their policies or not. >> form republican congressman charlie dent, thank you for making time first. tonight that is a supervised supersize double stuffed, all in, the