good to be with you. i'm katy tur. there is a lot of building anticipation right now as we watch the wires out of israel. the israeli government could be on the verge of announcing a huge deal to free a large number of hostages. a senior u.s. official along

with one source familiar tell nbc news that it is all up to israel right now. that there is a tentative deal in place, which is just waiting on sign off from prime minister netanyahu. we have the details on who would be freed and on what conditions in a moment. after all, it would be a major milestone in this now seven-week war and one that could steer the conflict into a new phase. as we speak, netanyahu is said to be in a sequence of meetings with cabinet ministers waiting on a vote from those ministers. there's also context on why the deal is so close right now. yesterday, netanyahu faced serious pressure from hostage families to make their loved ones a first, not second, priority of this war. we have the details on that tense meeting. his first by the way, along with a shouting match in israel's parliament as a far right minister tried to shutdown pleas from a man whose cousin was

kidnapped. let's sort out what we know now. joining us from tel aviv is raf sanchez. let's start with this hostage deal. i understand there are new details. what are they? >> we just spoke to a senior israeli official and this is the first time we are hearing from the israeli government about this tentative agreement that as we speak is being considered by the israeli cabinet. 50 hostages, womenchilen, released over four days in exchange for a four-day cease fire and israel agreeing to release 150 palestinian women and chire from israeli prisons. this senior official telling nbc news a number of mechanisms and a lot of detail about this deal that we did not know before. for starters, katy, there is an option to extend this deal beyond the initial 50 hostages.

this official tells us that if hamas releases an additional ten hostages, they will get an additional day of cease fire and this official says that could continue indefinitely. they say israel is skeptical and they will watch and see whether or not hamas delivers on these first 50, but there is the option to extend this deal further. this official also telling nbc news israel is not negotiating on behalf of the nonisraeli hostages. they say israel will only release palestinian prisoners in exchange for israeli citizens. now, that does include dual nationals and this official is quick to point out that most of the americans being held in gaza now are dual u.s. israeli nationals so they would be covered by these israeli negotiations. this official also pointing out that under israeli law that the

victims of terrorism have the option to appeal to the israeli supreme court to block the release of palestinians involved in those crimes. so any deal which could be approved tonight could only go into effect at the earliest tomorrow once that 24 hour period has passed. this official says look, the supreme court has never stepped in before to derail one of these high stakes negotiations, but it's possible it could happen this time. the official says of those 150 palestinian prisoners who israel is prepared to release as part of this deal, none of them directly killed israelis themselves. their convictions are for things like carrying explosives to the scene of an attack or driving attackers. >> let me ask you about the deal in terms of the cease fire. what that would encompass as far as we know right now. >> so, four-day cease fire.

both sides agreeing to essentially freeze their military positions. these deals are hard to negotiate. they can be even harder to uphold because we have a situation where not far from where we are now, there were thousands of israeli troops inside of gaza city just streets way by from fighters from both hamas and palestinian islamic jihad, so making sure those forces donn fi on each other and collapse the deal will be complicat. this official also says israel has agreed to suspend overhead drone flights for a certain number of hours each day over gaza. that is to give hamas the confidence that they can move around and gather these hostages who are being held in a number of different locations across gaza without being trapped by israeli drones. so a lot of moving parts here, katy, including the role of the red cross who we expect would be the ones taking these hostages from hamas custody over the

border and returning them to israel. >> raf, thank you so much. joining us now is eamon. you've been involved in the reporting surrounding this deal. what has it taken to get to this point? >> a lot. a lot of very delicate negotiations. a little bit of confidence building measure. a lot of difficult communications. some of the negotiations taking place from hamas' side require communications between its exiled political hero which is in doha and its military wng in gaza. some of the responses have been logistical. but because there are so many moving parts to it, it has been nearly impossible to get everybody on the same page. >> how much has the u.s. been involved? >> substantially involved. it has been involved in it from day one. the united states has tremendous amount of leverage with israel. it has an amazing relationship with qatar, excellent

relationship with egypt. it does not have a relationship with hamas. qatar has been the intermediary for the most part. the u.s. has brought a lot of both diplomatic pressure. it has also offered to try as much as it can to ensure successful cease fire. logistically. there are some questions as to whether or not the border between egypt and gaza can sustain 300 to 400 trucks every day. so that is a logistical undertaking that the united states -- >> why? >> it was never built as a passage, terminal passage f big container trucks. they want toensure everything that goes in is secured, doesn't have weapons in it, doesn't have anything that can be used in conflict. so the humanitarian part of getting trucks and food into gaza was normally done through the israeli side. it was done through multiple borders because israel had the

capacity and a longer border to do that. the border between egypt and gaza was mostly for foot traffic and occasionally small cars. now you're talking about overhauling it. >> from your reporting, what does hamas think they're going to be getting out of this? why would hamas have any desire to release hostages? what's their incentive? >> that's a good question. some of the statements they've made publicly. two of their leaders spoke a short while ago. held a press conference in beirut. they didn't speak about the hostage deal, but they have been talking about their, the strength of their people being able to withstand days of this heavy bombardment and still not capitulating. just being able to survive and withstand is a victory. having these conversations about what has been achiere a it's still very early to say

there's been anything achieved. once the hostages are released, that's going to be a huge relief for the families but for the palestinians inside gaza, a third of the gaza strip, 46% of homes. 5,000 children. the unicef saying it's a horrific milestone. it is hard to assess what they calculate as being the gain in all of this. >> are you hearing push from within gaza for hamas to surrender? stop doing this and bombardment will stop? >> to be fair, i haven't had a chance to speak with anyone on that capacity because communications are so difficult. so limited. i can assure you that conversation is happening in broader palestinian circles and sometimes, the further removed you are away from the conflict, the tone of the discussion is very different. palestinians are questioning what is the price that palestinians in gaza have had to pay for everything since october 7th. for what hamas did. that is one of the strategic

objectives of israel has been to make the price of october 7th so costly for palestinians that they reconsider and we know that from previous wars that israel has gone into with hezbollah for example in 2006. the leader of hezbollah famously said had he known the price lebanon was going to pay for what started the war in 2006, he would have recalibrated the capturing of israeli soldiers. i think that discussion will take place among palestinian society and organizations in weeks to come. >> thanks so much for coming on. always appreciate you talking about your reporting. appreciate it. joining us now, independent journalist who's been covering the con fligt for decades. let's talk about benjamin netanyahu and why he would be in a position or a mood to negotiate on the hostages right now. >> well, he's been blasted for failing to bring basically any hostages out over the last now

seven weeks of war. we're in the seventh week of war. and yesterday as you described was really a disgraceful day in which his own ministers and members of his coalition attacked families of hostages. they represent a small minority point of view, but they have the platform in parliament. there's just a general feeling that something had to give. but i have to underscore that this is a deal right now we're talking about the release of about 50 hostages as raf said out of 240. and so what we're really talking about is a sort of capitulation in which the israeli government is accepting that for the next x number of days, hamas is going to dangle before it, we're going to now release three more, four more. and this can go on for numerous, numerous days and the israeli

government is going to be crushed into a position where either it capitulates into hamas' demand. hamas is interested in a truce or the israeli government will have to face those remaining families and say to them we are resuming bombing. we're resuming destroying gaza and we know your relatives are there. >> that's an interesting or difficult choice they're going to have to make. let me play that moment you referred to where some of the members of netanyahu's far right coalition started screaming down hostage family members yesterday. we have that video. let's play it. video let's play it. explain what we just saw. >> what we just saw is an almost

indescribable scene in which the minister of national security of israel, the minister in charge of police who is a right wing rouzier who's never before held public office until netanyahu gave him this job. a man convicted of terror associations in the past is screaming. as you saw family members holding up posters of their loved ones who are hostages in gaza and he's basically saying to them you don't have a monopoly on pain. you're not going to tell us what to do. the context of that hearing is that he proposed introducing into israel a death penalty for terrorists. israel does not have a death penalty at the moment. this is hugely controversial and the families feel that puts the lives of their loved ones in danger. >> thank you very much. coming up next, what does it mean for the next stage of the war if 50 hostages are released?

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thank you for being with us. what do you know about this hostage deal? >> it's probably one of the hardest decisions any government has to make. how do you say no to the release of 50 women, children, old people. the families have been in indescribable pain for the last almost two months now. that goes without saying. on the other hand, we've now created a precedent of a cease fire. hamas needs a cease fire. hamas, they win. they get away with mass murder. they survive. it means the 250,000 israelis who have been evacuated can't go

back. if you have kids, would you go back knowing hamas is reorganizing? it means the whole process starts over again and we've lost 62 soldiers. have to go to those families and say hey, your kids may have died for nothing. then as the terrorists are going to get released from prisons and families are going to appeal to the supreme court and say you can't do this. what about my family. and at the end of the day, there's actually no good decision. i don't know the actual decision making process. i think the sense is that hamas may drag this out. after four days of the cease fire, well, we gave you 15, 20. we can't locate the others. let's have another five days. hamas is not an honest broker, negotiator. it's done this repeatedly in the past. so it's full of dangers. full of risk. at the end of the day, i don't think the israeli government could look those families in the

eye and say your kids aren't coming home. >> netanyahu hasn't been looking them in the eye until yesterday. there's been a lot of criticism of him. his political future hinges very much on what is happening right now. there are some that say he's got no political future and there are some that are arguing that all of his decisions are complicated by his desire to stay in office and stay out of prison. >> does he have a political future? probably not. does he believe he does? he does. will he fight it? probably. nobody knows right now. you know, in israel, people take responsibility. i don't think anybody resigned after pearl harbor, after 9/11. in israel, can't get away with that. so the chief of staff has come out and said i take responsibility. the head of military intelligence, i take responsibility. the head of fbi, i take

responsibility, which is really code for when this is over, 'm going to resign. netanyahu hasn't done that. he's only said there's going to be hard questions. i think he's going to put up a fight and could resign. we don't know. right now, everyone's focused on the war, on this hostage deal and the pain of the hostage deal and the danger of the deal. >> what's it look like if these hostages are released? potentially more? what does the war like after that? thousands are dead. the north is uninhabitable and there's bombings starting in the south. what happens after this? >> i think one thing, they're going to drag it out as far as possible. hamas can't release all of the hostages. let's game this out. hamas release all the hostages and fighting resumes, israel's going to flood those tunnels. that's what you do if you're fighting an enemy that has 300 miles of tunnels beneath the surface and you can't get in.

we've lost many soldiers just trying to get into the openings of these tunnels. so the hostages are the ultimate human shields. for hamas, a last get out of gaza free card. house is completely surrounded and it has no other options. they'll say okay, we'll give you those hostages but let us have free passage out of here because that's what they did in 1982. so there's a precedent for that. but let's be clear about this. the only reason hamas is negotiating is because israel went into that gaza strip and forced it to negotiate. without that pressure, we wouldn't be having this discussion. >> ambassador, really good to have you in person. hopefully today some good news in this ongoing horror we've been watching unfold. >> coming up, one of donald trump's codefendants could be thrown back in jail. what d.a. fani willis says harrison floyd did to intimidate

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herself to argue the case. joining us from atlanta, blaine alexander. what's floyd accused of saying and to whom? >> it comes down to social media post. today was the reading and rereading of posts and the interpretation. really a lot of it is focusing on referencing gabriel sterling, the secretary of state and ruby freeman. we all remember she is one of two georgia election workers who received a lot of harassment after they were accused of cheating in 2020. so he is facing charges directly in response to his interactions with ruby freeman in the first place. what we saw today with the reading of a number of not just tweets he posted, but the comments, responses from others who read those tweets and d.a. making the case it amounts to

threats. his lawyer pushed back and is saying this is a first amendment issue. these weren't intimidating. certainly didn't violate the terms of his bond agreement. but this was an unusual hearing for a number of reasons. chief among them, willis was in the room asking the questions. we've not seen that. in fact, we've not seen her appear in official capacity in this case since august when she had the news conference announcing the indictment. one of the witnesses she called was gabriel sterling. here's what he had to say on the stand. take a look. >> how many times a day are you tagged on posts? >> a lot. yes, sir. >> if you were threatened or intimidated, would you contact law enforcement? >> if i thought it rose to that level, i would contact law enforcement. >> and you didn't in this case. >> no, sir.

>> so his was probably the shortest testimony out of all of them, but of course it comes down to what the judge decides. now, he can take the most extreme route and that's put floyd back in jail in which case he'd have to stay there. the d.a. is hoping to take this trial in august of next year. or he could issue him a warning and tell him to stop posting. >> thank you very much. coming up, we are turning back to the israel hamas war. what netanyahu just said about the possible hostage deal. netat the possible hostage deal. mysek with my moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis symptoms. with my psoriatic arthritis symptoms. but just ok isn't ok. and i was done settling. if you still have symptoms after a tnf blocker like humira or enbrel, rinvoq is different and may help. rinvoq is a once-daily pill that can rapidly relieve joint pain, stiffness, and swelling in ra and psa. relieve fatigue for some... and stop joint damage. and in psa, can leave skin clear or almost clear. rinvoq can lower your ability

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it appears israel in ministers have voting now on whether to accept the deal with hamas. earlier, netanyahu told them voting yes was the right decision and security forces within israel support it. the israeli government says hamas would free 50 women and children over four days. officials also say there is an option to extend the cease fire for extra days in return for ten hostages per day. joining us again from tel aviv is raf sanchez. am i right to say the voting happening right now? >> the vote may be happening now. the cabinet is meeting. we don't know exactly what stage of this marathon meeting they're in. but the israeli government just released remarks that netanyahu made to his cabinet at the start

of the meeting. those are remarks that happened at about 1:00 p.m. eastern. what you heard basically was netanyahu making the case to his ministers to vote in favor of this deal. he told them this is a difficult decision but it is the right decision. he reassured them as you said that the israeli security forces, the military, the mehsud intelligence agency, the domestic security agency, that they support this deal. they believe it won't threaten the security of either israel or israeli troops operating inside of gaza right now. the prime minister saying something interesting. we did not know previously. he says that he asked president biden to intervene in these negotiations and that the president improved the terms of the deal in israel's favor. we don't know exactly what he means by that, but he seems to be implying that president biden changed the terms here so that

israel's getting more hostages out in return for paying less. we have not yet heard from the white house about any intervention by the president but we know that president biden has been speaking to the mayor of qatar as well as to the israeli government in recent days. the other point he stressed is that as far as israel is concerned, this is a temporary cease fire to get these hostages out and that the war continues on the other side. he is stressing to this right wing, in some cases, far right wing cabinet, this israel is committed to its goal of defeating hamas in gaza, making sure they no longer control the territory. it is a goal they have not described how they plan to achieve. the lot of people in the u.s. government, around the world, very skeptical about how israel is going to defeat hamas not just as a military organization, but idea, and how they're going

to secure the peace given the absolute devastation in gaza and massive loss of civilian life, but netanyahu telling his cabinet that as far as he is concerned, the war continues. >> israel's biggest ally, the united states, say it has to be a two state solution. can't be israel retaeking territory but has to be a two state solution. one other question for you. in terms of the cabinet voting on this, do they need to vote affirmatively? does there need to be a majority in order for netanyahu to accept these terms? >> prime minister netanyahu needs a majority vote of the israeli cabinet for this deal to go ahead. every indication is that he has the votes. this is a coalition government as you know. it is parties from the political right and a number of parties from the far right and we have

heard from these two small far right parties that they plan to oppose this agreement. now, that may not matter. there are some 30 something ministers in this overall government. they include a lot of ministers from netanyahu's own party who are going to vote with them. they include some ministers from the center right national unity party who joined this government during the war. they were in the opposition. they joined this government. it seems clear netanyahu has the votes in the cabinet but we will see what the tallies are when they come through. >> we're going to be watching for the tallies if that vote has started. joining us from the white house is aaron gillcrist. raf set you up perfectly. netanyahu saying he called president biden to get him involved. what do we know from your end of the reporting? >> we know that president biden

has had several calls, at least weekly, sometimes more, with the israeli prime minister. but we also know as raf referenced, the president has been talking to the qataris as well. i went through my e-mail and found a readout from a friday phone call the president had with the mayor of qatar where he said the leaders discussed the urgent need for all hostages to be released without further delay. that's what we got from the readout. you can imagine the president speaking to the amir of qatar would have been pushing for qatar to put more pressure on hamas to finalize the details of a deal. we also know that last week, last monday, a member of the national security team, the president's coordinator for middle east affairs was sent to the region. brett mcgirk was able to go into tel aviv, the west bank, qatar, egypt and other places. and his primary goal in doha and qatar was to work on the release

of hostages. a source familiar with the negotiations telling me today that mcgirk was intimately involved in these final stages of negotiations. the national security council spokesperson john kirby did speak today. he didn't want to confirm the details, but he did say there were still some approvals yet to be had. he suggested that there was still a need for hamas to get final approval but all indications we've seen from our crews on the ground is that this is something that hamas is backing and likely to go through. >> the ca director was also in the region. he speaks arabic. also trying to push for a hostage release as well. thank you very much for joining us. joining us now, senior fellow at the state craft program, aaron david miller.

i'm so pleased you are here. i've been waiting all day to talk to you about this. give me your thoughts on what it would mean going forward if a deal is reached and followed through upon that 50 hostages are released over four days and that potentially more after that. >> so many cruel twists. thanks for having me. the horrific terror surge on the part of hamas, sadistic killing and israel's efforts to eradicate hamas as a military organization. i think clearly this is wonderful news, certainly for those being released and their families. it reflects the cruel game of maneuver. 50 releases for a trade of probably 150 palestinian women and teens imprisoned by the israelis and a pause.

i guess the real question is how difficult will it be for the israelis after a four, five-day pause. extended with another day with the release of ten more hostages. this game could go on for a while. i think the real challenge for the israelis is how do they then proceed in its wake. >> so, with that challenge, i mean, international pressure is mounting. the international community wants there to be a cease fire. the american government hasn't said a final cease fire, but they are saying a limited cease fire to get more humanitarian aid in. with international pressure mounting, do you see it dissipating if there is this four-day stretch and israel does get some of its hostages back or do you see the opposite happening? >> i don't see how the prime minister will sell this to his security cabinet, the war cabinet, and the general cabinet, without a specific

commitment that this is not going to intercede. i can't believe there would be an agreement without assurance that the israeli would continue their ground campaign and the administration clearly to this day has not, or has resisted efforts to declare a cease fire. the problem is going to be these hostage releases, over time, another 50 programs in a ten-day, two-week period. that would still leave quite a few hostages in hamas' control. so they're going to string this out. play this out. today, john kirby in what was tantamount to a warning to the israelis said they would not agree to israeli military activities in the south unless

the israelis made provisions for how not to evolve operations. >> united states is the biggest backer of israel. so much of their arms and munitions come from us. their security from the united states. the president is in a tough position. his approval ratings on this conflict are very low, especially among younger people. how much time does israel have to do this? when i say that, how much time will the united states give israel to continue with this campaign? >> you know, the u.s.'s political clock the ticking faster than the israel's operational clock. so far, october 7th until now, what's that, 46 days almost? those two clocks have been in sync. i think this is a gut issue for the president. i think he agrees with the ultimate objective of this

israelis, which is to prevent hamas from ever doing this again and create some new reality post conflict in gaza. but increasingly as this campaign continues and international pressure, political pressure at home builds, those two clocks may well get out of sync. we haven't reached that moment of truth yet. it's hard for me to see the president calling netanyahu and saying simply, enough. it's a fraud issue. the longer the campaign continues and the more that humanitarian situation in gaza worsens, i think both israel and the netanyahu government are going to be put in increasingly difficult positions. >> israel says this will last a long time. it's not clear though if it can last a long time given the huge amount of international pressure for this conflict to end. thank you very much. again, we are watching and waiting to see what comes out of

israel. we believe that the ministers are voting right now on whether to accept the deal. netanyahu has said they should say yes. he does need a majority of ministers though in order to accept this deal. it could come through at any moment now. don't go anywhere because coming up, gershon bas kin will join us with what the hostage deal will look like in terms of the logistics of it happening. don't go anywhere. s of it happe. don't go anywhere.

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the ministers are voting on whether to accept the terms of a hostage deal with hamas. potentially 50 hostages. women and children released over a four-day period in what could be the biggest diplomatic breakthrough since the start of the war. joining us now, gershon. he initiated the peace gauche yass that resulted in the release of a soldier in 2011. it's always good to have you especially on a day like this where it appears we are on the cusp of something quite big. >> yes. well, it's the first optimistic day we've really had since the beginning of the war on october 7th. it will pass through the cabinet and we have to see that hamas is

prepared to implement it. the logistics are complicated. israel will have to redeploy some of the troops in order to facilitate the pause or cease fire. israel is obligated to cease its drone observations above the gaza strip for six hours a day so that hamas can find ways to release the hostages without them being discovered where their places of hiding are. israel has apparently agreed to that. we need to see the hostage ls come out. they'll be transferred to the international red cross and brought to the israeli side of the border. either directly or through egypt. at the same time, israel will be releasing prisoners from the israeli prisons. three prisoners for every hostage released. that's the deal. it's something that israel can -- the prisoners released are not considered very dangerous to israel. none have killed israelis.

they're all from the west bank. presumably, there will be additional negotiations and then it will become more difficult. >> what do you make of the 3-1 ratio here? is that just precedent set by the transfer. >> it just reflects the reality that hamas is really in charge here. hamas sets the terms of the deal. president biden did apparently weigh in. some of the achievements might be that it was announced that the hamas will allow the international red cross to visit the other hostages. that has never happened before. hamas has refused to allow that. we'll see if it actually does take place. that would be a very important step for the israeli families to be able to get real information about the hostages left behind. who's alive and who's not and who needs medical care. apparently, the red cross will be able to bring medical treatment to them.

medication and other things that might be needed so this is really important to the families and i think all of israel. >> what's your sense of whether hamas would be willing to engage in continued hostage releases in exchange for days of cease fire? ten hostages per day of cease fire? >> i think as long as we're talking about the civilians, the women, the children, the elderly, hamas would be willing to do it. once we get to the discussions about the soldiers, the young men, hamas is going to be a lot more demanding in terms of releasing palestinian prisoners. this is the goal of the leader of hamas in gaza, that he will empty the israeli prisons and free all the palestinian prisoners. that's very unlikely to find any kind of support within israel. and then the question is what happens with the remaining hostages as israel proceeds with the war effort in the south of the gaza strip. >> what's your sense of the israeli latitude to continue with the war pushing past the north and moving into the south?

>> 100% commitment. there is no scenario still that i can see that this war ends with hamas still in control of gaza and with the most of its leaders, military and political leaders still alive. i think there is a determination within israel in the government, in the military, and amongst the people that this war cannot end with hamas in place. >> who pays that price? is it the israeli country ultimately diplomatically in the region? do they pay a security price for continuing on? or is it the palestinians that pay the price for having hamas as their leadership? >> we all pay the price. right now the heaviest price is being paid by the palestinian people in gaza with thousands dead and over a million and a half homeless and the humanitarian catastrophe in gaza will continue. if i could make one comment about what aaron david miller said about the time clock of president biden, i think it would be much more in sync with israel if the americans follow

through with the estimate that there would be a two-state solution and end the israeli occupation that would be the declaration of the united states that it's willing to recognize the palestinian state once this war is over that. would make the two-state solution viable again and bring back for president biden a lot of support within his own democratic party. >> i think that's very astute. gershon baskin, thank you very much for joining us, as always. let's hope that this day does end positively. >> thank you. coming up, when the war is finally over, what does peace look like for the millions of israelis and palestinians living side by side? don't go anywhere. e. i have moderate to severe crohn's disease. now, there's skyrizi. ♪ things are looking up, i've got symptom relief. ♪ ♪ control of my crohn's means everything to me. ♪ ♪ control is everything to me. ♪ feel significant symptom relief at 4 weeks with skyrizi, including less abdominal pain and fewer bowel movements. skyrizi is the first il-23 inhibitor

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and up to 4 hours of battery back-up to keep you online. only from xfinity. home of the xfinity 10g network. once again, we are watching the knesset in israel where ministers are voting on whether or not to accept the terms of a deal for the hostage release between hamas and israel. that vote is happening now. we should get the results any moment now. again, prime minister benjamin

netanyahu needs a majority in order to say yes to the deal. it would be 50 hostages over four days, women and children. at the same time, there is an ongoing discussion of what happens next. how does there come to be a resolution? and how do two peoples live side by side in peace? a break in the fighting even just for days could mean that all of us around the world could take a collective breath torefl happened in the last 45 plus days, the last 100 years, and to find a way to come together to get to place that's better. joining us now are two people who are considering this, palestinian citizen of israel sally abet, and ilni green. they're national leaders of standing together, an organization that works towards peace between israelis and palestinians. you guys are really doing god's work right now trying to find a

which for people to come together on this very complicated issue in this extremely emotional and heated moment. i know that all of us have felt it to some degree or another, either in our personal lives or walking down the street or on our college campus, our group chats, with our family members, on social media. we felt it. when you came here to the united states to start having these discussions on how to live together in peace, what were you expecting? and ilan, i'll start with you. >> so we felt we were coming from war zone and entering a completely new war zone. it seemed like people were really in bunkers around the feeling that they have to hash tag either stand with israel or stand with palestinian, not being able to find a way in between where they understand that both people are living on this land. no one is going anywhere. millions of palestinians will remain on this land, and millions of israelis, of jewish

israelis will remain on the same land. and we found a very polarized discussion, a very theoretical discussion where we suggested talking about solutions. there is a very bloody war at the moment there was a very bloody massacre with hamas. palestinians are losing their lives. a lot of children are losing their lives. innocent people in israel lost their lives in the massacre of hamas, and we understand that innocent people live on both sides, and innocent people really demand an israeli-palestinian peace. that's the solution we want to talk about. >> that you can have empathy for both people at the same time. it's note one or the other. i thought it was interesting, sally, to start the conversation from a place of no one's going anywhere. israelis are staying. palestinians are staying. it's not a matter of kicking one out so the other can live. starting from a place where this is the reality, and we have to find a way to live side by side.

>> absolutely. it is really we are at a moment where really peace is becoming a very radical word. it's becoming a very radical idea. and that's when you know, you know, we are at a very dangerous historic junction. you know, when people have to fight for their humanity and people have to fight. when you see you have to pick a side that cancels the humanity of the other, you know, you need a solution. you need a different solution. we need a new story. and it's a difficult one. it's a difficult one to shift. both peoples are hurting. the palestinians, and we see on campuses the palestinian freedom movement, which is trying to tell us a message that i think the whole world needs to hear about the systemic oppression,

violent oppression that we have been enduring for decades as palestinians. and we are acknowledging that, and we need to also acknowledge that we need a solution, and we need to stop the bloodshed. and that starts from the very basic realization that we all deserve equal rights to exist in our homelands. we really deserve freedom. and no one is going anywhere. that's where we should start. >> when people come to you and say i don't know how to have this conversation, i don't know what to say, what's your advice? >> my advice is always, you know, try to hold your righteous stance, hold your values, hold your narrative. don't let it lead us towards solutions. narratives don't allow you to actually meet the other side and their emotional emotional state. and my advice is always, you know, just ask yourself who are you trying to convince.

are you trying to preach to the choir and feel righteous, are you actually trying to reach a solution that can actually stop the bloodshed. >> not trying to preach to the choir is a good one. >> ilon, do you have anything to add to that? >> as sally said, it's an historic junction. we need to choose where we're going to more settlements, more death, or are we going into a direction of israeli-palestinian peace. our leadership needs to also acknowledge that, that we cannot continue with this status quo. it costs not only the palestinian lives, but it costs also israeli lives. and it's unbearable anymore. >> ilon and sally, thank you very much for joining us. i'm sorry we had limited time, but as you know, it's been a day full of news. hopefully one again that ends happily. thank you, guys. that is going to do it for me today. do not go anywhere. we're waiting on this news about hostages. "deadline: white house" starts right now.