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good morning, good morning, to sunday september 1st. i'm ali velshi. we come on air with breaking news out of the middle east. the bodies of six israeli hostages taken by hamas during the october 7th attacks have been recovered in gaza. there bodies were found late yesterday in an underground tunnel beneath the southern city of rafah. according to the israeli military, it appears the hostages were killed shortly before the idf was able to reach them. they have been identified by the idf as carmel gat, eden yerushalmi, alexander lobanov, almog sarusi, master sergeant ori danino and american israeli, hersh goldberg-polin. hersh goldberg-polin was attending the music vessel one hamas launched the attack took he was taken hostage along with many others and later became one of the most well-known captives having been injured in

multiple hostage videos that were purred out by hamas. in the wake of his capture, his parents were extremely outspoken in their efforts to bring home their son and the other hostages. you been days even taking the stage at the democratic national convention two weeks ago urging the immediate return of the hostages while pleading for the end to the bloodshed in gaza. right now, in israel, protesters are -- protests are unfolding as demonstrators pressure the government to close the deal that would likely see the return of the remaining hostages. let's get to nbc news international correspondent matt bradley was live for us in tel aviv. what more do we know about this? >> reporter: we are seeing protests as you mentioned and this could be one of the more blistering protests we have seen out of months of very strong protests coming from the hostage families. there's thought to be dozens of them still alive, where than 100 hostages are remaining. we understand quite a few of them have been killed or died of wounds sustained on october 7th. we are seeing large protests in

tel aviv and in front of the office in jerusalem and we are even seeing the hostage family forum, a group that represents the hostage families, speaking with trade unions, trying to organize a mass protest, a walkout, a strike tomorrow. so the actual name of for these protests, shut down the country. they want to shut down the country, which is a really step up, a massive strike. in addition we have already been hearing from local disabilities throughout the country saying they will be joining in a strike. so this is a very resonant moment here in israel. it is not just a day of sadness, it is a day of rage for so many people and they are not just demanding israel's government come to a negotiation deal to free the remaining hostages, though that is the chief demand. we are also fearing -- hearing

front and center from the beginning, they want to see the back of israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu. they want him to resign and that is not even a new demand. ever since october 7th, if you remember, we saw a huge protest movement a year ago. talking about another sort of different political situation. benjamin netanyahu's effort to he called it reform the judiciary. and these issues kind of lay back to back seamlessly across the tragedy of october 7th and ensuing war in the gaza strip. so they have joined seamlessly now and the amount of anger we are seeing in these places, from mostly a secular left-wing folks in israel, that has really clawed out a very strong position in israel's internal culture wars and this is something that has been cleaved open again and again as the war continues. >> as always, we appreciate

your ported analysis. we will stay close to the story and to you today. matt bradley, reporting from tel aviv. let's turn to the 2024 election, 65 days until election day and at this stage if you split screen the election you're going to see two different campaigns. it feels like we've been trying for a years collectively to come up with the right words to describe the politics of donald trump. it is hard to put into words. he is a man who unabashedly lied and cheated right in front of our eyes and wears every scandal and felony conviction as a badge of honor. more or less it works for him. he still the standardbearer for one of our major political parties. use a nominee for president, again. during his presidency we talked a lot about the earth one and earth two because it felt like with his election we veered off into some dark timeline of alternate reality. and minnesota governor tim walz entered the race this year as, harris' running mate, walz call trump and his republican running mate j.d. vance weird. which is a nice midwestern kind of insult. but the word weird really did

seem to bother trump and if you look at the two sides of the campaign trail from this past week you can definitely see a team normal versus team weird pattern emerge. the campaign trail ran through georgia for vice president kamala harris and her running mate tim walz last week. they embarked on a bus tour, two parts of georgia that don't typically get a lot of attention from democratic politicians. according to the harris campaign it was the first time a general election presidential candidate has campaigned in savannah since the 1990s. they greeted college student from savanna state university, george's oldest historically black university, they crashed a marching band rehearsal at liberty county high school. and they stopped for barbecue at local establishments. honestly, not much to see here because that is what normal campaigning looks like, meeting people, shaking hands and trying out local cuisine. georgia was the site of harris and walz pop -- wells is first interview, and interview

remarkably normal. standard fair, no threats of authoritarian threats to pool. donald trump and j.d. vance on the other hand, their vibe was in fact weird. while the measured kamala harris discuss plans and defendant qualifications, trump spoke at a town hall in wisconsin about windmills and bacon. earlier in the wiki to base the hallowed grounds of arlington national cemetery and deeply offended a lot of american and veterans. this is what team normal versus team weird looks like this past week. >> prices in particular for groceries are too high. the american people know it and i know it, which is why my agenda includes what we need to bring down the christ -- price of groceries. >> some people don't eat bacon anymore and we're going to get the energy crisis down. when we get energy down -- this was caused by the horrible energy wind.

they want wind all over the place. >> i think it is important to have people at the table, some of the most important decisions are being made that have different views, different experiences and i think it would be to the benefit of the american public, to have a member of my cabinet is a republican. >> remember the ivanka line. >> i loved those shoes. tell your daughter, she made great shoes. >> she was making so much money with that thing. i said what is going on. >> we have had in the former president, someone who's really been pushing and -- and agenda and environment that is about diminishing the character and strength of who we are as americans. >> the war on christmas is back . remember? eight years ago i said there's a war on christmas. they were afraid to say merry christmas. >> and vice president harris and i win this election we will have your back like you have had a his entire time. >> president trump and i are proud to be the most pro-worker republican ticket in history

and i want to talk about why we are fighting for working people , why we're going to fight for unions and nonunion alike. >> interim measure of the strength of a leader is based on who you listen. >> nobody knows what her last name is. i go, okay, i'm going to give the first time, tell me the last name. i said kabbalah, they have no idea who the hell she is. women don't like donald trump. i said that's wrong. they love me. >> he suggested you happened to turn black recently for political purposes. questioning a core part of your identity. >> same old tired playbook. next question, please. >> timor mall versus team weird split screen is accurate but it is not a complete picture. trump and vance seem weird because they are doing an entirely different thing, playing an entirely different

game. kamala harris and tim walz are talking about plans and policies and trying to relate to voters because they are normal political figures who want to leave the country and believe they have the best ideas for america. donald trump and j.d. vance are alienating voters, sending people and delivering meandering off-topic remarks. it doesn't seem they are trying to win over voters with policies and plans they believe in. they represent a shrinking party tater -- catering to extremists which pushes dangerously unpopular policies and are led by a convicted felon and election denier who tried to overturn the last election he lost and trying to lay the groundwork to do it again. >> the democrats play different game and ballot harvesting but you also have people getting ballots. in california, your people getting seven ballots. anytime you have a mail-in ballot, there's going to be massive fraud. >> let's talk about some of the things he might be able to do as president. >> you can do everything.

the president has such power. >> that was just last week. so when you see the juxtaposition of kamala harris and donald trump, the way they speak, the way they act, the tone they use, it almost doesn't matter. what matters is this. one of the nominees wants to take american rights away. they want to consolidate the power of the federal government under his finger. wants to deny the will of the people if things do not go his way. during harris' interview last week she was asked what she would do on day one as president. here's her response. >> what would you do on day one? >> they won is going to be about implementing my plan for what i call an opportunity economy. i've laid out a number of puzzles on that regard. which include what we are going to do, to bring down the cost of everyday goods. what we are going to do to invest in america's small businesses. what we are going to do to invest in families, for example extending the child tax credit

to $6000 for families, for the first year of their child's like to help them buy a car seat, to help them buy baby clothes, a crib. >> low, day one is a weird thing because you have to judge the presidency on the whole time and for some people they criticize harris for calling that, thinking that was a vague answer. so i guess if specificity is your measuring stick, donald trump won this round with his super specific answer about what he's going to do on the proverbial day one of his presidency. >> you would never abuse power as retribution against anybody. >> except they won. he's going crazy. except day one. i want to close the border and i want to drill, drill, drill. >> that is not retribution. >> i'm going to be -- i love this guy. he says you're not going to be a dictator, you? i said no, no, other than day one. >> absolutely normal stuff. joining me as award-winning

journalist roland martin, host of roland martin unfiltered daily show, author of white fear, how the browning of america is making white folks lose their minds. stuart stevens is with the lincoln project, -- and author of several books including the conspiracy to end america, five ways my party is driving our democracy to autocracy. good to see you, thank you for being with us. roland, the point i'm trying to make is that you can and probably some of us should evaluate the competing policies of donald trump and kamala harris. but mostly we have to not lose sight of the fact that this is about democracy versus authoritarianism. this is about wacky weird stuff versus normalcy. >> actually about common sense versus entertainment. -- he said media wants vice president kamala harris to offer policies and prescriptions and they want entertainment from donald trump.

we've got to own up to this. we got to understand what media has done in allowing trump to do what he's done, since 2011. he will play into his --. but we have to go back to the tea party. they want chaos, terror of it all down. you got the freedom caucus. you have a lot of people in this country who say all of this is awful, tara down, let's get rid of it and so they see donald trump as the person who can come through as a bowling ball and destroy everything. and it appeals to them. so he makes these crazy comments and they go yeah, yeah. that is what we want. but it is unrealistic and those of us in media have to be willing to call a thing a thing. the longest, he wouldn't even say he lies. we have to be far more stronger and unfortunately too many

video folks with ratings go up, they get more clicks and revenue goes up and we have to call that thing what it is. >> as you know roland, i've said for years, i would take zero ratings and a peaceful democratic country that doesn't require --. stuart, there was a thing you put out from the lincoln project which has gone viral. about what could happen to people who are trying to get an abortion if they cross state lines. it was a dramatic commercial. and you said many times on the show and others, you said if policies to lean into, abortion might be one of them. the fall of roe v. wade maybe one of them because that commercial indicated wasn't whether you like abortion or don't like abortions. whether you think women and their families and doctors should be jailed for it. it is a very distinct matter, that seems to be one of the matters that will drive a lot of people to the polls. >> it is interesting when you

think about it. on the republican side, we attack national health care, obamacare, and on one basic principle that you didn't want the government to come between you and your doctor. and that resonated a lot with center and right motors. the same argument now, applies to the extremism and opposed roe v. wade world because this is exactly what has happened. you are putting the government there between a woman and her doctor. her family and a doctor. the lincoln project, we have looked at a lot of these voters in the key states, and there is a large segment of them who maybe 40% of them are just abortion but they find it repugnant. they say it taking away for two generations a constitutional right. that is anti-conservative. that is something that is the heavy hand of government. and that, i think, is a lot of

what this race is about. is not typical ideological lines. it is about the power of government versus the power of rita versus individual rights. and it is actually much more traditionally conservative position to support harris. that is where she is versus where my own party has gone. >> i recommend people look up the ad and watch it and send it to people because it is the heavy hand of government. it is a police officer who pulls over a father and his daughter and has all the information that the police officer needs to apprehend them and arrest them. roland, it is not just about calling out donald trump's lives. i think it is also about outlining to people that this is a man who deliberately denied and lied about the upcoming last election and is fully setting the table for that to happen again. so it actually almost might be irrelevant to people, if kamala harris wins more votes or wins more electronic -- more electoral college votes. he's already said everybody in

california is getting seven ballots. >> memory remind people when he taught -- lost to ted cruz in iowa, he called that rigged as well. that is what he does. people need to understand, there is no bottom for donald trump. there's no bottom. there's no such thing as, he's hit -- it doesn't exist. when you are dealing with someone like that, you have to hit them with everything. you cannot play normal politics. so the campaign of harris, walz, they need aggressive communication than biden and harris did in terms of how they're going at him. that is what you must do. also the campaign has to do is also expand the idea in terms of how you are talking to people. reproductive rights, is an issue. reverend william barber talks about if you have 140 million poor and working in america, 70 million are women.

the economic issues, actually stayed. say poor and working poor and how we want to be able to affect folks with a $50 living wage. because it is an economic issue. 66 million of those people are white. no one talks to them. trump would never say that but you have to juxtapose, we impact real people, working people versus somebody who only cares about the rich. you cannot get sucked into his drama. that is why when she said, next question, was so important. because he wants the race conversation. he wants a gender conversation. don't give him what he wants. >> stuart, we know that some people like presidential debates and some people don't but everybody in the world will tune into the next one because the last one was consequential. what you think of the concept?

kamala harris does not take donald trump spate. he tries a lot. he tries a lot. he pronounces her name incorrectly. he makes lewd comments about her. he insults her intelligence. she doesn't seem to take it. >> look, if i was giving a debate to vice president harris, i would say do what you have done for years, which is prosecute. that is a natural position. we have never had a moment like this in american history where there's two candidates on stage, one is a prosecutor and one is a criminal. think about it. this guy from queens out on bail, running for president and is the republican nominee. and we shouldn't lose sight of that. the most aggressive candidate who can control themselves and do it correct lee, wins the debate. so i would look at it as arguments before a jury. ladies and gentlemen, i will show why donald trump is unqualified to be president and he is a danger to the united states of america and the american experiment. at the end, i think you wrap it up and say tonight we have seen and why. and i would use that as the

threat for the will debate and it will drive donald trump absolutely crazy. he doesn't know how to respond to it. >> thank you very much for kicking us off. roland martin is host of the roland martin unfiltered daily digital show and author of white fear, how the browning of america is taking people lose their mind. stuart -- five ways my old party is driving my party to autocracy and look up the lincoln project at about abortion. it will keep you riveted. donald trump's behavior at the hollow grounds of arlington national cemetery should not surprise you but it absolutely should outrage you. i will talk to a military veteran who's also widow of a marine, buried in the same section of the cemetery donald trump turned into a campaign photo op. as we been doing you -- doing every week, we will look at what the far right playbook has in store for millions of americans who rely on federally supported housing. you're watching velshi on msnbc. msnbc. hing was wrong. then i saw my doctor and found out i have afib,

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donald donald trump tarnished the sacred ground of arlington national cemetery, filming and posting campaign images taken from the hallowed ground in violation of the cemetery's rules and federal law. it is important we stay shocked by this kind of behavior so we don't allow donald trump to inoculate us against his many sins by simply committing more of them. trump campaign took this photo of him posing with a thumbs-up in section 60 of arlington. let me tell you about section 60 of arlington national cemetery. it is a 14 acre section mostly reserved for veterans of the wars in iraq and afghanistan which means it is not just hallowed ground, it is an active cemetery visited often by the loved ones of america's recent war dad. yet lennox mitchell powell described as the liveliest and most sad part of arlington where young widows can be seen

using clippers and scissors to groom the grass around their husbands tombstones as lots of children run about. last monday you would have seen donald trump there, taking campaign photos amid headstones of those were dead. the same man who called dead marine suckers and losers, that according to his former chief of staff john kelly who lost his own son, robert michael kelley, first lieutenant, third battalion, fifth marine regiment killed in action and held in afghanistan on november 9th, 2010. he's buried in section 60 of arlington national cemetery. trump, who said john mccain who was a prisoner of war in vietnam for more than five years, was not a war hero because he got captured. trump, the man who avoided the draft on account of bone spurs, so it is not a surprise this man stomped over hallowed ground , that his staff got into a verbal and physical altercation with an arlington official, or his campaign spokesperson later attacked character of the arlington official who then

declined to press charges because according to a "new york times" source, she fears retaliation. we must not look away from this behavior. we must not allow it to be normalized by the frequency with which it is repeated and exceeded. as mitchell powell writes in the atlanta, for trump, the filing what is sacred in our civic culture, borders on a past time. peacefully transferring power to the next president, treating political adversaries with at least rudimentary grace, honoring the soldiers wounded and disfigured in service of our country, trump long ago walked roughshod over all of these norms. this was not a judgment call or minor violation of its cure -- obscure your erratic boilerplate. many paragraphs, lay out what behavior is acceptable and what is not. these are not suggestions but commandments. memorial services are intended to honor the fallen. the regulations note with a rough eloquence.

partisan activities are inappropriate in arlington national cemetery, due to its role as a shrine to all the honored dead of the armed forces of the united states and out of respect for the men and women buried there and for their families, end quote. i have invited someone to join me, both military veteran herself and a widow of a marine buried in section 60 of arlington national cemetery. i will introduce you to her, after the break. when my doctor gave me breztri for my copd, things changed for me. breztri gave me better breathing, symptom improvement, and reduced flare—ups. breztri won't replace a rescue inhaler for sudden breathing problems. it is not for asthma. tell your doctor if you have a heart condition or high blood pressure before taking it. don't take breztri more than prescribed. breztri may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis.

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you know, when i take the bike out like this, all my stresses just melt away. i hear that. this bad boy can fix anything.

yep, tough day at work, nice cruise will sort you right out. when i'm riding, i'm not even thinking about my painful cavity. well, you shouldn't ignore that. and every time i get stressed about having to pay my bills, i just hop on the bike, man. oh, come on, man, you got to pay your bills. you don't have to worry about anything when you're protected by america's number-one motorcycle insurer. well, you definitely do. those things aren't related, so... ah, yee! oh, that is a vibrating pain. the morning the morning of december 6, 2010, 22-year-old kate wyatt had begun her day when her doorbell rang. on the other side stood two marines. that only ever means one thing. she was about to receive the worst news a spouse can ever hear. her husband, this man, marine corporal derek wyatt had been killed in action in afghanistan.

kate, a retired marine was weeks away from giving birth to their son michael. on the very same day she learned of her husband's passing, kate told her doctors she wanted to be induced so she would be able to attend her husband's funeral at arlington national cemetery. the very next day i go wyatt was born two weeks early. on january 7th, 2011, both kate and baby michael buried their husband and father at arlington national cemetery. kate wyatt joins me now. thank you for being with us. >> thank you for having me. >> this is 13 years ago, and it still, that never goes away. i want to start by introducing our viewers to your husband. to derek. tell us about derek. >> absolutely. i talk about him as much as possible. derek was such a wonderful person. he lit up every room. he had such a huge personality. that many people say that with knowing him for a few minutes,

they felt like they knew him his whole life. because he just makes you feel so heard and loved and he had such a vibrancy to his life, that he was really difficult to not notice. >> you were a marine, and when you are spouse of a marine and marines come to your door, it never means anything else. what was that like for you? >> unfortunately i had just gotten out of the marines myself because i had wanted to go in as an officer and derek had already re-enlisted and he had said that when he got back from this deployment, which would have rounded out his second contract, that he wanted to get out and help take care of michael so i could go to school. and so i gave up my career and a lot of ways i gave up the life we dreamed of together. and i had just picked up my mom the day before.

and we had stayed up really late talking about birthing plans because it should've been about a week or two away. i woke up to the knock at the door, and looked at the people -- peep hole. i knew what had happened and i let the gentleman in. we cried and i took a deep breath and said, what do we do now. because i'm nine months pregnant and we are expecting our first son. and i don't know what to do. luckily through leadership and family and friends, i made it to today, where i am a graduate student and a mother of the most wonderful 13-year-old boy. and what's got me through that a lot is the camaraderie of their marine corps. i joined to serve my country. i joined to make a difference.

and so did derek. and so to hear the one place we all, servicemembers across the board, respect and revere, has been desecrated, not just by donald trump yet again, as the second time. almost four years to the day that i spoke out about the first time donald trump did this. and now that he has a marine corporal as his vice president, i am asking for accountability. i take that back. i am demanding accountability from corporal fans -- vance on how this egregious trespassing of sacred ground, how it can be worth your integrity to work for a man like that. is just very on -- on marine like. >> i haven't served a day in my

life. i can't imagine the bravery and the dangers and things you have to think about. you are a gold star widow and a marine. this does not end, as he said it is not the first time. this continues to happen, disregard for our armed forces. john kelly brought donald trump to his son's graveside and can be seen in a sea of cameras, directly behind or adjacent to your husband's grave. your husband is buried in section 60. >> directly behind lieutenant kelly's derek's platoon commander. when lieutenant kelly died, it really rocked derek. he actually had been able to call me and so in that picture came out, i was instantly infuriated. i reached out to my friends and i needed to talk to somebody about how inappropriate this was and how the president of

the united states should know this is inappropriate, let alone to infringe on the grieving process. of the kelly family, who i had upmost respect for. so this does not and cover us. however, our stories help to shape our to be told history. arlington national cemetery is a visible reminder of the dead, who made this country possible. it is also a reminder of the finite room that we have, to store honorably the dead from our battles, and it should not have to be explained, that this is not an opportunity for a photo op. so the goal star widow family, to the gold star families out there, i respect your right to

invite who you choose, to your memory ceremonies. however, our service and section 60, specifically, is just so much bigger than any one person. that was inappropriate to take pictures and when you are still young or new to this, widow hood of the military, you don't understand why you have the roles that we have. which is what that staff member was trying to enforce. and in my eyes, protect my husband and his honor and his memory. and they were rough handled at best and assaulted at worst by the trump campaign, because they wanted the entitlement of that honor, without ever even -- most people can't serve and

that is okay. you can serve in so many different ways. but donald trump made his views clear to general kelly, what he thought of veterans. and i believe general kelly. i believe a man of honor. i believe the kelly family. donald trump is not only a felon, but a known liar and a con artist. and i think the american people, to not focus on the bipartisan issue, but rather, the moral character of each candidate. so that those of us who are -- can continue to live our lives with respect and dignity and without worrying that when i die, and my son gets to visit derek and i in the same place, that he won't have to deal with this, so we can clear it up. >> kate wyatt, thank you or your service to the country. thank you for keeping the service and the ultimate sacrifice of derek alive and in and our emory.

kate wyatt is gold star widow and a marine whose husband is buried at arlington national cemetery. we will be right back. . t-mobile connects 100,000 delta airlines employees. powers tractor supply stores nationwide with reliable 5g business internet. and helps red bull revolutionize coverage of live events. this is how business goes further with t-mobile for business. new mr. clean ultra foamy magic eraser? with the scrubbing power of magic eraser and the cleaning power of dawn. watch it make soap scum here... disappear... and sprays can leave grime like that ultra foamy melts it on contact. magic. new ultra foamy magic eraser. my moderate to severe crohn's symptoms kept me out of the picture. now i have skyrizi. ♪ i've got places to go and i'm feeling free ♪ ♪ control of my crohn's means everything to me ♪

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now, hsa/fsa eligible. today's installment of our deep dive inside project 2025 focuses on housing policy. the far right playbook for second trump presidency predictably takes aim at programs designed to help the most vulnerable populations in this country. the poor and low-wage folk, people of color, families that don't fit the traditional two parent model and farrance -- parents of mixed legal status. you will find it in chapter 15 written up by ben carson, former secretary of housing and urban development. to sing on department of housing and urban development, one of the first lines of chapter 15 on page 503 reads quote, the secretary should

initiate a hard task force consisting of politically appointed personnel to identify and reverse all actions taken by the biden administration to advance progressive ideology. what progressive ideology are they talking about? project 2025 defines progressive ideology as anything that includes language that refers to race, diversity, equity, inclusion, gender, sexuality or environmental protection. first off it is important to understand why we need this so- called progressive ideology in housing policy at all. in the 1930s as the nation was reeling from the great depression, the federal government implemented a program to help struggling americans with their mortgages so that they can avoid foreclosure. the homeowners loan corporation sentence people out to appraise homes to determine value, and so-called detrimental factors that would inform which home lenders would want to insure. as it turns out, to lenders, being black was a quote, detrimental effect her. inadequate federal policies made way for lenders to read ruth to ensure remote bridges

in or near black neighborhoods. a phenomenon you know well, known as redlining. according to the national community reinvestment coalition, three out of every four neighborhoods in the united states that were redlined in the 1930s are still of low to moderate income today. roughly two of every three are predominantly populated by people of color. the policies of the 1930s provided subsidies for developers to build suburban communities and subdivisions while allowing them to be available only to white people. ineffectively forced segregation, black americans into housing progress -- project and stagnated inequality and prevented upper mobility for nonwhite people. black and brown neighborhoods up and treated as sacrifice zones. for sins, interstates and highways and industrial zones were systematically built to cut these neighborhoods off from economic opportunity

centers, exposing them to hire environmental and pollution risks at the same time. there have been attempts to edge closer to equity and undo the racist policies of the palace -- of the past. project 2025 wants to undo all of the progress. among other proposals, it recommends the next conservative president quote, immediately and cut the biden administration's property appraisal and valuation equity pave policies and repeal the affirmatively furthering fair housing regulation, reinstituted under the biden administration. now these policies were designed by the biden and initiation specifically to chip away the decades of housing inequality still affecting communities today, by preventing racial bias in home appraisals, by actively undoing segregation and allowing lenders to address the effects of our history of housing discrimination. but project 2025 does not end

there. page 509 the mandate says the department should quote, prohibit noncitizens including all mixed status families from living in all federally assisted housing. which means tens of thousands of immigrant families including those with spouses or parents or children who are united states citizens, will face eviction. in fact the department of housing and urban development estimates 55,000 children would face eviction under this proposal alone. the trump administration by the way, already tried to do this, the first time around in 2019. project 2025 proposes strict time limits on public housing residency. it wants to scrap so-called housing first models of assistance and replace that with models that require treatment and work in order to qualify for housing. this is an area close to my

heart because i worked in. housing first models have been extensively studied. they are found to be far more effective at reducing poverty and homelessness than treatment first models, which often require sobriety, mental health treatment, and have higher rates of failure and recidivism. if you're trying to recover from addiction you absolutely need housing first. on page 512 of the document, it recommends quote, maximal flexibility to direct the pha, public housing agency, and sales that involve existing stock of public housing units, congress must consider the future of the public housing model, where they can be sold by phas and put to greater economic use. throw the poor people out, we can build condos or factories. project 2025 recommends that congress allowed land currently used for public housing to be sold to private developers for the right price. project 2025 wants to eliminate the new housing supply fund, which specifically makes it easier to build

affordable housing. and finally, let's also make it harder for first time homeowners to reach the milestone. the mandate recommends the federal housing administration implement shorter terms for low income first-time wires. we can get 30 year loans, sometimes 40 year loans that divides the payment over a longer amount of time so you don't have to be 80 years old before you buy your first home. shorter mortgage terms make it harder for homeowners to get mortgage insurance. this, despite the fact, the vast majority of americans simply cannot afford the monthly payments that are required for shorter mortgages. these plans come in this book, will only make it harder for low income already disadvantaged americans to achieve stable, safe, affordable housing and will likely put the american dream of homeownership even further out of reach. (♪♪) i wish i had someone like evan when i started. somebody just got their first debit card!

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before the break i told you about project 2025's plan to cut programs aimed at helping the most vulnerable americans among us. more on this, the person i talked to when i want to discuss inequity and housing, that drake andre perry, senior fellow, -- at washington university and author of the book know your price, valuing black lives and property in america's black cities. good to see you again, thank you for being with us. we tried to do this justice but it's got a lot of stuff in it. what is the main take away from the house and proposals and

project 2025 quit >> well there's really not a lot of solutions to a housing crisis that we have in this country. we need to increase supply. the policies proposed and project 2025 essentially is double down on the existing architecture of segregation. it really encourages single- family zoning ordinance does, it perpetuates the smith that immigrants don't contribute to society and are a drag on resources. it eliminates rules that would encourage ending segregation, and it, this is near and dear to my heart, we need to eliminate bias in housing markets that lower home values. so this policy proposal offered in an project 2025 really does not offer solutions to our existing housing crisis, and it furthers a period of segregation that we have seen, since our founding of the

country. >> it is interesting, it's got a lot of stuff in here, none of which are actual solutions to create warehousing. housing affordability used to be something people thought about as an abstraction, a bunch of people living in a project somewhere in the city i don't live. in 2024, housing ability, the affordability is entirely mainstream. more than half of americans cannot afford housing. >> you know, this is an issue that is a bipartisan issue. republicans and democrats, and the republic overall, talk about increasing housing supply. however we are limiting the amount of tools that we can apply to increase it. we actually need more federal involvement in increasing the supply. it is the government agency, with the resources to do so. now it will require coordination between state and local entities, but we have a

history of that. remember, we instituted redlining and a lot of federally backed homeowner programs, but it was for the purpose of exclusivity. for the purpose of excluding black people from increasing homeownership. and so we have a history of that . we just need to do it for purposes of inclusion. more people who are low income into homes. >> one of the things i mentioned, there is another suggestion on 509 reads hud should implement reforms -- anti-marriage bias in housing assistant programs, strengthening work readiness requirements, implement maximum term residence -- limits for residents. stuff that will push people out of affordable housing, not expand the stock. >> there is still a lot of myth around what causes or throttles

economic mobility among folks, that this proposal says people aren't working, that they are essentially lazy, that single families or single mothers are the cause or root cause of poverty. what is the cause of poverty is lack of income, middle-class income, the lack of livable wage. people are working in this country. we have record lows and unemployment. people are actually working. people who aren't working generally can't. and so the myths really offer no solution to the affordable housing crisis, and we actually need to increase the share of black and brown homeowners in this country, so we need more tools in order to do that. >> good to see you. thank you for being with us. andre perry is senior fellow at brookings institution and author of know your price

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good morning good morning it is sunday, september 1. i am allie velshi. the bodies of six israeli hostages taken by hamas during the october 7 october attack in gaza. their bodies were found by the israeli military in an underground tunnel between the southern city of tran44. according to -- they have been identified as the american israeli tran 14, carmel gat, eden yerushalmi, alexander lobanov , almog sarusi and master sergeant ori danino. hersh goldberg-polin was attending the music festival when hamas launched the attack he was taken hostage alongside many others