worse is the only thing they understand. the idea that the people they are in this conflict with can be beaten. that there will be a point where they are beaten into submission. >> to that point and peter and your point about 1982, the goal in lebanon, they succeeded. they definitely left, they went to tunisia and then hezbollah went up and everything that proceeded from that. thank you very much. appreciate it. that is "all in" on this tuesday night. look who it is. my friend alex wagner. how are you doing, buddy? >> i'm alive, i made it. >> you did it. >> so did you. you are still standing. we did your podcast and vanished from the world and now we are back. >> we are back. we've got 63 days. >> i'm ready. have you got your power bars? >> i've got them. >> thanks as always. okay, as of today this song

can no longer be donald trump's music. ♪hold on, i'm ♪hold on, i'm coming ♪ >> today >> today a federal judge in georgia ordered trump to stop playing that song by isaac hayes, because isaac hayes's estate said it did not approve of the use and did not give the trump campaign permission to play it. of this would be one thing if it were just an isolated incident, but it is not. for example trump has already switched his music to the village people's ymca, which i should note is widely understood to be an anthem of the gay community and which the village people themselves have

objected to trump using. they have also threatened legal action against donald trump. in fact isaac hayes and the village people are just two of the dozens of artist and artist the states that have object did to donald trump using their music and that list includes abba, adele, aerosmith, the beatles, beyonce, bruce springsteen, celine dion, creedence clearwater revival, earth, wind, and fire. elton john. foo fighters. panic at the disco. pavarotti. phil collins. prince. queen. rem. rihanna. the rolling stones. sinnott o'connor. trump being ordered to stop using one song from one artist would be one thing, but this is not the first song trump has been asked to stop using, it is just the first time the matter has been settled in actual court. if you were worried about the musical desert that trump seems

to be relegated to, you can rest assured. because even if trump were to be legally barred from playing the music of every single popular artist in the world, well, there will always be the music of his daughter-in-law and the cochair of the republican party, lara trump. >> ♪ without your bravery we are out of luck ♪ ♪no this can't ♪no this can't be denied, you've got to be special ♪ >> that is right. despite the fact that she is currently the cochair of the republican national committee, the rnc, lara trump is still actively pursuing a music career in the middle of a historically significant presidential election. what i just played was a snippet of ms. trump's newly released single, a music video titled hero, which appears to

be a tribute to firefighters. >> ♪ and the flames getting higher, you are my hero, you are my hero ♪ ♪you were ♪you were climbing up the ladder and the scream was getting louder, you are my hero, you are my hero ♪ >> it should be said that lara trump's music career is not exactly taking off right now, but she is still on tour. just not as a singer. as cochair of the rnc, lara trump is heading up the parties protect the vote tour. >> we are going to put together the largest most aggressive and most comprehensive election integrity operation in the history of american politics. we have been all across this country.

michigan, pennsylvania, north carolina, georgia, arizona, nevada, wisconsin. it is integral to who we are as americans that we trust our electoral process and that is where you guys come in. we have to have people every time a vote is cast and counted, in the room and watching. you are going to learn today everything you need to know. things you never knew you needed to know about election integrity. about how to be a poll watcher and poll worker. to work in a tabulation center. >> i can't tell you exactly what happens in those trainings that trump and the rnc are holding across the country because the rnc is not allowing the press to observe those trainings. what i can tell you is as of a month ago the rnc claimed to have recruited 157,000 volunteers through this effort. as tens of thousands of people who believe the lie that the 2020 election was stolen and have now signed up to monitor the 2020 for election. what could go wrong? that is where the rnc's

priorities are at this moment. the cochair of the party is touring the country to recruit conspiracy theorists to monitor the polls and maybe also convince those same people to buy her new single. at the same time, today the harris campaign kicked off its own tour. it is a tour filled with harris allies called the fighting for reproductive freedom bus tour and to really under score the stark contrast between where the campaigns stand on the issue of abortion, this bus tour kicked off in palm beach, florida. that is where, just days ago, palm beach florida resident donald trump said that he will vote against florida's amendment 4, an amendment that would enshrine abortion rights into the state constitution. >> are you voting yes or no on amendment 4 in florida? >> i think six weeks, you need more time. i have disagreed with that from

the early primaries, when i heard about it. i disagreed with it. at the same time the democrats are radical because nine months is a ridiculous situation. you can do an abortion in the ninth month and some of the states like minnesota and other states have it where you can actually execute the baby after birth and all of that stuff is unacceptable. so i will be voting no for that reason. >> that is a lie. nowhere in the country can you legally execute a baby after birth. but those are the kinds of lines that trump and republicans are pushing as they move to restrict reproductive rights across the country. the reproductive freedom bus tour is all about calling out lies and telling voters where donald trump and kamala harris really stand on the issue of abortion. >> it is not lost on us that we are just 10 miles from mar-a- lago. home of one donald j. trump.

he calls it the winter white house. i call it his retirement home. he is the one -- he is the one who got us into this miss. he is the one who has clearly stated, clearly on video just last year, that he was probably the one responsible for overturning roe v wade. and florida, you are going to hold him to it. >> joining me now is democrat and senator amy klobuchar from minnesota, who today helped kickoff the harris campaign bus tour focused on reproductive rights. we are also joined by former senator from missouri, democrat and msnbc political analyst claire mccaskill. what a treat to have both of you here to weigh in on a lot of things. >> i'm afraid to be on with claire again. >> we want more of it and it

has not even started. you are fresh off this bus tour. kicked it off as you know in palm beach, florida. can you talk a little bit about the response you got and what the mood was like in a place that the trump campaign is calling trump country? >> highly energized. this amendment has galvanized the people of florida. just as you saw in kansas, ohio by 13 points, people have turned out. not just democrats. republicans and independents and said no, women should be able to make their own decision about healthcare, not politicians. so this could change the trajectory. a key senate race with the democratic candidate. we have got a number of congressional races down there of course. so it was a blast to be down there actually with anna navarro and a bunch of other leaders from florida and i think it was brilliant to start it right there in the backyard to make the point he is the one

that, exhibit a, claire was a prosecutor, she gets this. he is the one that said he wanted to overturn it. exhibit b, put the justices on. he said he was proudly responsible for doing it, so we rest our case. >> claire, i want to talk about the stagecraft. as the senator points out there are a lot of reasons and it is also a critical moment for trump as he goes back and forth on what his position is. i still marvel at the fact that, you know, we are 63 days from the election and trump seems to have no idea what to even say on the issue that could be the deciding factor in the election. >> yeah and i am sure my dearest buddy amy will agree with me on this. there are issues where candidates evolve over time. things change. the facts change. context changes and you have an

explanation for why you might take a different course than you might have five years ago, 10 years ago, 15 years ago. but this issue, voters are very suspicious of someone who tries to change their position on this issue, because this is about a fundamental freedom. deeply held personal beliefs. very rarely is it just about a political win and very clear that that is what trump is doing now. he's trying to change his position and why. say everyone wanted roe v. wade to be overturned or executing baby or saying it is okay for states to decide -- >> i think we are having some connectivity issues with you, senator mccaskill. we will get back to you as soon

as the internet connection is up and running. >> this is my dream. i will just fill in what she was going to say. >> she did mention executing babies which is repeated ad nauseam by those on the right and i wonder if you ever run into voters who are convinced that actually happens? do they think that is really something republicans are guarding against? >> when donald trump puts this type of misinformation out there there are people that believe it and there are innocent people who believe it because they hear it and think it is true. it is just not true, that is murder. the bigger point claire is making is that one out of three women now when you look at what is going on live in the states that have extreme bands. in florida it is six weeks. a lot of women don't even know they are pregnant by six weeks. >> and donald trump said six weeks is too early. the incoherence is staggering and it is not just donald trump, it is also his running

mate. every day. if it is tuesday their mass to be a strange j.d. vance position on a mainstream cultural issue. now we are finding out he wrote a sort of forward to a book that essentially says abortion should become unthinkable in the united states. it would like to ban ivf as a procedure for those seeking to have families and j.d. vance has a somewhat incoherent position on ivf and even abortion. >> for me i look at his vote on the senate floor. i was there. i voted, too. he had an opportunity that republicans seized to make it very clear that they stood with ivf and we need to protect ivf, given the outcome of the dobbs decision and what was happening in alabama. he voted the other way. so you not only have project 2025 and everything in it, banning mifepristone as tim walz said at the convention. when someone gives you a playbook you better look at it,

because that is what they will use. >> they are going to run it. >> the fact this is continued and you can go back in time and look at other statements, but i think of that vote and what that vote meant. >> right, you have him on record doing these things. claire, we began by talking about the overwhelming number of musical artist who wants nothing to do with donald trump. that is not just unfortunate for the trump campaign, but also evidence of a campaign that is so outside of mainstream culture. right? most people want nothing to do with this person. there is some section of the republican party that does, but on the whole they have painted themselves into the far, far corner of not just american politics, but american culture at large and reproductive freedom and bodily autonomy are but a signpost of that. >> but alex, he's got kid rock. you know, how can you not win with kid rock, for gosh sakes?

listen, he's got a huge chunk of this country that is buying what he is selling and we need to pay attention to that and we need to understand, grievance is a real thing in the united states and that is what trump is marketing. he is marketing grievance, negativity. our country is horrible. our country sucks. we are a dead country. unfortunately there are way too many people that are in that place where they see that negativity and they say he gets me. but i will tell you the majority of this country wants to believe tomorrow will be better and once someone who has a more joyous, positive outlook on everything that makes our country extraordinary. i do think he's not only got losing musicians on his campaign, which there are only a couple. i think it is a stretch to call them musicians. he also has a message i think that is not going to move those voters that decide presidential

elections. voters that amy knows well in minnesota and certainly the only way i could ever get elected in misery. that is voters that don't vote by party, that are more independent. that make up their mind based on their lives that that moment and the candidates and how they represent themselves. >> i made that point about anna navarro. you have republicans that spoke so eloquently at the convention in chicago. the democratic convention. former trump employees. and what you are seeing right now, jimmy mccain coming out. john mccain's youngest son who served in the military. you have republicans and independents coming out and that is partially why you see this surge in the swing states. >> do you think this election is going to be divided along gender lines? you look at the polling and trump is doing so badly. you look at what is happening on a central issue of bodily autonomy and reproductive freedom that affects in large

part women although men have a stake in this. do you see a massive gender divide in november? >> there has always been some divide, but i'm not sure that is what will determine it. i am looking at what claire just talked about, which is independent voters and moderate republicans and where they are, that they don't want to go back to the dark days. they don't want to go back to the insurrection. they don't want to go back to assaults on democracy and freedom and i think you see a lot of democrats reaching out right now to republicans and independents who are not comfortable and never want to be associated with donald trump. >> we will talk about that with sarah longwell in the next block. thank you for teeing that up. are you selling albums on your bus tour? >> we are not, we are selling joy, optimism and getting stuff done. >> and maybe freedom, too. senator amy klobuchar, i wish you luck on the bus tour. former senator claire mccaskill,

please come back again and again. with amy klobuchar and without, we love having you both on this program. thanks for your time tonight. coming up, trump now says he had every right to interfere in the 2020 election as he also pleads not guilty to his revised january 6 criminal indictment. but first a new multimillion dollar ad campaign is targeting trump voters. people who might be persuaded to vote for kamala harris and the woman behind those efforts joins me, coming up next.

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ima ima to time -- i am a two time trump voter. >> disgusting. >> trump called servicemen suckers and losers. >> it would be much worse than the first. >> kamala harris is a prosecutor. >> he is a convicted felon. >> i will be proudly voting for kamala harris. >> starting today, that message will be broadcast to voters in pennsylvania, michigan, wisconsin, arizona, and nebraska. there are also these billboards that will blanket those states as part of an $11.5 million add to blitz funded by the political action group, republican voters against trump. joining me now is the founder

and the negative director, as well as the publisher of the bulwark, sarah longwell. it is great to see you. i am so eager to hear about the project and you know better than most people who exactly is the sort of target audience here? is this the vestige of the nikki haley coalition? can you give me a profile of the kind of voter you guys are going to? >> on one level it is the vestige of the nikki haley voter. the fact is some of those voters were already biden voters last time. some of them were going to go home to trump and then there is kind of the group that prior to joe biden dropping out we were calling the double haters and these people really do hate donald trump, but they thought joe biden was too old and the thing about these letters as they are kind of right-leaning independence and soft gop voters. they don't identify as democrats and that is the tough

part. that is where you have got to build a permission structure for people like this who do not see the democrats as their natural tribe, to say you know what? i am so tired of donald trump. i am so over the lies about the election. january 6 was a redline for me. abortion is now a primary issue for me. any combination of those things can drive that voter to say this time i'm out on trump. one of the things we did with this campaign is we specifically went and found hundreds and hundreds of people who voted for trump. everyone who is part of our campaign voted for trump at least once. many of them have done it twice and i think it is important for people to understand that these voters, there are a lot of people who held their nose and voted for donald trump, or whatever reason. they were not wild about him. january 6 pushed them over the

edge and the fact the republican party decided to go again with donald trump. there are a lot of voters who say this is too much and once you give them someone new, like kamala harris, they basically were like, you know what? i am in. i am in for the optimism and i'm done with the doom and gloom and they were ready to be advocates. those people can create the best permission structure for other people on the fence who were looking for a reason to vote against donald trump. they are not comfortable voting for democrats, but when they see people from their own tribe, people who made the same decisions they had in the past two voted for donald trump and say i can do it for harris, i can vote for her, that is the sort of thing that helps people make that move. >> and we talk about the strategy. i know that you are going with billboards in major areas in swing states. grand rapids and madison, as

well as phoenix and omaha. my lord we hope this election does not come down to that one electoral vote. you said these are folks who don't feel like they are part of a democratic tribe, but when i think of those metropolitan areas i think of them as democratic strongholds. are these people that are reluctantly hanging out in the swing states? >> no, this is a great question, actually. most of these are what are called dma's. these are places where you advertise and that is, how do i explain this to you? yes it is the name of the city's but where we are concentrated on advertising is in those areas of those cities, because that is where the persuadable voters are. you're talking bucks county, pennsylvania. cumberland county. in order to reach those letters you often have to go into the

dma that is the biggest city in that area. so our focus is not to hit those blue voters that are concentrated in the metropolitan areas, but really in the rings around there. we are doing what is called a surroundsound campaign. not only are we up on television, but we are narrowly targeted with digital. on hulu and other places where you stream. we are on radio. we really are trying to hit people with a lot of different voices, but all of whom, a lot of college-educated, suburban voters who have been persuadable voters who made up the margins in the last key elections. >> i've got to ask, because chris hayes was talking about this and rightly so in the last hour and i've been thinking about this a lot. i know nate silver has been thinking about it a lot. pennsylvania. as it was in 2020, pennsylvania

has 19 electoral college votes. it is a big deal. everybody wants to win it and by everybody i mean kamala harris and donald trump. how much work do you think there has to be -- i notice you are going up with billboards and three cities in pennsylvania. >> pennsylvania really is the tipping point state. i was originally a big advocate for choosing governor josh shapiro as the vp candidate, because i thought in such a utilitarian way, it is so important to lockup pennsylvania. i don't think tim walz was a bad choice, there is just nothing more important than pennsylvania and i think you can see in terms of trump spending and harrises spending, that is what everybody is battling over. it is a state that has a lot of these urban areas that have suburban rings around them and a lot of those suburban rings are the kinds of places that have moved from red to blue over the last decade, that donald trump has been on the

scene. that is where the voters are moving. they are politically realigning out of the republican party and are becoming more willing to vote for democrats. these are people where previously they would vote for john mccain and mitt romney, but donald trump has been pushing them out of the party. it also has a lot of these rural areas, which is where i grew up in central pennsylvania, where donald trump dominates with voters. this is why it is so important. i think you have to get tim walz to these areas. you have to have him talking directly to voters. pennsylvania is the ballgame. we are going to spend a ton of money there, but so is everyone else. >> to say the least. sarah longwell, a wealth of information. founder of republican voters against trump, founder of the bulwark. thanks for your time. >> thanks for having me. >> coming up, while donald trump contemplates putting elon musk on a future white house cabinet,

the country of brazil is shutting down elon musk and his far right free-for-all. first, trump has officially filed and not guilty plea in his january 6 case, while also saying he had every right to engage in election interference. a new author joins me to discuss the weaponization of the justice system and what we can expect, next. e) and travelt our grandchildren. (fisher investments) i understand. that's why at fisher investments we start by getting to know each other. so i can learn about your family, lifestyle, goals and needs, allowing us to tailor your portfolio. (wife) what about commission-based products? (fisher investments) we don't sell those. we're a fiduciary, obligated to act in your best interest. (husband) so how do your management fees work? (fisher investments) we have a transparent fee, structured so we do better when you do better. at fisher investments, we're clearly different. always dry scoop before you run. listen to me, the hot dog diet got me shredded.

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it is it is so crazy that my poll numbers go up. whoever heard, you get indicted for interfering with a presidential election where you have every right to do it. you get indicted under poll numbers go up. >> he believes election interference is his right. today donald trump announced he would plead not guilty to his latest indictment and would do so at a hearing before a trial judge later this week. as david writes in his new book, americans agreed that actions like the watergate break-in were improper. no consensus exists today. he writes that the polarized electric has made things much more difficult for officials at the doj and the fbi task or investigating or prosecuting the former president. joining me now is two-time pulitzer prize winner david

rohde. his new book is out today and it is where tyranny begins, the justice department, the fbi and the war on democracy. david, congratulations on publication day. a very timely book in this moment. what stuns me about the book is not just the political polarization and trump's affect, which is stymieing the investigation and the prosecution of potential crimes, but also the degree to which the department of justice has been deeply and it sounds like profoundly affected by trump. can you talk a little bit about what the mood is inside the doj right now? >> the focus of the book was sort of the average career prosecutors look at the doj and agents who work at the fbi and morale is low. they feel like they are stuck in the middle. they feel like the justice department and fbi are asked to withdraw and resolve the

political differences. i think there was an assumption with trump that if he was indicted and brought to trial he would be convicted and discredited politically and that would be the end of it. it turns out the legal system is not the easy way to resolve political differences. >> by design. >> yes. so a former president it turns out can delay and it is difficult. we can talk more about it. you have a recent supreme court decision that is complicated on immunity. i would say if there is a second trump term, there would probably be less civil servants would fight it. many did in this book and i think he would be emboldened by the supreme court to be even more political. >> what is interesting about the extraordinary, extraordinarily slow pace of these investigations and indictments is that maybe it is not a surprise. people were primed as you say to believe this could happen expeditiously, especially after the house january 6 committee

showed the public this evidence. but it has not happened quickly and not just because of the supreme court. there was a delay at the department of justice bringing these charges. you think merrick garland understood this would take a long time? >> i think he did and it is part of almost the two realities that we live in now. that there is the trump supporter universe and the trump opponent to the democrat universe. merrick garland sincerely believes in the justice department. the post watergate justice department. nixon used his attorney general to go after his enemies. in the last 50 years there has been this pride in it being independent. the attorney general carries out the broader policies of a democratic elected president, but when it comes to individual criminal cases the president stays out of it. trump defied that, defiled that and paid very little political cost and what is interesting is it seemed to help him in the primaries, as you talked about. so there was a view that

somehow charging him would be a political silver bullet and it wasn't and -- >> well it hasn't. do you think there is any regret on the part of the a.g. about the timeline on which this has unfolded and if you can't speak to that, what now inside the doj? you mentioned morale is low, but also there seem to be camps, pro trump and anti- trump, which is not something we think of when we think of the justice department. >> the beginning of the book is about this meeting before the search of mar-a-lago and there are a group of fbi officials that are worried. they think if they do it it will play into trump's mo. the deep state conspiracy theory and the fbi victimizing him. there is another camp of more senior officials like we have to do this. and it got to the point where one group was looking at the other groups political donations. so this hyper partisanship --

>> extends inside. >> is seeping inside law enforcement investigations and i just want to emphasize, i did not find anyone who was wildly pro-republican or pro-democrat. they take their duty seriously. they try to be nonpartisan. for our democracy to function we need nonpartisan civil servants. we need election clerks who count votes fairly. we need judges and police who administer the law fairly. we need journalists who are nonpartisan in presenting facts. the problem is that the public is more and more cynical about constant attacks. recent polls say 75% of voters have little to no confidence in the justice department and 85% of republicans. again, there are heroes in this book. there are people trying to do the right thing. we face a sort of monumental test as the election approaches. >> and you painted a picture of what might happen if trump is elected, but if the white house stays in democratic hands and trials go forward, that will be

its own stress test as well. >> definitely. >> david rohde, thank you, my friend. the new book is called where tyranny begins. thank you for your time and for writing this in these perilous moments. coming up, the extraordinary step one country is taking against elon musk and his social media platform. that is coming right up. this is the easiest, non-toxic swap you'll ever make. lumineux toothpaste was made by dentists designed to break up plaque and remove any toxins in the mouth,

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a quick warning the image am about to show you now is not real and was generated by ai. elon musk posted an image to his account on's. it's kamala harris decked out in fully outfit. the fake bit of that fake bit of pots during came one day after he and provide another post arguing that democracy should be replaced with some kind of system were only high testosterone alpha males are allowed to be in charge. who actually knows if he's even included in that. both are examples of the kind of irresponsible and unhinged content elon musk has unleashed on our democracy and to not only our democracy was

grappling with it. the entire nation of brazil this weekend lost access to the x platform because of the ongoing dispute between elon musk and a judge on brazil's highest court. at the heart of the dispute is musk's refusal to comply with the new brazilian law requiring social media sites to remove misinformation and hate speech from the platforms. brazil's highest court held the decision to effectively turn off x across all of brazil until elon musk would comply with brazilian law. musk cited his commitment to free speech as part of the reason he is refusing to comply with the brazilian government orders but consider this little tidbit, last year, the autocratic leader of turkey demanded that musk allow him to censor his political opponents on what was then still called twitter and elon musk obliged, literary carrying out the government censorship requests.

at the time, the self identified free speech absolutist defending his decision saying that the choices to have twitter throttled in its entirety or limit access to some tweets, which one do you want? so when an autocrat threatens to cut off access to x unless they censor the autocrats critics he says he has to concede to the autocrat so that the people still have access but when a democratic country demands they take down hate speech or misinformation, then elon musk is willing to let the people lose all access to x. in any case, brazil's president is now also standing up to elon musk and told one news outlet he hopes the movement and moment will teach the world it isn't obliged to put up with elon musk's far right free for all just because he is rich. in the meantime, musk's wealth is precisely what strachan the

republican front-runner toward elon musk. donald trump continues to shower musk with praise in exchange for promises of big campaign donations. in fact trump reportedly has been considering giving elon musk a role in the future trump administration. musk responded by saying he can't wait to work in the next trump white house. the political violence of january 6 was historic and significant but don't call it unprecedented. cnn's chief correspondent joins me to talk about her new book which is about the little-known 1872 louisiana vittorio louisiana gubernatorial election and what it could tell us about today coming up after the break. i really tried sleeping with it, everybody. but i'm done struggling. now i sleep with inspire. inspire? inspire is a sleep apnea treatment that works inside my body with just the click of this button.

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donald trump's golf donald trump's golf club in new jersey was set to host a fundraising gala to celebrate and raise money to cover the legal fees of january 6 rioters. that event has now been quietly postponed indefinitely but in text messages obtained by the new york times the event organizers said she would reschedule it for after the election. to refresh your memory, in the three years since january 6, 2021, 944 defendants have been sentenced for their part in the violent attack on the capital. just last week, the first writer to breach the capital building was sentenced to more than for years in federal prison. as much as that'll seems unprecedented a new book recalls the echoes between louisiana's extraordinary election of 1872 and the political turmoil of today including allegations of election fraud and officials trying to hold onto power by

any means and political violence. joining me now is the cnn chief political correspondent and co- author of the new book america's deadliest election, dana bash. it's so lovely to have you. thank you for joining me. congratulations on the book. when we heard the title, americans deadliest election is about january 2020 and it's not. it's about 1872-1876. for those unfamiliar with this extraordinary moment in american history, could you talk about what sort of cross currents were in 1872? >> it was reconstruction . the country was trying to figure out how to come together and in the south what this meant, you had many-many new voters. the election beforehand in 1870

, carpetbaggers came down one particularly in the book who became a governor, henry warmest . he realized there was a lot of opportunity with these voters. he said the right things at that the time he won with these new votes into the next election, the segregationists in the south, the racists, southern democrats said okay, we cannot let this happen again because our way of life is bad enough without slaves and it's going to get worse. and so, they began to realize the way to stop their way of life from changing is to disenfranchise those voters at the ballot box and they did this with intimidation, with fear, with violence, they did this with murder. the result was this corrupted election.

there were two governor candidates, neither would concede. both of whom were then inaugurated by their own people, the same goes for the legislatures, to slates of legislators, judges and so forth. there was complete chaos. the violence was so bad that was a horrific massacre. i didn't learn about this in school, did you? >> neither did i. 2150, at least 150 lakh 150 were killed in cold blood. the federal government stepped in to try the purpose graders the perpetrators. it backfired because it went to the supreme court and what the supreme court said in the famous ruling, cruickshank, the federal government had no right and civil rights on the state level. then we got jim crow for 100 years.

>> first of all, the 1876 presidential election is subsequently affected by all that unfolds. what is staggering about this moment, it's a hinge point. the country is supposed to be going down the road of reconstruction, creating equitable democracy and the opposite happens. when you were writing this book with david fisher, were you thinking of this moment today is the supreme court as intervening as we are questioning what it means to be an american who gets to participate in the process and who doesn't, what parallels did you see between then and now? >> so many parallels . this is what happens when people doesn't trust the electoral system. people that trusted the electoral system, it was corrupt. they were disenfranchising people who should have been allowed to vote.

there was real cross current. now it's people don't trust the electoral system because half the country is told they shouldn't trust the electoral system not because they had seen evidence to prove, i did tell you already or your viewers here in 2020, it's a lesson of what we need to understand about the importance of these systems. i hope we learned the lesson from the last time round but subsequently, we've seen laws in place and states who still control the electoral system i'm not sure that they're going to make it easier. >> it doesn't look good in terms of in franchising the voters who need to be heard more than most given the history down south. i think this is sort of like, really, a must-read material