>> thank you very much for bringing us this story. a lot of focus on georgia. and what might happen down there. it is such a crucial state. and this could be a sticky one. julia ainsley. thank you very much. that is going to do it for me today. "deadline: white house" with nicolle wallace starts right now. hi, everyone. happy monday. 4:00 in new york. just ahead the first and perhaps only presidential debate between donald trump and vice president kamala harris. the ex-president reminding us all just why former vice president dick cheney, former republican congresswoman liz cheney decided to vote for the democratic nominee this year. why decorated generals and career military officials who despise the very idea of being involved in our politics, are

speaking out for the first time. why? this is not a normal election in any way. certainly not one defined by policy debate. in one fell swoop, donald trump laid the groundwork to dispute the 2024 election just as did he in 2020. he threatened mass arrests of election officials, political opponents and critics and it landed like a thunder clap in the saturday night truth social post. it read in part, quote, when i win, those people that cheated will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. which will include long-term prison sentences so that this depravity of justice does not happen again. please beware that this legal exposure extends to lawyers, political operatives, donors, illegal voters and corrupt election officials. those involved in inscrupulous

behavior will be sought out and caught and prosecuted at levels unfortunately never seen before in our country. and now you should know it includes a lot of nonsensical caps. a couple of long words that make me wonder who wrote it. we decided to read it to you, though. because it is long past time to include what he's saying to ignore what he's saying or to dismiss it as the rantings of a angry and bitters and delusional man. he's all of those things. but he often sounds addled and confused so we glass over these things. but this time he's lashing out at the justice system and the election system. as he faces a trial for an attempted coup, an actual prison time for the election interference case. although, all of that is true, the country has been drinking from the fire hose of trump's lies and conspiracies for so many years now. it often feels like too many of us have become numb.

to these kinds of pronouncements, these series of threats from trump. but at this point, what, 57 days out, ignore what he's saying is to ignore a political reality. and focus instead on a horse race or a tightening of polls. we're not going to do that. trump is all of the things that we said. he's addled, his delusional, the things that he writes have bizarre nonsensical fragments of sentences, incorrect. but he is the republican presidential nominee and tomorrow he'll be treated that way. he'll be on stage alongside the other person in the country who could stop him from acting on all of the crazy stuff he posted about. axios reports it like this, quote, trump proposed two of the largest ever federal arrests of people living in america. including u.s. citizens, if he's re-elected. the other being a round up of millions of undocumented migrants. we know what happens when trump turns his mega phone on election

officials and critics. this is from the january 6 select committee. [ crowd chanting ] >> stop the steal. stop the steal. you're a threat to democracy. you're a threat to free and honest elections. >> we love america. we love our freedom. >> you're a tyrant and you're a fell on and you must turn yourself into the authorities immediately. >> and then about 45 minutes later, we started to hear the noises outside my home. and that is -- my stomach sunk and i thought it is me. and we don't know what is going to happen. the uncertainty of that is what is the fear. they-r they coming. are they going to attack my house. i'm in here with my kids. >> i've lost my name, and i've lost my reputation.

i've lost my sense of security. all because a group of people starting with number 45 and his allies rudy giuliani decided to scapegoat me and my daughter shay. to push their own lies about how the presidential election was stolen. >> -- he's turned my life upside down. i no longer give out my business card. i don't transfer calls. i don't want anyone knowing many i name. >> so what he's posting about is doing that on a national level. and he's going beyond the threats. it is gone beyond the proposals that are black and white in project 2025 or the promises of allies and aides that me make day after day in right-wing

media. trump is making it clear that he will, as the harris campaign said in a statement, quote, use his unchecked power to prosecute his enemies and pardon insurrectionists who violated our capitol on january 6 and promising to imprison scores of opponents and clinics ahead of the debate with vice president harris is where we begin today with our favorite reporters and friends. professor from columbia university and basil smikle is here and vaughn hillyard is here. and also joining us white house reporter for "the washington post" tyler page and claire mccaskill will be here in a couple of minutes. vaughn, i start with you. there is a saneness to the trump story, right. it is been going on for nine years and we call on you and he deepen our understanding of what he said. but i think what we know through your lens is there a deepening

of the extra judicial reliance, there is a deepening of the socializing with his supporters and potential for violence and mass prosecutions and mass imprisonments, why? >> when we talk about mass potential prosecutions, we're talking about a department of justice that is not run by bill barr as attorney general. you're talking about a white house council that is not don mcgahn. you're talking about donald trump ensuring in january of 2025 if he surrounds himself by political appointees who want to execute on what could very well be a vast conspiracy charge, you are looking at something like steven richer, maricopa county recorder, he's a republican and just on the phone with him just a bit ago. he's one of the elections officials who face heat in 2022 and he said his concern looking at a social media post from donald trump is not only the threat of retaliation from 2025

and the prosecution, but it is the -- the threats that some of the elections officials could very well feel in real time when trump makes unsubstantiated claims of voter fraud. and the target is someone like steven ripper who is unable, because it doesn't exist, unable to prove the fraud or the cheating and that is where you sort of have this double hit taking place and then you get to 2025 and we could go much more into this and we're working on a story in real time about this, because there are allies of donald trump what want to ensure that he has an attorney general and it may not be one that he's confirmed by the senate, but it would be an acting attorney general who can go in and have the same legal capabilities of an attorney general. so you may have lisa murkowski, susan collins or bill cassidy who vote no on donald trump's pick. but in the meantime, there is a lot that could take place in the first 100 days of administration and in real time you could have

private citizens now working up what could amount to a vast conspiracy charge to begin the effort to compel a grand jury and begin to see that an indictment comes within short order in early 2025. >> if he wins. if he wins. >> if trump wins. but i will say, though, in 2016 donald trump won. he said though that millions of other voters that did not count. >> we have that guy from kansas. >> chris coback. >> and so you're looking at a reality that said he won in the state of california despite losing by 5 million claiming voter fraud. >> so we could expect the next few hours unpacking everything you just shared with us. let me start with this. there will be no don mcgahn or bill barr. our audience knows for the record, they oversaw the child separation policy. they didn't quit because that was too extreme or inhumane. they over saw the most -- i mean, they were not stewards of

the benevolence. they were not safeguards of the rule of law. what don mcgahn did is in a look back seems to be protectk himself from being an accomplice from obstruction of justice and what bill barr did after putting his thumbs on the scale of justice to the point where he repelled life long prosecutors from cases on the department, he said, he thinks a coup is too far. so this, with that frame, and bill barr and don mcgahn are here on the right. what is on the other side. >> there is an individual by th name of mike davis. and i was talking to mike davis earlier today. and he used to be a grassley aide, he's someone who is running a conservative legal group aligned with donald trump very close with the likes of steve bannon and others. don jr. has floated him -- >> don jr. was thinking j.d. vance is still nominating people. >> he should be a good acting

attorney general. someone who could in the first month execute on what would be the vast indictments. i was talking with mike davis. he said he doesn't believe he could constitutionally be the acting attorney general but there are individuals that could. and mike davis told me that as an example, that democrats need to be prepared for, again, i keep coming to this conspiracy charge, that could come out of fort pierce. because, as mike davis tells me, you have the search warrant execution by the fbi, at mar-a-lago which donald trump has claimed was unlawful. you could go and have someone as fln acting attorney general go and seek this indictment out of fort pierce where you could have a more favorable jury pool, favorable to donald trump and in that conspiracy indictment, you could loop in the likes of fani willis, matthew angelo, and alvin bragg. i was talking to a legal ethics professor out of nyu and it doesn't take much to get an indictment as we know. a ham sandwich.

and if they truly indeed want to go through with this, there is little barriers, because if donald trump were to implement the executive order, the schedule f that he did at the end ever his first administration, that joe biden rescinded on day one. they would be able to fire a vast number of career officials and turn those into political appointee positions. so while may have some career d.a. officials, donald trump could very well if the first months come in and move these people out and turn them into political appointment positions an it is not that hard to see how indictments come soon after. >> donald trump turning the federal government into an autocracy is unpopular. why are they rolling this out now? >> well, because donald trump has been indicted four times. and you should expect to hear kamala harris on the debate stage roll out the fact that she's been indicted four times. or he's been indicted four times. you should expect kamala harris tomorrow to tell the american public that he was found to have

sexual abused and defamed e. jean carroll and tell the american public that he was fined $400 million for fraud from the trump administration. so donald trump has one story to share. and that is what that he is being unfairly targeted so in every which way, it is at the froer front of his mind and that is why at social media post, he's telling the public he's the victim and they're going to catch him come 2025, make good on fighting, last weeker he said, two can play the game. >> and "the new york times" moved a story last week about two gentleman that trump pardoned who went on to beat their wives and be prosecuted and adjudicate and anyone that knows even a little bit about domestic violence know it is a sliver of the victims of domestic violence who report it and press charges. so, in that sliver, two people who happen to be pardoned by donald trump went on to commit heinous crimes against their most intimate partners.

is he really going to come out swinging on crime? he's got no shame, no concerns no soft spots in his view. >> donald trump has said he's going to pardon the patriots, the january 6 defendants who were there that day, in donald trump view, who were taking up the fight that mike pence wasn't willing to take. so when we're talking about violence, i was in north carolina on friday with a fraternal order of police, and would endorsed donald trump and i had some really tough conversations with a few of those officers when i asked them to grapple with the images that they saw of their fellow police officers getting beaten on january 6 and one man told many he that it was not actual trump supporters and it was a conspiracy theory that is not based in the 900 plus guilty pleas of those very january 6 defendants and another man just said i don't want to comment and i don't want to talk about it. it is very difficult. because on one hand, they want donald trump yet at the same

time we all bear witness to the video that played out in 2021. >> moving around there and reporting as it was unfolding around you. i want to ask you, with all of your knowledge of sort of the nonreality on this, and all of your reporting on sort of where his movement is, where do you assess sort of the appetite for something violent and not in line with even what happened four years ago for our election as you sit here today. >> from conversations over the last -- >> your reporting, yeah. >> four years ago, we knew there were violent instincts among many supporters and january 6 transpired. not that we were able to visualize that at the time. i don't know what comes next. and yet we've seen donald trump suggest that with ulysses s. grant, you're either a traitor

or -- and talking to the supporters, they feel like this is the final battle for the american democracy in their mind and i don't want to forecast what actions may or may not be taken but we've seen violent actions directed at the fbi before and frankly i think it comes down to what donald trump dricks them to do or not because we are hearing him direct to what would be his attorney general or prosecutors to go after the political enemies. i think it is a outstanding question of what potential thousands or millions of individuals who look at them as the leader, what actions they would take based off the words of donald trump. >> so, we are here to talk about what is going to happen tomorrow. which is called a debate. because it is actually what is going to happen tomorrow night. this is 16 minutes of the best reporting available on sort of the state of the trump candidacy and movement. and what he's prepared to do tomorrow night is to take to the

airwaves to put this in motion. and he's going to smear her about crime and immigration. he pardoned two men who went on to beat their wives and be prosecuted for it. he killed the only immigration bill in -- and president obama, they both set out to solve immigration. no one got as far as joe biden did with republicans at the table and trump killed it. there are only reason there aren't more agents at the border is because of donald trump. and he bragged about it. so what do you in your mind thinking about when you think about tomorrow? >> as you said, it is not going to be a substantive debate. at least from the point of view of donald trump. what i -- in listening to your great narrative about what has and could happen, my sense is look at it as a real threat in real time. not an existential threat.

and consider that donald trump is going to use everything in his power to test the limits of the powers of the supreme court has given him. and we should just accept that is going to happen. and i would love kamala harris to be able to -- to say tomorrow that this isn't some ideological threat or accusation, this is happening in real time. there are election workers in georgia who were threatened. people went to their house. do you want people stopping in front of your house and yelling at you in the middle of the night. do you want your bosses being called to tell them about the activities that your doing that may be subverting america if you will. do you want your doctors, your police officers, your teachers, taking positions on your -- your family or your children that are antithetical to what you think democracy is because they're in line with what donald trump is saying should happen and how do i feel that that is real? because on january 6 there was a

noose in front of the capital. for all of the work that i do and the way i go about my business in the subway, i don't want someone following many he to my house and putting up a noose in the street from where i live. but that is a real threat that people face when they do this work. at least from donald trump. there was somebody that showed up at a pizza shop in 2016 looking for kids that were being abused because they believed what he was saying. and so, you know, as one report said today, it is -- he's priming his supporters for violence. and we have to acknowledge that that is real because it has been real. not fake. not a thought exercise. and so i hope that in whatever -- and we could talk about her -- vice president harris's campaign strategy. but in what she's saying, whatever donald trump wants to do and say, she has to get clear to the american people that you are being threatened in real

time. your jobs, your livelihood, your families, kids show up to follow your kids to school. that is real. and i hope she could get that across with that same emotion. >> we have so much more to cover on this huge weekend of news. we'll talk to claire mccaskill and -- to about what the vice president's four days in pittsburgh ahead of tomorrow's face-off. and plus the challenge cutting through the ex-president's ramblings and randings and smears and torrent of lies and treating his statements as something as normal. what one writer calls sane washing. and following liz and dick cheney's lead, a show of support for vice president kamala harris's candidacy. retire the military officers out today warning of the dangers of a second trupg. we'll talk with one of the officers and much more.

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in 2016, trump said he would choose only the best people to work in his white house. now those people have a warning for america. trump is not fit to be president again. here is his vice president. >> anyone who puts themselves over the constitution should not be president of the united states. >> it should come as no surprise that i will not be endorsing donald trump this year. >> his defense secretary. >> do you think trump could be trusted with an secret ever again. >> no. it is a irresponsible action that places our nation's security at risk.

>> his national security adviser. >> donald trump will cause a lot of damage. the only thing that he cares about it donald trump. and the nation's highest ranking military officer. >> we don't take an oath to a king or a queen. or a tyrant. or dictator. we don't take an oath to a wanna be dictator. >> take it from the people would knew him best. donald trump is a danger to our troops and our democracy. we can't led him lead our country again. >> i'm kamala harris and a prove this message. that ad from the harris campaign is set to air on fox news tomorrow, debate day. let's bring in our conversation claire mccaskill at the table and also joining tyler page is here. i want to read from your great reporting. you write this, harris spent most of the past four daysin an intent debate camp to lay out the debate studio and put the vice president through hours of

rehearsed questions. those are tactics. what is the strategy? >> yeah, i think there are two things that they're trying to achieve here. one is the recognition that mr. voters are still getting acquainted with kamala harris. she's not a known quantity the way donald trump or joe biden is. she's going to have to intersperse her answers with her time before serving as vice president. so they want to give her an opportunity to continue to introduce herself and her record but they say they have a could accomplishment in california as prosecutor and as attorney general but also talk about her agenda. they're hoping that harris is able to create a clear contrast with donald trump on key issues particularly abortion and the economy. but sort of do that in tandem with talking about her biography and present what they say is in her slogan, a new way forward, paint donald trump as someone that is trying to bring the country backward at the tail end

of an era, where kamala harris, younger and the first female president, a woman of color trying to usher in a new leadership for the country. >> we know what trump will do. he doesn't do a lot of new things and we've seen this movie three times now. he will paint her as being soft on crime, and a san francisco liberal. he will have granular details about heinous crimes likely committed by people in the country illegally and blame her for them. and i could see him throwing some in smears about the withdrawal from afghanistan which is only put in motion because of the deal he negotiated and but for the interventions with some -- some of his did on 9/11. >> i think there is frustration in harris world about that because that is the fight over the microphones. they wanted kamala harris to be able to interject, interrupt and redirect trump when he said things that are not true.

and they expect him fully to be doing that. and so that is one -- one thing that they've been frustrated about is they feel she may not be able to be as effective in pushing back encountering some of the lies or falsehoods or things that she wants to push back on. so in conversations i've had with people close to harris and hoer her campaign, she will try to balance both of those things. when she had an opportunity to speak, to correct the outlandish claims that trump makes but not get too bogged down because trying to fight -- fight trump's lies or mistruths is a losing effort a lot of the time and we've seen that as trump has done interviews with mainstream journalists as he's debated other candidates, trying to fact check him in real time is quite difficult. so they're hoping she's able to do that at times but not get too bogged down and go on that attack as well. >> claire, i mean, the attacks that trump will launch tomorrow, we could write them here and probably get 90% close to exactly what he's going to say.

again, he's not capable of newness, just new lows. it feels like we know he'll attack her on crime for being a san francisco liberal. she's the prosecutor and he's the one accused of crimes but he's also someone who put two people back on street with his own personal pardons who went on to beat their wives. his record on crime is a real vulnerability if people know about it. >> well, i think she has an opportunity, nicolle, to explain to people about the reality of evidence. you know, she's got credibility as a prosecutor. our entire criminal justice system operates on evidence. evidence that has to meet a certain rigor, there is evidence that you could object to for all kinds of reasons. she understands this. donald trump has no evidence of any wrongdoing in the election. there is evidence, however, of

his supporters attacking police officers, they've been convicted. there is evidence of him committing crimes and he's been found convicted and liable and if he's abandoned the concept of evidence, he's abandoning the constitution and i think she's got a real -- i think she could do this in a really clever way and if i know her, she will. saying that, we can't -- we can't just lie. we have to have evidence and fakes. that is the only way we move forward. i also think that she's got to remember that, yes, she's got to be really strong, strong is most important. that she's capable and ready to do this and to introduce more of her biography. but she also has to show that she's joyous and into the country is not going to be in a trash talking america for next four years. she's not going to do that. she doesn't believe america sucks. she thinks america is wonderful and she's got to bring that

lightness to it even if he is stalking or, you know, lying or all of this stuff that he ties to do in debates, she's got to keep that tone, that it is different. she's different. >> what do you do going into -- like nobody on fox is saying trump's got to be light and joyful and honest and factual. he doesn't zip his pants up. what do you do with the absolute mix asymmetry of expectations? >> i do think she's suffering from high expectations and trump from low expectations. that is not a good way to go into a debate. and he's capable of dragging the debate down to a place that frankly is ugly and it is where -- hang out. and i think that is really hard. you know, i also think that she has to separate herself a little bit from joe biden. and that is tricky because you don't want to be disrespectful of joe biden, but she needs to

be the new kid on the block. she needs -- and here is a disadvantage trump has. everybody knows the vice president doesn't have real power. everybody knows that. the role is a diminishing role because they have no power. they go where the president tells them to go. and they do what the president tells them to do. but she doesn't have power to influence policy. and i think she needs to stress that now she will have the power to direct policy in a way that she never has before. she could do that without being disrespect afl of joe biden. >> and it feels like there is a pence line in there somewhere. >> of course. >> i stand by his agenda. yours didn't even endorse you. vaughn, i feel like i'm about to burt into the open with more reporting. will you run back out here. >> i will. >> tyler page, you too. amazing body of reporting from you and your colleagues. thank you for spending time with us on it. basil and claire stick around. ahead from us, we'll hear from

vice president harris and what she's saying about how she expected donald trump to behave tomorrow night. a quick break. we'll be right back. we'll be right back. everywhere but the seat. the seat is leather. alan, we get it. you love your bike. we do, too. that's why we're america's number-one motorcycle insurer. but do you have to wedge it into everything? what? i don't do that. this reminds me of my bike. the wolf was about the size of my new motorcycle. have you seen it, by the way? happy birthday, grandma! really? look how the brushstrokes follow the line of the gas tank. -hey! -hey! brought my plus-one. jamie?

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a test or approve a medication. we didn't have to worry about any of those things thanks to the donations. and our family is forever grateful because it's completely changed our lives. who knows, maybe it is because we have seen this all before. this is our third rodeo. maybe after all of these years, it is just hard. it is an effort to cut through donald trump's b.s. his word salads, to go find the crazy stuff he said over on hi

site. and then to figure out and decipher what he's saying and what he means or temptation to ignore his meanderings is an act of self-preservation to us. but waver the reason or reasons for tuning out of his incoherent truth free tirades, one thing is clear now especially ahead of tomorrow night, and it is that if trump's scattered ramblings take up 80 of the debate's 90 minutes, it would be an abject failure to focus just on the 10 minutes he sounded normal. it is a phenomenon called sane watching. in the new republic doing the yada, yada routine, ignoring the loony stuff and elevating some moment of bruf lucidity because it had a noun and a verb in it. making sure that doesn't happen is all of our responsibilities, not just the press, it is on us to watch.

if we see something, say something, right. some responsibility of the voters who should strive to actually listen to both of the candidates. and, yes, we have a role to play in the news media. we should be crystal clear about the truth and who is telling it and who isn't and who telling the truth, kamala harris, who is no doubt planning on doing some fact checking of trump in real time tomorrow night. she appears to be up to the task. >> he plays from this really old and tired playbook, right. where he -- there is no floor for him in terms of how low he will go. and we should be prepared for that. we should be prepared for the fact that he is not burdened by telling the truth, and we should be prepared for the fact that he is probably going to speak a lot of untruth. and, ultimately, you know, what i intend to point out is what we, so many people know and is certainly as i'm traveling country and this campaign, he

tends to fight for himself, not for the american people. and i think that is go willing to come out during the debate. but i, you know, i expect that he's going to be -- i think he's gonna lie. >> angela kars is here and angela, how do you deal with is this? and there were a lot of things that died in the first trump -- in the first run and one of them was the fact checker, the pinocchios. dead and buried. what do you do on a debate stage? >> yeah and i think it starts with the way that the moderators are planning engage. they're use something terms in part, and they don't call themselves moderators, they are facilitators and there are rules in place for the campaigns and even the way that the moderates set the stage ahead of it, talking about the fact that they don't -- i think fact checking, i try not to use that word very much because i know people don't like it. and that sometimes journalists

see that is not entirely their role. i think of them as journalists. which all of the time requires follow up. misinformation is much broader than just the individual facts that you get. it is the starty that the individual makes up and part of a good moderation is doing the follow-up questions not letting people get away with sort of making things up or steering the conversation into those rambling meandering rants. so i think it starts with the journalists that have the mic the entire time. do they let them dominate, do they let trump steal the stage and have lies and distract the conversation and set the bar so low when he said a few things, people sort after plaud him for it or do they do the job well and do follow up questions, vigorous follow up questions. are they true vigilantes. i don't think it needs to be about fact checking trump. that could happen later. but there are parts that do require a response and a follow-up and those are the

moments that will determine whether or not it is entirely in trump's favor, or whether it is neutral or we get something out of this and that is the difference maker and that may be the only shot. an it is on the journalist and that is where it begin. >> why not ask who won 2020? and if that is -- who cares. like, because, if you can't -- i feel like we don't any more have barriers to entry. and to me, if you're first question is madam vice president, who won the 2020 election. joe biden. donald trump, who won 2020? i mean, one, i think everyone would benefit from hearing the answer. there is a nexus with domestic environment extremism. said to his own supporters in last ten days that he, i quote, i lost by a whisker. that was a quote. and what his answer on who won 20 an who cares if that is as

far as it gets if that takes 90 minutes. wouldn't that be a service. >> it is a huge service. because as you noted, he made this acknowledgment recently, i lost by a whisker and his people are made at him for making that concession. because up until that very moment, any sort of suggestion that trump didn't win the election would be met with fierce attacks from his people and him and his supporters. and they're sort of programmed to not accept that reality. and so forcing trump to be in a position where he either has to explicitly say, i won, and that is what he thinks and in a what he's going to say. say it to the broader audience. or to concede something will have a political cost to it. and that is where these moments come in. that is where i try, i think fact checking is important but broader discussion about truth and what comes out of these is more important. that is the political calculation. and people will be reminded that they don't want to see that, they don't want to see that hang wringing and it will disturb it

and that is old news, we do need to deal with it. we just need to deal with the vaccine too, while you're at it. basic things that we no longer talk about that is just as critical and that is the stuff that i think is it the difference maker. being that truth vigilante. and it does depend on the the facilitators here. i'm skeptical. i think there is a go along and get along mentality into newsrooms with a few outliers and you're one of them. but i think that is ultimately the thing that will set the course here. who is a truth vigilante and these questions are more important than the nuance about economic policy an the tax rate and that is where trump wins. these lies give him dominance and let him set the agenda and people walk away with an impression and the scales need to be favored back in evident and truth. >> basil? >> if we zoom out a little bit, i wonder how many people are

actually going to be moved by tomorrow's debate. how many voters does it really move. and it going to be moved by policy, unlikely, right. so going to appoint, some of it is largely performative and that doesn't mean that it is not substantive in the sense that kamala harris can promote some real issues and have real dialogue. but a lot of her base just wants to see her go at donald trump. they want to see her be able to some some ways be dismissive of him and other ways take him to task and how that is going to happen is critically important. in many ways, which was mentioned before but i have to meng this, she goes into it having had donald trump and many of his supporters particularly the donors, say that she will be the dei president. she's going in with this -- having donald trump say that she's not smart. she can do -- she can counter everything that he said.

so i think so much of what is being to happen is not a conversation about issues, it is him talking and her just coming out and saying just exactly what she wants to say regardless of what he does. because all we -- in many ways all we want to see it some contrary presentation to anything that donald trump has put forward. we just want -- we want to be able to see that she can stand up to him, she can lead the country, and all of the things that she can do, because she's done it already. but that is to me, that is what the goal is. because i don't -- to an earlier point, is that a platform for the reporters to fact check him constantly and for her to fact check him constantly and that takes away from what she needs to do. just get out her points and make the case directly to the american people and not to him. and to appoint that you made

clear. i have to give credit to my cousin who used this word after she became the nominee. it feels restorative. her candidacy. and if she comes to the podium with that in mind, with a restore confidence in america, restore confidence in our system, and do with her projecting herself as the pinnacle of this. then i think all fact checking, nob of that -- none of that will end up mattering because she'll con tay the confident and trust to the american people that they could buy into her candidacy. >> i'm going to need all of you to stick around. we'll sneak in a quick break. we'll be right back. k in a quick we'll be right back. that matter. known for being a free spirit. no one wants to be known for cancer, but a treatment can be. keytruda is known to treat cancer, fda-approved for 17 types of cancer.

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angela claire and basil are back. i think it is the wort thing in the world to be asked to moderate or facilitate, i didn't know they changed the words at a debate. but it is also an immense responsibility and privilege and power. and just to go along with the thought exercise. i think it is a fork in the in . and i hear you on what her supporters want. i think this is -- i think they almost have greater expectations for the media. this is a moment where whether we talk about it or not there's peak exasperation with the referees and a lot of that is justified. a lot of the conversations, angelo and i have on this program are about places where

we -- and that's why when vaughn is here we spent 20 minutes, 16 minutes with him really understanding what the trump story is. because it's not just a post. it's not just a tweet. it's a threat. and behind the threat is now a plan in black and white in project 2025 and behind the plan and behind the threat are people he's already lined up to go and do it, to go prosecute journalists and election officials and election lawyers. but i want to know from you what the down side would be to starting with who won and then depending on his answer let the event flow from there. if he says i lost by a whisker, well, then why did you send your people to fight like hell at the capitol? why did you tell them to hang mike pence? and if he says i lost then the conversation -- or i didn't lose the conversation's totally different. then is chris krebs a liar? he said he lost -- are we not nimble enough? do we not have enough preparation? i'm sure there are binders with economic policy questions, foreign policy questions. afghanistan questions. taiwan questions. russia questions. why not just get with the one

thing that has destroyed our politics for four years and that's whether or not in trump's view he won or lost in 2020? >> i couldn't agree with you more. and i think the media writ large has struggled with an issue that has become so obvious in the era of trump and that is at what point in time do you quit both sidesing? at what point in time -- i mean, the idea they changed the name from moderator to facilitator tells you all you want to know. a moderator is someone who actually steps in and moderates. a facilitator is i'm just here to facilitate, you guys go do your thing. now-i get it. it would turn into a freakish mess if it turned into a debate between the moderator-facilitator and trump. that would not be good. but there's a way to do this i think, more risky, and i think a lot -- >> risky for whom? >> i guess it's -- this is a

perfect example. "new york times" today put in an article about how many times there had been personal smears on social media between when biden dropped out and september the 6th. they analyzed it. right? you know what they found? no shock. the article says they found that trump personally smeared kamala harris in almost every social media post and did it three or four times a day. and she on the other hand said he was an unserious person. what's the other thing she said? >> does trump find himself serious? >> wait. this is the whole article. and it lays out in gory detail how bad trump has been attacking her personally and smearing. you know what that line said? what harris and trump say about each other. i mean, how do you write that headline? the headline is donald trump is conducting a campaign of personal smears on social media. period. that's the facts. and either journalists are going to report the facts accurately -- >> in your telling the story the

journalists did. >> but the headline writer did both sidesies. >> what i always invoke to my students, when i talk to my students a lot of them don't watch cable news. they flip through their phone. and a good number of them will not go beyond the headline. >> right. >> so if that headline says what it says they're going to take something from that and run with it and there will never be an opportunity to go back and learn more. >> exactly. >> they just genuinely won't do that. it's a generational shift in how we consume news. and we're trying to figure out how to actually get good information in front of them and get them to actually go down and read as opposed to just a clickbait and the headlines. it's a massive problem. >> it's a mess. >> take more care with the headline -- >> to your point we're the only ones actually reading -- like you know the quality of the reporting -- >> was good. >> and so for you it is about

the headline not capturing it. and you're saying young voters don't even go through -- >> a lot of folks will not actually go deeper. they're look at the headlines and sort of try to -- they may go and see if there's anything that runs contrary to that. but they may not actually go deeper than the headline. and that's a huge challenge if you want them to get to the quality of the reporting. >> angelo, in sort of -- i was off for three months and i had a baby but i also read everything i could find on autocracy and came back and started autocracy could happen here. and in the study of autocracies the pro-democracy side splinters. and that's a boon to the wannabe autocrats. i feel like what can't happen is that the journalists who do the good reporting, who had their reporting put under this misleading headline it cannot be viewed as sort of enemies within the pro-democracy coalition. how do you keep everyone

interested in the country remaining a democracy rolling in the same direction? >> yeah, i think that's the biggest challenge, right? because you have to criticize the media and recognize those critiques are not necessarily coming from a place to diminish them or to weaken them or to hurt them but actually because they're essential. they're essential to supporting and buttressing democracy. we need journalists. and i think at minimum we're asking for people to do their job, to do journalism, to actually embody their profession and how you approach it. that's largely why, and i think this is how we really reoriented a lot of work we do, because we're a media watchdog, we're supposed to criticize. we don't tend to go after one individual article. not because they don't matter but because the biggest problem we're talking about is not one article it's about an orientation to a subject matter even as you pointed out a baseline question are we asking the most foundational question about democracy which is did you win or lose the last election is somehow a thing that we don't consider a threshold. and i think that's something that every interview should start with. and both trump and other republicans.

they should constantly be forced to engage on that very basic threshold thing. i think it starts with not focusing and hyperfocusing on one aspect, giving the benefit of the doubt and looking at the trends. because if you can show where the trends are deficient then you can actually get better coverage over time. i mean, it took "the new york times" 231 days -- just before this show. 231 days since "the new york times" had a news report on donald trump's age or mental acuity. that's the issue here. we have to look at the big picture here. and that's how you avoid hurting the individual jurjts and sort of reinforcing that splintering. >> angelo, thank you so much for joining us today and being part of these conversations and keeping us on the straight and narrow. basil, my thanks to you as well. claire, you stick around a the bit longer for us. we need a full hour of you. and i did clock you in. >> sorry. i'll do my time. i promise. with a smile on my face. >> you could check out -- the poor people that sit down and

think they're going to be here for one block and two hours later i'm like sorry. up next we'll switch gears just a little bit. retired u.s. military leaders collectively coming together in a huge and important show of support for democratic nominee vice president kamala harris. one of those generals is our next guest. stay with us. next guest stay with us ge it well. ♪♪ ♪♪ jardiance! -it's a little pill with a ♪♪ ♪♪ big story to tell. ♪♪ ♪♪ i take once-daily jardiance ♪♪ ♪♪ at each day's staaart. ♪♪ ♪♪ as time went on it was easy to seeee, ♪♪ ♪♪ i'm lowering my a1c! ♪♪ jardiance works twenty-four seven in your body to flush out some sugar. and for adults with type 2 diabetes and known heart disease, jardiance can lower the risk of cardiovascular death, too. serious side effects may include ketoacidosis that may be fatal, dehydration that can lead to sudden worsening of kidney function, and genital yeast or urinary tract infections. a rare, life-threatening bacterial infection in the skin of the perineum could occur. stop taking jardiance and call your doctor right away if you have symptoms of this infection, ketoacidosis, or an allergic reaction. you may have an increased risk for lower limb loss.

call your doctor right away if you have symptoms of infection in your legs or feet. taking jardiance with a sulfonylurea or insulin may cause low blood sugar. ♪♪ jardiance is really swell ♪♪ ♪♪ the little pill with a big story to tell! ♪♪

not only of course required because i was a active duty general and also a national guard officer. it's something where ever since 2016 where i have seen what trump has done, how he has treated people, how he has dealt with crises. i've been just absolutely opposed to such a very dictatorial strongman bully type of a leader. and so i -- it was easy for me to add my name to this list of those ten officers and ncos.

>> it's 5:00 in new york now. we're at a remarkable and unprecedented point in our history and our politics. the staunchest of conservatives are coming out and announcing their plans to vote for democratic candidate for president. and the kinds of people who usually remain steadfastly apolitical are being driven to speak out of their sense of duty to the country. that was retired major general randy manner, one of ten retired generals and admirals who just signed onto an extraordinary letter calling the ex-president and current gop nominee a danger to our national security and our democracy. these men and women who served our nation in high-ranking positions are emphatically endorsing vice president kamala harris, calling her, quote, the best and only presidential candidate in this race who is fit to serve as our commander in chief. they underscore harris's record this way, quote, she has demonstrated her ability to take on the most difficult national

security challenges in the situation room and on the international stage, from rallying our allies against russia's brutal invasion of ukraine to standing shoulder to shoulder with our allies in the indo-pacific against china's provocative actions. to advancing u.s. leadership on space and artificial intelligence. she's a steadfast supporter of service members, veterans, their families, their caregivers, and survivors. as opposed to her opponent about whom they say this, quote, at his core he does not understand selfless service and sacrifice and he should never be allowed to again serve as commander in chief of the greatest fighting force in the world. meanwhile, someone who understands service and sacrifice on a very personal level, gold star father kaz ir khan says the danger trump poses is even greater than four years ago. listen.

>> in 234-year history of united states there had not been a president or vice president convicted of felony charges. here we have donald trump. and that is where i say that in four years it has gotten worse. donald trump is convicted of 34 felonies. and he owes $554 million fine, monetary fine that he still owes. it has gotten worse. and he has announced in his own words that i will be a dictator on day one. >> as we alluded to at the top, the appeal of the current vice president has become so far reaching that former vice president dick cheney and his daughter, former congresswoman liz cheney are throwing their support behind the democratic ticket for the first time in their lives. to them there's only one candidate who puts this country

first. >> if you look at vice president harris's speech, for example, at the democratic convention, it is a speech that ronald reagan could have given. it's a speech that george bush could have given. it's very much an embrace and an understanding of the exceptional nature of this great nation. a love of america. a recognition that america is a special place. >> that's where we start the hour with some of our favorite experts and friends. retired u.s. army brigadier general steve anderson is here with us. he is one of the senior military officials who signed that letter backing vice president harris. also joining us, former republican congressman, msnbc political analyst david jolly's here. and we convinced sklaree mccaskill to stick around. general, i start with you. we've been talking about what the media can do a better job at. and it is because when folks like yourself come out and step into politics it's extraordinary.

and there's a flattening of nine years of trump that makes it difficult to articulate what a big deal it is for all of you who signed this letter to speak out. can you put some of that in context for us? >> well, thank you, nicolle. it's really an honor to be here. i just simply got to highlight what you said about how exceptional this moment is. i mean, i'm a retired army general officer, 31 years. i never in my entire career knew the party of my boss or any of my people, whether they're democrat, republican, independent, whatever. i didn't know, i didn't care. okay? but all of that changed for so many of us on the 6th of january. we saw what was going on. we saw the insurrection. we saw the leadership that was being provided. and really the evil intent of donald trump to try to destroy our democracy and overturn an

election. that caused many of us such as myself and you had lieutenant general randy manner on earlier, a great friend of mine, and the ten signatories of this letter. and i will tell you, there's 500 folks on the national security leaders for america run by admiral mike smith. all of us share this incredible love for our country and our concern of what's going on. all of us have decided the time has come now to take action. what happens, you know, when you -- if you go back 90 years and you look at what happened in germany, how did the nazis rise to power? it's because good people didn't take action. they were silent. they didn't step up. you know, and i talked to many of my colleagues who wish to remain on the sidelines. and i said okay, got it. understand that. but if not now when? are we going to wait for the jack bootes to march down the street and the brown shirts to get rolled up and our kids signed up for trump youth or

whatever? when do we actually step forward? that's why we wrote this letter. we thought the time has come, we need to support kamala harris for many of the reasons that we just articulated in your opening segment. the comments from liz cheney and of course adam kinzinger at the democratic national convention and whatnot. i mean, we need to ensure that donald trump never again sets foot in the oval office. and perhaps the most compelling testimony to that fact is that sochl his advisers and staffers and people that served in his administration, like 98% not only won't support him, won't vote for him but they consider him to be a threat to national security and totally unfit for office. now is the time to step forward. so that's why i and so many of my fellow general officers, admirals and ambassadors, senior leaders, that's why we have come forward and we're saying hey, look, america, please listen to us.

we know what we're talking about here. i was in afghanistan from 2016 to 2018. i saw what donald trump was doing over there. i'll tell you, we've got to make sure that man never again sets foot in the oval office. >> when you look at what he did around january 6th, his goal was to have the u.s. military seize voting machines. and it wasn't a law that stopped him and it sure as hell won't be a second time now that the supreme court gave him absolute immunity for official acts. what is he capable of doing to the military without someone like general milley or without any men or women who say no? >> well, the problem in the military right now is that there's extremism that we've got to sort out and we've got -- i mean, there's no place for extremism in the military. be it right, be it left, whatever. you know, and donald trump is trying to tap into that. and i certainly expect in his next administration he will declare the insurrection or

whatever, he will try to mobilize the military to take down his political enemies, he'll try to mobilize the legal system, the attorney general's office, not only will he try to wipe out all the felony convictions against him and all those other felony charges that are still pending, but he will try to use the legal system to take down his political enemies as well. we just cannot let that happen. and so we've got to stand up right now, speak up and say look, enough's enough, we need to get somebody that's competent, who's professional, who treats others with dignity and respect, who brings optimism and joy and focus, who's trying to -- and hope. she's trying to push america forward. whereas donald trump, he wants to wallow in grievances and hatred and prejudice and revisit, you know, transgressions from the past and try to take out his political enemies.

it's just shocking what's going on. we cannot let that happen. >> what is the private conversation among military families like around trump believing, really believing and saying out loud that anyone who serves the country and dies or is injured is a, quote, sucker and loser? that's according to his former chief of staff, general kelly. >> yeah, john kelly, a great man, a great leader, and so many people like him have spoken out in similar type stories. i mean, it's shocking. it's terrible. we know that he doesn't understand selfless service in the least. he's never done anything his entire life for anybody other than donald trump. look at kamala harris. she served as attorney general of california, state senator for four years. she's been the vice president. she's passed up millions and millions of dollars to be a high-speed lawyer which she could be. because she's incredibly talented and capable. she's doing that because she loves her country. she's here to fight for

americans. she came up middle class just like her superb vice president pick, former command sergeant major tim walz, by the way. these people understand america. they come from middle america. they're going to push this -- they know what we need. they know what we want. they know how really to push this country in the direction we need to go and not take it backwards like donald trump wants. >> what is the -- just help us understand what keeps more of your peers from speaking out? what is it that's sort of in the dna of the men and women of the military particularly at your level? >> well, it's very -- i'm sorry. >> no, help us understand. because i think a lot of people would love to hear from general milley or general mattis or general kelly. >> well, we were prize r raised in an environment in which, you know, we respect civilian leadership and civilian control of the military. so we were taught to be totally agnostic, to be apolitical.

like i said earlier, i didn't know if my boss was republican or democrat. i didn't care. okay? so we're working against decades of that, you know, people like mark milley, a wonderful guy who was raised in that environment. they were taught you never step up, this is something that gets sorted out by the civilians and it's not the military's place. i understand that. but then again, as i said earlier, when -- okay, if not now, when? there's got to be a time. we cannot sit back and watch our country get taken over by someone like donald trump and all of his -- the people like michael flynn, the guy that suggested using the military to capture and seize voting machines whatnot. and wants to essentially declare the insurrection act and all that kind of stuff. we can't let that happen. but there's an awful lot of people, in my own family as well, who -- people who have served in the military who don't think it's appropriate to step up in any way, shape or form.

and i'm trying to convince them, hey, look, we need to do this, this is an exception, this is not the rule. believe me, i'd love to go back to the good old days when all you had to do was argue about policy and politics and whatnot and are we going to raise tax, lower taxes, what are we going to do for national defense, what are we going to do about abortion rights and whatever. i'd love to go back to those days. but we aren't there. we're talking about a guy who wants to essentially declare himself to be a dictator in essence. and not only that, he's going to try -- he's going to weaken our why is security in the most profound ways. i mean, first of all, all of our applies think that he is really a cacophonous buffoon. and whenever i travel overseas people are always saying to he m, what is going on with america? you can't seriously be looking at bringing donald trump back into office. i said unfortunately, there's 50 million-plus people who he's been able to con. he's been able to convince that he cares about them and cares about this country. and of course he doesn't.

but i mean, the things that he's done in ukraine. we've got to continue to support the ukrainians. they're fighting for all of us. they're fighting against the russians. the way he coddles to dictators. you know, in north korea, in russia. i mean, he -- president bone spurs. the whole thing. he doesn't understand about selfless service. he doesn't understand about military families. he doesn't understand what it takes to serve in the military. he's a convicted felon. he wouldn't qualify to be in the army today. but yet he's going to be somehow qualified to be the president of the united states. it's sad. and unfortunately, you know, we need to convince so many americans to step up like this and understand what's going on. >> let me bring david and claire into this conversation. david, it's a conversation that we've had so many times that it's hard to sort of take in the

really big developments. but this is one of them. to hear from the general, to hear from dick and liz cheney, it feels like something tectonic under our feet is shifting. do you feel that? >> i do. and in some ways i think i should yield back my time to general anderson. he is making the exact case that the american people need to hear. here's what i think is fascinating politically and it addresses your question, nicolle. you know, when we went back to the liz cheney endorsement, my take on that is it's a very narrow impact on republican voters. i think the permission structure of a liz cheney is so small of a demographic. maybe it's enough to swing an election was this will be decided by such a small margin. but i think something else is developing and the general and his former peers are reflecting that today. joe biden made a very strong case every time he stepped up about the danger of donald trump. the soul of america was also

about protecting democracy. and as the incumbent president, incumbent president running for re-election, he had to do two things. he had to make his case for the vision for the country going forward but also defend democracy as the chief executive. as the sitting president. vice president harris didn't exactly just take that mantle and that coalition and keep going with it. he should put her own touch on it, her own vision on it, and in many ways is also having to reintroduce herself to voters. so notionally around the edges you see less from kamala harris about the danger of donald trump. frankly because that might not be the most winning message now for candidate harris. i think where liz cheney and dick cheney and general anderson and the other general officers that are stepping forward now with 60 days to go, the space they're beginning to occupy are the messengers about the danger of donald trump. you when you see kamala harris release an ad today that includes in their own words mark

milley and mike pence and esper and bolton those people who know donald trump best, specifically saying he's a danger, he's a danger to our national security that general anderson signed on to, this is an important chorus that can come adjacent to vice president harris's campaign while she talks about certainly defending democracy, defending kpreemd, protecting the nation from donald trump. but she talks about her vision for her first term in office should she be elected. these allies now are able to deliver to the american people an impactful message about the raw danger of donald trump. >> and claire, they're not making policy arguments. i feel like sometimes this conversation gets shoved into a box of letters that don't go to our national security. sometimes they do and sometimes they don't. but they always answer the threshold question of fitness to serve. and national security voices. what the general is talking about, the indictment is that donald trump is fundamentally unfit. >> it was an honor of my

lifetime to serve on the armed services committee for my entire time in the united states senate and learn up close the kind of leadership we have in our military and how apolitical it truly was. so this is a sad day and a good day because these men have stepped forward in ways they've been trained not to do. i would love to ask the general a simple question. i'm watching in venezuela, i am watching as maduro, who lost an election by a very large margin has held on to power, has now arrested and imprisoned 2,000 of his supporters. the candidate that won the election fled the country in an airplane to spain over the weekend. the military in venezuela has helped maduro do this. now, that military didn't get to that point overnight. how worried are you that if we had another four years of donald trump you could see an erosion

in our military in terms of the values of the american military, which is apolitical, which is about defending our country, not defending a politician? how worried are you that we could get to a situation where the military would actually respond to an illegal order from the commander in chief to inflict domestically on the united states citizens imprisonment without facts? >> well, thank you, senator. it's an honor to see you again. i briefed you in 2007 in beautiful downtown baghdad on the fire brigade surge, and it's wonderful to see you again. listen, i'm incredibly worried about that. if you look at what he's trying to do, he's going to demand loyalty oaths from those that he appoints into key positions. i absolutely see him as -- you know, he's not going to allow people to get promoted to general officer until they do like adolf hitler demanded,

which is swear and get everybody that worked for him to essentially sign on and swear an allegiance oath to take that position. i mean, that's the kind of thing that i certainly expect him to do. i'm really, really worried about that. i mean, one of the things that we've written about is about this -- the insurrection and what could happen the next time. 2025 of 6 january. there's a great motion picture out there called "war game" that i recommend everybody see that envisions that scenario, what happens if a person like trump actually has the time to plan out and execute in a more compelling way than they were able to do back in 2021. but senator, i'm very, very worried about this. that's exactly what -- the soldiers often get confused between loyalty to the constitution and loyalty to a person. and if donald trump has his way,

their loyalty will be to him and not the united states of america. >> we -- i feel like we just began this conversation. i'd love to put all of you on the spot to come back and pick it up and continue it. brigadier general steve anderson, thank you for speaking out, for writing this letter, and for joining us. david jolly and claire mccaskill, thank you as always for spending time with us today. when we come back on the eve of what may be the only debate between vice president kamala harris and donald trump, trump is launching more misogynistic attacks against the women who have accused him of sexual violence. we'll bring you that story next. and one of the rising stars in democratic politics will be here on what he's looking for from vice president harris and expecting from donald trump in tomorrow night's debate. illinois governor j.b. pritzker will be our guest later in the broadcast. "deadline: white house" will be back after a quick break. don't go anywhere. be back after a quick break don't go anywhere.

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i'm here today to tell my story yet again because i believe it's important to remind the voters of trump's disrespect of women. he assaulted me 50 years ago and continues to attack me today. the bottom line is he doesn't understand he's a sexual predator. i'm here to say we just cannot allow this person back into the white house. >> that was jessica leeds, who accused trump of assaulting her on an airplane in 1979.

one of the many, many, many women who have credibly accused the disgraced ex-president of sexual abuse and misconduct. responding to a disgusting tirade by trump at a press conference on friday where trump took no questions, trump lashed out at leeds and other women who have accused him of sexual assault, offering a horrifying defense for why he couldn't and wouldn't have assaulted leeds. here's the republican nominee for president of the united states of america responding to allegations of sexual assault. >> so think of how -- the impracticality of this. i'm famous. i'm in a plane. people are coming into the plane. and i'm looking at a woman and i grab her and i start kissing her and making out with her. what are the chances of that happening? what are the chances? and frankly i know you're going to say it's a terrible thing to say but it couldn't have happened.

it didn't happen. and she would not have been the chosen one. she would not have been the chosen one. >> a claim so audacious even his hair clips are offended. it's a gross claim. it's a gross thing that trump would say that being famous is an impediment to carrying out sexual assault because according to him in his own words on tape with billy bush, quote, when you're a star they let you do it. and he said to billy bush, quote, i just start kissing. for anyone keeping track of any of this at home this is at least the second time trump has sought to defend himself from allegations and accusations of sexual assault or abuse by saying that the women weren't his type. not that he's not the type to do such a thing. and not surprisingly, trump does continue to hemorrhage support among women. a new abc/ipsos poll finds that vice president harris leads

trump by 13 points. it says abortion, a right that trump bragged about taking away from a generation of women, has become the number one issue for female voters under 45. joining our coverage, president of emily's list jessica macler, and former assistant u.s. attorney and president of a leadership conference on civil and human rights maya wiley. i think all of our reaction is horror. but i guess i want to ask you 57 days out from an election, jessica, how you make sure all the girl dads in america know that's who donald trump is. >> absolutely. and as you said, it is horrifying, it is deeply offensive, and it's -- frankly it's hard to watch. but donald trump continues to show us who he is. he shows us who he is with his words when he launches these sexist and vicious attacks against individual women who've come forward bravely, and he shows who he is through his agenda and his record. again, as you said, this is the

man who's responsible for overturning roe vs. wade. and so it's really incumbent on all of us. this is something that we are doing here at emily's list every day and we're going to continue to do, is to put this information about who donald trump is in front of voters. he has shown women and men all across the country who he is, and on election day i am pretty sure that they are going to show him what they think of him. >> maya, let me show you how trump attacks on the debate stage since we are on the eve of what could end up being the only debate between vice president harris and donald trump. >> he told us who he was. >> should abortion be punished? >> there has to be some form of punishment. >> then he showed us -- >> for 54 years they were trying to get roe v. wade terminated. >> that's an ad. i want to play that for you too. but let me show you this. this is trump's attacks, a lot of them launched on a debate

stage. >> my social security payroll contribution will go up as will donald's assuming he can't figure out how to get out of it. but what we want to do is to replenish -- >> such a nasty woman. >> -- the trust fund -- >> that's some of what we've seen from him when he's on a stage or has to share a stage with a woman. how do you think this will play tomorrow night, maya? >> if you're thinking about attracting voters and what voters are looking for, we know that voters are looking for solutions to their problems. and i think the more we see defensiveness, the more we see an attack on a person kamala harris on herself as an individual rather than about her record or policies i think the more all those undecided voters

and there are still apparently 18% of folks who haven't made up their mind who need to hear how their lives are going to be better, i think it's going to be offensive. i certainly think it should be offensive. but it's also the playbook for donald trump, is to try to appeal to people's prejudices rather than appeal to their sense of policy solutions. and that's something that i hope everyone is listening for, is what are the candidates going to do for me or are the candidates and who is trying to tell me who i should not like or trust simply because of who they are or what they look like, what gender they are. because that's essentially what donald trump has been doing. that's been the playbook. and it's had very little to do with policy. >> jessica, what trump is has been in the public arena for a long time and was available to voters before they elected him in '16 and it was before voters, before he came too close for

comfort in my view in 2020. what wasn't available was what amanda zarawski did today, which was tie his record of credible accusations of sexual abuse and misconduct to a policy that threatens the life and fertility of every woman in this country from coast to coast, red state to blue state, young to old as well as access to basic health care and birth control and ivf. let me show you amanda za rausky at today's event. >> as jessica so powerfully shared, trump does not respect women. he doesn't trust us to make the choices that are best for our health, our family or our lives. and that has had devastating consequences for women all across our country including me. what i went through was nothing short of barbaric, and it didn't need to happen.

but it did because of donald trump and his allies, who continuously brag about killing roe v. wade. it is unthinkable to me that anyone could cheer on the full abortion bans that nearly cost me my life. but they do. and what's more, trump has said that there should be some form of punishment for women who have an abortion, women like me and kaitlyn. >> it should have been enough to have what we had in '16. it wasn't. these two issues together feel like they make the case without anyone really having to do too much more explaining than to just show people trump in his own words. >> well, trump in his own words and i think it's absolutely right that we are living in a wildly different environment than we were in 2016 and 2020. it is hard to overstate the impact that the dobbs decision and that trump's overturning of

roe vs. wade has had on the political landscape. it sparked an outrage in women across the country for exactly what amanda just articulated, that we are living with the chaos and the cruelty of this trump policy, of what it means to be stripped of our fundamental rights, to be denied life-saving health care, to be left, to be on the brink of death before we get access to health care that should be available to us. that is the reality we're living with. it is directly because of donald trump. it is all at his -- in his hands. and that is what is driving elections. in every election since the dobbs decision when we have put the stakes around reproductive freedom in front of people, in front of voters, they are with us and they are going to be with us again in november. but it is incumbent on us. it should be enough but we need to keep doing that work. to put in front of voters who he is, what he has done, and how he is responsible for this. because if we do that we will win. >> all right. and i'm going to show you more

of what we can sort of gird ourselves for tomorrow night as well as that ad on these issues. i have to sneak in a quick break first. i need both of you to stick around. we'll all be right back. around we'll all be right back. ♪ ♪ have you always had trouble losing weight and keeping it off? same. discover the power of wegovy®. ♪ ♪ with wegovy®, i lost 35 pounds. and some lost over 46 pounds. ♪ ♪ and i'm keeping the weight off. wegovy® helps you lose weight and keep it off.

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angry at her. i think i'm entitled to personal attacks. i don't have a lot of respect for her. i don't have a lot of respect. >> but if you think that bird brain -- i mean nikki becomes president -- >> you called women you don't like fat pigs, dogs, slobs and

disgusting animals. your twitter account -- >> only rosie o'donnell. >> she gets out and she starts asking me all sorts of ridiculous questions. and you know, you could see there was blood coming out of her eyes, blood coming out her wherever. >> if hillary clinton were a man, i don't think she'd get 5% of the vote. the only thing she's got going is the woman's card. >> she'll be so easy for them. she'll be like a play toy. they look at her and they say we can't believe we got so lucky. they're going to walk all over her. >> we're back with jessica and maya. i think maya, trump's talking about the military, and we did just have a former general call him a buffoon. so trump should be careful. what do you make of how ill equipped we still are to cover trump's misogyny ahead of the debate tomorrow night? >> i have to say that i find it

deeply frustrating because he says the quiet part out loud. he is unabashed, unapologetic. and he's clear. it's not like he's mincing words. and we should add to those clips how he talks about black women, how he talks about women of color. now, you had nikki haley in there. but remember how he talked about new york attorney general tish james, what really seemed clear to the rest of us a racist slur, and ways he's talked about fani willis. i mean, he really, really has a problem with strong women of color. and with women of all races. and he makes it clear how he belittles them, disrespects them. but the combination of the two is going to be really interesting to see just how he goes tomorrow night. but i think, and i think back to when ben smith posted this back in 2016 when he said it was factually accurate if people

call him a mend ashs racist on their social media accounts in terms of journalists because it was a factually accurate statement. you know, i think we have to get back to a journalism that is truly fair and evenhanded, and we have really seen a double standard in the willingness i think of far too many journalists, not all by any stretch and not that there hasn't been some good coverage of these kinds of remarks, but the reality is he's constantly berating people, belittling them and going as far as being offensive and stirring up stereotypes and hate, and that has to be called for what it is because if it's not we're in trouble. >> i think that some of where we end up in uncharted territory is dealing, jessica, with an electorate that after hearing him in his own words talk about grabbing women in the -- between the legs -- and i think we

should question whether or not censoring the word every time. are we sanitizing him? because the word is a lot more disgusting than the way we edit it. i mean, there is a crudeness to his misogyny. there is a volume to the accusations of sexual misconduct. there's a decisiveness to the civil judgment that found him liable for sexual abuse and defamation. that seems to pile up and almost get lost in its quantity. >> absolutely. and it is frustrating to have lived through all of this, and it's also true that voters have sometimes short memories of what happened back in 2016. i do think that what we're seeing in terms of our ability to connect these really disgusting and gross and vicious attacks that we absolutely, i agree, need to be calling out for what they are, sexist, racist attacks, but tying that then to what we have seen from

donald trump in terms of his agenda. to be able to say this shows us who donald trump is and here's how it is going to have an impact on your lives. and when we do that, when we can connect it to his policies that strip freedoms from women, that say you can't have control over when and how and if you start a family,you don't have the freedom over our own body, the most fundamental freedom that we should have, that that does spark an outrage in women. and we have seen that. and i would say particularly young women in this election and the research that we have done are showing that they are motivated to vote for kamala harris and that they will stand up against this. and we just have to continue having that conversation with voters, frustrating as it may be sometimes. >> jessica and maya, thank you so much for spending some time with us on this. when we come back, big star in the democratic party who made thert list to be vice president harris's running mate. what illinois governor j.b. pritzker will have his eye on, what he's watching for in

tomorrow night's debate. we'll be with him next. ate. we'll be with him next (children speaking) conflict is raging across the world, and millions of children's lives are being devastated by war, hunger, disease and poverty. we urgently need

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democratic governor j.b. pritzker, and his attacks on donald trump, the felon in the orange spray tan showing how the truth is the most effective tool for going after donald trump in debates like tomorrow's. it also serves the purpose of getting under donald trump's skin and throwing him off his game. joining us now, illinois governor j.b. pritzker. this feels like one of your sort of chosen political tools. but that doesn't mean that it can't be deployed by anyone who can simply use trump's own words against him on what we know will be vicious and lie-based attacks against harris when it comes to issues like crime and immigration what are your strategies for getting back on offense? >> well, let's start with the fact that he's a liar, he's a faker. remember, he's an entertainer. so he's going to say whatever he thinks is going to get the biggest rise out of the audience, whether it's true or

not. and that is challenging. i have to say, i've been on the other side of a debate stage from somebody who just told a whole bunch of lies. and you have to make a decision when you're on that debate stage about whether you're going to respond to the lies and tell the truth to set the record straight or whether you're going to stick to your own message and make sure you're getting that out. and that's the choice that kamala harris is going to have to make for most of the night because again, everythingtion a lie coming out of donald trump's mouth. so i personally would advise her to stick to her message rather than try to counter things than counterthings that trump says. he tries to throw people off when he is on stage. he tries to throw in new subjects that were not really something that should be part of the debate but there they are. so, i, i highly recommend to her that she sticks to her own message. it is a great message. it is focused on the middle class, creating jobs, on small businesses, on helping people, lifting people up that are most

vulnerable. kamala harris has a great message for america and she should not let donald trump throw her off. >> as i am listening to you answer it does seem to me that is what she sought to do in the cnn interview when she was presented with one of the spears against her and she said that is an old playbook, next question. and a long time trump advisory says that drives trump crazy. the reason he says those things, to your point, is to get a rise. just take me through what it might look like. accuses her of being soft on crime. a san francisco liberal, she says what? >> reporter: the biggest, most important thing that she needs to point out is her record as one as a prosecutor -- if you are going to talk about crime, for example, she has a way of talking to people who are accused of drugs, what trump says democrats are soft about,

she has been a tough prosecutor about. she has a great record. yeah, she can push those things away by simply pointing out her own record but then i think she has to pivot and pointing out it is donald trump that is tearing apart the police. he is the one that wants to defund the police. remember he is the one that wants to tear apart the f.b.i. he has been talking about that for a long time. he attacks members of law enforcement and the military and she needs to make sure to point that out. i don't think that she should be on offense all of the time about things that trump has said. rather to remind people what she is going to do to make people safer in their communities across america. that means investing in communities, lifting up people who have been left out and left behind, making sure you are addressing the underlying causes of crime and pointing out that crime is coming down all across america as a result

of harris/biden ticket and their policies that they put forward. >> i mean even that which is a perfect thing is anything more on the planet expect him to do. they want him to have on pants and a shirt and say home run, how do you deal with the parties of the expectations? >> well, i think the first thing we have to point out to everybody is that he has been on the debate stage, on the presidential debate stage more than any other presidential candidate in modern history. so, he has a lot of practice doing this. he is the one who actually has very high expectations to be set for him. to be honest he won a couple of the debates he has been in. kamala harris needs to make sure that she is staying to her message, not getting thrown off. you saw that as you are saying in the cnn interview. she knows how to stay on message. and, i also think she has a lot

to show for the success that she has had bringing down the cost of pharmaceuticals, drug prices for people across america. making sure she highlights the plan to make housing more affordable. donald trump does not have a plan for that. how about small businesses? she put out a plan. trump wants to raise tariffs and cost every american $4,000 each if he gets his way. kamala harris is trying to bring prices down. it is, it is, it is a strange world that we live in. it is upside down if people think donald trump is the, you know, is the underdog in this debate. he is guy who has won debates, he beat joe biden in that last debate, let's face it, that had such a upending effect on every thing in this debate. kamala harris is good debater and she has to show she can go

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. oh, people will come, ray. people will most definitely come. my favorite movie. sad news to tell you about before we go. james earl jones who gave "people will come" speech, died this morning, 93. more than 60 years he sustained the most prolific careers from the stage to film. darth vader, unforgettable voice, unforgettable and vast career. another break for us, we'll be right back. reer. another break for us, we'll be right back. i need indeed. indeed you do. when you sponsor a job on indeed,

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