♪♪ good day, i'm chris jansing live at msnbc headquarters in new york city. one of donald trump's most potent political attacks reduced to a punchline. so, will he use a trip to battleground arizona to pivot his immigration message away from migrants eating cats and dogs and back to the border? the latest on the political fallout for the former president straight ahead. plus, more and more young women leaning left. the issues that have led to a political shift among the women

of gen z that could be a boom for democrats. and hundreds of homes flooded. hundreds of thousands without power after hurricane force winds and record rainfall pound the gulf coast. the latest on what is now tropical depression francine still packing a bunch down south. but we start with donald trump. set to speak in arizona this afternoon, a state where immigration is consistently top of mind for many voters. it's an issue key to his election strategy, but even allies now worry that his unsubstantiated claims about migrants eating people's pets has weakened his cause. it is part of a pattern. trump brings up what he calls migrant crime or the migrant invasion in almost every single rally he does, but his decision to embrace this particular conspiracy theory has taken on a life of its own. even germany's foreign ministry, in a statement about renewable energy, included a ps, "we don't

eat cats and dogs." a headline in the british paper, the standard, calling him a laughingstock. harris' plan, meantime, seems to be to let trump keep talking. the thinking being he's only hurting himself. and, in fact, a focus group by fox news may bear that out. it found that when trump made his claims about migrants eating pets, "approval from all groups, republicans, independents, and democrats dipped with the strongest dips coming from independents and republicans." i want to bring in nbc's vaughn hillyard, live in tucson. david jolly is a former republican congressman from florida. ashley parker is "washington post" senior national political correspondent. both david and ashley are msnbc political analysts. welcome to all of you. so, congressman, "the new york times" says that trump's particular political goals in this case appear to be the same as they've always been. you stoke anger, give someone people to blame for their misfortunes. did he overstep this time,

though? >> he did. this was an idiotic moment by donald trump, truly an idiotic moment, and as the focus groups show, democrats, independents, republicans all are scratching their heads, saying, why is donald trump doing this? i think part of what is so unsettling is we also see a former president trying to regain the white house by paying attention to internet conspiracies and social media conspiracies and by being -- the likes of laura loomer and others going into this debate, so we see someone lacking the capacity to return to the white house if he didn't have it in the first place. i do think, though, it reflects, as you said, in the opener, chris, that the real goal here for republicans -- because they really have nothing to offer substantively on behalf of a plan. donald trump is not a policy wonk. it will be ultimately to tie immigration to crime, to conflate the two, even though statistically, those numbers are upside down, but to run a willie horton-type campaign down the

stretch, try to tie vice president harris to rampant immigration, conflate immigration with crime by brown people and black people. we saw it in the best example was katie brit's response to the state of the union, when she basically said, you have brown and black people coming into your white gentrified neighborhoods, and you should be scared, i suspect that is what donald trump will hone into on these last 50 days or so. >> vaughn, tell us what we know about what we might hear from the former president in arizona today. as we've said, key battleground state and one of the most important states when he talks about immigration. >> reporter: right, chris. at least the campaign is billing these events, these remarks that he is set to deliver here in southern arizona, as a focus on the economy and on america's housing crisis. of course, usually, with the campaign bills something as a certain theme, we see donald trump spend a significant amount of the time talking about other issues here, but the idea of the economy and the housing crisis, you know, i was just talking to

a couple of trump's loyal supporters who said they watched the debate, and one woman, she told me that one of her frustrations with trump or concerns out of that debate was his focus on repeatedly coming back to immigration as the cause or also the solution in stemming immigration flow for every issue that he brought up, saying that she was eager and was hoping to hear something else besides him continually coming back to immigration. well, she said that she knows and understands as somebody who lives in southern arizona, the importance of it. i was talking with another voter here, who told me that she was -- her head turned when the eating pet comment was made by donald trump on the debate stage. she hadn't heard anything about this theory or this narrative, and then she went on the internet and couldn't find any facts to back it up there. she said she is still voting for donald trump, and she wishes that he would have greater focus on issues like the economy and

housing crisis here, but as we have seen from donald trump, time and again, he often weaves between, you know, some policy tangential discussion and other conspiracy theories like eating pets that, frankly, a lot of allies that he listens to and right-wing media or sometimes even surrounds himself by, like laura loomer, are those -- those are the issues they so often bring up directly to him, and we see that play out on debate stages and in places like here on campaign rally stages, chris. >> the thing, ashley, is the people who want to win, in fact, the people who said to me, and i'm sure said to you, republicans, after joe biden stepped down, was, he can still win this. he needs to stick to the issues where he's strongest, the economy and immigration. obviously, he's gone off on a tangent on immigration. have you heard anything that he is willing or able to recalibrate his message to get back to where it's effective for the voters he needs to win?

>> well, again, i think if you just look at the debate, our reporting is that his team had worked to prep him to stay on message. they had prepared him that vice president harris would levy personal attacks against him for his criminal indictments over his rally crowd sizes, all of the sorts of things that she did, and in that moment, for those 90 minutes, as we and much of the nation saw, he was either unwilling or unable or some combination of both to maintain the self-discipline that his advisors and aides hoped he would have to get through that debate. now, having covered him from 2015, is he capable of recalibrating? look, there's moments where he is capable of changing his behavior for a stretch of several days or even a week at a time. he can sometimes stand up and read from a teleprompter, so there's a world tonight that vaughn's out there in arizona,

and donald trump could read a message that is prepared by his aides and advisors on a teleprompter about the housing crisis and the economy. will he be able to do that between now and election day without interruption? historically, he has never once done that before. so, i'm skeptical he will suddenly become an entirely different human now. >> so, let's take the first part of ashley's theory, then, congressman, that he might be unwilling. do you think trump and some of his supporters believe that the key to victory actually is, i don't know, painting such an apocalyptic vision of where the u.s. is right now that he becomes the change candidate, he becomes the one who can make it all better? >> yeah, the textbook theory, dispassionately, is called negative partisanship. he would run a campaign saying, vice president harris is worse than i am. you should be scared of her leadership. but trump turns that into some racist, xenophobic narratives

that reach for some of the darker elements in american culture, and then he also does the chicken little theory of, american carnage. chicken little worked in 2016, but chicken little, by donald trump's, not working right now. and i would love to see more of a debate over the economy. we didn't see a lot of debate on the economy because i think vice president harris and the biden administration have such a strong response to that. donald trump wants to play on inflation. the entire world suffered from historic inflation coming out of the pandemic, and u.s. policymaking around it. but the u.s. is the envy of the world in its recovery. more people went to work this week than ever before. home ownership remains at historic highs. the stock market is breaking records. inflation's coming down and real wages are going up. access to health care and education has hit historic highs and investments in infrastructure are unlike anything during the trump years so if donald trump wants to have a policy debate on the economy, i think vice president harris should welcome that, and i would also suggest there's a lot more room for vice president harris

to run on that. we didn't see that on the debate stage when she took the question, are you better off today than you were four years ago? yes, we are, for reasons of the biden/harris administration. it would be a wonderful debate for this country to have in the last six weeks of this race. >> well, let me go to yamiche in ohio where these claims about people eating cats and dogs originated or at least that's the first time it was, like, tied to springfield. what's the latest from there? >> well, good afternoon, chris. what i can tell you is that the tension here in springfield, ohio, is really palpable, and this all goes back to a rumor about, of course, haitian immigrants, a basisless rumor, baseless claim that haitian immigrants were abusing and eating animals. the pet rumors are connected with an unrelated case in a different part of ohio where a u.s. citizen was arrested for a grim incident dealing with a sort of cat and just sort of a

graphic incident there, but that had nothing to do with springfield, ohio, and then that turned into, though, people taking that and marrying it, people think, with their own biases against these hiegs immigrants who have come here by the thousands. legally, about 15,000 over the last few years. state officials tell us. and now, residents are really saying, long-time residents, some of whom are believing these debunked claims and these false claims, they're saying this is part of a larger issue here and that they don't want the haitian immigrants here. i talked to one of the residents here. take a listen to what he told me. >> i would say, by, you know, even just current birthrates, i would say that haitian, you know, the 2040 graduating class is going to be two-thirds first or second generation haitians, and it's going to be a very different town. >> so, chris, he told me he feels like springfield is going to be lost because it's going to go from being what he called an american community to being a haitian community. of course, people who don't agree with him would say, maybe it's going to be a haitian

american community and that's what america is all about. i should also tell you the haitian immigrants are really heartbroken. so many of them fled violence and insecurity in haiti, came here, legally, because the city of springfield was advertising new manufacturing jobs as well as affordability, saying they wanted people to come here to revitalize this town because the population numbers had been going down, and now those haitian immigrants said, i fled insecurity, one of them told me, in my home country and now i'm feeling insecure and worried i might get targeted and might be the victim of violence here because of these false accusations. a tough time for these haitian immigrants, but some of them are telling me they still want to be here, while others are saying they might leave because they're so heartbroken. >> yamiche alcindor, thank you for your great reporting. so, ashley, it's clear what donald trump's message is, right? and we're seeing the effect of that. meantime, you have the harris strategy, which seems to be, let trump be trump, and i want to show you a few clips of donald

trump. this is in the hours after the debate, and it was compiled by our friends at "all in with chris hayes." >> what made you come to the spin room? >> i just felt i wanted to. i was very happy with the result. we're looking at polls, the worst poll that we have had was 71% that i see. we had a 92% rating in one poll. 80 to 20. i told that to brett bayer, and we sent him a lot of polls, and we sent you a lot of polls this morning. we had an 86% rating on another. we had 77%. one poll is 92% to 6. it's 92 to 7. >> mr. president, speak louder. >> 88 to 11. all of the polls are 60, 70, and 80. 86-3. but every single poll last night had me winning, like, 90-10. 71% to, like, 24% or 25%. why don't you do a shoutout poll, who they thought won the debate last night? it would be great.

>> you know we always do the poll at the end, mr. president. i think you -- >> why don't you do it while i'm on the phone there? the polls are indicating that we got 90%, 60%, 72%, 71% and 89%. >> where are you getting these numbers from? >> so, ashley, i think we can say that those numbers are contradictory, at best. i'll leave it at that. does the harris team, i wonder, think now -- because you know, the view from a lot of folks in trumpworld was, let trump be trump. if the view in harris world now, yeah, do that, because then he becomes one of our strongest surrogates? >> yeah, and i would say it's not just "let trump be trump" from harris world, but it's actually encourage trump to be trump. she went into that debate with a very deliberate strategy, one of

her campaign adviser told me, to ensure that donald trump stepped on that debate stage as they put it, "triggered." from that opening handshake which, again, was described to me and others as a power move where she confidently walked over into his space, introduced herself, said her name, pronounced it correctly, to subtle little digs. she had throughout the debate, the most sort of obvious and the one that did lead to that cats and dogs diatribe about his crowd sizes and his rallies. that was all very concerted to get under his skin and to encourage him to be the version of himself that voters, even voters who have said they will still go to the polls in november and vote for him, have also said they do not like. >> vaughn hillyard, former congressman david jolly and ashley parker, thank you all. in 90 seconds, hurricane francine slams the gulf coast, and it's left hundreds of thousands of people without power. the damage we're now seeing and

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are littering flooded streets, and emergency teams say they've carried out at least 26 rescues from life-threatening storm surges. our local station caught this rescue on camera. a good samaritan used a hammer to break the window of a car stranded in the floods and was able to pull the driver to safety. that's amazing stuff. nbc's steven romo is reporting from gulf port, mississippi. nbc's bill cairnes is here with more. steven, i know the extent of this storm is really just being calculated, but among other things, it shut down colleges, airports, roads. how are things looking right now? >> reporter: yeah, chris, you're right, it caused a lot of complications for people. the rain has moved out of here in gulfport, but we are still seeing it in northern parts of mississippi right now. that storm really did slam into the new orleans area, causing all those power outages that you mentioned. there was damage to homes and businesses as well. the national guard was there as well, trying to help with those

rescues that you mentioned that had to happen last night due to that water, people driving into those flooded waters which, of course, they are advised not to try to do. here in gulfport, there was a curfew from 6:00 p.m. to 6:00 a.m. today. they were really concerned about that storm surge. it did flood some low-lying areas here in this area, but no major damage. the airports now starting to get back open. we understand that the airlines are starting to resume flights out of new orleans and also the gulfport, biloxi airport as well. people are assessing how much damage they have to deal with. we have some cities like new orleans talking about their sewer system has been flooded. right now, they're asking residents to conserve water as people are now trying to figure out just exactly how much damage they have as they try to get things back going again, chris. >> steven, thank you for that. bill, will this storm finally get out of there? >> the gulf and the areas that have all the power outages, the weather is fine today, and the hopefully will get a lot of

people back up during the day today and of course as we head towards the weekend. but there is still concerns. we still have what's left of francine heading for the memphis area. that's where we could see significant rain. it's also going to slow down and stop and stall, so those spiraling bands are going to sit here over the memphis and right over the mississippi river, so anywhere from little rock to memphis, we easily could see flash flooding later tonight into tomorrow, upwards of six inches. thunderstorms in birmingham, a train, means heading in the same areas, and that way, we could see an additional three to six inches of rain, and we have a chance of isolated tornados too. the flash flooding, moderate risk, that's the birmingham area. when you get a moderate risk, you're going to have a couple areas with extreme flooding. flash flood watches are up for about 11 million people. the tornado threat, we have had about one tornado, haven't heard any reports of any significant damage, but we still have that threat and those thunderstorms later this afternoon near

montgomery, birmingham, and we have been tracking strong storms around panama city heading east. everyone wants to know, what's next? there's a lot going on. most of it is well out here in the atlantic, no threat to anyone, but our friends here off the south carolina-north carolina coast, we're going to have some sort of storm developing. it may not be purely tropical. that will bring rough surf. that will be something we'll be watching as we head towards the weekend. >> bill cairnes, thank you. coming up, the feds take major measures to prevent another capitol insurrection. the huge security measures we'll see going into effect. and the new data that points to a growing political trend among women. you're watching "chris jansing reports" only on msnbc. hris jang reports" only on msnbc ♪♪ citi's industry leading global payments solutions help their clients move money

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attorney general merrick garland today is telling his employees, we've got your back. speaking directly to doj workers and other public officials in the face of what he describes as dangerous and outrageous attacks. >> these attacks have come in the form of conspiracy theories, dangerous falsehoods, efforts to bully and intimidate career public servants by repeatedly and publicly singling them out, and threats of actual violence.

it is dangerous and outrageous that you have to endure them. >> nbc's ken dilanian is covering this story for us. i'm wondering what else he had to say, but also, ken, why now? >> well, it's been building for some time, chris. garland talked about the tradition of inslating the doj from partisan influence which really began after watergate when he joined the department as a young prosecutor four seconds ago. he said that tradition is under threat as never before. he didn't say this part explicitly, but we all know the biggest threat comes from the republican candidate for president, who is suggesting that if he's elected, he will use the doj to go after his enemies. donald trump also has spent years falsely suggesting that the investigations into him were a partisan effort by democrats to frame him. garland got a huge round of applause when he said, and i'm quoting now, "the public servants of the department of justice do not bend to politics, and they will not break under pressure." and as part -- in part as a

result of these partisan attacks, polls show public confidence in the fbi and doj have plummeted. garland said the justice department will not be intimidated by these attacks, but he said it's dangerous and outrageous that these u.s. attorneys across the country have to endure them. chris, a lot of people i talk to wish garland had expressed these sentiments earlier and more often, but he did so forcefully today, chris. >> ken dilanian, thank you for that. meantime, with the concern that the violence of january 6th could happen again, when it's time to certify the election next year, the federal government is ramping up security, so much so that it would put the electoral count protections on the same level with the state of the union, the super bowl, and the olympics. nbc's ryan riley is following that story. it almost boggles the mind to think of a level of security around the capitol for an event that most people, up until last january 6th, didn't even know, really, even happened every four years.

i mean, they're doing super bowl level, it's unbelievable. on a practical level, though, what does that look like? >> yeah, it just means more resources, i think, for the protection of the capitol because this was all basically left up to the capitol police last time around and you know, there's one thing that the government does, it doesn't get caught flat-footed the second time. there's this big lesson that everyone learned the first time around and we're looking, staring down the barrel of that potential another time with a leading presidential candidate not conceding that he lost the last election and continuing to spread sort of these lies about his election loss last time around and telling people to target certain cities again and getting out all -- getting his supporters ready for this idea that there's going to be some secret mass fraud scheme that's going to steal the election from him. that's what they're sort of preparing for. here's what the house speaker had to say when asked about this today. >> what do you think of january 6th being designated now as a

national security event? do you think that's necessary? >> i don't even -- i didn't even hear that happened. who did that? >> dhs designated it as a national security event. >> sounds like politics to me. >> so, you know, he's calling it politics there, and i mean, politics is obviously a part of this, because that's why this has to happen in the first place. the reason that this is -- that they're instituting all this security is because you have, once again, donald trump, who is currently facing criminal charges for spreading these lies in the lead-up to january 6th in which, you know, his supporters stormed the u.s. capitol and injured police officers and tried to hang the vice president sort of, you know, potentially ready for that again. that's what he's preparing for. he still hasn't conceded that last election even though as i like to point out, many of the defendants who have gone before judges and now said they regret that they were gullible enough to fall for donald trump's lies last time around, but there are still millions of people who are going to believe what he said this year and are willing to put something on the line for that. so, i think that's what we see

officials preparing for here, chris. >> ryan reilly, thank you for that. there's new evidence today that young women are now more liberal than they have been in decades. a gallup analysis found that about 4 in 10 women between the ages of 18 and 29 describe their political views as liberal. two decades ago, that number was less than 3 in 10. nbc's ali vitali is following this for us. what do we know about this leftward expansion? >> a leftward expansion among a key group of voters, especially as we head into 2024 and there's a lot of reason to be looking at what women will do and as you further break it down by race and age, it starts to create a picture of where on the man in key battleground states these women might be able to have their say and why it's so important that we're starting to see this shift towards liberalism, specifically among women 18 to 29. you put up that initial graphic there that showed 4 in 10 women now saying, between 2017 and

now, that they identify as politically liberal. think about what happened during that year span. 2017, of course, the first year of the first term of donald trump's presidency. many of these women came of political age in the trump era. that certainly has an impact, especially, then, when you start looking at an issue breakdown of what they care about. i mean, look, first, at the ways that many of these women, almost 80% of them, say that they prioritize climate sound policy over economic growth. certainly, that's something that has grown in societal conversation over the years, but you also look at the ways that they prioritize gun violence prevention. 74% of them in this gallup poll in the same years, 2017 to 2024, think gun laws should be more strict, and i think perhaps the most salient of all of these policy issues is the mindset change around abortion. you see now that roughly 6 in 10 women from 18 to 29 say that abortion should be legal under any or most circumstances.

chris, that's actually in line with where national polling has been over the course of the last several years. most of the majority of the country saying they want abortion to be safe and legal in all or most cases, and of course, that's why we're watching republicans have such a tough time on this issue, especially in this, 2024, the first national election since the fall of roe vs. wade. that's something that donald trump himself takes credit for, but it also brings us to a recent endorsement. taylor allison swift, endorsing vice president kamala harris. for swift, she said it was a moment of sort of reclaiming her political narrative. it had several swifties wondering if this wasn't for us a call to re-release the reputation album, but it gives you a sign about what swift's voters, the 18 to 29 crowd and even older millennial women, might be motivated by when they see she's in team harris' corner and generally just building awareness about what's at stake

in this election cycle. >> ali vitali, thank you for that. global outrage today following another major escalation in the middle east. what we know about the latest israeli air strike that authorities say left more than a dozen dead in gaza, including u.n. workers. n dead in gaza, in n. workers ♪ ♪ have you always had trouble losing weight and keeping it off? same. discover the power of wegovy®. ♪ ♪ with wegovy®, i lost 35 pounds. and some lost over 46 pounds. ♪ ♪ and i'm keeping the weight off. wegovy® helps you lose weight and keep it off. i'm reducing my risk. wegovy® is the only fda-approved weight-management medicine that's proven to reduce risk of major cardiovascular events in adults with known heart disease and with either obesity or overweight. wegovy® shouldn't be used with semaglutide or glp-1 medicines. don't take wegovy® if you or your family had medullary thyroid cancer, multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2,

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the ivf is defending its deadly strike on a u.n. school

complex saying hamas was using the building as a base but the united nations says among those killed were six u.n. staffers. this is not an isolated incident. more than 90% of gaza schools have now been damaged in strikes. more than half of the schools that were sheltering displaced people have been hit. that's according to a collection of aid groups led by unicef and save the children. nbc's josh lederman has the latest for us. what more do we know about this strike and the reaction to it, josh? >> so, chris, this strike hit a u.n. school that is inside a refugee camp that has been sheltering displaced palestinians and those six u.n. workers were among a total of 18 people who died. that is according to health officials in the hamas-run gaza strip. our nbc team on the ground in the gaza strip captured harrowing video of the aftermath of palestinians carrying the bodies of the dead and wounded, including what appears to be, in one case, a small body, possibly

of a child, drenched in blood. there is notebooks strewn on the ground, food and clothing. the u.n. says this is the single deadliest incident for their staff of the entire war. the secretary general is condemning this, saying it is unacceptable, calling it a violation of international law, but today, chris, the israeli government is defending this strike. they say that they were mounting a precision strike on a hamas command and control center. they say they have asked the u.n. for a list of names of those who were killed and have not gotten it. the u.n. disputes that, but the israelis are also suggesting that they have verified some of the names that are floating around in social media as confirmed hamas operatives. we can't independently confirm whether or not that is true, but just one other quick update, chris, on those hostage negotiations taking place, there has been a delegation in doha, the capital of qatar, not involving the israelis directly

but involving the qatarese and hamas. they have been trying to break through this logjam, but today, a senior hamas official telling nbc news that round of talks has ended without any progress. >> josh lederman, thank you for that. a 167-year-old shipwreck has now been found at the bottom of the atlantic ocean. a group of divers discovered a french passenger steamship that sunk way back in 1856. it has long been a mystery where the ship ended up, but we now know it was about 140 miles off the eastern coast of nantucket. the ship was traveling across the atlantic when it collided with an american sailing ship, killing 114 people. the american ship kept sailing, and the captain told "the new york times" back on november 19, 1956, "we endeavored to save ourselves by tacking, but it was too late." now, if other shipwreck hunters are hoping to see the wreck, they're going to have to find it on their own, because the divers are refusing to share its exact

location. still to come, three former police officers back in a memphis courtroom today on trial for the death of 29-year-old tyree nichols, the brand-new witness testimony we're hearing and where this trial goes next. and the first presidential election battles just hit the mail. what we're hearing from officials about how many votes are expected to be cast that way and what election officials in various states are warning could happen. that's ahead. happen that's ahead they get it. they know how it works. and most importantly, it works for them. i don't have any anxiety about money anymore. i don't have to worry about a mortgage payment every month. it allowed me to live in my home and not have to make payments. if you're 62 or older and own your home, you could access a portion of your equity to improve your lifestyle. a reverse mortgage loan can eliminate your monthly mortgage payments and put tax-free cash in your pocket. it was the best thing i've ever done. really? yes without a doubt.

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today, the memphis police lieutenant who trained the officers charged in the death of tyre nichols told the jury that not only did they not follow protocol while trying to handcuff him, but that the other officer should have intervened. nbc's marissa para is following this and also with me, former federal prosecutor and nbc legal analyst paul butler. what's the latest we're hearing out of court, marissa? >> reporter: hey, chris. so, you mentioned that we heard from this memphis police lieutenant, lieutenant bright. this is a lieutenant who has been in law enforcement for almost 20 years. lieutenant bright is also someone who has trained all of these officers at different times and really did a lot of training on defense tactics, use of force, talked about the tactics on what to do at a traffic stop, how to handcuff, even things like what part of their hands they should use in certain instances, and he says

that he warned his students that they could face prison time if they didn't follow these policies. so, after watching the footage today, lieutenant bright testified that these officers who have been charged did not follow protocol. and specifically said that protocol was not followed when this -- when nichols was being handcuffed and that the other officers should have intervened and said, to the jury, "no resistance is met with no force. little resistance is met with little force, and deadly resistance is met with deadly force." now, we understand when that footage was shown, undoubtedly, something that was so hard for these family members of nichols to watch, we actually heard from tyre nichols' mother just yesterday. take a listen. >> our hope is that they're found guilty and to show the world that my son was a good person, and he wasn't the criminal that they're trying to make him out to be.

>> reporter: so, a lot that we heard in court, chris, this is just one day of what we're expecting to be several weeks of this trial, and as you can hear from that family, they are looking for closure, but there's a lot of time between now and when they're going to find out if they get that closure. chris? >> marissa parra, thank you for that. paul, what do you imagine the likely impact of this testimony might be? >> chris, police officers are very powerful, effective witnesses in trials against other police officers. we saw this in the case of the -- involving the four officers accused in the death of george floyd. jurors are frequently sympathetic to the difficulties of policework, and sometimes, they might want to give officers a break. they might think, even if the cop made a mistake, she was just trying to do her job. but what we heard today from this expert who's been on the force almost 20 years is that when these officers first approached mr. nichols, in his car, allegedly for a traffic stop, they had their guns drawn.

that's not part of protocol. and the officers have said in other statements that mr. nichols wasn't cooperating, and he refused to turn over when they ordered him to turn over. so, the lieutenant today testified the reason for that is that he was handcuffed and at the same time that the officers were ordering mr. nichols to turn over, they were kicking him in the head, and he had already been maced in his face. >> yesterday, the jury heard from the nurse who treated mr. nichols. she calculated he was without a pulse for about 25 minutes, and again, the prosecutors say, and i'm going to quote them here, "they stood by his dying body and laughed." and laughed. the autopsy showed he died from blunt force trauma. what do prosecutors do with this testimony? >> there's all this video evidence from the officers who

were on the scene. chris, when you see those videos, it looks like a crowd scene, which makes it even more tragic that people didn't step up to help mr. nichols. they might have been able to save his life. officers will be shown live, in person to the jury, and again, that's extremely credible evidence. now, we have seen cases in which jurors have this video evidence of alleged police brutality, and they don't convict. but one of the things we're seeing since the murder of george floyd is prosecutors are getting savvy at how to win these cases. most of the recent high profile cases there have been convictions, again, this body cam footage is a key part. jurors can believe their own eyes, and, chris, there's no legal justification for the way that mr. nichols was brutalized. >> we only have a minute left. one of the other police officers, justin smith is

testifying in his own defense. we talked about how risky it is for a defendant to testify. why do you think he'd consider it? >> i think he understands that the prosecution has a very strong case, and this might be a hail mary effort. there are a couple of accused officers who have already pled guilty, but, chris, what's really interesting is that even in those cases, prosecutors are asking for time. one of the cops who pled guilty, they're asking for 40 years, and so i think this other officer may be taking the stand. it's risky, but he doesn't have a lot of great options, and his lawyer seems to believe the state has a very good case. >> thank you so much for that, paul butler. always good to talk to you. breaking news that the new york city police commissioner has resigned a week after a federal corruption investigation became public. we now know who the mayor has named as an interim replacement. nbc's tom winter is here. he has been following this story. what's going on in the biggest city in the country. >> the biggest city in the

country and the biggest police department in the world rocked last week that the revelations the police commissioner had his phone taken for the southern investigations for the southern district of new york, and the question immediately became who else could be in trouble here and what is this investigation all about? the investigation may center around concerns about night life and whether or not there was any sort of corruption from individuals having to put forward a sort of payment to get police off their backs, for those bar and nightclub owners. that's something we're looking into, whether or not federal authorities are trying to review that. what the police commissioner now former police commissioner's involvement in that is not clear. he has not been charge with any sort of a crime. two former attorneys for him, federal prosecutors themselves say he is not a target of the investigation, doesn't niecely he's not a subject of the investigation. all together for the former

police commissioner, he believed enough is enough. he was not at the 9/11 memorial ceremony. he looked at it and said i don't want to be a further distraction for my cops and officers. also, this had gone deep into the commissioner's office where we understand several members of the command staff had their phones taken as well. we'll see where this goes. just because a search is executed, doesn't mean they will be charged. as far as the police department moving forward, they will move forward with tom donlan, he was a co-case agent on the 1993 bombing of the world trade center site. his focus, and he talked about it in his statement, we need to get back to business, and i want to have integrity, the highest levels of transparency, and i want to back up the cops that i'm going to be commanding day in and day out. that's donlan's focus. he's no stranger to the nypd,

he's no stranger to new york and certainly understands the way things work in law enforcement and new york city, which in and of itself is a challenge and a master class when they expand your show for another five hours. >> a challenge, is that how we're under stating it? >> very under stating it. exactly. >> thank you very much. appreciate it. >> still ahead, a massive wildfire wreaking havoc in southern california. the help that may be on the way in the fast. a live report from the scene coming up. first, you can watch the best parts of our show anytime on you tube. go to msnbc.com/jansing. stay close, more "chris jansing reports" just after this. reports" just after this

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it is good to be back with you on this second hour of "chris jansing reports." at this hour, what's being called the new, more aggressive phase of kamala harris's campaign. her plans for a post debate blitz and cutting off one of donald trump's main paths to victory, north carolina. we're live on the trail. a dilemma for mike johnson, how do you keep donald trump happy without shutting down the government to do it? the latest drama from capitol hill. plus, the state of emergency out west, as wildfires race