best comments, the comments that people love and keep coming back to. so we sort of looked at all of the numbers. we looked at all of the data, all of the posts that people loved. and then we sort of started cureating it. we put it together and that's how we arrived here. we wanted to showcase the recipes that have become iconic for nyt cooking, the plum torte, the recipes when you see the photo and think, i would make that, those are on the list. >> that's it for us this weekend. we are back tomorrow morning at 6:00 a.m. eastern to kick off a brand new weekend of morning joe. you will not want to miss that. until then, enjoy the rest of your sunday. , enjoy the rest o your sunday. good morning, it is sunday,

september 22nd, i'm lisa menendez with michael steele and symone sanders tounsened. harris anticipates a debate round two but trump is running scared. putting the court's immunity ruling under the microscope. and breaking overnight, new escalations between israel and hezbollah as iran says the region is on the brink of war. a lot to get to this sunday morning. grab your coffee, settle en, and welcome to the weekend. just 44 days until the election and donald trump is making up new excuses to avoid a second debate. here's what he said after harris accepted a debate proposed for october 23rd. >> the problem with another debate is that it is just too late. voting has already started. now she wants to do a debate

right before the election with cnn because she is losing badly. she has done one debate, i have done two. it's too late to do another. i would love to in many ways but it is too late, the voters are out there. >> well, it was not too late for donald trump to debate in late october in 2016 and 2020 when early voting was already underway. trump's refusal may have smpg to do with his performance the last time around. remember when he spread lies about haitian people specifically in springfield, ohio? that kind of behavior opens up the door for other extremists like mark robinson in north carolina who was not at donald trump's rally yesterday by the way after more vile comments surfaced from the past, comments that robinson denies he made. joining us now is columnist max boot, his new book, reagan, his life and legend is a best

seller. and also professor of history at nyu, ruth ben-gant. >> good to have everyone. thank you for dropping by the podcast last week. let's pick up on that with symone laying the table for us. the whole idea that trump now finds it that, i would like to, i would really, really like to debate but it is just too late. people are already voting. now the subtext to that, you and i know is i'm scared as hell. this woman whipped my behind last time, i don't want no more smack down like that. i'm a chicken. that's what is really going on here. the bigger picture for me is beyond the debate. it is about the state of the party which is what you get into in your new book.

the idea of reaganism leading to trumpism. you note in the book, by 2016, reagan's party had left his genteel brand of politics for the harder edged populism of donald trump. many analysts wondered if trump represented a repudiation of reagan's legacy or a continuation of it. the truth, as with questions of reagan's intelligence was complicated, there were many obvious differences between trump and reagan, both in their policies and styles. reagan was pro immigration, pro free trade and pro nato. but the reality is we are none of those things today as republicans. how does that backdrop really inform us about what is playing out right now on the national stage? >> thank you for having me on michael. it is certainly face setting to see how the party has changed

since reagan's hay day and you see it vividly in the camp that trump is telling lies about immigrants, claiming they are eating their household pets. and reagan in his farewell address talked about one of our great strengths was the imgrpts grnts. that is the difference between then and now. it shows the direction of the republican party. but you can trace some continuities. one of the troubling things of trump is the reckless sdard that trump and vance have for the truth. just on the migrant pet eating thing, they have been told repeatedly that this is is false. there is no basis. this is made up. and they keep on repeating the lies. now reagan never did anything that blatant. but never theless, i trace examples of where reagan says stuff that was not true and it

was pointed out that it was not true but he kept on saying it. he had all sorts of phony quotes about how democrats were leading americans towards socialism and communism. some of his populism and reckless sdard for facts, some of his catering to white politics prepared us for where we are today. but there is no question that trump is way more extreme. in 1981, raegennism represented a return to the right for the party. today if the republican party were to embrace reaganism, it would be returning to the center. we don't know if that will happen. but there may be an opportunity if trump loses decisively in november. >> part of the reason we don't know if that will happen is there is a desensitization to

fascism and i think tim walz did a good job of that in his latest speech. >> we have people running for governor that are proud to refer to themselves at nazis. let's not pretend that there is a gradual difference between the folks that are running here, that they are are running together across this country. >> i love that point about not allowing there to be a compare and contrast. >> it is absolutely crucial because many of these people including jd vance are maskrading as conservatives but they do not support attempts to over throw the government. the gop has become this party that doesn't only depend on lying as max said reagan would indulge in lying, but in

corruption and threat of violence as we saw on january 6th and dehumanization tactics that reagan would not have espoused. it is important to distinguish between the former party and this nakedly autocrattic party that is comfortable using the language and reputation of nazi germany, fascism, talking about people as vermin, this is something that goes way beyond. >> it is just -- i -- -- cannot believe we are having to have this particular conversation, still having to have this particular conversation this morning. this semester, i'm a fellow at george town institute of politics. we do a bunch of events with students where we talk about politics. we were talking about who the

harris voters are, who are the trump voters, who is the undecided voter in the election. as students were asking questions and i was sitting next to someone who was a republican his entire life. we had a good conversation,, it was great. the students were speaking asking questions as if it was a regular election and we were answering as if it was a regular election. and i finally had to say i think it is wraupg to sit here and not acknowledge the fact that this is not an election that is just about policy or we have candidates that are putting forth good faith ideas and people are going to have to make a hard decision. like there is one person on the ballot who is talking about demeaning, literally talking about taking citizenship away from people who have it, who is literally talking -- the things we see on the bowels of the internet are making their way to

the debate stages because the candidate for president, the fommer president is saying them and i have to tell students it is not a normal election. it feels like i don't know how we explain adequately to the young people coming up behind us about how this is not how things are, that we -- it feels like we are doing them a disservice if we are not being very specific and clear that not only is this not normal but much of this feels unamerican. >> absolutely. i feel you see that in the fact that there are a lot of republicans, veterans of the reagan administration or the bush administration who are endorsing kamala harris, not necessarily because they agree with vice president harris on every issue but they recognize this is a question of are you going to support our democracy or not. a lot of the horse race journalism kind of pushes the central issue to the side and normalizes trump and makes it

seem like you have a republican nominee and a democrat nominee and it is a standard race which is clearly not the case. i get frustrated when i see certain people criticizing vice president harris s. and you can criticize her for certain things, saying she doesn't have specific plans, she hasn't explained how she will do x, y, z but look who she running against. >> but is it valid? can i push you on that. all i have seen is rolling out fairly detailed policies on cost and affordability that seems to be top of mind. >> coming from the foreign policy, i think i have seen more criticism on not rolling out specifics on foreign policy but it is a moot point. you have someone who threatens our democracy at home.

it is ridiculous to hold kamala harris to a standard of like she was running against mitt romney. she is running against donald trump. a lot of the republican veterans led by liz cheney recognize the existential stakes but i want to make sure voters get it as well. >> on that point, it is important to note on the exchange between alicia and max, you have this side blowing by that affirms and kind of starkly lays out the fact that this is a different kind of race to symone's point. you have national security leaders, republicans, out of the trump administration, out of former republican administrations supporting kamala harris. this election is a choice between serious leadership and vengeful impulsiveness. it is a choice between democracy

and authorarianism. harris defends democrating ideas and trump endangers them. that was from a letter of a group of bipartisan, more than 700, i said 700 national security leaders and former military leaders endorsing the vice president. this is not a normal race. to max's point, while some want to do this, well she has not laid out specifically how she is going to deal with this drop in the market or this increase in this price, the reality is you are looking past what the rest of the political establishment is telling you, that the guy she is running against should not go back to 1600 pennsylvania avenue. if you have that kind of reinforcement, what does that say to the stories or the truths that you are trying to put out there about what

authoritarianism looks like in academic. is this something we should be paying attention to, i would think? >> absolutely. and the initiatives are very interesting if you think of how rigid our two party system is. it was thought to be a force of stability. and people would say the other countries with multiparty systems are so unstable. but when one party in a two party system is an autocrattic entity and if it had its own more than policy, it would be supporting dictators. that's where their sympathies lie. if you have that, having only two parties is a liability. and republicans for harris, putting country over party because that is the right thing to do right now is extremely encouraging. this is not an election that is primarily about policy, although it is life and death in terms of

policy on immigration, on reproductive rights, it is a referendum on what kind of political system we are going to live in. will it be continuing democracy or a version of autoaccuracy. >> that is no slouch question that ruth has put in front of us. i want you to stig around because we have more authoritarian business to speak about. max boot, really appreciate you. his new book, reagan, his life and legend is available now. it's a good read. ahead on the weekend, new mexico senator ben ray lujan on the harris campaign's out reach to latino voters. and we will get an update on the escalating situation in the middle east. a live report from lebanon straight ahead. ast. a live report from lebanon straight ahead ible is unmatched connectivity

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simmons in beirut, lebanon. there are real concerns at this moment that this whole situation could spiral out of control. that would be a big problem. give us the latest on what you are covering and hearing on the ground at the moment. >> reporter: yeah, to describe what the concern is i think is a worry that there is a domino effect that leads to civil or political unrest and collapse and conflict across the region. that is a very real concern. at the moment, things are really focused on the border, the southern border in lebanon and the northern border in israel after the intelligence led strikes by israel this week, this past week, the pager explosives, the walkie-talkie explosives, and then the strike on a suburb of beirut about 3 miles away from here. they are still kind of going through the rubble. the death toll now has increased

to 45. that would make it the deadliest strike here in lebanon by israel since the 2006 war. very serious situation that hasn't been repeated since the weekend. but the intensified exchanges of fire, hezbollah fired 150 rockets into israel including further south than we have seen before, reaching the city of hypha. and the israelis say they have hit thousands of rocket installations on their border at lebanon. prime minister netanyahu with a fresh statement in english, clearly directed to the west, saying effectively, we will not stop until we have returned 60,000 israelis to their homes along the border. that is israel's primary goal

with this. hezbollah's leader saying this week that they are not going to see that unless there is a resolution to the situation in gaza. clearly, hezbollah has been seriously weakened by the strikes this past week, either pinpointed on israel or israel saying that they carried them out, it has had a real impact. it has taken out a number of hezbollah military command. it has impacted their ability to communicate. and continuing even thou, the impression is, the messaging appears to be from a country like iran that they don't want to be pulled into a wider war. israel allows it to carry on with the strikes as it tries to pursue its day to day. >> nbc's keir simmons reporting from beirut, as always, thank

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with nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory medicine directly at the source. voltaren, the joy of movement. i want you to listen to what donald trump had to say last night about getting reelected. >> women will be happy, healthy, confident, and free. you will no longer thinking about abortion because it is now where it always had to be, with the states, and with the vote of the people. >> of all of his mad libs, that may be the most nonsensical. the harris campaign say they hear the threat of they will no longer be thinking of abortion and know it is his way of trying to trick people about his 2025 plan to ban abortion nationwide. trump has bragged about his role of overturning roe v. wade. propublica is out with new

reporting on restrictions that were found to have led to the death of two women who were not able to receive care. joining us now is alexand rurea zis, and professor. >> thank you, thank you to all of the journalists at propublica. propublica has brought us some of the most groundbreaking reporting over the last couple of years, whether we are talking about the links between justice clarence thomas and his billionaire buddies and now the report of what is going on in georgia. can you tell us more about the two women whose deaths were preventable? amber therman and candy miller. they died because of georgia's abortion ban. i think that is a fair statement to make. i wonder if the reporting your

outlet had been doing really gleaned out for you that this is emblematic of a larger healthcare crisis happening in america. >> we are convinced these are not the only deaths out there. each one of these deaths is a tragedy but it is a lesson in preventability. amber therman was 28 years old. she took some abortion pills and had a rare complication is that she did not fully expel the fetal tissue. she did what she was supposed to do and sought care from a hospital. what we understand from records is that they did not provide the procedure she needed. she needed a dnc to clear what had become a grave infection. she had sepsis. over the course of 20 hours, she was allowed to have her blood pressure dip and her organs fail. what is interesting is that doctors had discussed giving her this procedure a couple of times but they did not do it. unfortunately, we have not been

able to speak to the doctors. we do know that this procedure is with few exceptions a felony crime in georgia. a maternal mortality review committee reviewed the records of her death and deemed her death preventable . hers is a lesson in preventability that suggests a chilling effect on doctors. candy miller was 41 years old, also took the abortion pill, did not expel the fetal tissue. she suffered at home. her family later said she was afraid to go to the hospital because of the consequences of the laws. her children saw her suffering in bed for days. she ultimately took a fatal combination of drugs. that reflects a chilling effect on women who are not -- who are afraid of going to jail because of these bans.

>> the stories like this, ruth, for me are powerful monuments to a potential future because you have this form of maga republicanism, the idea that we habeas corpus, we have the body. we control the body. when donald trump says as we just noted, women will be happy, healthy, confident, and free, you will no longer be thinking about abortion. to me that is dear leader speak. that is nationalism speak. how do you interpret and understand the connectiveness of what these stories are saying, you know, about a potential future in america. >> i'm so glad that you are

phrasing it that way. it sends a chill down my spine when donald trump says women won't have to think about abortion anymore because he also said something similar about voting when he talked to a group of evangelicals. he said after this election, you will not have to vote anymore as if it is a kind of burden. it is fascist talk where the leader says i will free you from all decision making. just trust in me and you will not have to worry about any problems anymore. what they are doing, this also goes back to fascism. her body becomes a tool of the state and the state has a right to decide what she does with her body. this is part of great replacement theory and demographic schemes that the woman becomes a tool to make the right kind of babies for the

nation. this whole constelation of speaking in this way coupled with the actual tragedies on the individual level goes back to the origins of authoritarianism. >> we know how what happens when donald trump gets to make decisions about women and their bodies and vice president harris knows. i want you to take a listen to what she said at madison, wisconsin, about how amber's death was preventable. >> medical experts determined that amber's death was preventable, preventable. so understand what a law like this means, what these kinds of laws mean. these kinds of laws under trump abortion bans. doctors may have to wait until the patients is at death's door before they take any action. nobody wants that. >> she called it preventable. the other word she used was

predictable. i thought it was moving when i know your reporter tried telling this story multiple times and the families were not sure they wanted to tell the story. and finally the mom decided that she needed to share the story so it doesn't happen to someone else's child. there is something rich to your point about that fact that trump says trust me to make choices for you and now we are watching and bearing witness to the aftermath of the choices he has made. >> the word predictable really comes to mind. cavitha has been writing for a couple of years about the fact that doctors have been saying, the laws were not written with medicine and science in mind . they predicted this would happen. these exceptions do not protect the life of the mother. >> and they do not surprise anyone. >> thank you both for being with

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style your life the way you want. ♪♪ tresemme, style your way. so my kids keep me humble. unfortunately, kamala harris doesn't have anything keeping her humble. >> that offensive comment came from arkansas governor sarah huckaby sanders. it was a clear swipe at kamala harris for not having biological children. here's second gentleman doug emhoff's response. >> it is appalling for someone who is in a position of leadership like a governor to say something so repulsive and so out of touch, not only on the

one mispronouncing her name, which is disrespectful, and then two as if you node to have your own biological children to be humble, and then to say that women should be humble. and you can see the pushback from within her own party because it is a repulsive thing to say. >> raise my class to doug emhoff. >> i would like to defer to the step mom at our able who has a better understanding than most of what these words mean. >> it goes to show how we value women. all of this goes back to i think this is not in a vacuum. the childless cat ladies, the conversation about abortion, and the dear leader speak from donald trump, and saying women will be fine, even though women are literally dying from georgia to texas and many places in between. this goes back to how people value women in society.

apparently, our worth is connected to whether or not we have decided to or can birth children. as a step mother, i'm offended by the entire conversation. literally, it is offensive. it is not just -- it offends women across the board, regardless of who you voted for in the last election or who you think you may want to vote for. this is a bad strategy. it goes back to the point that way back when, when america was founded, women's worth was tied specifically to who their husband was, what t their husband did, and if they could have children, to be clear. there are people in this country that would like to take us back there. >> can i also say the idea of, let's start with a woman humble, you know what keeps a woman humble, being a woman in the united states. you know what keeps a black woman humble? being a black women in the united states of america. symone is speaking to this as a step mom.

i'm speaking to this as a woman who chose to have biological children. you know how often we are told we are wrong. if we choose to have children, we are wrong. if we choose not to have children, we are wrong. if we have children and take a break from our careers, we are wrong. it is one of the defining features of being a woman in a country, whichever choice you make, it is somehow wrong and delegitimized in the eyes of someone else. >> i want to complete the circle with the fact that i'm an adopted child. my mom could not have children. my sister and i are both adopted. remember the conversation we had about 6 or 8 months ago when republicans oddly enough , republican women were going after moms who adopted children, that you weren't a real mother if you could not have children?

this whole narrative that is coming from the party of families and faith and family, is so disengenuous to the point where it is boring but it is still underlining how dangerous it is. the idea that we now want to create an america where there are a certain type of women who have more value than other women because they can birth as ruth ben gat said in the last segment, the right kind of children. what do those children look like? and can i get a clue? could the project 2025 spell out to me what those children look like? >> i don't know they're black, michael. i don't think they are brown. they might be blond haired and blue eyed. >> maybe i need to google it.

this narrative again, goes to what simone was talking about before about how this whole campaign sometimes, people try to treat it like it is normal. this is not a normal conversation in this country. this is at outlier conversation for us. i think it is important that we are reminded now about women and the choices you have to make right now. was the next choice, you may not have the ability to make for yourself. >> come on, now. as we wrap this, i will note that it is a donald trump and jd jans party would love nothing more than for the entirety of the campaign to devulg into a conversation about race and gender and not about any of the policy that donald trump has put forward, the denaturalization, taking away citizenship from people which is why it is important for the campaigns to

be focused. but this is -- they mean what they are saying. they mean what they are saying about women. they mean what they are saying about immigrants in the country. and literally, we just talked about candy miller and amber therman who died. they did not have to die but died as a result of policy, policy that donald trump supported. put that in your coffee cup and stir it up, folks. next, we are going to turn to a star studded rally in pennsylvania. two award winning actors helped governor walz make his pitch to latino voters. be sure to follow our show on social media. our handle is at the weekend msnbc. r handle is at the weekend msnbc.

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show them they're not alone. please call or go online to givetosave.org to help save lives. we have a long history to being home to puerto rican and latino families who chose to start their lives in our state. they grew our economy and every single day, their presence in our states, in our country make us stronger and better. >> that was governor tim walz in pennsylvania with just 44 days until the election. the harris walz campaign is aggressively reaching out to latino voters. they kicked off hispanic

heritage month with an aggressive radio ads and they are deploying leaders to events around the country. one of the leaders is joining us now, senator ben ray lujan from new mexico. >> how fun to have you with us. it is telling to me, puerto ricans are americans. they are not immigrants to the country. many of your constituents in new mexico, third, fourth, fifth generation hispanics. yet, i think it is important for voters across the country to understand what it is that donald trump is promising viz a viz immigration in a second term. i want you to listen to what harris had to say about the deportation plan at the dnc. >> donald trump and his extremist allies will keep trying to pull us backward. we all remember what they did to tear families apart. now they have pledged to carry

out the longest deportation, a mass deportation in american history. imagine what that would look like and what that would be. how is that going to happen? massive raids? massive detention camps? what are they talking about? >> what are they talking about? when pushed on it, donald trump doesn't know how to articulate this vision laid out in project 2025. >> good to be with you this morning. look, i'm very worried about the impact to my latino brothers and sisters all across america including citizens of america because they will be profiled. when you have people like steven miller and the ugly policies and those that president trump decided to surround himself with, there is no question that there is going to be mass deportations if donald trump is

reelected. and how he will round people up is terrifying. going to schools, going to church, coming out of church. places where we should feel the safest is where donald trump and steven miller will target them. i'm terrified of the treatment of people under the president. that is one reason why he should not be elected and why we need to elect harris and walz to be president and vice president of the united states. >> it is interesting, where we are now, and how this journey began with hispanic voters and the democratic party. i think there was a lot of conversation about that vote much like the african american vote being taken for granted, assumed by the biden team at the time. the numbers then were not very favorable to donald trump in his campaign were making inroads by

levelling up fake sneakers and menthol cigarettes and deploying all kinds of tricks and gimmicks to sort of capture the imagination. now we are looking at polling of likely hispanic voters from "the new york times", showing 55-41% edge for kamala harris' campaign. talk about that shift in the attitude. i suspect it is a little more than oh, we replaced and switched out the top of the ticket. is the messaging from the campaign resonating on the economy, on the job creation, appealing to that true, purely entrepreneurial spirit? how do you account for the

numbers? >> you know the importance of speaking out to our communities, black brothers and sisters, i saw you do it. and you were good. >> a little too good. >> a little too good. but there were conversations from the beginning, not after voting begins, not after voting begins and making sure you connect. number one, the harris campaign and the walz campaign are reaching out to communities not just on television and radio with social media ads but they are showing up in community and having conversations. cereigates are deploying throughout the united states, arizona, pennsylvania, nevada, i have seen it first-hand. number two, the shift in energy latino voters are on cohort. i'm seeing a lot of energy from younger voters especially with latino voters as well. when the harris campaign is putting real money and julia

rodriguez is doing incredible work and the way i grew up spanglish. and i know you connect with that as well. that is how i grew up talking to my parents and grandparents. it was both languages used together beautifully and it was like a poem. but connecting with voters and understanding they are not monolithic. you are speaking to them in the spanish that is theirs and each hero rising up to share their stories. and the numbers are improving and getting better. >> i think that is important, meeting people where they are as i like to say, where they are, how they are, going to where people read, watch, and listen to and talk about the issues that they care about. and this is from a survey in early august. ranking the top six issues that elected officials should address and are important to latino and hispanic voters, this is what

they said, inflation, rising cost of living, jobs and the economy, lack of affordable housing, healthcare, border immigration, crime, gun violence. oh, the latino community, just like black people they care about the economy. who would have thunk it? it seems to me that the harris campaign is doing a good job speaking to issues that they know voters are concerned about while also warning them of the dangers that donald trump is talking about. the denaturalization, deportation, coming for people that are americans. they will have a legal way to do it and if it isn't legal, it doesn't matter because the supreme court says he can do what he wants. so this is a two pronged approach. >> amen is what i can say to that. around our kitchen table, and we are a family where the line has moved on us. new mexico once being old mexico, parts of the southwest as well. whether you are in the united

states multigenerationally or you are first generation as well with your family, we all have family, parents, grandparents, kids, nieces, nephews. in the community, family is everything. when you get together for a family gathering, it is first cousins, third cousins, and those that you think are cousins but you are not sure. but it is the conversations around the kitchen table, what is happening to you, roof over your head, job opportunity. i and rafael warnock are the only two senators that went to head start. what is available to your children for child care. that matters. and the treatment of our brothers and sisters as well. that is what the bible teaches me. that's what i hear from my priest, those make a big issues. those are democratic issues. the teachings of saint francis. helping those who need a bite to

eat, helping to clothe those who need help, providing shelter to us. that's an american issue. i appreciate where the harris campaign is leading. we talked about home ownership and the bills hitting us every month and what democrats are doing to make sure we lower cost for the american people and we help make home ownership a reality and we are lowering rent as well. i appreciate what vice president harris is saying about what we are going to do and how we will do it. she has laid out a clear plan. >> senator, thank you for being here with us today. we know it is a busy week in congress. we appreciate you coming to the table. stick with us, folks. we have another jam packed hour of the weekend ahead. eugene daniels will be here. and pramila jayapal are coming up on the weekend. l are coming up on the weekend. meet the jennifers. jen x. jen y. and jen z. each planning their future through the chase mobile app.

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