doesn't have anything to do with what he is accused of but it is an important disclosure, his disclosure came during a hearing today on the alleged misuse of welfare funds in mississippi. he had been accused of stealing more than a billion bucks in speeches he never gave. >> i promised to raise funds for a volleyball facility at southern miss. i wanted to help my alma mater and benefit the community. they introduced me to the non- profit. i had no way of knowing there was anything wrong with how the state funded the project since it was publicly approved by many state agencies and multiple attorneys. including the attorney general. i lost an investment in the company i believed was developing a breakthrough concussion drug i thought would help others and i'm sure you will understand why it is too

late for me. i have recently been diagnosed with parkinson's. >> you should point out he has not been criminally charged and paid bag the money but was named in a civil lawsuit filed by the state. we will continue to cover this story as it develops but for now, we are signing off. on that note, i wish you a very good night. from all of our colleagues across the networks of nbc news, thanks for staying up late. i'll see you at the end of tomorrow. from a very special location. good evening! you can probably tell that i am not in our usual new york city studio tonight. instead, we are coming to you live from lancing's midtown brewery right here in the batten ground state of michigan. this is one of the crucial

states that will decide who the next president is and both campaigns know it. donald trump will be headed back to the detroit metro area just one week after he held a town hall in flint, michigan. meanwhile, the harris walz campaign is barn storming the state with a bus tour talking about reproductive freedom. the bus just rolled into town and we'll have more an that including an interview with an important person riding on the bus. it is an important time for the harris campaign in the state of michigan. today a new usa today poll finds kamala harris narrowly leading donald trump in this state by three points which is well within that poll's margin of error. the poll also shows that 4% of voters remain undecided with just 42 days left until election day. the battle for michigan is likely to come down to a handful of votes. and a handful of key place.

one of those in the rust belt community of saginaw county. it is somewhat famous for how much of a bellwether it is. this week, the guardian newspaper declared it the swing county. in 2016, donald trump won it by just 1%. act a thousand votes. four years later joe biden won the county by 303 votes. out of over 100,000 votes cast. sag gnaw county makes up a huge portion of michigan's eighth district. according to the cook political report, there are exactly 217 districts that are redder than michigan. and 217 districts that are bluer than michigan's eight. so there are only a handful of places in this country where every individual vote matters

as much as they do in saginaw county. i came to talk to a key constituency in a key battleground state that both campaigns are trying to court. union members. in 2020, 21% of those votes that decided the election in the state of michigan were from union households. one in five. president biden made them the focus of his campaign and the administration. the first president to walk a picket line in the state of michigan. he appointed judges and federal officials with strong track records. his covid relief bill saved pension plans. biden's chips and science act was a boon to union workers. especially in states like michigan. saginaw is an old manufacturing town where union workers are

now working on projects that are a direct result of the chipping act. and vice president kamala harris is hoping all of that focus from the biden administration is something that union workers remember on election day. she was hoping but she is not taking it for granted. last week, one of the biggest unions in the country, the teamsters international union declined to endorse either candidate in the race while noting that nearly 60% of rank and file members supported donald trump. so. to get a better sense of what is happening in this hotly, hotly contested state, among this critical group of voters, we went right down to ground zero and talked to a group of nearly 60 members of ua local 85. and union group of plumbers, hvac technicians at their union hall in saginaw county. we talked about the upcoming

election, what might make them more decided. even with so much of this election riding on their vote and two such diametrically opposed candidates to choose from, a lot of these folks remain up for grabs. there is a stark generational divide among union members but maybe not the kind you would expect. what you are about to hear is critical in understanding why this race remains so very close and why the outcome may not even be clear on election night. there is a fascinating complicated snapshot of the front line. take a look. >> all right. so, by a show of hands, how many of you are paying close attention to this election? okay. i'm going to say that's like half the audience. is anybody undecided? okay. >> i'm undecided because i just

haven't seen enough of it yet. i need to pay closer attention and do more independent research before i make my judgment. >> what have you caught of this campaign? new stories about the candidates have made it way to your information team? >> not particularly. just how people act around this time. it is a little crazy. so i try not to partake so much. >> i'm supporting kamala harris because i have seen nine years of donald trump. we have to move our country forward. i think kamala harris, generation like that, younger than myself needs to start moving this country forward. donald trump is pulling us backwards, not moving us forward. that is why i support kamala harris. there's a lot of young people in this room. i see the policies kamala harris, the infrastructure act that has put most of these people back to work.

pretty much their entire career. at a good wage they can support their family and own a home and build generational wealth. >> president biden is the most pro working president we have ever had. the only president to be on a picket line and support working families. infrastructure bill. time after time. voting for the first time. who is voting for the first time? any issues or positions? can you talk a little more about that? what about immigration have you been paying attention to? >> there are thousands an thousands of illegal immigrants coming across the border every day. and the vice president has done

minimal work to fix that. based on what i have seen. so i would like that to change. >> do you feel like donald trump will be better on that issue? >> based on what we have seen on his first four years i do believe that he will be better on that. yeah. >> do you lean toward trump right now? >> yes, ma'am. >> is there anything that vice president harris could do at this point to change your mind? >> not particularly. no. unless she changes her stance completely on fixing the border. no. >> this your first election? >> yeah it is. >> have you been paying attention to stuff? >> some things. but as of right now, it's kind of hard to know what is true and what's false. as far as both parties are concerned. >> what issue matters to you the most? >> definitely our issues concerning democracy and what was discussed before the border. >> what about immigration concerns you? >> the influx in illegal immigration is affecting a lot more than just the people.

but our economy. we are losing jobs for the people who live here. people are running out of work and in return, it is making life as a whole for the country harder. >> do you feel like one candidate or the other is better on that issue? >> i don't know what to believe. from what i'm seeing from multiple news outlets and what comes across my news feed. i'm not super opinionuated either way. >> how do you think you will ultimately decide? one gentleman said i will go with my heart. >> the more i see and the more truth that comes out. >> is that going to matter to you? >> it matters to me. >> it affects my pocketbook and

my family? >> if the union doesn't endorse a candidate, and you are left, first of all, do you think you are going to vote? >> i am definitely going to vote? >> how are you going to make that decision? >> literally, a game time call. >> i think so. >> is it going to matter? >> it will matter. >> you guys talk about it? >> yeah. >> oh yeah. >> we will go back. we wanted to make our economy. service economy. manufacturing economy. people around the country.

chips acts going out here. biden's chip act. they don't even know it yet. do your research. pull your head out of your ass. >> reporter: you saw that a number of veteran workers there. who were strong supporters who saw there were a large number of union workers, particularly younger union workers who were undecided. and throughout our discussion, many of those undecided voters thought immigration and the southern border as a major concern. they were particularly motivated by concerns about the economy. including inflation and the rising cost of housing. >> housing is an issue. >> i just recently purchased a home. so yes i do think it is too high.

just the cost of a livable ready move in home now is absurd in my opinion. to where before i felt like you could buy a house for a reasonable price. and not have to have a ton of work put into it. >> i just recently purchased a house as well. and this house has gone up $50,000 in the past five years. so i mean, just looking at the past five years. >> paying bills. a factor in this election. >> if you can't afford to buy a house and have your family food, nothing else matters. >> so as much as the undecided voters are unsure about the candidates, however undefined their decision making process appears to be. you can see what issues are

foremost in their minds in this critical swing county. >> issues that have received a ton of media attention in this state. these are not the kinds of things these undecided voters were focused on. >> do you have any idea about what's happening in federal court relating to donald trump. january 6th. >> so like, you have been talking about your level of

interest. >> february 6th. i am not familiar with the charges being brought against him. i'm not following that charge. there's multimillion court cases. >> that doesn't sound like it will be a factor. when i say january 6th, what do you think? >> i just remember seeing it on the news. don't really know what it was about. >> how did it make you feel when you saw it? >> i don't know. i don't know how i feel about it. people showed their emotion i guess. probably in the wrong way. but it happens. >> who here has been following the decisions from the supreme court? raise your hand? i'm seeing only a handful. who here knows what the dobbs decision is? one person. okay. that's super interesting.

what about abortion? is that an issue that you think? >> i think it's a woman's right. nobody should be able to dictate that at all. >> and what do you think is trump's position on abortion? >> i think he is anti-isn't he? >> yeah. >> he wants to control that? >> yeah. well, he wants. >> i don't think there is any business even talking about it. >> what about abortion? reproductive choice. is that something you guys think about? is it something that concerns you? >> they meet in the middle. >> what do you mean by that? >> i think they go one too much one way and too much the other way. >> you think democrats are too open ended on i abortion and republicans are too restrictive in. >> yep. >> what about you? something you think about? >> same as her. >> something you think about? >> i don't have to. >> you don't have to? >> i don't really have an opinion on it. i haven't looked into it or even thought about it really.

>> stories certainly matter to a considerable number of americans in general. but those stories are not necessarily the deciding factor for these elusive undecided voters. especially undecided voters who don't get their news from traditional media and who may not even be particularly interested in current events. in general. for those voters, what matters the most is what may ultimately determine their vote. the conversations that happen within their community. in this case, that means fellow members of their union, of local 85 and the members who made up their mind and who understand the stakes of the 2024 election. >> you asked what are the issues that are important. the one thing that i said was honesty. and i think it really kind of ties together everything that people have been talking about here. you know?

believe the person you are listening to. i appreciate. who are you going to trust? look at the person. this is what i think of really ultimately needs to boy down for people undecided. if somebody has lied to you repeatedly, we were just, they were just mentioning covid. that was lie after lie after lie if you remember watching those tv press things every day when we were stuck at home by ourselves. continually. how many times does someone need to lie to you. kamala harris took an oath as a

public servant. as a prosecutor, as a senator, who in my opinion has not lied to anybody. >> vice president harris. how democracy should work, the freedom for women to choose. the freedom for everyone here to be able to work where they want. to do what they want. >> i'm not going to lose my democracy over the price of a gallon of gas for the price of a loaf of bread. democracy is too fragile. anybody voting, if you are voting for a republican, you are supporting treason and traitors, that's all there is to it. >> we have much more ahead from the midtown brewery right here in the heart of downtown lancing. john faverau and mallory mcmoore help me unpack what is happening and what it all means

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coverage from the front lines of the 2024 battlegrounds. today we are coming to you live from the crucial swing state of michigan where yesterday, we spoke with union workers. a key voting block in this state. about what they care about. >> so, again, my name is connor. february 6th. >> january 6th. >> so i remember that day. i know he was the standing president. i am not familiar with the charges that are being brought against him for that.

>> and that doesn't sound like that will be a factor in deciding who to vote for. >> no. >> we thank you. odds are, you know quite a lot about january 6th. this election is likely to come down to just a few thousand voters for whom keeping up with political news is not a priority. joining me now is mallory, democratic majority whip of the michigan. and john faverau.

i came away with you with these union workers thinking man, what a challenge it is for either campaign. trying to get to the union voters. here you have a group of key undecided. they are not following the new ins the way a lot of voters follow the news. they are getting their information from outside traditional media. and they might determine the election. i wonder what you can tell me from your firsthand understanding in this electorate? the challenge the harris team has in getting to these people and convincing them to go for kamala harris. >> i think what you heard is people are working hard. they are concerned about the economy. they are concerned about buying a home and keeping a good union job. and to me, that points to the importance of something i have been advocating for, for the past couple of years is state legislatures if not just the

bench, the foundation. because we are the ones going door to door. we had candidates in the community. we will be out knocking on thousands of doors for people who may not watch the news. as frequently as you and i do. talking about the fact michigan democrats became the first state in 60 years who repealed right to work. you saw president biden on the line with so many of us on the line during the picket to say this is a team and we support kamala harris and here's why. >> john, when you talk about political strategy, when there is a obviously a lot of money dumped into the ad wars. these conversations with undecided union voters. the trusted voices that these guys listen to. and i wonder.

what are the critical delivery systems? that one candidate in particular is the one that they should be voting for? >> first of all, i'm so glad that you are doing this. and that you talk to folks. and i hope that everyone watching will decide the election. to decide the election. and most people, most voters. fantastic organization. the biden campaign did as well in the state in the communities. at the end the, it will come down to door to door. grass roots. organizing. you will be more likely to trust someone you know who is a

colleague. who is going to fight for them when it comes to the economy? and so, kamala harris is giving a speech in pittsburgh tomorrow. she will lay out her economic vision. wand i would expect her to contrast that division with donald trump. forget what they have done in the past. who will fight for me? what is each candidate going to do for me? and the harris campaign will be making that case from every single person in that organization including the thousands of volunteers they have. >> to that end, who will fight for me. who will do the right thing for me? this is a group of union workers who are beneficiaries of the chips and science act. they are working on projects part of the portfolio of legislation passed under joe biden and kamala harris and

there seems to be a real disconnect in terms of how they feel about their job prospects and the economy. and what joe biden has done specifically for them. literally for them in the state of michigan in their own livelihoods. i would imagine that you know, the people in the union who can explain the reality of what this democratic administration has done for these particular union workers will be the key to harris winning just winning. justin palmerville, this is what he said at the end of this meeting. i want everybody to hear this. because i think this is actually how you win the vote. let's take a listen. >> thank you for spotlighting saginaw county. it's been a great deal. one thing i did want to address so this room knows the science and chips act, they are not kidding. we have hemlock semiconductor in this county.

anybody working on project phoenix is making money directly out of the biden administration bill sign. that is something we should have done a better job educating on. if you are working in any of the fab shopping sending stuff out. phoenix, hsc. it is science and chips act money. that is kamala harris an joe biden. >> that's the ball game. that's it. >> it is how do you connect. when we hear the chips and science act. those of us who think about policy all the time, we know what that is. almost the academic sense. for the average person, what does it mean for me? you have to draw that connection. the other reality is a lot of the net gains from this legislation will be delayed. it takes time for the money to come into the state. it takes time for us to appropriate those dollars before the jobs actually start. before the projects actually

start. so that is our job. that is going to be the job of the harris walz campaign to really connect those dots in very plain language. >> in 42 days. >> no big deal. no big deal. >> you have union workers here. they are not in a southern border state. their jobs are relatively secure. they have money, federal money flowing in to keep them in gainful livelihood. of course inflation and housing are concerned. the way immigration animated a lot of the young men in the audience, i found to be stunning. i think we have time to play another clip of landon who is you know, was one of the many voices in the audience talking about migrants flowing over the border. let's take a look at that clip again. >> what made its way across your radar? any stories or issues or

positions? >> mostly just immigration. >> would you talk about that? >> what about immigration have you been paying attention to? >> there are thousands and thousands of illegal immigrants coming across the border every day. and the vice president has done minimal work to fix that. based on what i have seen so i would like that to change. >> do you feel like donald trump will be better? >> based on what we saw the first four years i believe he will be better on that. >> are you leaning toward trump now? >> yes, ma'am. >> john, you know, this seems to exist. the emotional pull of trump's argument on immigration for these young white men seems to be independent of economics. it feels like it is something deeper and i think the work of a, potentially the first female woman of color as president, it is even harder for her to

articulate the reassurance i think young male white workers need about a changing american demographic. how do you look at the pull that trump's immigration rhetoric has on a group of people not on the front lines of their jobs being replaced by migrants? >> yeah. trump and the entire republican party and the right wing media have concocted a story that we are being invaded by immigrants take people ease jobs. that information filters down. an it becomes a powerful narrative. kamala harris is talking about how she is attorney general of a state where she prosecuted trans national gangs and said there would be border legislation as law right now that would have secured the southern border if donald trump hadn't told his republican allies in congress to kill it. and you know, she said in the debate, he doesn't want to solve the problem, he wants to run on the issue. talking about that and also

talking about the fact last time he was president, his own being legislationive accomplishment was a tax cut for the rich. now he wants a trump tax that will cost most families $4,000 a year on goods you buy. she wants to make a home more affordable an give midding class tax cuts. she will tell that story and point out the game what trump is trying to do. he doesn't really care about the issue of immigration. he is just using it for politics. what she wants to do is continue to fight for middle class families like the union workers you talked to. >> mallory i know you have thoughts ton this. >> there was recent polling in michigan that shows almost 75% of michiganers want a path to citizenship. it is a very small number of people in michigan who support trump's idea of mass deportation. this is an area where i think vice president harris should

lean into her prosecutor credentials. talk about prosecuting trans national games and push back on the fear mongering and the lies that jd vance and donald trump are painting all immigrants. even legal immigrants. look what's happening in springfield as if it is this mass horrible problem that makes these workers feel like their job is at risk when it is not. >> it is a powerful intoxicant, xenophobia. and we hope the antidote gets uncorked in the next few days. it is so great to have both of you guys here. thank you for your time tonight. we have more special coverage from the battleground of michigan where voting kicks off this week. the secretary of state joins me right here next. stay with us. right here next. stay with us.

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welcome back to our special coverage from lancing, michigan. voting is set to begin in 48 hours. ballots cast, meaningful number of voters who remain undecided. >> comes a little closer i think. the more i see and the more truth ends upcoming out.

i think i will make a more educated. >> absentee ballots are going out on thursday. >> this thursday! this thursday! absentee ballots go out across michigan to register voters who requested them. it is one of several election reforms voters overwhelmingly approved in an amendment vote in 2022. one which increases access to the polls. fancy that. that includes for the first time ever in michigan, beginning on october 26th, joining me now is jocelyn benson. a lot of people think that is voter disenfranchise. the opposite has happened.

can you talk a little bit. lawmakers have been supportive. enact early voting in our state. battlegroundstandard access to the vote. voters led the way. our job is to make their will real. >> i asked if just to play devils advocate, out of cynicism because i have seen what donald trump has done when we have infranchised voters. are you at all worried that it is easier to vote, something that comes under fire particularly from donald trump if he loses the election? 2024? >> it shouldn't. because making it easier to

vote for all eligible citizens should be the priority of every leader in this country. republican, independent, or democrat. we will focus on making sure that we have more voting turnout. regardless of who it benefits or who is participating. the end of the day, that is what makes democracy more vibrant. the thing about michigan's stories, we have been under intense scrutiny. every action i take has been intensely scrutinized. at the same time with all the challenges, our democracy has gotten stronger. more people are voting. young people are voting. we lead the nation in youth vote. really proud even in the challenging time, michigan and michigan voters have responded squarely on the side of democracy and supporting leaders who do advance their will. >> donald trump is making a late breaking plea to his voters to vote early while saying it is stupid that people get to vote 45 days before an election. just paraphrasing what he said in pennsylvania last night.

just from your understanding about the movement between the parties, do you believe as we prepare ourselves for election week and not election night, do you still think most of the early ballot is going to come from democrats or do you get a sense that it will be more bipartisan this year? >> we are not seeing any imbalance. voting just begins thursday. we are seeing democrats, republicans, requesting their ballots and a lot still haven't done so. a lot may be waiting to vote in the early voting period. we are not seeing any friends yet. too early to see any trends unlike 2020 where we saw a bit of an imbalance early on. the major candidate for the republican party, the sitting president at the time trying to tell people not to vote early though it ended up being ultimately something a lot of democrats took advantage of and voted in significant numbers. >> right. and he has the kind of

convoluted position now that it is very stupid. potentially unreliable. but you should still do it. >> i would never call any policy to voters of michigan have enacted as stupid. i'm a mom so i try to tell my son not to use that word. this is the policy the voters of michigan wanted. they enacted. let's respect that. that has been my focus. bipartisan administrators. there is obviously january 6th. there is also december 17th. when the state electors meet their numbers. all the secretaries of state, really ensuring the integrity of the process after election. >> indeed. in 2020, once we got to the high turnout secure election. it was made known we would be

able to do our jobs with our post election audits. any things we would do and things would proceed peacefully and the exact opposite occurred and so because of that, we are ready for anything. we have a post election plan to protect election workers, to protect the votes of the citizens of michigan. and ensure that this ongoing attack of our citizens is diminished because the facts and truth and law will always be on the side of the will of the people and democracy. >> secretary of state here in michigan. jocelyn general benson. good luck. thanks for spending a little time with me. >> thanks for coming to michigan. >> of course, we'll be back. when we come back, the harris walz bus rolled through lancing. talking about reproductive

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she worked her way up. i had a summer job at mcdonald's. he was born there. i'm very rich. she fights for you. when our middle class is strong, america is strong. he doesn't. you're rich as hell. we're gonna give you a tax cut. she has a reason for running. we are helping dig families out of debt by telling billionaires to pay their fair share. and so does he. they want to put me in jail. kamala harris. for you.

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would support ending the senate filibuster for specific legislation. and in particular, to protect abortion rights nationally. as part of harris' campaign focus on reproductive freedom, which now includes a bus tour making at least 50 stops and hitting all seven battleground states. today i got the chance to tag along right here in michigan and i sat down with one of the vip passengers. you may remember ms. duvall as a standout speaker after she shared her harrowing personal story about how she was raped an impregnated by her stepfather at age 12. i spoke to her about what she has seen and felt on the road and the challenge of reaching voters along the way. >> where have you seen the same level of energy and concern from young men as you have from young women as you have gone around the country? >> i have seen a lot of young men get involved when they have

been affected. when they know their mother has a story. when they know their neighbor, their girlfriend. someone who pulls at their heart strings. that is when they get involved and that's when it is too late. reproductive freedom is not going to be everybody's top. they need to know they have to be safe. because we know that we have seen what he has done. we can take his record and know reproductive freedom. >> it is not tom bailey not. craig monger of the detroit news joins me here coming right up next. g right up next. hey, scott. this stuff's perfect for fall, right? yep! it feeds your lawn now to strengthen roots

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we are back live in michigan. despite the tight poll numbers in the state, the voters i spoke to. >> who here thinks kamala harris will win the election? who here thinks donald trump will win the election? no one? interesting.. joining me now is craig, a state politics reporter for the detroit news and an indispensable figurement i was surprised by the number of voters. some independent, undecided and going for trump. how many of them believe kamala

harris will win? >> it speaks to the success the democrats have had in this state for the last three election cycles. they have won over and over again since 2016 when trump pulled a surprise and barely won against hillary clinton. so i think democrats in the state believe if it is a high turnout election, both sides have an incentive to go out. they are going to win. because they believe that there are more democrats in this state than there are republicans. that will be tested this year. that might not be set in stone. that is what the trump campaign is angling to upset. >> how much is the uncommitted vote going to matter in this election? it's a tight race and uncommitted is the movement saying it won't endorse harris but urging supporters not to vote for trump or a third party candidate. what does that mean and how do you see that? >> it means they are kicking it to the individual voters. and it will be a battle to try to convince all of these voters and i don't think uncommitted in itself is going to turn this election. but i think trump, the trump

campaign's angle here is to try to get gains with a whole bunch of different groups. they are trying to get gains. trying to turn out some republican leaning voters that haven't voted before. 100,000 people voted uncommited in the primary, the margin of victory for joe biden was 154,000 in 2020. if trump can get some gains he might have a path to breaking this precedent that says in high turnout elections democrats usually win. >> is rfk going to foul things up? >> it is so fascinating. i was talking to the secretary about this. having him on the ballot might hurt kamala harris. and they are fighting to get him taken off the ballot. a fascinating thing we will see