josh mankiewicz (voiceover): the idea behind this night at the end of october is that all that fear, danger, and horror are supposed to be imaginary, manufactured for the child living in every one of us. children: trick or treat! josh mankiewicz (voiceover): but of course, there is genuine evil out there, no matter what the calendar says. and sadly, sometimes the horror of halloween is the real thing. that's all for this edition of "dateline." i'm andrea canning. thank you for watching. ♪♪ this sunday, deadlocked.

with just three weeks to election day, our new nbc news poll shows vice president kamala harris and former president donald trump tied in a neck-and- neck race. >> the real measure of the strength of a leader is based on who you lift up. >> i think she's dumber than hell. >> voters revealing concerns harris would continue on the same path as president biden as positive perceptions of trump's presidency grow. >> would you have done something differently than president biden during the past four years? >> there is not a thing that comes to mind. >> steve kornacki will break down the latest results. plus, storm surge. >> former president trump has led the onslaught of lies. >> a rising sea of disinformation threatens relief efforts in the aftermath of two deadly hurricanes. >> she did nothing as people struggled and drowned, and day after day, no one came. >> the idea of intentionally trying to deceive people in their most desperate and vulnerable moments. and my question is when did that become okay? >> how will it impact voting in these storm-battered states?

my guests this morning, speaker of the house mike johnson and former republican congresswoman liz cheney. joining me for insight and analysis are nbc news white house correspondent monica alba, leann caldwell of "the washington post," democratic pollster cornell belcher, and lahnee chen, a fellow at the hoover institution. welcome to sunday. it's "meet the press." ♪♪ >> announcer: from nbc news in washington, the longest running show in television history, this is "meet the press" with kristen welker. good sunday morning. we begin with our brand-new nbc news poll and the headline, with just over three weeks until election day, former president trump and vice president harris are now tied among registered voters, 48-48%. the five-point lead harris held after the presidential debate a month ago is now gone. steve kornacki will take us inside the numbers, including

the enormous gender gap just moments from now. donald trump's approval rating, now 48%, is higher than his job rating was at any point during his presidency. by 43% to 41%, more voters are concerned that harris will continue president biden's approach than are concerned that former president trump will continue his first term approach. on the trail vice president harris has struggled to answer how she would be different than her current boss. >> what do you think would be the biggest specific difference between your presidency and a bidency -- a biden presidency. >> well, we're obviously two different people, and we have a lot of shared life experiences, for example, the way we feel about our family and our parents and so on, but we're also different people, and i will bring those sensibilities to how i lead. >> would you have done something differently than president biden

during the past four years? >> there is not a thing that comes to mind in terms of -- and i've been a part of -- of most of the decisions that have had impact. >> now, nbc news has learned that the vice president's steam has been discussing ways she could put more distance between herself and president biden in the final weeks of the race. harris is leaning into one key difference, her age, 59. on saturday she released a letter from her white house doctor, quote, vice president harris remains in excellent health. she possesses the physical and mental resiliency required to successfully execute the duties of the presidency. >> today i released my medical records, as has, i believe, every candidate for president of the united states except donald trump in this election cycle, and it's just a further example of his lack of transparency. >> former president trump's campaign recirculated a letter from his former white house

physician, now republican congressman ronny jackson, as well as a letter from a personal physician from last fall, but the 78-year-old former president has not released his medical records though he pledged in august to do so. meanwhile, former presidents bill clinton and barack obama are hitting the trail for harris. former president obama urgently telling black men they cannot sit out this election with a woman at the top of the ticket. >> you're thinking about sitting out or even supporting somebody who has a history of denigrating you because you think that is a sign of strength because that's what being a man is? putting women down? that's not acceptable. >> at a rally in coachella, california, last night, part of a tour aimed at showing mr.

trump can draw a crowd in blue states, the former president ramped up his dark rhetoric and false claims. >> she supported illegal criminal from the dungeons of a third world. she cannot lead america. kamala harris, her reign of terror ends the day i take office. she's finished. >> illegal crossings at the border are at their lowest levels in nearly four years after the biden administration's new restrictions on asylum. and for more on our brand-new nbc news poll, i am joined now by national political correspondent steve kornacki to take us through all of the numbers. steve, boy, this is a big one. >> kristen, numbers say it. it is a tie game weeks before the election and it's that shift. the last poll taken in the wake of that september debate. harris had opened up that advantage over trump, gone in our new poll. what goes into that? what's behind that?

i think this one is revealing. this is the basic perception voters have of these candidates? is it positive? is it negative? these are not great numbers for either one. trump, 43% positive, 51% negative, eight points underwater, you might say. >> look at harris, exact same positive score almost in the exact same place. and this is it. the last time we polled that question after the debate, harris had made up ground in this area. look, she had a positive rating, 48 to 45 so that advantage has all in the last few weeks washed away for her. then there are some issues and characteristics here. these are advantages in red that you see for trump now versus september on the immigration and the border. we asked voters who would be better on this. in september trump had a big advantage, and it's gotten bigger. on the economy, he now hits double digits. on the question of who leads in

change, harris had the advantage in september and still does, but lower. >> so significant because voters say change is a critical issue for them and not the direction you want to be going there, steve. >> she is the vp in an unpopular administration. look, we asked joe biden's policies as president, do you think they're helping or hurting your family? look at that. almost 2-1 say hurting more than helping. his job approval rating is in the low 40s. and here's the twist. when trump was president, were his policies helping or hurting. 44% say helping, 45% say hurt. retrospectively, he's getting numbers he wasn't getting when he was president. the challenge harris faces and these are the incumbent vice presidents running while their boss was still in office. and just look. 88, george bush sr., his boss had nearly a 60% approval

rating, and gore didn't win, but won the popular vote, and here's harris. look how different the at mos fear is. biden's approval rating is 43 points. she's running in a totally different atmosphere than previous incumbents vice presidents did. then we can talk about issues. this is an interesting way. typically in the past we've given folks a list of issues, and here we asked the question, is this issue so singularly important that it's the entire basis of your vote for president and you can see abortion comes in number one there. >> that's so significant, this is the first presidential election after roe v. wade was overturned and significant abortions at the top and we're looking at the cost of living as the energizing factor. >> this issue is her biggest advantage over donald trump, and you can see, as you say, potentially a motivating factor. and one more note here. you've just got to show this. the gender gap. we always talk about gender gaps in presidential races. trump 16 among men, harris 16 among women and if that happens

on election day, that's one for the history books. we've never seen it that high. >> a historic jep der gap for sure. steve kornacki, always great stuff. thank you. joining me now is the speaker of the house, republican congressman mike johnson of louisiana. mr. speaker, welcome back to "meet the press." >> hi, kristen. great to be with you. >> it's great to have you. i want to start off by talking about the hurricane response. obviously, it has up ended life in part of the southeast. fema says it does have enough funding for now. a different story for the small business administration, which provides low-interest loans to renters, homeowners, and beyond. sba is saying it could run out

of funds within mere days, mr. speaker. you've said it's premature to call congress back to get more funding, but has the possibility of leaving small business owners in a lurch change your calculation? >> congress will not leave small business owners wanting. i am a small business owner, and i'm from a hurricane-prone state in louisiana. we're kind of experts in this disaster recovery. the sba loan as you indicate side a small interest loan that helps people bridge the gap and helps people get back on their feet. it is a supplement to private insurance and other disaster relief funding, and so by definition, a necessity, it takes a few weeks to calculate it. congress is scheduled to come back right after the election. we're 23 days out from the election and that will coincide for most of these applications to even begin and many of them to be processed. now, fema has received thousands of applications already, and they're going through the laborious process of affirming it and confirming it, but when the time is needed, we will cover the need of small businesses.

congress is all onboard. remember, one day before helene made landfall we appropriated $20 billion additional to fema to address urgent needs and it is very important to note, as of yesterday, roughly 2% of those fund his been distributed. we need the biden/harris administration to get about the business of distributing the funds that congress has set aside. that is a really important thing. people are hurting, and i've been on the ground in the most affected disaster areas, florida, north carolina, they need the help. >> just to be very clear. are you ruling out calling congress back to get more funding even for the sba? >> no, congress will do whatever is necessary to cover the needs of the people. but see, what happens after a big storm like this, the magnitude of these storms was enormous, almost on the scale of katrina, which we're still recovering from in louisiana 20 years later.

i know this process well, but states have to calculate and assess the need and submit that to congress, but that takes time especially when you have a storm this broad and wide affecting so many people. as soon as those numbers are submitted to congress it will act, and it will be bipartisan and will cover the needs. >> mr. speaker, let's move on to another new issue, abortion. you just saw in our new poll there is a historic gender gap, the top motivating factor is abortion and donald trump has proudly says he takes credit for overturning roe v. wade. he also says he would veto a national abortion ban. let me put this to you. if you are speaker of the house, do you pledge not to hold a vote on any legislation that would ban abortion? >> kristen, listen. this is really important what you just did there. we watched four minutes, steve kornacki showing the numbers that donald trump is surging ahead that kamala harris is dropping in the polls. the only bright spot for her was abortion, and that's what steve just said. that's good news. when abortion is your only good news in an election we need to be talking about what people really care about. i've been traveling around the

country and campaign events in over 224 cities and 40 states, and i'll do many more this month, and i'm on the road again this morning. and anywhere i go, kristen, and i go to blue states and swing states, the number one concern on everybody's mind is the cost of living. and right after that is the wide-open border that they're enabled and put the catastrophe. and the word about the weakness of the world stage that biden and harris have projected which have gotten us into a dangerous situation since world war ii. that's why trump is surging in the polls and that's why we'll win this election. >> just to the substance of the question, there are big issues and on this big issue, do you pledge if you're speaker of the house again not to bring any legislation up to a vote that would ban abortion at the federal level? >> we're nowhere in a universe

where that would be possible right now. the next commander in chie donald j. trump, has said this is an issue in the states right now. that is exactly what the situation is. >> he said he would veto -- >> you want me to answer the question? let me answer the question, okay? before you can have political consensus on a divisive issue you have to have cultural consensus. we don't have that right now. there is a lot of difference of opinion on the states, and we have to work through that. they're pro-life who believe life is sacred and everyone has the chance to be born and live. i'm the product of a teen pregnancy, myself. this is my life story. i believe that's an important issue. but i have to build a culture of life and consensus. we are nowhere near that in this country, and we know, and there's a lot of work to do. donald trump said this is the state's issue. he's going to be the commander in chief, that is the end of the story. >> you co-sponsored the life at conception act, it would have

effectively banned abortion at the federal level. a lot of people want to know where you stand on this because donald trump said he would veto a national abortion ban. so can you say you wouldn't move to try to ban abortion at the national level? i understand there is not a consensus, but would you move to ban abortion at a national level? >> couldn't do that even if i wanted to, kristen. i have 434 colleagues. i'm a bible-believing christian and a believer in the sanctity of life. we couldn't even get -- it would be a very small vote right now even among republicans. we have a lot of work to do. the pro-life groups are out there doing what they do, and we care about women at all stages of pregnancy and all stages of life. that's what we are. we're for families, we're for ivf, everything that allows for that, and we need to take care of these ladies who are in difficult situations with their pregnancies. that's what the states are doing very effectively. crisis centers and pregnancy

centers around the world, there is a lot of work being done. and for us to have dialogue about this issue, there is not a bill coming to congress because we are nowhere near -- >> some states are doing this effectively and some women have said their lives are at risk because of these states. let me move on. with three weeks from election day, former president trump continues to make false claims. and let me read a couple of them. gang members have overrun an apartment complex, haitian migrants in ohio are eating cats and dogs, and fema money is being used to house migrants. mr. speaker, all of those claims have been debunked -- >> no, they haven't. no, they haven't. >> yes, they have. if former president trump is so confident in his policies, why not make the argument along policy lines, why say things that have been debunked by local officials?

>> president trump is making all sorts of arguments constantly. he works 24 hours a day. i saw kamala harris issued her medical records, congratulations. donald trump's health is on display for the country every hour of every day. he has more stamina and mental acumen and strength than any political figure probably in the history of the country that i can remember. he goes nonstop. what he's talking about are the things that american people care about. this fema dollars going to resettle migrants is a fact. it's not the disaster relief fund, but another fund fema used to resettle all of the illegal aliens that they let across the open border. kamala harris, the border czar, was the engineer of that. >> i do have to -- fema funds were not redirected to house migrants. that has been debunked. that's a separate fund. fema has said as much. >> that's right, that's right, but -- hold on. >> why not make the argument on the substance of the policies, mr. speaker?

>> i'm trying to do that. let me do that. >> the federal emergency management agency, fema, as its name implies, should be working on emergency management and -- they're putting them on taxpayer benefits and that has enraged the country and why kamala harris' numbers are dropping in the polls and you just said in her own words, you saw the tape there, there is no difference between her and joe biden. the biden policies and bidenomics and the things they championed are destroying the country, and everybody knows that. republicans will win the senate and the house. >> fema funds were redirected on donald trump's watch to deal with the migrant issue. let me ask you -- >> no, ma'am. wait. hold on. wait a minute. facts are important. that is a new program that started in 2020 under joe biden. that funding wasn't necessary under trump's administration because we secured the border. we didn't invite illegal aliens and dangerous people into the country. that's a biden/harris policy, and everybody knows that. >> mr. speaker, let me -- it did happen under donald trump's watch. >> no, kristen. he did not. that is a brand-new account.

>> should donald trump release his medical records, mr. speaker? >> he has. he issued the records of his physicians. kamala harris issued her medical records as a diversion because she's desperate because she's sinking in the polls. donald trump's health is on display. everyone in america can see it. the man works nonstop. he never quits. he probably sleeps four hours a night. he doesn't require as much sleep as the ash average /* average person, and he's at unusual figure. this is what we need. we are in a dangerous moment since world war ii, you have to have strength and a steady hand and a commander in chief that our allies respect and our enemies here. they do fear donald trump. >> just to be clear. he hasn't released his medical records and he released two letters. should he release -- >> it's unnecessary. >> it's unnecessary. you can see that he didn't release his medical records and you don't want to know things like his cholesterol level and if he's dealing with an issue that we may not know about if

he'll be commander in chief? but he also said he would release cognitive tests. should he release that? >> the american people -- kristen, the american people don't care about the cholesterol level of donald trump. they care about the cost of living and the fact they cannot pay for groceries because kamala harris and joe biden's policies have put them in that situation. the medical records are irrelevant. let's talk about the things that american people care about. that's why donald trump is surging in the polls because he's doing that on stages, in interviews nonstop around the clock, and kamala harris has done nothing. every time she talks, her numbers go down because she's uniquely unqualified to be commander in chief. >> mr. speaker, let me ask you. i'll be speaking with congresswoman liz cheney just moments from now. she's been very outspoken and an opponent of donald trump as well as house republicans. she's expressed concerns that if

trump doesn't win, that you would not certify the election results. so here now can you say if donald trump does not win do you commit to certifying the election results? >> kristen, i'm a constitutional attorney and dedicated my life and demonstrated every day that we will uphold the constitution. we will do our job in congress, a free and fair and legal election will be certified and that is the hope and prayer. of course, i'm going to follow the job. that's my job and duty, and i will fulfill my oath. >> regardless of who wins, you will certify the results? >> of course, yes. if the election is free, fair and legal -- and we pray and hope that it is. there's a lot of work being done to make sure that is true. i think that this one will be so large, there will be no question. i think donald j. trump is your next president and that can't happy soon enough. >> if it is free and fair, does that not undermine people's confidence in the election? >> no, it shouldn't because what i'm saying there is what the constitution provides, what the supreme court has affirmed time after time, what history has affirmed. listen, democrats have objected

to slates of electors in every single election this century when a republican president has won. every single time. >> and yet they all conceded. and yet they've conceded. >> yes. and that's the point. >> former president trump has yet to concede to 2020. that the process works, and we have the peaceful transfer of power. we will in 2020, and we will in 2024, and everyone can sigh and take a deep breath that our system will work. we have the greatest system in the history of the world because we live in the greatest country in the world, but that last part is in jeopardy right now. this is a decisive election and everybody knows it and that's why we'll be given a chance to run this country again and we'll turn it around and i can't wait. >> speaker mike johnson. thank you for your time this morning. we really appreciate it. >> you got it. thank you. when we come back, she's one of the most high-profile republicans supporting kamala harris. former republican congresswoman liz cheney joins me next.

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welcome back. joining me now is former republican congresswoman liz welcome back. joining me now is former republican congresswoman liz cheney, author of "oath and honor: a memoir and a woman." thank you for coming back to "meet the press." >> thank you for having me here. >> it's great to see you. let's start where i left off with house speaker mike johnson, and i'll put it this way. president biden said he does not know if there will be a peaceful transfer of power in 2025. you just heard how the house speaker answered my question about how he would certify the election results. do you have faith that the election will be free and fair and there will be a peaceful transfer of power? >> i do not have faith that mike johnson will fulfill his constitutional obligations.

and if you see what he did in 2020, he knew, and he knew with specificity the claims that donald trump was making and that he was repeating. he knew those to be false. we had very clear and specific conversations about that. he knew that courts had specifically found that those claims were false. he knew they weren't true. he also knew that what he was urging congress do in terms of throwing out the votes of millions of americans, he knew with specificity that that was unconstitutional. he was told that not only in discussions with me, but also by the house republican council. he signed his name to a brief filed with the united states supreme court that made those claims he knew to be false. so he has a record, repeatedly, of doing things that he knows to be wrong, he knows to be unconstitutional in order to placate donald trump and frankly, you say that sycophancy just now on display, so i think it's very concerning, and i do think that donald trump has consistently said again and again and again in the last few months that this election, you

know, is going to be rigged and if he loses that's why. so it's very important that the republicans not be in the majority in the house come 2025. and when it comes to the possibility of a peaceful transfer of power, are you optimistic that there will be? >> look, i think that donald trump is not currently in the white house, so he does not have the ability to exercise the control he did in 2020 and 2021. i hear repeatedly from people like mike johnson and j.d. vance that somehow we had a peaceful transfer of power. donald trump sat and watched for over three hours while our capitol was brutally attacked by a mob while our capitol was brutally attacked, while police officers were brutally beaten, and donald trump refused to tell them to go home for over three hours. so anybody who is interested in the truth ought to go look at those videos.

we did not have a peaceful transfer of power in 2021. >> just this week, senator jd vance was asked five different times if donald trump lost the election, and he refused to say yes. polls show millions of republicans share that same view. how do you reach those voters? those republicans? >> yeah. i think, kristen, when people write the history of this period the republican elected officials who know it's false, who continue to spread the lie, will be among those who are shown to be just really complicit in this attempt to unravel the republic, and so they are spreading this lie. they know it isn't true. if we are going to be a nation of laws we abide by the rulings of the courts and donald trump had the opportunity, 61 out of 62 courts ruled against him and he was told that what he was saying was false. the fact that you now have the republican party and the leaders of the party who are in the grips of, you know, it seems to

me just to be cowardice, that they are afraid of donald trump, but that they are willing to perpetuate his lies at the expense of their duty of the constitution tells you something about the real damage that's been done to the republican party. >> you told my colleague savannah guthrie, quote, a vote for donald trump may be the last election you may ever get to vote in. that is an incredibly dire warning, congresswoman, what did you mean by that? >> i think people have to look at what donald trump would do if he were to ever be in the oval office again, and the extent to which -- and he has said repeatedly that he believes he'll be immune, with the supreme court ruling, whatever they thought they were doing, donald trump believes he will be immune once he's in office. le will not respect the rulings of the courts, and people have to realize our courts can't enforce their own rulings. if the president refuses to carry out his obligation to do

so, then we are no longer a nation of laws. donald trump will ignore congress. he will appoint people -- people like mike flynn, for example, 36 hours mike flynn was at an event whether the president's opponents should be executed, and he basically said, listen, yes, i will unleash the gates of hell. these are the kinds of people that donald trump will be putting in place. the people that stopped him from his worst desires last time around won't serve again. >> like mark milley comes to mind according to mike woodward's book "fascist." >> i have tremendous respect for general milley and i see no reason to disagree with that assessment. >> i want to ask you about the donald trump that the world got to know in 2016. he was asked back then during a debate with secretary clinton whether he would accept the election results. here's what he said. >> one of the prides of this

country is the peaceful transition of power, and no matter how hard fought a campaign is that at the end of the campaign that the loser concedes to the winner. are you saying you are not prepared now -- >> what i will say is i will tell you at the time and i will keep you in suspense. >> well, chris. let me respond to that because that's horrifying. >> congresswoman, do you regret standing by him at the time and for all of those years after? >> yes, i do, and i think that, you know, we've now actually seen him carry that out. and so for, you know, certainly people after what he did on january 6th to act as though you can have confidence in him, you know, that simply is just not credible. the other thing i think people have to realize is what he did on january 6th, you know, watching that brutal attack, that's depravity, and it's just also fundamentally cruel. it's the same kind of thing that drives him to lie to people about where they can get

hurricane relief. think about the fact our fellow citizens are in dire straits, they're in dire needs, and people's lives are at risk, and he's lying to them for his own political gain about where they can get relief, and that kind of cruelty makes someone unfit for this office. >> and the supreme court has now ruled that he has immunity for official acts that were taken while in office. i'm curious, congresswoman. do you still have faith and confidence in the supreme court? >> look, i think that the court took far too long to issue that ruling. i think that they should have taken this up when jack smith asked them to initially, and i think they got it wrong. and i think justice sotomayor in her dissent and the description that she gives about the danger that donald trump poses, she got it right. now, i'm conservative. i am someone who has supported those supreme court justices in the past, many of them are friends of mine, you know, justice kagan was one of my professors in law school, my

favorite professor in law school, and the conservative justice is, too, but i'm deeply concerned about things like the role that ginni thomas played and ginni thomas's continuous refusal to accept the courts, and i'm concerned about the flag flying upsidedown on justice alito's home. >> have you lost confidence in them? >> i do have some real concerns about recent activities and rulings, but i think we need our courts -- both our supreme court as well as the lower courts, to play the kind of role that we've seen, frankly, the vast majority of judges play back in 2026. >> kamala harris, you called her a radical liberal whose policies, quote, are completely inconsistent with what most americans believe in and stand for. i know you don't view this as a policy election. you've been very clear about

that. but are their poll policies that kamala harris supports that you also back? >> absolutely. and i would say to the extent that -- you know, she and i certainly have had our disagreements, but when you look at the whole range of issues, for example, with respect to support to ukraine and with respect to the fact that she is saying that the united states has to lead the world, donald trump is embracing tyrants. donald trump loves tyrants. he idolizes them. jd vance and donald trump both support a isolationist foreign policy and an erratic and chaotic foreign policy that will leave us much less safe. >> do you regret the way you described kamala harris and the type of language used for donald trump? >> those were harsh things that i said. i think they reflect that we had a policy disagreement on a series of issues, but i also think that's why it is so important for people to focus on the fact that i am supporting

her now and that there's such a broad coalition that's coming together to support her, and it's based in part on who she is, on the fact that she will lead with a sincere heart, on the fact that she is someone who has dedicated her life to public servicing and looking at what donald trump poses, the kind of chaotic, absolute depravity that he would bring if he were ever to be elected again. >> congresswoman, do you still consider yourself to be a republican, and can you take us through the conversation you had with your father when he decided to vote for kamala harris? >> i'm a conservative. >> a republican? >> i am a conservative. i do not consider myself to be a member of donald trump's republican party. you know, my father and i speak every day, and he has really, you know,

from the very beginning of this process understood as much as i do, even more at the beginning probably, the threat that donald trump poses, and so, you know, this was not any kind of a surprise. and look, i think the fact that it's not just him, but the numbers of, you know, senior officials, national security advisers, secretaries of defense that you have seen who served in the trump administration who say this man is unfit, and republicans can try all they want to get people to ignore that, to look away from that, but i think that's a very important thing for the voters to recognize. >> congresswoman liz cheney, i know we'll see a lot of you out on the campaign trail. thank you for being out this morning on a very busy time. when we come back, positive feelings about vice president harris are falling in the latest poll. the panel is next.

welcome back. the panel is here. nbc news white house correspondent monica

welcome back. the panel is here. nbc news white house correspondent monica alba. leann caldwell, coauthor of the "washington post," early brief, and co-anchor of "the washington post" live, cornell belcher, and lahnee chen, from the hoover institute. thank you all for being here a big poll day. monica, let me start with you. 48-48. this race is deadlock and i know you've been working your sources in the harris campaign. how does she answer this critical question how is she going to be different than president biden. >> it's a major question, biden. and the sugar high after the ticket and the convention and the debate that that was going to wear off and come back down to earth. that's why she's running the ways she is what she likes to call as the underdog and there is certainly some indicators in the poll that help us understand some of the things that they're weighing actively about shifting here and one of those is this issue of the biden presidency being a bit of a drag on her own

candidacy, and she's tried to be very respectful and fiercely loyal to him, but we know that there are certain areas where she would like to say i could do something different, and i would do something different. and in particular in those answers last week that she tried to clean up in the moment but certainly didn't satisfy a lot of people on, we know there are things she could be talking about and try to suddenly shift that and hint at that, and they know that that's something she will have to get into in the next couple of days, and she'll be doing that while trying to earn the support of black men, have a blue wall battleground blitz, and she'll be in pennsylvania twice in the span of two weeks and in wisconsin, and they're trying to juggle that. there is certainly an awareness to that being a big challenge.

>> monica is reporting hits at the heart of the challenge for the harris campaign which is that our poll shows that former president trump's approval rating is higher than when she was in office and it's higher than president biden's. why do you think voters are looking back at the trump presidency at sth point and the way that they are, and what are the implications? >> i'm not really sure. maybe cornell can talk about what the meaning of that exact question is and that is common for presidents and they're always most popular when they aren't in office and people have nostalgia of what's happening. one thing with donald trump is that he's not on twitter anymore. news is not covering his rallies from, you know, wall to wall anymore, so one thing that the harris campaign is trying to do is to remind voters of the chaos that a donald trump presidency will bring. the trump administration believes despite the fact that there are a lot of good economic indicators right now, that people remember that still, their eggs cost less when donald trump was president than they do now. that's why you're going to see

kamala harris on the campaign continue to hit this economic message because that's really what independent voters seem to be caring about the most, and that's why she is talking about her economic plan gift and foremost. >> can i jump in on that? >> please. >> the 48 -- 48-51, 48 approval to 51 is where the horse race wants to go, right? when you look at the internals of the nbc poll, all his supporters are now in the polling and the approval of his job. that's part and parcel of what you have happening. and if you go underneath that, look at what's happening underneath that. approval rating, 72% among rural voters. and that 48-51, i've got a feeling that's where the election wants to go, and consistently in the polling, he's a 47%, 48% candidate, not really in polling. in an abc poll it has her at 51,

himming like 47 or 48 also. so he's -- this asymmetric conversation about what she has to do is interesting because he has a ceiling. >> it never goes above 47%, lahnee and republicans are coming home. the non-maga republicans are coming home, and he can't seem to get above the 47%. what do you think, lahnee. >> you are seeing coalescence among republican voters and the self-identified bloc of republicans who are non-maga is decreasing and there are a few reasons for that. first of all, there is a recognition among the issue that republicans care most about which is immigration. if you look at this poll, every poll that we see is immigration. there is a lot of contrast on that issue and trump has successfully driven contrast on that issue and those voters are coming home because of immigration. i would also say that there is a positive view, to your point, 6

about his administration's policy on the other issue they care about which is cost of living and that contrast of issues is significant and that's coalescing republicans and that is the single reason why his numbers have improved significantly over these last several weeks. >> and the good piece of news for vice president harris, leann is the fact that abortion is at the top of the list in what voters say will turn them out to vote? >> this is why in part, you see the gender divide in this polling. abortion is a big issue for kamala harris. she is winning this issue, and that's what not only democratic voters, and she's talking about freedom and the freedom to control your own body which is really important. meanwhile, donald trump is really trying to -- to expand that gender divide by focusing on men. everything that he has done in his campaign has been, you know, to increase his support among men. >> it's a historic gender gap, monica, and that's where this battle will be fought and won,

it seems. >> absolutely. we saw it with former president obama's in the last couple of days specifically with black men. this is an area where the harris campaign knows they'll be targeting and laying out more new ads specifically with black men talking about why they support the vice president. they're going to be leaning into that. but on abortion, as well on this point with the gender gap. after labor day, the harris campaign said we'll have a reproductive freedom event every single day in the swing state among the election and they view that as a key part of their strategy. >> reproductive rights is republicans chasing the car and catching it. the dog chasing the car and catching it, right? and i said this going into the last midterm. it is a mobilizing issue on the left in a way we have not seen before, so we're going into another election where i think democrats are going to overperform because of the mobilizing effect of abortion rights. >> all right. much more with all of you coming

up, but when we come back, two deadly storms fueled by climate change leave widespread destruction. so what lessons have been learned? our "meet the press minute" is next.

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welcome back. in 2005 hurricane katrina welcome back. in 2005 hurricane katrina ravaged the southeastern u.s., claiming nearly 1,400 lives and becoming one of the deadliest storms in u.s. history. in the wake of the tragedy,

former president bill clinton joined "meet the press" to discuss the growing impact of climate change and its role in intensifying natural disasters. >> i don't think any person with a straight face can tell you that katrina was caused by global warming, but what we do know, what the evidence shows, is that there is an increase in the number and severity of bad weather events all across the globe. we know that and that will continue. keep in mind, in the last decade 12 blocks of ice the side of rhode island have broken off the south pole. we now have some significant evidence that the north pole and even worse, the ice cap on greenland, the ice caps, are thinning. this is going to lift the water level and it will complicate the rebuilding of new orleans. if we don't reduce it in 50 years we'll lose 50 feet of manhattan island. and one of the countries i'm working with, maldives, the water will cover it, roll over

it, and we'll never recover it. we need to face the fact that the climate is changing and this is one of the consequences. >> to help those who have been impacted by hurricanes milton and helene, please consider giving to organizations like these. when we come back, former president trump is pushing more false claims about immigration and hurricane relief. what will the impact be? our panel is next. l is next.

welcome back. the panel is still here. cornell, monica just raised the point that former president barack obama out in welcome back. the panel is still here. cornell, monica just raised the point that former president barack obama out in pennsylvania campaigning for harris with a very strong message to black men. get out and vote. it's not acceptable to sit on the sidelines. some people said that seemed a little bit like lecturing. do you think that energizes or could it backfire? >> look, i will say this, there is not a more popular spokesperson in this country than barack obama. if you have african-american men who are sitting on the fence, by the way, historically, 14% of african-american men vote republican. i am most worried than i am for

those not turning out. if you look at places like milwaukee, since 2012, you've seen the turnout drop significantly behind white turnout. what i will say to them is these men are still on the fence and give them an economic message of how you're going to fix their economic eggs, and i think they'll come around for you. >> what nbc shows is for convincible voters it is the economy. it's not abortion. it's not immigration. it's the economy. it's not abortion or immigration. it's the economy. and so that needs to be the core of the argument for harris. it, frankly, is a trump strength and it will be a challenge for her because the case he makes on the economy is listen, look back to when i was president. and as the poll also reveals, people have a more positive impression of the economic policies during the first time than biden's.

>> and this is focused not on just black men, but hispanic men, and he's running an anti-transgender ad and that is not a play for the base. that's a play for hispanic and black men who are more culturally conservative and they think they can get them. >> trying to chip away at harris' lead, there, monica. >> on the specific message that's why you will tart to see bill clinton headed to rural areas in georgia starting today where i am told no harris surrogate has stepped foot and let alone a former president because they think he has the smaller events where he likes to be the explainer in chief that they think could be helpful again in those rural areas. and we will see former president obama being out there and you will see hillary clinton doing events in the closing stretch. but there's an open question about what role former first lady michelle obama might play in the final days.

she had a key message at the dnc imploring democrats to do something. the question is she's been more behind the scenes when it comes to voter turnout? will she be there in the final days? i am told yes. that's something to watch for too. >> there is no surrogate most popular than former first lady michelle obama on both sides of the aisle. fantastic conversation. thank you so much for watching. we'll be back next week because if it's sunday, it's "meet the press." ♪♪ ♪♪ donald trump cares more