take it! >> oh, my god. >> what happens in our culture, in our discourse on television and on the line as we've talked about on this program doesn't just stay there. it has interaction with how we all live as a society and politics. for his part, trump has not mellowed. we were just discussing this in a very different context with someone who has known him for decades. he uses political extremist approaches honed through the reality villain approach. >> you like omarosa, the way she just talks to you? i mean do you like her? she has a very sharp edge. i don't know how you can like her personally. >> such a nasty woman. >> do you understand me? i'm going to sue you if you have to. do you understand me? yes, i hung up, i didn't get disconnected. >> we can sue them and win lots of money. we will open up the libel laws.

>> you're fired. >> she just got fired. i said, debbie, you're fired. >> if you count the reality show era he has been doing it for decades. no surprise he went from cameoing as a version of himself in tv pro-wrestling which is fake and the embrace of fiction and partly true is the mental price of admission, to literally welcoming one of the fictional heroes to the sometimes villain hulk hogan to address the rnc in the nation, something we lived through if you kind of blacked it out. if it feels upside down, the producer i told you about that has been on the program, he argues if you are saying you should actually feel some of the vertigo, because now actual life is approximating reality testify and we're conscripted as cast members at the final stage of the cultural logic, people with no connection to the genre living as if they are also reality stars. he says there's good news here for democrats because harris seems to get it.

quote, the playfully self-deprecating memes, the repeated invocation of joy, she is reality lite. if trump is still doing gordon ramsay, he argues, harris is giving us lisa vanderpump. no greater prose have we come across in this campaign season. seriously, you don't have to watch either show to get his point. the same schtick over and over and over and over with the volume only turned up can get so old that people turn it off. that's what mr. hirschorn argues. whether this means kamala harris will win is what i will ask him next. ♪ ♪

( ♪♪ ) asthma. it can make you miss out on those epic hikes with friends. step back out there with fasenra.

fasenra is an add-on treatment for eosinophilic asthma that is taken once every 8 weeks. ( ♪♪ ) fasenra helps prevent asthma attacks. most patients did not have an attack in the first year. fasenra is proven to help you breathe better so you can get back to doing day-to-day activities. and fasenra helps lower the use of oral steroids. fasenra is not for sudden breathing problems or other eosinophilic conditions. allergic reactions may occur. don't stop your asthma treatments without talking with your doctor. tell your doctor if your asthma worsens. headache and sore throat may occur. tell your doctor if you have a parasitic infection. get back to better breathing. get back to what you've missed. ask your doctor about fasenra, the only asthma treatment taken once every 8 weeks. if you can't afford your medication, astrazeneca may be able to help. i have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. thanks to skyrizi, i'm on my way with clearer skin. 3 out of 4 people achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months.

and skyrizi is just 4 doses a year after 2 starter doses. serious allergic reactions and an increased risk of infections or a lower ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms had a vaccine, or plan to. nothing on my skin means everything! ask your dermatologist about skyrizi. learn how abbvie could help you save. when a tough cough finds you on the go, a syrup would be... silly! woo! hey! try new robitussin soft chews. packed with the power of robitussin... in every bite.

easy to take cough relief, anywhere. chew on relief, chew on a ♪ robitussin ♪

enough was enough and i said let trump-a-mania run wild, brother. let trump-a-mania rule again. let trump-a-mania make america great again! >> do you remember that, the hulk paying back a favor in the real world that trump spent so much time in the fiction of pro wrestling? we are joined by former vh1 programming chief and reality show guru michael hirschorn, who writes, can't explain this election. writing, quote, the final ratings won't be in until

november. >> i did a show with hulk for five seasons, and he was the nicest guy. so i don't know what happened there. >> okay. well, explain. >> well, i think -- i think, you know, the reason i wrote the piece was to sort of think about under any normal understanding of politics or why someone would succeed in becoming president or not, trump should be 20, 30 points under water. why is he not? why are the things that used to matter not important anymore? and i think we've moved into like a weird time where politics has always been downstream from culture and culture now is in this weird place where things that are real and things that are fake are kind of intermingling. trump does fantastically well in that space, and anyone who seems like a traditional old-school politician, looks kind of out of touch and looks like they're from another era. that's the danger that this moment poses.

>> hmm. the wrestling, trump is going to go on wrestling podcast. >> yes. >> the wrestling world is still really large. i want to show a little more of this. he's been the fixture there and those who knew him in that world are not exactly shocked by his political rise. >> i was entertained by trump when he was on the show. >> come on up here. >> his ability to speak to wrestling fans was excellent. >> to me they look like a very smart group of people. >> he was kind of perfect for the role. if you are going to look at the influence of pro wrestling on culture, man, we elected a president that -- that was playing a pro wrestler on tv. >> donald trump is an example of what seems to be a kind of pro wrestling-ification of american politics and american society. >> from the new netflix documentary. do you agree? >> i think it is 100% correct. i think you can look at what is happening now through the prism of reality tv.

you can look at it through the prism of professional wrestling. both are entertainment where villainy is a virtue. >> uh-huh. >> and being entertaining matters far more than what you say or do, and it is about projecting a certain persona. and we know increasingly look at politics as a kind of sub set of reality tv or professional wrestling. >> so the problem for that, which matters in october and might matter for many years no matter how this election is resolved, is that a society that is so cynical that it believes everyone is basically playing a role is going to have a harder time valuing or recognizing any earnest, genuine people who are not. >> i think that's precisely right, and also a very hard time telling the difference between correct information and fake information. i think you can go a long way, and we can go a long way down before we understand that a

government that's sort of run as a kind of, you know, television show is not delivering things that we need. i mean you can go all the way down to venezuela where -- where they're able to, you know, suffer through incredible hardships and deprivation of liberty, but it doesn't matter because they have a team they can root for, they have a story that they can tell themselves. and i think we're very much trapped and social media should be part of this discussion as well, at a time when it is -- if some piece of information is inconvenient, we just decide that we're going to ignore it. >> uh-huh. so you write in the piece that harris has a better style of routing around this and mocking it rather than being drawn into his mud wrestling, if you will. explain that and do you think that means she's on track to win

or not by the -- by the media lens you are using? >> well, i would say i would be foolish to predict anything. i think she comes closer than any democratic politician because there's a strain in democratic politics that is kind of earnest, sort of boring, that feels like it needs to justify the point and purpose of government. and to the degree she is able to get away from that, i think, you know, her kind of sick burn of those -- those protesters at her rally yesterday where she said, hey, you're at the wrong rally, going down the other street to the smaller rally, that's the spirit in which i think if she can keep channelling that she can kind of show she understands where the culture is without being kind of fully poisoned by it, let's say. >> yeah, and it is also an intellectual bug or challenge if earnest liberalism involves an awareness of your own

fallibility and an attempt at inclusion and humility, those are good things. >> yes. >> but as you were saying, if it culturally through the mediums reads as being apologetic for everything, your existence, your ideas, your plans, that might not resonate with the people that are watching some of what we just showed. >> right. and also it is watching it live and then watching it chopped up into social media. i mean i thought she was very effective on fox this week, you know, that she was able to, you know, be forceful and strong while also not getting caricatured as an angry black woman which is the trap. >> the trope they wanted to push. >> what she needs to pull off is extremely difficult, and i think a lot of it is unconscious in terms of the voters. like are they ready to elect a diverse woman as president. >> yeah. and i just want to make sure i have the -- quoting you right. you said she will definitely win by four states.

>> 40 states, yes. and if she isn't, we need to have an insurrection. >> wow. see, dry humor. a joke. don't quote it out of context anywhere. michael hirschorn, thank you. >> always a pleasure. >> click on "the draw." up next, we have a special guest as we look at ai and these campaigns and jason johnson, that's next. n johnson, that's next. clean. wetjet absorbs and locks grime deep inside. look at that! swiffer wetjet. rsv can severely affect the lungs and lower airways. but i'm protected (pause) with arexvy. arexvy is a vaccine used to prevent lower respiratory disease from rsv in people 60 years and older. rsv can be serious for those over 60, including those with asthma, diabetes, copd and certain other conditions. but i'm protected. arexvy is proven to be over 82% effective in preventing lower respiratory disease from rsv and over 94% effective in those

with these health conditions. arexvy does not protect everyone and is not for those with severe allergic reactions to its ingredients. those with weakened immune systems may have a lower response to the vaccine. the most common side effects are injection site pain, fatigue, muscle pain, headache, and joint pain. arexvy is number one in rsv vaccine shots. rsv? make it arexvy. (♪♪) hi, i'm greg. i live in bloomington, illinois. i'm not an actor. i'm just a regular person. some people say, "why should i take prevagen? i don't have a problem with my memory." memory loss is, is not something that occurs overnight. i started noticing subtle lapses in memory. i want people to know that prevagen has worked for me. it's helped my memory. it's helped my cognitive qualities. give it a try. i want it to help you just like it has helped me. prevagen. at stores everywhere without a prescription.

at humana, we believe your healthcare should evolve with you, and part of that evolution means choosing the right medicare plan for you. humana can help. with original medicare you're covered for hospital stays and doctor office visits, but you'll have to pay a deductible for each. a medicare supplement plan pays for some or all of your original medicare deductibles, but they may have higher monthly premiums and no prescription drug coverage. humana medicare advantage prescription drug plans include medical coverage. plus,

prescription drug coverage with $0 copays on hundreds of prescriptions. most plans include coverage for dental, vision, even hearing. and there's a cap on your out-of-pocket costs! so, call or go online today to see if there's a humana plan in your area and to get our free decision guide. the medicare annual enrollment period ends on december 7th, so call now. humana - a more human way to healthcare. my moderate to severe crohn's disease... ...and my ulcerative colitis symptoms... ...kept me... ...out of the picture. now... ...there's skyrizi. ♪i've got places to go...♪ ♪...and i'm feeling free♪ ♪control of my symptoms means everything...♪ ♪...to me♪ ♪control is everything to me♪ and now... ...i'm back in the picture. feel significant symptom relief at... ...4 weeks with skyrizi. skyrizi is proven to help deliver remission... ...and help visibly improve damage.... ...of the intestinal lining at 12 weeks and 1 year. don't use if allergic.

serious allergic reactions,... ...increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur. before treatment, get checked for infections... ...and tb. tell your doctor about any... ...flu-like symptoms,or vaccines. liver problems leading to hospitalization... ...may occur when treated for crohn's or uc. ready to get... ...back in the picture? ask your... ...gastroenterologist how to take control of your crohn's... ...or uc with skyrizi. ♪control is everything to me♪ abbvie could help you save. hey, scott. this stuff's perfect for fall, right? yep! it feeds your lawn now to strengthen roots all winter for a better lawn next spring. how do you know all of this? says it right there on the bag. yes, it does. download the my lawn app today for lawn care tips and customized plans. feed your lawn. feed it. this campaign is in full swing and that means we have plenty of things to fall back

on. we have two special guests right now, professor jason johnson, msnbc analyst who we love so much. he even anchors "the beat" sometimes. host "late podcast" award with johnson. making his debut, a chart topping legend, saxophonist kenny g. very few artists top 10 million records sold, but he is in the era of selling 75 million records worldwide. ♪ ♪ >> amen to that, putting him in the pantheon of nirvana and bob marley for global sales. one of the best-selling artists of all time and one of the most celebrated saxophonists in world history. ♪ ♪>> you were once a brave lawyer in the tribe of long locksman, which is a thing. ♪ ♪

>> the hits go on. what a life. a life still being lived, and the autobiography is, fittingly, "life in the key of g." jason and kenny g, great to have you here. >> thank you. >> i could not be happier. i just had to say that. >> do you feel good? >> i feel good. >> did you coordinate the looks? >> this is an honor with kenny g. i'm going to have a blazer and open shirt. >> looks good. >> thank you, thank you. >> kenny brought his instrument which is beautiful. >> yes. >> your instrument, we know this and i can say this, you brought it, it is your mouth. >> my mouth. >> and your brain. >> yes. >> since it is your home court advantage, what fallback list? >> my first fallback is this new deal with lion's gate and runway films. runway is linking up with lion's gate and they're going to get access to all of tear films, that's the john wicks, anything

from dirty dancer, hunger games, and basically steal artists' creative work to make new ai content. artists all over the world have their work taken every day by ai and turned into something else by these companies. i need them to fall back, respect artists. respect the creative process. >> makes sense to me and kind of a theme here because i know you want to talk about some of this on your fallback list, and ai, while it could be great, we did a piece on how the screening of cancer and mammograms has been improved which has human doctors using this as a tool to help human patients. what jason is describing and what people are concerned about is the other side, robots running rampant and stealing human work and creativity. >> i don't know if i can say it better than jason but when ai is going to take the sound of somebody, their voice, hopefully not my saxophone, and then create a whole new piece of

music, or a library of music, it's not fair. i spent 50 years practicing this thing for somebody to just be able -- somebody or something to take that sound and create a song that sounds beautiful, where don't think it's fair. if we can use it to help create things, that's great, but for it to create it is not good. >> one of your recent guests, ll cool j, i remember the first time i saw the legend in leather. i want to hear ll reinterpret his music, i want to hear kenny g. play his songs. i don't want to hear ai programs, somebody sitting in a lab somewhere, taking what he's worked on, what anybody has worked on and turning it into something new. it takes something away from us as human beings and part of what inspires us is seeing the work people put into it. >> i'm not here to hold you accountable. we do that all week with politicians. >> oh, good. >> but you did abandon your piano lessons when you were

young. >> i didn't like it. >> we only know this because of the great stories you tell in the book. >> thank you. >> i'll read a little bit and you tell us. you said my love of the saxophone started in the '60s. i was watching tv with my mom and saw a sax player. i thought the sax looked like the coolest thing i had ever seen. i turned to my mom, i said hey, i would like to play that instrument. my mom said, well, we're not going to buy you one. we'll rent one because you might quit like you did the piano. >> it's true. that is true. my mom was a little skeptical that i would not stick with it, but i tell you, the second i got that saxophone, i put it together. it was not a soprano like this. by the way, this is my high school sax. this is it, the one. the one that played with barry white in the '70s. yeah, this is the sax. but i put the sax together, and i never looked back. i took it into the bathroom, and i practiced in the mirror with all the hard surfaces. like a room like this. it sounds good in here.

see, a beautiful sound in here like a bathroom. >> let me give you a quick challenge. can you give us any soundscape that would work for a big nerd like jason? something that feels comic book, literature? it's not untrue. >> john williams, anything. >> something in the vibe, because he loves the comics, he loves the nerd stories. >> he needs a theme song for himself? >> a theme song or a video game vibe. anything that comes to your mind. >> it would be two-part for him. a par that would go -- ♪♪ -- and then it would be -- ♪♪ because he's a nerd but he's also got soul. >> the second part -- are you that swage? i don't know? >> underneath it all. yeah, in the right moments. >> the other question from the book, and i'll show our viewers,

in the key of g, and the g in different worlds it can mean different things. we say og, it means original gangster. if i say to jason, man, this politics thing, you're the g of politics. it doesn't mean he's a literal gangster, but he might be a politics g. have you ever had anyone ask if that's the kind of g that the g is in kenny g.? >> no. just look at me. they go, what is it, goldstein? that's close. >> last question is, because your work is instrumental, we have always on this show talked to people about how music can uneat. but language is still a barrier. as instrumental, basically someone who has captured basically every region potentially, what's been the most interesting place or the most exciting place for you to play? >> the most interesting is asia. one of my songs is huge in china. one of my melodies tells people it's the end of the day and it's time to go home.

the song is called going home. they took it literally and every day at 5:00, it's played everywhere. today in china, probably 500 million people have heard my song going home, and they hear it and go, oh, time to go home. and they go home. >> amazing. i love it. it's life in the key of g is the book. kenny g., and jason j. >> jason j. >> the original g. >> with a new theme song, by the way. >> a new theme song for j by g. time to go home, but you could be home and keep the news on. i have a new piece i wrote about campaign theme music. you can go to arimelber.com if you want to read that or sign up for my free newsletter. there's a lot of politics tonight and joy reid has you covered. "the reidout" starts now. ow

it's our son, he is always up in our business. it's the verizon 5g home internet i got us. oh... he used to be a competitive gamer but with the higher lag, he can't keep up with his squad. so now we're his “squad”. what are kevin's plans for the fall? he's going to college. out of state, yeah. -yeah in the fall. change of plans, i've decided to stay local. oh excellent! oh that's great! why would i ever leave this? -aw! we will do anything to get him gaming again.

you and kevin need to fix this internet situation. heard my name! i swear to god, kevin! -we told you to wait in the car. everyone in my old squad has xfinity. less lag, better gaming! i'm gonna need to charge you for three people. (♪♪) behind every splenda product is a mission. helping millions of people reduce sugar from their diets. now try a sweetener grown by u.s. farmers. introducing zero-calorie splenda stevia. at splenda stevia farms, our plants are sweetened by sunshine. experience how great splenda stevia can be. grown on our farm, enjoyed at your table. (♪♪) tonight on "id