i just happen to think that elon musk is a very dangerous figure. look no further than the disinformation that he advances on his own site, x. he's constantly pushing propaganda and disinformation while simultaneously being a billionaire, someone who is incredibly powerful in terms of the way we as americans communicate. now, apparently communicating with foreign leaders. by the way, in 2024, this is like the hundredth biggest story. it barely ranks, but it is scary and worth watching. >> it is indeed scary, how much influence this one man has over this election. we know from bob woodward, donald trump also has been speaking to vladimir putin. a author, columnist, and conservative writer, matt lewis. thank you so much. thank you to you for getting up "way too early" with us on this friday and all week long. "morning joe" starts now.

georgia, we have 12 days to choose which way our country is going to go from here. >> we don't have a moment to lose. you want to stop that other guy. i don't call him by his name. i call him agent orange. >> she's running to be the 47th president of the united states. donald trump is running to be an american tyrant. >> i watched him from the central park five to project 2025. and what i realized is that in this donald trump america, there is no dream that looks like me. ♪♪ good morning. those were the high-profile celebrities who appeared last night outside of atlanta for kamala harris. a rally which also included former president obama. donald trump, meanwhile, was in

two swing states out west disparaging america and praising an autocrat. i think he said america is a garbage can. >> so, this is what i never really understood. you know, all these republicans that used to be conservative, we're talking about, oh, you don't love america. don't love america. there's never in the history of the united states of america, since the confederacy, of course, been a president or a candidate for president that has trashed america as much as donald trump constantly trashes america. if he is in power, it's great again. if he's out of power, it's a garbage can. kamala harris has been saying time and time again, she loves america. she believes in america. it's just -- mika, it's really crazy. >> it's interesting. often, we talk about how some of the people who are still showing for donald trump, and republican leaders in congress who still stand by him, and yet you hear trump in the past day or so

absolutely just ripping to shreds his former generals, the people he hired. if he pric brings you in, make mistake, he will turn on you, too. >> i was just going to say, willie, the crazy thing is, again, these people that used to be flag wavers for america now will wave their trump flags. they sit back and smile and will vote for a guy who disparages america constantly, says he'll arrest his political opponents, and disparages generals who have given their entire lives for this country. i guess, again, we shouldn't be shocked because, of course, he disparaged john mccain. said he wasn't a war hero because he got shot down. this has been a long time coming. i don't think i ever expected him to be as disrespectful of

military members, of generals, of admirals, and of those who gave their life in defense of this country. >> in donald trump's eyes, being a patriot, a term he's used and his supporters use, being a patriot means supporting him, doing what he thinks is right. it has nothing to do with the country or constitution. it has to do with donald trump. yesterday, calling america a garbage can. he's called america a hell hole, a third world country. it brings to mind the line that pennsylvania governor josh sha he shapiro likes to use a lot, "hey, donald trump, stop s-holing america. why doo you think america is so terrible?" kamala harris seized on this at the convention first and ever since. that is, patriotism has been reclaimed. we support freedom. we support the constitution, not donald trump. the good news is, most americans do not believe america is a hell

hole or a garbage can. we're proud to have lived here our entire lives. we celebrate the country, and we'll see if people vote that way. >> if anybody believes america is a garbage can that's voting this election, they're stupid. they don't know the facts. >> might want to take a trip. >> yeah, they may want to move somewhere else if they think it is a hell hole. i don't want to bore people, but i'll say it again. i have richard haass here. anything i say, if it's incorrect, let me know. but america's military relative to the rest of the world, more powerful than at any time since world war ii. america's economic might relative to the rest of the world, more powerful than any time since world war ii. america's technological might relative to the rest of the world, more powerful than any time since world war ii. america's military, by the way, so powerful, that most organizations that rank the power of militaries have russia

number two. >> why does he hate it? >> he hates america pause because somebody else is running america. richard, again, we always hear about donald trump, i'll say it, shit talking the united states of america. the facts are just the opposite. our economy is the envy of the world. the gdp of texas, bigger than the gdp of russia. the gdp of california is bigger than the gdp of all other countries except for three. amazon's r&d budget is bigger than the r&d budget than just about every g7 country. we are a colossus standing on the top of a mountain regarding power compared to the other countries who envy us. of course, some see us as their

enemies, their sworn enemies. those are the very countries that donald trump right now is praising and the leaders who he is praising. >> look, we have real challenges in this country. everyone around this table, everyone watching knows this. >> of course. >> i wouldn't change it for anyone else's. one of the most controversial issues in this country is immigration. people want to come to this country. >> right. >> people are lining up around the world at american consulates. why? they want to go to america's universities. it's still the world's best. on and on and on. you mentioned the military, the economy, technology, our innovation bases is second to none. you know, you look at the chinas, the russia, the rest. their internal challenges are incomparably greater than what we face, whether it is demographic, economic, political, you name it. >> anand giridharadas, willie, said something so moing weeks

ago. he said, 7:00 a.m. across the world, in just about every country, you can go, look for the u.s. consulate, and there will be lines around the block of people who want to come to america. it reminds me of what jfk said about this country. we americans, we may have our challenges, but we never had to put up a wall to keep our people in. speaking of walls, people are going to be looking at those walls at yankee stadium, willie, that are about -- >> oh, wait a minute. >> -- 225 -- >> let's bring everybody in. >> -- 225 yards, like from home plate -- or feet from home plate. willie, what are you expecting tonight? >> please introduce our guests while you're at it. >> okay, jonathan here. we have rev here. >> i was talking to willie. we have meacham. >> we have jon meacham here, as well. jon and i will, of course -- >> thank you. >> -- be eating cheese

sandwiches and sipping sweet tea. willie, set it up for us tonight. >> we yankee fans are embracing the underdog role here. obviously, the dodgers have the best record in baseball. they have the best lineup in baseball. they have home field advantage. we just hope -- >> poor kids. >> -- we can win a game in the series against the mighty, mighty los angeles dodgers. they have the second best player in baseball, imagine that, shohei ohtani. they're really, really good. we hope we can hang with them. we're going to throw a kid named gerrit cole out there who is going to start and do what we can out of the gate. we're the underdogs, but, you know what, so was the 1980 hockey team, joe. we'll see what happens here. >> oh, my god. cannot do this, willie. >> yeah. >> you know, lemire, i really -- this is plagiarism. this false southern humility, he's taken a page from my book, and i do not appreciate it.

aaron judge, juan soto, stanton, gerrit cole, this is the best team in baseball, top to bottom. their payroll is, you know, bigger than about 50% of the countries across the planet. i mean, this is a yankees team -- i will say this, really, this yankees' team is so great, if they even lose one game this season -- >> it'll be a failure. >> come on. >> the list you did about why america is top of the world, just substitute yankees. they're bigger than every other nation on the planet except three. >> right. >> it is the best team money can buy. >> yeah. >> you know, the dodgers are a cinderella story. >> yeah. >> plucky upstarts by names of mookie, shohei, likes of those guys. >> that's right. >> america's team. we love an underdog story here. >> yeah. >> we're wrapping our arms

around the los angeles dodgers. >> let's figure this out. >> i'm giving you ten seconds. >> played for the angels, right? gerrit cole, where did he play? >> houston astro. >> okay. stanton, he came up in the system, right? >> he's a marlin. >> oh, a marlin. >> america's team, joe. >> what about soto? >> nationals and padres. >> oh, nationals and padres. >> aaron judge, farmhand. >> bring it home. >> predictions, go around. what do you say. >> my lord. >> yanks in six. >> rev? >> yanks, i'm a new yorker. >> dodgers in zen. >> willie? >> yankees in seven. we have to steal one of the two games. game one is tonight. game two tomorrow. come back for three in new york. if they can come back 1-1, they have a chance to win in seven. >> i have to say, the dodgers can be hot. they can be incredibly inconsistent, too. i don't know how -- >> pitching. >> yeah, not a lot of pitching.

this is -- i think it'll be dodgers in six. >> okay. >> i really do. i could be wrong. >> you could be. >> i usually am wrong. >> yeah. >> i'm good with it. >> let me hold your hand now. okay. vice president -- >> jon meacham. >> oh, my gosh. >> the thing is, just because he went to suwanee, you know, some of us do not denigrate the university of the south. jon meacham, who will you be cheering for tonight? >> i'm a yankees fan because -- >> geez. >> this will surprise you. i came to it through a literary experience. >> you don't have to tell us the history. >> wait a minute. >> what's going on with you? >> listen, jon, we don't need the history of this. >> i want to hear the history. >> you do. >> oh. >> colonel rupert -- no. so i read a book called "dynasty." the subtitle of which was, "when rooting for the yankees was like

rooting for u.s. steel." it was an account of the gehrig/ruth years. it's a patriotic decision. >> i don't agree. >> i think it is very -- >> thank you. >> kind of like me -- >> vice president -- >> -- telling my son that rooting for chelsea is like cheering for microsoft. >> -- held a rally in georgia where she appeared side by side for the first time with former president barack obama. a crowd of 23,000 people, the largest of her campaign, also heard from samuel l. jackson, tyler perry, and bruce springsteen. ♪ driving all night chasing the sun mirage ♪ ♪ pretty soon, darling i'm going to take charge ♪ ♪ well dogs on main street howl because they understand ♪ >> i want a president who

reveres the constitution. who does not threaten but wants to protect and guide our great democracy. who believes in the rule of law and the peaceful transfer of power. who will fight for a woman's right to choose. and who wants to create a middle class economy that will serve all our citizens. there is only one candidate in this election who holds those principles dear. kamala harris. >> so when i think about america, i think about my grandmother's quilt. we are all shapes, sizes, and colors, but we are one. [ applause ] and it was so important for me to stand with the candidate who understands that we as america,

we are a quilt. i could never stand with a candidate who wants america to be a sheet. >> kamala harris is ready for the job. this is a leader who has spent her life fighting on behalf of people who need a voice. who need a champion. kamala wasn't born into privilege. she was raised in the middle class family. she worked at mcdonald's when she was in college to pay her expenses. she didn't pretend to work at mcdonald's when it was closed. >> over the last years, and particularly the last eight years, donald trump has become more confused, more unstable, and more angry. you see it every day. he has become increasingly unhinged.

but last time, at least there were people around him who could control him. but do notice in this election, they're not with him this time. there's a choice that everybody has, so let's imagine it for a moment. it's either donald trump in there, stewing over his enemies' list. or me, working for you, checking off my to-do list! you have the power to make that decision. it is your power. it is your power. >> jonathan, her closing statement, her closing theme is going to be very basic. it's going to be he's about him. i'm about you. again, as i said yesterday, the october surprise has not been what one of the greatest journalists in america, jeffrey

goldberg, has reported. it's not what a great general who dedicated his life and whose son gave his life defending this country said. it's about what donald trump has said himself. he said this is going to be about me. i am going to arrest my political opponents. i am going to shut down cbs news because i don't like how account "60 minutes" edited a package. i'm going to exact revenge. he's talked about retribution, all these things. it's fascinating, you usually don't have your opponent playing right into your hands, but that's exactly what donald trump has been saying. yet, despite all of the unconstitutional things he has been saying and promising over the past several weeks, this race is tied this morning. >> it is a dead heat, this race. internals from both campaigns

suggest they're within a point in every battleground state. the trump campaign thumping their chest more than the harris team, but it is a tight race. this is going to be the vice president's closing argument, this idea that donald trump has no plans. he has no policy proposals. he has maybe one about no taxes on tips. that's it. everything else is just about himself. it's about, rev, retribution. it's about grievance. it's about going after his political enemies and potentially using the military to do so. while the vice president is trying to say, look, i have all these. you may not have loved everything about the biden administration, but we did a lot of good for a lot of people. look at the proposals. i'll go even further in a number of areas here. she is trying to say, look, he's about himself. i'm for you. that sound bite there, the idea of the to-do list, they love that, i'm told. we're going to hear that a number of times each and every day for the next 11 days. >> i think that that is exactly what we're looking at. i did four cities yesterday in

michigan on our non-partisan national action network tour, laying out the facts from both candidates. i had the central park five with me and brother of george floyd. i'm still hearing arguments, not the majority of them, but some among black men. i'm still hearing arguments among some of the americans as we toured just yesterday. i think it is very tight. i think we also have to deal with the fact that donald trump, it reminds me of a battered mate syndrome, where you beat down your wife or beat down your husband, saying you're lucky. you're nothing without me. and people are falling for this because of their own biases, some misogyny, some race, and others that they bring to the table. because they could rationally be listening to trump and harris and come up with trump. it's what they bring to the

table, as what you bring to a battered marriage. if you already think you're less than something, you accept somebody telling you that. that's what donald trump has, a battered syndrome campaign. you are nothing without me. you shouldn't be even allowed in my presence. and people with insecurities or biases feed into that. >> contrast what we just saw there in georgia from vice president kamala harris and her supporters with tyler perry talking about america being a great quilt like his grandmother used to make, with donald trump at his rally last night in tempe, arizona. here's what he said. >> when kamala came in, she deliberately dismantled our border and threw over the gates. she threw them open. the gates to an invasion of criminal migrants from prisons and jails, from insane asylums and mental institutions, from all over the world, from venezuela to the congo in africa.

a lot of people coming out of the congo. not just south america, they're coming from 181 countries as of yesterday. we're a dumping ground. we're like a garbage can for the world. that's what's happened. that's what's happened. we're like a garbage can. you know, it's the first time i've ever said that. every time i come up and talk about what they've done to our country,angrier. first time i said garbage can, but it is a very accurate description. >> so there it is, jon meacham. we were talking about that comment the top of the show, calling america, quote, a garbage can, with 11 days to go until the election. just the contrast you see, as someone who has written many beautiful words and told a lot of stories over the course of your life, what do you see when you watch the harris rally contrasted president trump rally? >> well, conventional politics

from jefferson forward, honestly, has been the politics of optimism, the politics of hope have tended to prevail, at least rhetorically. you know, democracies are human undertakings, and they're shaped by the tension between hope, which is about looking forward, and fear, which is about the anxiety created, the ancient definition. it's the anxiety created by the anticipation of the loss of something you love. the anticipation and anxiety about the loss of something you love. so the politics of fear is really powerful, but what has prevailed until now has been, ultimately, a politics of hope. jefferson talking about we're the world's best hope. lincoln saying we're the last best hope. ronald reagan saying we're the

last best hope of man on earth. you can track the phrase. and we face a very clear choice. there is no mystery about what we're going to decide right now and what's going to be rendered in, what, ten days. it's that vice president harris would conduct a recognizable, coherent presidency, and donald trump risks taking us so far down an authoritarian road that we'd become unrecognizable. and maybe people feel kind of a center/center-left presidency is just so much worse than this risk of the man who thinks we're a garbage can taking power again. but i don't quite see it. i speak as someone who, you

know, president biden is my friend. i've helped him when i could. but i voted for a lot of republicans. i'd love to be in a place where i could vote for a republican again, but this, to use a very technical term, willie, this ain't in. this ain't in. >> yeah, not even close. yeah, donald trump saying we're a garbage can, saying that we're a stupid nation, you know who is saying that, what leaders around the world are saying that? none, none. they may not like us, but they like us because we're too powerful. they like us because our economy is too strong. they like us because our military is too strong. they like us because our cultural reach is too strong. they like us because our hard power is too overwhelming. they don't like us because our soft power is too overwhelming, cultural power. you could go down the list. donald trump alone is saying we're a garbage can, and i guess he's teaching his followers to

say that, saying we're a stupid nation. go to silicon valley. not real dumb. not real dumb. richard, you know what's so fascinating, there are two threads coming together. over the past two years, post dobbs, we've heard a lot of people talking about how women have had their rights taken away, a right they had for 50 years, the right to make decisions over their own body. whether they were black or white, christian, muslim, jewish. whether they considered themselves pro-choice or pro-life. still, at the end of the day, if they had a complicated pregnancy -- >> a reproductive emergency. >> -- a reproductive emergency, they could make that choice to save their lives. >> right. >> they can't do that anymore. so you have that freedom that has been taken away. now, what donald trump promises at the end of this campaign is to take away other basic

freedoms. the freedom of speech. you look at nancy pelosi who has been critical of donald trump. now he's saying she's an enemy of the state. suggests that he can use the military, the national guard, to attack people who engage in political speech he does not like. at the same time, he is saying -- >> his generals, too. >> -- he is saying that he is going to go after cbs news. he said he was going to go after comcast. with cbs, he said his people said they're -- they're coming after our show specifically. with cbs, they didn't like how kamala harris' "60 minutes" interview was edited. they make decisions best for them. we have political speech with nancy pelosi and democrats called enemies of the state because he doesn't like what they say about him.

and we have first amendment rights, really sacrosanct in this country. the right for the media to be critical of politicians, to ask questions of politicians. he's promising. he is promising, these are his words, not mine, not yours, not "the new york times," not msnbc, not cbs, not nancy pelosi's. these are his words. he's promising, that just like he took away women's 50-year right to reproductive freedom, he's going to take away the right to criticize him, and he is going to take away the right of news programs to speak honestly about him. >> couple thoughts, joe. we've come a long way since ronald reagan's city on a hill, the shining city on a hill to america as a garbage can. i worked for reagan. you were in congress.

the idea you'd have a republican candidate so denigrate the united states, to me, is almost unimaginable. never thought we'd reach that point. the women's issue, one interesting question is whether there will be a closeted or secret women's vote in favor of kamala harris. you know, 2016, pollsters didn't pick up certain things that were maybe pro-trump. my hunch is, i can't prove it, but a lot of women aren't going to tell, particularly from conservative areas, that they're voting for kamala harris. >> i'll help you quickly, and then continue. in 2020, a lot of pro-trump votes were picked up. in 2022, a lot of pro-democratic votes weren't picked up. going in, and we're seeing it again here, it's hilarious because you know it's not true. you know the number is a lot higher, people are telling pollsters that only 6% are saying abortion is the top issue. that's what they said in 2022. exit polls showed it up in the mid 30s. post dobbs, reproductive rights

are undefeated. they're undefeated not only in liberal states. they're undefeated in states like kansas, in kentucky, and in wisconsin. it's not even close. >> one of the most interesting things about this election. i've had several meetings, you know, with well-known pollsters this week, and everyone is saying the race is too close to call. the other possibility is the race is too opaque to call. we don't necessarily know what is going on. the pollsters may not be picking up some important trends, important developments. we're all assuming we're not going to know the result until late the next day, maybe for days or weeks. maybe but maybe not. i think there's more unknowns. one last thought. you were talking about the enemy within, the criticism of the press and so forth. what's so interesting about this election is, normally, american presidential elections, and i'd defer to jon here, but to use the football analogy on the day of the world series, they take place between the 40 yard lines.

the differences are far more than the similarities. this is a difference. one of the two candidates is pretty much in the end zone. kamala harris represents, if you will, a degree, i think, of what's worked for this country over 75 years. >> madisonian democracy. >> yeah. jefferson belief, the jeffersonian belief. free press is essential to an informed citizenry. it was jefferson's insight to democracy. for the first time, we have a different strain representing one of the two major political parties. >> jonathan, quickly, i have to follow up on what richard said. i'm always telling people how brilliant richard is, aren't i? especially about the giants. >> so respectful. >> but he just really cut through the fog of polling. it's not too close to call. it's too opaque to call. right now, it's looking like black men and hispanic men and working class men may not be

going to harris as much as they have in the past elections. how do you weight that? right now, it looks like white voters with college educations are breaking in historic numbers toward kamala harris. we also saw -- i saw a poll yesterday, just a poll, but also showing that white americans without college degrees are actually about minus 6, minus 7, minus 8, breaking away from donald trump. still in the mid to high 20s, still a lot. again, we have, right now, we've got so many different groups shifting in so many different directions that, as richard said, this race is not too close to call. these shifts are too opaque to see for a basic poll that calls maybe 500 people. >> yeah, a senior democrat yesterday told me the phrase,

we're flying blind. pollsters have gotten it so wrong in recent years, as you noted. undercounting of trump's support in '16 and '20. undercounted democratic support in '20 and '22. each pollster is weighing things differently, and there's a sense some may be overweighted, oversamples. >> by the way, it wasn't just the 2022 midterms where everybody on the republican side was laughing and mocking joe biden for talking about apportion and democracy. and the red wave was coming. look at the kansas referendum. we were reporting here, every poll showed it was, like, a 50/50 split. you actually had the pro-life side winning, like, 51/49. ended up the pro-choice side winning 60/40. that's how opaque it is right now. >> coming out of the '22 midterms, the exit polls talked about how important abortion and democracy were. what's kamala harris closing on right now?

abortion and democracy. >> that's right. >> she's reviving those issues here for her finish. look, trump's name is on the ballot again. it wasn't in 2022. pollsters are taking that into account, as well. by their own admission, there's been honest confessions about this, pollsters aren't sure. neither are the campaigns. votes have started to come in. we'll know then. >> people trying to figure out who is ahead in the early voting in nevada right now, john ralston says it is looking good for republicans, but republicans are voting earlier right now. he said, i can't really tell because they may be, like you said yesterday, cannibalizing their day of voting. if these are new republicans, it's great news for donald trump. but, again, because they're shifting to early voting, people should be careful even looking at the early voting. we're flying blind there, as well. republicans, instead of donald trump saying don't vote early, don't mail in your vote, it's rigged, they've been really pushing hard. it's really the same thing with pennsylvania. democrats have a big advantage

right now in terms of voting. i think it's around 60/40. you don't know. you don't know where it ends up. >> all right. >> we're flying blind. speaking of, still ahead on "morning joe," more than one million voters in battleground pennsylvania have already cast their 2024 ballot. we're take a look at what the data says about which party is getting out the vote. plus, democratic congressman colin allred joins us to weigh in on the state of his highly watched race against republican senator ted cruz. this as vice president harris heads to texas tonight. the rnc's attempt to purge ineligible voters from state rolls, and how the gop's litigation strategy is largely failing. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back.

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i'm a lifelong republican and i voted for trump twice, is responsible for the but i can't do it again. trump wants a national sales tax on imported goods. it'll make everything more expensive for regular people, all while giving tax breaks to billionaires. you're rich as hell. we're going to give you tax cuts. kamala harris is for regular people. she wants a tax cut for 100 million americans, so we keep more of our hard-earned money. i'm a proud republican, but this year, i'm voting for kamala harris. ff pac is responsible for the content of this ad. we've got two weeks to go, and i'm very much grounded in the present in terms of the task at hand. we will deal with election night and the days after as they come, and we have the resources and the expertise and the focus on that, as well. >> so you have teams ready to go? are you thinking about that as a possibility? >> of course. this is a person, donald trump, who tried to undo a free and

fair election, who still denies the will of the people, who incited a violent mob to attack the united states capitol and 140 law enforcement officers were attacked, some were killed. this is a serious matter. the american people are, at this point, two weeks out, being presented with a very, very serious decision. about what will be the future of our country? >> vice president kamala harris speaking earlier this week with nbc's hallie jackson about the possibility of former president trump declaring victory on election night before all the votes come in. that comes amid multiple attempts by republican national committee to purge registered voters in at least two swing states. joining us now, former litigator and msnbc legal correspondent,

lisa rubin. you've been tracking ways republicans are attempting to swing the election in their favor. what have you learned, and how effective could they be? >> mika, what i have really been looking at is their affirmative litigation strategy. where are they bringing suit? we know right now, when we're looking at pre-election litigation, the vast majority of suits have been brought by republicans or republican affiliated entities as opposed to democrats. one of the things they're trying to do is just reduce the population of people who are eligible to vote, in ways that might surprise us. for example, some of the suits they're filing are against democratic secretary of states that they say are not complying with federal law that requires them to sort of go through their voter registration lists and take off ineligible voters. the only problem is, they can't identify who those ineligible voters are to begin with. all they say, for example, is, well, if you look at this county or that county, the rate of people registered relative to the adult population is impossibly high. that, courts have told them so

far, in nevada and michigan, that doesn't cut the mustard. the other thing that they're doing, and this is even more deeply offensive, is try and attack those who are spouses or adult children of overseas military members, whether current or former. >> wow. >> what they've said is, for example, if rev is my dad and i was born outside the country, we live outside the country, and the last place, for example, that rev voted was north carolina, they say i shouldn't be eligible to vote in north carolina because i was never a north carolina resident. not only is that contrary to north carolina law, but i'd also ask you, where is someone like that person supposed to vote? if your parent's last place of residence was in the united states as a particular state that's already made provisions for you to vote there, their they're trying to deprive you not just the right to vote in that state, but they're trying to leave you stateless and

nowhere to vote. courts denied that, too, mika. >> are they also trying to set up a scenario where they go in certain states, certain regions, targeting certain types of people by their nationality or their race or their gender, so that they have an argument after the fact if they claim that something was not properly done in terms of voting, to try and prolong a final count? even though they may appear to lose at this point, they appeal later, which can prolong -- we can end up like 2000, where we don't know for days who won because you have states going back and forth with the premise they're trying to establish now. >> i'm really glad you mentioned that. the object of some of these cases isn't really to win. it's to sow doubt about who is eligible to vote and almost preserve an argument for after the election, particularly if we find ourselves in a situation where there is a red mirage. you know donald trump complained bitterly in 2020 that states

where he appeared to be leading on election night ultimately, when absentee ballots were counted, particularly late absentee ballots that come in from people living overseas, you see that what looks like, for example, a lead for him in pennsylvania, ultimately became an 80,000 vote deficit. they're certainly trying to do both. some might describe this as sort of litigation by press release. again, not an attempt to succeed really for the sake of succeeding, but to be part of a larger strategy, to sowdoubt and confusion, and even slow things down to build momentum in time to create a narrative about cheating where no cheating exists, rev. >> what's the biggest challenge for democrats as far as you see it, coming from donald trump's attempts to disenfranchise voters? >> joe, such a good question. i think we don't know the biggest challenge. we don't know what the challenge is now. >> where they're going. >> correct.

every re-election cycle, we're introduced to new language, so to speak, about a different attempt to sway the election. in 2000, it was hanging chads. earlier, even in this cycle, we were talking about attempts to delay things in georgia. thanks to the georgia supreme court, it's been put to rest. i think we haven't yet seen the trend that will ultimately be the thing that is most contested in post-election litigation. when you ask folks, and certainly we've seen a memo that's been reported that was distributed by dana remis and others in the harris-walz campaign, what they keep telling folks internally and externally is they are prepared for every eventuality. they have almost like a marvel comics movie full of super lawyers with them to staff litigation in various states and partner with local lawyers who are expert in election codes in all these swing states, so they are not caught flat-footed. if you were to ask them that question, what is the problem that keeps you up at night, i

don't think anyone can idea what that problem is just now. that itself is the thing that keeps me up at night. >> yeah. msnbc legal correspondent lisa rubin, thank you very much. a lot of moving parts. coming up -- >> thank you, lisa. >> -- hillary clinton says kamala harris has one key thing going for her to avoid a repeat of what happened in 2016. we'll tell you what that is. plus, pablo torre is here with his world series predictions. >> oh boy. >> "morning joe" is back in a moment. >> do we have to really do this? >> pablo, i'm keeping this to time. ♪ i love l.a. ♪ what do we want more of? more laughs. more hang outs. yeah, more of all of this stuff. but getting older also means more risk of serious flu, covid-19, and rsv. vaccines lower your risk, so you can keep doing more.

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if you were not a pitcher, what would you be? >> the first thing that comes to mind is underwater basket weaving. hear we out. >> okay. >> play on words. i was definitely a water kid. then, you know, ear trouble, tubes, had to get out of that. now, i think i'd love to be a golfer. realistically, i would like to combine some type of drawing/i don't know. >> there you have it. there you have it. >> we didn't need to show that. >> ladies and gentlemen, your new york yankees. >> pablo. >> didn't feel entirely

necessary. >> pablo, what are you doing? >> why did we play that? it undermines the yankees. >> undermines the legend, right? >> pablo. >> willie. >> mika is staring at me, and i feel uncomfortable. asking why i'm here. maybe willie can help me justify the fact that the yankees, in fact, are in the world series, guys. that dude, willie, luke, thankfully, he is not professionally answering questions but professionally trying to close games. >> that's the yankees' closer, luke wieber. our answer yesterday. i don't quite understand what we said there, but let's focus on the real thing. the fall classic opens tonight in los angeles with the dodgers hosting the yankees in game one. the host of pablo torre finds out on meadowlark media, our good buddy, pablo. feels like it's been a month since the league championship ended. finally, the world series is here on friday night in los

angeles. cole and flaherty. >> this is the dream. for anybody who cares about baseball, not just these teams, but baseball specifically, this is the dream. it's a world series for casuals. these are the two biggest brands in a fragmented media economy. i always talk about the mono culture somehow when i'm with you guys. if you're drinking at home with the mono culture, you know, bingo game, sorry. look, this hasn't happened in 40 year. the reality is -- >> ay caramba. >> '81. >> when you think about -- >> great series. >> yes. the preemptive sense of history is palatable, actually. i say that as a fan of the game. this reminds me, with the potential of 2016 -- >> don't embarrass yourself. >> -- chicago cubs, 2004 red sox, like, the stuff that breaks through, because it's the yankees and dodgers, that's the potential here. yeah, if i can give a spoiler

alert, the yankees are, in fact, the better team. >> i will say, i will say, yeah, even in the '70s and the '80s, in the '50s, like, the dodgers and the yankees always broke through. whether it was the brooklyn dodgers and the yankees, the l.a. dodgers and the yankees. again, this is a dream, obviously, for the media, for whatever company is carrying this. who is carrying this? >> fox. >> it is, in fact, fox. >> yeah, just as we say about the nfl all the time, money just streaming through the vents. doesn't usually happen with baseball. pablo, you know, i'm on the streets with the kids. not my kids specifically, but the kids. they love "morning joe." >> yeah, the kids broadly. >> when i'm walking down the street with the kids, they're not asking me about, hey, who is going to win the election? they're saying, next time you see the guy in the chocolate

corduroy jacket. >> you noticed, deep chocolate. >> it is a deep, deep chocolate. >> i asked for the deepest chocolate at the store. >> not like the '70s deep purple. it is deep chocolate. >> a little smoke on the water. >> anyway, deep chocolate corduroy man, tell me, who is going to win the series and in how many games? >> go by star power, i'm going yankees in six. >> really? >> my fellow new york homer, richard, is next to me. if i'm talking about who i want to be in the documentary of this period in baseball, i want to be the person that says, shohei ohtani is the greatest thing we've ever seen, all caveats included. he was hurt, couldn't pitch, responded with an unprecedented offensive year. that's the reality of him. but when you look at the yankees' lineup, i mean, john. >> hard to disagree. >> juan soto, aaron judge, giancarlo stanton. >> who else?

>> who else do you need? >> the dodgers -- >> go through the first five batters. you need nine players, actually. >> the dodgers -- >> i mean, two of the three -- >> match that with shohei ohtani, mookie betts, and freddie freeman. tougher outs at the bottom of the lineup for the dodgers than the yankees. also, aaron judge is still not really hitting the playoffs. the other two certainly are. yankees had the edge in the starting. >> it's not close. >> dodgers have the edge in the bullpen. dodgers have home field. >> you know what is fun on the pitching staff stuff? it's fun to look at the projected rotations. gerrit cole for the yankees. flaherty for the dodgers tonight. it's bullpen for two of those games. i just don't like the bullpen era. not just because i think it is not fun to watch. >> let's remember who the yankees have as the closer. we saw the clip. >> hey, willie, i want to open this up to you and pablo.

let's talk about the weaknesses. i think the weakness for the dodgers is obvious. it is pitching. you as a yankees fan, die-hard yankees fan know this, the weakness for the yankees, at times, they go cold. they tighten up in playoffs. they choke. dodgers have been ding that in divisional series, as well, but there's an up and down quality to it. talk about that with the yankees. do you see anything in this playoff run that suggests they're past that? then the dodgers' weak pitching. >> well, you know, john is right, aaron judge hasn't hit well in the playoffs. huge home run in cleveland, and they ended up losing that game. but not much memorable for him in the playoffs. stanton steps up. torres, who we haven't mentioned, has been great in the second half of the season and the playoffs. they have enough fire power to cover for that, but they need in

the series against l.a., they need something out of judge. the bullpen has been shaky at times. luke wieber has come on strong late, but they've been through it with clay holmes, who was an all-star, but now he was moved to a different area of the bullpen. the bottom of the lineup isn't strong. as you said, the top of it is so strong. i like the yankees in seven. i mean, they're playing on the road. that's not great, not easy. i'm staying with my pick. yankees in seven. >> yes, can i just sound a note of optimism here? >> for the dodgers? >> sure. >> no, why would i do that? >> you're a homer. you cannot -- you can't separate yourself from the story. >> sometimes bias does have a tinge of homerism. this is objectivity. >> oh. >> this is objectivity. >> be objective about the yankees, go. >> when it comes to the teams that most recently have been

disappointing, i think we are underrating the ways in which the dodgers have not shown that they actually have the stuff to win. >> right. >> i believe that the dodgers have -- >> hey, hey, give him the "family man" paper bag approved by don cheadle. relax. i've been told we have to go, meaning we have one minute. >> it doesn't. it means we have to go. >> i want you to take me through the rams/viking games. rams losing their second in a row, good team. you say one of the worst calls you've ever seen. >> absolutely. vikings are trying to come back, two minutes left, down eight. one-score game. they can technically do it with a two-point conversion. this happens. what you'll see here is what the referees did not, which is, a brutal shake pass right in front of them. >> how didn't you see that? >> i don't want to come on any national program like this one and just complain about the officials, but this is egregious. >> how do you not see that? >> egregious. the thing about this, if i can

make a campaign stump speech, this should be reviewable. we live in a system of rules where you can't review a face mask? mika has to hear me talk about the nfl for an extra minute or two or three or four, depending on how long it can fiibuster until he cuts me off. >> ever see "family man," nicholas cage? >> i was born in 1985. should i have seen "family man"? >> pablo, thank you. >> there is a blind spot culturally about this. we're going to just -- >> i've seen "national treasure." >> "scream"? >> "conair." >> "the rock." >> people say, stop bringing up constitutional documents. >> there is a treasure map on the back of the declaration of independence! >> host of "pablo torre finds

out." >> i can't help you help yourself. >> "family man" came out in 2000. meadowlark media, pablo torre, thank you so much. >> you're unhelpable. >> public service announcement, "family man" showing on netflix. we're going to move past that and dive into eugene robinson's piece, "the double standard for harris and trump has reached a breaking point." gene joins us to explain what he means by that. plus, democratic congressman collin allred of texas and jamie raskin joins us this morning. "morning joe" will be right back. thursday. help fuel today with boost high protein, complete nutrition you need, and the flavor you love. so, here's to now... now available: boost max! my moderate to severe crohn's disease...

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with custom gear. we love how custom ink takes care of everything we need so we can focus on the kids. we make it easy to wow all your groups with high quality custom apparel, accessories, and promo products, all backed by our guarantee at customink.com. position in 2016, at this point in that race, looking at where we are 12 days out, polling averages in 2016 at this time had you on pace for a bigger win than president obama had had four years before. of course, you know better than anyone how those next 12 days went. what do you think vice president harris needs to do, in your view, to avoid a repeat? >> well, first of all, i don't think she has jim comey in the wings waiting to kneecap her, so that's good. i'm very grateful for that. >> former secretary of state hillary clinton with that answer last night on cnn. welcome back to "morning joe." it is friday, october 25th.

jonathan lemire, reverend al sharpton, and jon meacham are all still with us. joining the conversation, we have msnbc political analyst elise jordan. she is the former aide to george w. bush and his white house and state department. and host of the podcast "on brand with donny deutsch," donny deutsch. also with us, pulitzer prize winning columnist and associate editor of "the washington post," eugene robinson is with us this morning. good to have you all. hillary clinton giving a bit of a dynamic shift for this time around. at least so far. gene, your latest piece for "the washington post" is entitled "the double standard for harris and trump has reached a breaking point." in it, you write, quote, "somehow, it is apparently baked into this campaign that trump is allowed to talk and act like a complete lunatic, while harris has to be perfect in every way. i don't know the answer to the chicken or egg question, whether media coverage is leading public

perception or vice versa. but the disparate treatment is glaring. let's review. first, harris was criticized for not doing enough interviews, so she did multiple interviews where she was asked questions that held her accountable." i'm adding that. "including with non-traditional media. she was criticized for not doing hostile interviews, so she went toe to toe with bret baier on fox news. she was criticized as being comfortable only at scripted rallies, so she did unscripted events, such as the town hall on wednesday. along the way, she wiped the floor with trump during their televised debate. the only one they had because he won't debate again. trump, meanwhile, stands before his maga crowds and spews nonstop lies, ominous threats, impossible promises, and utter gibberish. his rhetoric is dismissed, or

looked past, without first being interrogated." >> gene, chicken or the egg, i mean, who is to blame here? >> so right. >> you asked the question. i will say, the media nine years in still don't know how to cover this guy because he says outrageous things every night. the papers just pass by him. i mean, you look, the papers, even after he said, "i'm going to put the national guard and the military after my democratic opponents, enemies of the state." >> mm-hmm. >> any other time, any other presidential election, that would have been banner headlines in "the new york times," "the washington post," "the wall street journal." none of them. none of them had it on the front page. >> yeah, and that's kind of shocking. look, you're absolutely right. we have not collectively learned how to cover donald trump over

the last ten years. some of us have, but a lot of us haven't. and so that's definitely a factor. but it is also true that when the media do cover, some just inescapable excess of trump. i talk to people or hear from people on the republican side who have read it, who have heard it, who know all about it, and they just shrug. it's not that nothing is sinking in. it's not that nothing is going out there about trump. that's why i'm not fully ready to say it's all the media's fault. i don't think you can say it's going to be the fault of "the new york times" if donald trump wins. i think there's a lot of guilt to go around.

but i wrote that column on wednesday, and i wrote it because, in the morning, i was listening to the audio of michael schmidt's interview with general kelly, donald trump's longest serving chief of staff, his closest aide in the white house, telling us how trump was a literal fascist. textbook definition of fascist. how he admired hitler. how he wanted to be a dictator. this is the guy who worked for him for a year and a half and is telling us, without being partisan about it, you know, it's flashing red lights and blazing sirens about voting for donald trump again and giving him that power again. then, that night, vice president harris does a town hall on cnn, and for good reason in my

opinion, she answers a lot of questions with that kind of criticism of donald trump. he is a fascist. you can't vote for this guy. we have a choice here. we need to make the right choice. afterwards, and the next day, i hear and i read all this about, well, did she close the deal? was she specific enough here or there? this is an existential question, people. it's just not the same thing. they're not being covered in the same way remotely. i think not being covered in a fair way. >> last night, donald trump calling the united states of america, quote, a garbage can, just to add to the rhetoric there. so, jon meacham, we have reached a strange, extraordinary, perhaps dark place, when we can get this big piece from "the atlantic" and jeffrey goldberg, and we can hear directly from general kelly talking to michael schmidt of "the new york times"

about his admiration for generals of the nazi army. why can't my generals be more like hitler's generals, denigrating veterans, denigrating service members who died, things like that. we talk to a lot of the similar people who like donald trump, and they say, he can't mean that. that's trump being trump. he's blowing off steam. there's always some excuse, some landing place they give him, and perhaps themselves to be able to put their heads down and march through it. >> that's exactly it. you know, vice president harris isn't on trial here in the same way president biden wasn't on trial when he was running. we are. the american people are on trial. and if we choose, if a sufficient number of us in a sufficient number of states choose to ignore the evidence that, as the bible says, those with eyes to see and ears to hear can detect, then there's

no -- we have no excuse. we might have an explanation, which is that for a series of reasons, people are not holding the republican party and the nominee of that party to rational account. and i think that this is a test of citizenship in a way that, certainly, you'd have to go back, i think, to both the 19th century and the civil rights era to find anything equivalent. i think gene is exactly right. in that the conventional media conversation just isn't commensurate and hasn't been for a long time to this election. this is not bob doll and george mitchell duking it out with bob novak. that's like talking about the

pelopanisian war. we have to lament it, but what we have to do, i think, is insist that if you believe in what you say you believe, and everybody we know, willie, everybody we know believes that they're constitutionalists, they're americans. they believe in the country. well, if you believe that, if that's what you say you believe, patriotism is not nationalism, trump is a nationalist. nationalism is loyalty to your own kind, to people who look likeexactly like you. >> thomas jefferson put it in the constitution, and we've tried to realize it a little

more through the years. that's been the conversation in america. and the conversation could take a radical, risky, and possibly irreversible turn if we don't pay attention. >> thank you, jon, as always. so eloquent and such an important message. by the way, if you had peloponnesian war on your bingo ticket this morning, as far as jon meacham, you can check that off. harper's ferry will be the final for many people, many ticket holders. you can, of course, shout "bingo," and we will send you a $1 million check from elon musk. >> thank you. >> jon meacham, as always, thank you so much. >> thank you, meacham. >> very, very important words. very important words. vice president kamala harris held a rally last night in georgia, where she appeared side by side for the first time with former president barack obama. the crowd of 23,000 people, the

largest of her campaign, also heard from tyler perry and bruce springsteen. ♪ driving all night chasing the sun mirage ♪ ♪ well, pretty soon, darling i'm going to take charge ♪ ♪ the dogs on main street howl because they understand ♪ ♪ if i could take one moment into my hands ♪ ♪ mister, i ain't a boy no, i'm a man ♪ ♪ and i believe in the promise land ♪ >> hear something about the american dream, fort mcpherson was once a confederate army base, where there were confederate soldiers trying to plot and plan on how to keep 3.9 million negros in place.

now, that land is owned by me. >> you ask donald trump what he is going to do to make health care more affordable. his only answer is, end obamacare. end the affordable care act. he doesn't really know why he wants to end it, except for the fact that i passed it. the problem he's got now is that it's popular. because 50 million people have gotten health care because of it. so couple weeks ago, you remember during the vice presidential debate, his running mate had the nerve to say that donald trump, quote, salvaged the affordable care act. donald trump spent his entire presidency trying to tear that thing down. and he couldn't even do that right.

now, eight years after he was elected, when he was asked, well, what are you going to do? he says, well, i've got concepts of a plan. >> before i was vice president of the united states, before i was the united states senator, and before that, a two-term attorney general for the state of california, and before that, a district attorney in a courtroom as prosecutor, i took on predators, fraudsters, and repeat offenders. i took them on, and i won. well, georgia, in 12 days, it's donald trump's turn! women have died because of these bans. including a young mother of a 6-year-old son right here in georgia. her family is here with us

tonight, and we speak her name, amber nicole thurmond. and you all have heard me say, look, i do believe donald trump to be an un-serious man. and the consequences of him ever being president again are brutally serious. these are just some of the consequences of the trump abortion ban and what he does and what he is likely to do. >> donny, it was a sta-studded appearance for the vice president outside of atlanta. must-win there. she'll be joined by beyonce this evening in texas. she has a to-do list for the american people while trump is just for himself. also dwelling there a bit on abortion rights and reproductive health care. contrast with what we're hearing

from donald trump, donny, in these last days. his closing argument is about calling america a garbage can, and his top surrogate, elon musk, according to blockbuster reporting from "the wall street journal" last night, he's been in frequent contact with put putin since the invasion of ukraine. >> i'll repeat what meacham said at this point. we can't keep saying it. i mean, we will keep saying it, but it's on us. if people are going to accept this, then it's on us. she talked about consequences. we around this table all believe that we're heading to fascism. the problem is, if we're right, you don't get a do-over. >> that's right. >> i hear people going, oh, it's not going to be that bad. it's only four years. has there been anytime in history where a democracy has no longer been a democracy, then they go, oh, no -- like in russia, are they going to vote putin out? in hungary, are they voting orban out?

people don't understand, there is no do-overs here. >> the harris campaign has a huge challenge here, and anybody who loves living in a free society has a big challenge here. how to explain to a fellow american, someone you love, that is a good person, explain that freedom isn't free. this comfort we've been living with. >> that they take for granted at this point. >> when it goes away, the consequences continue into eternity. and on everybody, democratic or republican. that's when i come back to women. i come back to women because we know we need to turn out. we need to turn out even when it looks bleak. we know to fight through the hardest of times. we're living them right now, if you can believe it. 50 years of rights taken away, and our daughters, our isters, our mother, and ourselves need the life-saving health care, and we're not getting it. kamala harris talked about a woman who died because of trump-era policies and the

overturning of roe, which he warned us about and then did. he warned us, and then he did it. nobody knows more the consequences of what that feels like than women who are left to bleed out in parking lots, women who have babies or fetuses in their bodies that could kill them, and they're sent to another state. or women who have babies that are completely unviable, income batable with life, but they're forced to bring them to term, deliver them the color blue, and watch their gasp for air. then, some women in those situations sterilized, to never be able to have babies again, because of what they went through. even simple life-saving procedures are not available. and it's not the women who don't have the choice to get these procedures. it's the doctors who are not allowed to do them. these doctors are traumatized, as well. they want to do what their oath

is, to preserve the life of the person in front of them. >> it's savage, it really is. >> it's sasavage. >> savage, some of the laws that have been put in place where women can't be given life-saving care. rev, this is, as we go down to the wire, this is a close race. it's also -- you and elise have both said, it's going to be a tough last week and a half, especially in places like michigan. >> it's going to be very tough. as i said earlier, i was in michigan yesterday, four cities. the thing that occurred to me, joe, and it brought back to mind when mika was talking, is the reason i think a lot of young voters, particularly young black male voters, have a different view is they never experienced the bias and the institutional

neglect that some of the older ones have. when you're talking to young women, they never knew a time until now they couldn't have the right to choose. talking to young black men, well, they grew up at a time when obama was president. saying having a black president doesn't mean as much to them as me. they weren't there. i was raised by parents who suffered jim crow. they were raised by parents who were getting jobs in corporations. a lot of it is that they haven't lived the life that we're saying is possible because it was never possible in their life. >> can't comprehend it. >> elise, what are you hearing out of michigan, your reporting? >> you know, i spoke to a canvasser who was a little dismal about enthusiasm level in michigan that he was seeing. you know, it's such a contrast coming out of july. we were in wisconsin doing the focus groups, and the energy right after kamala harris was the nominee -- >> what changed? >> coupled president trump energy.

now, i think democrats have done a great job on abortion, making it about basic human rights for women. >> tangible. >> you look at cultural issues, how the trump campaign shifted their ads from an economic focus to an anti-trans ad they run during football games in wisconsin and everywhere. >> it's a lie. >> there's no reason tammy baldwin should be down, that her numbers should be dropping in wisconsin. she's a very popular senator who has done good things in the state. she's running against an outsider from orange county. the trans ad has had impact. >> you're hearing that from the canvasser. >> yes. >> we talked about this earlier. they run that 30,000 times during football games. it's having an impact. the campaign is blind to it. they're blind to it. i don't know in they think they're too good to respond to

an'd. an ad. >> i spoke to a wisconsin operative who knows the state well, who was surprised at how many days it's taken to be any response to that ad. that ad is hitting a cultural, just pressure point. >> anger point. >> just with men, with black men, with hispanic men, with men who really, the trump campaign, it's been their strategy all along to get those men. >> that's been the trump policy, the transgender surgeries for prisoners is trump policy. >> that's the crazy thing, that's a trump policy. we had rick wilson with the lincoln project on. they actually, unlike the democrats, ran an ad on this that's chasing off a lot of black men, hispanic men, white working class men in wisconsin and michigan and pennsylvania, and how they're not picking that up with their canvassing, how they're not picking that up in their numbers is beyond me. here's the lincoln project ad

that actually sets the record straight. >> have you seen this ad? donald trump is spending millions attacking kamala harris on a desperate lie. taxpayer-funded sex changes for prisoners and illegal aliens is a trump administration policy. he is attacking kamala harris for his own record. and he thinks you're too dumb to get it. he's gaslighting america. because trump is for he/him. kamala is for us. >> that's something, if they had been running alongside of the 30,000 misleading ads that lie about kamala harris when it is actually a donald trump policy, pushed by donald trump's director of bureau of prisons, pushed by the justice department, spelling out the policy about gender-affirming care for inmates from the trump

era, then, you know, this would have been answered. people canvassing wouldn't be hearing this over and over again. rev, i'll let donny answer, but i'd love you to follow up. this is an issue with black men. this is an issue with hispanic men. this is an issue with working class men. is this michael dukakis mowing his lawn in the summer of '88, completely blind to a cultural issue? because some people in the campaign are just so liberal? >> no. look, they didn't respond. as your point is, this is a trump policy, and it is one out of 338 million people, this example. >> one out of 338 million people. >> it's a sign that, do you think the world is upside down? may not be about this, but do you think the world is upside down? >> by the way, the way bill maher said this past weekend, he said, this is a great ad. it challenges kamala harris to say, yes, there are some crazy things that my base want me to do that i will not do.

>> yeah. >> again, the crazy thing is, this isn't a harris policy. it is a trump policy. that gives you a chance to say, you say i'm liberal. >> right. >> donald trump had his justice department support gender-affirming care for inmates, and he wanted you to pay for it. >> yeah, no counter punching. but there are very few issues -- i mentioned 338 million -- that 338 million would agree on. one is we shouldn't be paying for gender surgery for prisoners. it is a universal thing. wait a second, somebody broke the law and we're paying for this? i don't care whether you're liberal or conservative, i don't think most people think that's a good thing. if you don't counter punch that, you get blanketed with the whole thing. >> i think that's where the counterpunch becomes absolutely mandatory. because when you don't address it, then you become guilty because you didn't address it. >> right. >> if you have this elitist attitude, well, people won't

believe that, it's nonsense, people on the ground will believe what they see over and over again as a commercial on a football game. and people are concerned about that. whether you are on one side of the issue or not, you grab a softball up the middle. trump did that. i didn't. trump is the one that dealt with this -- in terms of this gender question. make him the liar, and identify him with his policy. you get stuck with it because you didn't respond. by not responding, you affirm him. >> yeah, he who does not deny admits, goes the old saying. >> donny deutsch, thank you. >> before we go, can i comment gene robinson in the turtleneck? so on point. >> thank you, donny. >> okay. we can do that. seems like -- all right. >> better than pablo's corduroy.

>> pablo can wear that. you cannot. >> no, no. >> i've seen you wear something like that. it's too bulky. >> why don't you tell me to wear a baby blue leisure suit. >> i found one. it was a while ago. it doesn't work. >> we'll be reading eugene's piece in "the washington post." ahead on "morning joe," donald trump refused to commit to a smooth presidential transition. congressman jamie raskin joins us on that. before we go to break, willie, jack wants to know, what do you have planned for "sunday today?" >> before i get to jack, if we're giving out awards, donny in the double breasted blazer, strong. a lot of nice stuff on the set today. very nice, donny. very nice. meanwhile, coming up on "sunday today" on nbc this weekend, my guest is one of the brightest young stars in all of music. she is kelsea ballerini. country star in nashville who

has crossed over, kind of in the mold of taylor swift, to mainstream success. her new album is "patterns." sold out madison square garden. great conversation with kelsea ballerini this weekend on "sunday today" over on nbc. we'll be right back here on "morning joe." virus that causes shingles is sleeping... in 99% of people over 50. it's lying dormant, waiting... and could reactivate. shingles strikes as a painful, blistering rash that can last for weeks. and it could wake at any time. think you're not at risk for shingles? it's time to wake up. because shingles could wake up in you. if you're over 50, talk to your doctor or pharmacist about shingles prevention. every member of the military is tested for mental fitness except the commander in chief, who has the most

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will you commit to respecting a smooth transfer of power? >> you had a peaceful transfer of power. >> you had a -- come on, president trump, you had a peaceful transfer of power compared to venezuela. >> people were angry. people were there. i'll tell you what, they never show that, the primary scene in washington was hundreds of thousands, the largest group of people i've ever spoken to before. it was love and peace. and some people went to the capitol. a lot of strange things happened there. a lot of strange things. >> love and peace on january 6th. that was former president trump earlier this month, avoiding a question on whether he'd commit to a peaceful transfer of power. in fact, lying and saying there was one last night. this as a new letter from congress and jamie raskin of maryland reveals the trump campaign this time has not signed off on an agreement with the federal government on a transition process if he wins

the election. congressman raskin joins us now. he is ranking member of the house oversight committee. congressman, thanks for being with us. for people who don't quite know what this tradition is, this norm is in our government, what is this document that you would have expected the trump campaign to participate in? >> well, no president has ever broken from this precedent of participating in the presidential act, signing a memorandum, understanding with the government and president to ease the outgoing process. there's 75 days between the election and inauguration. there are 430 federal departments and agencies and a workforce of 2.3 million people. so there are a lot of technical and structural and personnel issues that both major parties are invited to start working on, knowing that one of them is

going to win the election. trump and his campaign have simply refused to enter into the mou with the federal government, or to sign one with president biden in order to ease the transition and make this work. on the contrary, all we get really is what project 2025 tells us, which is that they want to abolish the department of education. they want to abolish head start. they want to ban the use of the words climate change in the federal government. so on and so on. troubling moment for us when you think of the u.s. government as the structural entity we depend on for so many rights, benefits, and operations in the country. >> congressman, good morning. it occurs to us here that a phrase we haven't heard much of the last couple months is biden crime family. seemed to have disappeared from the headlines just as president biden abandoned his re-election bid. certainly would suggest some political motivations behind it. can you tell us if you've had

conversations from your counterpart, comer, about this? where do things stand? was this a stunt? >> yeah, they've completely dropped that. i mean, you know, they said this was a world, historical emergency with the biden crime family. of course, it was all about the election. now, they're talking about, you know, -- i mean, i don't know what they're off onto this week. it might be the transgender stuff, who knows? anything to throw sand in the gears and smoke in the air. they have no plan for actually taking over the u.s. government and making it work. but they want to shut down large parts of the u.s. government, and then what they would like to do is begin to deport 10 or 12 million people and fundamentally change the character of american government and american society.

so it's a profoundly troubling moment when you look at the real functions of the u.s. government. the environmental protection agency, noaa, the nih, department of defense. these guys are in league with vladimir putin and viktor orban, and they'd fundamentally change what the nature of the democratic project is in america. >> congressman, senate, tough seats are up for grabs there. democrats really have dismal prospects. how about the house? how are you feeling about the house? is there any hope that democrats could win back the house? >> well, yeah. i've been out to 27 states now. i see tremendous enthusiasm and surge of volunteers and action on the ground all over the country. with my friend sue altman in new jersey, she needs a few more resources to get over the top.

derek tran in california. democrats across the country are surging at the local level. a lot of the propaganda and disinformation that are operating in the national campaign are not affecting what's happening at the local level. there, i think, all of the grassroots energy that the democrats have galvanized is working to push people ahead. we are depending on our friends in the national campaign and the media to counter this wall of propaganda and disinformation that is coming down on the democratic ticket. >> ranking member of the house oversight committee, congressman jamie raskin, thank you. thank you for warning about the potential dangers to a peaceful transition of power. we appreciate it. good to have you. >> you bet. this year's brics summit wrapped up yesterday in russia. the organization, brics, takes its name from some of the

largest countries it is comprised of. brazil, russia, india, china, and south africa. the summit is where nbc news chief international correspondent keir simmons spent the week, and he joins us now from moscow. keir, what was some of the prevailing issues being discussed there? >> reporter: well, mika, look, russia, of course, in the past few years has become an increasingly dangerous place, but even by russian standards, this has been a geopolitically dangerous week. you mentioned the brics summit. we've seen president putin standing alongside president xi of china, president of iran. not just american adversaries but american partners and allies, like sisi of egypt, like erdogan of turkey, the uae, modi of india, all standing together and meeting together, shaking hands with president putin,

smiling. for president putin, it's been a week where he has attempted to rehabilitate himself, to put himself back on the international stage, on the world stage. not just that. because while that was happening this week, the u.s. confirming that it says there are more than 3,000 north korean troops here in russia now. south korean officials, according to reports, are set to brief nato next week about those reports of north korean troops here in russia. u.s. officials worrying not just about that, but about what president putin might have promised kim jong-un of north korea in exchange. what threat that may pose to u.s. allies in asia, like south korea and like japan. mika, you say, rightly, as we were at the conference, we had the opportunity to question president putin at a news conference about that, the

reports of the deployment of north korean troops and the danger of that here in russia. this is what he had to say. >> mr. president, keir simmons from nbc news. mr. president, satellite images are said to show north korean troops here in russia. what are they doing here? wouldn't that be a massive escalation in the ukraine war? and, mr. president, we are weeks away from the u.s. election. russia, again, is accused of interfering, and you have had private conversations with former president trump. have you been speaking with him, and what have you been saying? >> translator: now, as for our interaction, relationship with the north, with north korea, you know, we ratified our treaty on strategic partnership which contains article iv. we have never doubted the fact that north korean leadership is very serious about their

commitments to us and engagement with us. as for how we do and what we do, it's up to us to decide under article iv of this treaty first. we need to hold the relevant talks about implementing article iv of the treaty of strategic partnership with north korea. we're in contact with our friends from north korea. we'll see how this develops. now, as to my contacts with mr. trump, well, this is the thing, it's been discussed, rumors for many years now. moldova. first, there were accusations that there had been some alleged ties between trump and russia, but then there was an internal inquiry in the u.s., probably the u.s. congress, if i'm not mistaken. the conclusion they arrived at is that it was all nonsense,

nothing like that had ever taken place, nor is anything like this taking place right now. now, as for how the russia-u.s. relations are going to be constructed after the election, it is first and foremost up to the u.s. if the u.s. is open to us building a normal, healthy relations with russia, then we will do the same. if you don't want that, it's up to them. but it'll be the choice of the future administration. >> reporter: mika, there is another report, there's another report this morning that elon musk has been in regular contact with president putin. that's according to "the wall street journal," citing current and former u.s., european, and russian officials. mika, the kremlin reacting this morning to that report, saying it's an absolute lie. saying in a statement, there's only one telephone call between elon musk and president putin about space and future tech. nbc news reached out to elon musk's office for comment overnight. just to go back to the response from president putin, mika, what

he was citing there was a strategic agreement between russia and north korea, that they'd come to each other's aid if they were attacked. that is what's really got officials concerned. there are so many concerning issues, but that particular piece. what does that mean if kim jong-un felt threatened, went on the offensive, for example towards south korea? what role would russia play? what does it mean for asia and the u.s. allies in asia? >> nbc's keir simmons reporting live from moscow, thank you very much for coming on the show this morning. thank you for your reporting. we appreciate it. so let's talk about this. couple of things. first of all, the north korean troops joining the russians on the battlefield is just unprecedented. there's a lot of questions about it. i was watching admiral kirby during the press briefing yesterday, who, you know, talked about the challenges, even of

the execution of them working together, the language barrier, and just sort of how some of it didn't, on the face of it, from the very -- you know, from the first point of hearing about this, doesn't make a lot of sense. perhaps even showing a sign of weakness. but i'd also like to ask you what you're hearing about this connection between elon musk and vladimir putin, given that trump, there is reporting, is talking with putin. >> right. first -- >> had many conversations with him. >> first, it's not clear what tangible difference it'll have on the battlefield, but it is an example of the strengthening ties between russia and north korea, some of the other dictatorships. as for elon musk, it is sort of a stunning revelation. "the wall street journal" says that there's been multiple phone conversations, all taking place since late 2022, ie, after russia's invasion of ukraine. elon musk, his companies have significant department of defense contracts, yet he's

talking to a sworn enemy of the united states. not only that, a sworn enemy of the united states who has been conclusively proven to have interfered in american elections. elon musk is, right now, donald trump's top surrogate, controlling information on twitter/x, and being out there, giving out money to get people to register to vote and, therefore, vote for donald trump. it is just an extraordinary, un-american development. >> it's an extraordinary development to have a huge american contractor who is collecting millions and billions from the american government actively campaigning for a presidential candidate. that seems unprecedented. i can't think of a military contractor who has really put skin in the game the way elon musk has. >> i wonder about american voters and i think many, you know, just tapping into the election, so busy, have so much going on in their lives. this may be in that category of horrific realities they can't comprehend right now.

no judgment at all. but i do wonder about members of the military, veterans. i do think that this type of news may be a little too much. because it's yet another way that donald trump is proving that he has no respect for members of our military. zero respect and even nasty, degrading things to say for people who have died for our country. so stories like this coming out could kind of penetrate the mindset of people connected with our military, our veterans. up next, with less than two weeks until election day, "vanity fair's" molly jong-fast argues kamala harris is not repeating the mistakes of 2016. she'll join us to explain that. plus, democratic congressman collin allred of texas will be a guest to discuss his race

against republican incumbent senator, ted cruz. also ahead, grammy nominated singer and actress nicole scherzinger joins us in studio. she stars in a revival of andrew lloyd webber's "sunset boulevard" and delivers a stunning performance. "morning joe" will be right back. what does searching for a medicare plan feel like? it's kind of confusing. it's so complicated. it's a pain. it's daunting. it's really difficult. it's daunting. ehealth is a less stressful way to find health insurance to prove it. we found people looking for a new medicare plan, and we monitored everyone's stress.

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think about what's happened in our country. the level of vicious, vitriolic attack -- you know, when donald trump says that his political opponents are the enemy within, and when he contemplates deploying force against them, the response that we all have should not be to be so afraid we don't act. it should be, vote him out. defeat him. defeat him. [ applause ] vote for vice president harris. >> that was vice president kamala harris and lifelong republican liz cheney campaigning together earlier this week in battleground michigan. it was really incredible to watch these two cross party lines. extremely divisive party lines,

to preserve and protect the constitution and celebrate what they have in common, which in this case, is love of country. another thing they have in common? each was honored in the "forbes" know your value 50 over 50 list. here to discuss the vice chair of "forbes," huma abedin and executive vice president in chief, fran catsutas. after seeing liz and kamala, i decided -- i'd already been there. 60 is the new 40. 60 is the new 40. so huma -- >> would that make me 20? >> exactly. but it is. i'm telling you. in every way, especially with health care and science catching up. so huma, how do you -- first of all, i you want to know your mindset watching these two women on stage campaigning together, especially considering the community that we celebrate. >> well, you know, in the

context of our list, you think about the 50 over 50 list which m mika, you started. it's women who are changing their careers, pivoting, doing different things, and who would have thought it would be two women who are going to be saving our democracy? that's part of this conversation. i mean, to go from a time that i remember in the '90s where you could have different opinions and come together and solve problems, it is going to take these two women doing these very -- having these very courageous, difficult conversations because it's not about having different political perspectives. it's about defending our constitution, which is ultimately i found really inspiring and encouraging. >> i look forward to the luncheon today. we're going to be celebrating our honorees at this really kind of pivotal moment in history. current and former honorees. we're going to have brooke shields and suzy ormond, and fran, you're coming. you're a supporter. you have been here for over 25 years. that's most of your career. >> that's right. >> and in terms of personal experience, what do you think

the most significant gains have been in our generation for women, and if you want to add the most concerning challenges i could add with that, if you wanted to. >> so you know, when i look back on 25 years, it's fascinating because where i started in the company was at the entry level. i was a contact center agent, and i remember how i felt treated by the company which was really positive, and what it came down to is leadership, and i think for so many of the conversations we're having, we're really talking about the leadership and does someone early in their career, someone that doesn't have a ton of experience, do they seem -- do they feel seen? do they feel like they can have impact, that they're valued? and so i would say that was a pretty amazing starting point, but then i look back and i remember, and i think it was, like, 12 years ago. i happened to be at an executive

leadership offsite, and there were two meetings and there wasn't a single woman on stage. >> mm-hmm. >> and i remember it made me stop and ask, is this the right place for me? and it's just a reminder how important it is for us across every industry, every forum, to see women in leadership positions, and to know that it's possible, and i fast forward, you know, chuck robbins, our leadership has been 50/50 men and women, which is so very important, and i think tells people that it's possible, and i would say, mika, we always have more work to do, but you start first with the understanding that you want to have full participation. you want people to feel like they're seen and they're heard, and with that, i think you can do so much. >> that's how you lead. huma, the luncheon, it's sort of the beginning. it's our kickoff to our countdown to international women's day, and it seems to me the power in this community is

more vital than ever before, especially given the health of women right now is being severely impacted by the fall of roe in ways that i think even some republican women were surprised. i think we've never seen it. we have women in dire circumstances. so talk a little bit about the luncheon today, but overall the countdown to international women's day that we are doing as a community, how it's probably even more vital than ever. >> you know, the women that you gather in this room are women who most of us have never heard of. we should know each and over one of their stories. we're going to have democrats and republicans in the room. >> of course. >> this is not partisan, but these are about women's stories and lives, about protecting women's health care, everything that's at risk, and showing that there are women that are doing different things in their lives, leading up to international women's day, celebrating -- we're looking forward to going back to abu dhabi in march to champion what these women do,

and we're hearing them at a global level, but the women in the room today are leading the way, and we need those voices and their work now more than ever. >> fran, your best piece of advice to give to a woman at this moment in time, what would it be? >> i would say my best piece of advice is we are our best when we are speaking our truth, when we are passionate. i think it's so easy to feel like we're on our heels in so many ways, and i think -- >> yeah. >> using our voice is, i think, how we find that balance and to feel like we're participating. >> we are using our voices. that is for sure. huma abedin, and fran. we will continue this with actress, ceo, and union leader, brooke shields. also ahead, we'll turn back to the race for the white house with a recap from the campaign trail. one candidate held a huge rally with high-profile celebrities. the other, trashed america.

literally said america is a garbage can, and bragged about being friends with an autocrat. we're back in one minute. being friends with an autocrat we're back in one minute san francisco's leadership is failing us. that's why mark farrell is endorsing prop d. because we need to tackle our drug and homelessness crisis just like mark did as our interim mayor. mark farrell endorsing prop d, to bring the changes we need for the city we love.

san francisco's leadership is failing us. that's why mark farrell is endorsing prop d. because we need to tackle our drug and homelessness crisis just like mark did as our interim mayor. mark farrell endorsing prop d, to bring the changes we need for the city we love. name. i call him agent orange. >> she's running to be the 47th president of the united states. donald trump is running to be an american tyrant. >> i watched him from the central park five to project

2025, and what i realize is that in this donald trump america, there is no dream that looks like me. ♪♪ all right. good morning. those were the high-profile celebrities who appeared last night outside of atlanta for kamala harris, a rally which also included former president obama. donald trump meanwhile, was in two swing states out west disparaging america and praising an autocrat. i think he said america is a garbage can. >> so this is what i never really understood, you know, all these republicans that used to be conservatives are all -- we're always talking about, oh, you don't love america. you don't love america. there's never in the history of the united states of america, since the confederacy of course, been a president or a candidate for president that has trashed

america as much as donald trump, constantly trashes america. if he's in power, it's great again. if he's out of power, it's a garbage can, and kamala harris has been saying time and time again, she loves america. she believes inmika, it's reall crazy. >> it's interesting, often we talk about how some of the people who are still shilling for donald trump and republican leaders in congress who still stand by him, and yet you hear trump in the past day or so absolutely just ripping to shreds his former generals, the people he hired. so if he brings you in, make no mistake. he will turn on you too, along -- yeah. >> i was just going to say, and willie, the crazy thing is again, these people that used to be flag wavers for america, now will wave their trump flags. they sit back and smile and will vote for a guy that disparages the united states of america

constantly, says he's going to arrest his political opponents, and disparages generals who have given their entire lives for this country. i guess -- i guess again, we shouldn't be shocked because of course, he disparaged john mccain, said he wasn't a war hero because he got shot down. so this has been a long time coming. i don't think i ever expected him to be as disrespectful -- >> yeah. it's hateful. >> -- of military members, of generals, of admirals, and of those who gave their life in defense of this country. >> yeah, in donald trump's eyes, being a patriot, a term his used and his supporters use, being a patriot means supporting him and doing what he thinks is right. it has nothing to do with the country or the constitution. it has to do with donald trump. >> right. >> yesterday calling america a garbage can, he's called america a hell hole, a third world country. it brings to mind the line that pennsylvania governor josh

shapiro likes to use a lot, which is hey, donald trump. stop s-talking america. what is it about us that you think is to terrible? kamala harris seized on this, first at the convention, and then this. patriotism has been reclaimed. we support freedom. we support the constitution, not donald trump, and i think the good news is i think most americans do not believe that america is a hell hole or a garbage can. a lot of us are proud to have lived here our entire lives. we celebrate the country, and we will see if people vote that way. >> if anybody believes america is a garbage can that's voting this election, they're just stupid. they just don't know the facts. yeah mean -- they may want to move somewhere else if they think it's such a hell hole. i don't want to bore people, but i've got richard haass here. if anything i say here is

incorrect. >> the checklist. >> the military, relative to the rest of the world, more powerful than any time since world war ii. the economic, more powerful than any time since world war ii. america's technological might, relative to the rest of the world, more powerful than any time since world war ii. america's military by the way, so powerful that most -- most organizations that rank the power of militaries have russia number two. >> why does he hate them? >> well, he hates america because somebody else is running america, but richard, again, we also have donald trump. we always hear about him -- i'll say shit talking the united states of america. the facts are just the opposite. our economy is the envy of the world. the gdp of texas, bigger than the gdp of russia.

the gdp of california, bigger than the gdp of all other countries except for three. amazon's rnd budget, bigger than the budget of just about every g7 country. we are a colossus standing on the top of a mountain regarding power compared to the other countries who envy us, and of course, some see us as their enemies, their sworn enemies, and those are the very countries that donald trump right now is praising and the leaders who he's praising. >> look. we have real challenges in this country. everyone around this table, everyone watch. >> of course. >> we know this, but i wouldn't trade our hand for anyone else's, and ironically enough, what's one of the most controversial issues in this country? is immigration. people want to come to this country. >> right. >> people are lining up around the world at american consulates. why? because they want to go to america's universities. still the world's best.

so on and on and on. you mentioned the military, the economy, technology, our innovation bases. it's second to none. so, you know, you look at the chinas, the russias, their internal challenges are incomparably greater than what we face. whether it's demographic, political, you name it. >> i heard something that was so moving a few weeks ago. it was said, 7:00 a.m. across the world, in just about every country, you can go, look for the u.s. consulate, and there will be lines around the block of people who want to come to america, and it reminds me of what jfk said about this country. we americans, we may have our challenges, but we never had to put up a wall to keep our people in. and speaking of walls, people are going to be looking at those

walls at yankee stadium, willie, that are about -- >> oh, wait a minute. >> 225 -- 225 yards from home plate -- feet from home plate. >> feet. >> yeah. willie, what do you expect? >> please introduce our guests. >> we got jonathan here. we got rev here. >> and jon meacham. >> and jon and i will of course, be eating pimento cheese sandwiches. >> back to willie. >> set it up for us tonight. well, we yankee fans are embracing the underdog role here. obviously the dodgers have the best record in baseball. they've got the best lineup in baseball. they've got home field advantage. we're hoping to steal a couple of games in this series against the mighty, mighty los angeles dodgers. they've got the second best player in baseball. imagine that, in shohei ohtani.

they're really, really good. we hope we can hang in with them. we're going to throw a kid named gerrit cole to do what we can. we're the underdog, but so was that 1980 hockey team. >> oh my god. you cannot do this, willie. you know, lemire, i really -- this is plagiarism. it is false humility. he has taken a page from my book, and i do not appreciate it. aaron judge, juan soto, stanton, gerrit cole. this is the best team in baseball top to bottom. their payroll is, you know, it's bigger than about 50% of the countries across the planet. i mean, this is -- this is a yankees team -- i will say this really. this yankees team is so great that if they even lose one game this series, i would consider this season a failure. >> the list you just did about

why america is the top of the world, just substitute yankees. they have a bigger team than every other nation on the planet except three. it's the best team money can buy. >> yeah. >> the dodgers are a cinderella story. >> yeah. >> plucky upstarts by names of mookie, shohei. those guys. >> that's nice. >> america's team, we all -- we love an underdog story here. we're wrapping our arms around the los angeles dodgers. >> let's figure this out -- >> i'm giving you ten seconds. >> he played for the angels. >> that's correct. >> gerrit cole, where did he play for? >> he was a houston astro. >> he was an astro. okay. stanton, he came up in the system, right? >> no. he's a marlin. >> he's a marlin? what about soto? >> nationals and padres. >> oh, nationals and padres. >> aaron judge. >> yankees farm hand. >> bring it home, joe. >> predictions.

let's go around. what do you say? >> oh my lord. >> yanks in six. >> i got to go the yanks. i'm a new yorker. >> dodgers in seven. >> willie, what do you say? >> yankees in seven. got to steal one of these two games. they come back for three in new york. if they can come back 1-1, they have a chance to win in seven. >> the dodgers can be hot and incredibly inconsistent too. i don't know how these guys -- not a lot of pitching. i'm going to go, and this is -- i think it's going to be dodgers in six. >> okay. >> i really do. i could be wrong. vice president kamala harris -- >> i usually am wrong, and i'm good with it. >> yes. let me hold your hand now. wait. vice president kamala harris -- >> john meacham, you know what the thing is -- >> oh, god. >> you know what? just because he went to swanny, all right? there's some of us who do not denigrate the university of the south. jon meacham, you and keith. who will you be cheering for

tonight? >> well, i'm a yankees fan because -- this was -- i came to it with literary experience. >> you don't have to tell us the history. >> are you voting for trump now? what's going on with you? >> listen, jon, we don't need the history of this, okay? >> i want to hear the history. >> you do. you do. >> colonel rupert, and so i read a book called "dynasty." the subtitle of which, when rooting for the yankees was like rooting for u.s. steel, and it was an account of the gherig-ruth years. vice president kamala harris -- >> it's like cheering for microsoft. >> held a rally last night in georgia where she appeared side by side for the first time with former president barack obama. a crowd of 23,000 people, the largest of her campaign, also

heard from samuel l. jackson, tyler perry, and bruce springsteen. ♪♪ ♪ driving all night, chasing some mirage ♪ ♪ well, pretty soon, darling, i'm going to take charge ♪ ♪ well, the dogs on main street howl because they understand ♪ >> i want a president who reveres the constitution. who does not threaten, but wants to protect and guide our great democracy. who believes in the rule of law and the peaceful transfer of power. who will fight for a woman's right to choose. and who wants to create a middle class economy that will serve all our citizens. there is only one candidate in this election who holds those

principles dear, kamala harris. >> so when i think about america, i think about my grandmother's quilt. we are all shapes, sizes, and colors, but we are one. [ applause ] and it was so important for me to stand with a candidate who understands that we as america, we are a quilt, and i could never stand with a candidate who wants america to be a sheet. >> kamala harris is ready for the job. this is a leader who has spent her life fighting on behalf of people who need a voice, who need a champion. kamala wasn't born into privilege. she was raised in a middle class family. she worked at mcdonald's when

she was in college to pay her expenses. she didn't pretend to work at mcdonald's when it was closed. >> over the last years, and in particular, the last eight years, donald trump has become more confused, more unstable, and more angry. you see it every day. he has become increasingly unhinged, but last time, at least there were people around him who could control him. but do notice in this election, they're not with him this time. there's a choice that everybody has. so let's imagine it for a moment. it's either donald trump in there stewing -- stewing over his enemies list, or me working for you, checking off my to-do

list. [ cheers and applause ] you have the power to make that decision. it is your power. it is your power. >> you know, jonathan, her closing statement, her closing theme is going to be very basic. it's going to be, he's about him. i'm about you, and again, as i said yesterday, the october surprise has not been what one of the greatest journalists in america, jeffrey goldberg, has reported. it's not what a great general who dedicated his life and whose son gave his life defending this country have said. it's about what donald trump has said himself where he said, this is going to be about me. i am going to arrest my political opponents. i am going to shut down cbs news because i don't like how "60 minutes" edited a package. i am going to obsess over exacting revenge. he's talked about retribution. he's talked about all these

things, but it's fascinating. you usually don't have your opponent playing right into your hands, but that's exactly what donald trump has been saying, and yet, despite all of the unconstitutional things he has been saying and promising over the past several weeks -- >> mm-hmm. >> -- this race is tied this morning. >> it is a dead heat this race, and internals from both campaigns suggest they're within a point and, like, every battleground state, the trump campaign thumping their chest a little more than the harris team, but it is a tie race, and it is -- this is going to be the vice president's closing argument, is that this idea that donald trump has no plans. he has no policy proposals. he has maybe one about no taxing on tips. that's it. everything else is just about himself. it's about retribution. it's about grievance. it's about going after his political enemies, and potentially using the military

to do so while the vice president is trying to say, look. i have all these -- you may not have loved everything about the biden administration, but we did a lot of good for a lot of people. look at these proposals. i'm going to go even further in a number of areas here. she is trying to say, look. he's about himself. i'm for you, and that sound bite there, the idea, the to-do list, they love that, i'm told, and we're going to hear this a number of times each and every day for the next number of days. >> that is exactly what we're looking at. i did four cities in western michigan on our non-protestant election tour, but laying out the candidates with me. i had the central park five with me and the brother of george floyd and i'm still hearing arguments, not the majority of them, but some among black men. i'm still hearing arguments among some of the arab americans as we toured just yesterday, and i think it is very tight. i think we also have to deal

with the fact that donald trump is -- it reminds me of a battered mate syndrome where you beat down your wife or your husband saying, you're lucky you're with me. you're nothing without me, and people are falling for this because of their own biases. some misogyny, some race, and others, that they bring to the table because they could be listening to trump and harris and come up with trump. it's what they bring to the table as you bring to a battered marriage. if you already think you're less than something, you accept somebody telling you that, and that's what donald trump has, a battered syndrome campaign. you're nothing without me. you shouldn't be even allowed in my presence, and people with insecurities or biases feed into that. coming up, why the gop's new focus is old news. lisa rubin joins us with her latest reporting on the rnc's attempts to thin the voter roles.

that conversation is just ahead on "morning joe." that conversation is just ahead on "morning joe. i'm a lifelong republican and i voted for trump twice, but i can't do it again. trump wants a national sales tax on imported goods. it'll make everything more expensive for regular people, all while giving tax breaks to billionaires. you're rich as hell. we're going to give you tax cuts. kamala harris is for regular people. she wants a tax cut for 100 million americans, so we keep more of our hard-earned money. i'm a proud republican, but this year, i'm voting for kamala harris. ff pac is responsible for the content of this ad. now that you're eligible for medicare, it's time to take advantage of everything medicare has to offer, and much more. with a humana medicare advantage plan. humana has plans that can enhance your life in so many ways. it starts with peace of mind. humana's medicare advantage plans offer $0 or low monthly plan premiums. and there's a cap on your out-of-pocket costs. these plans can

even include coverage for the medications you take to feel your best every day. with $0 copays on hundreds of prescriptions. most plans include dental, vision, even hearing coverage. so you can fully participate in the lives of the people you love. and plans have $0 copays for in-network preventive services. so you'll feel protected when you have a humana medicare advantage plan. call to see if there's a plan in your area just waiting to enhance your life. annual enrollment for medicare advantage plans ends on december 7th. so call a licensed humana sales agent today. humana a more human way to health care. and kamala came in, she deliberately dismantled our border and threw open the gates. she threw them open, the gates to an invasion of criminal

migrants from prisons and jails, from insane asylums and mental institutions, from all over the world, from venezuela to the congo in africa. a lot of people coming out of the congo, not just south america. they're coming from 181 countries as of yesterday. we're a dumping ground. we're like a garbage can for the world. that's what's happened. that's what's happened to -- we're like a garbage can. you know, it's the first time i've ever said that, and every time i come up and talk about what they've done to our country, i get angrier and angrier. first time i've ever said garbage can, but you know what? it's a very accurate description. >> so there it is, jon meacham. we were talking about that comment at the top of the show, calling america, quote, a garbage can with 11 days to go until the election. just the contrast you see as someone who's written many beautiful words and told a lot

of stories over the course of your life. what do you see when you watch the harris rally contrasted with the trump rally? >> well, the conventional politics from jefferson forward honestly has been that the politics of optimism, the politics of hope have tended to prevail at least rhetorically, and because, you know, democracies are human undertakings, and they're shaped by the tension between hope which is about looking forward, and fear which is about the anxiety created, is an ancient definition, is the anxiety created by the anticipation of the loss of something you love. the anticipation and anxiety about the loss of something you love, and so the politics of fear is really powerful, but what has prevailed until now has

been ultimately a politics of hope. jefferson talking about, we're the world's best hope. lincoln saying, we're the last best hope. ronald reagan saying we're the last best hope of man on earth. you can track the phrase, and we face a very clear choice. there is no mystery about what we're going to decide as right now, and what's going to be rendered in what? ten days, and it's that vice president harris would conduct a recognizable, coherent presidency, and donald trump risks taking us so far down an authoritarian road that we would become unrecognizable, and maybe people feel that kind of a center, center-left presidency is worth -- is just so much

worse than this risk of the man who thinks we're a garbage can taking power again, but i don't -- i don't quite see it, and i speak as someone who, you know, president biden was my friend. i've helped him when i could, but i voted for a lot of republicans, and i would love to be in a place where i could vote for a republican again, but this to use a very technical term, willie, this ain't it. >> no. >> this ain't it. >> yeah. not even close. yeah. donald trump saying that we're a garbage can, saying that we're a stupid nation, you know who's saying that? what leaders around the world are saying that? none. none. they may not like us, but they like us because we're too powerful. they like us because our economy's too strong. they like us because our military is too strong. they like us because our cultural reach is too strong. they like us because our hard power is too overwhelming. they like us -- they don't like

us because our soft power, too overwhelming. our cultural power. you can go down the list. donald trump alone is saying we're a garbage can, and i guess he's -- i guess he's teaching his followers to say that or saying that we're a stupid nation. go to silicon valley. not real dumb. coming up, one of our next guests says donald trump is the republican party, and the republican party is him. >> that's pretty -- >> pretty sad. >> pretty true. >> molly jong-fast joins the conversation next on "morning joe." jong-fast joins the conversation next on "morning joe.

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i hope we find ways to bring in younger, newer equity members, you know, the development contract was sort of a big deal, but there's a lot

that's been going on with reproductive rights, with support for -- if a person gets into some kind of a medical issue and they're on tour, there's no fund to send them back to be able to be treated or to deal with problems. >> that was our next guest, actress, model, entrepreneur, brooke shields, during her recent 50 over 50 interview with "forbes" maggie mcgrath after a lifetime as an actress and model. she's now pivoting to labor leader and ceo. she was elected president of the actors equity association, a union representing 51,000 actors and stage managers in the u.s. she's also the founder and ceo of commence, a hair company for women over the age of 40, and i just found out i desperately need commence for my covid hair. okay. she was also honored on "forbes"

and know your value's 50 over 50 list this year, and brooke shields joins us now. also with us, the team, vice chair of the "forbes" know your value summit, huma abedin, and maggie mcgrath. great to have the team together, and brooke -- >> so happy to be with these women. thank you. >> we are going to be celebrating women all day today, especially in light of what is happening in history. we need a strong, powerful community, and we are building it. i guess i want to ask you what i ask our 50 over 50 honorees because you started working at the age of 11 months old. >> very ambitious. >> you were a very ambitious baby, but honestly even in your teens, superstardom with movies that has its attributes as well, and consequences and difficulties and challenges, but you have been working for so long. i wonder when you were in your teens and 20s, did you ever imagine your career after 50? >> 50 sounded very old to me when i was a child. >> yeah.

>> you think -- but that's old people, and then you start to advance closer to it and and you realize it feels younger and younger for me. >> yeah. >> so i don't think i -- i didn't really have too much looking forward with a career. we didn't really have a plan. we just sort of basically had to keep the lights on in our apartment. >> yeah. it was all light space or blank space for us when we were growing up, and now when you look at kamala harris and liz cheney on stage and you look at the women on these lists, now in four years exploding, we have to do four categories. we have so many submissions we don't know what to do with it. we have women lining up. we realize, huma, 60 is the new 40. >> i've decided i'm now the new 20 because now i'm 43. brooke, i wanted to ask you, speaking of pivoting from careers, you've said you were inspired to start commence during the pandemic when you were talking to women over 40, and they told you they felt invisible and discounted. what were they saying to you? >> they were saying that it was

absolutely shocking to them that they have raised families. they've run companies or haven't run companies, been stay-at-home moms, had such a history of experience that when they finally start coming into their own and feeling their own person and feeling that they have more to do, and their kids are leaving maybe, that the world of marketing, if you look at marketing, if you look at the way we advertise, you sort of -- i always joke. you're either the, you know, the hot girl at the bar or you're in depends. nothing against depends. i would like to represent the company when i need them, but don't make me laugh, but the truth is, you know, we get over -- they jump over us, and now everybody said, yeah, but we're starting to talk about menopause. great, but we're not just menopause, and i started commence as a community to really get to know that i wasn't crazy, that i wasn't the only one feeling that i had so much more to do. >> that's great. >> and the women that i know --

i think the why it's so shocking is because we don't fit into one category. we are all different in our many, many ways. we're diverse. we're different socioeconomics, and when you look at that vast -- that swath of women -- even millennials are turning 40. >> yeah. >> it's getting -- this demo is getting wider and wider, and it needs to be addressed, and we're formidable which is a bit scary. >> long runway. maggie? >> brooke, as you talk about women feeling invisible, you have a memoir coming out called "brooke shields is not allowed to get old." i would love to know what inspired you to write this memoir because you flipped the script on age, and i want to know how you chose that title. >> i chose it based on an incident that i had a stranger, and their hole -- his whole demeanor changed when he heard my age. he evidently knew me from the

past, and then he -- his whole demeanor changed and i thought, that's really interesting. if i've imprinted on in "blue lagoon" or "pretty baby," and i'm not comparing myself to marilyn monroe, but when you imprint yourself upon as a sex symbol, so to speak and they don't look the way they did in their 20s or teens, it's arresting to people, and that's fascinating. we all feel this, and i'm just -- it's not different for me. it's just played out on a different scale, and i thought, this is a problem, you know? that's why we chase youth. it's why we're obsessed with -- it's why kids younger and younger are getting botox. >> we feel like we have a window we have to work in. we are breaking the window with these lists. i have a question for you, brooke. you and i have something in common. we both have adult, young daughters too. >> yes. >> and i'm just curious how the conversation is right now with

reproductive emergencies not being answered by doctors, our health on the line, and in this election atmosphere, what's that like for you as a mom of two daughters? >> i feel more incensed now than i've ever -- i don't think i really learned how to self-advocate until i was much, much older, and, you know, my daughter wouldn't be here without ivf. i went through seven rounds of ivf. >> oh my gosh. >> i'm blessed to have been able to afford it, and had a miscarriage, and so thankful that i had the medical attention through that miscarriage. >> right. >> because i can't believe it's considered a luxury. >> it's now gone. you can't get the care you need if you are in a reproductive emergency. women have died. >> no, and the fact that medical professionals are worried about being jailed, it's unbelievable, and my daughter stood up -- i

couldn't believe this, and she said, you know, i'm -- it gets me every time. i'm the result of ivf. she said, if it didn't exist, and if my mom died during the miscarriage, i wouldn't exist, and to hear your 21-year-old say that, it's a mixture of pride for her and just deep, deep injustice and anger. >> it's an extremely grave time, and it's a time perhaps more than ever that we need the power of the woman. brooke shields, thank you. my team, maggie mcgrath and huma abedin will be at this luncheon together today, celebrating this community, banding together. it's the 50 over 50 luncheon which of course, recognizes the honorees. we're going to have a lot of coverage in the next week including any fireside chat with

you, valerie jarrett, and suzy ormond, and don't forget nominations for our 50 over 50 global list, it's open now. you can get all the details at forbes.com and knowyourvalue.com. brooke, thank you. up next, we're going through the rnc's attempts to purge ineligible voters from stale rolls and why those efforts are largely failing. keep it right here on "morning joe." failing. keep it right here o"mn orning joe. liberty mutual customized my car insurance so i saved hundreds. with the money i saved i thought i'd get a wax figure of myself. cool right? look at this craftmanship. i mean they even got my nostrils right. it's just nice to know that years after i'm gone this guy will be standing the test of ti... he's melting! oh jeez... nooo... oh gaa... only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty ♪ dry... tired... itchy, burning... my dry eye symptoms got worse over time. my eye doctor explained the root was inflammation.

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we got two weeks to go, and i'm very much grounded in the present in terms of the task at hand and we will deal with election night and the days after as they come, and we have the resources and the expertise and the focus on that as well. >> so you have teams ready to go? are you thinking about that as a possibility? >> of course. this is a person, donald trump, who tried to undo a free and

fair election, who still denies the will of the people, who incited a violent mob to attack the united states capitol and 140 law enforcement officers were attacked, some of who were killed. this is a serious matter. the american people are at this point, two weeks out being presented with a very, very serious decision, about what will be the future of our country. >> vice president kamala harris speaking earlier this week with nbc's hallie jackson about the possibility of former president donald trump declaring victory on election night before all the votes come in. that comes amid multiple attempts by republican national committee to purge registered voters in at least two swing states. joining us now, former litigator and msnbc legal correspondent, lisa rubin. lisa, you have been tracking some of the ways republicans are

attempting to swing the election in their favor. what have you learned, and how effective could they be? >> mika, what i've really been looking at is their affirmative litigation strategy. where are they bringing suits? because we know right now when we're looking at preelection litigation, the vast majority of suits have been brought by republicans or republican-affiliated enemies as opposed to democrats. what they're trying to do is reduce the population of people who were eligible to vote in ways that might surprise us. for example, some of the suits they're filing are against democratic secretaries of state saying they're not complying with federal law that requires them to go through their voter registration list and take off ineligible voters. the only problem is they can't identify who those ineligible voters are to begin with. all they say for example, is well, if you look at this county or that county, the rate of people registered relative to the adult population is impossibly high, and that courts have told them so far in nevada

and michigan, that doesn't cut the mustard. the other thing that they're doing, and this is even more deeply offensive, is to try and attack those who are spouses or adult children of overseas military members, whether current or former, and what they've said, is rev's my dad and i was born outside the country, we live outside the country and the last place for example, that rev voted was north carolina, they say, i shouldn't be eligible to vote in north carolina because i was never a north carolina resident. not only is that contrary to north carolina law, but i would also ask you, where is someone like that person supposed to vote? if your parents' last place of residence is a particular state that's already made provisions for you to vote there, they're trying to deprive you not just of the right to vote in that swing state, but really leave you stateless without the right to vote anywhere. and again, courts have rejected those attempts so far, too,

mika. >> lisa, are they trying to set up a scenario that they go in certain states, certain regions, targeting certain types of people by their nationality or their race, or their gender, so that they have an argument after the fact if they claim that something was not properly done in terms of voting to try and prolong a final count? so even though they may appear to lose at this point, they appeal later which can prolong -- we can end up, like, 2000, where we don't know for days who won because you have states going back and forth with the premise that they're trying to establish now? >> i'm really glad that you mention that because the object of some of these cases isn't really to win. it's to sow doubt about who's eligible to vote, and almost preserve an argument for after the election, particularly if we find ourselves in a situation where there is a red mirage. you know that donald trump complained bitterly in 2020 that

states where he appeared to be leading on election night ultimately, when absentee ballots were counted, particularly late absentee ballots that come in from people living overseas, you see that what looks like for example, a lead for him in pennsylvania, ultimately became an 80,000-vote deficit. they're trying to do both, and some might do this by lit gaugs by press release. again, not in an attempt to succeed for the sake of succeed, but to sow doubt and confusion, and even just slow things down to build momentum and time to create a narrative about cheating where no cheating exists, rev ch. >> what's the biggest challenge for democrats? as far as you see it, coming from donald trump's attempts to disenfranchise voters? >> joe, that's such a good question. i think we don't know what the biggest challenge is. don't know what that challenge now. >> where they're going. >> in every election cycle, we're introduced to new language

so to speak about a different attempt to sway an election, right? in 2000, it was hanging chads. earlier even in this cycle, we were talking about attempts to delay certification in georgia, that thanks to the georgia supreme court have now been put to rest. i think we haven't yet seen the trend that will ultimately be the thing that is most contested, and post-election litigation. when you ask folks, and certainly we have seen a memo that's been reported that was distributed by dana remus and others in the harris-walz campaign, what they are telling folks internally and externally, they're preparing for every eventuality. they have a marvel comic of in all of these swing states so they are not caught flat footed. if you were to ask them that question, what's the problem that keeps you up at night, i don't think anyone can identify what that problem is just now. and that itself is the thing

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senator cruz just called himself pro-life. you're not pro-life. it's no pro-life to deny women care so long that they can't have children anymore. it's no pro-life to force women to carry their rapist's baby. every texas family watching this, understand when ted cruz says he's pro-life, he doesn't mean yours. >> coming up, the democrat

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[ laughter ] >> luckily, it was the third party debate on c-span 2, so literally nobody saw that. >> that was mortifying. truthfully mortifying. >> what in the world? >> that's why i don't sing on live television. welcome to the fourth hour of "morning joe." it is 6:00 on the west coast. >> what a beautiful shot of the white house. >> and 9:00 a.m. in the east. trump and kamala harris head to texas today, the vice president for a rally in houston with the one and only beyonce, while trump heads to austin to tape a podcast with the one and only joe rogan. >> so it's going to be donald trump and joe rogan, and you're going to have kamala harris talking about freedom, reproductive choice, right?

right, molly? >> yeah. >> that's pretty stark. >> it could not be a starker contrast, right? >> yeah. >> texas, of course, has some of the most restrictive abortion laws in the nation. though not a battleground state, the senate race is close. that's why the vice president is there today. garrett haake has more. >> reporter: with just 11 days until the election, donald trump appearing to go all in in vegas, saying a harris president would cost people their lives. >> kill thousands of people too, by the way, and destroy your family finances, probably forever. >> reporter: this after he puts a spotlight on immigration at an earlier stop in arizona, blaming the vice president for what he calls an invasion at the southern border. >> we're a dumping ground. we're like a garbage can for the world. we're like a garbage can. you know, it's the first time i've ever said that.

>> reporter: vice president harris turning to star power at a rally led by bruce springsteen and former president obama joining the vice president for the first time on the trail. >> we do not need four years of a wannabe king, a wannabe dictator running around trying to punish his enemies. >> reporter: and the vice president delivering one of her new closing messages. >> it's either donald trump in there stewing over his enemies list, or me working for you, checking off my to do-list. >> reporter: while her campaign is also seizing on comments by former trump chief of staff john kelly to the new york times in a new ad. >> he certainly falls into the general definition of a fascist. >> reporter: trump on the trail yesterday firing back at kelly. >> john kelly was a stupid person. he was a stiff. >> reporter: while his campaign

also pushes back on new accusations of misconduct. staci williams, a former model, says in 1993 trump groped her in trump tower while talking totel zoom call this week labeled survivors for kamala. the first said they were told in 2006, the most recent in 2022. the trump campaign saying the accusations are, quote, unequivocally false. >> still with us we have special correspondent from "vanity fair" molly jong-fast, professor of history at rice university and presidential historian douglas brinkley and chris matthews. chris, first of all, fascinating wall street editorial page once again mocking people who are

concerned about donald trump saying he's going to round up political prisoners, he's going to round up his political opponents and use the army and national guard to arrest, quote, enemies within, that a four-star general who was, of course, donald trump's longest-serving chief of staff saying that donald trump is a fascist, that donald trump's last chairman of the joint chiefs said donald trump was a fascist to the core. and somehow the "wall street journal" editorial page mocking democrats. how fascinating they would say that. earlier this week they talked about the fascist meme despite the fact, again, days after donald trump is saying that he's going to use the military and the national guard to go after enemies from within and he listed the former democratic speaker of the house and the

future democratic senator from california. it's absolutely fascinating. they're writing this while donald trump is calling america a garbage can, a stupid country where donald trump and others are trashing four star generals that don't support donald trump. chris, you and i have been at this for a very long time. it's hard to be shocked but not surprised after all these years. but i've got to say i really am at how numb they have grown to even the most outrageous remarks of donald trump. >> yeah. it's so clear, joe and mika, that this election has come down to the talking points of both candidates, though. certainly the democratic party and people concerned about trump are worried about his horrific statements. of course trump is talking about immigration, immigration, we've become a garbage dump, people

are coming to this country at will. yesterday i spent going to my old neighborhood right in philadelphia near the edge with bucks county. that's sort of the dividing line politically. every other house is republican or democrat. i walked around with ward leader jim donnelly and state senator jim dylan. you can tell how all the houses are very much different in their views. there's certainly no doubt that race plays a role in this campaign. i mean, people don't say it. it's there. it's part of our history going back to the 15th amendment, going back to the 19th amendment with women being able to vote. it's there. the people in those houses that i used to serve the bulletin to, the newspaper, are faced with history. history is what they're going to make in this election, not just the news. they're very aware what's going on. they talk about the issues about

immigration, the fascist charge against trump. it's all there. but also history. women being able to vote since 1920 with suffrage. even in the same neighborhoods with kids coming home and me coming home to my old house where i grew up in, it's amazing to become having our close-up in history at the edge of bucks county in philadelphia deciding history. and it's going to decide history, because all history in pennsylvania is very easy to figure out. hillary blew it, fairly or not. she didn't go to erie. this weekend, christine baranski is in her old polish neighborhood.

movie stars go to your old neighborhood and talk to people about what it was like growing up and then tell them your politics. it's very important to communicate it properly. i don't think philadelphia people are going to blow it. the democratic ward leaders, all 67 of them, are all working and pounding their feet for this election. you have the labor unions all in there heavily very big for the democrats. you have a lot of college kids around the country coming in there and helping out, all over the state. they're really working hard at all the levels. so the democrats will not be surprised in this election like they were in 2016. this is an election where they're going to have to win it. they're going to have to see the enemy coming, knowing their neighbors are among their enemies in the sense of politics, and they've got to work really hard to win this thing. >> after this is over, both sides are going to have to figure out a way to come back to together. >> that's true. >> that's going to be

extraordinarily difficult. molly, i'm curious, chris kept bringing up 2016. there is no doubt that people that are working on the harris campaign right now still haunted by the specter of 2016, but as chris said, kamala harris taking nothing for granted, not taking pennsylvania for granted, not taking erie for granted, michigan for granted or wisconsin for granted. will it make a difference? >> i was in wilmington talking to them. everyone is always like in the hillary -- sorry. in the harris campaign, they want you to think that they're losing, right? they have taken a totally different tact. they want everyone to be worried, they want everyone to be out there. i think that's a lesson they've gotten from 2016. >> by the way, for people that are like laughing right now, oh, come on, they're just

whistling -- they know how much trouble they're in. i will tell you every time i ran campaigns the thing that drove me crazy and the few times people saw me show my temper was when people started walking around saying, hey, i hear we're three points ahead. i would turn around and say we are losing by ten points. now get out and knock in precinct 47, because we're going to lose this race. >> everyone you talk to in that campaign says it's going to be tight. we'd rather be us than them. she's spending. even the fact she's going to pittsburgh instead of philly, these are choices. she's going to go to philly too. these are choices. i think they've done a lot of really smart stuff. they have bill clinton out in the south. they have obama out there, michelle out there. really a very thoughtful

campaign, spending a ton of money. they have a billion dollars. we don't know what's going to happen, but it will not be because there was some huge blind spot they missed. >> if this is a turnout election, just getting people to the polls two tuesdays from now, that might be advantage to harris, who has a far better organization than the trump people. that's the one area the trump folks will acknowledge is their weakness, is those field operations. one thing trump is trying to do is create spectacles with his comments overnight talking about america as a garbage can, the stunt at mcdonald's. he going on joe rogan. he's even having a rally at madison square garden. he wants the images of the crowd. he knows the media won't be able to resist. >> for donald trump right now, every moment he just wants his name talked about. he'll say the craziest, most

bizarre thing just to gaslight the nation, but have the conversation being about trump. i'm surprised he's had the stamina thus far. he often seems exhausted and tired to me, but he seems to keep going over there. it helped him that he had the maga gear already in place, you know, kind of sticking to the old playbook. musk brought him the dark maga. musk that trump's most effective surrogate. but this is down to the wire, and i just don't think that we've seen an election that people's nerves are like this right now, because for a lot of people trump equals the end of democracy as we know it. >> now, there will be people who will say that's hyperbolic. so the "wall street journal" editorial page knows exactly what donald trump is doing, and yet they're trying to make it about somebody else. they're trying to make it about,

oh, people on the left are hysterical. no. liz cheney's not on the left. liz cheney is a lot more conservative than people that write on that editorial page. liz cheney will be the first to tell you that democracy, american democracy, the constitutional republic will change dramatically, will change radically if donald trump is serve this country saying the same thing. you have a lot of people that served with donald trump. again, it's hilarious. i guess think they they can get people to not say it. let's not let them do that. please tell me, have you ever heard of another presidential candidate at this stage of the campaign talking about using the military to arrest their

political opponents and then continually pushing back also on a murdoch-owned outlet to reporters and talk show hosts who keep saying, well, you don't really mean they're enemies of the state. you're not really going to use the justice department to arrest nancy pelosi, to arrest the next senator from california. and he goes, yes, that's exactly what i'm going to do. so please tell me, if that's not a definition or if that does not round out the definition of fascism, what does? when do we get to the tipping point for these people? >> you know, it's an american-style fascism. trump's supporters think it's kind of a joke, i'll be a dictator day one. it's not a joke. nixon kept an enemies list. if nixon could have stayed in there, he was starting to destroy reporters through the irs and the like. in this case, trump, if

inaugurated, will probably find ten or so major american figures to try to destroy, general mark milley, dr. fauci -- the list is going to grow long -- to send a broadband message i am above the law. the supreme court gave that immunity clause. it's back to nixon, to david frost on bbc, if the president does it, it must be legal. trump believes that in his soul. it comes right from roger stone's tattoo, transfers over to him that line of nixon. he had targets, trump. pelosi, a top political one that got under his skin too much. this is no way to run a country. we've already experienced january 6th. trump is saying i'll get inaugurated and i'm going to take our institutions, whether

it's the environmental protection agency or department of education and gut it. we're looking at a bit of a storm arm. we've had these figures in american history, the huey longs and joe mccarthy, strom thurmonds, but not as president and not one that already oversaw an insurrection. >> but republicans now don't care about january 6th. they say it's much ado about nothing. after the riots, after the attempted insurrection -- and by the way, even people running donald trump's campaign after the insurrection called it an insurrection. but now, oh, much ado about nothing. so what's going to happen if they arrest nancy pelosi, throw her in jail? how many republicans will go, yeah, that's fine, because she said bad things about donald trump. what if he shuts down cbs news? do we have any confidence that

the people that have heard these threats are going to really give a damn when he starts rounding up people who have said tough things about him? >> there will be a few lonely republicans and that would be it. and we all know their names. they've whitewashed january 6th. they've down played what happened. the rupert murdoch-owned "new york post" said trump was fundamentally fit to hold office. again, today they endorsed him on the front page. kamala harris will be in texas today doing so. trump will be as well. a congressman from that state, colin allred, announced that his campaign raised an additional $11 million in just the past 16 days. that brings his campaign total to more than $80 million in his battle to unseat incumbent republican senator ted cruz. at the same time, the congressman has focused on abortion health care as a key

issue after texas implemented its strict near-total abortion ban which is highlighted in this new campaign ad. >> she would have been our third baby. >> my second, our first. >> our second and third baby. >> our baby would never survive. >> and now my life was on the line. >> and the care we needed was on the line. >> because of ted cruz and the extremist abortion ban, a ban with no exception for rape, incest or our health. >> if you're experiencing pregnancy complications in texas, you're in danger. it's that simple. it's ted cruz and the anti-abortion extremists' fault. >> ryan nobles pressed senator sanders -- n nobles pressed senar sanders -- cruz on that issue. >> i said i agree with united states supreme court. >> isn't your preference relevant here? you're a leader. >> so i recognize you don't like my answer. >> you're not answering. >> no.

i am answering it. you just don't like it. what i am saying that's a decision for the state legislature and the governor. >> just to make clear, you're not in favor of a national ban for abortion? that's what you mean? >> every state is -- [ indiscernible ] >> there's not going to be a national ban. >> so you wouldn't vote for it? >> by the way, donald trump said he would veto any national ban. >> congressman allred joins us now. he'll be speaking later today at the harris rally in houston, which will also feature beyonce and willie nelson. abortion rights, abortion health care will be front and center at that rally today. texas, as you well know, has some of the most restrictive laws in the nation. that was senator cruz sidestepping a question about whether he would support a national abortion ban or not. talk about what today means, the vice president there talking about this important issue. >> thank you. thanks for having me on. good morning. what you saw there are what

texans are so sick and tired of. this guy, who has spent his entire career, trying to and putting in place this abortion ban, who introduced a national abortion ban five times in the united states senate, who on the debate stage with me wouldn't answer the question and was badgering the moderator saying, why are you asking me about this, is still trying to hide from the results of what he's done to our state. they're very real. all of those folks you just saw in that ad are friends of mine, and what they've been through is wrong. in texas we believe in freedom. i'm a fourth-generation texan. this is not it. we're going to beat ted cruz, make roe v. wade the law of the land again. >> you in texas, sb8 was enacted a year before the end of roe, so you guys have had an abortion ban functionally a year longer

than the rest of the country. john hopkins says it has increased infant deaths. >> we've had a 56% increase in our maternal mortality rate. we've had 20% of texas obgyns saying they're leaving the state. 13% say they're planning on retiring early. folks who are in residencies in texas, many of them are saying they're not going to practice in texas. this is a crisis for us, it really is. we're not talking about what's coming. we're talking about what is happening right now. if you want to start a family in texas, it's becoming dangerous and much more difficult. this is not what anybody wants. this is what we have to do. we have to talk about this on the national stage because what ted cruz has done to women and families in texas he does want to do nationally.

whatever he says -- everybody knows this -- he spent his entire career on this. when he ran for president, he went further and said we should ban ivf and certain forms of birth control. >> let me ask you about something that donald trump said back in 2015 when he was running for president. at the same time he was planning on picking three conservatives for the supreme court to get rid of roe v. wade, he said he believes women should face some sort of punishment for having an abortion. he said i want them to be punished, i changed the supreme court so they would be punished, and here i am denying i was for punishment. >> i do remember him saying that. this is very, very real. i'm telling you, i know that for y'all sitting there you might not follow this as closely as i

am here in texas, but people are aware this has gone way too far, even folks who are not necessarily what you consider to be pro-choice are supporting me, because they understand that versus -- understand this is way too far. in terms of people being turned away from hospitals, victims of rape and incest being forced to give birth to their rapist's child, 26,000 in texas. we have an attorney general who's starting to seek medical records of women who traveled outside of the state. they're talking about tracking folks' pregnancies. what are we talking about here? this is insane. that's why you're going to see on november 5th, so many texas women and families are going to show up, turn the page, and we're going to beat ted cruz. >> congressman colin allred, thank you so much for being with us.

greatly appreciate it. >> thanks, joe. so professor, donald trump is calling people who oppose him enemies from within. >> yep. >> said he'll use the military against them. chris was just talking about a campaign environment in pennsylvania where one neighbor is looking at another neighbor as a political enemy, far different than what donald trump is saying, but still not healthy for this republic. let's talk about it now, because if we talk about it after, 50% of the country is not going to want to hear this conversation, so let's talk about it now. how do we stitch together the fabric of this country again? how do we bring communities together? how do we get back to a point where politics is not the end-all be-all? evangelicals, that's now more,

as tim keller said, that's more of a political identity than an identity of faith,faith. saying you're a republican or democrat suddenly means if you're a democrat, you're a communist. and if you're a republican -- i'm not saying all republicans are fascist. donald trump is talking like one. but, still, if we get beyond donald trump or we have another four years of donald trump, how do we come back together as a country? >> trump will end up scapegoating different groups of people. you know, in 1856, former president millard fillmore started running a no-nothing party. it got 3% of the national vote just going after catholics. they said all catholics should be deported, germans reported.

there was a group of white anglo-saxon protestants that wanted to erase others. dwight eisenhower did the 1953 executive order, the lavender scare. if you were a homosexual or had any intonation of it, you could be kicked right out of government. that lasted all the way, that executive order until barack obama. operation wetback under eisenhower start shipping people, undocumented workers here that we needed for world war ii, they shipped them out. this becomes a problem we've had in american history, but it comes in these little pops. >> how do we bring people back together after that? >> with morality over membership and civics over listening to the internet.

we're going to have to go back early to teach young people about our founding fathers and founding mothers, talk about foundational texts, talk about the need for groups that have now been excluded to now be accepted in our history. the fact that it's 50/50 means it's going to go in a different direction. i think in the long run, the multicultural america is going to win over the nativist crowd even though this is a dire moment we're in. >> so we've got to go, chris matthews, but give us your 30-second executive summary of where this election is right now, who wins the blue wall, who wins the sunbelt states. what's it looking like to you? >> first of all, i don't think people are looking at the neighbors as enemies exactly. what they're going to be doing is watching television until about 1:00 in the morning or 3:00 in the morning hoping their

side wins. the next day you'll see from their faces who won or lost. they're not going to be disliking their neighbors as much as they're going to dislike the results. i want to say that democrats, again, are being serious about this election. they are not taking this easy. tim walz is coming up today to fishtown in downtown philadelphia where the yuppies live or the millennials live, if you will. he's going to try to reach the younger voters. when you go out to fulton county, what james carville called alabama in pennsylvania between pittsburgh and philadelphia, 50 out of 67 counties, they are going to be all red for trump. they are going to be 70% in some of those counties. it will be up. it will be. so the democrats have got to make up for that because of the dobbs decision in montgomery county. they've got to win in bucks

county with a strong margin. really what the state has always been divided by is look at lehigh county, bethlehem and allentown, look at that area and see election night late in the morning when all the votes get counted including the early votes that don't even get counted until 8:00 that night, look and see how that's going and you can tell who's going to win the election. i'll give you the answer. i think it's close. [ laughter ] >> i can't say anything else. part of my brain gets up in the morning and i worry, and i get another part of my brain that hears some democratic position, i go maybe i'm wrong. maybe down in georgia something's going differently. but i think pennsylvania is -- as governor casey, who got reelected by a million votes once said, it is a john wayne state. it's crusty, it's old time, it's a little more conservative of all the blue states. it's tough. it's just going to be tough.

the democrats have got to do exactly what they're doing right now. all hands on deck. >> for donald trump in 2016 and 2022 it elected senator fetterman, about as progressive a candidate -- >> that's true. >> it goes both ways. chris matthews and douglas brinkley, thank you guys. coming up, a new report says that the world's richest man has been in regular contact with russian president vladimir putin for nearly two years. we're going to figure out what's going on between elon musk when we come back. and cnbc's andrew ross sorkin will join us with the latest reporting on why some outspoken ceos are really quiet about supporting kamala harris. is that his cohost now? like, what's happening? turn around one minute, talk to chris matthews and then, poof, look. we'll be right back, i think. i'm not sure if they're going to escort me from the room. t sure o escort me from the room.

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♪♪ 35 past the hour. billionaire elon musk has been reportedly in regular contact with russia's vladimir putin since late 2022. this is according to brand new reporting by the "wall street journal," which cites several current and former american, european and russian officials. nbc news has not confirmed this report and has reached out to musk for comment. let's bring in the coanchor of cnbc's "squawk box" andrew ross sorkin. >> it raises a lot of questions. i don't think people remember, but back in 2022 ian bremmer said publicly that he understood that elon musk was talking to putin. and at the time, it was dismissed in large part because elon musk dismissed it and said it was not true.

what's so interesting about this report is not just that there are anonymous sources saying it is true, but the fact that the spokesperson for putin says on the record that they had a call. now, it says there's only one call in this article. the spokesman is only committing to one call. this article is suggesting there's a larger piece here. the question is, what's going on on these phone calls? why are they speaking? what are they speaking about? in one case, there's an anecdote that putin is asking elon musk to not allow taiwan to use starlink as a favor to xi jinping, the president of china. then the question is, is he reporting these calls back to the u.s. government, which is something you would have to do legally? he also has security clearance. so there's all sorts of questions. and the last piece is, if he's doing something that is untoward, is the government in a

position to rein it in in so far as the u.s. government relies on him almost exclusively to get rockets into the sky, to get satellite services. >> he has massive contracts. he deals with the pentagon, and yet he is talking to putin with some regularity. he's out there as donald trump's most visible surrogate. >> what does this all mean? >> look, we don't know the answer. i will tell you, you know, folks i know in the trump camp say this is a sort of october surprise effort to sort of push out -- >> wait, wait, wait, by rupert murdoch's "wall street journal"? >> that's the point i was going to make. >> that's actually mocking people concerned about donald trump saying he's going to use the military against nancy pelosi and his political opponents, that "wall street journal"? that's an october surprise?

>> i believe it is a reputable story clearly of a spokesperson saying it's true. the kremlin confirmed it. so the question is what happens next? i will say if trump wins, what happens next is nothing. if trump doesn't win, what happens next will get more interesting. >> by the way, how fascinating, one more link to russia. the guy who is all in for donald trump has a relationship with putin that he's calling all the time that we're finding out now. again, russia hoax, really? this is what marco rubio's republican senate intelligence committee said about the russian hoax in the report about the 2016 trump campaign, that it caused, quote, a grave counter intelligence threat that made donald trump's campaign susceptible to malign russian influence.

that comes from the republican senate intelligence committee. and we keep seeing these things come up, and people will write in the "wall street journal" russia hoax, like if they keep saying it enough, that people will be cowed to forget what marco rubio and the senate intelligence committee and the mueller report and everybody else that's looked into this has said. again, what a coincidence that elon musk is his phone pal is vladimir putin. i want to take your next story and turn it around. you're talking about billionaires hedging on harris or not comfortable with it. let me ask you this. i was watching you interview a billionaire on your show about donald trump's attitude, praise for hitler, the report -- >> wait, to make sure, is

this -- >> bill akman. >> he's the one, again, accused harris and obama of allowing vladimir putin to invade georgia. i'm not really sure that anybody that knows anything about such things doesn't know that it was george w. bush who was president then. i'm sorry, mika. go ahead. >> i just want to understand how he, as successful as he is and intelligent seemingly as he is, could say that donald trump didn't say those things, and if he did, he didn't mean them, that trump apologist route, because it would be as if i blurted out some profanities -- >> don't blurt it out. >> some profanities and racist tropes right now and then i said them again on the "today" show and then i went over and said it at my luncheon today and joe said to everybody, she doesn't mean it. it tells what trump has said and done as it pertains to attacking

his political rivals and about hitler and what he said to a general who lost his son on the battlefield about our own military. how dare he? that's the question. >> i quizzed bill akman about this, in large part because -- >> he just doesn't have to care. >> no, no. i think what's happened is there is a certain sector of people who have decided they are putting blinders on and that they have to put blinders on. >> he's so rich he can. >> maybe it's about the money. there's so many times bill akman spreads disinformation and has to come back and say, oh, i'm sorry, i spread disinformation. >> what, to me, is to concerning about this -- and i've said this to bill before -- is that he has made his name as an activist investor. he is often calling out ceos for

lying. that is part of his business. he has gone after companies for lying to the public. that is part and parcel of his franchise. here we are with somebody in the context of former president trump who lies with such regularity and it's not clear to me that any of these investors would be hiring -- would you go hire a ceo who lies? >> nobody would hire this guy. bill akman wouldn't hire this guy. you know that. can you name a ceo supporting donald trump that would hire donald trump as a cfo? >> i'm not going to defendant a position -- what i'm saying is -- what i think is happening is i think someone like bill akman on issues like israel and other things believes, genuinely believes that vice president harris is not as competent. i think this is the argument. i'm not saying that's the case. i'm saying they believe this. >> they don't believe that.

they just cannot believe that. they can't be that ignorant. >> i believe that they believe it. maybe i'm stupid for believing that. >> have they not heard donald trump speak? >> he doesn't mean it. >> look, i'm trying to maybe rationalize what we're seeing from some of these folks on the other side who are in the business community. and i think that in their minds -- >> they're not serious people. >> it's about tax cuts. >> i think it has to do with other things, i really do. i think that he would tell you if you say, look, his view is both of these choices, he believes, are bad choices and he believes it's a binary situation. he would say unlike a situation where i get to hire anybody i want, if you put these two people in front of me, this where i'm going. >> would he hire donald trump to work on his team if donald trump

lost? >> to be cfo. >> i do not believe so. >> okay. >> new reporting, john kelly, trump's longest-serving chief of staff comes out, says trump had a lot of good feelings about hitler. as a jew, that seems not great to me. >> i asked him that question, you're a jew. there's just a dismissal of it. for folks who are supporting former president trump, there's a dismissal. i said, actually, if you go back and look at all of the people who have worked in his administration, there's like 28 people who have said similar types of things. >> his national security advisors say he's not fit, his former secretaries of defense say he's not fit. you can go down the list. his chiefs of staff say he's not fit. one after another after another, and bill akman knows that.

>> he knows that. he's not stupid. >> does he think john kelly is lying, does he think john bolton is lying? >> that's what he thinks. >> does he think the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff mark milley is lying? >> i believe he must think that. >> does he think trump is lying? because trump has said enough without all of those people. >> this is just a sad state of affairs for the whole country. i think a lot of the people who are supporting president trump have said to themselves that they know he lies and they're willing to accept that. look, we're journalists here. i think we care genuinely about truth. that's what makes this whole situation as complicated as it is. but for whatever reason, there are people who have other views on this. >> so andrew ross sorkin, you're been in the hot seat today. i want everybody who is watching that wants to tweet at you to understand that you're doing an incredible job trying to tell

us -- [ laughter ] >> let me just say the opinions expressed by andrew ross sorkin here do not reflect andrew ross sorkin's own personal views. >> correct. >> you're trying to be a sherpa here, aren't you? we appreciate it. >> no. i appreciate your explaining. >> i'm trying to explain what some of these people believe. >> and we're friends, believe it or not, you guys. we are friends. >> yes, 100%. >> andrew ross sorkin, thank you. coming up, grammy-nominated singer and actress nicole skerzinger -- scherzinger and tom francis will talk about their broadway musical "sunset boulevard." they deliver stunning

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♪ i'll be back where i was born ♪ ♪ with one look i'll be back ♪ that was a look at the latest broadway revival of the andrew lloyd webber musical "sunset boulevard." the relationship in the show is as dramatic as it is destructive. joining us now the actress who plays norma and actor who plays

joe. i that err both making their broadway debut. everyone who stops me tries to find the words. alex in the booth, you saw it, you were blown away. t.j., what are the words? >> stunning. show stopping. hauntingly magnificent. it's one of the best things on broadway. >> alex lives on broadway. he's a broadway aficionado. i want to hear about the show and about nicole's norma and tom's joe. nicole, go first. >> oh, goodness. this production is fiercelessly led by our amazing director jamie lloyd. he's encouraged us to bring ourselves authentically to the roles and breathe our own lives into these stories.

my norma is a norma that struggles with abandonment and loneliness issues and feeling discarded in the industry. she's also a norma that's a warrior and a fighter who will never surrender. >> tom? >> the show's very, very stripped back. there's no set. there's nothing -- >> oh, wow. >> there's nothing other than ourselves on stage. that was jamie's vision. i would say that that kind of allows us to do the work. it's a beautiful score that andrew lloyd webber's written. they have written some unbelievable lyrics and scenes. just allowing the work to do itself is something i try to do every night. >> tom, as we saw in the video, it's visually striking. the use of cameras and projections, describe that for those at home. >> it's just a visceral

experience. we have this huge, huge video screen. i'm not sure how big it is, but it's impressive. >> it's beyonce size. >> that gets used quite a lot. it's just the sensory overload with this show. the sound design is incredible. the way the video is used is so cool. >> your voices are so powerful as well. >> thank you. >> nicole, we're the same age. we're 46. you talk about getting older as an actress and how it's empowered you. can you talk about that? >> absolutely. this story deals a lot with the subject of ageism, as you get older, not only in this industry, but in society it gets more difficult. i wanted to flip that on its head. i call it age-iliscious where you have to celebrate where you are right now. there's no better time. this is our prime.

never been stronger, more fit, more courageous, more brave. to be able to have lived a life and tell a meaningful story and create meaningful art. >> you all push a lot of boundaries in this performance in terms of its power and different effects, including the second act starts outside. tom, talk about, if you could, the -- [ laughter ] >> it's so cool. >> how does that work? is that real? >> yes. it's not every night. basically we do this bit in the show where we go through the whole of the theater and i start singing the title song on the streets of broadway. >> isn't that risky? >> well, we -- >> we've got a great security team. >> there's lots and lots -- >> he's out there rain or shine. >> i'm always out there. >> thank god he loves the cold weather. even in england he was out there without a jacket in a blizzard.

>> i'm going to photo bomb you. >> yes, please come. >> you don't understand. >> every night. >> i have to. >> the musical "sunset boulevard" is playing now at the st. james theater. co-stars nicole and tom, thank you both. congratulations. >> thank you. >> speaking of broadway, this month playbill is celebrating 140 years of serving the theater community. to celebrate the iconic magazine for theater goers teamed up with every show on broadway to design four collectible retro covers. these were sitting here when i got onset. i was like what? commemorating different playbills throughout the month. all broadway patrons will receive one of these legacy covers. the complete collection can be

found at playbill.com. posters are also available with the proceeds to go to broadway cares, equity fights aids. that does it for us this morning. we'll see you first thing tomorrow morning. a lot to talk about. ana cabrera picks up the coverage after a short break. ♪♪ with fastsigns, signage that gets you noticed turns hot lots into homes. ♪♪

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