the senate is almost surely going republican. i'm actually not sure why the harris campaign hasn't leaned into more the threat that they could present. not only could you be electing donald trump, you could be electing unified republican government to do whatever he wants to do. i think we often see in polling that when you talk about a message of checks and balances, that works really well. on the flip side, presenting donald trump not only as being put back in power but potentially having a congress that will be unified and do his bidding, i think could be a stark contrast. >> yeah, we'll have to see if the harris campaign leans on the message the last couple days. we expect her to deliver a form of a closing argument at the ellipse in washington, where trump spoke on january 6th. political analyst brendan buck, thank you, as always. we'll talk soon. thanks to all of you for getting up "way too early" with us on this monday morning. "morning joe" start right now.

we have the ability to turn the page on the same old tired playbook, because we are exhausted with it. >> these people are for real. you know, the cows are going to disa disappear. no more cows. no more anything. these people are crazy. >> we are ready to chart a new way forward, and, yes, we will be joyful in the process. >> what is happening with the whales? i've read about this. >> the wind is rushing, things are blowing, vibration, and it makes noise. you know what it is? i want to be a whale psychiatrist. it drives the whales freaking crazy. >> we have an opportunity before us to turn the page on the fear. >> they want me to say, oh, detroit is great. it's so great. it needs help. i said it needs help, and people said, oh, he wasn't positive. i can't be positive. >> and the divisiveness that have characterized our politics

for a decade because of donald trump. >> we're the garbage can for the world. we're like a garbage can, and they dump their criminals. >> this election is about two extremely different visions for our nation. >> i have the greatest resorts in the world. i could have been extremely happy. i could have had those beautiful waves smack me in the face. i could have had the beautiful suntan. this white, white skin could have been tan and beautiful. >> we are a new generation of leadership that is optimistic and excited about what our nation can do together! >> we have to finish it off with a big victory on november 5th. we will be a nation in decline no longer from the day that happens. >> wow. some of the very different messages coming from the two campaigns over the weekend.

stark difference. that didn't even include what came out of trump's rally at madison square garden. we're going to get to all of that in just a moment. good morning. welcome to "morning joe." it is monday, october 28th. with us, we have the host of "way too early," white house bureau chief at "politico," jonathan lemire. u.s. special correspondent for bbc news, katty kay, is with us this morning. president of the national action network and host of msnbc's "politics nation," reverend al sharpton is here. and ceo of the messina group, jim messina. jim served as white house deputy chief of staff to president obama and ran his 2012 re-election campaign. with just over a week until election day, new polling is showing vice president kamala harris with a slight edge over donald trump. a new abc news poll among likely voters haas harris up by four

points. 51% to 47%. that is within the margin of error. the poll also shows harris ahead of trump among key demographics. harris leads point by 30 points among latino voters, a group biden won by 33 points in 2020. according to abc news exit polling, harris also has a 19 point lead among suburban women, a 6 point gain from biden in 2020. among black voters, harris is outperforming biden's 2020 margin with black men by 14 points and by 7 points with black women. with college graduates, harris has a ten-point gain from biden in 2020. when it comes to white men with college degrees, trump won the group by three points in 2020, but now harris is winning by four points in this poll. and for white women with college

degrees, harris is winning by 14 points. that's more than biden in 2020. on top issues, harris leads by 6 points when it comes to looking out for the middle class. and by 10 points when it comes to health care. harris leads trump by 11 points as being seen for having the mental sharpness it takes to effectiveness serve as president. her advantage widened to 29 points on having the physical health to serve effectively. most voters see her as honest and trustworthy, likely to understand the problems of people like you, to share personal values, and to be trusted in a crisis. meanwhile, more voters think trump is more likely to say the things that are not true. registered voters are more than twice as likely to call donald trump a fascist than to say the same about kamala harris.

joe, what do you make of these numbers? there's a lot of other information to bring in. also, what appears to be the closing argument by the trump side, and that contrast with the harris campaign. >> we'll start with the last question first. you know, donald trump could win. everybody in his campaign thinks he can win. every republican in america, except those that are quietly voting for kamala harris, are running around saying he's going to win. they have -- i haven't seen a side this confident since mitt romney's side in 2012 knew he was going to beat barack obama. they just kept saying it. they were so sure they were going to win that it was mitt romney and karl rove who were shocked on election night and knew something had to be wrong with numbers because they weren't winning. so the bubble inside donald trump world is overwhelming, saying that donald trump is going to win this race. again, reminds me so much of 2012. everybody was shocked, actually,

when barack obama ended up winning and winning easily. we don't know where we are here. it's tied. that is the latest. that is the latest of polls. of course, the last nbc -- or the last "new york times"/siena poll that came out several days earlier had it tied, but also had her breaking, had things breaking her way. so hard to say which direction the poll is going. i will say, though, on the closing arguments, i just -- again, i've always believed that -- and i told donald trump in the distant past and other people in his administration -- politics is about addition. it's not about subtraction. >> right. >> i surprised myself by still being surprised by how negative, how exclusionary, how racist the attacks against puerto rico, the attacks again against hispanics,

echoing what donald trump said years ago, that hispanics were breeders. it's still surprising to me that any side in any campaign, in any part of american history would act that way, but they are completely confident they're going to win. jim messina, you know, this abc poll, again, the latest poll. interesting to see if other polls follow it. but you have trend lines going the way the harris campaign would obviously want it to be. same with siena, trend lines where late breakers were breaking dramatically toward her. i think the number i keep going back to, and it's a number that i have been looking at for three years now, with donald trump who is going to run, and the number is 47. donald trump is at 47%. donald trump is at 48%.

there was a time when people were cheering the 20% that bobby kennedy was going to take off the board to make 47% enough. that's not happening now. i guess if harris does win, and she has a four point lead, like 51 to 47, everybody is going to go, you know, why, of course, you idiots. he was never getting over 47%. maybe we'll be saying that, but i still think that's the question. for donald trump to win, this isn't even 40 years ago, he needs 48%, 49% most likely in national polls. for a lot of reasons, demographic shifts we won't waste our viewers' time with. that's where i'm stuck. he has a hard ceiling. how does he win with 47% of the

vote nationally, even as you eject that toward electoral college votes? >> joe, he doesn't. you're exactly right. the weird thing is, someone should call his campaign and explain your math to them. they have been stuck at 47, 47.5 for a year. yet, joe, what is their closing argument? in a race they desperately need another point, point and a half, maybe two points, the close is to ostracize voters, end with anger, end with racism, end with an argument that only their base could appreciate, and not even all their base. campaigns, you and i talked about this a lot, are contrasts. you can't end this campaign better if you're the harris campaign. what you want is very clear. optimism, hope, and the future over the anger of the past. donald trump is giving you that repeatedly. you know, don't believe you and i. look at the nbc poll. by ten points, late breaking voters are moving to her. you can tell why, because she

has a message to them. is it close? of course it is. is it always going to be close? of course it is. but what you need to do at the end is move your voters to vote and to get the persuadables to move at the end. right now, it looks like from early vote numbers and from polls, she's doing that, joe. >> i don't understand. again, i've never understood the anger, the hatred, the whole idea. i guess the problem is the party is motivated by a central theme. that is own the libs. but they don't realize when that's their theme, you have conservatives like me, more conservative than anybody that spoke last night -- you can say that about liz cheney, too. balanced the budget four years in a row. fought for conservative issues. actually believed, unlike jd vance, you push back against russian aggression. so you want people like me, that

even if they're not republicans anymore, to go, okay, well, that's fine. you want guys in wisconsin, older guys in wisconsin and michigan and pennsylvania going, yeah, that makes a lot of sense. but last night was as bizarre and confusing as the final weeks has been. it is optimism versus pessimism. it is joy versus retribution and rage. >> love versus hate. >> it's what i just didn't understand about calling puerto rico a floating pile of garbage, you know, attacking the united states, as he has. anyway, i want to go back, though, jim, because you're so perfect for this. you were there in 2012. i think you and i would agree, this race is tied. we don't know which way it is going to break.

but it is crazy, i don't know if it's a pose, but donald trump, the people around donald trump, the trump campaign, everybody else, they have been crowing that they've got this in the bag for three months now. again, i see no data privately or publicly to suggest they've got this in the bag. it just seems like a repeat of 2012 when they were saying the same thing about mitt romney. that he was going to beat obama by seven points. it just never happened. this has got to seem like deja vu all over again to you. >> absolutely, joe. you know, at the time, i remember the romney campaign telling reporters, look at our rallies. look at the momentum. look at the excitement of our base. that stuff doesn't matter. that matters is sheer, cold, hard numbers. when you look at who is early voting in atlanta, who is early voting in michigan, wisconsin,

and pennsylvania, it tells a very, very different story. you know, there's a 10 square mile logic-free zone called washington, d.c. in washington, d.c., people are like, look at the momentum trump has. show me that from the data, from the breaking numbers in the nbc poll. show me this abc poll, the numbers mika laid out. i mean, the number i thought was the most amazing, mika, was the six-point lead for her on middle class. who fights for the middle class? that's a really important number for these late, breaking voters who are mostly economic voters. you know, you just can't look at this and say he has this in the bag. all they are trying to do is display confidence and try to display strength because it's all they have left, joe. >> you know, the last couple polls have shown -- not just the abc poll. i think "the new york times" and siena poll has also shown, you know, who cares about people like you, cares more about

people like you? she's winning it and winning it comfortably. again, i don't understand the confidence. listen, i'm going to say this one more time, i think the race is tied. i have no idea what direction this race is going in. i'm genuinely confused why everybody around donald trump, everybody in that stratosphere, says they're going to win this easily. it is going to be a landslide. i don't understand it. you never know. you know what? when you make the mistake of thinking you've got it in the bag, which i never -- even when i was up 25 points in polls, i never let my staff think anything other than we were down five points and we didn't have enough time to catch up. we had to get out and work throughout the night so we ended up winning by 40 points. i mean, that's how you think. but i'm saying this not so much

for republicans who say, oh, he's got it in the bag. i'm saying this for democrats who are believing this. i'm hearing this. i'm hearing calls from people going, oh. not the campaign. the campaign has a steely-eyed optimism. i'm getting calls from a lot of other people, some people on this show, oh, so bad, ah. i keep going, it reminds me of 2012. >> yeah. >> you don't know who is going to win. look at these clips from 2012, fox news. >> the voters vote. the counters count. as the candidates and their supporters hold their breath. we will take you through all of it. >> well, i have great respect for our decision desk, and i see they're very happy in chicago. but i have to tell you, the romney camp has real doubts about the call that has been made by us and i guess other networks about ohio. they do not believe that ohio is

in the obama camp. i just got an email from a top romney person. i said, do you agree with the call? he said, not really. went through this in 2000. almost went through this in 2004. do you believe ohio has been settled? >> no, i don't. i understand what karl is saying, but if you look at some of these counties that are left out there, there are votes, a lot of votes left for obama. >> here's what we're going to do. karl rove said we should figure out what the deal is with this decision desk. the decision desk is in a different place, and i showed you earlier in the 6:00 hour what it takes to get there. i will escort you down the steps so you can interview them. >> all right. >> watch your step. >> thank you. i don't want to fall. >> there you go. >> in front of these millions of people. >> okay. >> all right. >> this only tells part of the story, mika, but go ahead. >> first of all, that doesn't prove the opposite is going to happen. i know that's not what you were presenting there. we don't know. >> that's why i said it is going

to be a tie. >> exactly. >> that's why i'm saying it is a tie right now. >> i was just validating that. i think also explaining some of what you're hearing is a sense of discouragement that it is so close, given the darkness and the threats, the serious threats to democracy and to people. >> yeah. >> on the trump said. >> right, right. jonathan lemire, i wanted to show the clips just to show that, again, that doesn't really fully explain the bubble that the republican party was in in 2012. >> right. >> but we talked about it a good bit. they talked about it afterwards. even had some, we're going to have to reassess and reboot the campaign -- or the party. that went well for them, didn't it? but behind the scenes, stories, and i know you were reporting on this, other people were, stories behind the scenes about the romneys, everybody in the camp because they'd just been listening to right-wing sources

throughout the entire campaign. they couldn't believe that they weren't crushing barack obama by the seven, eight points, that gallup, drudge report, their supporters were saying beforehand. i'm hearing from brashness from the trump campaign. are you whistling past the graveyard? again, maybe they win, but i've seen no data whatsoever to suggest that they have the confidence. my warning would be for either side, if you're sitting there telling everybody you've got it in, you know -- that you've got it, you've won, man, that is the wrong stance to be taking a week out. >> the romneys famously in 2012 had a rally i believe at the airport in pittsburgh on election eve. huge crowds. they turned to each other and

said, the romneys themselves, senior staff, like, we've got this. they lost pennsylvania. they lost the election. it is easy to fall into that bubble, to just talk to people who agree with you, to just watch news sources who are saying the things you want to hear. that was the case in 2012. it is more so now. things are that much more extreme and fragments. we know republicans have that much less of a relationship with the truth now than they did even 12 years ago. this race is tied. you're right, the trump campaign is extremely confident. they were thrown in july/august when the vice president took the top of the ticket. since then, they feel like, we've still got this in the bag. that's what last night at madison square garden was meant to be, a closing argument but almost a victory rally. we'll get into how offensive and racist so much of last night was. but that's how they feel things are right now. the vibes are with trump, but vibes are not votes. we just went through the data in the abc news poll which is, i think, the best poll harris has had in a while in terms of demographics.

counter the narrative that she is losing support among black and latino voters. that poll suggests that, actually, he's running as well as biden did, maybe even a little better. we're seeing also in the early voting the data, a real gender gap in number of these states from a day or so ago. 14 points plus, more women voting in michigan. 13 in pennsylvania. 12 in georgia. 10 in wisconsin. 9 in north carolina. those are five of the seven battlegrounds. that, the harris team, mika, they believe that's the secret here. >> okay. >> the end vote is not going to be, they believe, the young men breaking for trump. some might happen. they think it'll be overwhelmed by women, maybe quietly, but breaking for harris on abortion rights and other issues here in the last week. >> i think we've sort of set the scene of the state of the race, and now we have a lot to get to, including the litany of hatred and darkness at madison square garden last night. >> yes. >> michelle obama and kamala harris in kalamazoo, wow, what a

difference. also, we have some incredible stories of women with reproduct reproductive emergencies happening right now that went dreadfully wrong. that's ahead. we're back in 90 seconds. singer: this is our night! shingles doesn't care. but shingrix protects! only shingrix is proven over 90% effective. shingrix is a vaccine used to prevent shingles in adults 50 years and older. shingrix doesn't protect everyone and isn't for those with severe allergic reactions to its ingredients or to a previous dose. tell your healthcare provider if you're pregnant or breastfeeding. increased risk of guillain-barré syndrome was observed after getting shingrix. fainting can happen so take precautions. most common side effects are pain, redness, and swelling where injected, muscle pain, tiredness, headache, shivering, fever, and upset stomach. ask your doctor about shingrix today.

23 past the hour. welcome back to "morning joe." donald trump held a rally yesterday in new york city at madison square garden. his supporters packed the arena for what the trump campaign

called a closing message to voters. the setting was interesting given the history. the event featured nearly 30 warm-up speakers, some making extremely offensive and racist comments about immigrants, democrats, and vice president kamala harris. a radio personality received cheers from the crowd when he said, and i won't say the word, f-ing illegals get everything they want. a described lifelong friend to the former president called the vice president the antichrist and the devil, all while waving a crucifix on stage. another speaker compared harris to a prostitute with pimp handlers. and a former fox news host mocked the vice president's racial identity. sarcastically saying she is impressive as the first samoan, malaysian, low if, former

california prosecutor ever to be elected president. it was also a comedian who made extremely vile, so-called jokes about latinos and puerto rico. what we're going to do here is not feed into hate and play it all, but there is a few striking moments that cut through. we're going to play for you two of them. so you get a sense of how crude the rhetoric was coming out of the rally. take a look. >> believe it or not, people, i welcome migrants to the united states of america with open arms. and by open arms, i mean like this. it's wild. these latinos, they love making babies, too. just know that. they do. they do. there's no pulling out. they don't do that. they come inside, just like they did to our country.

there's a lot going on. like i don't know if you know this, but there is literally a floating island of garbage in the middle of the ocean right now. yeah, i think it's called puerto rico. okay, all right. okay, we're getting there. >> so you heard the laughter. in a statement, the trump campaign senior adviser tried to do a little damage control with puerto ricans, saying, quote, this joke does not reflect the views of president trump or the campaign. as a quick related aside, yesterday, vice president harris was promoting a new plan to help puerto rico's economy during her rally in philadelphia. pop star bad bunny posted harris' pledge to his 45 million instagram followers, jennifer lopez. the former president took to the stage two hours later than he

was scheduled, delivering his usual lies and threats to opponents, including calling his opponents, once again, the enemy from within. >> we're running against something far bigger than joe or kamala, and far more powerful than them, which is a massive, vicious, crooked, radical left machine that runs today's democrat party. they're just vessels. in fact, they're perfect vessels because they'll never give them a hard time. they'll do whatever they want. i know many of them. it's just this amophous group of people, but they're smart and they're vicious. we have to defeat them. when i say the enemy from within, the other side goes crazy. becomes a sound bite. oh, how can he say? no, they've done very bad things to this country. they are indeed the enemy from within. but this is who we are fighting. >> rev, the reason why there are

many who are very concerned about those comments is because trump means what he says when he makes a threat. he has immunity. he'd be coming into a second term. if you look at how the rise of autocrats around the world, often the second time is the charm because they have a sense of how to manage the situation and bring in sycophants, surround themselves with sycophants and not people who ultimately held the line last time around, like mike pence. so with that in mind, we put that aside, because i think those comments that were made by the comedian really cut through about puerto rico. so unbelievably degrading, this event was, to immigrants and to human beings who live in this country as free american citizens or legal immigrants. >> i think that was what was so striking to me, is that this comedian said this early in the night. no one got up, including donald

trump, and denounced what he said. there was a statement released later by the campaign. how do you let someone get on the stage and say something like that, and no one refutes it, as people in the audience laughed and cheered? >> it cut through, didn't it? >> i got calls all night because we work closely with puerto rican leadership. it reminded a lot of them of when donald trump was president. there was a real big storm that destroyed part of puerto rico. he went down and threw towels at them. it was consistent with what he said. let's also go to what donald trump himself said last night, that some of the black men group i've been debating about, why they can't be with trump, he said, i could be laying out on the beach in my white, white skin, getting tanned. this is donald trump's mouth saying this. >> right. >> i said to those on the fence,

this is not a real racial signal? my pretty white, beautiful white, white skin? donald trump said this last night at his homecoming. when people said that this was like reminiscent of the supremacist rally in 1939, the nazis. >> very scary. >> i think it lived up to that. i agree with joe, though, they cannot get comfortable in the harris side. i was around in '12 and involved, but i ran in '04. after john kerry won the nomination, we thought it was over. i campaigned for kerry all over. we were headed into the plains, boston, talking about who should be in the transition team, some of us who had been surrogates. then bush won. they should not find comfort. people ought to see the people they're running against openly make racist statements, including mr. trump with his pretty white or beautiful white skin, and that should motivate people to come out.

>> they had a chance yesterday. joe, in a moment, we will be showing michelle obama and kamala harris in kalamazoo and what a difference that was. take it. >> yeah. i will say, too, and i feel like, again, all of this probably makes jim messina twitch. jim, by the way, i have to go to jonathan lemire in a second, but i have to say, jim, i remember in 2022, we were on the special set. we were talking to you. we kept saying, oh, everybody is saying there is a red wave. we don't see it, but is there a red wave? what are you going to be looking for tonight? you said, first of all, i'm not getting in front of the tv until 8:00. i'm going radio silent. you never know what is going to happen. i think that's what i'm going to do. that's a brilliant idea. but, again, and i'm not just saying this for democrats who -- the campaign is working so hard, extraordinarily hard. like i said, they have a steely-eyed confidence. they're exactly what democrats want. you're getting calls from

bedwetters. i'm getting calls from bedwetters. oh, are we going to -- you don't know. i'm so glad that reverend al brought up 2004. i was on the phone with the senior member of the kerry staff at about 6:00 p.m., and they were talking about cabinet positions. we've got this locked up. we've seen it. i will tell you, in 2016, i was talking to one of trump's top people who came through 30 rock, went through the slide show, and says, looks like we're going to come up short. we'll lose iowa by two points. went through all the states they were going to lose and why they were going to lose. but it was off the record. then later that night of 2016, i talked to somebody in the clinton campaign at about 6:30. they said, yeah, these are our numbers. we're going to win six out of seven swing states. we may win seven out of seven swing states.

again, nobody knows nothing. people saying who are going to win it, i'll tell you who, it is who works the hardest the last seven days and gets their voters out, right? >> absolutely. joe, i go back to michelle obama's speech at the democratic national convention. shut up and do something. stop worrying about the polls. stop worrying about what other people are saying. go out and make phone calls. do postcards. hit the doors. that's what we have to do. we're in a tied race. you run for the tape. you build a contrast. you turn your vote out. that's exactly what the harris campaign is doing. you know, i thought last night was all about the trump campaign's aarrogance. it was having a celebratory moment way before anybody should be dancing. this is when you turn the vote out and talk to swing voters. i promise you, there is nothing in four hours of that rally last night that talked to any swing

voter you and i have ever met. >> well, and that's the thing. this should have been a rally talking to swing voters in michigan, in pennsylvania, in wisconsin, and, instead, we saw just the opposite. you know, jonathan lemire, i will say, there are a lot of republicans that are coming out today, trump supporters, going, oh, yeah, that comedian, what he said, oh, that was bad. don't listen to him. that doesn't -- no. he was standing in front of a trump/vance sign. he continued to speak. nobody called him out. you know, what, i guess three, four hours of speakers afterwards, as reverend al said, and no one called him out. the reason they didn't call him out is donald trump himself has attacked hispanics through the years. we know what his opening campaign speech was, talking about racists from mexico and criminals. we also know he called hispanics

breeders himself. he said they're breeders when they come to our country. so what was said last night was right in line with what donald trump has been saying for years now. >> a long time dream of donald trump's to headline madison square garden. he did it last night. he wanted the spectacle and the attention. he got it but had all the wrong headlines coming out of it. there was a permission structure. the comedian wasn't the only one on stage to say offensive things that -- certainly his comment about puerto rico broke through the loudest. let's remember, of course, 3 million people live in puerto rico. those are u.s. citizens. those are u.s. citizens. and there are a lot of puerto rican s who live in battleground states. >> senator fetterman tweeted out before the rally was over, shortly after the remarks, there are a quarter of a million puerto ricans in pennsylvania alone, three-quarters who can vote. that's about 180,000 votes.

joe biden won by 80,000. every bit makes a difference. there is a permission structure. last night, steven miller saying america is for americans and americans only. reminiscent of what we heard in the 1930s in germany. then i think some of this, the confidence i'm hearing set against that, the confidence i'm hearing, and i was texting yesterday with somebody from the trump campaign, that they think the only state they might lose is wisconsin out of the battleground states. they are dependent on young men, as he said, to drive up their turnout. then you look at these early vote numbers, and it's predominantly women who are turning out in such big numbers in some of the states. that makes a huge difference. some of this, you're right, it's the bubble. as joe was suggesting, is there a bubble inside the trump campaign that is feeding this? yes, the race is tight. >> i would like to push back. >> but they have to depend on the young men. >> on the bubble to an extend. i understand all these things

can be true at the same time, and it is close. but because i was one of those people calling you, joe, i'd like to defend myself. a lot of people are seeing the rally at madison square garden, seeing all those people doesn't mean he'll win the race. but my point is it is discouraging that so many people would gather and rally to hate, to hate speech in america. it's discouraging, and it hurts. that people who have family in puerto rico, who are puerto rican americans, who are american citizens, are hearing hate like that, it's discouraging. joe, i do want to show michelle obama in kalamazoo, but i just think it's important to look at the situation. it's not just, oh, my gosh about the race. it's, oh, my gosh, how did we get here? >> of course. >> a stadium of people come to hate.

>> well -- >> that's a different country, a different time. >> you know how you get past that? >> how do you get past that? >> work harder, vote. >> yes. >> and win. that's how you get past that. i want to really quicklymessina message that brings people together. i want to quickly read a message that brings people together. it was ronald reagan, father of the modern republican party. in his last speech to america, think believe is one of the most important sources of america's greatness. we lead the world because unique among nations, we draw our people, our strength, from every country and every corner of the world. by doing so continuously, we renew and enrich our nation while other countries cling to the paths. in america, we breathe life into dreams, create the future, and the world follows us tomorrow. thanks to each new wave of new

arrivals to this land of opportunity, we are a nation for every young, forever bursting with energy and new ideas, and always on the cutting edge and always leading the world as the next frontier. this is vital to our future. if we ever close the door to new americans, our leadership in the world would soon be lost. you had hitler talking about germans for germans. last night, you had speakers talking about america for americans. here in ronald reagan's final speech, he says, we are new. we are forever renewed, forever strong, because we open our doors to the rest of the world. he says, if we ever close that door to new americans, our leadership in the world would soon be lost. >> yes. >> that, my republican friends, that is a closing statement. >> yes. yes, it is. we'll get to the closing arguments and the location in a

moment. vice president kamala harris spent her entire sunday in philadelphia, making a pitch to black and latino voters. she visited a church, a barbershop, a bookstore, and a puerto rican restaurant before holding a rally at a youth basketball facility. during her address, the vice president slammed her opponent for his dark rhetoric and promised to win the election. >> we have an opportunity before us to turn the page on the fear and the divisiveness that has characterized our politics for a decade because of donald trump. we have the ability to turn the page on that same old, tired playbook, because we are exhausted with it! [ applause ] and we are ready to chart a new

way forward. yes, we will be joyful in the process. philly, we have nine days. nine days. nine days left in one of the most consequential elections of our lifetime. and we know this is going to be a tight race until the very end. so we have a lot of work ahead of us. but we like hard work. hard work is good work. hard work is joyful work. and make no mistakes, we will win. [ applause ] we will win. we will win. for the next nine days, no one can sit on the sidelines. there is too much on the line, and we must not wake up the day after the election and have any redprgrets about what we could e done in these next nine days. we are fighting for a future of

our nation where we tap into the ambitions and the aspirations and the dreams of the american people. we are a new generation of leadership that is optimistic and excited about what our nation can do together. [ applause ] and the great thing about living in a democracy as long as we keep it, is that we, the people, have the power to choose the direction of our country and its leadership. the power is with the people! >> the power is with the people, not one man. rev, i'm sorry, but talk about taking you to church. taking you to church.

mika is talking about the grimness that she saw at the rally last night, this campaign, and being troubled by it. i know one of your favorite bible verses is, weeping may endure for a night, but joy cometh in the morning. and joe cometh in the morning to those who studied and showed themselves a worker who is not ashamed in front of the lord. weeping may endure for a night. if you're looking at the rally and it depresses you, the campaign depresses you, work hard, because joy cometh in the morning. >> the key word there is work hard. when you see -- just imagine if you are a puerto rican child, a black child, looking at that rally at the garden. >> geez. >> you should not become depressed. you ought to be, in many ways, energized, that we've got to stop this. i looked at that and said, i could now look at how jewish kids looked at the 1939 rally in

madison square garden. that pain has to be turned into you being empowered. we've got a few days left to turn that around. when people will openly and proudly go and fill up madison square garden and say the things they said, it makes you -- it should make you go to work, not go in your shell. >> right. you really do wonder, parents who are proud americans, who are raising their children to be proud americans, who are from puerto rico, what do they say to their children after hearing that? really, my gosh, it makes me sad as an american that puerto rican parents, that americans who are from puerto rico are having to talk to their children this morning before they go to school, so they won't be bullied because of what was said at donald trump's rally last night. let's bring in managing editor of the bulwark, sam stein. author of the book "how the right lost its mind," charlie sykes. charlie, the book title says it

all this morning. again, everything that ronald reagan taught this republican party, our republican party, that led him to winning 49 states, that led him to a landslide victory in 1980, that allowed him to bring americans together as he led the reagan revolution, all of those ideas were thrown out years ago. years ago. as being irrelevant. they seem more irrelevant today than ever before. if you want to reach an older man in wisconsin, that's not how you do it. you do it by talking the way reagan talked. when it comes to immigration, talking about a country that opens the door -- its doors to the world, who still believes that it is the city shining on a hill brightly for all the world to see.charlie, charlie, that's how we used to think when

our republican party was our republican party, when it was reagan's republican party. >> you know, for the last nine years, i have used that passage and read it to folks who are saying that, somehow, this is a continuation of conservatism or what ronald reagan talked about. ronald reagan, you can't even imagine those words being spoken in madison square garden last night. you can't even imagine any speaker saying anything remotely like that. now, you asked an interesting question, what do the parents of puerto rican children tell their children about what they heard last night? what does any parent tell any child about the kind of hate and vulgarity and offensiveness and racism and insults that you heard last night? this is a hell of a closing argument we're seeing right now, and i hope we don't get numb to it. because what you saw last night wasn't a disciplined or coherent

campaign. this is donald trump, and we need to take it seriously and literally. the threats he is making, the insults, the culture he's created. that's what struck me. to mika's point, you know, after nine years, he has created a political culture where you can fill madison square garden with people who listen to that and say, yeah, that's the message i like. 47% of americans think, yes, i'm okay with this. i'm okay with the mass deportations. i'm okay with the attacks on latinos and puerto ricans and jews. you know, talking about pimps and the attack on kamala harris. this is a dark moment that we have right now. but i'm really glad you're playing kind of the split screen, of the closing arguments of the two campaigns. i don't think the contrast could be much starker. >> sam, let's talk more about kamala harris and what she has to do. a lot of time is spent talking

about donald trump. indeed, she spends a lot of time speaking about donald trump, as well. she's got this big speech on the ellipse tomorrow night, on tuesday night, a week out from the election. and the choice, i guess, for her campaign that they have to make is how much of this time is spent, as they have done over the last week or so, directing some of the message to donald trump and the threat he poses, and how much of it is spent on her agenda and what she would offer to americans? i know there's some debate within the campaign about the balance that is right for that. what are you expecting from tomorrow night? >> you know, there is debate in the campaign. obviously, she's leaned in more heavily to the trump contrast in recent days and weeks. i think part of that is because, frankly, it's been presented to her on a tea, right? trump says the enemy within and references nancy pelosi and adam schiff. when john kelly says, yeah, he is realistic, when you get the

praise of hitler's generals. how do you not pick that up, right? economic focus, trying to sell her in an affirmative sense. it is more of an either/and, not an either/or. tomorrow night, i think she's going to make the contrast. the key, i suppose for her, is can you -- i mean, the settle is the ellipse, right? the setting is this is where donald trump incited the insurrection on january 6th. they want the contrast. the question is, can she tie that contrast into an affirmative case for her campaign? can she say to the voters, look, this is why you have to vote for me, because, you know, these are things at stake. i can do x, y, and z. let me add one thing. the question is everything is about trump and we need to talk about harris. to charlie and mika's point, and something for harris to consider tuesday night, yeah.

the thing striking about yesterday to me was what wasn't there. eight years ago, four years ago, if trump held a rally in madison square garden, i suspect there would have been a huge backlash in new york city, counter protest, anger, things in the streets. nothing there, didn't happen last night. leading up to the rally, what we saw, in fact, was the ceos have warmed up to trump. major publisher of the newspaper, "washington post," jeff bezos, pulled the endorsement. the people who are the guardrails or who you have been in past runs are not there right now. i think for harris on tuesday night, that is a point she can make. look, we are the guardrails. this is it. trump is talking about enemies within. he's talking about using the military against american citizens. if we vote for this, he will have the license to do it because he ran on it and we voted for it. that's his mandate. if she the make that case tomorrow night, it might be

effective. >> again, the anticipatory kowtowing to a guy who is saying he is going to be an autocrat is the first step. >> right. "washington post." >> as billionaires are running "the washington post," "the new york times," running x, all this preemptory bowing to donald trump. i have to say, this is just me, you can be upset about that. but if i'm running against that guy and those three billionaires, whew, it is going to be a fun final nine days. it's the billionaires versus us. it is the billionaires versus we the people. we can win. they can have their billions and buy their newspapers, but we the people can have the final word. one final thought, too, on this

final week, week and a half. the october surprise has been what donald trump has said. >> yeah. >> the national guard, the military after his political opponents, pushing back when people say, you don't mean that, do you? yeah, of course i mean it. he continues to say it. again, we end this segment where jim messina and i began this segment. 47%, 48%. how do you get above the 47%, 48%? he's going to need to, most likely, to win this race. >> right. >> and so that's the big question. >> jim -- >> and we'll see. >> jim messina, thank you very much for coming on this morning. we truly appreciate it. we'll see you soon. coming up, congresswoman alexandria ocasio-cortez will join us with her reaction to donald trump's rally and the racist remark heard about puerto ricans.

plus, former first lady michelle obama makes the case for kamala harris during a rally in battleground michigan. she took the house down. we'll bring you the highlights from yesterday's nfl games, including a miraculous hail mary touchdown. did you see that, lemire? my daughter was there. pablo torre joins us in the studio with that. dodgers and yankees in game three of the world series tonight. we're back in two minutes.

your business needs a network it can count on... even during the unexpected. power's out! power's out! -power's out! power's out! -power's out comcast business has you covered, with wifi backup to help keep you up and running. wifi's up. let's power on! let's power on! let's power on! -let's power on! it's from the company with 99.9% network reliability. plus advanced security. let's power on! power on with the leader in connectivity. powering possibilities. comcast business. power's out. first down, jameer gibbs with the opening. gibbs, one man to beat. he'll beat him! touchdown! >> now hands it off. oh, touch for the outside. josh jacobs inside the 20, the 10. to the end zone, touchdown! >> just got the snap off.

cousins' rifle shot over the middle for pitch. kyle pitts is loose again for his second of the day. >> tight ends in the set. >> one-handed grab. >> herbert, sideline throw. the catch is made. >> wow! >> it's away from taylor. and he is in for a charger touchdown! >> winston going for it all. for the end zone for tillman. he's got it! >> fake it to barkley, sets, throws, looking for the home run ball. end zone, devonta smith touchdown! >> comes down to one last play. it's going to be getting longer by the second. all the way back at the 30 yard line. now you can step into it. here comes the hail mary with the game on the line. and the ball is caught!

it's caught! it's a miracle! >> come on. tj just said it's backyard football. that's like when we were younger playing in big flats, new york, in the snow, running around, and somebody would whip the frozen nerf football, like, 40 yards. it'd bounce off. nobody would believe this happened in the nfl, but it did! oh, my lord, what a play. what a player in jayden daniels. those are some of the biggest touchdowns from across the nfl yesterday. ending on the last second hail mary that gave the commanders an improbable, almost impossible 18-15 victory over the chicago bears. pablo torre, msnbc contributor, meadow lark media. lions and the browns. we could talk about the deshaun watson-less browns.

we could talk about the losers of the day. you have to say the cowboys at this point, it's surreal. it really is surreal. >> always. >> or the biggest loser yesterday, aaron rodgers. a jets team that, coming into the season, some were predicting would go to the super bowl. a good jets team overall. but you cannot hand the keys to somebody as volatile as aaron rodgers and expect him to bring you a team together. that's what's happened. we can talk about those winners. we can talk about the losers. but we have to talk about the guy that i would put, a least for the first half of the season, as the league's mvp, jayden daniels. i'll be the first to admit, i thought he was good at lsu. i never saw this coming. >> no. >> this guy is nothing short of extraordinary. >> there is a messianic aspect to him, joe, simply because of the recent -- actually, let's just go forever history of this franchise. this is a team that could not feel good about their name, their mascot, their owner, their

performance, their history at quarterback. you have a guy who comes from the clouds and drops manna like this. i just want to point something out for this play, for those who weren't necessarily sort of following the x's and o's here. there was a dude on the bears, number 29, i believe, taunting the commanders' fans. that happens to be the same guy who tips that ball, that then flips backward into the hands of that receiver for the commanders and gives, of course, this game-winning hail mary. >> instant karma going to get ya, baby. >> it's also, i believe, this is a fireable offense. there are ways to defend this play. this is the business school case study for what not to do on a play like this. it's one of those things, joe, speaking of the karma of all of it, it's one of the things you don't expect to happen to you when you're a terrible franchise. so this moment, with jayden daniels as the symbol, more than

the guy responsible, it was a bunch of mistakes, it's the feeling that you've been waiting decades for. of course, they're feeling it in that building. >> pablo, certainly, as mentioned, the new england patriots are terrible, yet they beat aaron rodgers and the jets, probably ending their season. as joe mentioned, it was one of those sundays where, with exception to the chiefs who always win, it's one of the sundays that show anything can happen. deshaun watson-less browns beat the ravens who i think many thought were going to be the chiefs' strongest challenge in the afc. >> look, everybody -- i say this to you as often as i can. everybody, short of kansas city, is mediocre. when you say, okay, here is jameis winston replacing, as i always say, the most morally compromised quarterback in nfl history in deshaun watson, who had blown out a ligament and is out or the season, you see, okay, the ravens, pencilling in

for a deep afc run, maybe we should consider them in the class of teams that are all kind of like each other. but to me, i mean, the idea that -- i want to go back to the patriots and jets for a second. aaron rodgers, okay, this is a guy who was favored to win two of the last three games. they've lost not just two of the last three but lost five in a row. as joe is eluding to, he has the reins to the whole franchise. there is no slump buster like the new york jets. patriots were a team whose coach called them soft to motivate them desperately recently. all you have to do is play aaron rodgers at this point of 2024, and you feel quite good about yourself. >> pats won with their rookie quarterback getting hurt. let's move to the world series. >> do we have to? >> yes, pablo, that's why you are here. your yankees losing two heartbreakers in l.a. but the series shifts to the bronx. there is a path yankee fans are

surely talking themselves into, why they could still be alive. tell us. >> i haven't talked to representative aoc somewhere around here, fellow yankee fan. the back page of the "daily news," you're like, oh, there's promise here. this is -- we don't need to relive this. >> keep playing that. >> a walk-off grand slam to lose game one. freddie freeman. you know, yeah, stuff like this happens. the argument for the yankees at this point is that the last time a team went down 2-0 in the world series and came back to win happened to be 1996, happened to be the new york yankees against the atlanta braves. this yankee team, as i always say, on paper, has all the talent they need. the issue here is that aaron judge is a clinic himself in how baseball is a deeply mental game. i have seen a lot of things happen in the bronx.

if you're hitting below .120 in the world series, chase a pitch out of the zone every time you see it, this is a -- i don't like saying this, but this is one of those things that changes how you see a person, especially because of the mythology of the yankees. lights are brighter, you get better. the exact opposite is happening to him. it is a crater in the lineup that should be so, so, so much better. >> when the lights are on pablo torre, he shines like a flaming supernova. pablo torre, thank you so much, as always. we love you. let's brick in -- >> i feel like i'm on fire. >> -- founder of "men in blazers," roger bennett. top of the hour. we should be talking about the future of the constitutional republic we call america. >> i can talk about that with you, joe. >> we'll talk about soccer. go. >> oh, the yankees. week nine of the premier league season, it's a weekend of heavyweight mano-e-mano.

the battle of american owners. you have l.a. rams' kroenke and the inspiring arsenal football club welcoming liverpool, your boston red sox owners, joe, fenway sports group. two title contenders. clashing a bit like jayden daniels and caleb williams. arsenal opened the scoring on nine minutes. ben white casually slapping a careless whisper of a pass for saka to whip down the pants of his defender. delirious football made to look easy. liverpool tenacious under their new dutch ball king manager. a flick-on kick by virgil van dijk. this is nfl meets premier league football. inaudible at the line of scrimmage. a goal that felt like a winner. liverpool so resilient.

81st minute, went "washington post" editorial board for arsenal. liverpool carved them open. after the egyptian king, mo salah, bringing the boom, like big justice. it ends 2-2. big point for both teams. across london, l.a. dodgers-owned chelsea, 22-year-old palmer, despite the haircut of jim carrey in "dumb and dumber," just carved the game open. he was electric for newcastle. carved them with the pass. summoned the winner, blasting the ball a bit like freddie freeman. dodgers should fly over cole palmer for replacements. god bless you todd burley, you genius. league leaders, manchester city, beating southampton, 1-0. i watched this in the chicago

bulls hack of shaquille o'neil. earling haaland still won. democracy dies in darkness, joe. >> all right. roger bennett, thank you very much. thank you, roger. five minutes past the top of the hour, and we want to talk about everything that's going on. donald trump had a rally at msg last night, threatening to use the military against his enemies, along with january 6th. that's an issue he's working on normalizing, which is a descent into fascism. stark, jarring moments. there were jokes made about puerto ricans. we'll talk about that. i think the discouragement we're seeing is that we're even here, where there is a stadium full of people that are supporting that. is this what we have come to? everything is on the line. women, women are already paying

the price. former first lady michelle obama delivered an urgent and impassioned message to voters at her first stop on the campaign trail for kamala harris over the weekend. during her speech, he talked about what a second trump presidency would look like. she really was incredibly effective in laying out in the clearest way the brutal double standard that has the added dangerous reality of what could descend this country into fascism if trump wins. she also lays out abortion in america today, because of donald trump, because of an abortion ban, more than half the country, women are not safe. she talks about the horror stories that are coming out because of what has been done to women's health care in america. take a listen to michelle obama in kalamazoo. >> so to the men who love us,

let me just try to paint a picture of what it will feel like if america, the wealthiest nation on earth, keeps revoking basic care from its women. and how it will affect every single woman in your life. your daughter could be the one too terrified to call the doctor if she's bleeding during an unexpected pregnancy. your niece could be the one miscarrying in her bathtub after the hospital turned her away. you will be the one praying that it's not too late. you will be the one pleading for somebody, anybody, to do something. and then there is the tragic but very real possibility that in the worst-case scenario, you just might not be one holding flowers at the funeral. you might be the one left to raise your children alone.

so i am asking y'all from the core of my being to take our lives seriously. please, do not -- [ applause ] do not put our lives in the hands of politicians, mostly men, who has no clue or do not care what we as women are going through, who don't fully grasp the broad-reaching health implications that their misguided policies will have on our health outcomes. the only people who have standing to make these decisions are women with the advice of their doctors. we are the ones with the knowledge and experience to know what we need. [ applause ] so please, please do not hand our fates over to the likes of trump, who knows nothing about us. who has shown deep contempt for

us. because a vote for him is a vote against us. against our health. against our worth. now, don't get me wrong, voters have every right to ask hard questions of any candidate seeking office. but can someone tell me why we are once again holding kamala to a higher standard than her opponent? [ applause ] we expect her to be intelligent and articulate, to have a clear set of policies, to never show too much anger, to prove time and time again that she belongs. but for trump, we -- [ crowd booing ] -- expect nothing at all. no understanding of policy. no ability to put together a coherent argument.

no honesty. no decency. no morals. >> all right. so much there on what michelle obama said. about abortion, the potentials, the realities happening now, if you don't think it's possible, i urge you to look at the stories, the realities that are coming in right now. the know your value instagram, we're pulling them in along with abortion in america. the latest story is a husband whose wife passed out from bleeding out on the bathroom floor. she was not even able to talk. she'd passed out. he loaded up the toddler in the car and brought her to the er. she was bleeding so badly, this was not their first stop. she finally got the health care she needed because she was dying enough. that's just one of many stories we're bringing in. jonathan lemire, katty kay,

carly sykes, and sam stein are still with us. joining us, we have national affairs analyst and partner in chief political columnist at puck, john heilemann. member of the oversight and reform committee, congresswoman alexandria ocasio-cortez of new york. very good to have you on the show this morning. i want you to comment, if you could, on michelle obama's speech. also, perhaps more on exactly how women right now perhaps might be. first of all, the savior of this country, and also the vessel, the example of what donald trump is able to do, what he has done already, the damage he has done. perhaps, people can understand when he is making a threat, when he is normalizing something like january 6th, it is important not to get tricked or not to think he is kidding, to believe him. >> mm-hmm. well, you know, in terms of

michelle obama's speech, what i found to be so resonant and so effective is how much she spoke not only for women, but how much she was speaking to men. >> compelling. >> to the men in our lives who love us. >> yeah. >> in a time right now in this cycle, where there's a lot of gender division happening in our political process right now, the polarization along the lines of gender, especially for young people, to make that direct appeal because women are a powerful force in politics right now, a decisive force, but we also cannot do this alone. >> absolutely. that's why i brought up the traumatized husband. sam stein, you have the next question. >> congresswoman, i appreciate you being here. i'm sort of curious as sort of a tactical political matter. you see the speeches from michelle obama and sort of ask, you know, should the campaign be

leaning even harder into this idea that men specifically have a stake in the abortion debate? that this is not just about women. that men have a responsibility to understand they, too, can be impacted by a post dobbs world. do you think there is a resonance that happens when michelle obama makes these comments, where younger men specifically seeking to have a family, to have a child, recognize that the stakes are there? or is this just one of the cases where you have an unbelievable historic gender gap and you live with it? >> i don't think we just live with this gender gap. i think we have a responsibility to talk to people and to educate and to make the case. part of that means talking to men. we did this right after the dobbs ruling in 2022. saying, this is not just a women's rights issue. this is an issue for men. this is an issue for the fact that, as michelle obama said, when it's your wife, your girlfriend, your partner who is

bleeding out and you are begging a doctor to save their life and they cannot, and if you have to walk home and raise a family on your own without a mother, that is a men's issue. and in these themes of masculinity, if we want to be leaning in as much as the trump campaign talks about being, part of it is protecting your family. to protect your family, part of that means voting for kamala harris and making sure that women's rights and our bodies are protected. the first line of defense from ensuring your wife doesn't bleed out while she's giving birth is making sure she has the right to make decision over her own body. >> congresswoman, last night, right here in new york city, your hometown, donald trump held a packed rally at madison square garden. a number of speakers used down right racist and offensive language. so more so than the so-called comedian who said puerto rico

was an island of garbage. can you give your reaction to what you heard last night, just hours and hours of, frankly, hate, and, frankly, how it could electrify this electorate? >> couple things. as you mentioned, this was a hate rally. this was not just a presidential rally. this was also not just a campaign rally. i think it is very important for people to understand that these are mini january 6th rallies. these are mini stop the steal rallies. these are rallies to prime an electorate into ejecting the results of an election if it doesn't go the way they want. because donald trump and that entire group of people on the stage, stephen miller, et cetera, do not respect the law of the united states of america. they either want to win this election, or they are using rhetoric of taking it by force. that is what they mean, and that's what they're doing when

they are inciting violence and hatred against latinos, black americans, americans who don't have children. you have jd vance literally talking about watering down people's right to vote, depending on if they can viably carry a child or not. we have to understand how unhinged this campaign has gotten. the only reason the rhetoric has gotten this far is precisely pause they are trying to prime the kind of froth that led up to the january 6th attack on the capitol. it is very important we connect those dots. right now, the campaign is scrambling. they're trying to blame this rhetoric on a so-called comedian. this is not a comedian. this is the trump campaign. these are -- they invited this rhetoric on their stage for a reason. it was a chorus of speakers on that campaign for a reason. it was vetted. they knew exactly who was going to say what before they went on. so the only backtracking they're

doing right now is just because tens of thousands of puerto ricans happen to live in philadelphia, florida, michigan, wisconsin. also, the several swing states in the house of representatives that run through the state of new york. they're just realizing they might have made a big error by saying out loud what they're thinking. >> let's be clear, politicians in pennsylvania, politicians in florida, republicans, they're wildly trying to scratch back and apologize and move away from that. mika, in any other political world, in any other political reality, after something like that was said, democratic politicians, republican politicians before donald trump on this level, they would have all condemned the hate speech. they would have all condemned the attacks against puerto ricans who are american citizens. they would have all done that.

but what happened here? one speaker after another speaker after another speaker got up there and talked. nobody condemned him. donald trump got up. didn't say a word about it. so you've got hours and hours of speakers saying more and more offensive things. holding up a crucifix and calling kamala harris evil. >> yeah. >> the antichrist. nobody says that what the comedian said was wrong. by the way, donald trump knew by the time he went on stage the reaction he was getting. he also knew, hey, maybe some bigots on the far right, maybe some angry, young men will be motivated and think it's funny and will be on my side. donald trump, knowing what he said, knowing that puerto rico was called a floating pile of trash, donald trump remained silent.

no, don't go, uh, it's like, okay, puerto ricans, you know. americans, you know. as you have to speak to your child this morning, to say that all americans don't they way. >> uh-huh. >> donald trump does. >> yeah. >> the people that spoke after the median do. there was a very clear opportunity to mitigate the damage, and every speaker last night refused to do it. >> this is what's called normalizing. >> mm-hmm. >> normalizing hatred. let's not mince words about what that leads to. that is the process that leads to fascism. nobody, to your point, joe, katty kay, nobody gets a pass at trashing america. nobody gets a pass at talking like hitler or fancying hitler or calling our veterans or people who died for our country suckers and losers. nobody gets a pass demonizing and degrading people. nobody gets a pass threatening

people. except for convicted felon donald trump. are we going to wake up? >> i mean, it's what -- the other great thing about what michelle obama said over the weekend which i think a lot of women will kind of feel resonates with them, is how does he get a pass on so much, and she's held to this extraordinarily high standard on everything? every woman listening, whether you work in a bakery, accountant's office, capitol hill, i'm sure, congresswoman, in a tv studio, we know exactly what that means. donald trump keeps getting the passes. over the course of the weekend, another thing happened. some of the confidence you hear from the trump campaign, i wonder whether they're setting themselves up for saying afterwards, listen, if we lose, it's not possible because, actually, look how well we were doing. over the weekend, elon musk said that january 6th, in no way a violent insurrection, and perhaps more importantly, said

mail-in ballots are a recipe for fraud. do you think that's what's happening at the moment? >> absolutely what i think is happening. you see the bread crumbs and the puzzle pieces being put together by the republican party right now. even the way they're dropping polls, the number of polls, the way that they are trying to outnumber republican skewed polls. and the way they're undermining elections, mail-in ballots. we're also seeing widely reported incident of a manipulated video about burned, you know -- an attack or ripped up ballots in pennsylvania that would prove to be fraudulent. all of this is exactly a replay of what donald trump did on january 6th. we don't have to think about if this is what happens. this is their playbook that they have used, that led to the deaths of multiple people on january 6th. this led to one of the largest attacks in american history on

the american capitol, on u.s. soil. it was done by exactly this rhetoric. so when the trump campaign says this was just a joke, we're bringing in a comedian, they joke their way right up until the point that people have lost their lives. >> congresswoman alexandria ocasio-cortez, thank you so much for coming on this morning. >> thank you. >> we really appreciate your thoughts, your words, and coming in today. joe, i'm jumping around here, but "the washington post" news is where i'd like to launch from. you can take it from there. you wonder what the deal was there. you know, what was the deal made? they pulled the kamala harris editorial for donald trump. some deal between jeff bezos and donald trump. i wonder what the deal was there that was cut. because what jeff bezos did was trade on america. he traded on american citizens. he traded on his customers bending to trump.

>> yeah. i guess i would be more concerned if a "washington post" editorial -- >> oh, i'm concerned. >> -- or a "new york times" editorial ever changed one vote. i will say, charlie, i know you're with me here, that, you know, usually, these editorials don't make a difference. but, my goodness, how distressing for journalists that work at the place that, you know -- ben bradlee and, you know, bob woodward, and carl bernstein, and our dear friends, david ignatius and gene robinson, to work at a place where your owner steps in and spikes an editorial that the editorial page wrote up. i mean, they're the billionaires. i guess it's their business. they did it at the "l.a. times," too. look what happened at "the wall street journal" where they're

making basically jokes about people being concerned about donald trump's fascist comments. calling, you know, donald trump -- calling it a meme, a fascist meme, when donald trump is saying he is going to use the military to go after his political opponents. again, i still think the power is in the hands of the voters. i'm not quite as shocked. i didn't lose sleep this weekend over "the washington post," but i sure felt sorry for the great journalists who have worked there through the years because a billionaire is scared of donald trump. then a couple hours later, reportedly, donald trump goes and visits one of his facilities after he spikes the editorial. >> yeah. i mean, that's the larger picture here. look, democracy doesn't die in darkness. it dies in this transactional capitulation by billionaires. look, i think jeff bezos is a smart guy.

he had to know the damage he was making to "the washington post," and he did it anyway. it was best not to antagonize donald trump before the election. he obeyed in advance. i think this is the real danger that a lot of these billionaires and oligarchs are taking donald trump's threats both literally and seriously. they're bending the knee. the newspaper and the newspaper editorial, they're the collateral damage. this is not about whether or not the endorsement would have moved anything. it's about what you're seeing with a handful of extremely wealthy individuals who you would think would be insulated from any fear about what donald trump would do, saying, you know what? we're going to go along. by the way, it's not just the media moguls. you're seeing this throughout the business community. i think jonathan lemire made the point a little earlier, a lot of the guardrails are already down.

people are anticipating all of this. now, imagine what a trump presidency would be like, where you would have this corporatist, crony capitalist state that governs by fear and favor. throughout the economy. that's what donald trump is promising. that's what many of these billionaires, i think, are taking literally and seriously. >> all right. charlie sykes, thank you so much. we really appreciate your coming on this morning. katty's co-host for the podcast "the rest is politics u.s.," managing partner at skybridge capital, anthony scaramucci is with us now. appreciate your coming on this morning. this is the talk of your podcast and of the world right now. what do you think the key issue for the closing arguments that kamala harris and -- with the help of michelle obama are making that could really break through? on the trump side, the key

issues that are breaking through, i'm not sure they're breaking through for him, but you tell me. >> my reaction is that was a combination of 1933 germany, 1939 madison square garden last night. i would like her to think about 2047. it's a significant time for me. 1947 is when jackie robinson crossed the baseball diamond. martin luther king said, without jackie, wouldn't exist. same with barack obama. i want her to talk about what america looks like in 2047, 100 years after jackie crossed the diamond. a healed america, unified america, and equal opportunity. what you saw last night is a divisive america. that's race baiting. it's all the things that we were doing in the '30s and '40s. for me, i'd love to see her do that. >> john heilemann, the closing

arguments, you know, we've heard from trump last night. the vice president will be addressing the nation from the ellipse tomorrow, the exact spot where trump spoke on january 6th before the riot at the capitol. this comes in a race that is tied. as we talked about earlier in the show, there is a new abc news poll that shows signs of hope for harris in key demographics. >> yeah. i think -- i was in michigan the last three, four days before i came back here. you know, the messages they're crafting, there's always debate, you know, among a lot of chattering class people about what they're doing. there are people in the democratic base who don't think they're doing enough. this is about precision-guided missile kind of a campaign. it's not -- there's not going to be a single closing argument that will have one thing. there's a series of groups where this campaign, which is very, very data focused, thinks they can chip away small numbers of votes in battleground states, in

particular, in the blue wall states. if everybody is being honest right now, that is the path. it's always been the likeliest path. it's not the only path for kamala harris now, but georgia still seems to be a state that they have some hope for. they are not that optimistic about north carolina. they are not that optimistic about arizona. but the blue wall states and georgia are still very much alive in their minds. and the messages they're driving are specifically designed to do very specific things. the message of the michelle obama event i was at was -- isu disciplined messenger -- but i've never seen in my life covering politics a speech quite like this speech. she did come out, and her entire section on women's health care, this group that's about 8,000 people in the room, pin drop quiet from when she came out,

and she started, basically, by saying, women's bodies are kmom complicated. she talked about abortion, but not before she talked about more mundane challenges that women face that men don't face with their bodies. how women feel ashamed and don't talk to men about those things. what a communications gap there was. i've never heard a national politician talk about menstrual cramps before. she gave this speech that was trying to say, and this was very much targeted to a group that are thought of in the political world as dobbs dads. essentially, suburban, college educated, mostly white voters, not exclusively, but that in michigan and across the blue wall states, where they're largely whiter states, that's what they were targeting. her speech was about the double standard in democracy, those arguments that kamala harris has been making, and the thing that

animates the democratic base, and the groups on the edges of it, which is to say the never trump republicans, mostly nikki haley voters, and the dobbs dad contingent. that is what they are driving. that's what they're driving, i think, through to the end. the margin of winning, they think, is in that group. if you listen to michelle obama's speech, you see the blueprint for what is going to be, i think, messages they're going to hammer over the course of the next seven days. >> any woman that talks about menopause, i think, you're right, it hardly happens. you don't hear people on stage talking about menstrual cramps and the things women are going through. the only kind of areas in the abc poll, which had a fantastic breakdown of the demographics, only two areas of people where kamala harris is doing worse than joe biden in 2020, independents, 12 points behind, and men 18 to 29, i think it is 8 points behind.

does anything that kamala harris is doing try to speak to those men? i heard michelle obama's speech. anything more? does she need to address them on the ellipse tuesday night? what more can she do to say, come and vote for me? >> i think there is a -- i don't want to say they're going to give up on any pieces of vote. i don't think -- >> well, that's the question. >> right now, i think, you know, she's obviously done some stuff. doing charlamagne, for instance. things in the last couple weeks were designed to hit a younger demographic, young men. i don't know exactly what her entire schedule is going to be the course of the next week, but i think there is at least -- in a scarce number of days, scarce number of minutes and hours, there is only so much you can do. there's some degree where you'll have to concede the notion that kamala harris is not likely to do as well with young men as joe biden did. i'm not saying they're giving up any part of the vote.

they have surrogates out trying to do this work in a variety of ways. but there is -- you can end the campaign without one single message. they're, in fact, doing that. there will be multiple messages. the nature of the target groups they're going after, you can't have 50. there is a limit to how many of the messages. you dilute at a certain point. i think from the candidate's point of view, they may have done the work and gone as far as they can to fix the problem. >> i urge anyone who hasn't seen the michelle obama speech to take a look at it. she doesn't focus on menopause in any way that's not effective. >> no. >> it is incredible. she threads the needle, talking about the challenges that women face with their bodies and now with the realities that donald trump has put in front of them. and then contrasts to a man who says he would grab women by their genitals, to a man who is obsessed with genitals and talks about them all the time. a man who was found liable, jonathan lemire, of sexual

assault, a convicted felon. a man accused of rape. you know, and the contrast that she was making was extremely effective. >> yeah, and another moment where many democrats believe that michelle obama is their single best surrogate out there. she was spectacular yesterday. anthony, you know, rivaling the world series game three in the bronx tonight, another major event in new york city is the live show you and katty have for your podcast this evening. last night, of course, the main event here in new york city was the donald trump rally. >> ours will be more fun, wholesome. >> yeah. >> stephen miller saying americans is for americans only. we need to do this fast. >> yeah, you may not be here much longer. but you know donald trump, you used to work for donald trump. you saw the spectacle last night. talk to us about where you think he is right now. feels like a campaign that's overconfident and playing into hate. >> i'm a little contrarian with

this. i think he thinks he is going to lose. >> hmm. >> you'll say to me, why do you think that? because there is an overbite. it's like shakespeare, you protest too much. he's saying he is going to win. by, oh, by the way, we have this little secret, me and the speaker. we have this little speaker. in his heart, he doesn't see himself winning. you can see by the whole exaggeration of everything that's going on, there's too much of an overconfident overbite. you know, you were showing clips of romney's campaign. i was on the campaign. we were overconfident because we were sitting in the fox news silo. these guys are overconfident based on nothing other than the fact they need to project that. because if he loses, they want to chip out there to contest the election. >> we'll see. >> that's what i really think. i think he thinks he's going to lose. >> i don't think anyone knows. sometimes you know, you can tell if a campaign is losing. i just -- >> i didn't say he was going to lose, mika.

>> i hear you. >> i think he thinks he is going to lose. >> i hear you. >> by the way he is projecting. >> yeah. anthony scaramucci, thank you for coming on. you and katty, your podcast is amazing. ahead on "morning joe," much more on the state of reproductive health care in america. and one alabama woman's story about needing to travel hundreds of miles from home to get life-saving health care. we'll be right back. have you compared your medicare plan recently? with ehealth, you can compare medicare plans side by side for free. so we invited people to give ehealth a try and discover how easy it can be to find your medicare match. this is pretty amazing.

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i'm not here as a celebrity or politician. i'm here as a mother. a mother who cares deeply about the world my children and all of our children live in. a world where we have the freedom to control our bodies. >> texas, what is happening across this state and our country is a health care crisis. and donald trump is the architect of it. he brags about overturning roe v. wade. in his own words, quote, i did it, and i'm proud to have done it. >> vice president kamala harris and superstar beyonce speaking about reproductive care in america during a rally in houston on friday night. joining us now, we have reproductive rights activist kate cox. also with us, ceo of the media

outlet, the meteor, cindy levy. and the co-founder and ceo of all in together, lauren leader. she's also an activist on women's rights and has been fighting hard. kate, i'd like to talk to you. we are bringing in a lot of stories and a lot of women who have suffered reproductive emergencies because of trump's overturning of roe. i'd love it if you could, i'm sorry to ask for this, but at this time, we can't mince words, if you could tell the story of what happened with you. also, there is an update. it's somewhat hopeful. >> yes. first of all, thank you so much for having me this morning to share my story. i've personally seen the devastation by these extreme abortion bans in texas. i'm a mother of two. being a mother is the greatest joy of my life. my husband and i were thrilled to find out last year when we

were pregnant with a third. we received the most devastating news, that our baby would never survive. that same pregnancyposed risk to my own health and a chance for a future pregnancy. we sued the state of texas to clarify we qualified under the ban, and i was denied the basic right. i had to hug my children good-bye, leave my home where my doctors are, and flee the state for medical care. in the end, i did receive the care i needed and had to flee my state to do it. but because i got the care, i'm pregnant today. >> but you had to leave the state in order not to be sterilized. i want to make this clear. because of donald trump overturning roe, in order to not be sterilized and get the health care you needed desperately, you had to leave the state. you are pregnant today because you made that trip, because you were able to make that trip? >> yes, i had to flee the state to get the care i need.

you know, i can't put into words how devastating it is to flee your home in the middle of a health care crisis. i developed an infection while i was traveling. my husband had to navigate finding antibiotics in a state we didn't know, find pharmacies. it was heartbreaking to endure. >> there are a lot of stories we're bringing in and trying to show in any way we can. the know your value instagram has an unbelievably gut-wrenching story from a husband's perspective. we'll have more. cindy levy, the meteor released a new article about a woman from alabama named tamara costa who needed life-saving abortion health care desperately and had to flee the state due to alabama's strict abortion ban. the article features a video interview with tamara and her husband, caleb, who have already a young child. they described theceived from t doctor ten weeks into the

pregnancy. listen to this one. >> he sat down and said, i wish i had good news but i don't. the baby didn't have a skull. baby's heart is not in his chest. he went down and was like, i can't even see the lower extremities. he said the baby would not survive outside of the womb. he said, i could get sick, so he said, you know, termination was the only recommendation he was giving. well, being from alabama, i don't have a lot of resources for you here. let me see what i can find. left and came back with a sticky note that said, planned parenthood, chicago, and had their number. we were terrified. we were miles and miles away from home. no family, just me and my husband. we don't even -- i mean, we didn't even know what was going on. >> it hurts that i lost our

child, but i really don't know what i would do without my wife. >> i live in a state where, like, i couldn't get that help. it's like the baby wasn't going to make it, so, at that point, by not helping me, it was, well, baby isn't going to make it, and neither are you. >> you can find more of that story on the meteor, which is pulling together these stories, as well. thank you so much, cindy, for that. and, lauren, this is trump's america. this is the reality versus the picture he's painting on stage in his closing arguments, in these final days of the election. these women are suffering, and some of them are dying. >> yet, he is going to be our protector while women are dying in the parking lot. it's completely, like, another version of reality. cindy, i wanted to ask you, the mission of the meteor is story telling around women's lives. it does feel like these kinds of

stories, there was also a powerful harris ad last week, unforgettable ad last week, of another woman who went through a life-threatening surgery. they walk you through the whole thing. what are you seeing as the impact of the gut-wrenching stories on the political environment? they're so personal, but, clearly, in some ways, really breaking through. >> i think they're incredibly important because they make clear that fundamentally, these should not be political issues, right? tamara says, this isn't a republican or democrat thing. this is about human rights, about my health. she's a woman who grew up in alabama, loves her state. her state, she was diagnosed, by the way, with a partial molar pregnancy, which cannot only cause multiple organ failure but can also lead to cancer. this is something that needs to be terminated immediately. because alabama not only has an abortion ban but also has an attorney general who has threatened to prosecute anybody who gives information about how

to obtain an abortion, she was literally handed, you heard her say, a sticky note. told to travel 580 miles away to illinois. i think when you hear that, you understand that, you know, this is basic health care. this is about saving people's lives. this should not be political. i think that's one reason it cuts through. >> for poor women who can't afford that, this is what my mother always said about roe, the poor women suffer the most. if you don't have the resources to fly to chicago or travel, i mean, it's just unbelievable. >> presumably, doctors, cindy, actually by handing the sticky note, could have been liable. alabama is not the only state. there are 14 states with total abortion bans. >> yeah. >> i think every woman that was listening to michelle obama, hopefully every dad who was listening to michelle obama, as well, is asking the question, what would happen next? how strong are the guarantees that this would be -- would not go further? >> well, i think it is very clear that, you know, many of

these politicians and lawmakers would like it to go further. i mean, in alabama, the same state, is where we saw ivf become temporarily halted in the state after the supreme -- alabama supreme court had said that unborn children were quote, unquote, babies, children, and had legal rights as such. i think, you know, there is a real ripple effect. also, one of the things that was really important that i think michelle obama said the other night is the ripple effect on other forms of women's health care is real. doctors are not going to be able to go practice medicine and not want to practice medicine -- >> health care deserts. >> -- yeah, in the states. but there is a chill on even speaking an annual, true diagnosis to one of your patients. >> well said. you know, this is exactly -- and you're really crystallizing the message michelle obama was trying to make to men and women, including men who love them, because it's not just women who are pregnant and in a certain age category making a certain

decision. it's not a decision when you're dying or your baby is definitely going to die and if you don't get the lifesaving health care for yourself you will be sterilized or die. but these treatments, abortion health care, used to treat women with cancer, women of any age who have medical conditions, and i would just say just wait, trump republicans, until this happens to a woman in your life, until this happens to your daughter. kate, if you could speak to young women and men about the importance of stepping up and voting in this election. i feel like saying as an older woman to the younger generation, we can't do this for you, you know? we can overperform as parents and we can overfunction for you in many different ways. we can't do this for you. what's your message to young people in this election?

>> there's so much at stake this election. we have to cast our ballot like our lives depend on it because for me and for so many others they do. >> reproductive rights activist kate cox, thank you so much for sharing your story again. ceo of the meteor, cindi leive, we're going to be hearing more from you this week. thank you for sharing the great work that you have done, pulling together these stories. and co-founder and ceo of all in together, "morning joe" regular, lauren leader. thank you so much for everything that you have been doing, especially lately. coming up, the director of the u.s. cybersecurity and infrastructure security agency will join us to discuss next week's election and the foreign threats our country faces. that is straight ahead on "morning joe." we're back in two minutes. ad on "morning joe." we're back in two minutes. are faster and stronger than tylenol rapid release gels. ♪♪ also from advil,

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welcome back. 54 past the hour. sources tell nbc news that a chinese hacking operation targeted the phones of donald trump and j.d. vance as well as people associated with kamala harris' campaign. nbc has not confirmed whether the hacking attempts were successful and it is unclear who in the harris campaign was targeted or if others in the trump campaign were targeted as well. a spokesman for the chinese government said they, quote, are not aware of the specific situation and that china has no intention to interfere in the u.s. election. let's bring in director of the u.s. cybersecurity and infrastructure agency, jen easterly. jonathan lemire, i don't know if you have reporting that adds to this and you can take the first question. >> certainly both campaigns are on high alert for possible hacking operations, both from domestic and foreign sources and, director, let's start with

this, this idea of challenges from overseas, whether it be china, whether it be russia, iran, north korea, there is a whole host of possibilities here. how ready do you think the government, but also these campaigns are? >> yeah, well, great to be with you. so it is a very complex threat environment and it's our foreign adversaries but it's also cybersecurity threats, it's physical security threats. the thing that i would want the american people to know is that based on extesive work by state and local election officials over the past several years, the reality is our election infrastructure has never been more secure. whoever you vote for, you can have confidence that your vote will be counted as cast. why do i say that? i think it's important for the american people to understand this. first of all, the machines that americans use to vote are not connected to the internet. second, 97% paper ballots.

third, multiple layers of safeguards put in place, cybersecurity, physical access controls to prevent compromise of election infrastructure as well as pre-election testing of the equipment and post election audits. yes, there are very real threats from our foreign adversaries who we know are working hard to try to undermine american confidence in our election st and to stoke partisan discord, but our election systems are secure. >> jen, it's john heilemann here. my question goes to the last thing you said and trying to get the message to voters that as a voting matter that these systems are secure is obviously very important for you and the work that you do. it's also the case as you acknowledge that russia, china, others, are actively trying to spread disinformation, that we are in that place in the campaign right now where we're seven or eight days out and i guess a lot of people expect -- both campaigns expect for these

efforts to increase. if you were going to talk to the american people about what they are likely to see over the course of this next week or what you anticipate to try to get them ready for what might unfold, what would you ask them to kind of be ready for so that they don't allow what they see in the course of the next eight days to make them think that the whole system is now breaking down? >> you are exactly right. americans have been subjected to a fire hose of disinformation. so the most important thing for everybody to understand is how to get that signal from the noise. there's going to be a lot of things coming at them in the next seven days and where that signal comes from is from state and local election officials. they are the trusted experts when it comes to matters of elections. so if there are any questions that people have making sure that you're getting your information from a trusted source and, again, that is state

and local election officials. they are the ones to go to. and in terms of the foreign threat here, which is very real, we've been working with the intelligence community and the fbi to put out more information than ever before because our foreign adversaries have been more active before, using more sophisticated techniques. so this morning we published a one-stop shop consolidated website that lists all of the reports and updates that we've put out about foreign adversary information so the american people can be empowered with this information. just last friday we put out information about a fake russian video that was purported to show ballots being destroyed. we're going to see more of this in the coming days and, you know, we also have to acknowledge that this is not going to stop on election day. these efforts are going to continue after election day probably until january and that is focused on undermining

american confidence in the legitimacy of the vote. there will be a result. we know that in the battleground states there are paper records so there will be a way to get to an accurate result, but our foreign adversaries will attempt to make us think that we can't and we cannot allow them to do that. >> and your votes are private. director of the u.s. cybersecurity and infrastructure security agency, jen easterly, thank you for the work you're doing, and thank you for coming on the show this morning. coming up on "morning joe," the head of democrats campaign arm in the upper chamber, senator gary peters of michigan is our guest. we will talk to him about the top issues in his battleground state. and in our fourth hour, emmy award winning actress kira sedgwick and actor adam brody will join us to discuss their work with the political group

swing left. and the third hour of "morning joe" starts right now. >> we have the ability to turn the page on that same old tired playbook because we are exhausted with it. >> these people are for real. you know, the cows are going to disappear. no more cows. no more anything. these people are crazy. >> and we are ready to chart a new way forward and, yes, we will be joyful in the process. >> what is happening with the whales? i've read about this. >> the wind is rushing, the things are blowing, it's a vibration and it makes noise. do you know what it is? i want to be a whale psychiatrist. it drives the whales fricking crazy. >> we have an opportunity before us to turn the page on the fear. >> they want me to say, oh, detroit is great. you know, it needs help. so i said it needs help and people said, oh, he wasn't positive. i can't be positive.

>> and the divisiveness that have characterized our politics for a decade because of donald trump. >> we're the garbage can for the world. we are a garbage can. we are like a garbage can and they dump our criminals. >> this election is about two extremely different visions for our nation. >> i had the greatest resorts in the world, i could have been extremely happy, i could have had those beautiful waves smack me in the face. i could have had the beautiful sun tan, this white, white skin could have been tan and beautiful. >> we are a new generation of leadership that is optimistic and excited about what our nation can do together. >> we have to finish it off with a big victory on november 5th. we will be a nation in decline no longer from the day that

happens. >> some of the very different messages coming from the two campaigns over the weekend. stark difference. and that didn't even include what came out of trump's rally at madison square garden. we're going to get to all of that in just a moment. good morning and welcome to "morning joe." it is monday, october 28th. with us we have the host of "way too early" white house bureau chief at "politico" jonathan lemire. u.s. special correspondent for bbc news katty kay is with us this morning. president of the national action network and host of msnbc's "politics nation" reverend al sharpton is here and jim messina. jim served as white house deputy chief of staff to president obama and ran his 2012 reelection campaign. so with just over a week until election day new polling is showing vice president kamala harris with a slight edge over donald trump. a new abc news poll among likely

voters has harris up by four points, 51% to 47%. that is within the margin of error. the poll also shows harris ahead of trump among key demographics. let's go through them. harris leads trump by 30 points among latino voters, a group that biden won by a similar 33 points in 2020. according to abc news exit polling harris also has a 19 point lead among suburban women, a six point gain from biden in 2020. among black voters harris is outperforming biden's 2020 margin with black men by 14 points and by 7 points with black women. with college graduates harris has a 10 point gain from biden in 2020. when it comes to white men with college degrees trump won the group by 3 points in 2020 but now harris is winning by 4

points in in poll. and for white women with college degrees harris is winning by 14 points. that's more than biden in 2020. on top issues harris leads by 6 points when it comes to looking out for the middle class, and by 10 points when it comes to health care. harris leads trump by 11 points in being seen as having the mental sharpness it takes to effectively serve as president. and her advantage widens to 29 points on having the physical health to serve effectively. most voters see her as honest and trustworthy, likely to understand the problems of people like you, to share personal values and to be trusted in a crisis. meanwhile, more voters think trump is more likely to say that things are not true. the poll also found registered voters are more than twice as likely to call donald trump a

fascist than to say the same about kamala harris. joe, what do you make of these numbers? there is a lot of other information to bring in and also what appears to be the closing argument by the trump side and that contrast with the harris campaign. >> well, we will start with the last question first. you know, donald trump could win, everybody in his campaign thinks he can win. every republican in america except those that are quietly voting for kamala harris, running around saying he's going to win. they have -- i haven't seen a side this confident since mitt romney's side in 2012 knew he was going to beat barack obama, and they just kept saying it. they were so sure they were going to win that it was mitt romney and karl rove who were shocked on election night and knew something had to be wrong with numbers because they weren't winning. so the bubble inside trump world is overwhelming saying that donald trump is going to win this race, and, again, reminds

me so much of 2012, everybody was shocked, actually, when barack obama ended up winning and winning easily. we don't know where we are here. >> yeah. >> it's tied. that is the latest -- that is the latest of polls. of course, the last nbc -- or the last "new york times" sienna poll that came out several days earlier had it tied but also had her breaking -- had things breaking her way. and so hard -- hard to say which direction the poll is going. i will say, though, on the closing -- on the closing arguments, i just -- again, i've always believed that -- and i've told donald trump in the distant past and other people in his administration, politics is about addition, it's not about subtraction. >> right. >> and i surprise myself by still being surprised by how negative, how exclusionary, how

racist the attacks against puerto rico, the attacks again against hispanics, echoing what donald trump said years ago that hispanics were breeders and so it still is surprising to me that any side in any campaign in any part of american history would act that way, but they are completely confident that they are going to win. but jim messina, you know, this abc poll, again, the latest poll, we will see if other polls follow t but you have trend lines going the way the harris campaign would obviously want. the same thing with sienna, even though it was tied it had trend lines where late breakers were breaking dramatically towards her. i think the number i keep going back to, and it's a number that i have been looking at for three years now if donald trump was going to run and the number is

47. donald trump is at 47%. donald trump is at 48%. there was a time when people were cheering the 20% that bobby kennedy was going to take off the board to make 47% enough. that's not happening now. so i guess if harris does win and she has a four-point lead, like 51 to 47, everybody is going to go, you know, of course, you idiots, he was never going to get over 47%. maybe we will be saying that, but i still think that's the question. for donald trump to win, this is not even four years ago, he's going to have to get 48, 49% most likely in the national poll for a lot of reasons, demographic shifts, we're not going to waste our viewers' time with, but still, that's where i'm still suck. he's got a hard ceiling.

how does he win with 47% of the vote nationally, even as you project that toward electoral college votes? >> joe, he doesn't and you are exactly right. the weird thing is someone should call his campaign and explain your math to them. they have been stuck at 47, 47 1/2 for a year and yet, joe, what is their closing argument? their closing argument in a race where they desperately need another point, point and a half, maybe two points is to ostracize those same voters, to end with anger, to end with racism, to end with an argument that only their base could appreciate and not even all their base. so it's just, you know, campaigns, you and i have talked about this a lot, are contrasts and you can't end this campaign better if you are the harris campaign. what you want is very clear, optimism, hope and the future over the anger of the past and donald trump is giving you that repeatedly. don't believe you and i, look at the nbc poll.

by ten points late breaking voters are moving to her. you can tell why, because she has a message to them. is it close? of course it is. is it always going to be close? of course it is. but what you need to do at the end is move your voters to vote and to get the persuadables to move at the end and right now it looks like from early vote numbers and from polls she's doing that, joe. >> i don't understand, again, i just never understood the anger, the hatred, the whole idea -- and i guess the problem is the party is motivated by one central theme and that is own the libs, but what they don't realize is when that's their theme you have conservatives like me, more conservative than anybody that spoke last night, you could say that about liz cheney, too, balance the budget four years in a row, i mean, you know, fought for conservative issues, actually believed, unlike j.d. vance, that you push back against russian aggression.

so you want people like me that even if they are not republicans anymore just g okay, well, that's fine. you want guys -- guys in wisconsin older guys in wisconsin and michigan and pennsylvania going, yeah, that makes a lot of sense, but last night was bizarre and confusing as the final weeks have been. it's optimism versus pessimism. it's joy versus retribution and rage. so that's what i just -- that's what i just didn't understand about calling puerto rico a floating pile of garbage. you know, attacking the united states as he has. but, anyway, i want to -- i want to go back, though, jim, because you are so perfect for this because you were there in 2012. i think you and i would agree this race is tied. we don't know which way it's

going to break, but it's crazy, i don't know if it's oppose, but donald trump, the people around donald trump, the trump campaign, everybody else, they have been crowing that they've got this in the bag for three months now and, again, i see no data, i see no data privately, i see no data publicly to suggest that they've got this in the bag and it just seems like a repeat of 2012 when they were saying the same thing about mitt romney, that he was going to beat obama by seven points and it just never happened. this has got to seem like deja vu all over again. >> absolutely, joe. at the time i remember the romney campaign telling reporters look at our rallies, the momentum, the excitement of our base. that stuff doesn't matter. what matters is shear, cold, hard numbers. when you look at who is early voting in atlanta, when you look

at who is early voting in michigan, wisconsin and pennsylvania, it tells a very, very different story. you know, there is this ten mile square -- square mile logic free zone called washington, d.c. and in washington, d.c. people are like, oh, look at the momentum trump has. show me that from the data. show me that from the breaking numbers in the nbc poll. show me this abc poll, the numbers mika laid out. i mean, the number i thought was the most amazing, mika, was the six-point lead for her on middle class, who fights for the middle class. that's a really important number for these late-breaking voters who are mostly economic voters. so, you know, you just can't look at this and say he has this in the bag. all they are trying to do is display confidence and try to display strength because it's all they have left, joe. >> you know, the last couple polls have shown not just abc poll but the last couple polls show and i think "the new york times" sienna poll has also

shown who cares about people like you, who cares more about people like you, she's winning it and winning it pretty comfortably. again, i don't understand the confidence. i'm going to say this one more time. i think the race is tied. i have no idea what direction this race is going in and so i'm genuinely confused as why everybody around donald trump, donald trump, everybody in that sort of stratosphere says they're going to win this easily, it's going to be a landslide. i don't understand t you never know. when you make the mistakes of thinking you have it in the bag, which i never -- even when i was up 25 points in polls, i never let my staff think anything other than we were down 5 points and we didn't have enough time to catch up and we had to get out and work throughout the night. so we ended up winning by 40 points. i mean, that's how you think.

but i'm saying this not so much for republicans who say, oh, he's got it in the bag, i'm saying this for democrats who are believing this. because i'm hearing this. i'm hearing calls from people going, oh, it's so -- not from the campaign. the campaign has a steely-eyed optimism, but i'm getting calls from a lot of other people, some people on this show, oh, it seems so bad. i just keep going, just it reminds me of 2012. >> yeah. >> you don't know who is going to win. look at these clips from 2012, fox news. >> the voters vote, the counters count as the candidates and their supporters hold their breath. we will take you through all of it. >> well, i have great respect for our decision desk and i see that they are very happy in chicago, but i've got to tell you the romney camp has real doubts about the call that's

been made by us and i guess other networks about ohio. they do not believe that ohio is in the obama camp. i just got an email from a top romney person, i said do you agree with our call? he said not really. >> you went through this in 2000, almost went through it in 2004, do you believe that ohio has been settled? >> no, i don't. >> i understand what karl is saying but if you look at some of these counties that are still left out there, there are votes, a lot of votes, left for obama. >> here is what we're going to do, karl rove said we should figure out what the deal is with this decision desk and the decision desk is in a different place and i showed you earlier in the show in the 6:00 hour what it takes to get there, megan, i will escort you down the steps so you can interview them. >> all right. >> watch your step. >> thank you. thank you. i don't want to fall in front of all of these millions of people. >> this only tells part of the story, mika, but go ahead. >> well, i think one of the things -- first of all, that doesn't prove the opposite is going to happen, i know that's

not what you were presenting here. we don't know. >> that's why i said it's going to be a tie. >> exactly. >> that's why i'm saying it's a tie right now. >> i was just validating that. i think also explaining some of what you're hearing is a sense of discouragement that it is so close given the darkness and the threats and the serious threats to democracy and to people on the trump side. i think we've sort of set the scene at the state of the race and now we have a lot to get to, including the litany of hatred and darkness at madison square garden last night. michelle obama and kamala harris in kalamazoo, wow, what a difference. we have incredible stories of women with reproductive emergencies happening right now that have gone dreadfully wrong. that's all ahead. we're back in 90 seconds. that's all ahead we're back in 90 seconds

it's odd how in an instant things can transform. slipping out of balance into freefall. (the stock market is now down 23%). this is happening people. where there are so few certainties... (laughing) look around you. you deserve to know. as we navigate a future unknown. i'm glad i found stability amidst it all. gold. standing the test of time. you can tell a lot about a person by the company they keep. like jill stein. stein isn't sorry about swinging the 2016 election to trump, and now she's being helped by maga allies and trump's former lawyer. longtime klan leader david duke endorsed her. and like trump, she's cozied up to vladimir putin. jill stein. look at her friends. because a vote for stein is a vote for trump.

just ask putin. jill stein i like her very much. i'm kamala harris and i approve this message. welcome back to "morning joe." donald trump held a rally yesterday in new york city at madison square garden. his supporters packed the arena for what the trump campaign called a closing message to voters. the setting was interesting given the history. the event featured nearly 30 warm up speakers, some making extremely offensive and racist comments about immigrants, democrats, and vice president kamala harris. a radio personality received

cheers from the crowd when he said, and i won't say the word, effing illegals get everything they want. he described lifelong friend to the former president called the vice president the anti-christ and the devil, all while waving a crews fix on stage. another speaker compared harris to a problems could you tell with pump handlers and a former fox news host mocked the vice president's racial identity. sarcastically saying she is impressive as the first samoan, mill shaan, low iq, former california prosecutor ever to be elected president. there was also a comedian who made extremely vialed so-called jokes about latinos and puerto rico. so what we're going to do is we are not going to feed into hate and play it all, but there was a few striking moments that cut

through. we're going to play for you two of them. so you get a sense of just how crude the rhetoric was coming out of the rally. take a look. >> believe it or not, people, i welcome migrants to the united states of america, with open arms, and by open arms i mean like this. go back. it's wild. and these latinos, they love making babies, too, just know that. they do. they do. there's no pulling out. they don't do that. they come inside, just like they did to our country. there's a lot going on. like i don't know if you guys know this, but there's literally a floating island of garbage in the middle of the ocean right now, yeah. i think it's called puerto rico. okay. all right. okay. we're getting there. >> so you heard the laughter.

in a statement the trump campaign senior advisor tried to do a little damage control with puerto ricans saying, quote, this joke does not reflect the views of president trump or the campaign. as a quick related aside, yesterday vice president harris was promoting a new plan to help puerto rico's economy during her rally in philadelphia. pop stars bad bunny posted harris' pledge to his 45 million instagram followers, as did jennifer lopez. as for the former president he took to the stage two hours later than he was scheduled, delivering his usual lies and threats to his opponents, including calling his opponents once again the enemy from within. >> we're running against something far bigger than joe or kamala and far more powerful than them, which is a massive, vicious, crooked, radical left

machine that runs today's democrat party. they're just vessels. in fact, they're perfect vessels because they will never give them a hard time, they will do whatever they want. i know many of them. it's just this amorphous group of people. but they're smart and they're vicious and we have to defeat them and when i say "the enemy from within" the other side goes crazy, becomes a sound bite. oh, how can he say -- they've done very bad things to this country. they are indeed the enemy from within. but this is who we're fighting. >> so, rev, the reason why there are many who are very concerned about those comments is because trump means what he says when he makes a threat, he has immunity, he would be coming into a second term and if you look at how the rise of autocrats around the world often the second time is the charm because they have a sense of how to manage the situation and bring in sycophants, surround themselves

with sycophants and not people who ultimately held the line the last time around like mike pence. with that in mind we put that aside because i think those comments that were made by the comedian really cut through about puerto rico so unbelievably degrading this event was to immigrants and to human beings who live in this country as free american citizens. or legal immigrants. >> i think that was what was so striking to me is that this comedian said this early in the night and no one got up, including donald trump, and denounced what he said. >> no. >> there was a statement released later by the campaign. how do you let someone get on the stage and say something like that and no one refutes it, as people in the audience laughed and cheered about it. >> it cut through, didn't it? >> i got calls all night because we work very closely with puerto rican leadership.

it reminded a lot of them of when donald trump was president and there was a real big storm that had destroyed part of puerto rico. >> right. >> he went down and threw towels at them. so it was consistent with what he said. but let's also go to what donald trump himself said last night, that some of the black men groups that i've been debating about why they can't be with trump, he said i could be laying out in the beach with my white, white skin getting tanned. i mean, this is donald trump's mouth. >> right. >> saying this. so i said to those on the fence, this is not a real racial signal? my pretty white, beautiful white, white skin. donald trump said this last night at his homecoming. so when people said that this was like reminiscent of the supremacist rally in 1939. >> it was very scary. >> the nazis. i think that it lived up to that. i agree with joe, though, they

cannot get comfortable on the harris side. coming up, our next guest says bill clinton has a solution for the vice president to beat donald trump. "politico's" jonathan martin explains in our fourth hour of "morning joe." n our fourth hourf "morning joe."

vice president kamala harris spent her entire sunday in philadelphia making a pitch to black and latino voters. she visited a church, a barbershop, a bookstore and a puerto rican restaurant before holding a rally at a youth basketball facility. during her address the vice president slammed her opponent for his dark rhetoric and promised to win the election. >> we have an opportunity before us to turn the page on the fear

and the divisiveness that have characterized our politics for a decade because of donald trump. we have the ability to turn the page on that same old tired playbook because we are exhausted with it. and we are ready to chart a new way forward and, yes, we will be joyful in the process. >> philly, we've got nine days. nine days. nine days left and one of the most consequential elections of our lifetime and we know this is going to be a tight race until the very end. so we have a lot of work ahead of us, but we like hard work. hard work is good work. hard work is joyful work. and make no mistake, we will

win. we will win. we will win. for the next nine days no one can sit on the sidelines. there is too much on the line and we must not wake up the day after the election and have any regrets about what we could have done in these next nine days. >> we are fighting for our future of our nation where we tap into the ambitions and the aspirations and the dreams of the american people. we are a new generation of leadership that is optimistic and excited about what our nation can do together. and the great thing about living in a democracy as long as we keep it is that we the people

have the power to choose the direction of our country and its leadership. the power is with the people. >> the power is with the people, not one man. rev, i'm sorry, but talk about taking you to church, taking you to church. mika is talking about the grimness that she saw at the rally last night in in campaign and being troubled by t i just know one of your favorite bible verses is weeping may endure for a night, but joy cometh in the morning, and joy cometh in the morning to those who studied to show themselves approved, a worker that is not ashamed in front of the lord. weeping may endure for a night, if you are looking at that rally and it depresses you and the campaign depresses you, but work

hard because joy cometh in the morning. >> and the keyword you are saying there is work hard because when you see -- just imagine if you are a puerto rican child, a black child looking at that rally at the garden. you should not become depressed, you ought to be in many ways energized that we've got to stop this. i looked at that and said i could now look at how jewish kids looked at the 1939 rally in madison square garden. that pain has to be turned into you being empowered and that's -- we've got a few days left to turn that around. when people will openly and proudly go and fill up madison square garden and say the things they said, it should make you go to work, not go in your shell. >> right. and you really do wonder, parents who are proud americans, raising their children to be proud americans who are from puerto rico, what do they say to

their children after hearing that? my god, i just -- makes me sad this is americans -- that puerto rican parents -- that americans who are from puerto rico are having to talk to their children this morning before they go to school so they won't be bullied because what was said at donald trump's rally last night. let's bring in sam stein and author of the book "how the right lost its mind" charlie sykes. again, everything that ronald reagan taught this republican party, our republican party that led him to winning 49 states, that led him to a landslide victory in 1980, that allowed him to bring americans together as he led the reagan revolution, all of those ideas were thrown out years ago, years ago, as being irrelevant. they seem more relevant today than ever before because if you want to reach an older man in

wisconsin, that's not how you do it. you do it by talking the way reagan talked and when it comes to immigration talking about a country that opens its doors to the world, who still believes that it is a city shining on a hill brightly for all the world to see. that's -- charlie -- charlie -- charlie, that's how we used to think when our republican party was our republican party. when it was reagan's republican party. >> you know, for the last nine years i have used that passage and read it to folks who are saying that somehow this is a continuation of conservatism or what ronald reagan talked about. ronald reagan -- you can't even imagine those words being spoken in madison square garden last night. you can't even imagine any speaker saying anything remotely like that. you asked an interesting question, what do the parents of puerto rican children tell their children about what they heard

last night? what does any parent tell any child about the kind of hate and vulgarity and offense that you heard last night. i hope that we don't get numb to it because what you saw last night was not a disciplined or a coherent campaign. this is donald trump's id and we need to take that both literally and seriously. the threats he's making, the insults, the culture he has created. i guess that's really what struck me. to mika's point, you know, that after nine years he has created a political culture where you can fill madison square garden with people who listen to that and say, yeah, that's the message i like. 47% of americans think, yes, i'm okay with this. i'm okay with the mass deportations. i'm okay with the attacks on

latinos and puerto ricans and jews and, you know, talking about pimps and the attacks on kamala harris. i mean, this is a dark moment that we have right now, but i'm really glad that you're playing kind of the split screen of the closing arguments of the two campaigns because i don't think the contrast could be much starker. >> so, sam, let's talk a bit more about kamala harris and what she has to do because a lot of time gets spent speaking about donald trump and she spends a lot of time speaking about donald trump as well. she's got this big speech on the ellipse tomorrow night, tuesday night, a week out from the election and the choice, i guess, for her campaign that they have to make is how much of this time is spent as they have done over the last week or so directing some of the message to donald trump and the threat that he poses and how much of it is spent on her agenda and what she would offer to americans. i know there's some debate within the campaign about the balance that is right for that.

what are you expecting from tomorrow night? >> there is debate in the campaign. obviously she's leaned in more heavily to the trump contrast in recent days and weeks. i think part of that is because, frankly, it's been presented to her on a tee when trump says the enemy within and references nancy pelosi and adam schiff, when john kelly says, yeah, he's fascist i can when we get these anecdotes about his praise of hitler's general how do you not swing at that pitch. at the same time if you look at any of the ad data and what they're running television ads on it's pretty much economic focus, trying to sell her in an affirmative sense. it's more of an either/and, not an either/or. tomorrow i think she's going to make the contrast. the key i suppose for her -- the setting is the ellipse, the setting is this is where donald trump incited the insurrection on january 6. that's not accidental. they want to have that contrast.

the question is can she tie that contrast into an affirmative case for her campaign? can she say to the voters, look, this is why you have to vote for me because, you know, these are the things at stake and i can do x, y and z. let me add one thing. i know the question was everything is about trump and we should talk about harris. i do need to say to charlie's and mika's point, the thing -- and this is something for harris to consider, too, tomorrow night -- or tuesday night, yeah -- the thing that was striking about yesterday to me was what wasn't there which was eight years ago, four years ago, if trump had held a rally in madison square garden i suspect there would have been a huge backlash in new york city, counterprotests, anger, things in the street. nothing there. didn't happen last night. leading up to the rally what we saw, in fact, was the ceos have warmed up to trump, major publisher of a newspaper, "washington post," jeff bezos, pulled the endorsement. the people who are the guardrails or would have been

the guardrails in past runs are not there right now and i think for harris on tuesday night that is a point she can make which is, look, we are the guardrails. this is it. and trump is talking about enemies within, talking about using the military against american citizens. if we vote for this he will have the license to do it because he ran on it and we voted for it. that's his mandate. if she can make that case tomorrow night i think that might be effective. coming up, inside the "washington post's" decision to stay silent on the presidential race. why the paper's owner jeff bezos pulled the plug on issuing white house endorsements. cnbc's andrew ross sorkin digs into that when "morning joe" comes right back. n digs into that when "morning joe" comes right back for people who feel limited by the unpredictability of generalized myasthenia gravis and who are anti-achr antibody positive, season to season, ultomiris is continuous symptom control,

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coming up, while donald trump was in new york city,

kamala harris was in pennsylvania. we will go live to philadelphia for the very latest on the state of the race in that key battleground when "morning joe" comes right back. this week on chewy, shop and get a $30 egift card to use on treats they want, toys they love or food they devour. at prices everyone feels jolly about. for low prices for holidays with pets, there's chewy.

san francisco's leadership is failing us. that's why mark farrell is endorsing prop d. because we need to tackle our drug and homelessness crisis just like mark did as our interim mayor. mark farrell endorsing prop d, to bring the changes we need for the city we love. san francisco's leadership is failing us. that's why mark farrell is endorsing prop d. because we need to tackle our drug and homelessness crisis just like mark did as our interim mayor. mark farrell endorsing prop d,

to bring the changes we need for the city we love.

the new apple tv plus series "disclaimer" is the first tv project from five time oscar winning filmmaker alfonso caron. it stars cate blanchett whose life is upended by a secret from her past. the writer director and the cast joined "morning joe" to discuss the seven-part mystery drama. >> you keep everyone in the dark to maintain a balance, and you think you have succeeded.

>> katherine. katherine. katherine. >> it's about me. >> destiny doesn't knock. >> she's outwardly successful in an outwardly happy marriage and she is a documentary journalist who is a bastian of truth and authenticity and integrity and is used to exposing hypocrisy of others and this book, this pulpy novel arrives on her doorstep the night after she receives an award for her documentary work and that book appears to be about a very cataclysmic event that happened to her 20 years prior. the more we try to bury the past the more it will come and return like a tsunami, an emotional tsunami and that's what happens to her and the book gets sent to everybody. the interesting thing about katherine is that she hasn't had a chance to fully know who she is in the same way that the audience doesn't know.

>> jesus. she dies. it was enjoyable, too. she deserved it, she was a selfish -- >> writer director explores the decades old mystery through the different perspectives each character, leaving it to the audience to form their own opinions. >> everything that we were describing throughout the first six chapters was actually truthful, that we were not misleading audiences. so there was a constant revisiting of the script and as kate was diving deeper and deeper into her character because we showed continuity, there were new inspirations. i don't think i have ever had any closer collaboration with an actor, but i'm talking from the standpoint of the overall process. from the moment that kate decided to do this, she was a constant collaborator for the new -- the transformations in the script, the new graphs that

we did. >> i know that woman. i've known that name for years, but until then i had thought she was just an innocent bystander in my life's demise. >> actress laila george depicts blanchett's journalist in flashbacks revealing the secrets that haunt her in the present. >> it's just a really complex character and there's a couple of different sides to her that jumping between those versions of her, sometimes in the same day, sometimes in the same morning, you know, and figuring out how i was going to do that in a way that didn't take any time. there's something about being able to like watch and study these great actresses and just attempt to kind of do them justice, it's terrifying, but also such a huge honer. >> they were friends at cambridge. i have a number for him. >> there's no story.

just leave it. >> but should i give him a call? >> geez, sue, i said there is no story. >> the actress that performed alongside blanchett found the project rewarding. >> translator: what i loved was the director, he prefers to take long takes. it was challenging but these challenging experiences i felt that they helped me grow as an actor. >> how do you sleep at night? >> you don't deserve us. >> the world needs to know who katherine really is. the world needs to know the truth. >> often when we experience something that we don't deal with, are allowed to deal with or choose not to deal with we get very estranged from ourselves. i think she's somebody as a lot of people do when you don't want to look at things in your own life you bury yourself in the lives of others.

>> chapter 6 of "disclaimer" is streaming this friday on apple tv plus, the series finale is on november #th. coming up, our next guest represents a key battleground in next week's election. from the state of michigan, senator gary peters is standing by. he joins the conversation straight ahead on "morning joe." straight ahead on "morning joe." (man) look at this silly little sailboat... these men of means with their silver spoons, eating up the financial favors of the 1%. what would become of them when they discover robinhood gold allows others to earn their very liberal rates on idle cash, unlimited deposit bonuses and handsome retirement matching? they would descend into chaos. merciless chaos. i'm a lifelong republican and i voted for trump twice, but i can't do it again. trump wants a national sales tax on imported goods. it'll make everything more expensive for regular people,

all while giving tax breaks to billionaires. you're rich as hell. we're going to give you tax cuts. kamala harris is for regular people. she wants a tax cut for 100 million americans, so we keep more of our hard-earned money. i'm a proud republican, but this year, i'm voting for kamala harris. ff pac is responsible for the content of this ad.

intelligent and articulate, to have a clear set of policies, to never show too much anger, to prove time and time again that

she belongs, but for trump we -- we expect nothing at all. no understanding of policy, no ability to put together a coherent argument, to honesty, no decency, no morals. >> former first lady michelle obama campaigning over the weekend with vice president kamala harris, questioning why harris is being held to such a higher standard than donald trump. welcome to the fourth hour of "morning joe." it is 6:00 a.m. on the west coast, 9:00 a.m. in the east. jonathan lemire still with us of course, as the former first lady helped kamala harris make her closing argument to voters in michigan. former president donald trump held a rally at new york's madison square garden last night that included dark and racist messaging from a number of featured speakers.

we have two reports for you this morning starting with nbc news senior white house correspondent gabe gutierrez. >> reporter: in the final sprint to election day vice president harris set to barnstorm battleground michigan where early voting kicked off saturday and more than 1.5 million people have already cast their ballots. harris rallying in the state on saturday, joined for the first time on the campaign trail by michelle obama. the former first lady addressing voters, especially men, with a message on reproductive rights. >> i recognize that there are a lot of angry, disillusioned people out there. if we don't get this election right, your wife, your daughter, your mother, we as women will become collateral damage to your rage. so are you as men prepared to look into the eyes of the women and children you love and tell them that you supported this assault on our safety?

>> reporter: the harris campaign continuing that focus after a massive rally friday in ruby red texas, with superstar beyoncé. >> we must vote and we need you. it's time to sing a new song. >> reporter: on sunday the vice president crisscrossing philadelphia. >> i so strongly believe that our campaign and this fight really is not against something, it's for something. >> reporter: also preparing to deliver her closing argument in a prime time speech tomorrow from the ellipse in the shadow of the white house, the same place where former president trump spoke ahead of the january 6th attack on the capitol. >> he is full of dark language that is about retribution and revenge and so the american people have a choice, it's either going to be that or it will be me here focused on my to-do list. >> reporter: donald trump kicking off the campaign's final week with a massive rally overnight in new york's madison square garden. the former president introduced

by his wife melania, lashing out at his political rival kamala harris with personal attacks. >> everyone knows she is a very low iq individual. >> reporter: mr. trump repeating his recent attacks on democrats. >> they are indeed the enemy from within. >> reporter: but the rally took a car and divisive tone long before trump took the stage. comedian tony hinchcliffe the opening speaker cracking a racist spoke about latinos, so vulgar it's mostly unairable. >> latinos, they love making babies, too. just know that. they do. they do. there's no [ bleep ]. they don't do that. they [ bleep ] just like they did to our country. >> reporter: then pivoting to puerto rico. >> there's literally a floating island of garbage in the middle of the ocean right now. yeah. i think it's called puerto rico. >> reporter: that joke not just offensive but potentially politically unwise, too, with large populations of puerto rican voters spread out across the swing states, including more than 400,000 in pennsylvania alone.

the trump campaign responding to the comedian's set which included other racist attacks, saying this joke does not reflect the views of president trump or the campaign. other speakers continued the attacks. radio sows sid rosenberg on hillary clinton. >> what a sick son of a [ bleep ]. >> reporter: many targeting harris. >> her and her pimp handlers will destroy our country. >> reporter: david ram calling her the devil. >> she is the anti-christ. >> reporter: tucker carlson also attacking the vice president who is indian american and black. >> the first samoan, malaysian, low iq, former california prosecutor ever to be elected president. >> reporter: as the speakers rallied the crowd. >> it needs to be a landslide. we need to slaughter this other people. >> reporter: and trump delivered his closing message. >> everyone will prosper. every family will thrive. and every day will be filled with opportunity and hope and

very much so it will be filled with the american dream. we're bringing back the american dream. >> okay. that's nbc's garrett haake with that report. let's bring in now senior political columnist for "politico" jonathan martin. his latest piece "bill clinton has a solution for harris to take down trump" and white house correspondent for "politico" and co-author of the playbook eugene daniels. j. mart, i find it fascinating -- first of all, my goodness, we have both been in politics for a very long time. that is not like the closing statement to bring people together talking about puerto ricans, puerto rico being a floating pile of trash, and, again, as i've said before, this rally went on for hours and nobody called out that -- that language insulting the puerto ricans or calling kamala harris

the anti-christ. and this was my favorite, that she has a low iq. we heard that throughout the evening. how fascinating. she has a low iq and yet she beat donald trump so badly in the debate that he's afraid to debate her again. she went on "60 minutes," he didn't. we could go on and on. maybe you can explain it to me but when you are in a tight race, when you get swing states, when you're trying to bring everybody together on your side during this homestretch, they seem to be going out of their way to insult people and i just -- i'm not shocked. they want us to be shocked. i'm just not shocked. this is who they are. i just don't understand the political strategy. this seems to me like an old reference, jim marshall picking up a fumble for the vikings and running 85 yards the wrong way for a safety. >> yeah, the only rationale -- look, i don't want to give them

too much credit, but the only rationale that i can see is putting bait out there to somehow try to distract harris in the final week, but i still think that it's obviously a negative. joe, for precisely the reason you just mentioned. you have a chunk of voters left in this country that cannot stand donald trump but they're not sure about voting for kamala harris because of her politics or because of inflation and they don't want to vote for trump, but can they get there for harris? if they see that rally and that kind of bile, i think that's a huge turnoff. look, this is a centrist country essentially, people don't like the extremes in america. to see that rally from the stage of madison square garden i think is a huge turnoff. joe, if you want evidence of what i just said, the whole trump theory of the case in politics, in life, is never back down, never apologize. his campaign did something last night they rarely do, they backed down and they put a

disclaimer out saying they don't agree with that statement on puerto rico. you never hear the trump campaign throw a speaker under the bus like that, which tells me they obviously know they created a problem last night. >> j. mart, though, here is the crazy thing, he made the statement, it immediately exploded, you had bad bunny who -- people would say kind of the taylor swift of puerto rico. >> sure. >> you had j.lo, you had ricky martin. like if this went viral immediately, everybody in the trump campaign, trump, everybody had to know this was a firestorm calling puerto rico garbage, basically calling puerto ricans trash, and yet for five hours no speaker including donald trump -- >> said a word about it, yeah. >> -- pulled that back. in fact, they didn't put out that statement for six full

hours after this firestorm had erupted. >> yeah. >> and, again, i just -- again, i don't understand it. >> well, it's self-defeating, especially in an election where pennsylvania could be the decisive state that's going to decide 270 electoral votes and there is a large puerto rican community in philadelphia and allentown, pennsylvania. and, again, a lot of those folks, working class people, amenable to donald trump, especially working class men, and you then give them these kind of comments in the final ten days of the election, boy, i mean, if that's going to move votes in that community i'm not sure what will, joe. >> yeah, you know, jonathan lemire, one other thing, too, and again let me say this for the 8,000th time this race is tied, anybody can happen, you go swing state by swing state. the only thing i would feel comfortable saying is that donald trump is outperforming

himself in the sun belt states. those polls, though, are all within the margin of error. kamala harris still in most of the blue wall states up north is doing better, again, according to these polls, than the sun belt states. we don't know, though, the modeling inside the campaign. you know, the trump campaign was absolutely certain that 77 million votes was going to get him a victory four years ago. they were shocked that biden, you know, beat them as badly as he did. but as they go for older voters -- their theory of the case is trump is going to win because we're going to get younger men voting for us. right? okay. maybe they will, but the fact is that if they're calling puerto ricans crash and calling kamala harris the anti-christ and

making statements that in past times would be deeply offensive to the overwhelming majority of americans, you know, again, it's the politician in me and maybe the rules have changed, but if i'm running this race i'm not thinking about the younger men who will be turned on by racist language, i'm worried about the older men in wisconsin, the older men in michigan, the older men in pennsylvania who grew up -- who grew up believing in this country, grew up believing in this government, grew up believing that churchill was the good guy in world war ii and hitler was the bad guy in world war ii and didn't believe historians that said the opposite were the, quote, only -- like this is turning everything we have thought upside down as far as how you

close a campaign and if i'm running, i'm worried about older voters. i'm worried about women. i'm worried about people who have a high propensity to go out to the polls and the final week of the campaign i'm worried about swing voters, i'm worried about independents and everything i've seen over the past two weeks from this campaign seems to fly in the face of 60 years of political -- political rules. >> joe, you're certainly right that the trump campaign is betting on this time around it's about young men, young men who have never voted before. that that's who they think they can turn out for this election. well, those aren't very reliable voters, obviously. look, trump, he did, he turned out low propensity voters in 2016 and 2020. he's trying to do so again, it's even hard there are time around. you can see the focus with the bro podcasters, elon musk, the vile rhetoric last night, that's who this is aimed at but there

is a cost, as you say. eugene daniels, there are two groups i know the harris campaign is really trying to quietly work here, one joe just mentioned, the idea of older voters, seniors, who the democracy argument really resonates with them. we saw that with joe biden and we're seeing vice president harris close with that now. they think that will matter. they also think one of their better accomplishments is lowering the price of prescription drugs that is correct also matters for seniors, particularly in those three blue wall states they believe, and then of course there is women and they believe that they think quietly voting for kamala harris, maybe not even telling their husbands or boyfriends, they who might be voting for donald trump, but voting for harris because of abortion rights and because of decency. >> yeah, you can really hear the harris campaign in every speech that she does, every speech that any of the surrogates do kind of pushing exactly what you just said. they talk about abortion as the number one issue. that goes across gender -- that

goes across race, that goes across socioeconomic status, that goes across region, right? when they looked at the numbers, i did a story recently with our colleague megan messerly, we did a story in the runup to harris' tacks rally. they say in their internal numbers what they're seeing is that women without a college degree, white women without a college degree are a large reason why trump has seen a bit of an erosion with people without a college degree. that's something that has happened in public polling as well. so what they're saying is we're going to keep doing what we're doing and what the trump campaign has done is giving them gift after gift. right? last night was a gift because vice president harris tomorrow at the ellipse will 10% bring this up in some way, shape or form, what happened at that rally. she's been doing recently, which is really interesting, is showing clips from trump rallies at her rallies. >> yeah. >> she said on the debate stage someone should go to the rallies

so they brought it to her own. that's something that the campaign because they see and don't -- and think that people have forgotten how trump makes them feel and made them feel during his presidency and that's what they're trying to show out as they're trying to expand their tent and expand what the base means here in democratic politics. >> so i want to talk about the two prevailing factors that are going on right now, but first here is kamala harris at her event in philadelphia. take a look. >> we have an opportunity before us to turn the page on the fear and the divisiveness that have characterized our politics for a decade because of donald trump. we have the ability to turn the page on that same old tired playbook because we are exhausted with it.

and we are ready to chart a new way forward and, yes, we will be joyful in the process. >> philly, we've got nine days. nine days. nine days left in one of the most consequential elections of our lifetime and we know this is going to be a tight race until the very end. so we have a lot of work ahead of us. but we like hard work. hard work is good work. hard work is joyful work. and make no mistake, we will win. we will win. we will win. >> for the next nine days no one can sit on the sidelines. there is too much on the line and we must not wake up the day after the election and have any regrets about what we could have

done in these next nine days. >> we are fighting for our future of our nation where we tap into the ambitions and the aspirations and the dreams of the american people. we are a new generation of leadership that is optimistic and excited about what our nation can do together. and the great thing about living in a democracy as long as we keep it is that we the people have the power to choose the direction of our country and its leadership. the power is with the people. >> so that was kamala harris. there are two prevailing issues playing out right now in the final days toward election day,

the first is that women in this country are exhibit a of trump's america, of what is happening right now because of donald trump. one tiny example amid a sea of horrific stories is a woman bleeding out so bad, but yet turned away from the er when she needed health care for a miscarriage, for symptoms of a miscarriage. a woman, that woman, bleeding out so badly she's passed out, being dragged to the hospital by her husband, that woman bleeding out so bad that she had to prove to the hospital that she was bleeding out to the point where she was dying enough to receive care. michelle obama spoke to these issues as well as the double standard playing out between donald trump and kamala harris in this election. take a listen to michelle obama

over the weekend. >> so to the men who love us, let me just try to paint a picture of what it will feel like if america, the wealthiest nation on earth, keeps revoking basic care from its women, and how it will affect every single woman in your life. your daughter could be the one too terrified to call the doctor if she's bleeding during an unexpected pregnancy. your niece could be the one miscarrying in her bathtub after the hospital turned her away. you will be the one praying that it's not too late. you will be the one pleading for somebody, anybody, to do something. and then there is the tragic but very real possibility that in the worst-case scenario you just might be the one holding flowers

at the funeral. you might be the one left to raise your children alone. >> so i am asking y'all from the core of my being to take our lives seriously. please, do not -- do not put our lives in the hands of politicians, mostly men, who have no clue or do not care about what we as women are going through. who don't fully grasp the broad-reaching health implications that their misguided policies will have on our health outcomes. the only people who have standing to make these decisions are women with the advice of their doctors. we are the ones with the knowledge and experience to know what we need. >> so, please, please, do not

hand our fates over to the likes of trump who knows nothing about us. who has shown deep contempt for us. because a vote for him is a vote against us. against our health, against our worth. >> that event was in kalamazoo, michigan, on saturday, more than 1.7 million residents in that state have already cast their ballot, that breaks down to more than 1.5 million have done an absentee ballot and over 200,000 voted earlier in-person. the second prevailing factor in this election is democracy and i -- i understand for many voters it might be harder to comprehend, especially the concept of what is happening at, for example, the rally at madison square garden. what we're seeing play out before our eyes is the normalization of disinformation,

the normalization of lies, the normalization of violent events like january 6th, calling it a day of love. the normalization of threatening your enemies, threatening to use the military against your enemies. the normalization of fans seeing hitler and wanting his generals. the normalization of calling people who died for our country suckers and losers. trump republicans are allowing a dissent into fascism by not standing up. where is the moment like right after january 6 when lindsey graham said, i'm out? and then he backed down. he said he was out, but he backed down. where is mitch mcconnell? where is speaker johnson? guess where he is, speaking at the rally. the normalization of the most degrading, difficult, violent

things you can imagine, that is what happens when fascism takes over and that is what they are attempting to carry out. so the question is in these final hours are voters going to take these warnings seriously? because many think it can't happen, it's not possible, that he doesn't mean it. are voters going to take it seriously when he says what he's going to do? i go back to abortion and look at the women who are suffering today and ask you don't take what they're going through in vain. please believe me. joining us now democratic senator gary peters of michigan. he is chairman of the democratic senatorial campaign committee as well as the chair of the senate homeland security committee. your thoughts on this election and the very, very stark difference between the closing arguments that are playing out right now. >> you're absolutely right, the stark differences are very clear to everybody.

you know, i was in kalamazoo for that rally. i can tell you democrats are very fired up, they understand what is on the ballot, the stakes of this election, but right now it's incumbent on making sure just everybody gets out to vote and also talk to their friends. right now the most powerful advocate for us are going to be friend discussions where people talk about why it's important, stories that women have, for example, that you mentioned that have gone through some horrible situations not getting reproductive health, we're seeing that in states all across the country. you know, i've been working on these senate races, kamala harris clearly to move the agenda forward that we all want her to move, and she's passionate about moving, requires having a team on the field and that means a majority in the united states senate. we are very close, all of our races are also in the margin of error. it's going to be the amount of effort that we put forward over these next few days. so i'm encouraging everyone,

please, volunteer, talk to your friends, get out. we're also have a pick up opportunity and talking about a state right now who is experiencing firsthand the horrors of what the republicans have done in terms of taking away rights for women, it's the state of texas. right now we have colin allred coming very close to defeating ted cruz. we know in texas what's happening. we've heard the horror stories coming out of texas of women who have had to leave the state to get life-saving health care which is absolutely outrageous. this right should be at every state in the union and the only way we're going to be able to protect that is electing kamala harris but we're also going to need a majority in the united states senate and right now all of our race right side in the margin. >> senator, let's talk about your home state, maybe the most hotly contested battleground there is on the senate side to be sure, but also there for the presidential race. what do you think as someone who knows the voters of michigan so well, what does the closing argument need to be for your

specific state here in these last eight days? >> well, i think kamala harris is making that closing argument and it's about making sure people know that she is on their side, that she has a record of fighting for folks. people are dealing with issues of higher grocery prices and economic issues. kamala harris has a plan to deal with that and can make a meaningful difference. it's also important to make sure she let's folks know she's about unions, about supporting unions. we are a big union state. donald trump has never supported union members. in fact, i'm going to be with vice president harris today at a union training facility in macomb county, a key part of our state, many swing voters, but a very large union membership in that county as well. kamala has actually walked the walk. she's been on picket lines, she has fought for unions, she's fighting for the pro -- so people can come together and organize, form a union and

bargain for fair wages. we know when unions are strong the whole middle class is strong. when they have victories at the bargaining table, those victories tend to permeate the entire economy and everybody's wages go up. people in michigan understand that and kamala has leaned into that, she's going to be talk being that again today in macomb county at a union training facility. i think that's just so important. >> senator peters, eugene daniels. good to see you. one of the questions that your colleagues in the senate and also democrats writ large have had for a while is the balance between democracy and the economy, talk being those things in equal measure or more than one depending on where you are. i'm curious, one, if you think that vice president harris needed to do that and, two, if she does, how she's striking that balance and towing that line. >> i think she is. i think that's a great question. i think you have to make the connection it's not between the economy and democracy and the fact that if you don't have a strong and vibrant democracy,

you don't have an economy that works for everybody. you've got to hold people at the top in power, the billionaires who control so much of the economy, you have to hold them in check and the way to do that is to have a vibrant democracy. going back to the union movement, the unions not only created the -- a vibrant middle class, they also created a very vibrant democracy where you could see those folks in power held in check. you could speak truth to power. we can't have an oligarchy with billionaires controlling. donald trump? that class, he's already said he's going to sporp huge billionaire tax cuts. he did it before he's going to do it again. he's already done that. he's not about every day working people, he's not about making sure that people, for example, get paid overtime when they work overtime. that's a huge economic issue for people and donald trump has not supported that. he didn't support it in his last presidency, in fact, he made it more difficult for people to get that, and he has said when it comes to unions, he was with

elon musk, another billionaire, saying that if people strike, they can be fired. if we don't have a democratic check on billionaires, this economy is not going to work for every day americans. these two are absolutely linked. kamala harris is making that connection. our senate candidates across the country are making that connection and the american people have to understand if we lose our democracy this is not going to be good for the economy for every day workers. >> and that's an important message for everybody, whether you're somebody that's just getting into the workforce or whether you are one of those billionaires, if we don't have a strong and vibrant democracy, then we're not going to have a strong and vibrant economy. in fact, the economists who won the nobel prize for economics this past year said as much. democracy, a strong democracy, a strong rule of law leads to a strong economy. chair of the democratic

senatorial campaign committee senator gary peters of michigan, thank you so much. we greatly appreciate it. jonathan martin, you've got a great, great column, great article about bill clinton who in 1992 as republicans were going after him nonstop, the way he brushed off the attacks against his past, he said, republicans care more about my past than your future. drove us crazy, but he was right. only bill clinton could turn it that way and voters said yeah. >> you have to slow it down. >> that's right. now he's boiling this election down to another fascinating statement. talk to us about bill clinton and what he thinks democrats need to be doing. >> they care more about my past than your future. you've got to do it in the half-speed, joe, you have to slow it down to south arkansas speed, man. >> i'll slow it down.

>> yeah, look, i spent time with the former president last weekend, five stops with him across eastern north carolina, which was, as you know, joe, kind of the epicenter of the jesse helms base in north carolina, very, you know, agrarian heavy country and clinton has two rivets, i talked to him for a bit and he has two rifts that he wants to convey to kamala harris, one is make this about people's pocketbooks and how trump affects their lives, whether it's social security, whether it's health care, whether it's the economy. connect trump and trump's bombast and conduct to people's lives in the future. and secondly, offer an open hand to the republicans. you know, you heard kamala harris in that clip from philadelphia talk about how exhausted we are from the last decade. joe, that's clinton's point. reach across the aisle and say, you know, america, we all want to end this food fight and here is the truth, a lot of republicans do, too. i think clinton's point is the more you compromise, the more you offer a hand to republicans,

the more your message is going to be received by republicans who may not be quite there for you just yet. so he's still got his fastball, he's slowing down a bit, he has hearing aides and he's rocking the sneakers everywhere he goes but he can still deliver a hell of a lot. joe, when he is in the pulpit of a black church, man, there's nobody better. >> i saw it and our good friend elijah cummings' funeral. man, maybe he didn't have his 98 mile an hour fastball, maybe it was that greg maddox 88 mile an hour fastball that plays everywhere. yeah, there is no doubt. you have a line here i want to say it before we thank you because i said republicans care more about my fast than your future. for today focus more on their insulin than his bombast which is a perfect message. john, thank you so much.

>> thanks, joe. mika, that's the thing, you can do two things at once. >> yeah. >> you can talk about the bombast, you can talk about the danger to a democracy, but also the danger to people's pocketbook if we lose some of the basic foundations of our economy, our political system, our constitutional republic. >> absolutely. white house correspondent for "politico" eugene daniels, thank you as well. and coming up, the billionaire owner of the "washington post" continues to face criticism after his paper announced it will not make a presidential endorsement. the same day executives from his aerospace company met with donald trump. we'll dig into the latest on the controversy surrounding jeff bezos. plus, actors kyra sedgwick and adam brody join us next to talk about what they're doing to help democrats get democrats elected this year. you're watching "morning joe."

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fast forward to the end of november and you're sitting at the thanksgiving table. >> imagine donald trump was elected president. >> now also imagine that democrats have lost the senate. >> and that we've also lost our chance to change the supreme court. >> and we've also lost the house. >> meaning there is no check on donald trump and his project 2025 agenda. >> you know this feeling, it's 2016 again. but it's worse. >> i don't want to relive that feeling. i want to look back and say that i did everything i could. >> to elect kamala harris and protect our democracy. >> and defeat maga extremism. >> and also defeat donald trump for good. >> that video is from the progressive political group swing left which unleashed its calls -- it calls -- what it calls its super state strategy over the weekend sending

hundreds of volunteers on buses to crucial swing districts from pennsylvania to california. and with just eight days until election day swing left's 1 million members have collectively mobilized to raise nearly $20 million and contacted more than 10 million voters to help democrats win next tuesday. joining us now on behalf of swing left three of the people you saw in that video, actors and political activist kyra sedgwick and adam brody and swing left executive director yasmin raji. yasmin, a lot getting done as we can see. what are your plans for the final week before election day? >> with just eight days left in an election that as you all talked about all morning is basically tied, what we are making sure is that everything from anywhere in the country who wants to get involved is not entering this election with any regret. it is going to come down to such close margins that we all remember in 2016 what it felt

like to wonder could i have knocked more doors, could i have made more phone calls, could i have donated a few more dollars to help get us across the finish line. so with kyra, with adam, with katherine hahn in the video and our million members around the country we are making sure that anybody who goes to swingleft.org can volunteer and donate. not just in general but in the districts that matter most that are going to determine who is going to be president, whether we're going to have control of the senate, the house and of course key state legislatures. >> i have so many questions, kyra, just about this election, watching everything play out at madison square garden yesterday and i just wonder why trump republicans and trump supporters are betting against the health of women. what trump has done is destroying health care for women in america, already has. the medical gains that we have before us are now not available to women in america and it's not just women in their reproductive years or having babies --

pregnancies that are problematic. women of all ages need abortion health care for cancer and other medical conditions. so i don't really understand like speaker mike johnson on stage yesterday trying to get around this abortion reality, making it a faith issue when it's not a faith issue. >> it's reprehensible, it's disgusting, it's vulgar and it's -- >> forcing a young child -- >> shocking. >> -- to deliver their rapist's baby. >> it's shocking, it's almost hard to look at and get your head around but i think that we have to look, we have to not be afraid to look and with our rage and fear and panic we need to actually do something. i think that it feels so good, especially right now, when you're sitting at home freaking out to actually take an action. it is the antidote to despair and there are -- >> it helps with stress. it works. >> it totally does and it also helps with community, you are not alone, everyone is freaking out so do something.

go to swingleft.org, punch in your zip code and you can find actionable things to do today. >> adam, you are a busy guy, everybody else involved in this project is as well. you are out there, been going door to door in pennsylvania recently. talk to us about what inspired you to do this and then when you are going -- doing the door knocking what sort of responses are you getting? >> well, i mean, as mika said earlier, you know, the threat -- i mean, we have so many problems, so many ways to tackle the issues of the day but currently when under such a threat. i believe that donald trump and just a government of pathological lying leads to ruin for everyone whatever your political outlook is, whatever -- wherever you stand on the issues. i promise you won't be happy in the end. and so i -- so that's why.

what's the response? well, it's really good and as kyra was saying it's a community, it's a support group, it's very heartening to meet -- to meet other people that are like-minded and are out in the fight and the other thing is if you're knocking on doors at this point you're knocking on democrats or independents, it's a friendly audience, most of the time you're getting a positive response and you won't believe the amount of people i'm going to vote, yes, i'm democrat, i haven't done it yet, i'm going to go on election day and you can talk them into doing it early because if they wait until election day anything could happen, they may be sick, a million reasons they might not make it there. it's a warm response. >> asking people if they have a plan is such a great idea. what is your plan? let's talk about it. >> how can i help you? >> exactly.

do you know where you're going. >> we're closing in age but you're cool so i want you -- yasmin, i want you to follow up if you can. i need you guys to speak to young people because my message to young people is we cannot do this for you. >> right. >> or without you. >> right. >> and we really need you to step up. kyra. >> we spent some time over the weekend talking to pennsylvania-based influencers, all of which were very young, and they are -- feel very plugged into me and they feel very -- they understand the skin that they have on the line and it really is about a lot of people getting online and talking about why they are voting, young people, because i think that that's where most of these people -- they need them desperately and it's their future. >> yes. >> we're going to be gone, we're going to be dead in a bit. >> right. yasmin? >> i think there are so many things that have been inspiring about this campaign but for us we have seen so many first-time

volunteers, people who have never participated and that is a lot of people who were too young to participate, people who are college students getting on buses, going and knocking on doors for the first time so that we win this election but also, i mean, you know this, maga extremism is not going to go away even when kamala harris is president, we've won the senate and house, we need young people to help us win for the short term and long term. we are excited they've been stepping up. >> learn more at swingleft.org. kyra sedgwick, adam brody and yasmin radjy, thank you. coming up, donald trump says his plan for tariffs will be such an economic windfall we won't even need economic taxes. it's a proposal experts from both sides of the aisle dismiss as mathematically impossible and economically destructive. we will dig into that with wnbc's andrew ross sorkin and why billionaires are bending to trump's will. y billionaires are trump's will

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did you just float out the idea of getting rid of income taxes and replacing it with tariffs? >> well, okay. >> we serious about that. >> yeah, sure, why not? ready? our country was the richest, relatively, in the 1880s and 1890s. a president who was assassinated named mckinley, he was the tariff king. he spoke beautifully of tariffs. his language was really beautiful. we will not allow the enemy to come in and take our jobs and take our factories and take our workers and take our families unless they pay a big price. the big price is tariffs. and he'd speak like that, but he was right. then around the early 1900s, they switched over, stupidly, to, frankly, an income tax. >> well, stupidly, let me give everybody a history lesson. it's tiresome, but you have to do it sometimes. to compare the united states'

power economically in the 1880s to where we are in 2014 is just insanity. it's like comparing a jv football team with the kansas city chiefs right now. the united states economically is more powerful relative to the rest of the world than at any time since world war ii. we are the envy of the world. ask any leader of any other country, and they will tell you that in every department, the united states is just crushing the world. from business to markets to jobless rates to low inflation rates now to technology, there's just not a close second. let's bring in co-anchor of ""squawk box"" andrew ross sorkin. also, at "news week," tom rogers. andrew, billionaires supporting donald trump understand that his tax policy, which he states on

the campaign trail, it's a fantasy. it's also financially ruinous. they also understand that the disruption, that the threat to democracy is a threat to capitalism. yet, we saw a few billionaires kowtowing over the weekend, most dramatically to him. let's start with jeff bezos. what's the reaction on wall street to that? what is your reaction? >> i think the reaction to that is the same kind of reaction that you have seen in the media space, which is to say, not necessarily that jeff bezos is supporting donald trump. i'm relatively confident that's unlikely to be the case. having said that, i think that there is a complete move among ceos, business leaders, and others who are now, at minimum, quote, unquote, hedging their bets. they're saying to themselves, you know what? if i can be in the line of fire or out of the line of fire, i'd prefer to be out of the line of

fire. i'm not saying that this is a great moment in history, joe, when i say this, but i think that that is the perspective of those people that are taking that position. >> you know, it is a national version of what happened with ron desantis. part of this is on the run-up when he was trying to court primary voters. >> yup. >> you had ceos petrified to cross ron desantis because he went after disney on the lead up. he went after the tampa bay rays for tweeting out their thag tho to the people of uvalde. they completely ran because they were scared -- >> but a -- >> get this, though, hold on. a small government conservative using the power of the executive branch to solidify power and crush businesses whom he disagrees with politically. is that what bezos fears? >> well, i think there's the -- i don't know what he fears. look, what i wish, if the

decision was, in fact, genuine, and i also think it could possibly be. i know there will be skeptics about this, but there is a genuine view the paper doesn't want to endorse anybody. that could be a view. i wish if that really was the view or if that was the view of the "l.a. times," they could have taken that view 12 months ago. or two years ago. i think that the timing of this, and given the fact that there is a candidate who is publicly attacking the media, by the way, makes it very difficult to ultimately make the decision that was made in this case. >> totally agree. quick, lemire. >> tom, let's get you in on this. on the billionaire class hedging their bets and other billionaires, elon musk going all in. let's remember, he was one of the speakers last night at the msg rally. >> yup, absolutely. look, i am somewhat disappointed with the ceo community here who knows damn well that undermining

democracy has a whole lot to do with the strength of our capital system and the economy. clearly, andrew is right, they're hedging their bets. i would expect, though, that if trump were to lose and to pursue big lie, the sequel, you will see ceos jumping in to support election integrity and democracy, and we will hear stronger voices then. >> let's weigh in on what we heard from trump in the joe rogan interview. the idea of doing away with income taxes and replace it with tariffs, i mean, how nonsensical is this? >> not only is it nonsensical, and steve rattner has done a great job on your broadcasts over the past year talking to us about how tariffs work. it doesn't make any sense. but if he were to ever go in this direction at all, it'd be a complete rewrite of our tax code, of our economies, in such, sort of wild ways, that the disruption, i can't even --

>> what makes the billionaire response we're seeing all the more surprising. tom, your piece, "lawyers, stand back and stand by for election day," tell us about it. >> well, as i said, we're either going to see a trump victory or we're going sequel. if it is big lie, the sequel, it'll be based on all kinds of false voter fraud, immigrants who aren't citizens voting type claims that have been totally discredited. as lisa ruin said on your show on friday, there have been 90 lawsuits filed by republicans that are clearly a foundation for post election litigation. i'm part of the american bar association task force on democracy. you've had its chairman, jeh johnson, and judges, rallying the legal community to understand the importance of their role in supporting election integrity. what this column is about,

though, is the local and state bar associations in the swing states, where we have to be most concerned about these efforts to try to avoid certification of legitimate election results, which republicans, if trump loses, may well try to take as a basis of avoiding congress certifying the entire election. and we're not seeing the kind of voice from these local and state bar associations to prophylactically say, hey, lawyers, you have ethical responsibilities here. beware. you could get disbarred. you could face severe penalties. >> right. >> the fact we're not seeing that worries me. >> i see. i hear you. the piece is online now for "news week." editor at large, tom rogers, thank you very much. cnbc's andrew ross sorkin, thank you, as well. good t see you. that does it for us this morning. ana cabrera picks up the coverage in two minutes.

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