do not have to hide schools from gun safety. do it for all the little girls who shouldn't have to carry their rapist's babies to term and women who are driving three states to get lifesaving health care. >> thank you for leaning into the message and thank you for leaning into the work for preserving democracy. martin sheen and mary mccormack. >> thank you for having us. >> thank you, so much. >> another hour of velshi begins now. begins now. it is sunday, november 3rd, two days until election day o with plenty of activity on the campaign trail this morning with things currently underway to pennsylvania where donald trump is holding the first of di his three rallies today. later, we expect to see kamala harris who is making multiple p stops in michigan. we received the results of nbc news final national poll

this morning, which continues to show that the race is deadlocked. they are currently tied at 49% each, which is a result that is largely unchanged from the same poll last month. we do know that this is about what will happen in mostly seven key states and we know by now how much we stand to lose that our democracy rests on a knife's edge until tuesday, but in this last bit of sunday morning real estate before the final ballots are cast, i want to focus on one issue that represents both the life and death stakes of selection election and great deal of political common wisdom about american politics. that issue is abortion rights. the constitutionally protected rightal to abortion was strippe away in an instant with the overturning of roe v. wade on june 24, 2022. a gruesome parade of first- person medical horror stories s that has followed and we shipped the politics of the abortion fight in ways that

could be game changing in the election. if there is one person in the country who can help us understand what's happening and who can sort the truth and the political spin who knows history and has been reporting on it for decades. it is my friend and colleague rachel maddow. after the 2009 assassination of the kansas abortion doctor, produced a documentary that included crucial context of thei violent fringe of the antiabortion movement. after that, she continued to follow the threat of violence against abortion providers. in 2010s one republican swept statehouse majorities passing unprecedentedaj abortion restrictions and he was one of the very few journalists in the country to pay constant and unrelenting attention to these efforts to chip away at the rights that were at the time guaranteed by roe v. wade. when he turned 40 in 2013, the

inside of an abortion clinic was rarely ever seen on television. herschel visited five of them in battle states of abortion already eliminated by a combination of hostile state governments, harassment and threats of violence. in 2019 one donald trump's reshaping of the supreme court was in progress, she has a special hour full of original reporting and historical context that served as a flashing red light of what was to come in 2022. we are deeply committed to covering the erosion of reproductive rights in this country and we bear witness to the rights of women on every single show we do, which is why i'm so grateful that she has agreed to join me this morning playing the role of the amazing reporter that she is and sharing this special report and her own analysis on this crucial and potentially decisive issue. rachel, this is the second time we have had this luxury, so thank you so much. an >> thank you for giving me the space to do it and i know this

is your final sunday before the election and i'm grateful to talk to your audience about it. we put together the special report to eliminate something that has flummoxed a lot of political class, but it's easier to see if you take a different lens on it. in an election in which n basically no reputable political forecaster is saying that he or she definitely knows how this will go over all, there is one expectation for the boat this year that forecasters seem to be pretty em comfortable predicting, which is that there will be a massive gender gap and possibly the largest in history. more women are casting their ballots for democrats and mormon casting ballots for republicans. on the republican side in terms of the campaign, the presidential campaign of trump and vance has leaned into this. they have effectively abandoned any sustained substantive effort to appeal to women voters. while they have tried sometimes quite awkwardly to up their

campaigns perceived virility or something. republicans holding up jars of what they said was j.d. vance's sperm after he was selected as his running mate. le that really happened. trump himself talking about them size of another man's . trump saying that his plans for women will have", whether they like it or not. there was also a long trip from a top trump surrogate about america being a quote, very bad girl who is going to get a very quote, vigorous spanking from daddy trump and it's not going to hurt the daddy at all, but it will definitely hurt the girl. and, that's a good thing. this was at an official rally for a presidential campaign just days before election day. it has all been a little bit weird. yes, the expectation is that there will be a gender gap perhaps none like we have ever seen before. on the democratic side, you canv

see less in the campaign and more in the campaigns stated expert patients. both harris campaign and other democratic campaign this year will tell you that they expect more than anything to benefit electorally from the issue of reproductive rights. the question is, how much should they expect to benefit from the issue? there is an underappreciated reason that net that now remains a mathematical black box. it is an unpalatable metric. the american public's reaction to the overturning of roe v. wade, imposition of new republican abortion bans in 21 states is not yet in focus in t terms of how strong it will be as an electoral factor. that is because the american public's understanding of what the fans mean is something that is growing and changing every day. that is because women are coming forward themselves and because there is an increasingly good and prolific

investigating and shoe leather journalism about the real world impact of the trump abortion bans in america. it is changing understanding day by day of something that the antiabortion movement fought for years -- for decades to keep out of the political fight on the issue. it is the contested fact that the unmissable fact that abortion is healthcare. you have heard that phrase for a long time. it has sounded like a slogan to many americanso for the pro-choice side and maybe like a branding effort yb and something that is a little h bit hard to understand. abortion is healthcare. now, we are seeing it in the news and our faces every day. this raw and very miserable undeniable fact that when the government makes abortion a crime, you take away healthcare from american women that is healthcare they need to stay alive.

handing abortion hurts and kills women. american women in our generation and our time. a midwife from the agent is new that as well, but the antiabortion movement in this country for decades has insisted on messaging not just that abortion is bad or wrong, but more insidiously that they have insisted that abortion is not needed. it's elective and an indulgence or a sin that it's not part of healthcare. even while we had five decades of federally protected abortion rights in the country, that gh messaging campaign from the antiabortion side seeped into mainstream thinking even among people who largely set supported largely reproductive freedom. modern thinking people started believing that abortion is a marginal thing and that is at best a regrettable necessity. it can be severed from women's healthcare without bringing down

the women's healthcare system. it can be severed from all other things that keep women alive and you can take abortion away without causing needless suffering and preventable deaths among american women andt it turns out it cannot. ahead of the selection, the ea american public is learning that in real time broadly and friendly. seen in the news what two plus years of trump abortion bans is doing. to collapse women's healthcare in the united states. here it is. this is what women's healthcares looks like in post roe v. wade america . it looks like carmen brewster who spent 19 days miscarrying, bleeding, blacking out from the pain and unable to eat and denied healthcare, because the healthcare she needed is what is known as a dilation and carriage. the procedure used in surgical

abortions. abortion is banned in idaho, she lives. ere here she is on a hospital bed literally crying for help. >> i've been actively miscarrying and i have gone to a doctor and my second visit to the e.r. if you are wondering why women's rights matter, i'm just going to bleed out on this le table until someone actually helps me. this is my life. nobody is actually coming to help. they are always going to send me home. >> now, because of complications from that 19 day ordeal, which could have been addressed with a 30 minute procedure on day one, carmen brewster has an incurable heart condition that she will have to regulate for the rest of her life. it also looks like amber nicole who arrived at a georgia hospital suffering from a rare, but easily treatable complication after taking

abortion medication. she also needed a d&c. as reported, because of georgia's abortion ban, her doctors didn't feel that they could treat her, so they watched her infection spread and her blood pressure drop. he watched her organs begin to fail for 20 hours before they could bring themselves to operate. by then, it was too late and emma nicole died leaving behind a six-year-old son and grieving family. >> does she really have to be the sacrifice? i feel like she had to be that sacrifice for the greater good. it hurt so bad, because this could have been prevented. somebody has to be held accountable. >> it also looks like whose story was just reported and she died six months pregnant after trying to get care in three re separate visits to texas

emergency rooms. she was turned away twice the worst shape and she arrived. she turned away a third time after arriving feverish, vomiting and blood staining her thighs and she was forced to wait two hours for treatment while doctors confirmed that her fetus did not have a heartbeat. by then, it was too h late and her blood pressure dropped in her organs began feeling. hours later, she was dead. it looks like whose story was also reported this week by propublica and she was seven weeks pregnant when she learned that a her pregnancy was not viable and she started to miscarry at a hospital, but doctors told her that it would be a crime to speed up the delivery in order to offer a possible infection. her husband told propublica that they had to wait until there was no heartbeat, so she laid there in agony for 40 hours

while her uterus was exposed to bacteria. three days later predictably she died of an infection leaving her husband to raise their four-year-old daughter alone. it is hard to imagine. is letting this happen to their patients. you should know that the system was denying -- designed deliberately by antiabortion politicians and upheld by them every day in the face of outcomes like these, which are now well documented and publicly known. in texas in particular, the abortion been promises present time for any health intervention that ends a fetal heart rate. one health law expert from georgetown told propublica that pregnant women have become essentially untouchables.

in states with abortion bans, patients who have complications in their pregnancies are sometimes balanced between hospitals like hot potatoes with healthcare providers reluctant to participate in treatment that could attract re prosecutor but in some cases, medical teams are wasting precious time debating legalities and creating documentation preparing for the possibility that they will need to explain their actions to a judge and jury. it is not paranoia. it's not an unfounded fear. here is a situation in texas. there are federal guidelines in the united states of america that require hospitals. if a pregnant woman shows up in the e.r., federal guidelines require the hospitals to stabilize or transfer any pregnant women who shows up in an e.r. meeting help. the texas state attorney general thought in federal court to be able to force texas doctors to disregard the federal guidelines. in court, he won that fight. it is not a surprise that women are dying and it's not mysterious why it is happening

or who is causing it. in texas, the same state attorney general has intervened himself to stop life-saving care for women in crisis. kate cox, 31 your old mother of two told she was not viable and needed an abortion to preserve her health and future fertility . she had to get court approval for an emergency abortion and she did. once she did that, the same attorney general, ken paxton, intervened personally in her case and threatened to prosecute her doctor even with a court order along the abortion she needed. she still had to flee the state in order to get it. this is a fact right now. this is not a threat. this is the lived fact. the top law-enforcement official can deny you healthcare and threatened your p doctor. incredibly and this is

something that i think most people do not know. the crisis here that we are already in which is into postpartum care, as well. the trump abortion bans are e hurting american women after they give birth, as well. katelyn needed a d&c to resolve a dangerous complication after she gave birth to a healthy y baby girl. because she gave birth in post roe v. wade texas, the postpartum care that she needed used the same tools as an abortion. >> after my daughter was born, i had a placenta and the standard care is a d&c to remove the tissue. the standard of care is to make sure you have that procedure within 30 minutes of birth and i waited an hour and 49 minutes. i nearly bled out, because they couldn't get me the equipment they needed. that was two years after it had gone into effect. >> post-roe also looks like

kylie who had an ectopic pregnancy. that is when a fertilized egg grows somewhere outside of the uterus. it is nonviable. an ectopic pregnancy is never viable pregnancy. it is a deadly threat to a woman if untreated. the only treatment for an ectopic pregnancy is abortion. kylie was initially denied care because of texas is abortion ban. at the time they agreed to give her an injection to end the pregnancy, one of her fallopian tubes ruptured. >> i want to have kids and i wanted to keep my fallopian tube, but now it's gone and a piece of my womanhood was taken. >> it also looks like deborah who was five months pregnant o when she learned that her baby would not survive, but because of florida's abortion ban, she was not even allowed to have

labor induced before carrying her pregnancy to full term. that is to say that she was forced by the state of florida in her grief to carry on that nonviable pregnancy for three e more months knowing that she would be forced to give birth when the state decided that it was okay, then she would be forced to watch her son die with no help. >> i remember my ob handing me a baby boy that was blue and cold gasping for air for 94 minutes. i just held him. we just watched our son suffocate. the trauma i went through, i wish it upon no one. >> because abortion has not just been banned, but it has been criminalized, this is also what post-roe looks like . it

looks like 22-year-old who suffered a miscarriage in the second trimester of her pregnancy in the state of south carolina, then charged her with murder/homicide by child abuse. that is for a miscarriage. she spent three weeks in jail and another 13 months on house arrest before ultimately being cleared by a grand jury for a miscarriage. one abortion is a crime, every miscarriage is a potential criminal investigation. this is what post-roe looks a like. if americans had never truly understood before that abortion is healthcare and if you thought that was a slogan and you didn't quite get it from the pro-choice side, we are now learning it in the most hardest and emotional possible way. since the onset of the first abortion bans, one in 29 25 have shuddered according to the march of dimes.

35% of all u.s. counties are now considered maternity care desertsni -- 35% without a sing birthing center. this collapse of women's healthcare in our country and time can be seen in the infant mortality rate and it's on the rise nationwide and concentrated in the very states that have trump abortion been bans. take a look at this. this is a map of a abortion restriction. the red states are the one with the bands, but look on the bottom. this is ac/dc map of the states with the highest infant mortality rate. the relationship between these two is not a coincidence. this is a policy decision and it's costing lives. women need abortions for a host of medical and personal reasons. there is no credible medical or scientific organization that suggests otherwise.

we have been steeped in the idea that it is a controversial topic for so long and that is only a necessary evil and separate and apart from healthcare. we have forgotten that it's healthcare. in this country, abortion began to be criminalized in the last half of the 19th century as a male-dominated medical profession started to overtake the realm of women's healthcare that had previously been the dominion of midwives who regularly helped women terminate pregnancies. the catholic church didn't start to condemn abortion untilr the 1860s. it wasn't until the 1970s that it became a partisan issue in the country as the republican party under nixon's leadership took up antiabortion positions really for the first time as a r political strategy to try to create a wedge issue to deliver catholic votes and socially conservative voters to the gop. we also know that richard nixon's personal take on abortion was much more ambivalent than the message he projected to try to win over

religious conservatives thanks to his ill advised oval office tapes. we know that his take was quite ignorant and racist on the issue of abortion and quite different than what he was saying in public. i will show you how we know that. the day after roe v. wade was decided by the u.s. supreme court in 1973, this is how he discussed abortion privately with his staff. >> there are times when >> abortions are necessary, i knowi that, you know that is when you have a black and white. >> or . >> no one believes now that republican candidate donald trump has a particular interest in abortion beyond politics. he promised to appoint antiabortion justices to the supreme court and made good on that promise. he brought this health catastrophe down upon the country, but did he care about

what it would do to american women? did he care about who it would kill? on that front, trump told on himself not in secret recording, but a townhall interview with chris matthews in 2016. >> should a woman be punished for having an abortion? this is not something you can dodge. >> it's not. >> if you say it's a crime or murder, you have to deal with it under the law that should be punished? >> people in certain parts of the republican party and conservative republic would say yes that they should be punished. >> do you believe in punishment for abortion? >> the answer is that there has to be some form of punishment. >> for the woman? >> some form. >> schmidt for the woman. that is what he promised for the offset of his political career and that is what he has delivered as he is now asking for another term in the white house. as we head toward's election w day on tuesday, republican candidate donald trump does

seem to understand that this has been a deeply unpopular thing that he has done. you will hear him talking about turning abortion over to the states as it had nothing to do with him. you will hear him talk about the exceptions to abortion bans. the american people e know now from the wave of journalism fr that we have had about the practical impact, we know that the bands are in effect because of him and in effect in the places where republicans have political control and we know that the exceptions don't work at all to keep american women alive in the face of these bands. the american people now know that the republican party is actively and openly planning for a fully national abortion been and to reverse the 20-year- old fda approval of abortion medication. we know all of that. the reason that nobody knows what the electoral impact will be of the trump abortion bans is because it is really only now

that we have this new understanding. we have two years of journalism and testimony. we have two years to start to see the accumulating faces and stories and frankly the obituaries for what it means to take this kind of healthcare away. americans are not voting in this election on a slogan or abstraction about rights and freedoms, but we are voting for the first time ever for these women and for every other american woman with a bans will kill . honestly, the big electoral black box in the election is that nobody yet knows how to the power of that will manifest at the polls. not yet. >> as comprehensive as that was, that is eight faces and we know of so many more. so many stories. we don't like to take commercials in the middle of these conversations, but maybe we need one to digest this a little bit, then we will come back on the other side. rachel

maddow will stay with us and we will get questions after the break. ♪ vapocooooool ♪ whoa. vaporize sore throat pain with vicks vapocool drops. protect against rsv with arexvy. arexvy is a vaccine used to prevent lower respiratory disease from rsv in people 60 years and older. arexvy does not protect everyone and is not for those with severe allergic reactions to its ingredients. those with weakened immune systems may have a lower response to the vaccine. the most common side effects are injection site pain, fatigue, muscle pain, headache and joint pain. arexvy is number one in rsv vaccine shots. rsv? make it arexvy.

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we all got to take a breath and refill our water and coffee. rachel is back to dive into this with me. >> thanks for letting me on. >> one point you made several times is the idea that the concept of abortion is healthcare if we say it that way, some people feel that it's politicized. it's not. i think we have tried all the ways to explain to people that it's not and we have to get this out of the realm of being us versus them conversation. it's in all of us conversation. >> we all follow political tactics and political strategy and we see the way things evolve over time. a lot of it is language. the phrase abortion is healthcare has struck people as a slogan. you don't want to seem controversial, but we know it's something separate. who came up with that idea and

slogan to the idea to try to make people understand it that way are coming from a position where they knew what they were talking about. it was abortion providers and people who worked on the issue with the women it was affecting for years and who can foresee what was going to happen if abortion rights were taken away. now, the american public is getting a bucket of cold water in the face. if you take away abortion as a right and a federally protected right, than anywhere that republicans are in control, they will benefit, including nationally. when you take away abortion as a right and criminalize it, women die. it's not an esoteric thing or an idea. it's not an aspirational thing, but it's the lived reality. in some cases, it's the reality of dead women we have because of the van. >> it should be decided by the states and it is abstract versus their criminalization of abortion.

what we are seeing is the criminalization of abortion and miscarriage. possibly the criminalization of pregnancy. the criminalization of contraceptives and people are looking to go down that road. criminalization of ivf. one a voter is presented with that idea, will we actually criminalize women? do you think it changes the way they think about it? >> yes, i think people are realizing that in the states where you are saying we are not going to prosecute the woman and only the doctor, then only prosecute the doctor, but it result in dead women under the doctors care. either doctors leave or they refuse or feel like they cannot . in texas, they have been told that they cannot provide life- saving care for fear of going to prison. you can't blame doctors in these situations for not knowing what they are legally allowed to do, because the laws are vague and

did nine designed to be threatening to women and doctors. i just feel like whatever you believe about your own personal decisions that you either have made or hypothetically have to make about whether the to terminate a pregnancy, then people are now realizing that a lot of this is not about elective choice. it's about whether or not you are going to take off the table or take out of the doctors armamentarium something that is basically a part of healthcare that we have done as people for thousands of years and save for political reasons we are not going to do it. we are not punishing the woman and we are punishing the doctor -- all of these fine lines do not matter when you are banning abortion. women die and we are living through it and seeing obituaries and hearing from their families. we are hearing from their widowed husbands who are taking care of their surviving kids. i feel like it has slipped away a lot of political nonsense and

small talk that we had on the issue. that is why i feel like the electoral impact of the bans is a black box. i don't think that it's gullible, because i don't think people know how the celery and got a lead this is affecting people's understanding. >> what has changed since you started reporting the story? reported while row is there and while it's not going away, but challenges to abortion are alive and well, which came up with weird rules about abortion clinics and how wide the hallways needed to be. you saw that movement. what has changed since you started reporting? >> while we still had it, courts were a refuge and increasingly unreliable refuge, but a refuge for women's rights.

everywhere republicans have control, they push it as far as they could in terms of restricting rights and making the practical necessities of how to access abortion care and making those things impossible to get. he saw some of the states go down to one and some cases no clinics. the courts were increasingly unreliable and the courts wherever republican appointees are in control are hostile. the ways that we protect women the best we can are in some ways outside the legal system. it is supporting abortion funds and trying to make sure that you can access abortion medications in places where it's threatened to be illegal. it's taking stuff outside the legitimate system of how we protect one another and women are trying to take care of each other off the grid. that is a very dangerous and liminal way to do it. to know that your country and everywhere republicans are in control, your country is trying to hurt you. your country is willing to see you dead in order to keep one

of these in place. it puts women in an adversarial relationship with democracy and the country. i think that is a radicalizing thing and i think women want to go back to feeling like our government actually wants to keep us alive. >> you have a situation where your government might be killing you and you have a situation where all of the political violence that we are talking about these days, the dry run was with the antiabortion movement. there was political violence given covered by authority for a long time in this country. >> that is underappreciated. when we did the documentary about the assassination, one of the things that was so unsettling was that not just the murder, but you had a movement and a promo about which the assassin came and celebrated and lionized the attempted assassination and successful attached nation assassination. in the radical antiabortion movement, which has taken over the republican party and

succeeded in putting bans in effect , you had a movement that said that it was moral to kill people who were involved in the provision of healthcare to american women. that justification of violence towards our fellow americans for supposedly moral reasons echoes and what you are seeing in terms of violence and threat and intimidation that is against election workers and democratic political opponents of republican officials. the idea that violence will be a way of stopping certification and that violence will be a way that you can stop the counting of philadelphia, detroit or one of these things. there is a run for the country over the decades in the antiabortion movement that celebrated the murder of american doctors. >> you talked about how we have some good journalism on this and we did have it with you.

back in 2013 on the 40th anniversary of roe v. wade, you showed abortion clinics with my executive producer. i want to play a little bit of the interviews and what you heard from an abortion provider talking about the harassment they faced. >> when you are the only provider in a state, you become a target for both your local people who disagree with the services you offer and you get put on the national radar input on the national map. it doesn't happen in any other business where people are allowed to act like stalkers and use your first name and try to intimidate you on your way into work. there is no place else where you would work where somebody would be allowed to act that way. >> you ever worry about your safety? >> i always look around when i

step out of the door. again, i'm on social security and medicare and have had a good life. somebody has got to do this and i won't be intimidated. >> somebody has got to do this and i won't be intimidated. i am fascinated since the fall when i started speaking to some of these people, what motivates them? it's amazing. they literally do it at risk of life and limb to help others and then some ways to uphold the democracy that we believe we share and that all of us should have the same rights, which we do not have. >> the amazing thing about going into clinics before it was overturned, in these embattled clinics and republican-controlled states, once you get through the gauntlet and radical antiabortion protesters and all security challenges and the legal harassment and all other things, once you go inside those clinics, you find providers who are not at all

radicals. they had incredible job satisfaction, because once they are in there providing healthcare, they know that they are saving people's lives and they know they are giving care that they desperately need and if they don't do it, they are not sure if anybody else would. that sense of being needed and providing something important made for surprising interviews where they are talking about the incredible threat they are under, but also no question that they will continue doing the work. that is inspiring to me in terms of all of us as americans in a time of repression and the thing that keeps you going is not necessarily having debts and being willing to get it out, but being needed and making sure that you are doing the things that you can do that may be other people can't. being needed and that gives you not just a righteous place in history, but it gives you a righteous life and a lot of satisfaction and love and respect of people you are helping.

>> people are needed and people can do something to help fellow americans. you are a great friend and colleague. you are busy enough, too, and having to come here on a sunday morning. >> this is crucial and i'm grateful to be here. thank you. >> we love to have you here. special shout out to our mutual friend and colleague who helped put this all together. one day, i will get her on tv. thank you, rachel maddow, emmy award-winning host of the rachel maddow show. thanks for the work you do . we will be right back. so we invited people to give ehealth a try and discover how easy it can be to find your medicare match. this is pretty amazing. i can go on a vacation with this money. i have quite a few prescriptions. that's why people call us. we're going to compare plans, and i'm gonna try to get you as much bang for your buck as possible. that's great. this one here covers all your prescriptions, your doctors as well. oh, wonderful. i have a hard time with this. that's okay, that's what i'm here for.

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with two days until election day, kamala harris is pulling out all stops in her campaign after crisscrossing the country for various events and swing states. she made a pit stop right here in new york city to practice her election eve self affirmations on saturday night live. >> it's nice to see you,, love. >> it's nice to see you. i am just here to remind you that you've got this, because you can do something your opponent cannot do. you can open doors. >> i see what you did there. >> i don't really laugh like that, do i? >> a little bit. now, kamala, take my palm. the

american people want to stop the chaos. >> and the drama. >> a new step mama, kickback in our pajamas and watch a rom kamala . >> like legally blonde. >> start decorating for christmas. what we always say? keep kamala and carry on. 0% effective. shingrix is a vaccine used to prevent shingles in adults 50 years and older. shingrix doesn't protect everyone and isn't for those with severe allergic reactions to its ingredients or to a previous dose. tell your healthcare provider if you're pregnant or breastfeeding. increased risk of guillain-barré syndrome was observed after getting shingrix. fainting can happen so take precautions. most common side effects are pain, redness, and swelling where injected, muscle pain, tiredness, headache, shivering, fever, and upset stomach. ask your doctor about shingrix today. power outages can be unpredictable, inconvenient,

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vice president kamala harris in michigan making her final pitch for sway voters in this important swing state and is scheduled to speak at a church service in detroit this morning, then she will head over to lansing. winning michigan and 15 electoral votes and blew all states of pennsylvania and wisconsin will be the easiest way for kamala harris to reach the total of 270 electoral votes that she needs to secure the presidency. she gets those, the other swing states won't matter as much. michigan is home to many black and working-class white voters will be key to victory. black voters took over the top of the ticket and specifically in detroit, which is the largest majority black city in america. detroit has a strong union presence and endorsement of

autoworkers was a huge boost for the harris campaign. one challenge for the ticket will be swing michigan's sizable arab-american and muslim community and many are still frustrated with the administrations stance on israel's war in gaza adding more to the stakes of the election in michigan, which is the very type u.s. senate race between congresswoman alyssa and republican mike rogers. there is a lot going. with a quick break and chair of michigan democratic party. go nowhere.

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are not there yet and the other is getting people who are there to make sure they come out and vote. how is the second part looking? >> it's looking magnificent and the days are beautiful. you know good rather weather makes it easy for us to go out and about woke vote. folks are reaching out to voters and teaching them how to vote and where to find there early but location. we have lines at some early vote locations, which is a sign of enthusiasm and not a sign of clerks not doing their jobs, so

they are doing a terrific job. it's great out here with a lot of enthusiasm and excitement. >> as you know, i declined no excuse to go to michigan in the last election in 2022 where i was there and abortion is now in our state constitution thanks to her voters in the last election. it was a remarkable issue. i spent the better part of this hour talking to rachel and how that might be a case again. talk about the relationship between reproductive rights and the selection. >> michigan voters are smart voters. that is why they did the work they did and they understand the threat to abortion that donald trump and republicans pose. they know that if we let trump back into the white house, the band becomes a real thing and the work we have done in michigan gets erased. they will not let it happen and will not go back. you have seen a surge of voters , women and men who support and love the women in their lives and want to make sure they have these rights. they are all out there working

hard to make sure that they protect abortion rights and keep donald trump out of the white house. >> you and i talked about this early on from people in early michigan and people who knew the party and knew the electorate to say that there was something about the messaging around economics that was not necessarily landing with people in michigan. i'm not sure if everyone understood what that meant, but what was that and has that been adjusted, so that the right message is getting to the working-class people? >> it is. some people are feeling that we as a party and campaign were not doing enough to make sure that folks understood that we recognize the reality of the economy and we recognize that things are expensive and housing is still an issue, so we have done a lot of good work and harris campaign, has well. those stories and the fact that the kamala harris administration will have a focus on this work and middle class and we will make sure that she is taking care of issues that affect our folks and

pocketbooks. of course, our friends in labor are doing the same thing. great conversations and worker to worker conversations but i was told that our friends have talked to 225,000 union doors in the month of october. 225,000. these are important conversations that not just the parties have and campaign, but all partners. >> dearborn and dearborn heights and same county as detroit is home to an arab muslim population that appears to be divided in their support of kamala harris, because of israel and gaza. biden won by a significant margin obviously in wayne county. what's happening on that issue right now? is there any money noticeable movement? >> we have a large number of people working in those communities. members of the council and dearborn council. dearborn elected officials and terrific deputy executive. they

are all working hard to make sure that we are pushing at the vote for kamala harris. here is what folks know. while they may not be happy about where the biden administration is on the issue, they know that donald trump is the worst possible thing that could happen to their community , neighbors and friends across the world. they know this. that is why we are working hard and working closely with them to make sure we are turning out the votes. >> last-minute pitch to michigan voters. what is the thing you are most hearing? you are in touch with people knocking on those doors. what is the thing that people need to hear to put them over the line and vote for kamala harris? >> we are at the point where many people have heard from her and know what she stands for. they know who she's going to be as their president. they need to be reminded at this point where, when and how to vote. their vote will count and that it's important to the future of families and country that they get out and support kamala harris. >> lavora barnes, good to have

you and thank you for taking the time to talk to us. i'm pretty sure you have a busy day and few days ahead of you. chairperson of the michigan democratic party. that does it for me. thank you for watching and you can catch me back here saturday and sunday morning from 10:00 to noon eastern. join us on msnbc tuesday night for our special coverage of the 2024 presidential election. rachel maddow and the team will kick off. i will join you later that night after the moon is completely up in the sky and i will take you through the overnight on tuesday night. until we have a declared president of the united states elect. stay where you are. begins right now. here we are. we have just two days left in the craziest campaign season most of us can remember or at least that i can remember.