. good to be with you. i'm katy tur. at this moment, control of the house is still up in the air, as is the margin of control in the senate. a margin that could meaningfully change what sort of cabinet officials donald trump will be able to confirm, which could in turn meaningfully affect how much a president trump take two can upend the way the federal government operates. and it's just that, the ways of washington that democrats are wrestling with today now that a clear majority of americans have said they don't like the status quo, and those americans, by the way, come from all over. case in point right here in new york city, manhattan swung nine points to the right, brooklyn swung 12, queens 21, and the bronx 22, rich americans, middle class americans and those barely making it, people who live in

cities, and people who live far outside of them. trump's support this time around came from everywhere. the now president-elect is calling that a mandate. so how will the party that lost to him pick itself back up. do they let donald trump's policies speak for themselves? including across the board tariffs, mass deportations, revenge against his perceived enemies, and pardoning january 6th rioters, or does the party go back to the same voters it lost. does it acknowledge as bernie sanders argued they messed up and misread the electorate. quote, it should come as no great surprise that a democratic party which has abandoned working class people would find that the working class has abandoned them. so what do the democrats do now? joining us now, moderator of "meet the press," kristen welker, it's going to depend

largely on what donald trump does. you talked to him a moment ago. he talked about his mandate. what did he tell you? what does he want to do when he gets back to the white house? >> well, katy, good to be with you. this conversation lasted about 15 minutes. he talked about some of what you just mapped out in terms of what a lot of folks are looking at as a realignment in terms of the groups of people who backed him. he did say he believes he has a mandate. here's how he describes it, it's a mandate to bring common sense back to the country. i said, okay, what is the first order of business on your to do list once you're back in the oval office. he said it was to make the border safe and secure. he of course leaned into his long held plan, mass deportation plan. i tried to get some specific details. what does that look like? how much would it cost? on that point, katy, he said it's not a question of price

tag, it's really not. we have no choice when you have people killed and murdered when drug lords have destroyed countries and now they're going to go back to those countries because they're not staying here, there is no price tag. so that was certainly notable. he also talked a bit, katy, about the conversations that he had with president biden and vice president kamala harris. he called them very nice, very respectful, both ways. he said vice president harris talked about transition. she would like to see it be as smooth as can be. i agree with that, of course 100%. he had a very similar conversation with the president as well. he wants to see a smooth transition, of course, the transition four years ago was not smooth on january 6th. we all saw that, the violence that unfolded in the capitol. i asked him, katy, about the calls he has had with foreign leaders, he says he's had about 70 phone calls with foreign leaders so far. i asked him to start naming them. you give me names, and i'll tell you if i've spoken with them.

prime minister netanyahu, a number of european leaders, including macron. he said he has spoken with president zelenskyy. i asked if he's spoken with president putin, of course he's talked a lot about wanting to end that war. he says he can do it in 24 hours, even though a lot of people hear that and say that would require ukraine to give up its territory. he says he has not yet spoken with president putin, he anticipated that he will do so. tried to get a few details about his cabinet, katy, the conversation kind of ended on that point. he did, when i asked him if susie wiles is someone he's looking at as chief of staff, she would certainly be a contender. she is great. a number of headlines coming from a brief conversation, the first one since he has won and is now president-elect of the united states, katy. >> kristen welker, moderator of "meet the press," thank you very much. "the new york times" chief white house correspondent and political analyst, peter baker, staff writer at the atlantic, and mark leibovich, and msnbc

political contributor, errin haines, welcome. peter i'm going to begin with you, the democratic party now is doing a bit of soul searching as donald trump prepares to retake the white house. and they're doing that soul searching based off of who they lost this time around, not only did fewer people come out to vote, millions fewer people, but those that did shifted to the right, and they shifted in most all places. 90% of counties, and in some really notable ways, including what i just laid out at the top of the show in new york city. i wonder when the democratic party looks at this today, peter, what is the take away? >> well, look, i think there's going to be, as you say, soul searching, blood letting, it's going to be a pretty sharp debate i think going on for the next year or two to figure out how they lost. republicans went through this after 2012 when they lost the mitt romney race to obama. how did we lose, they asked,

these were important questions for any party that loses. the historical analogy is that all the things the republicans said they should do differently and better through the autopsy turned out to be the exact opposite of what donald trump ended up doing. well, we should have done this and that, but you may not in fact be diagnosing the problem correctly, and you may have somebody come along who proves the opposite. we have a specific situation where the specific candidate, donald trump was a specific appeal. the question is whether that's a permanent change in our political alignments or whether or not it's generous to him, and do democrats need to do something different next time around based on trump, given that he won't be the one who runs in four years or do they need to think about how they connect to voters in a broad way? >> we can't say donald trump was an anomaly, he's been the dominating factor in american politics now for nine years, and by the end of it, it will be

much longer. can we say, though, now, that this is the end of something else? this is perhaps the end of the obama coalition? >> well, you know, i don't know if that is where things are now. but i do think, you know, to your point, katy, what we have seen and how we get to this moment is the staying power of the former president who is now, you know, the president elect. you have to also consider the fact that he has a very young, among the youngest vice presidents in u.s. history in j.d. vance who is also very much on board with trumpism. we may not be seeing the end of the trump era with the end of a trump second presidency even, right, so i think that as democrats are kind of doing this soul searching, hammering, and whatever you want to call it, understanding, you know, what people's concerns were around the economy, around immigration, two of the top issues that people cited as motivating, and to vote the way that they did at

the polls, i think that's going to be important. really what do they do around rural voters, around white working class voters, right, i think that's going to be something they continue to look at. noncollege educated americans also, you know, these are the kinds of people who are feeling left out by politics, regardless of what the biden and harris administration was saying about the strength of the economy. that was something that they were saying they were not feeling. they were resonating with the former president's comments around immigration. so, yeah, i think that we have not necessarily seen the end of the -- we're not necessarily seeing the end of the trump era, at the same time we don't yet know which direction the democrats are going to go from here. >> what is the message that democrats take when of all the demographics that went to trump, maybe the most surprising is that young women went to trump. not older women, young women went to trump. how did the democrats absorb

that when they were running off a message of women's health care? off of, you know, the overturning of roe v. wade, saying that donald trump will be a threat to your very well being, your body? >> yeah, i mean, i think that's a real question. let's be specific, katy, we're talking about young white women. i mean, young black women were among the 92% of black women that supported vice president harris, which was unsurprisingly saw the enthusiasm and the excitement around her campaign particularly around black women, but, i mean, when we are talking about young women, who are these women, where were they? some of them, you know, maybe voting in some states for abortion ballot measures and voting for former president trump. so, you know, how do we kind of begin to square that? i think we saw in the two years since dobbs abortion being a huge issue on the ballot for millions of women across the country, but it was not as much

of a priority for them this cycle as the economy, especially for white women who we saw still breaking in the majority for donald trump overall. >> mark, i want to get you in on this, david brooks said this is another message from the american public to washington, to the elites, do you hear us now, that this is the democrats being out of step, fundamentally out of step with the way that the rest of the country sees itself. what the rest of the country is concerned about, and what they want to prioritize. >> the question is how you put that into the real world of politics these days. the fact is at the very least, democrats have the gift of clarity. there's not a lot of people second guessing whether kamala harris should have spent more time in wisconsin or whether, you know, it was just a decisive whooping across the board, and there's like a real, i think, you know, i think there are some big conversations being cued up,

and i think what brooks is talking about is something that's probably going to play out -- that conversation is going to play out over a number of months. i think also, just a little historical perspective, recent historical perspective, i mean, republicans were in deep despair after 2020, they had just lost the white house. there was a seemingly a very vocal population of the party that moved on from trump after how that residency ended. he had just single handedly lost the senate for the party. 2016, eight years ago, a similar despair to what we're having now, peter talked about 2012, so, i mean, four years is a long, long time in politics, and cycles of despair move very quickly, and i mean ultimately in 2020, you know, democrats did turn back to joe biden. an old familiar figure. who will they look forward to, who will republicans look forward to after donald trump's, you know, administration ends. so look, there's a lot out there, there's at least clarity at this moment, and a space to sort of work through the muddle. >> there are some out there

arguing just sit back and let donald trump do himself in. let his policies speak louder, loudest, the mass deportations, watch how that goes, the flooding the cabinet with loyalists over those with experience, see how that goes. a tariff across all goods coming into this country, see how that goes, see how americans actually like it when donald trump is able to put the policies that he wants into place. is that a good strategy? is that, you know, does sitting back and letting him do what he will a good strategy in the long-term? >> yeah, i don't think sitting back is ever a good strategy necessarily. the fact is, it's a lot harder to govern than it is to oppose. democrats, unfortunately for them, are in the minority and they control zero chambers right now. and, you know, republicans are going to have to actually try to execute on some things. when you look at the one chamber that did control over the last

two years, the house, it was a disaster. they did nothing. so what will it look like when they have all three chambers. donald trump's first two years in office, the first time around, was kind of uneven, didn't get a lot of the things he wanted to get done done, so we'll see. but obviously democrats need to figure out a voice to sort of operate and resist from within all of this. >> i wonder if we can say yet, peter what the guiding principle of the trump administration will be. don jr. has been saying recently and a few months ago, what they want in the trump administration are loyalists, people that will let donald trump do what he wants to do, people that will allow him to be president, unlike the last time around when he had all of these aides who were, you know, acting as the bulwark against his worst impulses. what is the guiding principle for a second trump presidency look to project 2025? donald trump's disavowed it, but a whole lot of people who are very intimate with donald trump and his allies are the ones who wrote it? >> i think project 2025 is a

decent guide to what we should expect. even if he has disavowed it, as you say, it was written by people he trusts and installed in the past, and he's likely to put many of them into positions of power again, and what we saw in the first term was there are plenty of people who were working for the trump administration who managed to do things that were on their own agenda, maybe not just his agenda, keeping them under the radar, off of his radar screen. they were able to do a lot of things they thought were important or conservative goals, and i can see that happening this time with some of these project 2025 things, even if he's not particularly wedded to put people in place who are, they will, you know, have some latitude. now, to your previous point, one thing we have learned in the last eight years is the most effective opponent of donald trump actually hasn't been the democrats, it's been donald trump. most times that trump has ever gotten in trouble are because of his own, you know, self-destructive habits, and you know, his own, you know, tripping up over his own words

or over his own actions. democrats have done less to discredit him or to attack him than he has done to himself, and so that's the motive behind that thinking you're hearing. i think to mark's point, obviously no political party likes to sit back, and certainly one that wants to return to power has to define themselves, and they're going to define themselves in opposition to donald trump. >> peter leibovich, thank you for starting us off today. what about the antitrump republicans, what are they preparing for as donald trump takes office. plus, who is on the short list for key roles, and what does donald trump want them to do? a lot of that who and the what will depend on how many seats republicans get in the senate. so far, the two-seat majority that they currently hold might end holding donald trump back from some of his more out there choices. we are back in 90 seconds. 0 sec. s playing detective. but the real mystery was her irritated skin.

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of the times, you're less interested in exploring why donald trump won. what are you more interested in exploring if not that? >> yeah, i think it's much more what next? . i think that is the much more interesting question than why he won. i think the high he won is pretty obvious and pretty easy to state. i mean, he was running against a president who had a big inflation problem, where the border had not been under control for about three years of his presidency, and when there were two hot wars waging around the globe. that's a tough environment to run in. that's much less than an interesting sort of -- that's much less of an interesting analysis than the question of what do you do now, what is it that happens next, and to me, that's where there's two principles that come into play. one is protect the vulnerable because one of the elements of the trump plan when we're beginning to talk about mass deportations, attacking his political opponents, weaponizing the department of justice, there are a lot of vulnerable people

in this country who are going to need protection for their civil liberties, and then the other thing is, speak the truth. understand the truth and speak the truth. we're living in a world where there's an enormous amount of disinformation and misinformation, and that is not only corrupting our politics, it drives us apart as we live in different silos. one of my points is we need to speak the truth and know the truth. >> i hear what you're saying on that. who's listening to that? i mean, i'm serious, and how do you reach the people? because there's an argument to be made if anyone was watching traditional media, it would be hard to vote for donald trump, given the voices that said the guy was not only unfit but dangerous. his own major aides were saying this, generals, telling stories about what he did or tried to do while he was in office. i'm not sure that, you know, speaking truth, where you speak the truth, who's listening? >> well, yeah, that's a great question, katy.

look, you're correct. if readers of newspapers were the only voters, trump would have lost. there's polling data that indicates that. but where are people getting information? and that means that people like me, for example, need to be thinking creatively about how do you get out of our own bubble, where do you go, and so, you know, you had donald trump speak to go joe rogan, you had donald trump speaking to megyn kelly and others, there's an entire media ecosystem in which i think people who are defending american democracy, trying to uphold the rule of law need to dive into that ecosystem. you don't just leave it out there and say, well, if only we can get our headlines at "the new york times" exactly right, then everything will be okay, no, we need to, of course, do our jobs at "the new york times" as well as we possibly can, but we also have to creatively think about, go where people are. you go where people are, and speak to them where they are. and through the mediums that they are viewing, and this is

not easy to say that and to do that are two different things, but i do think it's absolutely necessary. we cannot continue with this siloed information environment. and so it requires creativity, energy, and, you know, not too much naval gazing. >> do you think it was a good idea for harris in retrospect to be going out there with liz cheney, was that a winning message to motivate democratic voters or independent voters to go to the polls? and i ask that because turnout was way way down. >> no. there's no question that in my mind when she was doing that, that was something that could be a tipping point in a very very very close race. i don't think there was any credible argument that going to liz cheney would shift millions of votes because that's overall what you were talking about that she needed to do eventually. no, that would be in a very very close race. i think that the fundamentals of this were very negative for her. she was not helped by biden staying in for so long.

and things like should chef talked to liz cheney, or should chef gone in joe rogan's podcast, those are rounding errors in this election. i think if you're talking about going forward, how do you sort of begin to bridge these divides and bring people back on to the same page means over time, you do have to do things like go on joe rogan's podcast. you do have to do things like go on to alternative media. that's a longer term cultural project. if you're talking about would it have changed the outcome of the election, if she had liz cheney on stage or not, no. it was going to come out the same way, given what we now know. >> one of your colleagues, ezra klein was arguing that part of the issue the democratic party has right now is they haven't been a big ten party, that they have pushed people out of the party, and they have actively rejected some people based on, you know, those people not having, i'm not going to say it as eloquently as him not having

the right beliefs or party line beliefs, and he mentions joe rogan as somebody the democrats should have been engaging with much more frequently, but pushed him off to the side believing that he was fringe. >> oh, i think that is absolutely correct, that, you know, there's -- one of my other colleagues, michelle goldberg has this great statement that she said, movements need to be seeking converts more than hunting for heretics. and if you are hunting for heretics, you are shrinking your tent. if you are seeking converts, you're expanding your tent, and by the way, seeking converts means having a more open heart. it means having a more tolerant approach to people. when you're hunting heretics, you're closed, furious, you're angry, off putting to people, in particular, when you're asking people to swallow their concerns about the direction of the country and vote for you anyway because the other guy is the greater threat. so i do think absolutely you cannot be a movement that's

hunting heretics, you have to be a movement seeking converts. >> i'm not as eloquent as all of you. thank you very much, david french, i appreciate it. >> thank you, katy. coming up, who will donald trump be able to get confirmed in the senate? it very much depends on how big the gop majority will be. we're going to have a look at all the uncalled races in just a moment. don't go anywhere. nywhere. do you have high blood pressure? if so, you're at greater risk of developing afib, one of the leading causes of stroke. detect afib with kardiamobile, the world's most clinically-validated personal ekg. with kardiamobile, you can take a medical-grade ekg in just 30 seconds from anywhere. and it's proven to detect three of the most common arrhythmias. yeah, before i had kardia i didn't know what my heart was doing, and now i do. it gives me great peace of mind. it's in my pocket all the time. it goes where i go. i never am away from it. it's like a virtual cardiologist. you can pull out the device, check your heart rhythm,

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we got some new reporting, a little bit more information about what donald trump plans for day one of his second term, including executive orders on energy production and border security according to what trump's senior adviser jason miller told "politico." before anything gets done, donald trump will have to select the people he wants to carry those policies out. joining us now from west palm beach, florida, nbc news correspondent vaughn hillyard. so, vaughn, what do we know about who he wants to populate his cabinet with? who will be among his closest advisers? >> reporter: there's a lot of names circulating down here in palm beach, florida, and i think this will become a hotter destination this november and december than it typically is, and let's just start with the attorney general position. we're getting new names in our own reporting right now. there's mark paoletta, he's helping lead the doj transition effort here in palm beach. he is the former general counsel to the omb under donald trump's

first administration, but two new names for you, one, you've got eric schmitt, the u.s. smart from missouri is under consideration, and matt whitaker, the acting attorney general after jeff sessions left the ag after donald trump's first administration in 2018, in 2019. you're also looking at the department of defense for the pentagon position, you're looking at tom cotton, taking his name out of the running. at state department, marco rubio is potentially under consideration. of course, there is a lot that is taking place here when you're looking at interior department, ag, for the would be trump administration. this is very much an active conversation, at the same time, donald trump is actively making phone calls with foreign leaders, katy. >> vaughn hillyard, thank you very much. it's also very much going to depend on the balance of power in congress. and specifically, how many people donald trump has at his

back in the senate. joining us now, nbc news capitol hill correspondent ali vitali who's got the breakdown of the uncalled races. a donald trump controlled senate with 50, i don't know what's going on. there we go. hi, ali. >> i'm here. >> say donald trump gets four more seats in the senate, it's much easier for him to confirm pretty much anybody he wants than it is a 52-seat majority. >> that's exactly right. and it's why these races that are still uncalled are so important. at the end of the day, though, it's looking like the seats out west, specifically nevada, as well as arizona just to the south, are likely to tilt in democrats' favor. that means that democrats are not losing those two key seats, but the one that democrats and republicans alike are looking at so closely is pennsylvania. that's because dave mccormick right now is leading by just about 31,000 votes. the incumbent center, bob casey, trailing, but his team continuing to say that if you keep counting all the votes, they think they have a path to

victory, but again, that really does mean that it's a 52 or a 53 seat total for republicans, and that really does mean that you think about most of these senators, most of them are already trump allies, they have taken up the maga mantel. many of them are in conversations to even be part of the cabinet. whether trump wants the headache of having to go through taking most people out of the senate to only have them replaced by their governors and whatever the rules are there in each state. that's another question, but we already know that key people like senator tom cotton, by taking their name out of contention for a cabinet position means that he wants to stay and in the leadership role he's vying for have a bigger say in the way that senate republicans support the trump agenda from the other side of pennsylvania avenue. >> so what is the likelihood, ali, that they're going to want to confirm, say that rfk jr. gets put up for, you know, a major post. what's the likelihood that a republican-led senate, 53-majority puts him into a position? health and human services.

>> it's an excellent question. it almost doesn't need to be asked, though, because even if the senate is, like, i don't want to confirm this person at all, they don't have the numbers, we have already seen that you can leave people in an acting capacity. right now, the labor secretary is acting. they were not confirmed by the senate. they didn't have the numbers there. so that could also be part of the story of the trump administration 2.0. in the 1.0 version, there were several acting administrative people in the agencies, in large part because there was a lot of turnover at various points because trump would find people who fell out of favor with him, and then ask them to leave or demand their resignation, and so that is one of the realities here that he could be trying to install allies like rfk jr., and while the hill might not like those people, there is a world in which they could vote to confirm them or he could leave them as acting and wait for the outcry there. >> very good point. i have left you absolutely no time for the house, but there's

something around 30 seats that are open. >> yeah. >> and now looks like it's going to be even harder potentially for democrats to maintain control. give me the ten second version. >> the ten second version is everyone is trying to count to 218. republicans are closer than democrats. that doesn't mean there's not a path. it's narrow and unlikely. republicans right now are preparing for another time in the majority. that means that trump has the same scenario in 2024 that he did in 2017, which is all three branches for the agenda. >> didn't get that much done. we'll see if it's different this time around. ali vitali, thank you very much. coming up, the trials are likely kaput. what about the prosecutors who brought the cases against donald trump? what the president-elect could do if he actually does want to punish them? first, though, the economy, another fed cut today and a surging stock market. what donald trump will inherit when he takes office in january. d the swiffer powermop. it has a built-in solution that breaks down dirt on contact.

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fed chair jerome powell was just asked if he would resign if donald trump asked him to step down. he said no. joining us now, nbc news senior business correspondent christine romans, and cnbc's senior analyst and ceo of, i never know this, ifiai. ron insana, i should have asked. good to have you. jerome powell, christine, the reason this is news, donald

trump wants to be involved in the fed, thinks the president should have more control over what the fed does. jerome powell doesn't have to go anywhere because it's the law that he has that job for as long as his term is. >> it's an independent fed. it's independent from the white house, right, and it's meant to be that way so you don't have presidents trying to get you to lower interest rates so they can get reelected. and the fed chief was asked if donald trump asked you to resign will you, and he said no. he was asked if donald trump tries to put his own people in or demote you, would that affect the fed, and he said that's not permitted under law. and he said it twice. he was trying to send the message there that he's there. the fed is going to try to do its job. >> donald trump did want to get involved in the fed rate cuts or hikes, but likely cuts. if he wanted to try to influence things, is there anything that he could do if jerome powell refuses to budge? >> so not under current law. i mean, i think the only outside possibility that would exist, katy, would be for there to be a new mandate written by congress

for the federal reserve, what we call humphrey hawkins, the rules as written by congress call for the federal reserve to maintain max up sustainable employment and price stability. they would also have to rewrite the rules around nominating and maintaining the governorships and chairmanships of the federal reserve. currently no. would he have a big enough margin in congress to do something that would alter that, i doubt it, but he could certainly try if the numbers went his way. >> let's talk about what the fed did today, they cut rates by a quarter of a percentage point again. there's also a record stock market right now. >> yeah. >> donald trump stands to inherit quite a good economy. >> absolutely. he does, and the fed is lowering interest rates, slowly, it might continue to go slowly because the economy is so strong, despite what everybody who voted believes, the economy is so strong, the fed needs to be careful not to cut rates that it spins off more inflation. the stock market is so

interesting because i was reading all of this stuff in maga world yesterday where people were saying, look, finally, you know, things are going to be better in america. stocks are doing so well. wait a minute, they have been rallying. they were you were 68% under the first trump administration, another 50% under joe biden. they have been going up strongly because conditions have been good, even with covid, or despite covid, the conditions have been good for american companies. now, the president-elect wants to have a lot of tariffs. deregulation, tax cuts, some of those things are good for corporate america. tariffs might not be, if there are trade wars. the jury is out, i think, about what longer term wall street is going to think about a second trump administration. it just depends on what he does. >> he was able to put some tariffs into place during his first administration, ron, what is the likelihood do you think he's actually going to impose a 10% tariff on all goods, even higher for some other goods. is he going to have the voices of wall street in his ear saying

this is a bad idea for this, that and the other? >> perhaps. but, you know, i just finished giving a speech on the economy not too long ago, and i went back to 2016 where we were told either to take the president literally, but not seriously or seriously but not literally. if you take him both this time around, he has the latitude as president of the united states to impose across the board tariffs on all of our trading partners, 10 to 20% on many, 60% there will be people trying to talk him out of that. it would be costly. as christine was saying, what's interesting here, when you parse the stock market's reaction, they're responding favorably to the notion of tax cuts and deregulation. the bond market was worried about cutting taxes and the impact on the deficit, the inflationary impact of tariffs, and the wildly inflationary and recessionary impact if it were to be undertaken of mass deportations of individuals who are currently in the labor force. so i think you have to look at each thing singularly, and then look at them together to

determine what the economic exact is versus the market impact. >> yeah, also wall street's not main street, and i underscored that. christine romans, ron insana, thank you very much, i appreciate it. still ahead, what world leaders are bracing for as donald trump comes back to office. we have reaction from the world's strong men. not including zelenskyy obviously. obviously. why use 10 buckets of water when you can use 1 fire extinguisher. and to fight heartburn, why take 10 antacids throughout the day when you can take 1 prilosec. for easier heartburn relief, one beats ten. prilosec otc. one pill. 24 hours. zero heartburn. ["the glory of love" plays] giving. ♪ giving that's possible through the power of dell ai with intel. so those who receive can find the joy of giving back. jorge has always put the ones he loves first. but when it comes to caring for his teeth he's let his own maintenance take a back seat.

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now that donald trump will be president again, what happens to the legal cases against him? and what happens to the prosecutors who brought those cases? joining us now, msnbc legal correspondent lisa rubin. first up, the cases themselves going away, i assume. >> i think a lot of them will go away. we have had reporting including from nbc news that jack smith, who brings both of those federal cases pending against donald trump, one of which is on appeal and has been dismissed, that their office is looking for ways out, how do they unwind those cases, dismiss them, ask to stay them, one way or another those cases are likely to go away and sooner than trump takes office. >> i was wondering yesterday what it would mean if donald trump, what it would look like if donald trump wanted to go after jack some way or another end those case. >> i wanted to know if donald trump wanted to go after jack smith or anyone who has brought a case against him, and ken delainian said it is something

akin to the durham investigation. >> i think it might be the durham investigation, and that is someone close to the investigation is telling him to lawyer up or the internal doj investigation, and there is people who want him to be investigated. >> what charges? >> if you look at the white house council mike davis it would be a conspiracy against civil rights which is basically if you conspire with other people to interfere with their constitutional rights and the argument would go that trump was persecuted for the political speech and therefore there was a conspiracy to his legal rights. >> and the likelihood it would go anywhere? >> well, if you devoid the department of justice of civil servants who are not there regardless of the political

party, there are not line experienced prosecutors to say, let's bring the cases, but if trump does not pursue them or stopped by a court from doing it, then you have a cadre of prosecutors who are willing to say, that is not a case worth bringing, and i won't do it. >> even if they were able to bring it, and it did not go anywhere in the courts, and i would imagine that is a hard case to prosecute within a court system or maintain, the legal expenses there, or even if you are just investigated by durham or someone like durham, the legal expenses of defending yourself and the discovery and the process, and the -- >> when you think of durham investigation, nobody was successfully prosecuted and certainly people's lives and financial status were ruin and think of the january 6th investigation as well, and so many people took legal prosecution provided by trump world is because they could not afford it on their own, and these are the things that

bankrupt ordinary people, and civil litigation, you can terrorize people enough through that. >> lisa rubin, thank you very much. >> thank you. and now, from ukraine to gaza, donald trump promise and end to those war, and what the wartime leaders are saying about donald trump today. with tremfya®, most people saw 100% clear skin... ...that stayed clear, even at 5 years. serious allergic reactions and increased risk of infections may occur. before treatment, your doctor should check you for infections and tb. tell your doctor if you have an infection, flu-like symptoms or if you need a vaccine. emerge with clear skin. ask your doctor about tremfya®. ♪♪ why use 10 buckets of water when you can use 1 fire extinguisher. and to fight heartburn, why take 10 antacids throughout the day when you can take 1 prilosec. for easier heartburn relief, one beats ten. prilosec otc. one pill. 24 hours. zero heartburn.

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mean? >> well, since you have been on air, president putin has been talking at a convention inside of russia near sochi, and he has been talking about president-elect putin offering his congratulations and saying, and i think this is the piece that is going to be making headlines and saying that if, quote, president-elect trump picked up the phone to him before the inauguration, he would be interested. he seemed to suggest and in the translation of russian and english, and we will have to check the language exactly, but he would be interested in a summit even maybe before january. he also praised president-elect trump for his quote courage during that assassination attempt. he echoed some of the election themes talking about women's sports and the deep state of

america, and intimating that president-elect trump should not be led by the deep state the way that president putin says that he was back in 2016 in the way of the first administration, and interesting to hear that. of course, it is going to raise the question of whether we will see an echo of that first trump administration. we certainly know of course that president-elect trump has said that he wants to see a cease-fire over ukraine. volodymyr zelenskyy offering his congratulations, too, and dueling congratulations of course, because after years of war in ukraine, there is now a battle to see what the new american president will demand and how that will play out. >> what about this middle east? you are there in dubai and president trump famously stopped there to saudi arabia and his first trip was to sasaudi, and w

is the middle east reacting and president benjamin netanyahu reacting? >> yeah, i think it is, kat , so much has changed since 2016, and the saudis have been clear they need a palestinian state before they agree to some normalization with israel and some kind of a security deal which they desperately want with the united states. president netanyahu is openly celebrating the election of trump. the others here in the gulf not authorized to speak on the record are concerned with the next weeks and months when you have a lame duck president biden and what is israel going to do and iran do before president-elect trump becomes