american ever, the first asian- american in the senate from the east coast of america, but that is the kind of representation i think people want. they want to see a new generation of leadership step up, see a new era of politics come into place, with we can restore that sense of integrity and that sense of fairness. and i get it, we have challenges ahead. difficulties moving forward. but, we need to make sure we don't give up. >> senator elect andy kim, who really earned that victory in new jersey, i got to say, from the beginning. it was a well earned victory. senator-elect, thank you very much. >> thanks so much for that is "all in" on this tuesday night. "alex >> i just feel like the perspective from these guys is so vital right now. great show, my friend. do you remember how earlier this year, south dakota governor

thought it would be a good idea to put in writing her own book that she shot and killed her 14- month-old dog cricket because cricket was an trainable, the reason governor kristi noem thought that would be a good anecdote to recall because she thought she would illustrate her willingness to do anything difficult, messy and ugly if it simply needs to be done. after that story did not land exactly the way she thought it might, she treated that shooting her 14-month-old dog wasn't easy but often the easy way isn't the right way. this is the person that donald trump is planning to nominate to run the department of homeland security in his upcoming administration. and just to be clear, south dakota is closer to the canadian border than the southern border but for whatever reason, donald trump

picked kristi noem to be his homeland security secretary, dog killing and all. and the wildest part is that so far out of everyone trump has topped to run his immigration policy, dog killing kristi noem is probably the most normal of the bunch.>> you grab illegal immigrants and you them to the staging ground, then you deputize the national guard to carry out immigration enforcement, the military has the right to establish a fortress position on the border and to say no one can cross at all.>> that was stephen miller, he is expected to be named the deputy chief of staff for policy and we don't even have to imagine what his plans are when it comes to immigration. late last year, miller spoke to the new york times, laying out plans that involved giant camps

and mass deportations, and the goal here is millions of people per year, a project that miller and kristi noem will be aided by thomas homan, he will have a wide portfolio overseeing immigration policy and its limitation. you are probably familiar with the policy he championed from the last trump administration, family separation. also known as the zero tolerance policy, it separated more than 5000 families in trump's first term and dhs published a report this year showing that for more than 1000 of those children, the u.s. government still does not know if they were ever reunited with their parents. that was the policy tom homan championed, something he defends to this day . last

month, when tom homan was asked whether the biggest deportation program would be possible without family separations, here was his response.>> is there a way to carry out mass deportation without separating families?>> of course there is. families can be deported together.>> there are 4.7 million households across the country where the residents are of mixed immigration status, some are undocumented, some are permanent legal residents and some are american citizens, so the idea that you could just deport families together does not comport with the reality, the scale of this situation. and that happens to be true about a lot of his ideas, somewhere between half-baked and just not baked at all, for example when he speaks about immigrants coming over the southern border, he describes all of them as criminals, whether or not they have

actually committed a crime.>> if i'm in charge of this, my priorities are public safety and national security threats first.>> first implies others follow, right? so what is the scenario? >> it is not okay to enter the country illegally, this is a crime.>> so grandma is in the house, she is undocumented, does she get arrested, to? >> if you have entered this country illegally, you have committed a crime and you're not off the table.>> the reason why he thinks it depends when it comes to whether he will arrest grandma, is that tom homan is purposefully vague about who gets deported first, who exactly is a criminal. this is him last night on fox laying out the different categories of immigrants as he sees them.>> you came to this country illegally which is a crime, you are committing a crime against the united states

citizens, you get no grace period so we are coming for you. for those others, deport all four.>> so, you committed a crime and you should be deported or you are not a criminal but you should leave, too. the general gist appears to be criminalizing immigrants as much as possible and there is a reason for that. the trump administration would like to deport as many immigrants as possible, stephen miller laid out the plans for the new york times, he wants to end the deferred action for childhood arrivals program that would strip more than half 1 million americans of the legal right to stay in the united states, he wants to use title 42 to refuse to hear asylum claims altogether. that would mean even people with valid asylum claims for a war and violence and dictators, even they would not have a legal path to citizenship in the u.s. it is essentially a

criminalization of immigration at large and these are the people he has tasked to carry out what he says will be the largest deportation operation in u.s. history. there are more than 11 million undocumented immigrants living in the u.s. today, his aim is to deport more than 1 million of those people per year but even just logistically, that is a nightmare, right now immigrations and customs enforcement only has around 6000 agents, so trump has voted using the national guard and potentially the u.s. military to pull this off. the national guard and the u.s. military going into communities and ripping people out of their homes.>> stephen miller said this will involve large-scale raids.>> i don't use that term but you are probably talking about law enforcement operations which the administration pretty much stopped.>> workplace

enforcement that is around them. >> and that is going to be necessary. >> this is what it looked like in the first trump administration, ice conducted a workplace raid in nebraska arresting 133 immigrant workers, the superintendent of the local public schools told the washington post that she suspects anywhere between 50 to 100 kids in her district may have been separated from a relative or family member by that raid. at least three children were separated from both parents, one was in third grade and another in fifth grade. one was a baby. and that whole operation to arrest a grand total of just over 100 people, that operation took 15 months to plan and trump wants to do raids like that to round up more than 1 million people per year, nbc news reports that the trump administration is already talking to companies defined

detention centers near major u.s. cities, they are contemplating building camps near denver, los angeles, miami and chicago. even though trump and his incoming officials seem woefully unprepared for the gigantic task they have assigned themselves, immigration lawyers across the country say they are ready for whatever donald trump brings their way. the founder of the international refugee assistant project told the times this week, we literally have a blueprint of what they are planning to do, so we have had months and months to figure out how to protect people. joining me now is the ceo and cofounder of the international refugee assistance project and jacob silver from nbc news and one of the executive producers of separated, a film by errol

morris. the film of course is based on jacob's book by the same name and it is indispensable in this moment. becky, there is an astounding amount of fear and trepidation and concern about the people trump has named in the last 24 hours and the plans, first of all, the definition of who is going to get deported first seems like a real moving target, everyone appears to be a criminal, how are you looking at this situation? >> we are anticipating chaos and i think chaos is what people thought they were voting against, trump ran on a policy saying there's chaos at the border which is actually not true, encounters at the border have been down under biden, now he's saying they have 60,000, 77 -- 70,000 beds, they are

going to use that to create mass deportation camps to deport millions of people, what he is talking about is chaos on a level that we can't even imagine and i think that is what we are facing.>> jacob, you listen to tom homan, you know this individual, and when he has asked about family separations, it is clear that while he knows it is not a good thing to announce that is going to be a part of it, it is an inevitable feature of all of this. i want to play a little bit of a clip, this is aoc interviewing tom homan in 2019, about how and why people get separated from their families.>> zero-tolerance was interpreted as the policy that separated children from -- >> if i get arrested for dui and i have a young child in the car, i'm going to be separated,

-- >> this gets at the heart of it, he thinks if everybody is a criminal, which is a permission structure to deport anybody that is involved in immigration.>> he is describing that prosecution has a reason for separation, and in the case of the film, separation was the purpose, prosecution was the tool, basically to effectuate that separation, separation was the goal all along, it wasn't a crime committed that necessitated a separation like a criminal act or basically what john kelly said would be the reason they would separate people in the first place. i loved your quote in the new york times about having a blueprint, you and i together at the convention saw the blueprint, signs that said mass deportation now. that piece of reporting that you announce from our colleague that came out tonight about ice detention centers, new ones around big cities, you don't

have to think too hard about that because they already exist, they have been inside, it was one of the only times i met a separate apparent inside ice immigration detention, that is a facility where i saw as i walked through, grown men curled up in the fetal position in solitary confinement, it is a place where inspector general reports literally said nooses were found inside those facilities and the idea that on a broad scale, if this reporting bears out to be true, that they want to use those facilities for families as well and julius articles that i want to bring back family detention which was done away with under this current administration, sometimes holding families, which is prohibited today. it is a very clear sign of where they want to go with this and my final thing, mass deportation is family separation, just by another name. maybe as many as 20 million

people with undocumented family members living in this country, so while it is not ripping away children deliberately at the border from their parents, it is ripping the parents away. >> let's unpack the prospects here, from a legal perspective, where do you see the biggest challenges for the trump administration that wants to set up mass detention centers around big metropolitan areas and blue states?>> i think there's a bunch of potential legal challenges, what it is going to come down to is the supreme court figuring out whether it is a body of politics or body of law. there's a lot of logistics and we are about to see what the answer to that is, are they going to uphold the constitution and the equal protection cause, are they going to uphold that the people have due process rights? are they going to let this happen the way it is discussed? there are a lot of potential

legal challenges, i think blue state governors and mayors who are targeted by the detention policy could choose to stand up for it, the federal government will say we are going to withhold your funding. the legality of using federal funding to force state governments to take on constitutional hacks be upheld, that is a question.>> this is a huge stress test, ironically the republicans are the ones pushing against state rights. there's the question of who is going to do this. you know, rounding up people, first of all, it's not like the biden administration says murderers, come across the border, tracking down criminals and getting them out is still a priority. the trump administration says they will prioritize these people but even small-scale raids like the one we talked about in nebraska is an incredible tax on resources, staffing, agencies, this is something, if you're talking about 1 million people per year, how is dhs going to

manage this?>> it is a fair question but what i come away with, i believe them when they say they intend to do something at this point, during the obama administration, they have a policy, they call it felons, not families. they ended up deporting more people including families than any other president in the history of the united states and that is the baseline for this administration starting today. they may not have the resources today but they also didn't have the national guard down at the borders, then they did all of a sudden. they said they were not going to separate, then they did. i don't know necessarily how they will do it or if they are going to do it but what i know is that when they said last time they would deliberately take children away from their parents in order to scare other people from coming to the country and everybody said wait a minute, we are only going to

do that in the worst case scenario to the worst case offenders. 55 million children got taken away from their parents.>> in terms of, i want to drill into stephen miller saying we are going to take dea agents and put them on this task, we will take the national guard and repurpose them, they have some leeway with these fallacies, can you really do that in a time where there's a lot of natural disasters happening in this country? >> that is the question, we are talking about a multibillion dollar operation, ironically at the same time, elon musk is here to cut down on federal bureaucracy, so i hope there's a cage fight on that and that would be fun to watch.>> everyone wants to close the door behind them, i think. but, it is a massive undertaking, you have to ask

yourself, what else would the national guard be doing that they are going to be persecuting immigrants instead? should the dea be trying to cut down on trafficking and trying to fight the opioid epidemic or the should they be persecuting immigrants. there is a real cost to this that they are not anticipating.>> and they will say, reporting is so essential because in many ways, you and a handful of other reporters on the front lines of this family separation policy when it first started, that moved the needle in terms of this administration, and the past administration, changing its position and i'm not sure the american public is going to be down for mass detention centers.>> it was my colleague, katelyn dickerson, at the university of michigan, dr. lopez who wrote a book about

separating law-enforcement, i think this admin she forgets that donald trump reversed the separation policy because he said i didn't like the sites and the feeling of the children being separated and maybe what was one of the more awkward moments in the oval office to watch, watch him sign that executive order, reversing the policy that he put himself, because it was not bipartisan condemnation, it was universal, the pope spoke out against that policy and i think that's what they are up against again if they do go forward with this but that is a decision they will have to make, do they want to revisit one of the most shameful chapters in the history of our country? >> thank you so much for your perspective on this, i really appreciate your time. coming up, trump picks the fox news host to be the secretary of defense, george connolly will weigh in on that. but first, it has been a week

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xfinity mobile. now xfinity internet customers can buy one line of unlimited and get one free for a year. >> i think president trumps return to the white house is a great thing for our country, having republican control of the senate is really important and i think people are very

anxious and excited about that move. >> mike johnson is feeling optimistic about congress today, a sharp contrast to the backstabbing that defined most of the recent republican-led congress. a week after the election, nbc news has yet to project who will win control of the house, republicans have 216 seats, nbc news has 12 races undecided. on the senate, republicans have 52 seats, and although the last race in pennsylvania has yet to be called by nbc, dave mccormick has already been invited to senate orientation this week. joining me now for his first tv interview since he won re- election is senator chris murphy, democrat of connecticut. thank you for being here, i wanted to talk to you last week, let me just first get to your big picture thoughts on the fact that while we haven't

called the house, it looks very likely that republicans will control the white house, senate, and the judiciary as well, how do you look at the landscape right now?>> yes, i think election day was a cataclysm for democrats, i don't think there's any way to sugarcoat it, there is a path back to electoral majority and house majority, it is very difficult in the senate right now, we have an effective cap of 52 seats and you saw this massive demographic movement away from democrats amongst some of our core constituencies. this is a red alert moment for the party, i think we are beyond small adjustments and i don't think i have all the answers at this point but, my sense is, we are a party that claims to fight for and care about poor people and yet they started voting a few years ago

in droves for republicans and that probably is due to the fact that we are just not listening to them, that we elect think tanks and special interest groups to tell us what the people want instead of listening to them. that is our job, to reconstruct an agenda that will speak to the people that we are trying to lift up out of difficult circumstances in this country, something we haven't done a very good job of doing or translating over the past few years. >> you talk about it being a red alert moment, i would think that some version of an alarm bell should be running, ringing for whatever republicans there are left in the senate, given the fact that the incoming president, donald trump is already saying he wants republicans in the senate to be down with a recess appointments, that is basically bypassing the senate to get his

nominations through but republicans will be running the senate, for people who don't understand what that signals about the caliber of the people donald trump is nominating, can you explain and weigh in on how concerned you are about that?>> so, recess appointments are a limited ability for the president to appoint people to post that are normally confirmable by the senate when the senate is in recess but that is normally done when the senate is out for a long period of time. what trump is asking republicans to do as i understand it, is to essentially voluntarily recess the senate for the explicit purpose of allowing him to put into place people who probably couldn't get 50 votes in the senate and frankly just to avoid the scrutiny that would come with a debate and confirmation process in the senate. that is extraordinary. it is not likely to be upheld by the supreme court, but it is

also a sign of the fact that trump is already starting to propose the shredding of democratic norms, either because he knows he can't get his people confirmed or he doesn't want to bother with the normal constitutional checks on his power. it's an early sign that we may be in for some really dysfunctional days as trump asked so cavalier about the democratic checks and balances of how this country is held in check and the executive branch for the existence of our republic. >> given the fact that rick scott is this maga pick to be the republican leader, there's also jonathan cornyn, do you feel like with trump in charge and with an ally, maybe even more extreme that mitch mcconnell or almost decidedly

more extreme, can you help me understand how your thinking about the way the senate does its business, is a radical -- i'm not suggesting that mitch mcconnell was a moderate, but for somebody like rick scott, what does that mean for you and your colleagues?>> i have worked with john cornyn and john thune but i'm not sure there's going to be a practical difference between the two of them and rick scott, let's be honest, donald trump is in charge, republicans are not going to cross him. i saw this up close and personal when we negotiated the bipartisan immigration reform bill, there were 20+ republicans ready to support that until donald trump told them all to vote against it and they all fell in line within hours. so i don't necessarily think that the narrative here is some establishment republicans

running against a maga republican for senate leadership, whoever runs that caucus is going to be taking his instructions from donald trump and perhaps instructions to dismantle some aspects of our democracy to allow trump to govern his authoritarian. >> chris murphy, you have got your work cut out for you, thank you for taking a few minutes to chat about how you are looking this moment in the work that lies ahead, really appreciate the time.>> coming up, trump selection in the second term cabinet has kicked into overdrive this evening, george connolly joins me to discuss the trump nominees, that is next. it no. i can do some research. ya know, that's backed by j.p. morgan's leading strategists like us. when you want to invest with more confidence... the answer is j.p. morgan wealth management people love to find me. wh but me, i love findingith the perfect gift.. like for my friend wenda, who loves coffee. or for my little dog woof, who eats big.

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>> the first person donald trump ever appointed to be his national security adviser was general mike flynn. he lasted in that position for 24 days before he was indicted for lying to the fbi about his contacts with russian officials and had to resign. trump cycled through several other national security advisers, mcmaster went on to call trump's presidency in an exercise in competitive sycophancy. there was john bolton who told donald trump he was unfit to serve as president, and his

first term national security adviser, robert o'brien might have stayed in the fold, and now donald trump has found the guy he wants to be his next national security adviser, michael waltz, he showed up outside trump's criminal trial to defend the president's hush money arrangement with an adult film star, and he worked with other election tonight republicans to try to overturn the results of the 2020 election, leaving his hometown paper to detract the endorsement of him, we had no idea, had no way of knowing at the time that mike waltz was not committed to democracy. that is the man donald trump has picked to be his national security adviser and he finds himself in rare company,

tonight trump announced that fox news has pete hegseth to be the first security of defense, he had some questionable reviews on personal hygiene.>> i don't think i've washed my hands for 10 years, really, i don't really wash my hands.>> somebody help me.>> germs are not a real thing, i can't see them, therefore they are not real.>> today trump picked elon musk and vivek ramaswamy, he

claims the new department will dismantle government bureaucracy, cut wasteful expenditures all in the name of making government more efficient because nothing says government efficiency like topping two people to do one person's job. there's also trump's nominee for ambassador to israel, mike huckabee, when he ran for president in 2008, he told voters at one campaign event, i have to be careful saying this because people get really upset, there's really no such thing as a palestinian. that has been a political tool to force land away from israel. all of this is a part of his worldview as evangelical christian scientist, and he writes, particularly for popular evangelists with significant clout within the republican party, their support for israel is rooted in its role in the supposed end times, jesus returns to earth, a buddy final

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>> donald trump has been on a tear over the past 72 hours, appointing loyalists, many of whom are entirely disqualified to keep future positions in his cabinet. marco rubio, elise stefanik and pete hegseth. joining me now is george conway, contributor for the atlantic and a wealth of information and feelings about donald trump. first of all, as we all are to a certain degree, we have some reporting that the vetting

process or the deliberation process involves a lot of television, here is what the war room at mar-a-lago has multiple tv screens, it is how you look on tv, but how you suck up to the boss and tell the boss he is great and how wonderful he is. and that is the main purpose of the people surrounding donald trump, it is not to actually run anything, god forbid, it is basically assuages ego, that is what this sequel is, the opening credits.>> questionable

history, a person who successfully got trump two-part criminals, clearly he wasn't even a weekday host on fox, but i mean, first of all, the churn here would be remarkable. >> it always is remarkable, but, but for the following reasons, these people are not going to challenge him in any way. the churn in the first trump administration because people would occasionally stand up to him or slow things down or take paper off his desk or say no to him, and there's all sorts of instances where people were kind of resisting his stupidest

urges and they all treated him in the first administration, they understood that he didn't know anything and they kind of treated him that way and he got mad about it and sooner or later, he fired people and they claimed they were terrible, and who hire those people by the way, and you know later, we didn't see very many supporting him into the 24 but somehow he is back and the people he has this time, it makes perfect sense for a narcissist. >> marco rubio has as of late been in the band or camp, but he does have a distant past of being a critic and i wonder if you hold out any hope that he is in some ways tethered to reality of secretary of state.

>> i don't have the full opposition or research file on marco rubio, i try not to pay too much attention to him but he has been all over the place on all sorts of things, he was very pro anti-russia at one point, now he says let's sell out the ukrainians, whatever, he will do whatever trump wants, and now at least when you are in the senate, it is a secure job, you don't have to run except every six years and people say the senator, they follow you around and they are respectful to you. that is not going to be true anymore. he is an employee at will. and that is not, you know, for a guy, i don't know where he goes from here if he loses that job. >> perhaps it is his way of appeasing the maga right as he sharpens his tool for another potential presidential run in 2028, who knows anything, elon

musk and vivek ramaswamy being offered jobs in a nonexistent department, the department of government efficiency, nothing has been more overwhelming, it doesn't actually exist, can they bring it into existence by the sheer force of their own will? what do you think is the plan? >> it is not going to be a governmental department as i understand it and there are rules and statutes that apply to the federal advisory committee act, it talks about regulating from ethics standpoint, people coming in and being consulted on how to run the government and i'm not an expert in that but we are going to end up knowing a lot more about it in the not-too- distant future i think.>> we are going to become experts in confirmation processes during senate recesses, we are going to understand appropriations

like never before, partly metro -- parliamentary procedure, it is going to be a whole new addition to the american public, thank you for your time and your incredible disbelief with everything that is happening right now. the justice department is bracing for big changes when donald trump re-enters the white house but who is going to be left in the building? that is next. is next and with the right help, i can make this place i love even better. earn up to 5% cash back on business essentials with the chase ink business cash card from chase for business. we shall overcome. we shall overcome. the struggle for equal rights in the united states has been hard fought, but even today, we're still fighting for racial justice, for voting rights, and against hate and extremism.

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>> two months after president trump abruptly fired james comey in 2017, he nominated christopher wray to lead the top law enforcement agency or a 10 year term, but now with three years still left in that term, christopher wray is reporting for the very real possibility that he will be fired before it ends and he is not alone. if trump makes good on his promises, the entire justice department may soon be replaced by a cast of trump loyalists,

many career justice department attorneys do not plan on sticking around long enough to find out whether trump threats are real or just campaign bluster. joining me now is the author of that legal affairs reporter, political, josh kirstein. thank you for joining me tonight, i'm very curious to hear your assessment about how much of this is attrition or how much of this is just trump coming in and siting mass layoffs. what is the mood inside the doj in terms of the career lawyers who still work there? >> well, i would say it is pretty grim and pretty glum at the moment i would say, how many of those people are going to decide to actually leave their jobs voluntarily before january 20th i think is still an open question. people i talked to seem to be inclined to try to stick it out until they find it unattainable to do that anymore. but at the moment, they are very nervous and one key reason

is that a lot of these people have been through this already, they have been through this from 2017 to 2021, they saw what a chaotic scene it was at the justice department, i have been covering the justice department for a long time and we remember being called in because it looks like jeff sessions is going to get fired today or rod rosenstein is going to get fired or bill barr is going to resign, and everybody i have talked to now expects it to only be more chaotic, unpredictable and perhaps off the rails then the previous administration.>> you talk about the jeff sessions and rod rosenstein's of the world, trump likes to fire people, but vivek ramaswamy is going to have a role in the new trump administration, in 2023, proposed mass layoffs, firing

75% of the federal workforce, he believed that the supreme court would back him up. is there any expectation that this may not be a case-by-case basis, am i staying or going, just a massive bloodletting, is that discussed in the doj? >> the main concern is more of an ethical and moral concern that people don't want to be put in a position of having to defend something like family separation or something worse. but, there is another concern which as you say is sort of a massive bloodletting, mass layoff, there is this thing where trump or at least in project 2025, you can see it there and at the end of his previous term talked about massive cutbacks in the civil service and eliminating civil service protections so you would not only have fewer people in these federal government agencies but the political appointees could choose at will which career people they would keep and which ones they would get rid

of which is basically the end of the civil service which is supposed to be merit-based and have some criteria other than politics. there is definitely widespread concern about that within the justice department, both among lawyers and other career staff that have been there for a long time and might have a harder time finding a job than a talented lawyer who is already at the department. >> then there's the people that trump suggested he's going to run out of the country like jack smith, can you talk about that predicament and how these very prominent heads, whether it is investigations or even merrick garland, what the consensus or what the feeling is about how worried they need to be about the future. >> there's always some change in how the justice department is handled from republican to democratic administrations going back and forth, more emphasis on civil rights or more emphasis on environmental enforcement. but what we have potentially coming in is not normal which

is all these people saying they are going to be special prosecutors investigating the special prosecutors and not only the names that you mentioned, people like jack smith might be on the line but anybody who might have worked with jack smith at any capacity could find themselves potentially prosecuted, investigated, could be very expensive for them and for the government. that is a very abnormal and unusual situation and that is part of what is inspiring the fear inside the walls of doj at the moment.>> nothing about this that is our show for this evening, now it is time for "the last word" with lawrence o'donnell. good evening, lawrence. >> good evening, alex. amy klobuchar is going to join us, she helped confirm another biden judge today and this is after donald trump ordered republicans in the senate to make sure that no biden judges