what a day. that does it for us from all of our colleagues across the networks of nbc news. thank you for staying up late. i'll see you the end of tomorrow. today we learned that special counsel jack smith is preparing to leave the justice department before donald trump, the man he has spent several years investigating, takes office. and it seems like for jack smith, that is probably a good call. the justice department is on track for some seismic change and jack smith would do well to get out now. today, donald trump announced that he plans to appoint congressman matt gaetz to be the next attorney general of the

united states. he was trump as he national security security adviser john bolton reacting to the nomination earlier today. >> it must be the worst nomination for a cabinet position in american history. i think this is something that falls well outside the scope of deference that should be given to a president in nominating presence of the senior team. gates is not only totally incompetent for this job. he doesn't have the character. he is a person of moral turpitude. this is a nomination the republican party should oppose. >> now, matt gaetz is a lot of things. for the past four years, gaetz, a republican from florida, has been one of trump's main deep state witch hunters. >> jack smith right now is engaging in explicit election interference.

he is the insurance policy, except now they're trying to ensure that the trial occurs before the election. >> are you protecting the bidens? >> absolutely not. >> hold. on you won't answer the question about whether or not that's a shakedown. you come in here and you lodge this attack. it is a conspiracy theory that there's coordinated against trump. >> i don't care if it takes every ounce of our energy, we either get this government back on our side or we defund and get rid of, abolish the fbi, cdc, atf. doj. every last one of them if they do not come to heel. ? i don't think it's too much to ask. >> that last part was matt gaetz literally calling to abolish the department he's being asked to oversee.

he is also a january 6th truther. as early as january 6th, 2021, the actual day of the insurrection, he was ing baseless conspiracy that's it was instigated by the fbi and antifa. >> i don't know if the reports are true, but the washington times has just reported some pretty compelling evidence from a facial recognition company showing that some of the people who breached the capitol today were not trump supporters. they were ing as trump supporters and were members of the violent terrorist group antifa. >> he is one of the primary defenders of the jigt rioters and has held hearings alleging the mistreatment of january 6th defendants. >> the critical feature of our gathering today is to better understand how people were treated in the follow-on to january 6th. >> we are here to expose the truth.

to ask key questions about what happened on january 6th, who animated the violence, the extent to which the federal government may have been involved. we know this. january 6th last year wasn't an insurrection. but it very well may have been a fed-surrection. >> head of the department of justice? these things do not usually go together. nor does this. gaetz has been investigated by the justice department as part of a probe into his alleged sex trafficking of a minor. now, gaetz has denied any wrongdoing and the justice department never charged him with a crime. according to testimony before the january 6th committee, gaetz did try to wrangle himself a broad pardon in support of sporting trump's insurrection. >> and was representative gaetz requesting a pardon?

>> i believe so. the part that he was discussing, requesting, was as broad as you can describe. from the beginning of time until today for any and all things. he mentioned nixon. and i said nixon's pardon was never nearly that broad. >> all of that is who matt gaetz is. and what makes him such a particularly dangerous choice to be trump's attorney general is that matt gaetz does not care. he does not care what the consequences of his actions are. he does not care what anyone including his colleagues thinks of him. he is willing to be reviled for personal gainful but that may also be the thing that prevents matt gaetz from being confirmed. as one doj official told us, matt lacks any substance and any understanding about the way the department works. this is someone completely unprincipled.

even if you are diehard maga, you don't like this. to that end, the nomination has reveal what could be the first cracks in the forthcoming republican majority. here is lisa murkowski from alaska, a republican. >> i don't think it is a serious nomination for the attorney general. we need to have a serious attorney general and i'm looking forward to the opportunity to consider somebody that is serious. this one, this one was not on my bingo card. >> senator susan collins of maine, also a republican, said this. >> i was shocked that he has been nominated. if the nomination proceeds, i'm sure there will be an extensive background check by the fbi and public hearings and a lot of questions. >> now, there is very little reason to believe that republican there's stand up to

trump on this or really anything else. but voting to confirm congressman gaetz as the attorney general of the united states could be the biggest test of republican resolve that we have seen yet. for his part, gaetz seems confident in his chances. mike johnson announce that had congressman gaetz has offered to resign from the house of representatives immediately so that he can be replaced in a special election before the next congress is seated which is, i don't know, kind of considerate of congressman matt gaetz. except that, punch bowl news is also reporting that the house ethics committee was set to vote friday on releasing a highly damaging report on its investigation into matt gaetz. and that the ethics committee loses its jurisdiction over gaetz when he leaves congress. joining me now, michael schmidt, investigative reporter at the "new york times," and an msnbc

national security contributor, and the author of "where tyranny begins." thanks to you both for being here on this extraordinary news day. let me, of course, get your reaction to this. you've done extensive reporting on the justice department. i wonder what you're thinking about it. >> i was pretty surprised. i had covered the investigation of gaetz. the sex trafficking investigation. and there was something about that investigation that was always really serious that i'm not sure everyone appreciated. that was that if he had been indicted, he would have faced a mandatory minimum of ten years in prison. and that means that if he was convicted, the sentence he would have gotten that the judge could not have wiggled out of unless something really, really extraordinary happened was that he was going to prison for ten years.

and that always made the stakes of the investigation really, really high. ultimately, the department chose not to charge him. we don't know why that was. we do know the woman in question was 17 at the time. the age under the law is 18. we don't know if that played any role in it. the fact that the age was so close and people speculated about that. but to me, to have someone that was facing down the justice department in such a serious way, in such a serious investigation in which it would have been really, really hard to wiggle out of, to then become nominee to be the head of the justice department in just a short period of time. it was only a year or two ago that the department ended its investigation into gaetz. you know, the trump story never fails to surprise me. >> and also, the investigation here seems to have been a turning point in terms of matt gaetz's own personal views and

his anger at the deep state, right? this is something that affected him deeply. >> maybe. i was actually going back and re-reading the stories of the investigation. the reason matt gaetz with donald trump, in 2017 he's a freshman congressman going on fox news. railing against the mueller investigation. donald trump sees him and calls him. this is at the end of 2017. that is how, that was, that's a if he hadder system. that's how john eastman, the lawyer from january 6th legal theories, that's how he got on to donald trump's list. gaetz, whatever you think of gaetz, knows how to exploit those times of things. that's the perfect way for someone like matt gaetz to rise through the process, by becoming

essentially his spokesman on capitol hill in many ways on the russia investigation. >> on the deep state which he now maybe could sit atop of. what are your contacts inside the department of justice saying? the anecdotal reporting that i've gotten has been somewhere between shock and horror. >> i was in the justice department. it was before the announcement was made and things were already somewhat somber. after the announcement was made, a flood of messages, you know, expressing shock and dismay. the career prosecutors who work there for democratic and republican administrations are planning to stay. i think even this announcement of gaetz as the nominee will cause them to double down. most people who have worked there many, many years under both parties care deeply about the institution and they will stay and try to carry out their jobs. if they get asked to do

something illegal, they will decline to do it. i spoke with at least one person who could face a criminal investigation. this was someone involved in one of the investigations of donald trump. this will person said, i have done nothing wrong. there is no case that they can bring against me. this person will be leading the department. they're a more senior official. there's a bit of defiance and a belief in the justice department and its principles. it's the most powerful law enforcement in the country, that they will merit and bring out justice in a fair and balanced and nonpartisan way. it will be a huge test if gaetz is confirmed. that's at least the feeling among go the work force and the justice department. >> michael, there's some reporting from axios about how matt gaetz landed this nomination. matt gaetz's conversation with trump on trump force one this morning, as in today, had a major role in getting him named

for ag this afternoon, people inside the operation tell me. the transition team started vetting ag candidate and gaetz came out of left field. first of all, does that surprise you? and secondly, it's very clear that donald trump thinks the ag should be doing his bidding. you've published some of the memo that's the white house gave trump about the relationship between the president and his attorney general. what is your understanding? >> it's interesting. that goes i know what the reporting i had on this which is that they were considering jay clayton who had been the head of the s.e.c. under trump, and a new york lawyer who, both those people are considered serious lawyers. especially the one who comes from a fancy law firm in new york and was someone who was not interested, apparently, in retribution and such.

it was may understanding that they wanted someone who will go in and move with their agenda. the six or seven names i heard, gaetz was not one of them. and he was someone they were still interested in or talking to or talking about. when i heard gaetz today, i had a list. i was taking notes. >> just likeliesta murkowski. he was not on the list. >> so i, i don't know. >> this is the way we do business now. announce on truth social. is there hope that this may not actually even come to pass? i'm thinking now of the murkowski and collinses of the world. saying joni ernest has expressed some amount of disbelief, john barrasso, others. there are a number of

republicans who are between an eye roll and a head shake. inside the doj, is there hope that the republicans do what is the better thing for the country and not confirm matt gaetz to be ag? >> yeah. they said they home he won't be confirmed. what donald trump is doing is immediately putting moderate republicans under pressure. this is the peak of his political capital. he's just won the house, the trifecta that they've wanted for so long. it is an enormous test. there's concern from these moderate senators about the defense secretary nominee who wants to bar women from being in the military. so it's a huge moment for washington, for these republican moderates and for trump. he's very good at the timing. he's very good at pushing people to bow to his demands. so we will see what happens. i guess i just want to see what plays out.

i don't want to make any guarantees. >> i don't think anybody wants to make any guarantees including republicans whose reputation is on the line. if this came to pass this morning, if friday was the day the house ethics committee was set to release its findings on gaetz' conduct. is it possible that this was such an extraordinarily important choice for our country, was truly motivated by the hips of a conversation on air force one and making sure damaging information did not come to light as part of a house investigation? >> look, whenever there's an idea that trump and his folks are playing multidimensional games, they're usually not. it is usually whatever the simplest answer is possible. if you believe what trump said on the campaign trail about using the justice department and

going after people, then matt gaetz is the logical person to do that. and sometimes we can overthink the trump story and when trump doesn't talk a lot in the past, like he hasn't in the past few days, people say, well, maybe he is whatever. then he does something and you see, you know, let's just go back to what he said on the campaign trail. he said on the campaign trail that he was going to ek retribution. i can't think of anyone who identifies with that mantra and that idea and doing what donald trump wants with the government and cleaning out the deep state than this person who essentially built their political career, not just on being donald trump's advocate but advocate on this particular issue. so i think as i was saying, we can overthink the trump story.

we have to leak at what's in front of us. sometimes it is that easy to understand. >> well, whatever happens, jack smith is deciding to take leave of the justice department at this juncture, certainly seem like a prudent choice given the way the chips seem to be falling. thank you both for your time and your reporting tonight. appreciate it. we have a lot to get to including a welcome at the man president-elect trump wants to oversee the purge of the pentagon. and today president biden met with a man whose threatened retribution on a friendly welcome back.

when you smell the amazing scent of gain flings... time stops. (♪♪) and you realize you're in love... steve? with a laundry detergent. (♪♪) gain flings. seriously good scent.

you got better things to do than clean out clogged gutters. call leaffilter today and never clean out clogged gutters again. leaffilter's technology keeps debris out of your gutters for good. guaranteed. schedule your free gutter inspection now and save up to 35% with leaffilter's black friday deals. meet the traveling trio.

each helping to protect their money with chase. wooo! tools that help protect. alerts that help check. one bank that puts you in control. chase. make more of what's yours. what are folks 60 and older learning these days? new perspectives! ♪♪ how to fix things. ♪♪ fun recip... (high pitched sound) (high pitched sound) (high pitched sound) ♪ ♪ ♪ something has changed within me ♪ ♪ it's time to try defying gravity ♪ ♪ ♪

looking forward to, like we said, having a smooth transition. making sure you're accommodated, what you need. we'll get a chance to talk about

some of that today. welcome. welcome back. >> thank you very much. and politics is tough and it is in many cases not a very nice world but it is a nice world today. and i appreciate it very much. >> today president joe biden met with president-elect donald trump to discuss the incoming transition. a courtesy that by the way, donald trump did not extend to joe biden in 2020. trump appeared to be on his best behavior with you trump has made his intentions clear here. with numerous threats of prosecution and punishment of his political enemies, including president biden and his son hunter. that revenge was played all the more likely with trump's choice of cabinet members including the announcement of matt gaetz as attorney general. joining me to discuss all of this is jen psaki, president biden's former white house press secretary and is now the host, of course, of the smash hit msnbc show inside with jen psaki.

>> great to see you. >> i was thinking about you. i know you've been there through these transitions and they are hard. walk me through what you saw unfold there in front of the fireplace. president biden saying, welcome back to donald trump. >> well, the reason it looks so unfamiliar to everyone is because we have not seen that take place since barack obama invited donald trump eight years ago to the oval office, just two days after he defeated hillary clinton in the election. because donald trump did not invite joe biden because he, as we now know, was busy planning an insurrection, planning fake electors, busy trying to challenge the outcome of the election. that's why it looks so unfamiliar. what i think i saw, and some of the coverage today that is concerning to me and i think everybody should be clear-eyed about, we can't normalize photos and moments and just kind of

forget about all the context. that's why the context is so important here. you just showed a bunch of headlines. the context here that is one moment sitting in the oval office, which trump did not yell, he did not answer questions. he seemed to behave semi normally. it does not mean his plans have changed or his plans to go after his political opponents have changed. we don't know that. that's what i was thinking about. the other thing i would mention, what is normal in transitions is not just this kind of ceremonial meeting between the presidents which always happens between republicans and democrats. republicans to democrats. the staffs are working in lock-step on everything from national security issues to, i remember when we came in and followed the bush team, the obama team did. we were working on the financial crisis and addressing that together. that's what tells you whether this is a peaceful and smooth and effective transition more than one photo op.

>> i have to say, and i understand that biden's goal here is to reaffirm america's commitment to the peaceful transition of power. that is a big, broad -- you know, that's an important thing for the institution of democracy. at the same time, jen, you know, this is someone that biden spent a fair amount of time saying he's ready to shred the constitution and doesn't care about democracy. is his an existential threat to democracy. it is hard to hear him say welcome back in that context. and i would imagine it is hard for staffers to be doing the jobs they're doing. on the one hand they want to be an example of what a functioning democracy looks like. tell staff coming in, today's north america that matt gaetz could be the attorney general, signals a new chapter for this country and a real threat to our existence as liberal democracy. do you think, you know, i'm proned to quota lot on this

program, if trump is really attempting to shred the constitution and democrats are trying to raise the alarm, a rational person might ask, if this is beyond the pale, why are you sitting politely? i know this is tough. you respect biden for what he's trying to do. >> with all due respect to jonathan and others, i've sat with two presidents over three terms. the goal of any president should not be to go to the lowest denominator. i'm not saying that's what he was doing saying but a return to normalcy means returning to normalcy. showing people there can be a peaceful transition of power and not accepting and lowering yourself to the lowest denominator of what the other represents. now, i will say that probably for joe biden, he wanted to punch a wall before and after that meeting, right? probably for every single staffer. in building, they felt the same way. it is much worse now than eight years ago.

i remember feeling the transition, we were living double lives was the best way of describing it. you just felt viscerally like this person is a threat to the country. that's what every person in the white house feels right now at every level. and president obama was telling, we have to treat them with grace and respectful offer them the binders we've made. make sure they know what to do when marine one lands. it feels unfair, all of those things. it doesn't mean that any sitting president should not invite the next one or just behave in the same manner they did. joe biden should go to the inauguration. i'm sure he will. >> we have a picture, actually. i was reminded when you talk about how wrenching -- >> oh, god! >> i remember this picture. of course, i knew who you were

but what i remember about this photo is the woman, i just knew in my lizard brain. there's someone who looks ashen and it's you. it's you dead center. this is the day before trump comes to visit the white house and meet with obama. this is president obama making remarks in the rose garden. you know the visceral repulgs and going into this transition, it must be even harder for those people working inside the white house. >> i would note, i hadn't slept. i looked ashen because i hadn't brushed may hair or put make-up on. i have a little hermione granger vibe to me. i think what that showcases, in the hours before that photo, we had all come into the white house. had a meeting with senior staff. we're members of the cabinet were getting teared up because they were worried about the impact. not on barack obama's legacy. no one was thinking about that at the moment. they were thinking about

people's lives. before that meeting, there was a meeting with our teams, the communications and press teams. people were crying. you know why? they were from muslim american families, first generation immigrants, members of the lgbtq+ community. it sounds cheesy and cliche but it is absolutely extra how people felt fear for their own lives and their way of living at the moment. that's what that followed. yes, the look on may face shows the double life i was leading. the next day i had a lengthy meeting with hope hicks because i was asked to. donald trump asked where the open workspace was and who would be staying. so there are strange bhoemts that transition that won't be replicated but it does remind me of how hard it must have been today for joe biden as much as i know why people are frustrated by what he said and all the people sitting in that building. many of whom worked for him when

he ran. >> the extraordinary and extraordinarily resilient jen psaki. thank you. >> thank you. coming up, donald trump has picked fox news host hegseth to lead the military. that's next. o lead the military. that's next. king? i'm thinking... (speaking to self) about our honeymoon. what about africa? safari? hot air balloon ride? swim with elephants? wait, can we afford a safari? great question. like everything, it takes a little planning. or, put the money towards a down-payment... ...on a ranch ...in montana ...with horses let's take a look at those scenarios. j.p. morgan wealth management has advisors in chase branches and tools, like wealth plan to keep you on track. when you're planning for it all... the answer is j.p. morgan wealth management. our right to reproductive health care is being stolen from us. i can't believe this is the world we live in,

where we're losing the freedom to control our own bodies. we need your support now more than ever. go online, call, or scan this code, with your $19 monthly gift. and we'll send you this "care. no matter what" t-shirt. it is your right to have safe health care. that's it. go online, call, or scan right now. as americans, there's one thing we can all agree on. the promise of our constitution and the hope that liberty and justice is for all people. but here's the truth. attacks on our constitutional rights, yours and mine are greater than they've ever been. the right for all to vote. reproductive rights. the rights of immigrant families. the right to equal justice for black, brown and lgbtq+ folks. the time to act to protect our rights is now. that's why i'm hoping you'll join me today in supporting the

american civil liberties union. it's easy to make a difference. just call or go online now and become an aclu guardian of liberty. all it takes is just $19 a month. only $0.63 a day. your monthly support will make you part of the movement to protect the rights of all people, including the fundamental right to vote. states are passing laws that would suppress the right to vote. we are going backwards. but the aclu can't do this important work without the support of people like you. you can help ensure liberty and justice for all and make sure that every vote is counted. so please call the aclu now or go to my aclu.org and join us. when you use your credit card, you'll receive this special we the people t-shirt and much more. to show you're a part of the movement to protect the rights guaranteed to all of us by the us constitution. we protect everyone's rights, the freedom of religion, the freedom of expression,

racial justice, lgbtq rights, the rights of the disabled. we are here for everyone. it is more important than ever to take a stand. so please join us today. because we the people means all the people, including you. so call now or go online to my aclu.org to become a guardian of liberty. (tony hawk) i still love to surf, snowboard, and of course, skate, so i take qunol magnesium to support my muscle and bone health. qunol's high-absorption magnesium glycinate helps me get the full benefits of magnesium. qunol. the brand i trust.

the president may be preparing pardons for service men accused of war crimes. >> i can't stand that headline, accused of war crimes. these are men who went into the most dangerous places on earth with a job to defend us and made tough calls on a moment's notice. they're not war criminals. they're warriors who have now been accused of certain things that are under review. >> that was pete hegseth who donald trump just picked to run the military. he reportedly spent months personally lobbying trump to pardon multiple u.s. service members who had been accused of war crime. the most famous of whom was navy s.e.a.l. chief edward gallagher. his own platoon members accused him of war crimes including targeting civilians, and most dramatically, gallagher was accused of stabbing a sedated 17-year-old captain to death

with a hunting knife. "the new york times" obtained videos of gallagher's platoon members explicitly describing the episode when interviewed by the navy. >> so he's still alive. >> he's still alive. he was sedated. >> at that point in time, like he probably wasn't going to die. >> gallagher comes on the scene with his medic bag and pushes the kid down on the ground while he checks him for wounds. right then you can see a hand reach up and turn off the helmet cam. >> so what did you actually see gallagher do? >> maybe just start stabbing the dude. >> i see him with the navy in his neck. >> gallagher's platoon members accused him of taking photos with a 17-year-old's corpse as if it was a hunting trophy. >> taking a good picture, getting the [ bleep ] picture. bring it in, bring it in.

>> i'm not getting with the [ bleep ] picture. >> the body is right there. >> very controversial. gallagher was ultimately acquitted of all charges except for the charge of taking that photo for which there was indisputable photographic evidence. after the verdict, gallagher was incredibly specific about who had helped him. >> i want to say thank you, fox news. >> and thank you pete. as in pete hegseth. months later, gallagher had all the more reason to thank pete hegseth. >> president trump intervening on behalf of three u.s. service members accused or convicted of war crimes. the president issued pardons and restored the rank of navy s.e.a.l. eddie gallagher -- >> not only had gallagher been acquitted but president trump himself had intervened to reverse the navy's decision to demote gallagher.

it was a scandal even inside the military. jeffrey goldberg reported in the atlantic that the joint chairman of the joint chiefs of staff had tried to talk him out of it. milley tried to convince trump that he was hurting navy morale. mr. president, we have laws about what happens in battle. you can't do that kind of thing. it's a war crime of trump said he didn't understand the big deal. the reporter who covered gallagher's saga for the "new york times" described the impact of the acquittal inside the navy. >> what's the gallagher effect? in some ways it's very real and has already happened. after he was acquitted, the navy prosecutors in san diego looked at the cases of some of his friends who were also facing charges for killing people overseas and just dropped the cases. >> when the daily beast first broke the story that fox news' pete hegseth was lobbying trump

to pardon accused war criminals, including gallagher, they spoke with people who explained why hegseth might have wanted to get involved. most people said hegseth strongly views current rules of engagement as too restrictive, and that that restrictive name sets u.s. troops up for failure, and to be unfairly branded as criminals or monsters in combat zones. now donald trump wants that man he thinks was too hard on war criminals and who thinks the rules of combat are too strict, trump wants that man to lead the united states military. did i mention about the "wall street journal" is reporting that trump's team is considering purging all the generals he deems too woke? we'll have more on all of this coming up next. xt

how are folks 60 and older having fun these days? family cookouts! ♪♪ playing games! ♪♪ dancing in the par... (high pitched sound) (high pitched sound) (high pitched sound) there he is.

wherever i go they always ask “where's waldo?” (high pitched sound) ah, you found me. never “who's waldo?” sometimes it takes someone who really knows you to make you feel seen. gifts that say i get you. etsy has it. we have a great military and we have a military that is not woke. you may have a few people on the top that are woke and we'll get rid of them so damn fast your head will explode. >> according to the "wall street journal," trump's transition team is mulling over exactly how trump might purge the pentagon. ideas include a draft executive order that establishes a warrior board which could effectively fast track the removal of generals and admirals found to be lacking in requisite leadership qualities. among the men exhibiting leadership qualities that trump approves of is apparently fox news personality pete hegseth,

the man he has chosen to lead the military as secretary of defense and the man who has been to the mat for accused war criminals. joining me now, director of homeland security jay johnson who alsoered as general counsel to the department of defense. so great to he sue you here. >> thanks for having me. so much to talk about. >> first, pete hegseth, defense secretary. what is your reaction to that? >> in contrast to one or two of the other nominees who were announced, i tend to want to give him the benefit of the doubt. here's someone who highly educated, could have been a career in wall street, chose to put on the uniform of our country in due combat. i give him that benefit of the doubt. the job of secretary of defense which i observed up close when i was general counsel, you're the ceo of the government's largest cabinet department and most

complex. you're in the fighting chain of demand and you're responsible for the welfare and well-being of the service members. you don't necessarily acquire those skills with all due respect, being a cable news host. >> i'm not trying to be the secretary of defense. >> so i believe that the senate has a major, major responsibility here. it's constitutional prerogative. this nominee with respect to matt gaetz, most certainly, and there are people, there are republican senators who i know and respect and i'm counting on them to do their jobs. people like joni ernst, chuck grassley, the most senior member, these are people who i believe take their constitutional progress.

his stated views on fox else and where should be carefully examined. >> his defense of war criminals, perhaps? >> his defense of war criminals perhaps. on that point, here's why it is so important that we have a military code of conduct. we have military justice. the u.s. military is the most powerful, the greatest military on earth because of our power. but also because we observe the rules. we have a rule of law in the military that is marrow deep in the training of every officer to excuse a violation of the rules, to excuse war crimes is a major setback. it's a blow. it violates everything that is a fundamental part of training of any officer, of any enlisted

member of the u.s. military. that is in my opinion as someone who used to be the senior legal official of that department, one of the things that make our military the greatest military on the earth. they observe the rules and they are taught to observe the rules. >> what about the warrior board? the idea that there would be some new trump body that vets generals and admirals to ensure they comport with trump's ideals. >> there is already a process for doing exactly that, in the selection of three and four stars. unlike the selection and promotion of one and two-star generals, when you get to the three and four-star level, you're being evaluated by the chief of staff of that service, the secretary of defense for a specific command position. there's a will the of vetting and scrutiny that goes in that process. the back stop to that is senate

confirmation. in my years working with the military, alongside a lot of three and four stars, i never asked their political views. they never expressed their political views. i didn't know their political views. i didn't care about their political views. it is simply, what is my mission, give never tools to train and execute the mission. that's what makes our military great. are there some who probably have political views? most certainly. in the military environment day in and day out, it's not expressed. this will warrior board, frankly, i'm sure will be seen by the community as, it has the feel and the smell of a litmus test. are you with the program or not? >> yeah. >> and there are adequate screens for how we evaluate leadership skills in the military that have worked for

decades. >> it all feels like a litmus test. it is a real question about whether or not we can keep the country safe. secretary johnson, it's great to have your perspective on all of this. coming up, senate republicans elected a knew leader today and he was not donald trump's preferred choice. how much backbone might we expect? that's coming up next. expect that's coming up next. see what i did there? hey, jackie! (♪♪) evan, my guy! you're helping them with savings, right? (♪♪) i wish i had someone like evan when i started. somebody just got their first debit card! ice cream on you? ooo, tacos! i got you. wait hold on, don't you owe me money? what?! your money is a part of your community, so your bank should be too. like, chase!

there are some feelings you can get with any sportsbook. so your bank should be too. ohhh! the highs! no, no, no. the no, no, noooos - oooooooo! the oh, oh, ohhhhs! now whatcha wanna do with this? but the feeling that, no matter what, you're taken care of. ohhh, i just earned a hotel suite! hee! you only get that here. at the sportsbook born in vegas,

where they know how to treat you right. who you talking to jamie foxx? bonus bets. exclusive offers. real world rewards. betmgm. download and bet today.

drop everything and get some magic of your own during the xfinity black friday sale. xfinity internet customers, our best deals of the year are back! switch to xfinity mobile and get your choice of a free 5g phone, plus your next unlimited line free for a year. get amazing savings and connect to wifi speeds up to a gig on the go with xfinity mobile. fly don't walk to get our best deals of the year. connect to the world of wicked this holiday, only in theaters november 22nd.

you said that recess appointments are on the table. that's a key demand from president-elect trump. >> we'll make sure we are processing his nominees in a way that gets them into those positions so he can implement his agenda. how that happens remains to be seen. >> new senate majority leader john thune incoming next year seems fairly opened to the idea of bypassing by using recess appointments. is that how this is going to go

down? joining me, former chief of staff to senators john fedderman and harry reid. help me understand what is happening here. john thune sounds like he's cool with recess appointments which seems to be the only way you would get matt gaetz confirmed as attorney general. >> he did sound cool with it in theory. that was before matt gaetz was announced for attorney general. i think he might have thought twice about recess appointments after that announcement. i think the only way matt gaetz will become attorney general is by a recess appointment. i don't know he can get the votes to be confirmed the regular order. what trump did was raise the stakes of that, recess appointments, senate republicans now know what the stakes are. if they give him that power, what they are doing in effect is to give him the power to appoint people like matt gaetz. >> they're giving away their

role of advise and consent. demanding senator back gaetz is the 2024 version of forcing sean pacer to say it was the largest inauguration crowd ever. these aren't just appointments. they're loyalty tests. the absurdity is the point. that seems right to me. >> that's right. absolutely. you're absolutely right. it is about loyalty. this is about forcing his followers to defend the indefensible and we'll see what they do. from an institutional perspective, confirming nominees is something that only the senate does. the house has no role in that process. it is part of senate's special responsibility. if the senate republicans decide to just cede that responsibility entirely by giving trump the power to do recess appointments, and he's made clear, recess appointments were used in the past for special circumstances where a post really needed to be filled under an emergency or something like that. no president has ever used the

recess appointment's power to just fill his cabinet. that's what trump has made clear he's going to do. that is a complete bypass of the senate's advise and consent responsibility. so if senate republicans give him that appointment, they're not just letting him fill one post here or there. they're saying we cede our power, our constitutional responsibility of advise and consent to you, donald trump, our leader. so that's a big test for them and a big test for johnathan. >> do you read anything into the fact that they elected john thune over rick scott who is more maga? let's not say that he's somehow a centrist. do you think that both anything good for the institution? >> you know, john thune is an interesting character. he won his seat in 2004 by knocking off the reigning democratic leader tom dashle in

what was seen at the time a as major victory for this new stale of politics. that was 20 years ago. that style of politics has gotten much more confrontational since then. so yeah. he's not necessarily some institutionalist but he is more of an institutionalist than rick scott. i think rick scott would have rolled over immediately to give trump any power he wants. thune, in theory, is supposed to be the leader who is more protective of senate republicans' prerogatives as independent representatives, as senators entrusted with the advise and consent. >> it is a test for them and taes for our democracy. >> is a test for them and a test for our democracy. thank you for joining me tonight, my friend. great to have your perspective on this one. that is our show for tonight. now it is time for the last word with lawrence o'donnel