donald trump, adhere to the norms and welcomed donald trump back to the white house. >> it's important. we have to have a peaceful transfer of power and free and fair elections in the united states. and it's important that we continue to uphold that tradition and we demand it be upholded in the next two and four years. >> i think the president was trying to send that signal yesterday even as in his last two or so months in office they try to rush through their agenda and try to protect it when trump takes office. thank you for getting your "way too early" for us. "morning joe" is coming up now. . "morning joe" is coming up now i was shocked that he has been nominated. it is the nomination proceeds, i'm sure there will be an expensive background check by the fbi and public hearings and a lot of questions. >> it will be a significant

challenge. >> i don't think it's a serious nomination for attorney general. that's lisa murmurkowski's view. >> it will be like any other nomination and we will do our job. we will see how it goes. >> republican senators on capitol hill reacting to trump's most controversial pick so far, republican matt gaetz from flr as attorney general. he would lead the department that he has called to be eliminated and one that once investigated him for sex trafficking. we will see if he has enough support to be confirmed and if

he could become attorney general without the votes. and the new leader when republicans take majority in the next congress. how republican senator john thune of south dakota is planning to carry out president-elect trump's agenda. inside the oval office meeting yesterday between president biden and president-elect trump in an effort to signal a peaceful transfer of power. >> donald, congratulations. >> thank you. >> and looking forward to as we said having aing smooth transition and make sure you are accommodated and what you need. and we will have a chance to talk. >> cool. >> welcome. >> thank you very much. politics is tough and in many cases not a very nice world but it is a nice world today and i appreciate it very much, a transition that is so smooth, it will be as smooth as it can get

and i appreciate that joe. >> you're welcome. >> good morning. and welcome to morning joe. we have a lot to get to this morning. >> a lot to get to, a busy day yesterday. now many of you have reached out to us since the election and though many were disappointed by the results, you let us know you appreciated our reporting and the reporting of the results in a calm and measured way. >> we are thankful for the kind words we received from those who voted for president trump. we will continue our best efforts to be fair and objective in reporting on the incoming administration. >> now unfortunately, the next story doesn't bode well for us personally but we still give you the facts by remaining objective. >> president-elect donald trump has selected matt gaetz of florida to serve as attorney general and lead the department of justice. if confirmed by the senate, he

would head the department he has in the past called to be shut down. >> i don't care if it takes every second of our team and every ounce of our energy, we either get this government back on our side or we defund and get rid of, abolish, the fbi, cdc, atf, doj, every last one of them if they do not come to heel. and i don't think it is too much to ask. >> also if confirmed, gaetz would lead the department that once investigated him for sex trafficking. in 2020, the fbi investigated allegations that he was involved in the trafficking of a 17-year-old girl. at the core of the case was testimony from a former gaetz associate who is now serving an

11 year prison sentence for several crimes including sex trafficking. but the investigation into gaetz ended enfebruary of 2023 with no charges filed. gaetz abruptly announced he was resigning from congress yesterday after trump posted the message on social media. multiple media outlets reported that the house ethics committee was set to release a report on hem. according to the washington post, gaetz has been under investigation of the bipartisan committee for allegations that he may have engaged in sexual misconduct, illegal drug use, and accepted improper gifts. and now more on the character of matt gaetz and how it connects to this show. donald trump began tweeting about widely discredited conspiracy theories about joe after receiving documents given

to trump by congressman gaetz. that's according to former white house communications director alyssa farah griffin. show revealed the information en2022 in a deposition before the house select committee investigating the january 6th attack. she told lawmakers she was in the west wing with republican congressman jem jordan, former white house press secretary kayleigh mcenany when and gaetz when she noticed he had a folder with him. she asked what was in it and gaetz pulled out conspiracy theories about joe scarbrough. and she said she could not put that in front of the president right as she was getting ushered into the oval office. the next morning, then president trump started tweeting about those debunked conspiracy theories. trump tweeted about the lies to millions of followers for at

least five times over the next three years. those posts caused so much pain and emotional trauma for the widower of an aide who worked for joe, that the widower hemself wrote an open letter to jack dorsey, the then ceo of twitter pleading with him to remove the posts from social media, from the platform, writing, quote, my wife deserves better. twitter never deleted the posts. responding in a statement that the tweets did not violate its terms of service. >> they of course changed the terms of service the next day. so. >> some senate republicans yesterday were surprised and expressed doubt about gaetz's nomination. we will get to that in a moment. it may not matter. trump is demanding that senators allow for recess appointments so

he can unilaterally select the cabinet, arguing it takes too long to confirm nominees. those are the facts. it goes without saying that we invite members of the incoming trump administration to be on our show. and we look forward to discussing this issue and others, face to face with president trump himself. along with joe, willie, and me, we have the most of way too early, jonathan lamere, u.s. special correspondent for bbc news kathy kay, president of the national action network and politics nation, reverend al sharpton, and nbc national security edker david rowe, and also chuck rosenburg. great to have you with us. >> lts talk about the day yesterday. one shock after another that

will have longterm, motion democrats and republicans agree, will have longterm negative impact on the united states. you can look at the ag selection, you can look at tulsy gabbert, dni which our allies said don't expect the shearing of any intell with the united states because of course she has constantly spread disinformation from putin. also, many people concerned about her relationship with assad in syria. and also the d.od. peck which retired generals and admirals, deeply concerned about his lack of experience but also some of the extraordinarily hostile things that he has written, talking about democrats, his enemies from within and worse.

>> yeah, he wrote that in a book not that long ago. that's not an old thought for pete hegseth, the man who has been dominated. for every marco rubio and john thune win yesterday to be majority leader of the senate which most people in washington said, we can live with those choices, john thune highly respected across party lines, along comes a tulsy gabered. she was critical of the invasion of ukraine, always tilting towards russia. the same goes for syria. she paid a visit to assad not so long ago. so big concerns about her directing national intelligence. and then matt gaetz shook democrats and republicans. we will play some of the reaction in a moment from people

who have utterly stunned not just on the other hand well liked in the united states congress and not just democrats but by republican colleagues as well. he is someone like a lot of republicans who talked about the weaponization of the justice department and using the legal system to attack people personally. here you have a lot of that was invented of course but matt gaetz is chosen for the very reason that donald trump will tell you, he will go after donald trump's opponents and perceived enemies as well. david rowe, let's swing over to you for reaction, what you are hearing from sources across the justice department and people who have worked in our legal community for years. what are they saying? >> so yesterday i was in the justice department before this announcement was made. and afterwards, there was shock from people in the department. they were stunned by the choice

and it's a pattern of essentially matt gaetz, based on his past activity will repeat a false narrative, false narrative that fits his political goals. that's dangerous. we need institutions that operate on facts. the power of the justice department is tremendous. that's the concern here. people are not talking about mass resignations but staying and doing their jobs, both democrats and republicans. but it was a shock. there are calls for him not to be confirmed by the senate. but it is this very dangerous rewriting of history and fact that appears is what i believe well happen if she becomes attorney general. >> so one of the things i heard repeatedly after the shock came down is that he won't make it through, and perhaps donald

trump threw this out there and said i will let you shoot down matt gaetz in the senate but you have to give me x, y, and z as a strategic. but the problem with that is if he does recess appointments, it doesn't matter and there is no vote. >>ia, there are a lot of things in play. it can't be overstated how disliked matt gaetz is across capitol hill by both parties. there is no sense that he is qualified for this position. we heard republicans and democrats alike say he would not be able to do the job. it is almost a dare, try to defy me. most of the picks were met with acclaim from the gop. the last few less so. that is one of the theories that gaetz gets knocked down but that

is the one that senate republicans can object to, allowing others toget in. the timing is striking, two weeks before a house ethics report about his conduct. now he is suddenly resigned from congress which is not how this works. you keep your seat in casia are not confirmed. but that makes the probe go away. and now there are questions on whether the report will see the light of day. so chuck rosen burg, let's talk about that, whether that is the decision making process, giving gaetz a cover but also what it means if he is confirmed. there is real doubt about the recess appointment process. thune said he might support it but that was before he was elected. it would be sacrificing a lot of

power if they did that. if gaetz were to get in, what would that look like? >> it wouldn't be good . you mepgzed he is unqualified for the office and of course he is. but in a sense, everyone is unqualified for that office. the work is so deep, and broad, and complex. no one comes enknowing everything from the federal bureau of prisons to the federal bureau of investigations. it is not just that he is unqualified, you look for three things in an attorney general, republican, democrat, male, female, black, whielt white, meaningless unless you have integrity and judgment. and if you don't have that, we are not. and i came in with the republican from western district

of pennsylvania served. a man of tremendous integrity and honor. passionate about the work of the department, understood the norms followed by janet reno who drove bill clinton crazy because of her independence but it is what the department of justice needed. andefen jeff sessions disappointed donald trump when he recused himself of the investigation of russian election interfeerps. i'm sure joe biden was unhappy with merrick garland when hunter biden was indicted and when garland appointed a special counsel to investigate joe beaden's mishandling of clasfeed information. what they have ipcommon is an independent streak. with matt gaetz, not only is he wholly unqualified for the substance of the work but he lacks, integrity, judgment, and independence. what does it look like if he becomes the attorney general of

the united states? it's a train wreck. >> okay. so looking at the reaction on both sides of the aisle, seeing words like stunning, shocking, hearing them this morning, disturbing, wow, from republicans and democrats. to many nominations, you have been with us reporting on the campaign and run up to the reelection of donald trump. my first question is, is it so shocking? i don't think it is at all. not shocking at all. this is actually the kind of thing that president trump laid out very clearly as he was running for reelection. i just want to set the record straight on that. it's just not a surprise, not to me. wondering what you think? and what is your reaction to the nominations that you are hearing from around the world?

>> so i suppose it is shocking enthat the earlier picks in the cabinet seem to be more conventional, they seem to be understood in foreign policy and american system of government more broadly. and that's why matt gaetz came as a shock, maybe not after tulsi gabbard, an unconventional pick. i have heard even from very conservative constitutional lawyers that they find the pick of matt gaetz unfathomable. but donald trump did signal through the campaign and people around him signalled that one of his priorities was to go after his political enemies. it is clear he feels aggrieved at the way he was treated by the justice department, in the way that gaetz does. they are peas in a pod.

they both feel they have been wrongly investigated. you can kind of so why it would make sense. the reporting is that matt gaetz was not high up on the list. other people around donald trump didn't think he would be the attorney general peck. he flew up to washington d.c. and as a result of conversations, he was picked. so maybe donald trump is not as organized about the cabinet as he came we thought. it was organized and there was a system but the last couple of appointments suggest that is not the case. pete hegseth only went down to mar-a-lago on monday and was announced quickly. and matt gaetz was announced quick leafter conversations on the plane. perhaps there is more chaos around this one. what i remember thinking in 2016

is how does competence factor into the trump administration's cabinet and some of the last picks we have had are not the most qualified for the job he is doing. and will the cabinet be able to do what donald trump wants because do they have the experience? . >> it is interesting, because the people who have gone in and seen buffers against trump's impulses, maybe john thune or marco rubio, maybe. but now he gets about everyone in his party to bend to his will. so someone who is viewed as a guard rail ends up not being one. after the gaetz announcement yesterday, outrage, people saying wait a minute, when i voted for donald trump, i voted for lower prices and a tougher border. you get the whole package when you cast the vote. you buy the ticket and you get to ride. this is a part of it. >> this is a part of it but what is stunning is how they are handling it in such a way that

is so bizarre for their own interests. donald trump despite all of my criticisms of him, had the opportunity to now say i was put in office, even after being defeated, maybe only the second president to do that and rise to the occasion. but you come in and put people in the department of the defense, you nominate people like matt gaetz, whennia look at the temperament and the background of the people, they are even disliked among republicans. what gaetz does to an innocent family, trying to take shots at joe, let's not get past that, it shows a temperament. despite the fact that we know how ludicrous it was. why would you pilot something like that unless there was something about you that should not be sitting at the head of the department of justice?

i think what trump had an opportunity to say, i was not everything you said i was. he is now confirming our worst fears and making a mockery of government to put these people over the defense department, to put gabbard there, to nominate gaetz is to mock the american people who voted for him and those of us on the other side say we defer to the vote of the people, but we told you so. >> to your point, you are getting a whole package. trump couldn't be clearer. his agenda is retribution against perceived enemies. that's the deep state, department of justice, intelligence community, and department of defense. those are the three picks here. that is what the second term is going to be about. we should note that republicans yesterday did defy him in their choice of john thune in majority

leader in a secret ballot. now they will have to do it. >> let's get to julie tsirkin, a lot to get to hear. the chance of matt gaetz being confirmed by the senate who is openly expressing disdain for him with the caveat about the possibility of a recess appointment. >> this is the first big test for senate republicans. jonathan is right when he is saying that all of the appointments are one thing. you had hegseth and gabbard but we were running around the hallways notifying lawmakers of gaetz chosen and this is someone who is disliked evenly on both sides of the aisle. kevin cramer says he doesn't like what he did when he ousted kevin mccarthy. and other women members say they

are disgusted by the investigations and some of the allegations he was facing with sexual misconduct, something he was investigated for as jonathan laid out. when you talk about the chances of getting confirmed, the reagzs were filled with expletives. they were filled with shock. a lot of senators in the maga wourld said look, i was okay with all of the people so far but gaetz is really a shocking one. you can have defections like susan collins and leasey murkowski, they are about to have a 53 seat majority although that race was headed to a recount. regardless of the cushion, you have a lot of republicans scratching their heads at the pick thinking maybe it will not happen at the end of the day. and you talk about recess appointments>> john thune was asked about that before the gaetz pick was announced. take a listen of what he said.

>> we are going to make sure that we are processing his nominees in a way that gets them into those positions show he can implement his agenda. how that happens remains to be seen. >> here's the thing. nobody wants recess appointments. the last time this happened was under president obama. the supreme court blocked him because he didn't do it in a certain amount of days. the senate returned to a hand shake agreement of doing this. both chambers are dismissed and not in session and trump installs whoever he wants. with someone like gaetz, alarm bells are ringing. when they met behind closed doors and the candidates where they voted for thune, i'm told they talked about recess appointments and everyone prefers going through regular order. >> what are you hearing about what i heard from some republicans yesterday which is donald trump threw out matt gaetz so the senate could shoot

that down so trump could say okay, but you have to give me everyone else. you have to approve of everyone else that i put on the table. you get one. it's an interesting theory. i think the ethics investigation with gaetz is really fascinating. i heard from republican lawmakers that perhaps he was nominated, knowing he will not get confirmed but it gives him an out and a chance to go away before a damaging house ethics report is released. that goes away since he handed in his resignation letter. that is just gone. the doj never charged gaetz. that is an interesting possibility and theory when it comes to pete hegseth. no one said that is a flat out no. they were confused and didn't see the pick coming but they see the pairing of pete hegseth at

d.o.d. and mike waltz as national security advisor as the grown up and hegseth could be the face of it. >> the report was due to come out tomorrow about t matt gaetz, three years in the making, one member of the committee saying it is highly damaging to matt gaetz. now it goes away but those things have a way of finding their way to the open. julie tsirkin, thank you. chuck rosen berg, we will give you the last word on this. what is your sense of the recess appointments taking place, is anything possible in a compliant congress? do you see the possibility as being very real? >> i see the possibility of being possible but it would require the members of the senate who took an oath to the constitution to ignore the

advice and consent clause. if that's not an important part of their jobs and they're honest, there is not a thing we can do about it. i can't imagine a world in which matt gaetz could pass senate confirmation, regardless of the constitution of the senate. so let's see whether or not the senators take all of the clauses of the constitution seriously. it is possible they won't? of course it's possible. to your point, anything is possible. >> all right. former u.s. attorney chuck rosenberg, thank you for being on this morning. we will talk to you soon. time to take a quick look at the other stories making headlines. new york governor kathy hochal is expected to revive a plan to charge a toll on vehicles entering midtown and lower manhattan. that comes after she pulled the plug on the idea in july, suggesting the $15 charge was too high. according to "the new york times", the new cost will be $9

for vehicle. the new plan would be fast tracked for approval in an effort to head ouf president-elect trump's vow to kill the program. a storm could hit florida next week as a category 3 hurricane. the system named sara could bring catastrophic flooding. conservative attorney theodore olson hoz died. he argueded that the florida recount, which secured the presidency for georgia w. bush. he worked to overturn the california ban on same-sex marriage. the former solicitor general appeared more than 60 times before the u.s. supreme court. he was 84 years old. still ahead on morning joe, the atlantic's tom nichols joins

us for more on tulsy gabbard. us for more on tulsy gabbard ♪ limu emu & doug ♪ woah, limu! we're in a parade. everyone customize and save hundreds on car insurance with liberty mutual. customize and sa— (balloon doug pops & deflates) and then i wake up. and you have this dream every night? yeah, every night! hmm... i see. (limu squawks) only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪

it must be the worst nomination for a cabinet position in american history. i think this is something that falls well outdoorsman of the scope of deference that should be given to a president in nominating members of the senior team. gaetz is not only totally incompetent for the job, he doesn't have the character. he is a person of moral

turpitude. and not withstanding how difficult it will be politically, this is a nomination that the republican party should oppose. >> do you think he is the only one that you will see real opposition to or do you think there are others? >> i think tulsi gabbard's nomination for drek ter of national intelligence, my reaction was hilarious. >> why? >> she is totally not competent for the job. gaetz is the worst. she may be second worse. >> one of trump's former national security advisors, john bolton, yesterday reacting to the controversial trump nominations. trump picked tulsi gabbard, a former house democrat who ran for president in 2020 to be the director of national intelligence. she is a lieutenant colonel in the army reserve and has served in the hawaii national guard. she has never worked in the intelligence world or served on

a congressional intelligence committee. back in 2017 when she was in congress, gabbard received criticism for meeting with syrian president al-assad who was accused of human rights violations and war crimes. gabbard defended her meeting at the time saying assad is quote, not the enemy of the united states. gabbard has often been at odds with assessments from the national community and has clashed with government analysts who say russian leader vladimir putin is the primary purveyor of disinformation that is designed to sew divisions in the u.s. two years ago, lawmakers accused gabbard of promoting russian propaganda after she posteded a video online that claimed to show u.s. funded bioweapons labs in ukraine. gabbard denied the allegation. she has claimed the biden administration could have prevented the war in ukraine if

it addressed russia's concerns about ukraine joining nato. >> so willie, we know, as we said at the top of the show, we have done our best since the election, and we plan to continue doing, reporting the news straight down the middle. if someone were just tuning in and listening to these reactions to matt gaetz for ag and tulsi gabbard for dni, they may go oh, my god, these are left wingers that don't like donald trump's selections. well, of course there you saw john bolton. but i think what is unique about the selections, unlike the others that president trump laid out there, you actually, if you go on the hill, you will have republicans and democrats both being critical of the

selections. and i suspect republicans being more critical of the gaetz pick just because they know him personally more and have had a lot of problems with him for many different reasons. but with tulsi gabbard, you talk to anyone on the intell committees, talk to any republicans who have dealt with the gathering of intelligence, the sharing of intelligence with foreign governments, they seem to be the ones most horrified by this. we talked about matt gaetz before but it is fair to say that tulsi gabbard is a bipartisan shock as well only because the conclusion is if she were to ever be in that position, other t countries wouldn't share intell with the united states. >> that's what i was going to say. you touched on that earlier. i read yesterday that you have people in the intell community saying our allies will not share

intelligence with us if she is in there. the kindest view is that she is a sympathizer of vladimir putin, and assad. i think tom nichols and others may take it further on who she is and what she has been doing the last few years. let's bring in the staff writer from the atlantic, the latest title tulsi gabbard is a national security risk. can you explain why she would be a risk to the country? >> every federal employee every year has to sit through insider threat training to recognize people they think may be hazardous around classified materials. people like that are people who are deeply critical of the united states, and foreign policy, and seem to have a lot of affinity with and meetings with foreign nationals. there are all kinds of alarm

bells that go off here. this nomination sets them all off. this is not someone who you would say , sure, i will hand the crown jewels of american intelligence to someone who as you pointed out, leave aside that she is completely unqualified for the job, this is somebody who has consistently taken the side of people like vladimir putin, even when she was a member of congress. there is no way in any normal universe we would have a discussion of trusting gabbard with the american intelligence community. a reminder that the dni sits on top of all of america's intelligence communities including c.i.a. and one of the terrible things about the matt gaetz nomination is that it was so cartoonishly shocking that it is wiped out talking about how

completely unfit tulsi gabbard is. and frankly pete hegseth as well. two people at defense and dni that i think we would be shocked that are handling classified misinformation or in pete hegseth's case, part of the nuclear chain of command. this is donald trump in a way he is trolling the nation, mocking, i think, reverend sharpton already said mocking his own voters. these are people who will punish donald trump's opponents, merely by virtue of being in the jobs. there is no thought about what is best for america or american national security. >> right, right, right. so jonathan, help me out here. you have reported on president

trump for quite some time. let's look back over the past week. he received 50% plus in the vote tally that came in. he swept the swing states. did far better than anyone had expected as far as that big of a route, was praised by republicans, got grudging respect from political pros on what he did, certainly a lot of respect and aduleation from business leaders, something he likes to hear. laid out the first two or three picks that were met with i think a good enough reception. and so everything seemed to be breaking

his way. and again, if you had a president who wanted to be a 50% plus president, he certainly had started off the first week very well in that direction. i'm curious though, yesterday, one shock wave after another. obviously, matt gaetz not qualified to do the job and would cause reaction with republicans and democrats, same thing with tulsi gabbard. i'm curious, your best reporting on why that sharp turn when everything seemed, the first week, to be going so smoothly? >> the people that are around trump say this is an impulse he has. he wants to be liked and receive praise from wall street and media and business leaders.

at the same time, he gives in to his darker intincts of revichg and siding with those who flatter him. this is about his agenda too. leaders are pushing back against tariffs or the mass deportations because those things will impact the economy. will that be enough to get him to stop? we will see. he was praised for a lot of early picks including the announcement of marco rubio to be secretary of state. beginning two nights ago with a pete hegseth pick, and then gabbard and gaetz, he is prioritizing loyalty and also retribution which he said this entire term would be about. those around him were taken by surprise, particularly by the gaetz and gabbard picks. they weren't on the short list. they now wonder what happens next. it seems like a dare to republicans. tom nichols, i wanted to circle back to the gabbard selection

with you. the concern i heard from those currently and formerly in the intelligence community, this would have a chilling effect on our allies. because gabbard is viewed with such suspicion, there would be some european partners who may not want to cooperate with us, who may have had skepticism of trump. trump famously blabbed intelligence to the russian ambassador in the oval office. now you add gabbard to the mix. what is your concern? will this undermine our alliances? >> my degree of concern about all three of these and especially gabbard is off the charts level of concern. of course it is going to affect our allies. they would be irresponsible in their duties to their countries if they were not concerned about her because when you are thinking about dealing with again, the top american intelligence official, you take your pick. you wouldn't want to work with

her because she's not qualified for her job or because she is overly sympathetic to the president of russia and the president of syria who she thinks was -- seems to think is not our enemy and needs to be understood after he gassed his own people. there is also within the intelligence community within the united states, you will see information slow down, simply because there are going to be offices and agencies who we are going to have intelligence professionals saying, where do i send up the chain, where should this piece of information go? do i keep it in house at cia or the fbi, or national security. it's a mess. >> can i ask you, let's say, perhaps she's not -- she doesn't

get confirmed by the senate. who would be some other strong candidates for this position that might fit more into donald trump's world view? so if not gabbard, and we heard from republicans and democrats alike not her. but who would be two or three good names for this position if for some reason she gets voted down? >> joe, i'm not going to make the life of a future nominee difficult by naming them and saying that's someone i think would be okay. >> how about describing the type of person that republicans and democrats would support? what would the qualities be? >> the quality would be some experience with intelligence. this can't be amateur hour. this isn't the apprentice or celebrity director of national

intelligence week on the staffing apprentice to see if the hawaii national guard lieutenant colonel can make it it to the top of the intelligence heap. this is ridiculous. this is reality show approach. so you would want someone with background in national intelligence, spbd perhaps, if it is a legislator, someone on the committees, someone within the intelligence community, someone who has managed a large intelligence. these are imance bureaucracies, they require people who have run big organizations. you look for that kiepd of background. gabbard has none of them. >> yeah. rev, look, no matter how his first few few appointments went that might have led people to think in certain ways, these

nominations are in line with exactly what donald trump was repeatedly communicating to the country. there is -- if people are shocked then in some ways they haven't heard what he was saying or they didn't believe it or think he meant it. now we know he does. i'm wondering if you could speak to the impact of the nominations, and if we could talk more on how it could impact the american people, how it could impact their day to day lives. why this matters to not the eletes in washington who are concerned about big, big issues. but to people in america who are perhaps tuning in for the first time and looking at the president they voted for. >> i think that is what is critical here. when you look at the fact that american people are dealing with day to day challenges in how they afford their life. we talk about a lot about how

the price of milk has gone up. how they deal with their travel in terms of infrastructure and this is just a cheap seat for nominating people who don't have the capacity to address any of that. to have someone over the justice department who is more concerned about vengeance and chasing conspiracy more than getting rid of criminal elements, people tracking guns and are causing real problems for people to live under threat is in many ways a real, real tragedy. i think that's what we are looking at. to have our intelligence compromised because someone who is highly suspect in terms of their relationships at a time when we have wars, we have wars in ukraine. we have wars in the middle east.

why would we be playing this risky game? who are we playing to if you are the president? i thought about how coretta scott king told me once, she said, al, you can't be big and small at the same time. you are playing the small crowd rhetoric but what about the bigger picture. the president is playing to a small crowd that cheered at his rallies and not really evolving into being the president and the leader of the free world and doing what is right for the average maand pasitting in the house figuring out how to get through the week. >> when you look at the foreign policy picks, some more isolation than others. rubio probably more classically in the vein of american

leadership. but hegseth, gabbard, more isolationist. how does the balps of power play out when it comes to the issue of t what is america's biggest concern and that is china. does this seem to suggest to you that american consumers should be looking at tough air forces on china which could potentially raise prices for them or do you see it as being more complicated than that? >> i think tariffs are a great examine. what you need is officials giving you frank advice. will tariffs cause china to back down. the scenario for american consumers says donald trump has not given a promise that he would defend taiwan from an invasion of china. china's leader says he mrapz to do that during donald trump's second term, 2027 is the year he talk about regaining control of taiwan. if a trade war starts over tariffs, prices go up and just again on intelligence, it is

critical. intelligence is getting information, what is she thinking and also making estimates and predictions. iraq, wmd, the intelligence community got wrong. the united states invaded, thinking there were weapons of mass destruction. a system was set up after the vietnam war when intelligence officials lied and 50,000 americans died in vietnam. we need fact based intelligence operations. tulsi gabbard saying that the war in ukraine was caused by secret chemical weapons plants in ukraine is false. that makes you think putin will be reasonable. these are momentous decisions and why it is so important to have fact based, and there are -- i will not name people in congress but former heads of intelligence xhounts do this. mike waltz is a responsible person. there are people out there that support donald trump that can do

these jobs effectively. >> exactly. that's what i was going to say. there are republicans that have been extremely responsible over the past decade on the intell committee and other committees who also supported donald trump through the campaign very supportive of him that could do the job for him. because at the end of the day, we are talking about how these picks for bad for the country. they are also, if they are bad for the country, they are bad for donald trump. on the issue of intell, you want to have someone with a whole world is sharing intelligence to help get to the president of the united states the latest on what's happening in iran, what's happening in china, what's happening across the world with people who want to do us harm. we certainly recall several times during this administration

the united states intelligence services actually getting intell on attacks that were going to be happening in iran. and of course during president trump's administration, he got intell that allowed him to issue a strike against soleimani. and something that could never have happened without all of the intell agencies working together. so while we are talking about these picks being bad for the intelligence community, being bad for the united states, ultimately, it is bad for the president of the united states, the incoming president of the united states if he has someone there who is not up to the job and also someone that other countries will not trust with critical intell when trump will need it the most. >> it turns out personal retribution is not a good guiding principle for a president of the united states. you need the best, most competent people in the job for the benefit of the country and

the benefit of the president in office. we will see. we will see if matt gaetz, we will see if tulsi gabbard make it through the senate. as john said before, this is a big test for the majority leader john thune. will he control the caucus and keep the people out of office. as i said before, fbi is still out there and bobby kennedy jr. still floated around to perhaps run the n.i.h. >> david road, and tom nichols, thank you for smg on the show. coming up on morning joe, donald trump meets with president biden at the white house and promises a peaceful transfer of power. we will dig into what the two discussed yesterday. morning joe will be right back. . morning joe will be right back

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few minutes before the top of the hour. live look at the white house. time for a look at the morning papers across the country. ige new jersey, the record leads with democratic governor phil murphy's drought warning advisory. he made the announcement yesterday following an unprecedented streak of dry weather that has fuelled wildfires across the state. the governor's warning aims to preserve water supply and avoid shortages. in rhode island, the west

sun has a feature on declininging opioid deaths across the country. nearly 97,000 died of overdoses over a 12 month period that ended on june 30th. that is down 14% from last year. in new york, the buffalo news reports that restaurants are seeing more cooking oil thefts, at least seven local restaurants were targeted in one day. officials believe the thieves they be trying to produce biodiesel, a highly valuable commodity that can be made from cooking oil and animal fats. and in vermont, the burlington free press is looking at the state's record number of votes cast in last week's election. there were nearly 373,000 votes for national and statewide races, topping vermont's previous record of 370,000 votes from the 2020 election. >> wow. that is something because a lot

of states the voting numbers were down. >> i know. still ahead, continues reaction to donald trump's pick for attorney general. our legal experts are standing by with what thas move likely signals for the doj. and democratic senator elizabeth warren will join the conversation with her take on trump's new appointments. and two time golden globe nominee richard gere will be our guest to discuss his new film, oh, canada. we are back in 90 seconds. , cana we are back in 90 seconds.

you got to think about this guy. this is a guy that didn't have -- the media didn't give a time of day to after he was accused of sleeping with an underaged girl. there is reason why no one in the conference came and defended him because we had all seen the videos that he was showing on the house floor that all of us had walked away of the girls he had slept with. he would drag he crushed e.d. medicine and chase it with an energy drink so he could go all night. this is, obviously, before he got married. so when that accusation came out, no one defended him and no one on the media would give him the time of day. all of a sudden, he found fame because he opposed the speaker of the house back in november and he is always stayed there. he was never going to leave until he got this last moment of fame by saying -- by going after a motion to vacate. >> republican senator mark wayne

mullin of oklahoma speaking last year to cnn about the character concerns with republican congressman matt gaetz. in a moment, we will hear what the senator is now saying about gaetz's nomination for attorney general. welcome back to "morning joe." it is thursday, november 14th. jonathan lemire and katty kay are still with us. so let's dive right in. president-elect donald trump has selected republican congressman matt gaetz of florida to serve as u.s. attorney general in his had you administration. garrett haake has the latest reaction from washington. >> reporter: president-elect trump's selection of florida congressman matt gaetz for attorney general already sending shock waves through washington. trump describing one of his strongest defenders as, quote, a deeply gifted and tenacious attorney who will end the partisan weapon sayings of our justice system and says he is entitled to the team he wants. >> i know matt very well and

know him very well and i'm confident if the senate confirms him, he would a good job. >> reporter: he is facing bipartisan backlash from both democrats. >> this feels like a red alert moment for democracy. >> i would describe it as god -- level trolling. >> mr. gaetz breaks things to break things and when he breaks it, he breaks it even more and that is someone who should not be the attorney general of the united states. >> reporter: gaetz has built a reputation for fiercely defending the president-elect and repeatedly going after doj officials including fbi director christopher wray. >> you preside over the fbi that has the lowest level of trust in the fbi's history! >> reporter: gaetz texting me, quote. i'm hornled by the president's trust and confidence. trump repeatedly attacked the legal battles he faced as political pos prosecutions witf sessions. in gaetz, he would have an a.g. that critics say would be more

willing to do his bidding. gaetz would have to be confirmed by a republican senate. and one likely concern, the doj and fbi investigated gaetz for possible sex trafficking but the case end inside 2023 without any charges filed. gaetz denied any wrongdoing. many republicans backing trump's choice. >> matt gaetz denies there is no question that we have had our differences. they have been public about it and i completely trust president trump's decision making on this one. >> reporter: what do you think about trump's election of matt gaetz in the department of justice. >> i think it's gone rogue and corrupt in many remains. >> that was garrett haake reporting from capitol hill. let's bring in andrew wiseman and u.s. attorney and senior fbi executive working with doj, greg brower. nbc political analyst and former

u.s. senator, claire mccaskill. greg, let's begin with you and your reaction and so many nominations we will shift through this morning. the nomination of matt gaetz as attorney general. we have heard bipartisan condemnation and some of the strongest criticism from his republican colleagues in the congress. as a practical assessment for the justice department what would a matt gaetz attorney general look like? >> good morning, willie. i'd like to say that i'm surprised, but if anyone has been paying attention, this shouldn't really surprise anyone. this type of pick. but the reaction has been interesting. you know, everybody from the "the wall street journal" editorial board to certain republican senators to the legal community and the public at large really is kind of shocked by this one. i think for the department of judge, this is a sign that the department's traditional

independence and credibility and strict adherence to the rule of law is now in question. it's in question by -- being questioned by the president-elect. it doesn't seem that that sort of traditional approach to the department and how it functions is really what this new president has in mind. and i think that this will be a real test for republicans in the senate to decide whether they are going to exercise their constitutional authority to advise and consent in a serious way. and i think we have seen, so far as i've mentioned, some real pushback by republican senators, and i just have to think that this nomination is probably not going to go far but we will see. >> all right. "the wall street journal" editorial board is out with a new piece entitled "matt gaetz is a bad choice for attorney general." it reads, in part, this. quote.

former federal and state prosecutor writes, trump's nomination of matt gaetz is a sign of dark intentions. quote.

>> he goes on to say that bill barr had a line he wouldn't cross. barr use his power to defend trump. he generally would not use the department as an offensive weapon. willie, that is, obviously, the concern that you're hearing from republicans. this is what, again, kind of goes back to the tulsi gabbard pick which at the ends of the

day, really bad. most republicans believe and democrats for the intel community. therefore, bad for the united states of america. but, ultimately, bad for the president of the united states who needs to get the best intel that he or she can get from around the world and that certainly would be the case with president trump. we just talked about soleimani. you have republicans also, you know, and "the wall street journal" editorial page. you have others asking the same thing about matt gaetz saying this is not good for the justice department, not good for the republican party. not good. at the end of the day, though, again, not good for president trump. so these are picks that i don't think would strengthen his

cabinet, would strengthen his white house, but actually weaken it, because he would have people at jobs where they have absolutely no idea how to handle the bureaucracy they are working for. >> claire mccaskill, with that in mind, do you believe that your former colleagues in the united states senate, despite the fuelity they have shown almost to a man and woman on donald trump on everything here the laugh couple of years and especially now he has come in with this mandate, do you believe in the case of matt gaetz and perhaps tulsi gabbard they will vote this down? i'm curious what do you think is legitimate about this idea of recess appointments? >> well, first, let's put this in context. yesterday morning, the united states senate gave the back of their hand to donald trump. everybody in the senate knew that donald trump did not want john thune as leader. now, why were they able to do that? because it was secret ballot.

but nonetheless they did it. a couple of hours later, he drops gaetz and gabbard. now, i made a list last night of 11 names of senators that i think are most likely to say no to both of these appointments, particularly gaetz. keep in mind, a few of these names, like chuck grassley. he is not running again. he got re-elected and he is 90! you've got mitch mcconnell who is not going to run again. you've got susan collins who i can't imagine voting for these people. you've got lisa murkowski. i can't imagine lisa voting for these people. you only need three. so i think trump was sending a letter to the senate saying one of two things -- either i expect the senate to ignore the part of the constitution, which says you must give advise and consent, or, two, you've got to show me that you have no power. i need you to demonstrate to me

that the senate is not in session ever, because what you do does not matter. i just don't think either one of those are going to sit well with the majority of the united states senate. and keep in mind, willie, they still have to do a background check on matt gaetz. anybody who thinks the fbi can't get what the ethics committee has in the house has never been subjected to a background check and trust me, a background check for attorney general is not your average run-of-the-mill background check. and then the same thing for tulsi gabbard. the background check for dni is not your average background check. so i just don't think this recess appointment thing is going to fly with the supreme court for jobs like attorney general of the united states. >> yeah. there are certainly deep skepticism on capitol hill that gaetz could get the votes. you can never say never say never as unlikely as it is.

let's talk about this selection. you know the department of justice. give us the insight what you believe is happening inside that building to the possibility of matt gaetz leading as attorney general? also, what it would be like in gaetz, you know, if he does find a path to confirmation, if he does find his way in to that post, just what would that look like for the department of justice and the nation? >> i think the reaction in the department is really one of shock and it's not because of a policy difference. people at the department have been there for years and years and they are used to the fact that elections have consequences. and that you can have attorney generals and you can have presidents who come in with very different agendas. but the reason for the shock is not that. it's that just start with the fundamental. there is a complete lack of qualification for the job.

in other words, you might disagree with bill barr. you might disagree with sessions or errick garland but they are serious people and people who are able to do the job and people can disagree with how they did it and whether they adhere to all of the norms. but with matt gaetz, i think the biggest concern, leaving aside his sort of maga feelity and his potential criminal problem, he simply doesn't have the chops for a job that is intended to protect all of us and that is really, i think, the biggest issue i think people the department would have is the idea that this is a job which you are tasked with protecting the public day in and day out. not from ordinary crimes but from terrorist crimes and the idea that matt gaetz or tulsi gabbard being in these positions, i think would be

so -- to people who have taken an oath to the constitution to protect the united states, and the concern that they just don't have the experience to do these jobs. obviously, if they were to be in the position, people will do what they are required to do legally, but these people also have taken an oath to the constitution and then not going to do something that is illegal either against the law or where the facts simply do not support it. so i suspect you will have that kind of resistance. you'll also, i think, see what you saw during the first trump administration, which is people resigning, which is -- just does not happen, except in the most extraordinary circumstances, which is something that he with saw during the first trump presidency and this signals that we would see it again. >> katty, when andrew talks about the lack of experience of matt gaetz and tulsi gabbard to hold these positions, it really

does underline what i've been saying this morning that actually we can talk about the disservice it does to everybody but especially trump. i remember reading one of bob gates' biography. nobody knew how to work washington better than bob gates. the second and the director of the cia would write that it was a constant battle staying one step ahead of the bureaucrats that were around him. people that were trying to help him but it was a constant grind and constant -- you know, to be able to move and agency in the direction that the president wants an agency to move in, you need people that are really, really experienced hands or also just get swallowed up in these bureaucracies. i don't care what, you know, some think tank says about being able to fire all of the members of the, quote, deep state. it's just that is not going to happen in a way that is going to

make these jobs any less difficult. so it seems to me, again, what is in the best interest of the president is to find people that have experience, that line up with him ideologically and they can actually do the job. and these two candidates, republicans in the house, republicans in the senate, "the wall street journal" editorial page, people that have worked with both of these people will tell the president to a man and a woman, they are not qualified, mr. president, they will not be doing you any favors. >> so i would put pete hegseth in that bracket, too. i've had conservative republicans reach out to me saying, listen, they think he is a terrific guy but he is just the -- the pick as one described it, unfathomable because he just has no experience running something on the magnitude of the department of defense. matt gaetz and tulsi gabbard are in that category as well. so i think you're right.

the line we are hearing this morning is this issue of competence and whether even donald trump will be able to get his agenda accomplished if he puts people in positions who just aren't up to the job or have the experience to do the job. i guess the donald trump's view is populists are elected. they are elected in a way because they don't have traditional political experience, but for donald trump, when he did in his first administration, he put people in positions of power who didn't have that experience. it didn't work out particularly well for him. so he still wants the disruptors who will come in and blow up the intelligence community, question whether the department of defense really needs all of the people it has, and spending question that elon musk has been put in, cut or slash spending by $2 trillion or whatever it is. the system really doesn't allow

for that type of person to flourish. greg, how do you think this plays in to the idea of competence and does it actually work in the way that even donald trump might want it to work? >> well, it is a fundamental or lack of understanding on the part of the president-elect, even after having served as president for four years, about how the government really works and how these agencies and departments work. let me go back, if i could, just a moment to the comment that senator mccaskill made about the background investing. in the normal course, traditionally, presidents and white houses have used the fbi to do background investigations before a nomination is announced but not always, to gauge whether or not the person really was qualified and could pass a background investigation and get the requisite security clearance to do the job and be confirmed and do the job. but let's remember that as important as that has been to the process, the president

doesn't have to have a background investigation done. if the president wants to simply say we are not going to use the fbi or we are not doing a background investigation at all, a background investigation will not be done. in fact, the president can decide who gets a security clearance without regard to a bcket investigation at all. -- background investigation at all. the senator will have something to say about that if the white house decides to go in a different direction. we have seen signals already that the white house, the transition team is talking about doing away with background investigations in the normal course. that will be a big deal. >> andrew, i got a question for you. are you aware ever in the history of the country, has there been an attorney general that literally had zero legal experience? zero. we are talking about a young man who went to william & mary law school, passed the bar, and then

immediately went into politics, immediately went in to, i believe, the florida house of representatives and then to congress. i am not aware that he has ever touched a legal document in his life, that he's ever even familiarized himself with how -- and people don't realize the huge number of civil lawsuits that the department of justice brings. both civil and criminal lawsuits. and then, also, andrew, could you touch on the ultimate guardrails which are facts and evidence, judges and juries? and how matt gaetz may not fully can comprehend that he can investigate someone and cost them a lot of money but, ultimately at the end of the day, to put somebody in jail in this country, you have to get through a court with facts and law. could you speak to that a little bit? >> sure. let me just get to the second point first. i really think it hits the points that joe is making, which

is kj this is a pick that ultimately will not only not serve the public in terms of safety, but it's hard to see how it will serve the white house either. bringing a case that is not grounded solidly in facts in law is just going to lead to embarrassment to the department. you saw that with john durham. he brought cases that were highly questionable and that two juries unanimously rejected. and he is a much more serious and experienced guy with much w pressures put on him, he brought cases that simply flopped. there is no other term and that is the kinds of thing that matt gaetz simply doesn't have the skill set to do. he has not been a prosecutor. he has not been a defense

lawyer. i do think when he first got out of law school, according to his bio, he may have worked for a couple of years in a civil firm. it's unclear what he did. but certainly since then, claire, you're right, he's had no legal experience whatsoever. i cannot think of an attorney general who falls in to that category and i think it's really important for people to understand that what everyone here is stressing is a matter of confidence, even if you put aside his own potential criminal issues, even if you put aside his adhering to sort of conspiracy theories. it's simply somebody who does not have the experience that is necessary for a job to carry out both what the president wants, but actually what the public deserves, whether it's the attorney general, the head of national intelligence, or the department of defense. you can't think of three more important positions for the

safety of this country. >> nbc news legal analyst and former prosecutor andrew wiseman and former u.s. attorney, greg borrower, thank you both for being on this morning. it is time for a look at some of the other stories making headlines this morning. california teenager could face up to 20 years in prison after admitting that he made hundreds of false reports of bomb threats and mass shootings. the so-called s.w.a.t.ing calls targeted schools, religious institutions, and government officials. federal prosecutors say the fake threats caused profound fear and endangered first responders, and civilians who were caught up in the chaos. according to "the new york times," ukraine is prioritizing security over territory as president-elect trump pushes the idea of truce talks with russia. it comes as ukrainian forces steadily lose ground in the east. kyiv has long pledged not to

seize any territory occupied by russia but a guarantee against renewed aggression is seen as the most critical component to any settlement. >> that is what really has been at the heart of this negotiation. the idea of negotiations is that if they seated ground they would need to have a guarantee that russia wouldn't just innovate them the next month. there would have to be an green light -- agreement that the united states had a protective shield over ukraine moving forward. a powerful dust storm through california. 20 cars were involved in the accident and several people were injured. the california department of forestry and fire protection posted video of the weather event which typically occurs in florida and other areas. still ahead on "morning joe," we will get to president biden's meeting with president-elect trump and what the two leaders discussed at the

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washington. president biden invited president-elect trump to the white house yesterday for a peaceful power. the two presidents posed for photos in front the reporters before meeting y for 90 minutes. they discussed their difg ferin views on the war in ukraine. trump said, quote. i wanted to know where his views on where we are and what he thinks and he gave them to me. it was very gracious, said trump. president biden posted a photo from the meeting on social media writing, in part, my team is committed to doing everything we to ensure the incoming administration has what they need. here is the cover, john, of the aforementioned the "new york post." welcome. a roaring fire there in the oval office. president biden, obviously, doing everything he can so at least signal a peaceful transfer of power. this is a courtesy that was not extended to him by donald trump

four years ago. >> speaking of some west wing aides in the aftermath of the meeting they acknowledged how difficult this was for president biden to sit there and to say, welcome back to a man that he spent four, six years describing as a threat to the nation's democracy. his own vice president was defeated by trump. this is the first meeting since that debate that forced biden from the race in late june. the president told his team and has told the nation that he believes america needs to see this. they need to see a peaceful transfer of power. they need to see a very different image than one four years ago when donald trump did not concede defeat and his -- stormed the capitol. donald trump in the brief comments made to the press and oval office, he was very gracious to president biden. i'm told afterwards the conversation was rather civil and lasted 90 minutes and they covered a number of topics including some of the lobal hot

spots and trump departed the white house. this is a moment that president biden felt needed to have. >> trump walks out of the office and nominates matt gaetz to be the attorney general of the united states. coming up next, diagrammatic congresswoman abigail spanberg certify on our guest. the former cia officer will weigh in on trump's selection for tulsi gabbard to be the director of national intelligence. director of nationl intelligence things are gettinge ♪ (♪♪) ♪ i feel free ♪ (♪♪) ♪ to bare my skin, yeah that's all me. ♪ ♪ nothing is everything ♪ (♪♪) with skyrizi, 3 out of 4 people achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months. and most people were clearer even at 5 years. skyrizi is just 4 doses a year, after 2 starter doses.

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the american people delivered quite an incredible mandate for change in this election with the popular vote and the electoral vote overwhelmingly saying, hey, we want donald trump as president and we have had enough of the harris/biden regime. of course, there is going to be resistance to change from the swamp in washington. i think that is kind of the point. the american people are saying, hey, stop looking at yourself and stop focusing on your own power and own position and your own bank accounts. how about we have leaders in washington who are actually looking out for the american people? >> president-elect trump's pick for director of national intelligence, tulsi gabbard is speaking on fox news last night. joining us now is a member of the house intelligence committee, democratic

congresswoman abigail spanberger of virginia. great to have you back on the show. looking at trump's actions in his first presidency and his words during this past campaign, it seems this pick lines up, but i'm wondering what your concerns are about it, and, also, how this may not be in the president-elect's best interest. >> well, i think importantly the choice of tulsi gabbard as dni is not in the best interest of the american people and it's not in the best interest of our national security, or our position of leadership on the global stage. the role of the dni is complex. the dni is responsible for what information goes to the president and the presidential daily brief. the dni has access to every

single secret that we have as a nation. the dni knows the sources, the methods, the ways that we are able to attain information. and so nominating someone who has a clear track record of pushing conspiracy theories, and aligning herself and excusing the behavior of authoritarians and odictator. she met with one after he used chemical weapons on his own citizens or defending the actions of vladimir putin, totally at odds with american interests. anyone who would do those things is certainly not only an irresponsible choice, but a dangerous choice to fill this role. >> but is this -- isn't this what donald trump supported and said he would do? >> so, you know, certainly i did

not vote for donald trump for so many reasons and among those reasons, worry and a concern related to the people who would fill his cabinet and his administration. but even within the constraints of the poor choices or the questionable choices that we knew he would make, you know, there is the politics of it. there are people who are aligned with president trump and then there are people who are aligned with president trump who objectively will be dangerous to national security. and we are seeing with his choices that he is choosing for select roles, certainly for the dni, for the a.g., and potentially for secretary of defense, people who are objectively not qualified, but when it comes to the specifics of the dni role, someone who has aligned herself previously with russia and syria and regimes the world over is not should not be

in a position to have any of the information that is, you know, america's greatest secrets. and just to give an example of why i say that, you know, the united states provided intelligence to ukraine before the russian invasion. intelligence that said that we knew that russia intended to invade. that information came from somewhere. that information came from something that a former cia officer, we call sources and methods, right? the sources and methods, the ways that the united states gains information is through technologies that we keep secret, through relationships with people who risk their lives to ensure that the united states has good information. and so the idea that someone who has aligned herself with and defended vladimir putin could potentially have information related to the sources and methods of how it is that we knew that russia was going to invade ukraine is just one singular example, i think, it

helps illuminate why this is so extraordinarily dangerous. it's not just the information we collect and not just the sources and methods used by the intelligence community working on behalf of the united states. our brave men and women who are doing good work, it's also the intelligence that shared with us from our partners the world over. so i question when someone like tulsi gabbard might be in the role of dni, will our partners, our british partners, partners -- i don't have to list them all -- who share information with us, meant to keep us safe and meant to keep them safe. will they do that if they question that their information might get passed on to somebody about whom that information might be, about a country that they are, you know, at odds with. so it's not only an irresponsible choice, it's a deeply, deeply dangerous choice. >> congresswoman, as someone who is a cia officer and served the country in that regard, so

admirably, you're still connected, aassume to the intelligence committee to some extent. do the people you speak to or perhaps do you have your own information, think that tulsi gabbard is more than just someone who is sympathetic to vladimir putin or sympathetic to assad in syria? what is your take? >> not to speak for anyone else but i think there are two elements to this. one, the dni position is a relatively new position. it was created after 911 to ens greater communication between the ones who represent the intelligence community. a limited number role and a limited number of individuals to fill that role. so many of my former colleagues are reflecting on the prior choices between clapper or coats, right? here are individuals with a proven track record of service

to our country, whether it be themselves in the intelligence community, former dni coats, on the senate intelligence committee, also as an ambassador. people with certainly a bipartisan background of service. but looking at the types of comments that we have heard from tulsi gabbard, i think the clearest through line of people's concerns, but speaking predominantly for myself, is whether -- whether there might be any sort of effort at engaging or influencing her. the source of it doesn't necessarily matter. the reality is that we have someone who as a sitting member of congress, would fly off to meet with al assad on her own without any sort of overarching understanding what was at place and the concerns that existed, the fact that this is a man who had just used chemical weapons on his own citizens and yet she

is an adversary of the united states. it's irresponsible. whatever motivation behind that, who knows what they talked about, the types of things she would say, but someone who is willing to do vladimir putin's bidding on television and in the public sphere, certainly whatever the motivation is behind it, she is surely going to be doing that behind closed doors as well and it's dangerous, it's disqualifying. frankly, there are many choices that wouldn't be my top pick, but at least would be a responsible choice to lead the extraordinary men and women of the intelligence community, protect and safeguard our secrets and uphold the strength of the u.s. on the global stage. >> let's switch gears here, congresswoman. on election night, republicans made gains throughout the country. donald trump swept the swing states and made inroads even in states that had been reliably

blue. virginia in mind. with republicans making gains in your state, what lessons can you learn for a gubernatorial run? >> i think notably in virginia, we held all of our congressional seats, including my own seat where i wasn't up for re-election. it was held by a democrat congressman-elect who i know will be serving our community well into the future. i think there are so many lessons to be learned. certainly every race is different and every candidate is different. i spent a lot of time out across the state supporting candidates who were on the ballot and supporting our senator for re-election, senator kaine, as well as the top of the ticket. and i think that there is much to be learned to be understood and so much of it is specific to campaigns. i'm out and about and talking about about the issues as to the commonwealth of virginia and that is lowering costs for families and recognizing the

challenges that people are facing, particularly given the fact we don't have a housing inventory that accommodates the needs of people who want to live in our wonderful commonwealth. it's about strengthening our public schools and a top concern i hear about, not just from parents and families, but also from employers within our commonwealth. it's about protecting our community from violence and keeping people safe and particularly recognizing that a challenge to our community is gun violence and addressing that issue head-on is important. and fundamentally in virginia it's about protecting our rights and our voting rights where virginia has expanded the ability to vote for a 45-day period of early voting. and also our reproductive rights. virginia is the only state in the south that since the dobbs decision hasn't further restricted a woman's access to abortion or reproductive health care. and so i'm out and about in my campaign talking about the issues that matter to people because, frankly, it's the

issues that i'm hearing about most from voters, from individuals, from small business owners from the farmers and producers i've long worked with during my time in congress and that is what i'll continue to do. but certainly there is always lessons to be learned and i think that some of those lessons do vary state-to-state, given communities and the needs of different communities and the uniqueness of the way that certain challenges that our country is facing might impact a particular state. >> candidate for virginia governor, former cia officer, congresswoman abigail spanberger, thank you for coming on the show this morning. >> thank you for having me. paris is ramping up security today ahead of france's soccer match with israeli. it's the first game for the israeli national team since last week's attacks against jews in amsterdam. that is straight ahead on "morning joe." that is straight ahead on "morning joe." but home is also your body. i asked myself, why doesn't pilates exist in harlem? so i started my own studio.

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authorities in paris are ramping up security ahead of tonight's soccer match between france and israeli one week after anti-semitic attacks in amsterdam. >> reporter: this morning, paris on high alert ahead of tonight's face-off between the french and israeli national soccer teams. tensions soaring after violence around a soccer game in amsterdam last week and anti-semitic attacks in the days after. before that game, footage showed

israeli fans attacking people, chanting anti-arab slogans and tearing a palestinian flag. later, groups of rioters seeking out and attacking israelis over the weekend and mob attacking a tran. many were ignoring police orders to disperse. in paris today 4,000 french police officers will be deployed around the national stadium and across the city. >> the moment everything is fine. we are feeling safe. >> reporter: overnight, pro-palestinian and left wing jewish groups took to the streets in largely peaceful protests. >> there is no other way than peace. >> reporter: some calling for a cease-fire deal as a new video was released of an israeli hostage held in gaza pleading with israelis not to forget the hostages. president biden meeting with the families of american hostages

yesterday and discussing their plight in his meeting with president-elect trump. seven american citizens are still held in gaza. >> we have asked the president and his senior staff, as well as the incoming administration, to begin work immediately together arm in arm. >> that match in paris is tonight. democratic senator elizabeth warren in massachusetts will be our guest coming up and we will get her reaction to president-elect trump's latest rounds of cabinet picks and where democrats go here from here after last week's election. wall street will be reacting to new inflation data due out shortly. "morning joe" will be right back. will be right back with miebo, eyes can feel ♪ miebo ohh yeah ♪ miebo is the only prescription dry eye drop that forms a protective layer for the number one cause of dry eye: too much tear evaporation.

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i was shocked that he has been nominated. it's the nomination, if it proceeds, i'm sure there will be an extensive background check by the fbi and public hearings and a lot of questions. >> it's one of those nominations that is going to be a significant challenge, let's put it that way. >> why do you think it will be a significant challenge? >> i don't think it's a serious nomination for the attorney general. that's lisa murkowski's view. >> i was a little surprised at that. >> i don't really know him, other than his public persona, so, you know, we will handle it like any other nomination, and

then we'll do our job providing advice and consent and see how it goes. >> republican senators on capitol hill reacting to donald trump's most controversial cabinet pick so far.congressman gaetz of florida to serve as attorney general. if confirmed by the senate, gaetz would lead the department he has called to be eliminated and that once investigated him for sex trafficking. we'll take a look at whether he would have enough gop support to be confirmed and if gaetz could still become attorney general even without the votes. also ahead, the latest reporting on senate republicans' choice for their new leader when they take the majority in the next congress. how republican senator john thune of south dakota is planning on carrying out president-elect trump's agenda. mr. plus, inside the oval office meeting yesterday between

president biden and president-elect trump in an effort to signal a peaceful transfer of power. >> donald, congratulations. >> thank you. >> look forward to having a, like we said, a smooth transition. make sure you are accommodated, what you need. we will get you to talk about some of that today. >> good. >> welcome. >> thank you. thank you very much. and politics is tough and it's in many cases not a very nice world, but it is a nice world today. i appreciate it very much. a transition that's so smooth, it will be as smooth as it can get. i very much appreciate that, joe. >> you're welcome. >> good morning. and welcome to "morning joe." we have a lot to get to this morning. a lot to get to. a busy day yesterday. many of you reached out to us since the election. many were disappointed by the results, you let us know you

appreciated our reporting and the reporting of those results in a calm and measured way. >> we have been especially thankful for the kind words we received from those who voted for president trump and we are going to continue our best efforts to be fair and objective in reporting on the incoming administration. >> unfortunately, the next story does involve us personally a bit. but we still give you the facts while remaining objective. >> here they are. president-elect donald trump has selected republican congressman matt gaetz of florida to serve as attorney general and lead the department of justice. if confirmed by the senate, he would head the department he has in the past called to be shut down. >> i don't care if it takes every second of our time and every ounce of our energy, we either get this government back on our side or we defund and get rid of, abolish the fbi, cdc,

atf, doj, every last one of them if they do not come to heel. and i don't think it's too much to ask. >> also confirmed, gaetz would lead the department that once vest get gated him for sex trafficking. in late 2020 the fbi started investing allegations that gaetz was involved in the trafficking of a 17-year-old girl. at the core of the case testimony from a former gaetz associate who is now serving an 11-year prison sentence for several federal crimes, can including sex trafficking. but the investigation into gaetz ended in february of 2023 with no charges filed. gaetz abruptly announced he was resigning from congress yesterday after trump posted the a.g. nomination on social media.

multiple media outlets reported yesterday the house ethics committee was set to vote this week on releasing a report about him, quoting from "the washington post," gaetz has been under investigation by the bipartisan committee for allegations that he may have engaged in sexual misconduct, illegal drug use, and accepted improper gifts. and now more on the character of matt gaetz and how it connects to this show. donald trump began tweeting about wide by discredited conspiracy theories about joe after receiving documents given to trump by congressman gaetz. that's according to former white house communications director alyssa griffin. she revealed that information in 2022 during her deposition before the house select committee investigating the january 6th attack. she told lawmakers she was in the west wing with republican

congressman jim jordan, former white house press secretary kayleigh mcenany and gaetz when she noticed he had a folder with him. when she asked him what was in it, she says gaetz pulled out conspiracy theories about joe scarbrough. she then told gaetz he could not put that in front of the president. right as he was getting ushered into the oval office. brock said that the next morning then president trump started tweeting about those debunked conspiracy theories. trump tweeted about those lies to his millions of followers for at least five times over the next three years. those posts caused so much pain and emotional trauma for the widower of an aide who worked for joe that the widower himself wrote an open letter to jack dorsey, the then-ceo of twitter,

pleading with him to remove the posts from social media, from the platform, writing, quote, my wife deserves better. twitter never deleted the posts. responding in a statement that the tweets did not violate its terms of service. >> they changed the terms of service the next day. >> some senate republicans yesterday were surprised and expressed doubts about gaetz's nomination. we will get to more of those reactions in just a moment. but it may not matter because donald trump is demanding senators allow for recess appointments so that he can unilaterally select his cabinet members, arguing it takes too long to confirm nominees. those are the facts. it goes without saying that we invite members of the incoming trump administration to be on our show, and also we look forward to discussing this issue

and others face to face with president trump himself. along with joe, willie and me, we have the host of "way too early," white house bureau chief at politico, jonathan lemire, u.s. special correspondent for bbc news katty kay, president of the national action network reverend al sharpton, and nbc news national security editor david road. and former u.s. attorney and msnbc contributor chuck rosenberg. great to have you with us this morning. >> willie, talk about the day yesterday. one shock after another that will have long-term most republicans and democrats agree, will have long-term negative impact on the united states. you can look at the a.g. selection. you can look at tulsi gabbard -- >> dni. >> dni, which our allies have said just don't expect the

sharing of any intel with the united states anymore because, of course, she spread, constantly spread disinformation from putin. also, of course, many people concerned about her relationship with assad in syria. and then, of course, also had the d.o.d. pick, which retired generals and admirals deeply concerned about not only his lack of experience, but also some of the extraordinarily hostile things that he has written, talking about democrats as enemies from within and worse. >> yeah, he wrote that in a book not that long ago. that's not an old thought for met gala hegseth, pete hegseth. for every marco rubio and secretary of state and john thune winning yesterday to be the majority leader of the united states senate, which most people in washington said, okay, we can live with those chooses.

john thune a highly respected guy across party lines in the senate. along comes tulsi gabbard who, as you said, at best is sympathetic to russia and syria. she was critical in the early days of russia's invasion of ukraine of ukraine and the united states for provoking that somehow. always tilting towards russia. are and the same goes for syria and assad. she paid a visit to him not long ago. deep concerns about her correcting our national intelligence. and then in matt gaetz this is the one that shook not just democrats, but republicans. we will play some of that reaction in just a moment from people who just utterly stunned, not on the other hand well liked in the united states congress and not just by democrats, but by republican colleagues as well. he is someone who talked about the weaponization of the justice department, about "lawfare" that is using the legitimate institutions of the legal system to attack people personally.

here you have it actually, a lot of that was invented, of course. matt gaetz chosen for the very reason that donald trump will tell you he will go after donald trump's opponents, his perceived enemies as well. so, david, let's swing over to you for reaction. what you are hearing from sources across the justice department and people who have worked in our legal community for years, what are they saying? >> so yesterday i was in the justice department. it was before the announcement was made, and afterwards there was sort of shock from people in the department. they were stunned by the choice, and it's a pattern of essentially matt gaetz based on his past activity will repeat a false narrative that fits donald trump's sort of personal political goals, and, you know, that's dangerous.

we need institutions that sort of operate on facts, the power of the justice department is tremendous, and that's the concern here. people are not talking about mass resignations. they are talking about staying? the department and doing their jobs. they worked for democrats and republicans. it was a shock. there is calls for him not to be confirmed by the senate. but it's this very dangerous rewriting of list and fact that, that is what i believe will happen if he becomes attorney general. >> jonathan lemire, one of the things i heard after this shock came down, this was from rchs, he won't make it through, and perhaps donald trump threw this out there and said, okay, i will let you shoot down matt gaetz in the senate, but you've got to give me x, y, and z, sort of strategic. the problem, if he does recess appointments and he has a compliant congress now, we know that, doesn't matter. there is no vote. >> yeah, there is a lot of things at play here.

first, you're right, can't be overstated how stunning this announcement was, how disliked matt gaetz is. across capitol hill, both parties. there is no sense that he is qualified for this position. we heard republicans and democrats alike voice real concerns that he would not be able to do this job. there is -- look, donald trump, almost feels like a dare. daring republicans, try to defy me. yes, his initial picks were met with mostly acclaim from the gop. the last few, particularly gabbard and gaetz, much less so. that is one of the theories, maybe gaetz is knocked down and that's maybe the one that senate republicans can object to, allowing the others to get to. the timing is striking, two days before the release of a house ethics report about gaetz's conduct because he is suddenly resigned from congress, which was not normally how this works. usually you keep your seat in

case you don't get confirmed. that makes that probe go away. now there are questions as to whether or not that report will still see the light of day. so chuck rosenberg, this is -- let's talk about that, if you think that that report will see the light of day, whether that's part of the decision-making process here with trump perhaps doing gaetz a favor to bow out of the house of representatives, and also what it would mean if he is confirmed. there is doubt about the recess appointment strategy. thune said he might support it before he was elected. it would be sacrificing a lot of senate power if they were to let trump do this. if gaetz got in, what would that look like? >> wouldn't look good, jonathan. you just mentioned that he is unqualified to the office. you are exactly right. of course he is. in a sense, everybody's unqualified to that office. the work of the department of justice is so deep and broad and complex. nobody comes in knowing everything about tax or

antitrust or civil rights. civil work, criminal work, you know, everything from the federal bureau of prisons, federal bureau of investigation. so it's not just that he is unqualified, jonathan. you plook for three things, i think, in any attorney general. republican, democrat, male, female, black, white, absolutely meaningless as long as they have one of these or i should say all three of those things. integrity, judgment, and independence. if you have those three things, we're fine. if you don't have those three things, we're not. and i first came in when dick thornburg was the attorney general of the united states. republican from the western district of pennsylvania, served as u.s. attorney, had been governor, a man of tremendous integrity and honor, intellect, passionate about the work of the department, understood the norms followed by janet reno, who drove bill clinton crazy because of her independence. it's exactly what the department of justice needed. even jeff sessions, right, disappointed donald trump when

he recused himself from stewardship of the investigation into russian election interference. i am sure joe biden was unhappy with merrick garland when hunter biden was indicted and mr. garland appointed a special counsel to investigate joe biden's mishandling of classified information. what they all have in common, all of these attorneys general is that independent streak. with matt gaetz, you get not just somebody who is wholly unqualified to the substance of the work, but to somebody who lacks integrity, judgment and independence. so what does it look like, jonathan, if he becomes the attorney general of the united states? it's a train wreck. >> all right. so, katty kay, just looking at the reaction on both sides of the aisle, stunning, shocking, hearing them this morning, disturbing, wow from republicans and democrats to many of these nominations, choices, you have

been with us reporting throughout the campaign in the run up to the re-election of president trump. so i guess my first question to you is, is it so shocking? because i don't think it is at all, not shocking at all. and this is exactly the kind of thing that president trump laid out very clearly as he was running for re-election. and i just want to sort of set the record straight on that. it's just not a surprise. not to me. wondering what you think, and also what is your reaction to the nominations that you're hearing from around the world? >> so, i suppose it's shocking in the sense that donald trump's earliest picks for his cabinet seem to be more conventional. pete waltzes of the world, people who have respect, could be understood in the context of america's foreign policy and mark's system of government more broadly. that's why matt gaetz i think came as a shock, maybe perhaps

not an tulsi gabbard, also an unconventional pick. i think many of us thought he would go down a more conventional route. i have heard, as we all have this morning, even from very conservative constitutional lawyers that they find the pick of matt gaetz unfathomable. but you're right, mika. donald trump did signal all through the campaign and people around him signaled that one of his priorities was to go after people who are his political enemies. it's very clear that he feels aggrieved at the way he has been treated by the justice department in the way that matt gaetz does. in this way, they are similar, peas in a pod. they both feel they have been victimized and wrongly investigated. you can see why it makes sense. the reporting is that matt gaetz was not high up on the list. other people around donald trump didn't think he was going to be the attorney general pick and then he flew up with adult yesterday morning to washington,

d.c., and the reporting is his name was announced. maybe this is donald trump not being as organized about his cabinet as we had thought he was from the early pick. when he came in and immediately announced susie wiles, we thought this is different from 2016. this is somebody who has been planning this. it's organized. there is a system here. yet, the last couple of appointments suggest that may not be the case, that some of this is being -- pete hegseth, only went down to mar-a-lago monday, announced quickly. matt gaetz was announced quickly after those conversations on the plane. so perhaps there is a little bit more chaos around this one. the thing i remember thinking in 2016, how does competence factor into the trump administration's cabinet. i think some of the last appointments that we have had, pete hegseth not necessarily the most qualified for the job he is doing, matt gaetz also raised questions. is this cabinet going to be able to do the things that donald trump wants because do they have the experience to do it. >> rev, interesting.

even some. people that have seen perhaps as buffers against donald trump's worst impulses, john thune or marco rubio, susie wiles as well, maybe, but also he gets just about everybody now in the party to bend to his will. even somebody who is viewed as a guardrail potentially ends up not being one. and you see in here after the gaetz announcement yesterday, outrage, people saying, wait a minute, when i voted for donald trump i voted for lower prices and a tougher border. you get the whole package when you cast your vote. you buy the ticket, you get the ride, and this is a part it of it. >> this is a part of it. what is stunning is how they are handling it in such a way that is so bizarre for their own interests. donald trump despite all of my criticisms of him had the opportunity to now say, i was put in office even after being defeated. maybe only the second president in history to do that, and rise to the occasion.

but you come in and put people in the department of defense, you put people in, nominate people like matt gaetz, i mean, when you look at the temperament and background of these people, that they are even disliked among republicans, i mean, what gaetz does to an innocent family, trying to take shots at joe, i mean, let's not get past that. it shows a temperament, despite the fact we know how ludicrous it was. why would you even pirate something like that unless there is something about you that should certainly not be sitting at the head of the department of justice. and i think that what donald trump had an opportunity to say, i was not everything y'all said i was. he is now confirming our worst fears and making a mockery of government. to put these people over the defense department, to put tulsi gabbard there over intelligence, to put d -- to nominate gaetz is to mock the american people that voted for him, and those of us

on the other side saying, we defer to the vote of the people, but we told you so even we didn't tell you it would be this bad. >> to your point, you are getting the whole package, trump couldn't have been clearer. his agenda is retribution against his perceived enemies, the deep state. the department of justice, the intelligence community, department of defense. those are the picks here, pete hegseth, tulsi gabbard and matt gaetz. that's what the second term is going to be about. we should note, republicans yesterday did defy him in if their choice of john thune as majority leader. they did so in a secret ballot. now they are going to have to put their names to it. coming up, what the incoming senate majority leader is saying about the prospect of president-elect trump putting his people in positions of power without a confirmation process. that's next on "morning joe." . everyone customize and save hundreds on car insurance

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even, but it was like whiplash when gaetz came down the pike. in some cases running around the hallways informing lawmakers the news that gaetz was chosen as attorney general. this is somebody who is disliked equally on both sides of the aisle. for example, kevin cramer said to me, i don't like what he did when he ousted kevin mccarthy. i had other women republican senators tell me on background, not attaching their name to it, they are disgusted by the allegations that gaetz was facing, with his sexual misconduct, something he was being investigated by the house ethics committee for. but when you talk about the chances of getting confirmed, the reactions were filled with expletives, with shock. a lot of senators, even conservatives in the maga world type, told me i was okay with all of the people he put forward so far, but gaetz is a shocking one. and look, you can have defections like susan collins and lisa murkowski. they are about to have the 53 seat majority with david

mccormick in pennsylvania, although that race is headed to a recount. still regardless of the cushion, you have a lot of republicans scratching their heads at this pick thinking it's not going to happen at the end of the day. you talk about the recess appointments, john thune was asked about that before the gaetz pick was announced. take a listen to what he said. >> you have said that recess appointments are on the table. that's a key demand from president-elect donald trump. will you move forward with that? >> we are going to make sure that we are processing his nominees in a way that gets them into those positions so he can implement his agenda. how that happens remains to be seen. >> here is the thing. nobody wants recess appointments. the last time this happened was under president obama, the supreme court blocked him because he didn't do it in a certain amount of days. the senate returned to the handshake agreement of not doing stuff like . both chambers get dismissed. then trump is allowed to install who he wants.

with somebody like great, alarm bells are ringing in senators' ears. when they met behind closed doors before the elections where they voted for thune for a leader, i was told they talked about recess appointments. while that's on the table, everybody prefers going through regular order. >> coming up, our next guest says one of the president-elect's cabinet picks is a risk to national security. tom nichols says former congresswoman tulsi gabbard is unfit to serve and explains why when "morning joe" comes right back. omes right back hey little bear bear. ♪ ♪ ♪ i'm gonna love you forever ♪ ♪ ♪ c'mon, bear. ♪ ♪ ♪ you don't...you don't have to worry... ♪ ♪ be by your side... i'll be there... ♪ ♪ with my arms wrapped around... ♪

time to take a quick look at some of the other stories making headlines this morning. new york governor kathy hochul expect today revive a plan to charge a toll on most vehicles entering midtown and lower manhattan after she pulled the plug on the idea back in july, suggesting the $15 charge was too high. according to "the new york times," the new cost will be $9

per vehicle. the new plan would be fast tracked for approval in an effort to head off president-elect trump's vow to kill the program. a new storm could hit florida by the mid of next week as a category 3 hurricane. government forecasters say the system to be named sarah could bring catastrophic flooding. the gulf coast has seen five hurricane lafls this season. and theodore olsen has died. the long time lawyer successfully argued the florida recount, the case that sealed the presidency for george w. bush. the former solicitor general appeared more than 60 times before the u.s. supreme court. he was 84 years old. coming up, our next guest says matt gaetz's nomination for attorney general could already be doa. jake sherman of "punchbowl news"

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well, it must be the worst nomination for a cabinet position in american history. i think this is something that falls well outside the scope of deference that should be given to a president in nominating members of the senior team. gaetz is not only totally incompetent for this job. he doesn't have the character. he is a person of moral turpitude, and notwithstanding how difficult it may be politically, this is a nomination the republican party should oppose. >> we'll tick through some of the other nominees. do you think he the only one you might see real opposition to, or are there others? >> i think that tulsi gabbard's nomination to be director of national intelligence, when i heard that my reaction was hilarious. >> why?

>> she is totally not competent. gaetz is the worst. she may be tracking in at the second worst. >> one of donald trump's former national security advisors, john bolton, yesterday reacting to the controversial trump nominations. trump picked tulsi gabbard, a former house democrat, who ran for president in 2021, to be the director of national intelligence. gabbard is a lieutenant colonel in the army reserve and served in the hawaii national guard, about but never worked in the intelligence world or served on a congressional intelligence committee. back in 2017, when she was in congress, gabbard received criticism for meeting with syrian president bashar al assad, who was accused of human rights violations and war crimes. gabbard defended her meeting at the time, saying assad is, quote, not the enemy of the united states. gabbard has often been at odds with assessments from the u.s.

intelligence community, and has clashed with government analysts who say russian leader vladimir putin is the primary purveyor of disinformation that's designed to sew divisions in the u.s. lawmakers accused gabbard of promoting russian propaganda after she posted a video online that claimed to show u.s. funded bioweapon labs in ukraine. gabbard denied the allegation. she also has claimed that the biden administration could have prevented the wrar in ukraine if it addressed russia's concerns about ukraine joining nato. >> so, willie, you know, as we said off the top of the show, we have done our best since the election, and we plan to continue doing, reporting the news straight down the middle. if somebody were just tuning in and listening to these reactions

to matt gaetz for a.g. and tulsi gabbard for dni, they might go, my gosh, this is -- these are left wingers that don't like donald trump's selections. well, of course, there you saw john bolton. what is so unique about these two selections, unlike the others that president trump laid out there, that you actually, if you go on the hill, you will have republicans and democrats both being critical of the selections. and i suspect republicans being more critical of the gaetz pick just because they know him personally more and have had a lot of problems with him for many different reasons. but with tulsi gabbard, you talk to anybody on the intel committees, any republicans on the intel committees, talk to any republicans that actually have dealt with the gathering of intelligence, the sharing of intelligence with foreign

governments, they seem to be the ones right now most horrified by this. this is -- we talked about matt gaetz before, but it's fair to say that tulsi gabbard is a bipartisan shock as well, only because the conclusion is, if she were to ever be in that position, other countries simply wouldn't share intel with the united states. >> that's what i was going to say. i heard from and read yesterday where you have people in the intel community saying our allies aren't going to share intelligence with us if she is in there because the sympathetic view, the kindest view is that she is a sympathizer of vladimir putin's, of assad's a syria. tom nichols and others may take it a step further. let's bring in the staff writer for "the atlantic," tom nichols, a piece titled tulsi gabbard's nomination is a national security risk. good morning. can you explain why you believe

she would be if she gets this job a risk to the country? >> every federal employee every year has to sit through insider threat training to recognize people they think might be hazards around classified material. part of that is people who are deeply critical of the united states and its foreign policy, who seem to have a lot of affinity and meetings with foreign nationals. i mean, there is all kinds of alarm bells that go off here, and this nomination sets them all off. this is not somebody that you would say, sure, you know, i'll hand the crown jewels of american intelligence to someone who, as you pointed out, she is completely unqualified for the job, this is somebody who has consistently taken the side of people like bashar al assad and

vladimir putin, even when she was a member of congress. there is absolutely no way that in any normal universe we'd even be having this discussion about trusting tulsi gabbard with the american intelligence community. a reminder for people watching, the dni sits on top of all of america's intelligence communities. including cia. and i think, you know, one of the terrible things about the matt gaetz nomination is that it was so cartoonishly shocking, that it's wiped out talking about how completely unfit tulsi gabbard is. frankly, pete hegseth as well. i mean, you have -- you would have two people at defense and dni that i think you would be shock to think are handling classified information, are at least in pete hegseth's case, part of the nuclear chain of command, you know. this is donald trump in a way he

is trolling the nation, mocking, i think, reverend sharpton it right, mocking his own voters. those are all about people who are going to punish donald trump's opponents by virtue of even being in the jobs, and there is no thought at all here about, well, i don't know, what's best for america or american national security. >> right, right, right. so, jonathan lemire, help me out here. you have, obviously, you have reported on president trump now for quite some time. let's look back over the past week. he received 50% plus in the vote tally that came in. he did -- i pin, swept the swing states. did far better than anybody had expected as far as that big of a rout.

was praised by, of course, republicans. got grudging respect from political pros on what he did. certainly a lot of respect and adulation from wall street and business leaders, something that he certainly likes to hear. laid out a -- his first two, three picks that were met with, you know, met with, i think, a good enough reception. and so everything seemed to be breaking his way. again, if you had a president who wanted to be a 50% plus president, he certainly had started off the first week very well in that direction. i'm curious though, yesterday one shockwave after another. obviously, with matt gaetz, somebody who is not qualified to do the job and someone he knew would cause the reaction that he

caused from republicans and democrats. same thing with tulsi gabbard. i'm curious your best reporting on why that sharp turn when everything seemed the first week to be going to smoothly. >> the people i talked to around trump show this is a case tiger woods study of competing impulses. he wants to be liked, receive praise from the mainstream media, from wall street, business leaders. at the same time he gives into instincts about revenge and retribution and siding with those who simply flatter him. it's about his agenda, too. we should fully anticipate business leaders pushing back against tariffs, let's say, or the mass depoortations because those things will impact the economy. will that be enough to get him to stop? we shall see. he was praised for a lot of the early picks, including the official announcement of marco rubio to be secretary of state.

but beginning two nights ago with the pete hegseth pick and then really accelerating with matt gaetz and tulsi gabbard, this is him prioritizing personal loyalty and also retribution, which is what he said this entire term would be about. and those around him, look, were taken by surprise, particularly by the gaetz and gabbard picks. they weren't on the short list, and they wonder what happens next. seems like a dare to republicans. tom nichols, i wanted to circle back to the tulsi gabbard selection with you because one thing i heard yesterday or concern i heard from those who are currently and formerly in the intelligence community is that this would have a chilling effect on our allies, that because gabbard is viewed with such suspicion, that there will be some of our european and asian partners who might not want to fully cooperate with us, who frankly might have had skepticism about trump himself, trump famously blab about intelligence to the russian ambassador in the oval office,

and now you add gabbard to the mix. what's your degree of concern? is this going to undermine our alliances? >> my degree of concern about all three of these, especially about fwab in that position, is off the charts a level of concern. of course it's going to affect our allies. they would be, you know, they would be irspob responsible in their duties to their countries if they were not concerned about her because when you're thinking about dealing with, again, the top american intelligence official, you take your pick. you wouldn't want to work with her because she's not qualified for her job or because she is overly sympathetic to the president of russia and the president of syria, who, you know, she thinks was a -- seems to think is not our enemy and is a, you know, needs to be understood after he gassed his own people. there is also, i think, within the intelligence community,

within the united states you are going to see information slowed down simply because there are going to be offices and agencies who we are going to have intelligence professionals saying, what do i send up the chain? why should this piece of information go? do he keep it in house at cia or the fbi? >> so, tom -- >> national security agency. it's a mess. >> can i ask you, tom, so let's say perhaps she's not -- she doesn't get confirmed by the senate. who would be some other strong candidates for this position that might fit more into donald trump's world view? so, if not gabbard, and we certainly heard from republicans and democrats alike, not her, but who would be two or three good names for this position if for some reason she got voted

down? >> joe, i am not going to make the life of a future nominee difficult by naming them and saying that somebody i think would be okay. >> how about describing the type of a person that republicans and democrats would support. what would the qualities be? >> the qualities would be, first of all, some experience with intelligence. i mean, this can't be amateur hour. this isn't the apprentices. this isn't celebrity director of national intelligence week on the staffing "apprentice" to see if, you know, the hawaii national guard lieutenant colonel can make it to the top of the intelligence heap. this is ridiculous. this is reality show approach. so you want somebody who has background in national intelligence. somebody perhaps, if it's a legislator, somebody who sat on the kmuts. someone from, the intelligence community, someone who managed a

large organization. this is another thing we keep forget being these. one of the problems with both the gabbard and hegseth nominations is these are immense burrock sees that require people who are executives who have run big organizations. you look for that kind of background. >> right. >> gabbard has none of them. >> coming up our next guest has a vote on donald trump's nominee to lead the justice department. that is if the confirmation pro takes place. senator elizabeth warren reacts to the president-elect's pick when she joins the discussion straight head on "morning joe." .

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if it weren't for donald trump, we would have lost the house of representatives. there is no question. he's got a mission statement.'s mission and objectives, whatever that is, we need to embrace it. all of it. every single word. it is his mission statement. if he says jump 3 feet high and scratch your head, we all jump 3 feet high and scratch our heads. >> [ laughter ] the constitutional republic called the united states of america. i must say i've never heard it put quite that way. >> republican congressman troy nehls speaking to reporters after president-elect trump spoke to reporters yesterday. >> scratching our heads.

i guess. >> welcome to the fourth hour of "morning joe." >> you see him on podcasts. for those who hate donald trump, love donald trump, yeah. it's pretty incredible. >> 6:00 on the west coast. 9:00 on the east. >> some would call that a cult, but not us. >> president-elect trump has announced his pick for several key positions including tulsi gabbard for director of national intelligence and a controversial republican congressman matt gaetz of florida to serve as attorney general. we have two reports for you this morning starting with chief white house correspondent peter alexander. >> reporter: president-elect trump returning to mar-a-lago last night singing god bless america with billionaire elon musk on his side as he ramps up the transition process.

the director of national intelligence is already facing scrutiny. tulsi gabbard, a military veteran, once a democratic congresswoman and trump critic -- >> it is important our commander-in-chief have a military mindset. the military mindset doesn't mean you walk around looking tough making idle threats. >> reporter: gabbard has since endorsed trump and changed parties. she would be close to the nation most closely guarded secrets and be the president's main advisor. gabbard has questioned the u.s. intelligence community. she met with the syrian dictator in 2017, blamed the u.s. and nato for russia's invasion of ukraine in 2022 and has shared russian claims about ukraine discredited by lawmakers. abigail spann berger a former cia officer writing not only is

she ill-prepared and unqualified, she traffics in conspiracy theories. all of it after the president-elect capped his comeback at the white house at the invitation of president biden. biden vowing a smooth transition. >> you will come in and we will have a chance to talk about some of that today, so welcome. welcome back. >> politics is tough. in many cases, it's not a very nice world but it is a nice world today and i appreciate it very much. a transition so smooth, as smooth as it can get. >> reporter: trump told the washington post he and biden discussed the war in ukraine and the conflict in the middle east adding, i wanted to know his views on where we are and what he thinks. >> reporter: questions swirling over whether matt gaetz, one of capitol hill's most critical of

the justice department can lead at. >> i don't think it's a serious nomination. >> reporter: praised as the period -- president-elect writing gaetz will rule out corruption at the doj, something trump has long railed against as he has faced criminal investigations. at one point, saying prosecutors should be thrown in jail and saying this when asked if he would use the justice system to go after perceived political enemies. >> look, when this election is over, based on what they have done, i would have every right to go after them. >> reporter: gaetz often serving as an attack dog for president trump -- >> we will do well beyond our time in service. we either get the government back on our side or we defund and get rid of, abolish the fbi, cdc, atf, doj -- every

last one of them if they do not come to heal! >> reporter: and saying this back in 2020 -- >> maybe i should serve as attorney general of the united states. if necessary, i would fire every little [ bleep ] at the building. >> reporter: reaction scathing. multiple current and senior officials left speechless, calling it insane, unbelievable, saying he is the least qualified person ever nominated for a position at the department of justice. people raising concerns about the would-be top lawyer of the country having been a subject of a federal investigation for allegedly sex trafficking of a 17-year-old girl. prosecutors ultimately closed the cage without charges and gaetz maintained his innocence. >> i have not had a relationship with a 17-year- old. that is totally false. >> reporter: and an investigation by the house

ethics committee ongoing. that investigation comes to an immediate halt. gaetz frequently clashing with members of his own party, leading a successful charge to houston -- oust house speaker mike mccarthy. >> at the end of the day, he probably shouldn't be on the streets. >> laura jarrett without reporting. joining us now, state attorney for palm beach county florida dave ehrenberg, cofounder of punch bowl news, and justice and intelligence correspondent ken dilanian. ken's reporting is called justice department employees stunned that trump's insane, unbelievable choice of matt gaetz for attorney general. >> jake, let's start with you. you are on the hill yesterday when the news came. the news broke. we have been talking this morning about the justice department and the republicans,

but it doesn't serve president trump because as so many people have said, this is the least qualified pic ever to be attorney general. what are you hearing from republicans on the hill after the news broke? >> well, joe, if they could muster anything to say, they were saying they weren't going to confirm him in so many words. we got called last night from senior senate republicans who vowed they would do everything in their power to make sure matt gaetz does not get confirmed. a few thoughts here. number one, it is a healthy senate republican majority. 53 seats. you could do a lot with that. you could get almost anyone within reason you want confirmed. this is not within reason for republican senators. you've got susan collins, mitch mcconnell is no longer in leadership and is a free agent.

that's what i'm watching on top of many, many more republicans who think matt gaetz is despicable. that is number one. number two, you know, if trump keeps doing this, there are two direct impacts. number one, he's losing his house majority. it is crazy to say that. he will nominate republicans into the minority if he's not careful. mike johnson said last night, it's enough already. you can't keep nominating house republicans for administration positions or we will be in the minority and we will no longer have all branches of government. that was number one. number two, if he puts forward these pix that are so problematic, it will eat up valuable senate time. the first 100 days of the last trump administration were wasted. that is true. they did not get a lot done in the last 100 days. if you waste your time on stunts like this, you will be behind the eight ball in getting an

actual agenda. which he may or may not care about. >> jake, you said stunned. i'm curious because i've heard from several people on the hill that they thought this was donald trump either plunking -- punking the hill, or trolling. republicans said this isn't a serious pick. he must be doing it for other reasons. have you heard that? if so, what other reasons could there be? >> reporter: beats me. i don't see any other reason to do this. joe, you served with the president that was very good on capitol hill. he would give a heads up to members of his party when he

would put forward a nomination that could be controversial. what is the effect? maybe the next person softens the ground for the next attorney general. maybe it makes his other picks look more palatable. i couldn't tell you what the president-elect is thinking in any way, shape, or form. all i can tell you is matt gaetz will probably not get 50 votes in the senate. i don't know -- i don't know what is behind this. it is according to everyone we talked to seems like a stunned and an unnecessary one at that. >> all right, ken dilanian, great reporting on the reaction to these nominations. specifically matt gaetz for attorney general. it does feel like they are speaking in a reality that involves a senate and a functioning government house and a senate who actually wants to get something done, have an agenda, has plans to be

productive. but if we look at what donald trump had promised, had tried to do in his first presidency, had promised to do repeatedly during his campaign, don't these nominations that? >> reporter: well, they certainly do, mika. he has promised to prosecute his enemies, to blowup the fbi, to purge the justice department of career civil servants who won't his views of the world. matt gaetz is probably the person, the personification of the kind of figure that could try to do that. i will say one thing about analysis. could this be a way to make the nest nominee look more powerful? i remember in 2019 the next cia director was nominated and he was not confirmed.

he had to withdraw his nomination amid controversies he lied about his background and some other things and rick grenell was installed as the acting dni which was seen as a nightmare inside the intelligence community. john radcliffe seemed a lot more palatable and was confirmed by the senate. i think that is a reasonable question to ask. matt gaetz is not confirmable. taking this at face value, there is a human trafficking prosecution unit and some of those people may have worked on the investigation of matt gaetz and now they are confronted with the idea he could be their boss. he could control their fate. they are absolutely horrified. we speak to the justice department all the time but i've been speaking to the career public servants. before this happened, there was no plan to engage in mass resignations because donald trump was elected. they are perfectly capable of changing policy on time and

pursuing policies with a republican president which involves different minorities on civil rights in the police departments, may be antitrust, all sorts of things but this set of nominations and particularly matt gaetz has really caused a lot of people over there to think about whether they can continue inside the justice department. that may be what the trump department wants but i've never heard the comments and some of which we have published in our story that people are saying right now. they are flabbergasted and really, really scared, guys. >> so, dave ehrenberg, let's get your perspective on this. speak to the idea that this is -- trump has always sort of wanted this. he has prized his personal loyalty. he asked for this in his first term.

>> trump always wanted his attorney general to be his personal defender and he holds him as his ideal lawyer. i'm surprised he actually picked matt gaetz. we knew he would pick him but matt gaetz has become a caricature. it is not just he was prosecuted for child sex trafficking. he was nearly expelled from congress and could have been expelled if he stayed around. with this pick, trump is trolling the doj but it could have devastating consequences. a republican friend of mine who is also friends with matt gaetz told me he thought this appointment was the worst thing that has ever happened to the country. considering our country went through the civil war, the great depression, and 9/11, it is so shocking and unserious i think we will have a hard time getting this confirmed.

he is working the phones to try to defeat as top enemy or he could become in the sights of the doj. i think there could be a chance for gaetz to serve two years, so it's up to john thune to see if he is a man who loves his country like mike pence, or whether his legacy will be the guy who watches as rome burns. >> let's bring in msnbc chief legal correspondent and the host of msnbc's the beat . it is great to have you on this morning. your thoughts on this pick for attorney general in light of what we just heard from dave aronberg? >> you are reporting, coverage, and discussion here is right on the money. this is an extreme, outrageous, complete shattering of all standards including as is always the case with trump and maga efforts a shattering of

conservative legal norms so i think this is a huge starting test of what the senate will do should this type of individual after the vetting, which will continue the questioning, should he be voted in. this shouldn't be taken for granted even though we all on this program and the viewers understand the environment of the unity of the republican party and with donald trump and maga but the constitution has the advise and consent provision because the should not be automatic. >> you know, ari, as you know from your reporting and what people like jake have been reporting on, this is not a democratic versus a republican battle. it's republicans -- most republicans have lined up against this and think it will

do grave harm. you start looking at all of the people who said they could not support this pick. it is almost impossible to see how donald trump's ag pick gets to 50. >> you look at john bolden and others about the investigation and what reporters have discussed last night and today with the ethics investigation and further evidence there. whatever the house material -- whatever is in the government possession be it the congressional branch, what the fbi has and others. this is all material with key interest united states senate to vet. of course, famed battles with both parties. again, we have had him on. i've interviewed matt gaetz several times. the things that hurt him for this kind of role that are

traditionally disqualifying are not in dispute, joe and mika. these are things he talked to me about, like why there should be a very partisan maga approach to government. why he believes in one side, not both. he has basically said all of the things that would traditionally disqualify you for a nonpartisan job and for all of the attention and i believe merited concern over the abuse, constitutional abuse of power under the incoming trump administration's doj, that's all one piece of the job . this is a law enforcement job that deals with terrorism, immigration, financial crimes. putting someone in there with no experience or being a prosecutor, overseeing prosecutors, all the stuff this top law enforcement job does including liaison with the fbi handicaps the united states to deal with all of those other issues. i try to be as evidence-based

as i can but i would say it's actually worse than it looks at first. it's bad for all of the obvious reasons of matt gaetz and the politics. it's also bad for the underlying reasons of how important the agency is. >> as i have been saying all morning too ultimately it's bad for the incoming president, president trump, because there will be so many things he will not be qualified to do. it is a tough enough job for people who have been around it for 30 years. jake sherman, everything -- you know, everything is coming at you and other reporters on the hill so fast. let's talk quickly about tulsi gabbard and the same situation but on an intel basis. again, what we keep hearing from one republican after another is she just doesn't seem to have the qualifications to be able to -- even if you

get past and this is a good -- big get past, she is too close to putin and russia. there is no experience that could suggest you would be able to oversee the intel agencies and provide good intel to the president of the united states. as many have been saying overnight, it also raises a serious question about our foreign allies and whether they would actually share the intel they have. >> there is one area on capitol hill that is mainly partisan, the intelligence committee in the senate which will be chaired and vice chair to buy two lawmakers seen as serious minded and honest. they will hold hearings on

gabbard and if she gets through committee which i'm not convinced she will, i think she will have a difficult time. pete hegseth who trump nominated as defense secretary will get through. at least it seems like that at this point. i'm not completely confident but i think gabbard and gaetz -- listen, we haven't mentioned this by gaetz resigned yesterday ahead of tomorrow. the ethics committee was set to vote to release a report about matt gaetz so he resigned and had set theoretically the releasing of that report. those nominations, joe, will be absolutely an incredibly heavy lift. again, in the early days of the administration when it's trying to get going on legislation and serious nominations. >> of course, we will see if that hands it over to capitol hill reporter, like maybe jake

sherman. nbc's ken dilanian, let's turn to you now. the tulsi gabbard pick -- you know, i've heard from current and former intel officials who are in disbelief and frankly outraged by this selection, pointing to her past trips to syria, her kind words for putin and the like. tell us more about what you are hearing. >> reporter: two concerns. one, the level of an experience . secondly, these fringe positions she has taken over the years to the point she repeated russian propaganda about the false claim there were bio weapons labs. ukraine was denounced at that time by mitt romney as having essentially russian propaganda does. think about the idea she was running in 2020 to take on donald trump as a democrat.

now she is poised to be in his cabinet. what does that suggest there about her intellectual malleability? look, some people argue the dni and the whole agency maybe needs to be downsized. it was created after 9/11. it is a management job and brings the intelligence community together. arguably the cia director is a more important job overseeing intelligence operations and has a lot of operators that work for that job. dni is a 10,000 level. in the donald trump first administration, the dni is giving the president his intel briefing. he's in the oval office every day talking about the most important national security issues facing the country and the idea that would be tulsi gabbard is really frightening and disturbing to a lot of people i've been talking to inside the intelligence

community. >> ken dilanian, jake sherman, dave aronberg, thank you for joining us this morning. let's get over to our next guest, elizabeth warren of massachusetts. senator, thank you for being on this morning. let's go in order. the first thing i want to ask you about is the pick for attorney general, matt gaetz. what does this signify to you? many people are expressing shock. are you shocked given what donald trump has said all along? >> look, donald trump is telling us what the criteria is for every one of these jobs and its complete loyalty to donald trump. not experience. not qualifications we would ordinarily consider. not having -- how good you would be at this work. not loyalty to the people of united states or the constitution. absolute loyalty to donald trump and he's making this clear with

every single one of these picks. particularly with gaetz, it is a reminder to the democrats right now who are in charge for the next 50 days that we have a responsibility to help take care of the judicial system, to help strengthen our court system. we have 28 judges out there who have been nominated, who are through the process. we need to spend every single minute making sure that those judges get confirmed. look, i get it. supreme court has been captured by a radical wing, but this is about the court of appeals, the district courts. these are lifetime appointments. trump cannot remove them. it helps bring more stability to our system. this is what the democrats need to be spending every minute on

until we get the judges confirmed. >> what about -- i mean, i think it's fair to say democrats have been concerned about this for quite some time and will be following suit with what you are talking about. they have their own very big concerns about this. what about, senator, your republican counterparts? will they hold a line for the united states of america? >> you know, every single one of them took the same oath of office that i did and that is a pledge to uphold the constitution of the united states of america. we have a constitutional advising consent role here to play and every single one of them will have a vote. and they will demonstrate by that boat is there loyalty to the constitution, or loyalty individually to donald trump?

i think trump is putting it to them straight up and we will find out who those republican senators are who believe their only job is to attach themselves to donald trump and those who say they have obligation to follow through to the people of the united states and uphold our constitution. >> the president-elect making threats about recent appointments, senator warren, and i want to take on a colleague of yours who has been nominated less controversially. senator marco rubio as secretary of state. do you think he's qualified for this position? >> look, there are several things i disagree with marco rubio on and i have not decided yet on voting for him but he is qualified. he has experience. we may have differences that cause me to say i don't think he should be secretary of state and we will go through that. we will listen to the hearings. i want to hear from him but when we talk about matt gaetz, it's very different compared to marco rubio. we have to keep that in mind.

but do understand with matt gaetz, and you've already made this point, he's not the only one out there that is unqualified and who raises whole questions, like tulsi gabbard does. you really want her to have all of the secrets of united states and our defense intelligence agencies when she has so clearly been in putin's pocket? that has to be a hard no. >> i know, but the republicans know that in some ways that is what trump has telegraphed to america? right? >> you know, again, i have to say i understand elections have consequences, but the oath we take in the united states senate is to uphold the constitution and that means to serve the people of the united states. even if trump says, hey, i only want people loyal to me and if

they are giving -- you know, they have pushed national security risks, they will prosecute my enemies as it appears two of his choices would do, his views are not the views anyone has taken an oath to uphold. our responsibilities are to the people of the united states. democrats need to do their work right now to get the judges confirmed. republicans need to do some serious soul-searching about whether or not they can support any of these nominees. >> democratic senator elizabeth warren of massachusetts, thank you for coming on this morning. i really appreciate it. let's take a look at other headlines this morning. president biden will meet with chinese president xi jinping in peru on saturday. among the topics slated to be discussed, artificial intelligence, climate change, china's support of russia and the war against ukraine.

this will be the third in- person meeting between the two world leaders. premature births in the u.s. remain at an all-time high with no improvements over the last decade. a new report gave the country a d+ grade based on a number of babies born too soon last year. the preterm birth rate was 10.4% last year, up from 9.8% in 2013. a proposal to refurbish the iconic houston astrodome was unveiled yesterday by a nonprofit focused on saving the iconic stadium. the astrodome conservancy plan would construct four state-of- the-art buildings inside the stadium to offer statements for restaurants, stores, and offices. nicknamed the eighth wonder of the world, the stadium opened in 1965 but has been closed

since 2008. coming up, the latest key inflation report. the consumer price index was released moments ago. we will break down those numbers straight ahead. also ahead, a.i. al sorkin? >> don't call me dave. >> good point. never, ever call me andy. this is us, now avatars. artificial intelligence. a.i. me is almost as good as squawk box me. >> the latest on a.i. deepfakes as technology continues to evolve. was that you, or a.i.? that was a.i.? that's next on "morning joe."

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there, he's not. >> black lives matter trying to destroy christmas as we know it. >> can the black panther be played by a white guy? >> it's the chinese virus or the kung flu. >> it is sudden-death soccer. >> i haven't washed my hands for 10 years. >> that is secretary i don't wash my hands to you. >> all right, there is that. meanwhile, the decision to nominate matt gaetz is making waves on wall street. let's bring in new york times columnist andrew sorkin. we will get to a.i. in a moment. talk to us, andrew, about wall street's reaction to the

selections. >> reporter: look, i was at a conference yesterday and there were a whole bunch of investors when the news came down and i would say up until that moment so many of them had a big grin on their face about where the market was going, the economy, all of that. when it first came across the phone, there were people including, by the way, myself and thought it was a parody account, who literally thought it was the onion and they didn't believe it and the shift in tone from, wow, we will have a great economy to all of these things and i don't have to worry to, okay, maybe now i have to worry was like in the blink of an eye. my phone was lighting up from people in the business community who i think are still hopeful in their own ways about the economic issues and the like, but when it comes to law and order, when it comes to the justice department and what this will ultimately look like,

what prosecutions will look like, that through a lot of people back on their feet and the question is whether they can stand up and say so publicly and i think unfortunately the answer is still no. especially because of the role this individual may ultimately play. if i could throw the ball back to ari, you had a point i thought was actually fascinating about why you thought he was selected that i had never even contemplated. >> reporter: one of the reasons we heard matt gaetz is such a controversial pick, he is a pariah across both parties. i think it's clear donald trump want someone who will not ever worry during or after the job about any other views. professional views, even peer groups. in that outcast, donald trump has someone who will not only go further than the doj has

gone since the nixon era. nixon's attorney general was ultimately prosecuted. has no future look at caring about any program from anywhere. >> that is a really good point. andrew, we have republicans and business leaders talking about matt gaetz when they want to be talking about the economy. right? >> reporter: the consumer price index is rising. that is a real thing, but not too much. we should not get too worried about the consumer price index or the price people will be paying on the wholesale side. it will get fed, if you will, through the consumers. it is a little inflationary, but when you look at where things have been over the last year, i don't think this is something the markets today for example are going, oh, my goodness, the prices are too high. >> andrew, yesterday you hosted

a panel featuring innovation investors and you had a chance to showcase the latest in artificial intelligence. let's take a look at that. >> hi, it's me, andrew. >> and i'm david but don't call me dave. >> and never, ever call me andy. >> point taken. >> this is us as avatars. artificial intelligence. a.i. me is almost as good as squawk box me. >> let's be honest. squawk box you is not as good as squawk box me. >> david, even your avatar is cutthroat. >> could a.i. andrew cover for you the next time you oversleep? >> i hope management is in watching. it can be fun to trick them. >> let me do a trick right now. hey, i'm over here now. did you think this was andrew? it's actually me, david.

>> wow, it is cooler to be you. >> eye donor if you are creeped out or excited. everything you just saw -- everything you just saw, mika, was generated by a computer. i never said those words or read a script like that at all. >> they re-created your voice? >> reporter: i did have to read a page. you know, i need to sound sad, sound happy, different things. the video, same thing. i had to look down, up, sideways, smile, frown, all of that. 60% of corporate america, of working companies have signed agreements and the whole idea is that, you know, if you are a business leader, you could actually put out a video of yourself on a weekly basis without actually making a video at all. you could write a script in 10 different languages around the

world. there are certain things that are exciting. also certain things that are scary about it. >> mika, i always wondered how andrew sorkin put out a book, a writer, a daily tv show host. was it too much? >> there you go. >> reporter: this is the real me but i have to say this is the future. i had a form to sign. by the way, we did this independently of one another and we were not in the same room this happened. the scary part, in a year or two from now, they said they wouldn't even need to film you. they could just take a photograph, animate the photograph. they could take your voice off the internet, off youtube or whatever and we would not have to do the specialized things we did and it would look even better than that. i don't know. the future is here.

it is scary. >> thanks for that. cnbc's andrew sorkin, we appreciate it. coming up, we will discuss the film oh canada which tells the story of flooding the u.s. to avoid serving in vietnam. richard gere is our guest next to talk about his role and the project receiving a lot of buzz. "morning joe" will be right back. woah, a lost card isn't keeping this thrill seeker down. lost her card, not the vibe. the soul searcher, is finding his identity, and helping to protect it. hey! oh yeah, the explorer! she's looking to dive deeper... all while chase looks out for her. because these friends have chase. alerts that help check. tools that help protect. one bank that puts you in control. chase. make more of what's yours.

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this documentary will record your progress from your arrival from canada as a draft refugee to a filmmaker. >> where is my wife? >> i'm here. >> i want to tell you everything for the record. you don't know any of it. >> okay. let's begin. lights, please.

>> december 22, 2023. >> the story begins the night of march 30th, 1968. >> i can hear him. >> she will be a girl. >> something tells me you are going north tomorrow. >> i'm needing to decide my future. >> a look at the new film "oh, canada" starring richard gere. richard gere please 1 of 60,000 who fled from the u.s. to canada to avoid serving in vietnam. he eventually becomes a respected documentary filmmaker and decides to give a final testimony of his life. during a non-camera interview reviewing his decisions to leave the u.s. all of those decades ago. joining us now is actor, producer, golden globe winner,

and humanitarian richard gere. it is great to have you back on the show. this was fascinating. >> mika, when was the last time we did this? >> a good decade may be. it was years. give him more volume, please. come into the shot. can you hear me enough? i would love to ask you to tell us about "oh, canada." >> well, it's -- we hadn't worked together in i hate to say this, 40 years. you know, we stayed friends since we made american gigolo together. we have talked about things over the years but he sent me the script and it was something normally i take a long time to say yes to things but this was

pretty immediate. my dad had just passed away and he was one month short of 101, but i had seen him go through this process of aging and disassociating and how memories and emotions and stories became conflated with each other and much more impressionistic and i really took to the script. >> it is based on a novel. were you familiar with the book? >> no, i wasn't actually. i don't think most people knew this book. it wasn't super successful. >> they will certainly learn from this film. what are some of the other themes right now that were striking to you that drew you to this project? >> you know, i forgot this was

really centered on that time in the late '60s, '70s. that was also the time i was drafted. i was in the first draft and i had friends that left. at some point i will tell the story but i left as well. i left school. after my sophomore year, i left to join the circus and become an actor. and -- but i was in a sense running from the draft at that point. so this resonates with me and i think people of my generation. i don't know if kids today can even relate to that. i don't know. >> quick complement and then my question. you look really great. >> this is not me. i have been cleaned up. >> i'm sitting here thinking,

look at richard gere. he looks great. >> i'm 103. >> you look at a project like this. it draws on history and it takes a while to put these things together. we all know that. yet it lands at a certain moment. i'm curious how you feel about a story about the classic idea the unjust law is no law at all. where does one's moral obligations fit into the country's demands? >> the movie is not about that. it's about how we all have secrets. we have all invented ourselves. there are things in our past we won't let go of and in this moment, he is giving his last confession. somewhat like crap's last tape, a very famous play. a guy sitting alone in a room listening to old tapes of the

story of his life and it is true to some extent what he is remembering, but i think what you get in a sense because this is in and out of time, jacob elordi plays me as a young man and it's not exactly true what we see on film. even the story i'm telling may not be true. it is true in a broad emotional fence, but the facts are fluid. i think we see that. the facts are fluid but the emotion is true and what we feel about things is something we can hold onto. >> here's a clip from the film when richard's character is confronted by his adult son. >> thank you. i appreciate it. >> congratulations, dad. >> what? >> i am your son. >> who is this?

>> that's right. i am your son. >> i don't have a son. stay away from me. >> certainly a powerful moment there. let's get your reflection upon that and working with the rest of this spectacular cast. >> in that scene, he has not seen his son since he was a few years old. in the context of the film, it is pretty powerful. he is not a wonderful guy at all times. what was the other question? >> the cast? >> oh, the cast was terrific. uma thurman plays my wife in this. michael imperioli was a

student of mine in school. he and his wife were students of mine and they had come to me and they want this last confession. this last interview. they are terrific. jacob is wonderful. we didn't know who jacob was when paul hired him for this film. we were talking about actors and i have heard very little about him. i saw his work and he was terrific but we had no idea there would be 500 girls hanging around the set when we were shooting. >> all right, the new film "oh, canada" opens in select theaters on december 6th. it looks absolutely fascinating. actor, producer, golden globe winner richard gere, thank you very much. >> when am i going to see you? you are in some other world right now. >> it could be a.i. mika for all we know.

thank you very much for being on this morning. that does it for us this morning. a quick, final break.