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tv   Alex Wagner Tonight  MSNBC  November 22, 2024 9:00pm-10:00pm PST

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extraordinary and speedy recovery. we cannot wait to have leukon this leukon this show. we have seen extraordinary, hard working journalists who crush it at their jobs being called all sorts of names in the last few weeks and a guy like luke who is the best at our job, he is the best in the world. isn't that unbelievable? >> unbelievable. >> a good story. >> it sure is. >> and you're the reason i don't get any sleep. that i'm up late. because of the great job you do. >> thank you. wow. and now don is my favorite guest. all right, tara, steve, birthday boy, don. thank you for joining us. we leave you on that good note. you can catch the night cap tomorrow night. you can see it tomorrow at 11:00 p.m. eastern. >> you know what i'm doing tomorrow night. >> 11:00 p.m. eastern right here on msnbc. for now, we are signing off. for all of our colleagues
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across the networks of nbc news, thanks for staying up late. we'll see you at the end of monday. donald trump's second term cabinet is rapidly taking shape and we have some very big news tonight as it relate to some key positions. first, the president-elect has picked billionaire scott bessent to be treasury secretary. one of trump's top donors and a hedge fund manager started by a democratic megadonor george sauros. but he has turned into a maga true believer and embraced populist economics. trump also chose the office of management and budget. a position of significant influence as far as the
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president's agenda. in that position, trump hopes to install the architect of project 2025. the man who served the same role during trump's first term in office. trump's full embrace of him is further information that his disinterest in 2025 was anything but. and he had a surprise pick from the teamsters union. picking republican congresswoman from oregon lori chavez-deremer. one of few republicans to cosponsor the pro act protecting workers rights to organize. joining me, faz, thank you for joining me, it has been a flurry of news from trump world tonight. and i want to kind of just tick through some of these appointments.
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first let's talk about the treasury secretary, there was a lot of back and forth about who he was going to pick, if this was someone trump could rely on. what do you make of someone who was once affiliated with george soros, play add key role in his investments, now part of the maga firmment? >> this has been an interesting fight. because eli musk opposed him saying he was business as usual. it became a major tussle between the elon musk wing of the trump world versus steve bannon. steve bannon fresh out of jail, this was his major campaign. he had him come on his show. it became so much of a tussle that trump didn't look to a third person who is probably the highest profile person who
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came to mar-a-lago, talked to him. and he went with bessent. you can see trump doling out favors to various factions of his coalition tonight. but steve bannon got this one. >> so a w on the board for steve bannon. and i would assume you feel that this is also a w for steve bannon in that the master mind of project 2025, he was there in the first term, but it was obvious from the writings in project 2025 that russell vought oversaw, he has very clear, very extreme ideas about what to do next. what is your reaction to this one? >> with that one, for those frequent watchers of the alex wagner show will remember two nights ago you and i were talking about the cuts to
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medicaid and food stamps. and that was in the first trump administration. it happened. who executed that? when we saw all of the great protests in capitol hill over medicaid cuts. who was the architect? mr. russell vought. and he is back. if you look at the last budget donald trump produced and sent out in 2020, it had massive cuts. over a trillion-and-a-half dollars to medicaid. massive cuts, cut social security even. food stamps of course. so you can assume looking at project 2025 which trump aid no. that's not going to have anything to do with me. of course it is. and he has now named not only vought, miller, authors of project 2025 to his administration. he is going right at all the things you and i were talking about. the far right agenda to attack
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working people. >> yeah. just to put a finer point on that. from the project 2025 stable, he named tom homan. brandon carr. let me, the sort of probably most i'm going to say unusual pick here, i'm eager to hear your thoughts. lori chavez. she was at the rnc, she had a speaking slot at the rnc this summer. but she endorsed the proact. she has been a friend to labor. the teamsters endorsement. i know you are familiar with this individual. what do you make of trump's pick for her as labor secretary? >> it was a pro labor pick. winning big for this.
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he got, shawn o'brien did. got opposed by much of the conservative movement. competitive enterprise institute. all came out against shawn o'brien's. and trump went with him. he said hey, i'm doing to do something for my friend shawn o'brien which is great. and i hope we are able to push. the country needs it. but the hostility that surrounds her is real. you have elon musk. you have scott bessent. they are not ready to go fly with the pro labor agenda so she has her work cut out for her but it is one voice at a table where she is out gunned. by wall street friendly people. i think it could be helpful when workers go on strike. i will just note that in order to support the labor secretary, you need a national labor relations board support.
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so who donald trump picks for that needs to compliment this direction if we are going to carve into being a pro labor but it is a decent first step here. >> yeah. just, it's already, first of all, it's friday night. and he has announced 320% of his cabinet in five minutes right? that's chaotic. the actual picks themselves, some of whom we will get to a few more in a second. but the fact you have a pro labor candidate at the department of labor and elon musk advising. this is all you need to know how unified this group will be and the chaos bound to ensue with so many people at odds over such key issues. thank you for playing what feels like some kind of terrifying game show night of trump cabinet picks this friday evening. i appreciate your time and sanity. >> riding cockpit along with you. thank you alex. >> thanks brother. okay, so trump is also tonight announced a number of key administration picks who may be working under robert f.
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kennedy jr. for the commissioner of the food and drug administration, trump has chosen dr. marty makary who previously said the federal government was the greatest perpetrator of misinformation during the covid-19 pandemic. he is a proponent of natural immunity saying it was at least as effective or even better than immunity provided by vaccines. and he mistakenly arguedwould r immunity from covid by april of 2021. for the director of the centers for disease control, trump has picked dr. dave weldon. a trained physician and army veteran who served in congress from 1995 to 2009 and for u.s. surgeon general, he tapped another fox news contributor. dr. janette neshwat. joining me now, dr. gupta. what a night it is turning out to be. admittedly. this happened moments ago.
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so i'm just looking for an initial reaction. the surgeon general is a fox news contributor which seems to be a must have to work in the trump white house. hah what is your reaction to that? >> i know her by reputations. i have seen her clips. she is pretty modest and i would say pretty conservative when it comes to saying things that we may disagree with. so on that pick, that is probably the most sober pick we have seen when it comes to trump's appointees. marty makary has been proven wrong. he says that as an example, this is a common talking point on the right that covid vaccines cause inflammation of the heart. and that infection itself poses less of a risk. several studies have debunked that main talking point.
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he is just broadly speaking just not qualified. he is an author and a clinician. not somebody who has been at all close to medical compliance, policymaking on drugs or food safety. he doesn't have any type of bureaucratic or government experience when it comes to managing a sprawling organization so he lacks management skills but he doesn't even have basic skills when it comes to understanding medical, legal, compliance when it comes to these critical initiatives. he will be replacing dr. rob gala. he just doesn't have the fundamental background to be in that position. then of course there is oz which we could go on and on about. >> let's table oz. makary is overseeing the fda's $7 billion budget. i wonder what the future is for vaccines and vaccine distribution and development given the fact that you have someone who could be hhs secretary who is an avowed
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vaccine skeptic who does not think there are any good vaccines out there. and makary who mistakenly believes things about natural immunity being better than vaccines. is there a real world effect that we are barreling toward having these two individuals in these roles? >> we are seeing the cdc. the cdc can or cannot recommend which vaccines that kids should be getting. they have a critical thought leadership role. turns out recommending at the state and local level, what we should be doing. so they can on day one start to revise that. so the cdc director will follow rfk junior's edict. every single one of these appointees has been floated by him.so, makary has you have poi out is going to bend the knee. to exactly to rfk jr. 's preferences. it will have a real impact on
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what the fda is going to say. what they will approve. how they will talk about potential side effects. is it going to be balanced information? rfk jr. talks about safety. we have been doing that since the 1986 law mandated it across the country. he is also introducing skepticism on things we in green scrubs or white coats in an actual hospital have been doing for decades. so that is the concern here. creates skepticism when there should be trust. >> public health is the notion that paranoid skeptics now hold central places inside the firmament of the u.s.
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government. that is a radical change. doctor, it is such a pleasure and it is so necessary to have you with us tonight. thanks for your time, sir. >> thank you. coming up, we have new reporting tonight on trump's doj's plan for the team of prosecutors who worked under special council jack smith and whether any of his plans are actually legal. but congresswoman jasmine crocket joins me to discuss republican's full scale assault on diversity. that's next. assault on diversity. that's next.
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i promise this is not a joke. but there is some poetic justice in the special election to replace florida congressman matt gaetz in the next congress. gaetz's congressional seat is now open after his bid to become u.s. attorney general crashed and burned. and the special election to replace gaetz has now been set for april fool's day. april 1st of 2025. now, in addition to that being a cosmically appropriate date, it also means that for at least the first three months of next year, his house seat will sit empty. republicans also look set to temporarily lose at least two more house seats once they are vacated by florida representative mike waltz and
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new york representative stefonic. though those would only be temporary losses, those seats will really matter because the balance of power in this incoming congress will be incredibly close. right now, there are still three house races left to be called. two in california and one in iowa. all three of those races are currently split by less than a thousand votes. but it looks like republicans will end up with just a two to 2004 seat majority equal to the majority they have had the past two years and that means that all is not lost for democrats in the house this session. you might remember that in this past session of congress, the republican party was so divided that it took 15 rounds of voting to elect a house speaker only for that speaker to become the first house speaker in american history to be ousted from the role by his own party.
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and all of that drama meant this past session of congress was one of the least productive sessions in modern history. >> one thing. i want my republican colleagues to give me one thing. one that i can go campaign on and say we did. one! anybody, if you want to come down to the floor and explain to me one material meaningful significant thing the republican majority has done. >> that was republican congressman from texas chip roy just one year ago. republicans in the house have not done much at all since. house republicans have introduced literally thousands of pieces of legislation this session. but with a razor thin majority actually passing that legislation is an uphill battle. so while donald trump may soon have a trifecta with republicans in control of the house and the senate and the
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white house, the potential for his legislative agenda to stall in the house is incredibly real. the work for democrats is convincing a handful of republican members that whatever trump is trying to get them to pass is a bridge too far. it will not be an easy task. but there are battles democrats can win and have already started fighting. yesterday, a bill called the dismantle dei act passed out of the house oversight committee on a party line vote. the bill has 75 cosponsors. all republican. it would close all federal diversity programs. the federal government is the biggest employer in the government. it has more employees than wal- mart, amazon, or anyone else. so the federal government taking diversity and equity and inclusion into account when it is recruiting, that matters.
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and what this dismantled dei act is trying to do is legally bar the federal government on the act that it is discriminatory against straight white men. will democrats be able to convince two or three republicans that a bill like that is a really, really bad idea? well, this is one of those battles that democrats have already started to fight. here was the emergency shelters passioned plea from texas democrat jasmine crocket trying to explain to that diversity is not the boogeyman they present it to be. >> 62% of office holders. these are the issues that we are constantly looking at and recognizing and trying to say is this just? i can't even tell you how many white men have served in this chamber but i can tell you that i am only the 55th black woman to be elected to congress and so when you want to talk about
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history and pretend as if it was so long ago, it wasn't. because again, i'm just number 55. finally, when we start to talk about what do these numbers do as we are trying to say the diversity equity inclusion is the problem, when it comes to financial performance, companies with more diverse work forces are more likely to outperform their competitors. for racial diversity, 35% more likely to out perform their peers on profitability. they are 25% more likely to generate greater profits. diverse companies earn 2.5 times higher cash flow per employee. diversity works. >> this was one more section of her remarks. that is very much worth hearing. here was her response to the
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white male republicans saying that dei amount to oppression. >> you consistently said over and over the word oppression. every time you said it it was as if i was hearing nails on a chalkboard because it seems like you don't understand the definition of oppression and i would ask you to just refer to google to help you out. oppression is the prolonged cruel or unjust treatment or control. that is the definition of oppression. and so, as i sit here as a black woman who practices civil rights, let me tell you the reason my colleagues wanted to make sure you understand the same black history that your side of the aisle wants to delete out of classrooms is because you can then misuse words like oppression. there has been no oppression for the white man in this country. you tell me which white men were dragged out of their homes, you tell me which one of them got dragged all the way across an ocean and told that
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you are going to go and work. we are going to steal your wives. we are going rape your wives. that didn't happen. that is oppression. we didn't ask to be here. we are not the same migrants that y'all constantly come up against. we didn't run away from home. we were stolen! so yeah. we are going to sit here and be offended when you want to sit here and act like, and don't let it escape you that it is white men on this side of the aisle telling us people of color on this side of the aisle that y'all are the ones being oppressed? that y'all are the ones being harmed? that is not the definition of oppression. you tell me the prolonged cruel or unjust treatment that you have had and we can have a conversation. >> joining me now is congresswoman jasmine crocket. democrat from texas. it is great to have you on the program. there is a reason your remarks
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went viral. and that they have gotten people talking. they are incredibly powerful. very forceful. and i think a lot of people think not said enough. what was the reaction that you got after making them? >> yeah. it was the first time that my colleagues on the other side of the aisle just shut up. and they did not want to comment on the remarks that i made. there had been a back and forth between presley and higgins out of louisiana at some point in time. but they all kind of just looked dumbfounded. it was almost like oh my goodness, she had the audacity to tell the truth. she had the audacity to give us a history lesson. she had the audacity to stand up for people that look like her and not back down and not pretend as if these white tears, this white fragility we
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are experiencing is anything other than that. and that it is not about equity. it is about making sure that we can have the likes of the people that have been elevated into trump's administration who we know are not qualified while skipping over qualified black men i disagree with. but donalds and scott are more qualified but also black. that is the type of life that they want us to have in this country. one in which even if you are mediocre, even if you are unqualified but you are white, that will be enough. >> do you think that, first of all, do you talk to your republican colleagues about that? those two specific people, especially tim scott who humiliated himself in a lot of ways for donald trump on the campaign trail. and has yet to be rewarded with
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anything. do you think that argument has found any resonance with your colleagues on the other side of the aisle? >> i doubt it. you know. i asked where is byron. did i miss him? and byron had not been in committee at all to argue and i was curious to see how he was going to vote. we did not see him make an argument as to why this bill is good. but we saw byron on the trail. i was very curious to hear or see his arguments on this anti- dei bill. but hi did not show up to actually debate it. he did support it. >> i think what is so powerful about the arguments you made.
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injecting much needed emotion into what is an indignity that people of color have been forced to suffer when white people talk about oppression. given the history of people of color in america. and you articulated it beautifully. but the other piece of it is you came with receipts in terms of the numbers. companies that do well for diversity. there has not been a forceful argument for an inclusive america. it was given up upon. democrats didn't make a huge argument for it at the top of the ticket and i understand a lot of the cross winds for someone like kamala harris. a candidate of historic nature. but it almost feels like we got to talk about the way that this issue is tethered to reality and history. do you sense this dei effort that is being made on the part of republicans in congress? is actually going to pass? that they will do away with federal interests in having a
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diverse workplace? >> yeah. i mean it was a part of project 2025. as we know, at least two of the people he selected are authors of project 2025. as much as we yelled that it was his plan. he said i know nothing about it and it is not my plan, people believed him. we see how that is playing out. so yes i do believe this is something that we will end up enduring in the trump administration. i will say this. this bill is going nowhere. the senate is still controlled by democrats and joe biden is still in the white house. and we know that this president has been historic in so many ways. besides making sure that he had the first female black woman specifically added to the ticket as a vice president. besides that, he put the first
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black woman on the supreme court. besides that, he has combined appointed more black women specifically but overall, more people of color to federal benches than all other presidents combined. so this has been someone who absolutely has believed in diversity. he has had one of the most diverse cabinets ever. in the history of this country. so no. he would for what we are going to experience once trump is in office. the question is will the filibuster stand? will democrat ins the senate say okay, wait a minute, filibuster. or will they bow down and say this identity politics thing. it is a problem. or whatever it is they want to say. they are trying to dismantle our civil rights in front of us. and it is really, really sad. and so i am hoping that we will be united not only in the house, but in the senate. and it would be nice if we
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could find the backbone of some republican to stand with us hopefully one that is of color and the final point i will make is the biggest beneficiaries of dei as well as affirmative action have been white women. so at least maybe one white woman can stand with us democrats and make sure that we stop this harmful and divisive rhetoric that we see happening that they are now trying to turn into actual bills. >> representative jasmine crockett of texas. i know we will be talking to you more. thank you so much for your time tonight. >> good to see you. coming up, more breaking news tonight. new reporting from the washington post that donald trump plans to fire all the members of special council jack smith's prosecutorial team including apolitical career prosecutors. we will break it down with lisa coming up next. lisa coming up next.
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staying true to his campaign promise of retribution, donald trump plans to fire the entire team that worked under special counsel jack smith on investigations into trump's efforts to overturn the 2020 election. and his mishandling of classified documents. when asked about trump's plans,
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a trump spokeswoman said president trump campaigned on firing rogue bureaucrats who have engaged in the illegal weaponnization of our american justice system and the american people can expect he will deliver on that promise. according to the post, trump also aims to build teams within the doj to hunt for evidence of fraud in the 2020 battleground states. joining me now is lisa rubin, msnbc's secret legal weapon. help me understand how this is possible. first of all, lisa, how many people are we talking about and can this actually happen? >> reporter: if this were to come to fruition, we are talking about dozens of people, career employees at the department of justice who would be impacted. but to your more fundamental es the short answer is, it really isn't. there isn't a way to fire on a widespread basis career employees at the department of justice because most of these
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folks are entitled to civil service protections i won't detail because they are complicated but that's the point. they are complicated. firing somebody who is a career staffer at the department of justice is purposefully complicated because these people are entitled to a process. when caroline lovett scheduled to be press secretary says he campaigned on the promise of firing rogue bureaucrats who have participated in the weaponnization of our justice system, on one hand, i believe she means it. on the other hand, i'm not sure how they will accomplish it. >> does the ascension of pam bondi as the attorney general, does having a sympathizer and someone with a vested interest in carrying out trump's orders expedite that process or make it any easier? >> she told the washington post tonight that the people who spoke to the post don't know what the transition is planning and that the only people who speak for the transition are
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the transition itself. we can expect that pam bondi would deliver on these promises. she thinks the investigators should be investigated. prosecutors should be prosecuted. that is apart from whether people should lose their jobs in the first place. just the act of being fired, that is designed to terrorize people. the uncertainty is the point. to put legal costs on people who can ill afford it. they cannot even accept pro bono legal representation if they are employing so if you are a career employee and somebody comes to you and says we are going to let you go because you participated in this jack smith nonsense, you can't even have somebody provide free legal services to you. you have to be fired first before you can even begin to have that legal representation. it is designed to impoverish people and terrify them.
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that's the whole point. >> there are a couple of trump layers who have been named for very top positions at the doj. todd blanche. these guys defended trump but they know the law. they are not wac-a-doo fox news contributors who are maga warriors. they are lawyer withs some credentials. could they be a moderating influence at all when we look at an attempted purge of the department of justice. >> i think they could be a moderating influence but that doesn't mean that some of these things won't come to fruition in some modified way. can you reassign them? can you assign them to a job they are neither really qualified to do nor would they
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want to do. do i put it past this group of people to make it very difficult for some of the folks who are career staff and joined up with jack smith's team? i do. and that might be what it means to be a moderating force. >> just move them to a place they don't want to be at all. lisa, thank you for doing important reporting on top of the important reporting for washington post. we appreciate you as always. >> thanks for having me. coming up, republicans were so outraged over being confronted by the deadly reality of their abortion ban, one that led to the death of two women, they fired the officials who leaked the data. that's coming up. that's coming up. while loading up our suv, one extra push and... crack! so, we scheduled at safelite.com. we were able to track our technician and knew exactly when he'd arrive. we can keep working!
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minutes. that's a case! add up to it. that's a case. >> slow down the testing please. trump was angry the country was testing so many people because that meant we were finding more positive cases and in his mind that made trump look bad. almost like he was mishandling the biggest health crisis in a generation. so trump's instinct was to cook the books. to mess with the numbers. so america looked like it had fewer cases than it did. never mind that fudging the numbers would get in the way of solving the actual crisis. this was about making trump look good. or at least less worse. and now that he is returning to office, we can expect more attempts to mess with critical data collection efforts. the trump world project 2025 agenda makes several recommendations as to how the incoming administration can screw around with data. things like preventing the equal employment opportunity commission, the eeoc from
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collecting basic data on race and ethnicity. preventing the centers from disease criminal for collecting data on gender identity. and manipulating u.s. census data by adding a citizenship question and gutting america's weather monitoring infrastructure including the national oceanic and atmospheric administration and the national weather service. to erase data about climate problems that conservatives don't want to admit exist. now this week, we got our first look at what this conservative war on information actually looks like in the real world. if you followed this last election closely, you may remember how propublica reported on the deaths of two women. both of whom died because they could not get access to safe and legal abortion care in the state of georgia. that reporting was based on information propublica received from georgia's maternal
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mortality review committee saying both women's deaths could have been prevented. republican officials in georgia confronted with the deadly reality of their abortion ban was outraged that propublica was able to get that information. and propublica is reporting that all 32 members of that review committee have been dismissed as punishment for leaking data about the two women's deaths. it is a stunning act of retribution but it is also an attack on the public's right to life saving information. in just a second, i'll talk to the reporter who broke this story about what it might portend for the future of health and safety in donald trump's america. that's next. trump's america. that's next. into the night. it's all the things that keep this world turning. it's the go-tos that keep us going. the places we cheer. trust. hang out. and check in.
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get amazing savings and connect to wifi speeds up to a gig on the go with xfinity mobile. fly don't walk to get our best deals of the year. connect to the world of wicked this holiday, in theaters now. my daughter amber made me so proud. she was having complications and. >> we are learning more about
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the death of amber thurman. >> it was likely preventable if she had access to abortion care in her home state of georgia. >> what happened to her was preventable. my daughter is gone because of what donald trump did. >> in september, the country learned for the first time about two preventable deaths caused by post dobbs abortion bans. thanks to propublica's reporting on two women. it is the sort of data every state's maternal mortality review committee is supposed to collect and review and report in order to make recommendations to reduce deaths. but now, the entire 32 member in georgia, the group that determined that their deaths were linked to abortion bans, that entire committee has been dismissed. it is the direct report of propublica obtaining the committee's reports. joining me now is the propublica reporter who broke the story about the dismissal of the review committee. thank you for being here
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tonight. first of all, who is on this commission and what happens now that all 32 members have been dismissed? >> thank you so much for having me. this commission is made up of a wide range of professionals. doctors, nurses, doulas. a whole range of people serve on this committee and their job is to review these maternal deaths and to sort of look at them from a bigger picture frame of reference and try to make suggestions, make recommendations to reduce the number of deaths. now that they have all been dismissed there is no one in georgia to review the deaths now. i understand the department of public health is trying to refill those positions so that they can resume this extremely important work. you know, we know georgia is struggling with the really high
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maternal mortality rate. right now, there is no maternal mortality review committee and they are in the process of rehiring and refilling the positions and taking applications as we speak. >> i would imagine it was shocking to the members of the commission. what about the groups around the commission advocates for maternal health? is there any sort of, are there any consequences i guess for georgia deciding to do this? >> i know a lot of people have gotten in touch with me to talk about their shock at this move by the state to remove the committee. there is outrage that this step was taken. and so, i'm not sure with the next steps are for them. the department of public health has said that they are going to try to refill it, get it back up and going. in the letter they sent to members said that there would be no delay in the work that
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they do. obviously, a lot of experts have a lot of questions about that. it is hard to imagine they can dismiss an entire board and there would be no delay in the work they do. so there are certainly questions about how this could delay the important work this committee does. >> committees like this across the country. i wonder the degree of whether this is a model. are these commissions going to become more politicized? how chilling do you think the effect of this is? >> that is kind of an open question. but i mean, a very huge concern for sure. the chilling effect could definitely be there. and georgia isn't the only state where we have seen some changes to mortality review committees in response to
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criticism. in response to politics. idaho allowed theirs to basically lapse after a special interest group took issue with some of the recommendations. in texas you saw a little bit of movement. you saw a member who had been on the board, who made a public criticism. suddenly her seat was sort of shifted around. and she reapplied for it and wasn't able to get it. so, you know, there have been changes. this was the first time we have seen an entire board dismissed. the reasons that the department of public health said was for violations of a confidentiality agreement. but yeah. there certainly are concerns. >> it is important reporting. amy, thank you so much for your time tonight. really appreciate it. that is our show for tonight. now it is time for the last word with jonathan capehart who is in for lawrence. good evening my friend. >> good evening alex. fly, be free. enjoy your weekend. >> thank you my friend. have a great show. >>

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