thanks for staying and

spending time with us on "the beat". now, it is time for "the reidout" with joy reid. tonight on "the reidout" -- >> in a month, i was shooting her when, and i had a drug of choice, i started doing heroin, i went to the top of my class. it worked for me and if it still worked, i would still be doing it, but it didn't work. it starts -- it works really great at the beginning, but then it starts exacting a cost. >> oh, yes, welcome to your brand-new, 2025 health system, america, led by antitax or and recovering heroin addict, rfk jr. ringworm, optional. plus, a couple of doctors from tv, including dr. oz, all with very limited experience in, you know, public health. also tonight, the cardinal sin, making money off of trump's name and not even cutting him in on the profits. someone is in very, very big trouble in trump world tonight. plus, "the reidout" guide to navigating autocracy.

tonight, how business owners should prepare for the coming mass deportation raids, as trump's border czar vows to lock up anyone who stands in his way. but, we begin tonight with a word you all need to get real familiar with -- tariffs. now, just hold the beat before you change the channel. let me explain what they are and what this will mean for you and your pocketbook. okay, tariffs are taxes imposed on foreign-made goods as a way to discourage the consumption of those goods, and to encourage american-made versions instead. the tariff, or tax, is paid by the u.s. business that does the importing. at the time the foreign goods come into the country. basically, a border tax. and much of the time, the extra cost gets passed on to the consumer. so, just to make a simple math example, say a t-shirt company used to import shirts from china for $20, and marked them

up to $30 in order to sell them to consumers, to you. and a five dollar tariff is slapped on. the t-shirt company will mark the fittest shirt up from $30- $35 to cover the cost of the tariff. so,'s suddenly, teas hurts cost more at macy's, walmart, whatever. well, last night, donald trump posted on his social media thing that he would be signing an executive order, as soon as he sits down in the oval office on january 20th at noon. that would issue a flat, 25% tariff on any items imported from canada, china, and mexico. or, sorry, canada and mexico. just canada and mexico. and a 10% trump tax on goods imported from china. all three of those countries are our largest trading partners and we ship a lot of stuff back and forth, so

imagine what is going to happen when you target the countries you do the most business with. trump's tariff tax, his tariff tax plans, are no secret. he talked about them all throughout the campaign, but apparently, people weren't paying much attention. after the election, people started to ask questions about his plans, google searches for the term "tariff" spiked more than 1600%. searches for "who pays the tariffs" rose 350%. that would be like doing your homework after the test. am i right? but, okay, now we get to see who pays for tariffs. let me give you the big, big picture. according to some estimates, the average american household is going to spend an additional $2600, or more, per year. i thought americans didn't like the high cost of eggs? $2600 in extra costs for stuff that you buy, is a whole lot of expensive eggs. but, enough about that let get down to brass tacks.

mexico is america's number one trading partner. that means we sell each other lots and lots of stuff. they sell us cars, components for cars, crude oil, beer, lots of fruits and vegetables, including the famous avocados from mexico. well, 25% tariffs, experts estimate that we could expect to pay up to 75% -- $.75 more for a gallon of gas and we could pay up to $.25 more for avocados, and we can pay $.33 more for a corona, or pacifico surveys a. now, let's move to our friendly neighbors to the north, who probably won't be so friendly if those tariffs go into effect. we also buy lots of oil, and stuff like lumber and plastics from canada. so, again, you are going to pay more at the pump and you are going to pay more to build your house that needs lumber. and finally, let's talk about china. they sell us all the stuff we rely on for our everyday lives, like your smart phone, your computer, the toys your kids

play with and the cheap clothes you buy on amazon. this time next year, you are probably going to pay a lot more for your christmas gifts, if those tariffs are still in place. now, a big part of trump's selling point on the tariffs is that these inflationary tactics would force american companies to make more stuff here, in america. that is kind of a pipe dream. take, for example, the ceo of stanley black and decker, the tool company. he told shareholders that he had explored shifting production from china, but it was unlikely, because it is not cost-effective. likely, due to the high cost of american labor and high real estate prices to build a manufacturing plant. and other stuff like that. but, how are we going to lower costs for fruits, vegetables, and construction prices, when much of the labor in those industries will have been forcibly locked up and

deported? you know what economists say would happen? the policy would cause prices to nearly double. so, welcome to maga consequences, america. joining me now is robert rice, who served as labor secretary in the clinton administration, and ron somma, cnbc senior analyst and ceo of ifi.ai. robert, let me ask you first, you will be my professor in this and let me ask, did i get anything wrong in the presentation of tariffs, and if so, please correct me. >> i don't think you did, joy, other than that $2600 family estimate was made in august, before we knew how large the tariffs are going to be. i think the actual per family estimated cost is probably closer now to $4000. >> so, let's go into -- i just want to put this up again because i think in theory, i could understand who people who don't pay attention, who aren't you, who aren't ron somma, who don't pay attention to these types of economic ideas, that might think, that sounds like a

good idea, we want to build more in america, but we want to put up again who our biggest trading partners are, meaning, who do we import the most stuff from? mexico, channa, canada, germany, japan, and exports, canada, mexico, china, netherlands, and japan. if we slap a massive tariff, robert, on those countries, what would they do, what might they do in return? >> well, they will do exactly what countries did in 1930. 1930 was the last time we had a big, across-the-board tariff increase, and that was from herbert hoover. you remember hoover? president hoover? and also, congressman smoot and holly. that resulted in a retaliatory tariffs, by other countries, other countries retaliating against us, for putting tariffs against their goods, and those retaliations, those tariff wards, ended up worsening the great depression. >> right. so, robin sauna, it's good to see you again, it has been too long. but, let's talk about what business leaders are saying,

because we know we have seen a lot in california, some farm businesses who really were very supportive of trump who went, don't deport my workers. hold on, you don't need my workers, right? so, already starting to worry about the inflationary costs of mass deportation. but, what about the tariffs? are ceos preparing for the tariffs, and what do they intend to do, vis-@-vis prices, if those tariffs get slapped on? >> well, they are doing two things already, joy. number one, they are starting to stockpile goods in anticipation of tariffs being placed on those imported goods january 20th. and they are already planning to raise prices on those very same goods to offset the tariffs once, indeed, they are enacted. now, there was some hope on wall street that the treasury secretary, these scott fund manager would appear to president trump spittle andrews so we saw a stock market rally after the individual was identified and i think that might have been a bit premature. i wrote about that on cnbc.com, they are cheering this nomination, yet president trump

came out last night and basically said, effectively, if you will, reading between the lines, "nobody's going to tell me what to do, we are going to go ahead with the tariffs, irrespective of what my cabinet things." he didn't talk to marco rubio about it, or ben scott about it. this issue, it becomes extremely important insofar as united states, under donald trump, renegotiated nafta. imposing these tariffs would violate the very treaty that he and his administration wrote the first time around. so, you would expect both canada and mexico to retaliate in time. >> so, let me read a little bit from your peace, this is from cnn. during -- or, i'm sorry, this is a piece from cnn. during a radio interview saturday with larry kudlow, benson, you mentioned, who is going to be the good guy, everyone is cheering for him to be okay, he said, "tariffs cannot be inflationary because if the price of one thing goes

up, unless you give people more money, then they have less money to spend on the other thing, so there is no inflation." that doesn't make sense to me, ron. what does he mean? what is he saying? >> i'm not quite sure. he said a couple of things over the last couple of days, that you escalated trade wars so that you can de-escalate later, and there is this sort of carrot and stick approach to all of this. i'm not sure what that means. now, in the 1930s, which bob referenced, we did not get inflation from the tariffs because we were in an deflationary depression where prices were sinking through the floor. but, it did worsen and exacerbate, you know, the downside of the depression. i don't know what they are saying, there. as we are understanding it right now, given current conditions, the strength of the u.s. economy, inflation may already be on the upturn to a certain extent, in certain parts -- certain sectors of the economy. by adding those tariffs, you would raise the price level, at least one time. and you would raise the overall level of inflation. the same thing people are complaining about, that occurred after the pandemic. that big pop in prices we got

that won't come back down, that will just exacerbate the trend that they presumably voted for donald trump, to correct. >> right. and robert, there is polling that says people's number one goal, what they want donald trump to focus on his lowering prices, but he is not going to even lower the price of his own special guitars. gibson, the price that makes guitars, are threatening legal action because he created his own version of a gibson guitar and he signed them and they are like $10,000 for the most expensive one. here is a fun thing, they are also not made in the united states, they have been manufactured by multiple providers, domestic and international, going against trump's america first policy. but, that means that even his guitars, robert, or going to cost your more, so your $10,000 guitar will be like $11,000, so even his own projects, his stuff he makes, a lot of it is made in china! >> you know, it is interesting, joy, we don't realize how much a one way by -- even things that are labeled "made in america" actually come from parts that are coming from all

over the world. >> right. >> now, if you add in the extra costs of these tariffs, to the costs that come from deporting a 11 million people, who we rely on, to help us keep costs down and make a lot of stuff, we are talking about very, very large expenditures for the typical american family. this is crazy economics. >> and the other piece of it is the cronyism angle, ron. >> yeah. >> so, here is number one, yes, we will pay a little bit more for it, but let me read a piece from the new york times. why do tariffs create more potential for cronyism than other taxes? because the way they operate under our laws offers so much room for discretionary enforcement. the president can, however, exempt allies from tariffs. and does anyone really believe that the trump administration will be too ethical to do so?

trump himself has bragged about his ability to game the system. he has bragged that not paying his fair share of taxes makes him smart. so, ron, this would mean that if there is an across-the-board tariff on china, mexico, and canada, he could say "but not for you, individual company, that is my friend." "but, not for you, elon." "not for you, if you give me enough money into my super pac. >> so, there is actually true, p so, ken griffin, a hedge fund manager, who is generally supported republicans in the past made the same claim about crony capitalism creeping in because of the imposition of tariffs and then those that you mentioned. then, there is the flipside, where we saw president trump last time around imposed tariffs and other countries stopped buying our agricultural goods, we had to pay subsidies to farmers to make up for the lost sales that they experienced overseas. to the tune of tens of billions of dollars, over the course of several years.

and so, it is a two sided corn in that regard. on one hand, someone may have to wait paying the tariffs, on the other side, someone is going to bear the brunt of that in lost sales and the government is going to have to reimburse them. so, it really is a lose-lose in so many different ways and it really is not, in my estimation, bob might agree or disagree, it is not the way one conducts trade policy. it is just too blunt an instrument and it doesn't really necessarily achieve the desired ends. >> and since it doesn't lower costs, robert, and it increases cronyism, when you combine that with mass deportation, which will raise the price of everything we eat, what then happens to the economy? >> well, joy, if there is mass cronyism, that is if you have major industries all over, america and elsewhere, who are paying republicans or the trump administration, or making side deals, then the cost is just to democracy. kind of an uncertainty that hangs over the economy. and hangs over democracy. on the other hand, if you have

tariffs and combine that with deportation of 11 million people, you are going to increase costs to the average american, but much more than $4000 a year, including again the deportations you are probably up to $5000 or $6000 a year. >> well, the good news -- go ahead. >> people don't think this through necessarily on the deportation side, anywhere from 11 million to 20 million individuals that have been targeted by president trump and some of his potential cabinet picks who are deputy chiefs of staff. the industries that will be affected, so agriculture, hospitality, healthcare, housing construction, when you have a labor shortage then in multiple industries, it is not just that the price goes up, things don't get done that

everybody seems to rely on. there are 33 million non-native workers in the u.s. workforce of 168 million. 8 million of those are undocumented. so, if they are going to round them all up, we will be doing a lot of things on our own that we didn't in the past. >> yeah, and firing 50,000 federal workers will not put those people in the field. we are out of time, but really quickly, robert rice, 10 seconds. >> well, it's not going to create more american jobs, that is the thing. these jobs done by foreign workers right now, particularly from mexico, they are not the kinds of jobs that americans want and they avoid it. >> that's right. correct. but, that's what folks voted for, so we are about to do this live experiment next year. robert and ron, thank you very much. coming up, grifters will always drift. with trump's win gift griffin, that will essentially be a core facet of our federal government. we will take a sneak peek at the crony capitalism already on display before trump is even inaugurated. and that is next. s next.

asthma. does it have you missing out on what you love, with who you love? get back to better breathing with fasenra, an add-on treatment for eosinophilic asthma taken once every 8 weeks. fasenra is not for sudden breathing problems. serious allergic reactions may occur. get help for swelling of your face, mouth, tongue, or trouble breathing. don't stop your asthma treatments without talking with your doctor. tell your doctor if your asthma worsens or you have a parasitic infection. headache and sore throat may occur. the future of cool, comfortable sleep is here. ask your doctor if fasenra is right for you. introducing the new sleep number climate cool smart bed. the only smart bed in the world that actively cools and effortlessly adjusts to both of you. sleep up to 15 degrees cooler on each side. it actively cools by drawing warm air away from your body,

to keep you cool and comfortable throughout the night. our smart sleepers get 28 minutes more restful sleep per night. and now, save 50% on the sleep number limited edition smart bed. plus, free home delivery beds when you add a base. shop a sleep number store near you.

donald trump's first administration was a carnival of self-enrichment for himself and his cronies. but, one thing that really trump off, it's people profiting off of his name for personal benefit instead of his financial benefit. and it seems that boris m steen, a longtime trump adviser, may have broken the cardinal rule. he helped organize trump's legal defenses and has been helping make cabinet selections including pushing matt gaetz

for attorney general, just to give you an idea of his judgment. but, i digress. according to the new york times, trump's legal team found evidence that a top adviser asked for retainer fees for potential appointees in order to promote them for jobs in the new administration. trump directed his team to carry out the review of the adviser, boris epshteyn. the review claimed that epshteyn had sought payment from two people including scott bessette, whom trump recently picked for treasury secretary. according to the review, epshteyn met with bessette in february at a time when it was widely known that he was interested in the treasury post, and proposed $30,000- $40,000 a month to promote bessette around mar-a-lago. bessette denied. bessent then called epshteyn on december 14th to see whether or not he was criticizing bessent to people around trump, the review said. epshteyn told bessent that it was too late for him to be hired, and that he was boris epshteyn with an expletive between the two names. and it doesn't seem like boris blanking epshteyn's influences matter is since he didn't get

the job a week later. but, it seems boris made a similar hard sell to other candidates. the second person cited in the review was a defense contractor from whom he sought $100,000 a month. the report said epshteyn depicted his own hiring as "do or die" for the persons prospect. according to the review, the contractor did not hire epshteyn and is fearful of retaliation. join me now is david corr, washington bureau chief and msnbc political analyst. and welcome to groundhog day, my friend. more corrupt, but less funny part >> yes, yes, less whimsy this time around. this is kind of like "the sopranos" moving into the white house, here. >> truly. >> i mean, boris epshteyn was always kind of a second rate political commentator. >> on msnbc. i used to debate him on msnbc. >> that's right. and elsewhere. people thought he was kind of a

funny character. >> a goof. >> a couple years ago, he tried to make money in crypto with steve bannon. i wrote about that at mother jones. it didn't go well. if you look at where that crypto is now, it has flatlined. >> you were saying he wasn't good at business? >> yeah, he wasn't good at business. now, we have this mob like thing, i can see him walking into these guys going, "nice little office you have here. if you want a better office, i think i can help you." >> "you have to pay me." >> right. this is mob like behavior, and it is not surprising. and is he being bounced out of the trump circle for this? well, so far, no. >> right. >> he is also, don't forget, under indictment in arizona while being one of trump's biggest advisers, at least up until this point. and it is just part of a larger piece, the trump transition team won't tell us who is funding it. >> right. >> it could be anyone, maybe foreign sources, may be people who are trying to get jobs from trump. >> yeah. >> usually, they take public funds, and that is it, and you

don't have to worry about corruption before they get into office. but, now we have to worry about corruption before they get into office. >> let me just go through some of the people who stand to benefit financially from etruscan trump administration. elon musk, at number one. he has at least $15 billion in government contracts, tesla, spacex, and starling being just three. vivek ramaswamy, he has $700 million in stock from relevant into sciences which is pursuing fda studies for three drugs. dr. mehmet oz, and of course, they did that before for a drug company. mehmet oz, millions of dollars in investments in healthcare and companies regulated by the center for medicare and medicaid services, which he would run. dr. oz's holdings include up to $690,000 in major health, a major insurance company at $2.4 million in amazon which owns

medical and accepts medicare. so, these guys would be dealing inside the administration, theoretically print >> you just talked about terrorist in the first segment, the potential for corruption there, for companies who want exemptions, or companies that want terrace put on other sectors. >> and all they have to do is write a check. >> do you remember these words, "drain the swamp?" >> yeah. >> it sounded so lovely, so quaint. susan wiles, the chief of staff for trump, is a lobbyist. boris epshteyn is a swamp creature. there are others who will be coming and taking powerful positions. this is not draining the swamp. this is building the trump swamp. we have jared kushner, with $2 billion from the saudi's already, we have trump with his own business, having deals in the middle east. we have him bringing in a special adviser in the middle east, who has his own deals with middle eastern bankers. i don't think there are enough journalists, who will be able to cover all of the sleaze that

will be pouring -- >> and cover it, because he also has the threat of putting those journalists in jail if they try to get any sources inside the administration and any leaguers who talk to them. so, this is starting to sound a lot more like russia, where vladimir putin is the heavy and anyone who has to do business in russia allegedly has to give him a little money. >> i mean, remember the trump hotel, the first time? now, it is mar-a-lago. all these people are hosting fundraisers and events at mar-a- lago, so he gets money out of that. >> yeah. >> it is graft, graft, graft. and it is just never going to stop. >> it is never going to stop point >> emoluments -- >> and also, john roberts -- >> is -- john roberts says the constitution is optional for donald trump, he said it over and over again, including article two and section 14 of the 14th amendment. the thing that is so kind of sad in a way, is that a lot of donald trump space, they see him as above politics because he is rich.

they say, he doesn't need money, he didn't even take a salary as president, he doesn't need to take a salary, he is going to make billions of dollars, and he did the first time, too. >> and they all see him as a champion is the working class. last time around, he did tax cuts for the rich. it is going to happen again. the tariffs are going to hit middle income, low income people more than anything else. and even when he was president, he cut back on overtime. he tried to cut back on regulations that would have expanded overtime for workers. so, we are going to see him not serve the working class. we see a lot of pocket lining from his aides on this side and from his own family, and from trump himself. so, this is autocracy, it is oligarchy, it is all woven together into one, gigantic reality tv show. we saw it before, we are going to see it again, and i think it will all be worse. >> it is going to be worse, and we didn't even get into the united states senate members, the crypto kings that now have senate seats, that now can oversee parts of the government and "regulate" them and make investments and profit there, too. welcome to the american oligarchy.

always great to see you. >> good to be here. coming up, trump's picks to handle public health are downright dangerous and scary. we have any report detailing how rfk jr.'s anti-vaccine rhetoric may have led to several deaths in samoa. don't go anywhere. anywhere.

in 2019, before covid ravaged the world, the tiny,

polynesian island nation of samoa, home to only about 200,000 people, faced a different deadly epidemic. many thousands fell sick. nearly 2000 people were hospitalized, and at least 83 died. many of them, young children. the cause? a measles outbreak, an entirely preventable disease, for which there has been a vaccine, going back to the 1960s. the year prior, two infants died after receiving the vaccine due to a medical error. nothing to do with the safety of the vaccine itself. but, as that investigation was underway, it opened up the door to a wave of vaccine misinformation, to spread across the tiny island. and just four months before the outbreak -- who should visit, to meet with the anti-vaccine advocates? robert f kennedy junior, that nebo baby kennedy zion and accused sex pest has picked to

lead the department of health and human services. i should note, he denied groping to then 23-year-old babysitter. kennedy then met with officials, trying to dissuade them from developing the vaccine, claiming the vaccine itself was the cause of the infants' death. i should also note that kennedy is not a scientist. arguably, he is a conspiracy theorist and rich people tend to think they know everything, but a scientist, he is not. suffice it to say, the disinformation campaign by kennedy and his organization, kennedy's health defense, was successful. the vaccination rate dropped to 31%, down from 84%, four years earlier, according to world health organization data. this is the same man who donald trump has tapped to be in charge of our healthcare. a committed vaccine skeptic, and admitted recovered heroin addict, who has pushed unsubstantiated claims, like vaccines cause autism. take a listen. >> there is no vaccine that is, you know, safe and effective.

>> and if that doesn't worry you enough, trump has made a number of other concerning picks to round out his healthcare codger. there is dr. marty mchenry, a fox news commentator, who is against vaccine mandates, to lead the fda. dr. jeanette mishawaka, another fox news contributor, with little public health experience, picked to be the nation's top doctor as a surgeon general. there is former congressman and former florida physician, dave weldon, to lead the cdc. rfk jr. pushed the debunked link between vaccines and autism. and we can't forget former daytime television host, dr. mehmet oz, who once said that uninsured americans have no right to health, and has now been tapped to run medicare, and medicaid. while all of them, other than kennedy, do have medical backgrounds, none has ever led a federal agency. and when it comes to rfk jr. is

the ringleader, there are a number of things he could do, especially on vaccines, that could put the country's health at risk, that you need to know about. that is next. is next. and then i wake up. is limu with you in all your dreams? oh, yeah. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty. ♪ when i was younger my calling was to play football. but as i grew older i realized life isn't about how many people you can knock down. it's about how many people you can lift up. at ram, our calling is to build game-changing trucks.

so when you find your calling... nothing can stop you from answering it. right now, during the ram black friday sales event, get $5,000 total cash allowance on the purchase of most 2025 ram 1500 trucks. hurry to your local ram dealer today. your best defense against erosion and cavities is strong enamel. nothing beats it. i recommend pronamel active shield because it actively shields the enamel to defend against erosion and cavities. i think that this product is a game changer for my patients.

it really works. will

oh, my leaffilter? i just scheduled an appointment online and the inspection was a breeze. they explained everything. leaffilter's technology protects your gutters for good. schedule your free gutter inspection now and save up to 35%

with leaffilter's black friday deals. shop etsy's cyber spectacular until december 3rd for up to 60% off gifts crafted by small businesses. get fetching finds for friends with fur friends and everyone else on your list. for up to 60% off gifts that say i get you. etsy has it. robert f. kennedy jr. has long used his marquee political name and pulpit to push his anti-vaccine activism. and while it has led to tragic results, his impact has been somewhat limited to his fans in

the french world online. his run for president fizzled, for example. but, if confirmed as donald trump's health and human services secretary, rfk jr. will have the opportunity to undo decades of progress on infectious disease prevention. as former baltimore health commissioner, dr. leanna wen points out, there are a number of steps kennedy could take, especially on the coronavirus with vaccine. he could pressure the fda commissioner to revoke the covid vaccines approval. he could take over the cdc's advisory committee on immunization practices, which develops recommendations for how vaccines are used. and, by replacing existing acip members with vaccines get this, he could say, he is not interfering with the cdc, but rather the new, much better experts have decided vaccines are not safe.

he could also attempt to dissuade manufacturers from making vaccines, by taking away their liability protection, which keeps people from suing them, if they are harmed by a vaccine side effect. and these are just a few actions he could take, if given the keys to hhs. joining me now is internal medicine physician, dr. libby roy. it is good to see you. i just read a few of the concerns with rfk jr. being in charge of public health. talk a little bit about, do you share those concerns? and what are some you might have? >> great to see you, as always, joy. god, i wish i had better news, these picks, these medical cabinet picks, are interesting, to say the least. but, i can't say i am surprised because president trump has really been talking about these individuals and has been supporting them for many, many months now, if not years. we can start with rfk. as you pointed out in your earlier segment, he has no medical training.

and i know critics will say, well, the current hhs secretary doesn't have any medical training. and by the way, i'm not necessarily really okay with that, either. i think the person that oversees the largest federal health agency in the country, if not the world, should have some type of medical training. but, let's set that aside for a moment, joy. will you accurately point out in this segment -- and for many months now -- rfk is really known for his rhetoric against evidence-based medical policies and medical facts, including vaccines, which we know are perhaps the safest and intervention in human history up there with sanitation and clean water. this anti-vaccine rhetoric, you mentioned the example of samoa, an island where the people were tragically affected, but we are seeing that play out right here in the united states, joy. the cdc recently released a report showing that children entering kindergarten have the lowest vaccination rates in a

long time. i think about 3.3% -- or, sorry, the highest non- vaccination rate of 3.4%. that is really disturbing. and we are seeing measles outbreaks throughout the united states. and by the way, the world health organization rescinded the measles eradication status of four countries. here is hoping that the united states won't be next. >> and the reality is, you know, i have said multiple times to my team that we are about to conduct a live, human experiment on 320 million people, where the biggest conspiracy theorists coming out of covid will get to practice their version of public health, on all of us. let me just read you a few of the things that rfk jr. has said he will do. he wants to cut prescription drugs and increase weed and psychedelics access. here is a tweet last month about what the fda will be promoting in a trump administration. f fda's war on public health is

about to end. this includes its aggressive suppression of psychedelics, peptides, stem cells, raw milk, hyperbaric therapies, chelating compounds, ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine -- remember those, from the covid pandemic? vitamins, clean foods, sunshine, exercise, nutraceuticals, and anything else that advances human health and can be patented by pharma. if you work for the fda and are part of this corrupt system, i had two messages for you. one, preserve your messages, and two, pack your bags. he is saying, that is going to be the basis of public health, now. kooky theories from x twitter, ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, and other -- sunshine. that will -- we will just sheer pandemics with sunshine. bird flu is on its way, we will cheer briefly with sunshine. >> yeah, so, this is what really troubles me, joy. if you are a medical professional like me, and several of my colleagues, who are trained, for years, and years, and years, or train, to understand the nuance of which

medicines actually work, are backed by evidence, and which are not, which policies, which medications, which doses. so, this is what is tricky about people like rfk and some of the other selections for these medical cabinet positions, because not everything rfk is saying is actually a bad idea. for instance, psychedelics, i am an addiction medicine doctor, there are plenty of treatment gaps, and if they want to actually approve federal funding for psychedelics and other medications that have some potential, that is great. however, at the same time, he is also promoting hydroxychloroquine, ivermectin, and these medications for covid- 19, as you remember, there was no data to support that. so, that is what is confusing the public, and it is very concerning, when people at these highest levels are making these arguments, have no medical training, and it is confusing and will harm the public. that is what concerns me, joy. >> yeah, this is going to be,

like i said, a live human experiment on 320 million americans, where your kooky uncle with the conspiracy theories now gets to practice his version of medicine on you and your kids. dr. libby roy, scary times, thank you so much. coming up, our trip "the reidout" show to navigating autocracy. our friend is back to answer some of the legal questions on trump's mass deportation threats. we will be right back. don't go anywhere. n't go anywh.

asthma. does it have you missing out on what you love, with who you love? get back to better breathing with fasenra, an add-on treatment for eosinophilic asthma taken once every 8 weeks. fasenra is not for sudden breathing problems. serious allergic reactions may occur.

get help for swelling of your face, mouth, tongue, or trouble breathing. don't stop your asthma treatments without talking with your doctor. tell your doctor if your asthma worsens or you have a parasitic infection. headache and sore throat may occur. ask your doctor if fasenra is right for you. drop everything and get some magic of your own headache and sore during the xfinity black friday sale. xfinity internet customers, our best deals of the year are back! switch to xfinity mobile and get your choice of a free 5g phone, plus your next unlimited line free for a year. get amazing savings and connect to wifi speeds up to a gig on the go with xfinity mobile. fly don't walk to get our best deals of the year. connect to the world of wicked this holiday, in theaters now. tuckit makes every guy look better. from tall to short. from big to slim. from our iconic button downs for all shapes and sizes to a whole lot more. try us today. untuckit.

we just make guys look better. oh, and we make great styles for her too. shop the sale now at untuckit.com and more than 80 stores worldwide. all aboard! come with me to meet the wizard. why couldn't possibly. this is your moment. i'm coming. if you think that's something to see, wait til you see this. ♪ ♪ you're good. -very good. as we near the presidential

transfer of power, how trump will implement an outsourced immigration policy based on xenophobia and racism continues to raise more questions than answers. questions like, where will they get the judges to litigate the removal proceedings of the millions of people he plans to round up? let alone, resolve any appeals? where will they build detention facilities to hold people, while those proceedings are taking place? what will the condition of those camps be? how will the raids be carried out? who will conduct them? and what will happen to those whose moral compass prevents them from complying? what we do know at this moment is that trump's promise of a shock and awe blitz of executive orders and actions has no price. it includes plans to build a new deportation force out of the u.s. military. with his border czar, tom homan, threatening states that don't cooperate with having their funding cut. homan, who traveled today for a photo op at the border, also said this weekend that he would jail mayors if their city resists mass deportations.

his threat, coming just days after denver's mayor said he wouldn't comply with trump's plan, and advocated for protests against them. >> if you are a sanctuary state or city, are you breaking the law? >> you are absolutely breaking the law. look, me and the denver mayor, we agree on one thing, he is willing to go to jail, i am willing to put him in jail. >> joining me now is former u.s. attorney, joy vance, msnbc legal analyst and professor at the alabama school of law. joyce, great to see you. could larry homan put the mayor of denver in jail? >> well, unless mr. homan is about to become a federal prosecutor, or a state prosecutor, he won't be putting anybody in jail. but, look, this is the sort of threats that we have seen associated with deportation efforts before. this is an effort to get the people, the good, decent, public servants who can stand in the way of these measures,

to backdown out of fear for their personal safety. that is what this is about. >> let's go through this a little bit. so, here are some numbers. the unauthorized population, about 11 million+ people. the population 25 and older is 8.8 million. the employed are 6.829 million. married to u.s. citizens, 1.3 million. those reside with at least one u.s. citizen child under 18, 3.5 million. and homeowners, 3+ million. if you are a homeowner with a u.s.-born child, married to a u.s. citizen, and larry homan says he will deport the whole family, what happens to your home? does your home remain vacant? do you still have to pay your mortgage, your car note? what happens to your business, if you own one? can the country, the state you live in, just seize those things? >> yes, so, i think the question you are asking is, how much economic chaos results from these sorts of deportations? especially when we are talking about well-established, mixed status families, where some people are, and others aren't

citizens. you know, the reality is that in the federal system, when people are prosecuted, in some cases, you can seize their assets. it is called asset forfeiture and you can seize assets that are the result of criminal conduct. it is a stretch, here. but, if these people aren't in favor of stretching to enforce the law, that i have never seen people who are, and i suppose we theoretically could see these sorts of seizures as a result. but, the downstream impact on banks and other entities that rely on these people to feed the economy are going to be catastrophic. >> yeah. i could only imagine. migration policy, top institute, civilian owned population, 6.8 million, 1.4 million working construction, accommodation and food services, arts, and entertainment, over 1 million, professional, scientific, management, administrative, waste management, 900,000. almost 700,000 work in

manufacturing. 547,000 work in retail trade. 9% living in nevada, 8% in texas, 8% in florida, 7% in new jersey, 7% in california, 7% in maryland. if those states suddenly see military troops on their streets, kicking in doors of restaurants and dragging people off construction sites, manufacturing sites, and out of retail stores, number one, can those stores and retail sites resist? can they refuse to turn their people over? and if they do refuse or if the states refuse, what can the federal government do to them? >> yes, so, lots of complicated questions, and the answers depend on how far the trump administration is willing to go. on the extreme end of this, whether or not they can use the military for domestic enforcement is really very much a live question. many people believe that violates our traditional understanding of the law, there is a provision that prevents using the military for domestic law enforcement, but of course,

trump has contemplated ways around that, ways of bringing the military on board, perhaps using the national guard to get around those sorts of provisions. the american people who voted for gasoline and grocery prices, i am not sure that they voted to have the military arresting their friends, their neighbors, the people who take care of their kids, and clean their houses. my modest comparison, joy, is 2011, when alabama adopted a very restrictive immigration bill. they wanted people to deport themselves, they relied heavily on local law enforcement to arrest people. the pushback was massive. >> and we are already seeing some pushback from people who operate funds who are saying, if you come and get our workers, we will go under. the last thing i will say is, on the question of property, if

you own a home and you are undocumented or in a mixed status family, is there some way to ensure that if you were removed from the country, that your property would not become somehow the property of the trump administration or your state? is there some way you should be protecting yourself, now? >> well, there are, and i think people who are documented need to see lawyers, they need to aggressively do what they can about their immigration status. they can certainly arrange for their property to be put into a status where it is less vulnerable to seizure, or to some sort of a foreclosure proceeding. many folks are in mixed status families and will have american citizen children who will be adults, so there are a lot of options here. but, folks will need to plan in advance. you know, the human tragedy here is the real issue, along with the financial problems. >> absolutely. absolutely. and by the way, if you are in daca, you came as a child, so you literally did nothing wrong, but be a baby, they don't care. tom homan has said he will deport whole families, including whole families. joyce vance,