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tonight's lead, trump's tariff inflation. donald trump spent months promising to bring down costs at the pump and the checkout line. now experts are screaming that his plan to upend north american trade with 25% tariffs on mexican and canadian goods will cause food, gas, and tech prices not to just inflate, but explode. and overnight, canadian prime minister justin trudeau met with the president elect at his florida estate, where he says the two leaders had an excellent conversation. despite the tariff threat. but mexico is saying that it will retaliatefor tat with the

tariffs on its own, and china now facing an additional 10% hike on its u.s. exports under trump's plan, on a trade war it says neither country can win. the trouble with trump's tariffs, that is on tonight's politics nation. and later on in the show, i talked to the mother of aj owens, the florida mom who was killed in 2023 when she was shot by her neighbor after a racially charged dispute. that neighbor just got 25 years in prison. i will ask her family, who i've gotten to know personally, if justice was served. joining me now is congressman andre carson, democrat of indiana. congressman, thank you for joining us, and happy holiday weekend to you. we start tonight with the uncertainty surrounding the

president elect's promised tariffs on mexican and canadian imports. along with the additional 10% hike he says he will add on to all chinese goods coming into the u.s.. trump says he will take these actions on day one, even though experts are warning that costs could explode for american consumers and businesses. how should house democrats respond? >> well, i think the house democratic leadership is on it, led by my friend leader hakeem jeffries. experts agree, reverend, that the tariffs that the president- elect is proposing could rapidly increase inflation. we have just seen the threat that he has made against the nations that are threatening to get away from the dollar. so, tariffs, in president

trump's first term, did very little to impact the economy. it did not deliver on the factory jobs he promised, and this time the impact could be far worse. the tariffs that he is proposing are much bigger and far more dangerous. and these actions are estimated to directly raise prices on consumer goods by $4000 a year for the average american family. >> now, trump ran for president promising to bring down costs for consumers. yet, some experts are warning his proposed tariffs could harm the midwest in particular, where you serve as a congressman. because of its reliance in the midwest on than other regions on imported goods, from these tariffs. if that happens, do you think trump and the republicans will pay the price

during midterm elections in the states like indiana in 2026? >> it would be most unfortunate for them, but it would certainly be a gain for the democrats. but are worse for the american people. and hoosiers especially will have to pay a price because of these very damaging proposals, reverend. >> trump and his allies have insisted that our nations immigrants are a drain on the u.s. economy. to be fixed in part, they say, with mass deportations. but with trump almost back in the white house, our nations construction and food industries are getting nervous about what is going to happen if he carries his deportation plan out. that includes america's farm sector, where nearly half of its 2 million workers lack legal status, as is the case with many dairy and meat-packing workers. can trump's promised purge be stopped in washington, congressman? is there legislation that can block this from happening?

>> well, there is a series of legislation that i am a part of that will roll out in the next session, i think in addition to the human toll on mass deportation, there is an economic toll, as we know. i am in favor of safe borders, but the administration's current plan would be devastating to families in our economy. and we cannot forget, reverend, these are families that have been here for years, as you know, and in some cases decades. they are part of our communities, just like any other family, and they are part of our economy, just like any other worker. so we certainly have a workforce shortage, and this plan would certainly make it worse. in addition, this plan would take a lot of money, a lot of taxpayer dollars. it is estimated that this plan could conservatively cost over $300 billion. i'm not sure our country can afford it right now. >> $300 billion to go through with the deportation plan he

has proposed. let me go to another subject. earlier today we learned another stunning trump appointment, charles kushner, father of his son-in-law, jared kushner, who is married, nominated to be u.s. ambassador to france. you may remember, trump pardoned kushner in 2020 after he served a two year prison sentence for preparing false tax returns, witness retaliation, and making false statements to the federal election commission. of course, kushner is far from the only nominee with substantial baggage that senate republicans must get confirmed with a narrow majority. all face trump's wrath. his other selections, like defense secretary nominee pete hegseth , have not made their job easier yet. it appears many are circling around him, despite multiple scandals, just to appease trump.

how do you think these confirmation battles are going to go once they get started next year? >> well, like many americans, reverend, and many of my colleagues, i am deeply concerned about many of these possible appointments in addition to allegations of rape and misconduct. it is up to my colleagues in the senate to confirm or not confirm these appointments, quite frankly. i sincerely hope they look at who is capable of doing the job, to do the right thing for our country, and not just be rubberstamps for the trump administration. and while i do believe that president trump is a patriot, i think in the meantime we have to get beyond the rhetoric and work together to rebuild, mobilize, and push policies that are actually helping working people. the extremist policies of project 2025 will, i think, not put food on the table or even lower costs for everyday

families. they will not create more jobs or even grow the middle class. but we have seen this before, and this is what the president elect has done in the past. he likes to push the envelope. he is a provocateur. he likes pageantry. but i think these things create diversions, and it is time to see what his administration can do to work with democrats and bring us together to do what's right for the american people. >> we are out of time, but let me ask you, what do you think the priority for democrats should be this monday when they go back to work? >> i think under the leadership of hakeem jeffries and catherine clark and others, i think it's time for us to really look at districts. what may work in one region of the country may not be applicable in the industrialized midwest, or in the south, so i think we have to look at ways in which our regional differences can

coalesce around an agenda that speaks to everyday people. the appeal to even who we recruit in the future, it may have to be going to nontraditional places. you and i are very nontraditional, reverend. it may be going to someone and recruiting the adult learners, someone who comes out of a community college setting, someone who comes out of a trade setting where they went to trade school. these are everyday folks that the democratic party has been missing, and it is time for a recalibration. but we have the leadership to do it. >> all right, thank you, indiana congressman andre carson. always good to have you on. let's go from indiana to michigan. joining me now is michigan's attorney general, dana nussle. attorney general nussle, you wrote an op-ed for the detroit free press published on wednesday that says donald trump's cabinet picks show a disdain for the survivors of sexual assault. can you elaborate more on your

thesis that these nominations reduce the trauma that affects victims? >> yeah, i think it is incredible that you have so many different nominees for higher office who have had credible allegations against them for sexual assault or for aiding and abetting in sexual abuse. and i think it sends a terrible message to those who have suffered from sexual assault that it is tolerable somehow to us, that somebody could have engaged in these offenses. and then risen to higher office without consequence. >> now, you also mentioned in a piece that trump has nominated fox news personality pete hegseth to lead the department of defense. hegseth settled in an accusation that he rape a

woman and entered a nondisclosure agreement with the victim. according to the new york times, even his mother wrote him a heated email calling him a quote abuser of women in the midst of his 2018 divorce proceedings. she later reportedly disavowed those sentiments and noted that she apologized to him in a follow-up email. nbc news has not obtained either one of those emails. but this issue is expected to be a subject of scrutiny during the senate confirmation hearings. what message does it send if the senate goes through with the confirmation? >> well, i am incredulous that people who have these substantial indiscretions and character flaws, and that's really putting it mildly, right? could possibly be entertained as individuals to be part of the trump cabinet. but we had to push very hard back against this, that we will be setting back not just years, but decades, our efforts to ensure sexual assault survivors

that they have champions in the criminal justice system. and they have people who start off believing them when they make a complaint, and that these claims are properly investigated and prosecuted. and i think it's is a terrible message, honestly, as well, to judges and to juries that have to decide these cases later on, and basically it says we don't really care about the crime of sexual assault. we don't think it's that big a deal. and i would counter that it is a very, very big deal. these are heinous crimes and they should not be tolerated anywhere in our system of government. >> now, you are pushing ahead with criminal cases against republicans accused of falsely presenting themselves as presidential electors in an effort to overturn the results of the 2020 election. these allegations say it was part of a scheme to try to switch michigan's 16 electoral votes to donald trump. even though joe biden had won

the state. however, after this month's election, six of the people facing charges will now actually be michigan's gop electors. they are expected to convene at the state capital next month to officially cast michigan's electoral votes for trump and vance. what are your thoughts on where this and where does this stand within the criminal charges you are filing? >> here's how i look at it. if you'd go into a casino and you try your hand at blackjack, and you lose, so you tried to rob the casino, i'm going to charge you with that. it does not matter that maybe four years later you somehow get back into that same casino, and this time you win and you just peacefully go home with your winnings. it does not absolve you of the crime that you tried to commit four years ago. and i'm not dropping the charges.

i brought these pieces because i believe these people were guilty of the crimes for which they are alleged to have committed. and just because their candidate happened to win this time does not make them any less guilty of the crime they committed four years ago. but even more than that, you know, the damage that they did to people's beliefs and our system of elections, we used the exact same procedures, policies, laws, and election equipment as we did last time, and i did not hear them complaining about there being fraud in the system this time when their candidate won. you can't only love democracy and only support free and fair elections when your candidate is the winning candidate. >> let me raise this. trumps immigration advisers are reportedly discussing plans to enlist local law enforcement to help the federal government deport undocumented immigrants, with talks of him also planning to give rewards to jurisdictions

that cooperate and retribution for those that don't. from a legal perspective, how is this going to be funded, and would that take away resources from other vital community matters like those we just talked about earlier, for example, the sexual assault, and human trafficking prevention? >> yeah, i'm really worried about it. we have a finite number of law enforcement resources, and we have many partnerships and work together at the local and state and federal levels. and again, we fight very, very serious crimes, like sexual assault, like human trafficking, like solving cold case homicides. and when you detract from those resources and you instead focus on other offenses that in some cases, of course, are pretty

minor. we are talking about, for people who are here undocumented, a misdemeanor offense. you are necessarily letting serial killer is run free and murderers and other people that have committed some really heinous crimes that are incredibly disruptive to our state and also create safety hazards in the community. and you can't do everything, right? so to focus on those much lesser offenses that don't necessarily hurt people in our communities, i think it's going to be really damaging from a safety level. and i think we are going to see serious crimes escalate as a result. >> lastly, looking ahead to the rest of the holiday season, you are warning against predatory scams through websites and text messages as holiday shopping picks up for the next month, let's say. black friday sales have continued into this weekend, and we can expect more deals from cyber monday. what advice do you have to

avoid these elaborate scanning methods for our viewers? >> well, people should know and understand the risks, right? there are people who are out there in full force, trying to separate you from your money. and you got to be careful, right? that means that any links that get sent to you during the course of your shopping adventures online, be careful not to be clicking on things that are just sent to you out of the blue. and to make sure that you are always going to the right websites. remember, when you enter something into a search engine and as soon as you google something you are going to see pop-ups all over your device, you're going to see things that come up in your social media feed that are exactly what you've been searching for, and my advice is to please don't click directly on this. if you want to, go separately to those websites and look around a little bit. but don't click on anything

that comes to you directly, because you don't know if it's a scam. >> all right, michigan state attorney general, thank you for being with us. up next, the white woman who shot and killed a black mother of four will serve 25 years in prison. after the break i will speak with aj owens mother about how she is making sure others who kill innocent, unarmed victims are held accountable in florida.

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welcome back to politics nation. one of the saddest eulogies i have ever given as head of national action network and as a minister was that of aj owens, a 35-year-old florida mother of four who was killed in 2023 by her neighbor, susan lawrence, who shot owens

through a screen door during an escalating dispute involving owens's children. earlier this week owens lawrence was sentenced to 25 years in prison three months after she was convicted of manslaughter for owens's killing. joining me now is pamela diaz, aj owens's mother. ms. diaz, first of all, my thanks to you joining us this evening, i appreciate you doing this, having gotten to know you and aj's family, her children, and you, we know that no prison sentence can restore an innocent life. i have to ask, what went through your mind when you saw that the woman who killed your daughter was sentenced to 25 years in prison? >> well, the first thing i thought about was this death,

this killing, this loss of life, my daughter losing her life, the children losing their mother, should've never happened from the get-go. that was somewhat with the sentencing, and that the justice system did work, that she was held accountable for her actions. although i had hoped for the maximum, but it was a step in the right direction with the 25 years. and again, it just reiterated the fact that my daughter and the children's mom should still be here amongst us. >> now, it rings me to aj's children, who have gotten to meet, especially when i came to the funeral, who were the center of the tensions between the daughter and miss lawrence. can you tell us what they have expressed about the sentencing?

>> israel, as we call him, is he, he was the one that was standing with his mom when she was shot and killed. this kid is incredible. so, he had a lot of questions, and i tried to be as honest as i could with them. but he was happy, with a light in his voice, his eyes. he said something very powerful . he said he does not fear susan . even if she was released sooner, because we talk about what it means to have authority over our feelings and emotions. and he will not let anyone take anything else from us. those were his words at hearing that susan had been sentenced for 25 years. >> i've met him, you have come and brought him to national

action network events after we did the funeral and help the family. launch a fund to ease financial burdens for families affected by racial violence as yours has been. you called it standing in the gap, and it will also go towards advocating for legislation to repeal florida's stand your ground law, which lawrence legal team invoked in her defense. our audience may remember that if someone reasonably believes they are threatened by the use of deadly force against them, they can use deadly force to defend themselves. that was the defense zimmerman used in the favor on trade on martin case. can you talk more about why you want to have this wall repealed instead of revised? >> it is an archaic law, and i feel that many racist people

stand behind that law in terms of shooting people of color. there are studies out there that have shown that to be true. and in this case, susan evoked her standing the ground law, and it took four days for an arrest, when clearly that was not the issue. my daughter was not trying to get inside of her home. she did not have a weapon. she was not a threat. in fact, she asked susan to come outside so that she could speak with her. so again, this is just a tool, a weapon to justify unnecessary killings, and unfortunately, it is people of color who are affected by this law.

>> i met you at the funeral, and we had you come to national action network convention and headquarters a couple of times and work with other families. you met other families and have really done some real, i would say partnering with them, dealing with how all of you have gone through this grief. you started this fund and others have started funds, none of which national action network is involved in the funds, but involved in the fight. how does it make you feel when you are bonding with victims families that are similar to aj. does that bonding kind of, because only you and people that have experienced things like you, you had to literally relocate from your job to florida to raise your grandchildren, because their mother was killed. you had other mothers and family members that have the experience. do you get strength by dealing

with other victims families? >> it is a bond that we share, that no one can understand. i will never be able to express my feelings or emotions with anyone as i can with other people who have, other mothers who have experienced this type of loss. often we call each other and sometimes we just sit there in silence or we cry. i have cried on the mother of ahmad aubrey many times. the mother of terry nichols. they have held me. we hold each other up. and this is one of the things that i did have to relocate. and it was a struggle.

it was something that i was not prepared. and this is one of the things that we are hoping that the funds will help other families in life situations. help them with relocation. help them with any type of financial burden, funeral, burial expenses. it is intended to be a rapid response, a rapid reimbursement. but again, this is a club, a sisterhood, a fatherhood, a brotherhood, a fraternity, a sorority that only those who have experiences can truly understand. >> and you have been courageous and strong, as the other mothers and some cases fathers have been throughout this, and whatever support you get i am sure you are going to be

telling that story along with people like attorney ben crump, who was there with you. pamela diaz, thank you for being with us. the mother of aj owens, thank you again for sharing this week with us. coming up, some people are returning to their homes after a cease-fire deal between israel and lebanon, but will we see the same on the gaza front? we will head to jerusalem from the latest on the ground after the break. the break. ♪♪ over 600,000 usps employees working in sync to ensure everything sent on its holiday ride ends with a moment of joy. ♪♪ the united states postal service.

it's time for the main event: wayfair's black friday savings spectacular is here! ♪♪ right now, get up to 80% off furniture and cookware, holiday decor, and more at wayfair's lowest prices of the year! plus, score 24-hour flash deals you have to see to believe! and get free shipping on everything! save up to 80% off wayfair's black friday savings spectacular! now through december 2nd! ♪ wayfair. every style. every home. ♪ welcome back to politics nation. some positive, hopeful, and optimistic moves out of the middle east. it is day four of the cease- fire between israel and hezbollah in lebanon, and it appears to be holding. joining me now from jerusalem is nbc's hala gorani. israel

lebanon both accused each other of minor violations of the cease-fire, but it seems that many residents are moving back to their homes. what is the latest? >> many residents in lebanon are, indeed, moving back to their homes. it is not the case, really, in northern israel yet. northern communities have been told their prime minister that it is too early to do so, that there is still a risk involved. but the lebanese, in many cases, don't have a choice. they were displaced, they had nowhere to stay, they were not really, for many of them, staying in hotels. they were made homeless. and what they have returned to has sometimes been a pile of rubble, not a home. an nbc news investigation, and fact, found that in the area occupied by the israeli military, there have been about 6000 structures destroyed, and in some cases entire villages

leveled. so it's going to be a very difficult, long process for the people of southern lebanon to be able to rebuild their lives and rebuild their homes, quite literally. and as you said, this cease-fire appears to be holding. there were a few minor violations reported by both sides. but right now it is relatively calm. certainly a lot calmer than it has been over the last few months. >> so, president biden says he will focus on securing a cease- fire deal in gaza. with turkey, egypt, qatar, israel, and others in the coming days. today the terrorist organization hamas has released a video showing an american israeli citizen who is among the hostages being held for more than 400 days. what is the latest on the possibility of a cease-fire on that front? >> yeah, so this is a new hamas video showing hostage eight and

alexander, he is 20 years old. he was taken october 7th, he was an idf soldier, from his post outside of government. and i spoke to his mother today. she is urging the prime minister, but also president biden and american leaders in general to do more to get a deal to get her son and the 100 other hostages still held in gaza out of the besieged enclave . now, as far as hopes for a deal, even though israel just struck a cease-fire agreement with hezbollah, and there have been attempts, it has to be said, timid attempts at restarting negotiations, for example, there are representatives of hamas, islamic jihad, in cairo right now. the expectation that there might be a deal around the corner for an end to the war in

gaza is still quite low. though, with president-elect trump about to take office and reports that he might want to put pressure on benjamin netanyahu to make sure there is no active war going on while he is in office, perhaps that will be the pressure that the israeli prime minister needs to agree to a deal to get the hostages out and also in the war in gaza. >> all right, nbc correspondent hala gorani. thank you for your reporting from jerusalem. coming up, as small businesses across the country brace for the impact of trump's tariffs , democrats are looking ahead, ready to vote on a new chair in a few months. we will be right back. new exciting additions. and they discovered that when they mixed their scents. ♪♪ they were more than just soulmates.

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susan, i want to start with you. on trump's day one priority as president. it tariffs. despite his 25% tax threat on all canadian products that come in to the u.s., canada's president, justin trudeau, said

he and trump had a quote excellent conversation this weekend. official details on the matter told the associated press that topics included trade, border security, and fentanyl. how should we be reading into this? should consumers be concerned that prices of basic necessities, gas, food, electronics will go up? >> certainly, if the tariffs went into effect at that level, we should all be very concerned. and i think the markets would be very shaken by it. however, when that news came out, we really did not see very much change in the markets whatsoever. there was a little hit against the mexican peso, against the dollar. the reason why that didn't happen was because we have seen this story before. and so have the markets. donald trump threatens tariffs,

and especially when it came to mexico, he did it in 2019, and he said we are going to put tariffs on it unless you do something about the border. and mexico, seven days later, made some promises to then president trump. i expect we are going to see similar things. there's a lot of bluster that comes out of trump's mouth, but he also knows, with this kind of tariff, what it will do to the u.s. economy, and he does not want to come out of the gate, in my opinion, starting out with higher gas prices, inflation increasing, and the markets turning against him. that is the thing, it is his ego and you know how he likes his poll numbers. i think that is what would prevent him from going full 25%. >> small businesses are staring down big fears about trump's's tariff proposals. one california small business owner told nbc news she is hoping her chinese suppliers can turn out a single $200,000 order for 2025. then get it through the u.s.

ports, all before trump takes office. she makes non-toxic cups and lunch boxes for kids, by the way. could invoking this type of fear on people's livelihoods backfire? >> of course it could. especially if he goes through with it. because when you have these types of moves from businesses, it shows that they are scared, but it also is impacting their books on a way that is negative and harmful. susan went through the impacts of the rise of gas costs, but i also want to emphasize the rise in alcohol costs, or produce costs like avocados, or the cost of cars. these are all things that are big imports from mexico and canada. and i think, when we think about it, it is not isolated to those dollars that will be coming out of the pocketbooks of americans. but also jobs. think about how the hospitality industry or the automotive industry could be impacted by these types of tariffs.

i think there is something to be said about yes, there is bluster coming out of trump. but if he keeps on saying i'm going to do this on january 20th and we see these mixed messages coming from these conversation report outs, especially the one you just highlighted with justin trudeau out of canada, i think we are all having people right on the edge of their seats, it is still an unhealthy posture even if he does not go through with it. >> susan, we already know the names of trump appointed or inked for positions in his cabinet so far. and as the new york times describes it, his choices have reaffirmed for democrats and others that civil servants will be replaced with his own loyal servants instead. you even write that his secretary of state pick marco rubio may be the only adult in the entire cabinet. so, with just 51 days to go

until he enters the white house, will trump declaring war on the federal government work? >> well, in many ways he has already declared war against the federal government workers by the people he is putting into the positions to lead those government agencies. beyond that, it is, there is a lot of lawsuits that would have to go through to really implement the type of change that 2025 and donald trump has mentioned. that is the good news. also, you know how government is. if they want to move a slow roll on something, boy, can they do it. and the fact is that just putting in political employees does not ensure they know how to do the job. i would be much more concerned about social security checks actually getting out, having the workers who know how to do those types of things. so yes, do i think it can happen over the four years? yes. you may see some of it. but i don't think it will be on an epic proportion.

>> now, one nita, with all this going on, the democratic national committee leadership vote is now set for february 1st. in your recent book, you have written about the blueprint of diane carole and shirley chisholm mapped out to reshape politics. what are your thoughts as to who should be the next chair of the democratic national committee, and what kind of leadership should the dnc have for the next two years? >> luck, i feel like based on the announced candidates for the dnc chair position there is a shift within the democratic party away from women leadership, away from diverse leadership, as the announced candidates are only white men thus far. i say thus far, because there is still an opportunity for additional candidates to jump into that dnc leadership role. but i appreciate you emphasizing shirley chisholm in this case, because she had a very clear prescription about how the party should move

forward, even after her own lost back in 1972, that still applies to today. this is going to take inculcation, reorientation, and education. so democrats have to focus on learning lessons from this election cycle without losing sight of their values, and then the entire process of reorientation, educating the voters in the public every step of the way. that was one of the big gaps in 2024 about the connection and the communication of a clear vision, and while i am sure democrats running for the chair position are going to be focused on fighting back against trump, fighting back against some of the extremist policies, they have to carve out a lane to communicate an explicit, positive vision of what they want to do in the driver seat for this country. >> as you know, i worked as a teenager in shirley chisholm's presidential campaign. maybe we should get a copy of your book to all the dnc members. >> i would not be opposed, and i got to say, happy 100th

birthday to shirley chisholm, today would've been that day. >> all right, thank you to msnbc political analyst juanita tolliver and susan del percio. up next, my final thoughts about my thanksgiving . stay with us. repairs as well as the leading luxury bonding brand. stronger, healthier hair, without the $60 price tag. if you know, you know it's pantene. (♪♪) today, you can give a gift like no other. a gift that can help st. jude children's research hospital save lives. i think it's the most worthwhile place to put your money when it comes to childhood cancer. if it weren't for st. jude, i wouldn't be sitting here today. if it weren't for st. jude, a lot of kids wouldn't be with their families every day. let's come together to help the children of st. jude fight childhood cancer visit this website, call this number, or scan the qr code with your $19 monthly donation. join with your debit or credit card right now,

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on thursday, thanksgiving day, national action network got out and fed hundreds of people in harlem and brooklyn. those that were homeless, those that were needy. some seniors who just don't have family in new york. because we wanted to share with others. i don't do it from some lofty place. i do it because i was a kid that watched a single mother on welfare, domestic worker, put things together to make sure my sister and i had thanksgiving dinner. i also remember her taking me and letting me see people like adam clayton powell and others,

and i looked up to them and see in them at that young age that i could try to be somebody like that, that cared about me. which is why it was important. people like mayor eric adams and public advocate giovanni williams, city controller, all came together. and in brooklyn, u.s. attorney damon williams and his family came and spent time that day for others. it's not about, to me, on thanksgiving day, what you read. it's about who you help to make sure they eat. and that they have role models to look up to. that does it for me, thanks for watching. i will see you back here tomorrow at 5:00 p.m. eastern for another live our of politics nation. the saturday show with jonathan capehart starts after a short break.

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