donald trump isn't even president yet, but the chaos has already begun. trump and his copresident elon musk are into a tailspin and nearly sent the government into

holiday shutdown but in the end, democrats kind of saved the day. who better to talk to today than the democrat leader hakeem jeffries. leader jeffries is standing by for an exclusive interview, he is coming up first, and i have so many questions. x [ music ] welcome everyone, i think it is pretty safe to say it was quite a chaotic week here in washington. it was also a very educational week, you could say, because we learned a whole lot about what is coming and how the republican party plans to govern. for starters, we learned that elon musk is pretty powerful. i mean, was really the spark that lit the whole dumpster fire of this week. on wednesday, after house speaker mike johnson did a little dealmaking with democrats and can forward with a bipartisan spending bill that would keep the government open, a good thing, the richest man in the world took to the social media platform he owns and fired off over 150 posts about the bill. many of them completely false.

i will talk about that later in the show. demanding that republicans abandon the deal. and guess what? many of them did point. those tweets from moore torpedoed the original bipartisan agreement and set up a mad scramble in the house to come up with a new one. in the meantime, democrats started highlighting what had become obvious to basically everyone watching. >> welcome to the elon musk presidency point >> it is donald trump and president musk blew up what was a bipartisan agreement. >> president elon musk. >> president musk. >> president musk point >> elon musk who everybody is now calling president musk. >> is elon musk is kind of cosplaying copresident here, i don't know why trump doesn't just hand him the oval office. >> now that drumbeat certainly got the happy couple's attention. musk felt the need to go back on x and say it was the media

who was trying to drive a wedge between him and trump. also declaring it wouldn't work. it trump spokesperson even felt the need to clarify that the actual president-elect is in fact the leader of the republican party. i promise you, that is not exactly a statement you want to have to make. so, president musk tanked the original bill, everyone got super offensive, and in an attempt to prove he could make demands as well, trump himself got in the mix, and said any new bill must do away with the federal debt ceiling. now, as a side note, he basically doesn't let the blame of raising the debt limit while he is president, and he wants to be able to spend and cut taxes for rich folks like a drunken sailor when he gets into office, that's what this is all about, that piece. in fact, he felt so strongly about that point that you said any republican who didn't vote to raise the debt ceiling should be primaried, which by the way is one of his favorite threats these days, he is throwing it out nearly every day. so, there was a new vote on thursday, one that included trump's demands, and 38

republicans voted against it. 38 republicans heard that threat from trump and basically shrub. so, it was on to plan c at that point which finally got underway on friday night just hours before the government would have shut down. the house split it into three parts, want to keep the government "want to provide aid to disaster areas, and want to provide aid to farmers. what it did not include was that demand from trump on the debt ceiling. and yet, even though that wasn't included, 170 republicans still voted for it. so this time, 170 republicans heard that threat from donald trump about primaries and 170 republicans basically shrugged, and that is very, very notable. and for trump, it is very, very embarrassing but still, after that series of bills passed on friday night, i was kind of waiting and wondering how trump was going to try to spin it as some grand victory. i was wondering, i mean, how would you take an embarrassment like that and somehow make it

seem like that is what he wanted all along? but it never came, nothing, new tweets, new truths, no reaction whatsoever, and that is pretty notable, too. now, elon musk did send out a tweet taking credit for turning a bill that weighed pounds into a bill that weight ounces. to be clear, he is literally referring to the number of pages. also to be clear here, there were a few things that were cut from the original bipartisan bill -- that were in the original bipartisan bill that you would have appreciated. i'm going to pull this up here because i want to make sure i get this right, from the actual list of things. first of all, a fix for stolen food stamp funds, cracking down on junkies like hidden hotel fees, criminalizing some deep fake images, i have more. they also cut funding for research on the premature labor, on the treatment of sickle cell disease, and on early detection for breast and cervical cancer. wait, there's more. they also did away with ensuring that providers of internet service for rural areas

weren't ripping off customers. i mean, can you believe that? that is a lot. they also cut funding for a program that helps the 9/11 responders and survivors, and the cut enhanced funding for community health centers, which typically has bipartisan support. oh, and also, by the way, they even cast aside funding for childhood cancer research, which was only saved by the senate late on friday night. it is also worth pointing out here that there would have been no deal if it weren't for the democrats, who unlike republicans were a cop is very much on the same page. in the end, not a single democrat voted no on the final package. just listen to how democratic leader akim jeffries, who i am about to talk to, framed it on friday night. >> house democrats have successfully funded the government. house democrats have successfully stopped extreme maga republicans from shutting down the government. crashing the economy and hurting

working-class americans all across the land. >> so, an incredibly hectic week, one where elon musk's power over the republican caucus was on full display, donald trump's power it seemed to be shakier than ever, and chaos was basically the only constant. look, part of the reason that trump was elected is because the american people felt like there was a better answer, that the system, that the government wasn't working for them. but what became clear this week is that what the american people are going to get is the world's richest man meddling in congress, an open question about who is really running the government, and a republican party that really doesn't seem to have its act together, so maybe the system wasn't perfect, it really never is, but the new system isn't looking so great after all. joining me now is house democratic leader akim jeffries

. in addition to his day job, later jeffries is also the author of a brand-new children's book called the abcs of democracy. i know people watching are doing last minute christmas shopping, this is a perfect thing to buy them. hello, leader jeffries, great to see you. i just want to start by asking you -- i just gave my take on what a chaotic, hectic week this was, where democrats essentially saved the day, but what did you learn from this week? >> well, it was important for the american people to see the beginnings of what is going to take place over the next two to four years, which is chaos, dysfunction, and extremism, and a republican party that is not really interested in helping out working-class americans, but is really determined to not to massive tax cuts for the wealthy, the well-off, and well- connected corporations. that was the centerpiece of donald trump and elon musk's demand with respect to recklessly trying to suspend the debt ceiling and secure a four to $5 trillion blank check

. thankfully, we stop that from happening. >> it's been quite a week, and one of the things i talked about a bit here, leader jeffries, is that elon musk -- we saw elon musk take kind of a powerful role in his power over the republican caucus. that surprised me, i guess, maybe it shouldn't have been did anything about how he wielded his power surprise you? >> well, many people throughout the capitol are saying that he has perhaps emerged as the leader of the republican party moving forward. and we will have to see how that plays itself out over the next few weeks, next few months, and next few years. as house democrats, our position is simple, there are three things that we should all be focused on in connection with the american people. first, lowering costs. second, bigger paychecks for

hard-working american taxpayers. and third, securing safer communities. that is going to be our northstar moving forward, and we will see whether the incoming administration is prepared to join us on behalf of the american people. >> i listened to a number of them, pieces that were in this bipartisan agreement, that were stripped out of the bill before it went to the senate. some of them were saved in the senate, but because of the whole chaos of this week, there have been questions about whether mike johnson is at risk of not being the speaker of the house in a couple of weeks. what do you think? >> i think that is a real risk, and there will be no democrats available to save him or the extreme maga republicans from themselves, based on the reaching of a bipartisan agreement that reflected priorities that were good for the american people. we are going to have to continue to work on several of

those as we move forward, including doubling up resources for community health centers, which is a bipartisan priority that republicans walked away from, even though it benefits people in urban america, rural america, small-town america, the heartland of america, as well as appellee shut, but we will have the ability to wage those battles over the next few weeks and the next few months, given that this is only a short- term continuing resolution that will expire on march 14th. >> and that means that vote, just for everybody paying attention at home, is going to come up again, there's going to be a need to raise the debt limit, to keep the government funded. i just listened to how there were 170 republicans were more than that who voted for this bill, even though trump was threatening primaries. you are in the minority last time, not in as powerful of a position, to think that he has

lost a hold on the caucus that he had before? >> that is an open question and it will be very interesting, but that certainly is one of the narratives that perhaps has emerged over the last few days, in terms of what we saw in the congress, a willingness by some of my colleagues, including far right extremists in the house republican conference, to defy donald trump around the debt ceiling. in particular. which means that notwithstanding their plan to stick the american people with trillions of dollars of debt in order to jam tax cuts down the throats of the american people, in part by cutting social security and medicare benefits that democrats will remain united in pushing back against that, and donald trump is going to have to find the votes for that reckless scheme amongst house republicans and house republicans alone. >> is there anything from navigating -- being in the minority during a first term that you are applying now as

leader of the caucus? >> it's important for us to stay calm, stay present at all times, because the margin is going to be extremely narrow during the first 100 days of the new administration. the margins will be about 217 republicans and 215 democrats. even at full strength, house republicans will be at 220, we will be at 215. that is the narrowest majority of any party since 1931. and so, we have got to stay calm through all of the turbulence that the republicans are going to try to visit on the american people, in order to defend our working american taxpayers. we have to be present in washington to make sure that our leverage can shine through on behalf of the american people, and we of course have to stay unified in fighting for the things that matter, which first and foremost is to lower costs for everyday americans,

for working-class americans, and for middle-class americans. >> one of the pieces that came out of the november election that i don't think has gotten enough attention is that democratic house candidates outperformed the top of the ticket, which i think as we are looking for bright lines or lessons to be learned, is an important thing to reflect on. why do you think that was and how does that inform how you and other party leaders are thinking about the best messengers for the party moving forward? >> we have incredible members of the house democratic caucus who are returning, who are in battleground districts all across the nation, and we are overwhelmingly successful. we have some red to blue candidates who were able to defeat republicans. in fact, in this most recent election, we flipped a total of 10 republican held seats this year, and we were able to hold some tough districts as well, and i think it was in part because

all of our members and all of our candidates focused on quality of life issues. lowering gas prices, lowering grocery prices, lowering the cost of housing, which is a challenge that impacts americans all across the country, and we are able to overcome a national environment that was more adverse than what we expected but it is also important to note, jen, as you know, that in the last trump presidency, when the former president took office in january 2017, there were 241 republicans and only 100 -- 194 democrats. so, the margin this time is going to be entirely different, and that is why we are going to fight as hard as we can to deliver real results for the american people, and protect the things that matter, like social security, medicare, and of course, a woman's freedom to make her own reproductive health care decisions.

>> i think people are really happy to hear all of those priorities. so, you have this new book, i mentioned it at the top, i have it for my kids, it is called a disease of democracy, it is based on the first speech you gave us democratic leader, which people can find, we will repost it, too. you went letter by letter through the alphabet, i'm sure that to planning, to talk about what the democratic party stands for. it was a memorable speech, but tell us what you hope young people get out of this book. >> well, it is an illustrated book for people of all ages, and certainly, i am hopeful that younger americans will have an opportunity to process that elections, and elections go, presidents, and presidents go, but there are american values, american institutions, american ideas that have endured over a 240 year period that have made this country the greatest democracy in the history of the world but i was in part inspired by my younger days, growing up on schoolhouse rock, and just thought that

these are principles that we have to continue to bring to life for the next generation of americans. >> i hope it is a good generation, we have a lot of hope in them. before i let you go, we are all getting ready for christmas, what are you most looking forward to this christmas? you rarely get a break. >> looking forward to spending some time with family, spending some time in the community, spending some time in church, and watching the knicks. >> that sounds like quite a full holiday. thank you so much, leader jeffries, i know you have quite a busy year ahead, i hope you come back and talk to us all about it, and merry christmas to you and your family. >> thank you. democratic leader hakeem jeffries, perfect person to talk to in this moment. coming up, we just heard from jeffries, of course, but we should also hear what republicans are saying about house speaker mike johnson. punch bowls melanie is one of the best reporters on capitol hill. doug was a top adviser to republicans in both the house and senate, they both join me here at the table in just a

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>> reporter: so, just a month ago, house speaker mike johnson was kind of riding high. fresh off donald trump's victory in november, it seems like he finally made it to the cool kids table. and he wanted people to know he made it to the cool kids table. here's the photo they posted from the army-navy game last week. he was in the box with donald trump and elon musk. if you weren't sure, you can see it in the collage there. same thing after ufc fight in new york city last month, lots of pictures coming from johnson's account. ufc at mst was epic, he wrote. here is another photo from that same night where johnson was literally hovering over a table on transplant that only had seats for trump, musk, vance, and rfk. maybe he hadn't quite made it

to the cool kids table yet, he was close. you've got to hand it to him, he was nearby, he was on the plane, but what a difference one spending fight can make on where you stand in the world but after that bipartisan deal fell apart this week, nbc's garrett asked trump if he still had confidence in mike johnson. trump responded with a party we will see. not exactly a ringing endorsement, that's how i heard it at least. just listen to us how some other republicans in the maga verse talked about johnson this week. lexi has got to go, he has got to go. president trump supports him until he doesn't support him. >> he is a good man, he is a friend, he has been a friend for a long time, great person. he has lost control of this process. i don't know how he can remain in power. we need a elon or vivek as speaker. betsy is a friend and you just threw him overboard. politics is tough, senator. >> it is. >> how frustrated are you with speaker johnson? that's how does it sound? x well, that doesn't sound great.

if you are listening to that and your speaker johnson. melanie, senior congressional reporter punch bowl news, whose twitter feed i was refreshing constantly this week. doug is a top adviser to republican lawmakers in both the house and the senate was also communications director for the rnc, both join me here at the table. anytime you say so and so is a nice person, but -- bless their heart. melanie, you have been doing tons of reporting on the hill, i just talked to leader jeffries about this, you indicated, yes, his speakership could be at risk. >> mike johnson is in trouble, let's be clear about that. the dynamic around his political future has changed dynamically in the last week, and a huge reason is because of trump. he was really banking on the idea that donald trump was in his corner, he was saying nice things about him, and that's really why my numbers were lining up him, people like marjorie taylor greene, previous critic, who said i will vote for him because trump likes him and we want to get

stuff done. now it is a different scenario because of those things like you said, we will see. he is not happy, and told him the scenes, he has been really upset with what down with mike johnson, so johnson is going to have some serious work to do to win these people over, and i think it really comes down to what donald trump does, and that is the risk of putting all your eggs in the donald trump market because he is so mercurial, and you just don't know, he could come out and say i want jim jordan and i think members would try to listen to him and bubbly fall in line. we will see what happens in a few weeks. the only reason i am a little skeptical he will ultimately not become speaker is because if you don't elect a speaker, you can't certify election results, you can't do anything in the house. it was different when it was mccarthy, it was different when it was joe biden in the white house but i think perhaps there will really be an effort to get his speakership through quickly, but we will just have to wait and see. >> there are kind of comparisons to kevin mccarthy and that whole scenario because it was a spending fight. no, trump also lost, he was

threatening primary fights and 170 republicans still voted for the final package, so i don't know if that means he still has a lot of power or he doesn't, but people always say bless their hearts if somebody can get the votes. can somebody else get the votes or what is the alternative here? x if you remember, it was less than two years ago, mike johnson wasn't on anybody's radar. he was vice chair of the republican conference and there were so many stories of this unknown mike johnson. well, if you don't pay attention to capitol hill, most people don't, you don't know who mike johnson is. and then that shortlist is really short. and this is where i think republicans will find themselves if donald trump says something against mike johnson. if he doesn't, mike johnson is smooth sailing. obviously, it is a narrow vote but he will be fine. but the problem is for republicans, they're always trying to score points with donald trump. donald trump doesn't give points, he only takes them away, one at a time. elon musk is another character here, thrown out as potential speaker of the house, i am not sure i buy that.

but i do want to play something mike johnson said about elon musk, and we will talk about it. >> elon musk and i talked within about an hour ago, and we talked about the extraordinary challenges of this job, and i said, hey, you want to be speaker of the house ? i don't know. he said this may be the hardest job in the world, i think it is. but we are going to get through this. x okay, so this is a serious question because this is the kind of think that people who don't live and breathe politics like us asked all the time in the last couple days, is the elon musk for speakership thing a real thing? >> it is not. technically, you don't have to be a member of the house to become speaker of the house. we have seen people like marjorie taylor greene floating this idea. what i'm taking away from the is they are looking at other options. i think that is a bad sign for mike johnson that this is even being floated out there, and just more big picture, it mike johnson is the speaker, it is very clear he is going to have to do a musk in the same way he deals with donald trump, which is getting his approval for

everything, making sure they are in lockstep with you so what happened when he didn't get the approval for that initial spending bill, and then musk blew it up on twitter. so, i think musk is going to be a huge headache for the gop leadership over these next few years, and that is partially their own fault, they elevated him, they put him in this position, and the republicans are taking their cues from musk and not mike johnson and that is a problem. >> [ inaudible ] let me ask you, one of the things that a number of republicans -- you are familiar with the republican party and the caucus, it is a very narrow majority they have your, a number came out and said i'm not supporting this, and said they won't ever vote to raise the debt limit. some will vote for extending the high end tax cuts and say they are deficit hawks, this is not a time we are going to debate that, but what do you anticipate from seeing how many voted for this spending package? trump threatened primary opponents. there's going to be another spending bill package in march. what did this teach you about what to look for next year?

>> we use all these trends like maga and house freedom caucus and so forth. the people who voted for this are ogt party, we haven't used that term in a long time. and that strain is still there, and that is what we saw in this boat, and i think so often, when we look at things with donald trump, you can defy donald trump if you are doing so on policy reasons. you can't do it on things that are very trump court centric. right? build the wall, you have to support building the wall. obviously, investigations, you start to see words like sham and all of that. but when it comes to policy, look at marco rubio in china for instance. he was against donald trump almost every step of the way on china, he is now a secretary of state. if it is on policy, you can defy trump but if it is on trump, you can't. x and he is also not married to many policies, so i think it makes it easier for republicans

on some of these issues but >> loyalty, the number one thing he is looking for. melanie, doug, thank you both so much, happy holidays. i appreciate you both being here. coming up, we will take a look into the week that was elon musk, president musk, whatever you want to call him. a quick scan of his social media. tells an alarming story about what comes next. we will be talking about it more after a quick break. >> [ music ] . >> [ music ] good to go binge-watch. ♪♪ good to go out even later. ♪♪ with cabenuva, there's no pausing for daily hiv pills. for adults who are undetectable, cabenuva is the only complete, long-acting hiv treatment you can get every other month. it's two injections from a healthcare provider, as few as 6 times a year. don't take cabenuva if you're allergic to its ingredients, or taking certain medicines, that may interact. serious side effects include allergic reactions or rash, post-injection reactions, liver problems, and depression. if these occur, get medical help right away. tell your doctor about your medicines or supplements, medical conditions, liver or kidney problems, mental health, pregnancy, and breastfeeding.

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and t-mobile will give you a brand-new iphone 16 pro with apple intelligence on us. plus, families can save 20% when they switch. t-mobile is one of none. go get that. what he said! given the events of this week, which we have been talking about already all show, it didn't feel worse spending some time digging into the sheer political influence of the richest men in the world. donald trump's unelected billionaire backer, elon musk. now, as we mentioned earlier, musk inserted himself right in the middle of a spending fight on capitol hill this week. on wednesday night after a bipartisan deal had been negotiated and announced, musk and bailey began railing publicly against the bill. you might know he posted a ton about the bill. what you might not know is he posted a ton of things that were completely false.

he said that the original bill funded a bio weapons lab, it didn't. he reposted a claim that the bill contained $60 billion for ukraine, as well as mask and vaccine mandates, it didn't. musk also reposted a claim that the bill included $3 billion for a new football stadium in d.c., didn't include that either. but musk, the richest man in the world and the owner of the social media site formerly known as twitter got what he wanted, and house republicans killed the bill. and i don't know who needs to hear this, but an unelected billionaire with a lot of government contracts appearing to call the shots in congress is not exactly a healthy sign of democracy. by the way, all that fear mongering republicans and the right-wing have pushed about liberal billionaire donors like george soros all seems pretty rich right now, considering what elon musk has been up to over just the last couple of days. i mean, right now, musk is basically flaunting his influence in order to bully elected lawmakers and government officials. he has singled out relatively unknown federal officials and

workers whose jobs he wants to cut, and he has already warned republicans standing in his entranceway that he will find primary challenges against them, that is one of their favorite threats these days. and as we look at all that influence, i think it is important to point out that his actual positions are at times indiscernible from your average a red pill poster on for chan. he has said that the woke mind virus is a threat to modern civilization, he has repeatedly echoed the white supremacist rate replacement theory, he said that europe is headed towards the civil war due to the arrival of refugees, and this week, even expressed support for a far right already in germany. in the midst of a spending fight in washington, musk tweeted that only the aft can save germany. now, for those of you who don't know, the af the promotes an ethanol nationalist and islamophobic message. it's you wing and has been confirmed as extremists. some of its leaders had broken german laws by repeating slogans, and it has ties with

known ne-yo nazis. that is the kind of thing that elon musk has decided to promote to his $200 million, that is what he is using his platform four. like i said, in some ways, there is not much that separates musk from a run-of- the-mill internet troll. he spreads misinformation, he celebrates extremism, he does it to basically stir the pot. the only difference, and this is a big one, is he is also the richest man on earth, who owns and operates one of the biggest social media megaphones in the world, and who basically controls the president-elect of the united states. and that, my friends, is a very dangerous combination. coming up, donald trump is enlisting the help of house republicans in his retribution campaign, and they are setting their sights on ms. cheney. trump was posting about it today, and former acting general neil is standing by, we will be right back. >> [ music ] >> [ music ] — i don't want to wr my contracture to get worse.

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so, one of the things that was overshadowed by the spending fight in congress this week is that house republicans are already trying to help trump deliver on his promise of retribution in his second term. in a report released this week, they called for an fbi investigation into former congresswoman liz cheney, basically accusing her of witness tampering, among other things in the connection of testimony with cassidy hutchinson. now, the problem, as you might imagine, is that the allegations

don't pass the smell test. of course they don't. in fact, their case is so flimsy, it is already falling apart under scrutiny, but that is not exactly the point here, because i don't think these republicans care. their goal is to tee up, i think, a federal investigation of liz cheney under false pretenses, which would save trump the trouble of ordering one himself. of course, trump is also pushing these accusations, characterizing them today as a gracious and unthinkable acts of crime, which they definitely are not. joining me now is our friend and former acting u.s. solicitor general, the best explainer out there, neal katyal. okay, this allegation against liz cheney is pretty baseless, we have said that, everybody has said that, but i think it is really important for our viewers to understand why. >> so, it is kind of nuts, jen, to think that the one crime that occurred around january 6 was not the hundreds of people who invaded the capitol or the leadership that led to that insurrection, but rather the crime was the investigation into january 6, but that's what

this house report evidently says, that cassidy hutchinson, one of the witnesses against trump, had counseled, and that liz cheney ignored her council and just went and talked directly to cassidy hutchinson, procured another lawyer for cassidy hutchinson and the like. this is just bogus. it is true that there is a crime in the statute book, 1622, that borrows someone from procuring another person to commit perjury. here, all this cheney did was say to cassidy hutchinson, hey, you have got a trope affiliated lawyer who evidently is not letting you tell the truth, here's a list of some other lawyers who could represent you. that is not witness tampering. witness tampering is when you are preventing someone from telling the truth, and here, liz cheney was enabling cassidy hutchinson to tell the truth. >> such an important point. she was trying to enable her to tell the truth publicly to the american people, that's what

the objective was here. so, i raised this, but i'm really curious most importantly what you think, as it may be that some of these republicans realize this is a little flimsy, but the question is the point here, and part of the point is to predicate, to justify a doj investigation. i mean, that is not how it is supposed to work, but are you worried that trump's fbi could use this as a pretext to try to launch a probe? >> they could try, but jen, it would fail right at the get go, not just because there is no crime here or any credible allegation, but also because liz cheney, as a member of congress at the time, is entitled to the constitutional protection of speech or debate community, it is actually in the constitution, unlike trump's claim about being absolutely immune when he was president. so, i don't think that is what is going on. why are we hearing about all this conversation right now in december? i think because the republican party is thinking about what is

going to happen on january 20th, and one of the things donald trump wants to do his part in the hundreds of people who are involved in the january 6th insurrection, and so, they have already been convicted, they have gone through jury or other trials and the like. i think what trump is trying to do here is to bait president biden into pardoning liz cheney, and that will allow trump to say, hey, look, even biden thinks liz cheney did something wrong, by pardoning these people, this investigation is bogus, now i need to remedy what is left and pardon all these january 6th people, so i think that is really what is going on. i hope that biden will use the pardon power to protect liz cheney, and then that will enable trump to use it for the january 6th insurrectionists. >> gosh, that is a lot of -- getting in the minds of a lot of people, but it sounds pretty right on to me.

you have advised a lot of people. i mean, the thing about these congressional committees, this is not how it is supposed to work, they have subpoena power, they are supposed to use that to get to the bottom of the truth. i mean, if you were advising liz cheney who hasn't hidden, she has called us militias, what would you tell her to do in this case? >> i think -- she will fight and there will be no problem for her. i mean, there is no crime here, not even a hint of one, and she is protected by immunity, so i suspect this is a fight that she wants to have. liz cheney is one of the last remaining symbols of a principled gop, and this new gop isn't going to stop until her memory is erased, but i think it is very important that she continue what she started >> neal katyal, thank you so much, always one of the best explainer is in the business and legal minds, appreciate you joining us. coming up, democrats passed up a big opportunity to elevate one of their youngest and brightest stars. we will tell you what happened and talk about it with our friend david who is now candidate for vice chair of the dnc, we will be right back

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on capitol hill this week, house democrats missed what i would consider a big opportunity. they passed over congresswoman alexandria ocasio-cortez for the top democratic spot on the democratic oversight committee and said they chose gerry connolly, backed by speaker america nancy pelosi. why does that matter? this is one of the few committees in congress that actually generates national attention or media coverage but under jamie raskin, it became a critical platform for countering republican misinformation, and while i have deep respect for speaker pelosi, she has been on this show many times, she is fierce, and nothing against congressman connolly at all, this felt like an obvious chance to apply some of the lessons we learn from the november election, right? instead, democrats passed over one of the youngest, most media savvy members of congress for a

key leadership of public role. joining me now is someone who has known the importance of having youth at the table for a very long time, david hogg is cofounder for march for our lives and just announced his bid for the dnc. you have been out there since election, you have seen some things that i think are pretty interesting. you mentioned in a recent interview that when he raised concerns that kamala harris is not doing enough to win over gen z voters, you received messages from political consultants who said you didn't know what you were talking about, which i think is quite a response. what is the consulting class when there are some great consultants, there are some not as good, but what are they getting drunk generally about gen z voters? >> one, i think it is that we are going to be able to move them with ads. gen z is responsive to obviously the messages they see on social media, and i think that is one of the biggest mistakes that we made, was we thought we could just put tons

of money into telling young people how to feel instead of addressing how they actually felt. when inflation was going up and costs of living were going up pretty dramatically in many of our urban centers, especially with the cost of housing, our response a lot of the time was well, you don't understand, your rent going up 20 or 30% was not that bad, because according to this chart of the g7, so on and so forth, our inflation isn't as bad as theirs. and that might be true, but we need to meet people where they are at. and instead, what we should have done in my opinion is talk about the corporate landlords across the country. we should have talked about what efforts we can do to increase the available supply of housing, but instead, it was to tell people they weren't right and feeling what they felt, and we should have listened to what they felt. and one of the things i am doing in my run for vice chair is encouraging our party to stop and consultants, to shut our fingers in our ears so far that we just don't hear the voters, and instead just listened to

what they're actually saying. and it may not be as profitable for those consultants to get cuts of the ads they are buying, but i think it will certainly be a lot more effective. >> sounds like you're saying two things there. our delivery mechanisms, where an ad is run, but what i am hearing from you more is the message that was being used in those ads was not the right message for gen z voters, probably, i would argue, other voters as well. let me ask you about something you said, because i agree with this, i think a lot of people have said this, how exactly does the party do that effectively? i mean, they're not going to show up in diners, that is not super effective, what does that look like to you? >> for me, if it looks like if i win this role, i would really like to go around the country and talk to young people and older people, too, and everyone in between. in a lot of places democrats have left behind, rural america, red states, and have conversations about what we can do to address the growing monopolies, address the crushing reality is that many people are facing around the country, and talk to people and listen to them, not to say we

are going to agree on everything, obviously, but this is part of the reason i joined the club in college, it wasn't easy to do, but it is an important thing to do to know what other people are saying and listen to them and not just write them up over and over again. one of the other things i would like to emphasize, too, and many of the conversations i have had with different members of the dnc is the need for us to invest in our state parties, because we need to build sustainable infrastructure where it is not just every four years, we have a massive presidential campaign that comes up, and we are sending people two months before the election to michigan or pennsylvania from another state in a community they don't know anything about other than what wikipedia says, but instead, we build sustainable infrastructure with the community is there and help to build them up. that means organizing local democrats, state parties, and the national party as part of that could >> it sounds like what you're saying is more of a 50 states energy which a lot of people have talked about. i know you have an interest

anyone for the dnc chair, but is there anyone in particular you would be most excited to work with? >> you know, i think that i am excited to work with whoever it is. i have had many conversations with all of the chair candidates, as you can imagine. i think somebody like ben would be a great spokesperson but i think ken martin is an incredible organizer as well. and whoever wins that role, i look forward to working with them if i have the honor of getting elected to this. so, it is going to be a quick election year, but i look forward to having more conversations with members of the dnc. >> david hogg, you just named two from wisconsin and minnesota, both running. thank you so much for joining us, i look forward to talking to you more in the new year. i have got one more thing to tell you about before we go today, we are back after a very quick break. er a very quick break. because it could be peyronie's disease, or pd. it's a medical condition where there is a curve in the erection, caused by a formation of scar tissue. and an estimated 1 in 10 men may have it. but pd can be treated

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f0 okay that's going to do it for me today but we're already working for a great show tomorrow night. we'll keep digging into all the fall out at capitol hill after all the casts we saw this week. congressman jim himes will be stopping by to talk about all of it. that's coming up tomorrow at 8:00 p.m. eastern. for now, stay right where you are because there's much more news coming up on msnbc. on this new hour of ayman, republicans will soon control government yet the party is fighting into how much it's allowed to hate trump, if not forever. >> matt gaetz wants a job after his report of