with that power. and understanding that what you have to say is important. i tried to say when i wish i had when i was 16 or 17 years old. something to nudge me through the uncomfortable parts of it. i love seeing people read it all around the country and get that feeling. >> wicked is in feelings -- theaters now. and john's memoir is also available now. director and author, jon m. chu, thank good morning, it is saturday, december 28th. today with the new year right around the corner, republicans gear up for a battle for the gavel. donald trump isn't so sure mike

johnson is up for the job. debbie dingell joins our conversation. elon musk becomes an easy target for democrats. she tells us how her party can turn it into a winning message for voters. we look at the crucial role the nc secretary will play. grab your coffee, settled in and welcome to "the weekend." donald trump has a new year's resolution that flies in the face of the international order. he apparently wants to leverage the power of the presidency to read in america's neighbors. a series of posts on christmas day, trump called for the u.s. to take control of the panama canal and buy greenland and also suggested that canada should become the 51st state.

the only problem, the panama canal belongs to panama. greenland is not for sale in canada is its own country. this is all bluster, just a series of unhinged ideas. one thing is crystal-clear, he plans to use the pulpit to intimidate our allies. when it comes to china, he might be singing a slightly different tune. just last night urging the spring court to hit pause on a law that could ban tiktok in the united states. michael, the congressional reporter for the washington post. >> welcome, welcome, welcome both of you. i hope you had a great christmas because there is a whole lot of stupid that we have to get through. so you are well girded through the conversation. let's start with this smart idea that we are somehow going to take control of panama and that we want to go and buy

greenland. why? because it is there and it is green and i guess that is what donald trump wants to do. so mariana, is there any appetite, do you think, from your reporting and your coverage of these things with this coming congress, the idea that they are going to entertain legislation to [ laughter ] to do these crazy fantasy-driven ideas of donald trump that, somehow, he not only wants to rule the united states but he wants to rule the world? absolutely not honestly among democrats and definitely among republicans, they don't want to be doing these things. there are so many things congress could do not to mention raising the debt ceiling in just a couple of weeks mentioning that wednesday night saying this should be the priority of the conversation even before trump is sworn in. how are they going to tackle

something like this? trying to acquire other nations or other nations properties? it is just something where i talk to congressional republicans in particular, no, don't take any of this seriously. when trump wants to enter and negotiation, usually says these platitudes to try to bring these countries to the table. but obviously, it is a way that could alienate a lot of these countries who do want to help and our allies, already. >> okay, alecia? >> there is no "okay," michael steele. when we were coming on the show, i heard you say, this is not how any of this works. like i don't even know how to frame this conversation because it is not how it works and it is always sort of two truths and a lie. right? like there are him saying he feels like china has too much

influence in the panama canal, time that to trade, but then the idea simply becomes that he is going to take it over. i want to read you this. this is from the new yorker it is susan prosser putting this in the broader context of donald trump's new governing ideology. she writes, whether it is preemptory attacks on a 1977 panama canal treaty whose terms he now wants to reject or the fantastical reimagining of the january 6th riot is, trump is a conservative in an entirely different sense than the one we have come to know. he is not a republican who sticks to the status quote but instead would be strongmen who is casting his own imagination down once again will become the country's governing ideology. that is where the rubber meets the road. >> absolutely and when i first heard about the panama canal, i thought, wow, imperialist, much? the world's sole remaining

global power, superpower, this is our move, not expanding healthcare, not expanding mental health and making college affordable, it is going after sovereign nations and what is concerning is that he treats our enemies better than he treats our friends. and i don't think this is real. it is a bargaining position of his. he said something like this with respect to greenland, before. it is a bargaining position and i think the point you make about china is very important because if you pay attention to what is happening in parts of africa, particularly in the port cities of africa, there is a strong chinese presence and building those ports and expanding their foot print and trade routes and there is an incredible amount of money being spent on infrastructure in those countries like china. where is the united states in that? they are far behind. there is a

solution in that that doesn't include acquiring other nations and could potentially put boots on the ground so i think it is a bargaining position in a way that is meant to sort of bring the center of power to him and that strongman sort of ideology but at the same time, like people need to be focused on other things. >> yeah but it is the focus on other things that is where it gets kind of crazy because those are the things that include not just our relationships with foreign governments or what we are seeing which we will talk about later, the emerging culture in this country in the text space that is creating some new landscapes but it all goes to i think the selective nature of it all because as alysia noted coming into this, how donald trump is, you know, hard on greenland and canada, right? but soft on china.

i want to take a little bit of a knee on china because there are some things i want to be able to do here. for example, you talked about this tiktok ban. you have a statement from trump saying president trump alone possesses the consummate dealmaking expertise. i am not editorial comments. the electoral mandate and the political will to negotiate a resolution to say the international security expressed by the government. that all sounds rather normal, right? saying, we can roll but there is always something underneath it all. what are you sick and with this whole approach to china with reese to take versus how we see the knock him down, pray, and sort of bullying with respect to greenland and canada? >> there is a different and the fact that he is asking for a pause, he is literally going against a large bipartisan

support for banning tiktok. this was congress having driven and signed and law by president biden, something that republicans want. and i will say there is bipartisan will to go against china. there is a committee in the house literally focus on countering china. they actually get along which is pretty rare to see so there could be a moment where congress produces legislation to be able to go against china in many a different way and i think basil is right. the fact that is in our backyard, that is something that you hear from republicans and democrats. they are building for the and south american countries trying to win over a lot of soft power , the u.s. is not there so it is odd to see trump, you know, focused on other areas where he could really go strongly against china because it is. >> you had harold calling

oppenheimer, underscoring all of that writing, if the is president-elect is making filled threats of the u.s. invasion or economic sanctions against panama, the central american country will have little choice but to get support from wherever it can get it. china, cuba and venezuela would be the first to offer help and the net result of tom's bravado could be pushing at half into their hand. it is the problem of the fact that he is playing a game of checkers what is international has become a game of chess. >> three-dimensional. yeah, he doesn't seem to be able to understand and maybe he doesn't care to but he doesn't seem to understand really how this works but i just remembered a very quick story, back in the mid-early 90s when mandela was released from prison, i took a tour of new york and i remember at a town hall meeting, i think it was ted koppel that was introduced to him and said he had concerns

and was wondering does mandela have concern about his relationships with certain countries including cuba and mandela said, you know what? these countries were with me even when the west was not. your enemies are not my enemies and it really crystallized nothing in my head which is that if you layer it with what is happening today, there will be alliances formed around the world based on what donald trump is saying and when he and understanding the power of the country significant but the question is, can these places frees him out and freeze out american interest because he is playing this game that he doesn't know how to win? and that is the three- dimensional chest that we are talking about. and that should worry both democrats and republicans because there is so much going on economically around the world that the president and his allies don't seem to be able to keep up with. >> there is a lot that you say

there, basil, that could reduce a whole another segment just around the idea, the relationships that are or could be formed or broken by what trump does next but we are not going to talk about that. we have other things we want to cover with you so we want you both to stick around because what we want to get into is whether or not mike johnson can hang onto that speaker's gavel. you know that little wooden stick with the bowl at the end that shows his power in congress? well we will talk about that and later this hour, we will talk to congressman debbie dingell to talk about the democrats plan for the second term. you are watching "the weekend." that's why i love my swiffer wetjet. it's a quick and easy way to get my floors clean. wetjet absorbs and locks grime deep inside. look at that! swiffer wetjet. i won't let my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis symptoms define me...

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in just six days, house republicans are set to elect the next speaker of the house. the biggest mystery, however, might be where donald trump stands on that process. sources tell political trump is unhappy about the deal speaker mike johnson struck with democrats to keep the government open. he only did his job. one trump insider saying "the president is upset, he wanted the debt ceiling dealt with." another adding, "in the past couple of weeks, the question whether mike johnson has been an honest broker."

>> i am not sure if you noticed that i flubbed in opening calling mike johnson, mike pence, which is clearly sweet memories of other mics that donald trump has abandoned the >> it looks like they want to hang him, too, so you are good. [ laughter ] >> republicans find themselves somewhere they have found themselves before and i think the former republican congressman has said it best which is, the thing that is most scathing mike johnson is it is not really clear who else wants this job so what is your reporting telling you about what competition for this could potentially look like? >> i mean, we are all going to watch it live on friday, i think. as of right now, johnson does not have the vote. majority, matt gaetz is no longer in office. he resigned. we have congress in thomas

massey saying he is definitely voting against johnson so that leaves johnson with 218. the literal number that he needs to become speaker. that means he needs all republicans, every single one, to line up and vote for him on friday for this to be an easy win. it is not going to be easy because there are a number of republicans particularly in the far right who have said that they are already critical of his leadership and don't know if they will support him and what this means over the next week is that johnson will be having i'm sure conversations with a number of these holdouts to see if he can win them over for friday's vote. the thing is that johnson hasn't been one to be making many promises and the fact that he broke a couple during this funding fight was very transparent and really resonated among a number of republicans and trump. i think one thing to note, lesson learned from my reporting is that trump world

has been saying, trump in every conversation, he wanted the debt ceiling, he was so surprised by the deal. that is just not accurate based on a number of republicans and he is very close to trump and has been in trump's good graces but the fact that trump is starting to pull away, we have heard that trump does not want to get involved in the speaker fight. that might be a good thing for johnson but what would be really bad is if trump does come out and say i don't support him anymore. all republicans say we need the green light from trump and one way or the other to know how to vote. expect they don't need the green light for trump. they are an independent body and they need to pick your speaker based on trying to get an agenda done and they can't. that is the bottom line this will be what the fourth speaker would have gone through. they cannot govern and they don't have the leadership to

govern and that is reflected in this process so this idea that somehow, donald trump is going to manufacture speakership that gets him what he wants, it just is improbable in this house as it was in the last congress and the congress is doing trump's turn which then puts the spotlight on the democrats who did say the republicans a number of times where you have, for example, john bacon saying on our friends show less sunday, i cannot say with -- let's just listen. he can tell us. the >> i can say with divinity that he is going to be the next speaker because you have one of the gentleman from kentucky that will oppose them. by the way, he was going to vote against speaker johnson is weakening our half and it is going to strengthen the hand of

the king jeffries. i am just going to be bold about it. expect that is true but that hand is already strong and you have access reporting democrats basically saying, we are not helping you again so it is not a question of how strong the democrats hand is in this but how weak the republicans have made their own. >> the thing that the republicans go into this next congress with the second slimmest majority in history, they absolutely need democrats to help them govern but the question is, does donald trump actually care about good governance? we know that he doesn't and someone argued that chaos is the currency and that is all intentional just to bring the attention back to him, back to himself. at the freedom caucuses, they are sour on johnson. they don't know if he is going to have a job going forward but

we can be certain that the democrats are going to create the same kind of split screen that you saw during the mccarthy vote, right? they have all of this behind the king jeffries at the chaos on the rights and i think that is really the model going for democrats going forward, you will see this consensus around good governance and good policy and you're going to have people running scared on the right because elon musk is going to take away their badge so they will lose twitter followers. and when you have that kind of chaos where folks are really worried about whether or not elon musk is on their side and playing to try to figure out whether or not they are still in the good graces of donald trump, what does that say about their view of governance versus democratic you? so i think that split screen will be really bright going into this next congress. >> marianas mayor, thank you very much. next, how democrats are feeling heading into the speakers vote. you are watching "the weekend."

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this has been an incredibly embarrassing performance. just embarrassing. it is a laughing stock. this bill is a joke and the negotiations armijo. >> clearly, johnson has got to go, right? he has got to go. should johnson be speaker of the house? >> no! >> that is how some republicans are talking about mike johnson and have next week's speaker election. joining us now, congresswoman, it is good to see you. let's just set the tone for a moment. the streets are saying that democrats are not going to help speaker johnson if he becomes embattled in his quest to retain his speakership.

is that true? >> that is true. he made that very clear and you saw as we voted on the budget at the end of the year that we stay united. there were a lot of things in there that bothered us, things that we wanted and if we were going to negotiate, we need to negotiate with one voice, key communicated with us directly, regularly, we stay together and trust me, we will stay together when the vote for speaker comes up. >> it is funny, i was listening to josh hawley who was sort of talking about the budget deal and brandon screaming about speaker johnson needs to be fired, we don't want him, and biden in the room saying no! who are you going to put up? can i have a name, please? who is your candidate that is going to go and run that gauntlet and get those votes that you need because the democrats should absolutely just sit there and go, we got a

guy, we are good. give us another six votes and he is the speaker, right? that is how that works. so when you watch this unfold, what do you see coming down the train track in terms of what the house is going to look like going into this vote and when this vote is taken and how does the other chamber react to that? do they just kind of sit back and go, all right, we just wait until this plays out? what do you see the mood on the hill being with respect to this chaos when there is no alternative that is being put forward? >> yesterday, we have a thread of women democrats and i focused on this because i have a speech next saturday on the fourth, the day after and i suddenly realized that i'm not going to be able. i said, we are not going to be able to go

home next weekend. it was four days before we got kevin mccarthy the vote and no one knows what is going to happen. there are two, three, four, of the republicans who have expressed their doubts. i talked with some republicans yesterday. i heard you are reporting that trump is unhappy with what he is hearing, he may come out for him so we are dealing with what we often deal with, everybody speculating and nobody knowing. i hear the name jim jordan as a potential alternate so i don't know what is going to happen. i can tell you i know what is going to happen, democrats will be united. we are not going to bail him out this time but this is only an indicator. if republicans and the republican, those who are going to be a part of this cabinet is ever running it, we seem to have several different ones not only present to be trump but elon musk and whoever, this is what every type vote is going

to be like and president trump is to be again several members of the house to be and cabinet positions, those are ones that are likely to be confirmed. that is going to leave the house down again for several months. these votes are down to one or two type modes so we are going to have to figure out how to work because i don't think the american people sent any of this back to washington for total. maybe what we see for two years but i am somehow praying. >> i actually want to pick up where you left off because i think sometimes when we talk about these, they can sound bureaucratic or technocratic where only people in washington or capitol hill killer about but it gets to what you are arriving at which is people did vote because they want to see some type of change, the change they want to see is policy and it actually delivered makes their lives better, that makes things more complicated for

republicans and democrats alike if republicans cannot get there speakership together, if they cannot get their ducks in a row so when you talk to constituent in michigan, people are like, why should i care about all of this? how do you drive it home for folks that their dysfunction becomes america's dysfunction? >> i get that question and i say to them, because, look at what happened when kevin mccarthy was speaker. now they have changed the rules so it takes a little bit of a vote to deter a speaker but 15 votes later, kevin mccarthy came speaker and for eight months, we had total dysfunction. matt gaetz was one of the house members and a member of the staff, anything could happen. here is the reality, we have a lot of challenging issues ahead of us. voters were sending us that message, they were not packing with the status quote and i am not one of those democrats who

says, let it be total dysfunction for two years and then have us back. if we have the dysfunction that we saw on what happened with the budget, who is in control of the republican side, was it to be president trump? was it president mosk? now we see steve bannon attacking mike johnson. by the way, i don't think that is appropriate and i think the president is the one who should be talking about this and telling the republicans what he wants or what he doesn't but i will tell you something you are going to see in the democratic caucus is unity. we have these agreements from different perspectives but we talk to each other and we know that our strength is our unity. republicans don't. >> we will be watching what happens with the speaker vote. i am with the chairman. who else wants the job other than mike johnson?

be a speaker of the republican conference is difficult. >> but jim jordan might want it. >> well, you said that, i was like, well -- >> there are some that want it. >> but can they get it is the question. >> he can't get it. >> while all of this is happening, folks out there talking about what democrats need to do i got the founder of the progressive policy institute writing this saying comes anti-semitic -- trips antics and miserable will no doubt create tactical openings for democrats to take those democrats must show they get how those voters feel and what matters to them, and offer concrete remedies to problems. i think -- this is the holidays we are just coming out of christmas, hanukkah, kwanzaa going into the new year, folks may not be paying very close

attention to the chaos on capitol hill. they just say it is chaos and they say it is the republicans but maybe it is the democrats, too. how do you distinguish yourself and continue to drive home that you all are actually have a plan for the american people even though you are not in the majority, you are still a part of the governing that is happening and americans, according to the progressive policy institute, they want to see some results. >> so i think that is a very good question and as you know, i am someone who has been saying this for a very long time. i was the bad democrat in 2016 when i said donald trump is going to win because he is communicating with the voters and we are not and we did a terrible job of doing it. this time because everybody was yelling at me about not being negative, i can say number one, and it wasn't that i go to the grocery store and people want

to know when i am going to be at the grocery store and now come to see me at the grocery store. they are talking about what the present day is. i said this to you in september and october. we have to show working men and women that we understand what they are worried about. just words that they understand and show what we are doing to deliver them, to deliver for them. joe biden was a great president for working men and women in the union but they did not see what he was doing. they did not translate what the bipartisan infrastructure did and how it created jobs, how it make sure workers were making more money. we've got to talk about it and show how we are supporting more skilled trades and investing in that by the way, we need to be training our engineers. talking about having broader people overseas, we need to be investing here at home and assure that we are educating young engineers to be our future but we have got to meet them

where they are. you know me, one of my roles is that i want to be in a union hall every weekend or in a meeting with union workers and veterans and every weekend, i want to meet with them and talk to them. you listen something that is really important to understand what matters to them is to listen. god gave us two ears and one not for a reason, understand what their peers are, understand what their concerns are and then go and tell them how you are going to try and help them and they are worried about a lot of stuff. they can't afford their houses and they are worried about education their kids. they are worried about a college education. >> you are absolutely correct, there are a lot of things on the docket and we will have to have you come back because we have to finish this conversation. congresswoman debbie dingell, we appreciate your time. at the top of the hour,

congresswoman debbie wasserman schultz will give us her perspective. be sure to follow our show on social media. our handle is@the weekend msnbc . it's . it's it's better over here! families save 20% every month. what a deal! to all you new and existing customers, trade in your busted old phone, and t-mobile will give you a brand-new iphone 16 pro with apple intelligence on us. plus, families can save 20% when they switch. t-mobile is one of none. go get that. what he said! alright, we got your home and auto bundled t-mobile is one of none. go get that. and you saved hundreds. oh, that's nice, with the economy and all. what's the economy? [chuckling] where do we start? what isn't the economy? yes. [ laughter ] uh, it's -- it's so many thing. right.

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well -- >> well -- >> dij@ vu! dij@ vu all over again! >> okay, this is why doubled back. i've got pockets, by the way. you know, i've got pockets. he is my pockets, by the way. have you got pockets, alysia? i like this sweater. >> i spilled coffee on myself and that is why we ended up here. >> it's like, oh, lord, zip it up. >> she is like this! >> alysia's question about the

chaos, we understand it is a fight here in dc and for people in new york and people at home, what does that mean for our lives? i trickle down on it because i believe that is true. people don't pay attention, they don't know who the speaker is. people are going to look up on january 4th, who is it? did they pick somebody? or they might not even realize that this whole fight went on. i think there is something to the fact that, for a lot of democratic strategists and democrats on capitol hill believe that the chaos of the last republican-led congress was going to yield democrats some goodwill and i think some results at the ballot box. and the chaos wasn't enough. the democrats were not rewarded for being the adult in the room and helping govern over this last congress so it ain't going to be enough to just sit back and let them be chaotic.

the democrats have to be proactive in what they are communicating outwardly because, come on! >> their core argument is the government does not work, the government does not function. that it actually behooves them when the government does not work and does not function because this proves their point. >> i got nothing. >> you got a gray turtleneck. very snazzy. >> thank you. we are trying to be a little hot and sexy that after christmas but here we are. look, you are both absolutely right. this is something that the american people by and large don't care about because they don't know how their government functions and they don't know how these roles are played and how important they are. why it matters when the is dealing with the budget and the debt ceiling, why it matters when you have an incoming president who wants the speaker to cowtown to his heel. that is

why i said that congress is an independent body. they are not an adjunct of the executive branch, they are an independent branch and it is high time republicans started acting like it. grow a spine or other body parts that may help you understand what your job and your role is and if you want a good speaker, republicans, elect one. because you ain't got one and you haven't had one in a while! you know that person exists within your ranks, it is just that you are too scared to nominate and elect him . the american people don't care because you don't care and you don't make it important so it is not important. so i just have a turtleneck on and what do i know? >> we are ready to get things done, let's get things done, let's get things going and that will power us through the next couple of days. the white house says it has more information about russia's possible involvement in this

week's plane crash and cause extent. john brennan will join the table. you are watching "the weekend." cks vapors. easy to apply for the whole family. vicks vapostick. and try new vaposhower max for steamy vicks vapors.

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to ten times the impact and when you call with your credit card, we will send you this save the children tote bag as a thank you for your support. your small monthly donation of just $10. could be the reason a child in crisis survives. show them they're not alone. please call or go online to givetosave.org to help save lives. the white house says it has indications that russia was responsible for the crash of a passenger jet in kazakhstan this week. john kirby told reporters on friday that the evidence goes beyond widely circulated images of the crash but he did not provide details. early indications show that the jet

may have been targeted by russian air defense systems. 38 people were killed in the crash and another 29 are being treated for injuries. john brennan joining us now. they are now reporting, nbc news has verified from the new york times and cbs news and i am told we do have a -- is that the president of russia called the leader to apologize, today, but stopped short of taking credit for the crash. what does that say to you. >> i think it is tantamount to the mission that russians are responsible for this downed aircraft. he noted that the drugs were active in terms of targeting the airport which is where the plane was heading to.

even though he did not explicitly say we did it, i think by calling the president and having it being reported, now, this is an early admission for the russians because the russians weekly we will continue to deny it but i think the evidence is so obvious especially with the shrapnel that was so apparent on the fuselage of the plane that he had no choice but to basically admit it. >> it is funny, director, you had vladimir putin spokesman on thursday, striking a very different tone in noting that it would be incorrect to make any hypothesis before the investigation comes to conclusions and we definitely cannot do it and no one should do it he said in his daily conference so the investigation has been included. so clearly, it was something that vladimir putin decided was in his interest to get ahead of the story. is that from your experience because of relevant

facts that will come out about this? that prove the level of involvement of the russians or how do you in such a quick turnaround time do you have now this sort of, oh, i am so sorry, we apologize for this. as i said before we came on the air, asking for a pardon for something that you did not do, right? dearly, something is going on that they are now more aware of that may be made public. >> i think the evidence is starting to mount, not just the physical evidence that the footage of the aircraft on the ground but also u.s. military officials who were saying that there was intelligence that indicated the russians had shot it down so i think vladimir putin was trying to get ahead of what was more evidence coming out publicly and i think he is trying to address it without it getting worse.>> the

timing of this not only because it happened on christmas day but because we are in what will be a transition period from one presidential administration to another and that is playing with issues all across the world. you had durst saying about vladimir putin, "this is not a man anyone should take seriously when he says he is ready for a negotiated settlement. he has proven quite the contrary in almost every single possible way." in ukraine, as someone who has been in these room, sort of pull back the curtain on what it looks like when a transition in this highly sensitive information is done properly and when that handoff is not done with the care and consideration it deserves and what that means for america's safety and security. >> i think this transition is

taking place in a more serious and professional fashion that happened in 2016 and 2017 because you had people like marco rubio who has named to be secretary of state who is well steeped in these issues and also takes them very seriously and i know there is engagement between the biden department of state and the incoming trump team so it is critically important during this period of time because there are things like this that happened during this transition and you want to make sure that the incoming team has as much intelligence and analysis as possible that is available so that when they take over on day one, that they are fully informed about what the situation is. i think there are people in the trump administration coming in that are trying to do everything they can to be as prepared as possible on january 20th. >> you know, on christmas day, russia launched what the president, president biden has called an outrageous christmas day assault on ukraine. they have launched hundreds of

missiles and drones on infrastructure and now all of this talk of a settlement, of a cease-fire, saying that vladimir putin would be willing to come to the table, president zelenskyy signaling he might be able to negotiate. the reality is that russia's war in ukraine, if there is a settlement, a deal to be cut, deals to be cut, ukraine has to be at the table but the ukrainians have been very clear: they want nato membership , okay? first and foremost and before they come to a cease-fire deal -- why are we not talking about the fact that that is probably the least likely thing to happen so if that is what the ukrainians are saying they want on the table to negotiate a cease-fire with vladimir putin and they would be essentially willing to give up most of the territory that russia has already taken from them, are we really going to see a cease- fire?

it seems like we are talking, some other tables are talking in circles and avoiding the real truthful conversation and i think for the incoming president? >> president zalewski has shown personal relationship in terms of his opposition to the russian assault on ukraine and also i think zalewski is aware that with the incoming trump administration and donald trump's position on ukraine that he has to be more practical and pragmatic about what the prospects are for continued us and nato support and we see that that is likely to be reduced under a trump administration so i think what president zalewski is saying now, he is trying to find some way to bring this conflict to a close but not to just submit and capitulate to russia but it is going to be very difficult i think for zelensky to continue to hold fast. just this week, there was another european leader to travel to moscow to talk to putin and so i think we are seeing this lessening of

the support and the resolve that the united states has had and i think zelensky is basically aware of the winds that are blowing and is going to do everything possible to see whether or not he can protect basic core ukrainian interests and is it going to be negotiated settlement on this? will there be some type of demilitarized zone? we will have to see what happens with the new trump administration but i expect we will see in 2025, a period where you do not have this constant bloodshed and there will be some type of effort to try to see whether or not we can bring at least a temporary close to the act of fighting on the battle front. >> i am just kind of like, i know we have got to go on this but you raise an interesting question in my mind and i am sure a lot of folks are thinking the same thing. your reference marco rubio is the incoming secretary of state.

marco rubio's position on ukraine is diametrically opposed to this administration's view. how does that navigate? real quick? it is a big question and i need a very short answer but that is going to be the very interesting early tension and sort of thing what direction this administration takes next on ukraine. >> marco rubio will take direction from donald trump. i think he will express his concerns in the white house room. i am sure there will be animated discussions but i think there will be a deal with putin over ukraine and i think whatever deal will be advantages to ukraine as possible. >> director brennan, we love you. you must come back. it is crazy out here in the international streets because the reality is that vladimir putin just rolled up and said we are taking it and if we can do that, i don't know what kind of world we are living in. john brennan, i appreciate your time. up next, representative

debbie wasserman schultz is here, former secretary, donna should layla is here, marilyn davis is here and that is all coming up on "the weekend." i'.

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