remember how skittish she was around ashlea's girlfriends at first? no longer. now, they're family. have a good weekend. when monica and i go and get our nails done, they always say, oh, your daughter is so pretty. she never corrects them. as far as she's concerned, she gained several daughters. keith morrison: and when they're all together, ashlea is there too. that's all for this edition of "dateline." i'm andrea canning. thank you for watching. . ♪ ♪ ♪ >> this sunday, "meet the moment." conversations with people who are having a impathis sunday, meet the moment. conversations with people who are having an impact in washington and beyond. >> there are times where i feel like i'm all alone.

>> still. >> a limb picks swimmer, michael phelps opens up about anxiety and depression. >> personally, i struggle with almost every single day, and depression and anxiety aren't just going to disappear. >> civil rights icon, ruby bridges reflects on how she made history. >> i was thrust into the middle of a situation that no six-year- old should be put in. and, game changers. >> i feel like we just came to the end of all the excuses of why nobody likes women sports and it turns out, everybody watches women sports. >> sports icons, sue byrd on how women sports are breaking records. >> don't you want to look like a genius? invest now. help this grow now. plus, fight for justice. >> i didn't know if he was innocent. i didn't know if he was guilty. >> journalist and j.j.

valasquez share the journey. >> there are hundreds of thousands of wrongfully convicted people on this earth and they are suffering. >> and keeping the faith. nbc's savannah guthrie shares her journey to get closer to god. >> i'm a regular human who walked in faith and out of faith over the years. these are things i learned. i didn't learn them because everything went well. i learned them mostly when things went wrong. >> welcome to sunday, and welcome to a special edition of "meet the press." >> the longest running show in television history, this is a special edition of "meet the press," with kristen welker. >> meet the press had a history of shining the light on people who influence our politics from outside of washington. from jackie robinson, carl, and

gloria. this morning, we take a look back on our special series, meet the moment, and the conversations we've had this year with the voices outside of our politics, shaping conversations that matter. michael phelps joined meet the press for a candid conversation about his battle with anxiety and depression. and his advocacy for other athletes. ruby bridges who became a civil rights icon for attending her school, which was newly desegregated in 1960. spoke to us about book banning and whose stories can be told? j.j.valasquez, who was exonerated after spending 24 years in prison, wrongfully convicted for a murder he did not commit, a conversation about their more than two decade fight to free valasquez. >> marked what may be the

biggest year on record for women sports in america. and today's show coanchor sat down for a special conversation about her relationship to her faith. but we begin with michael phelps, with 23 gold medals, he is one of the greatest competitors alive. but that doesn't mean he doesn't have his struggles. in retirement, he is using his voice to speak out about depression and anxiety and advocating for mental health resources for athletes. i sat down with phelps for a meet the moment conversation about how he is doing in his own mental health journey and what more needs to be done in the olympic community. >> you have dedicated so much time to advocating for, to speaking out about mental health, your mental health, the importance of getting help, if you are struggling. before we dive into your advocacy, how are you doing right now, michael? >> i'm good. i have my days, like everybody

does. we have ups and downs, and that's just life. i feel like i have more tools to prepare me through the bumps or the roller coasters, that i go through in my life. i'm enjoying it. being retired again, and being able to talk about mental health, which is something that personally, i struggle with almost every single day, and my depression and anxiety aren't going to disappear. these are things that i have to adapt and i have adapted throughout my life. they are always going to be a part of my life. it's finding the pest way every single day to be the best version of me. >> you said something powerful. you still struggle with depression and anxiety every day. >> yeah. i mean, there are times. there are ten day spells where every day is a struggle. what can i control in that moment? i looked at myself as a swimmer and an athlete. now i can see a person. somebody that has feelings and emotions.

>> i do think it is striking to hear you saw yourself as a swimmer, as an olympian, not necessarily as a person. when did you first realize you were really struggling with depression? >> i would say probably 2004. 2004 was my first taste of post olympic depression. you know, coming off such a high. the edge of the cliff, and you're like cool, now what? i guess i have to wait four more years to have the chance to do it again. for those that don't have a successful olympics, those four years can feel like an eternity. 2004 is my first. 2008 was my second taste of post olympic depression. because coming off of that high after doing something you set out to do your whole entire life. my goal was to do something no one else had ever done before. >> did you know it was depression, or think i'm feeling a little off? >> at that point, i'll say as a male athlete, i can tell

something was off. but i think i saw it as a sign of weakness. if i shared anything about it, then it would give my competitors an edge. i'm not trying to do that. i don't want to give my competitors an edge. i'm trying to be better than anybody. so for me, i looked at it as weakness. i had to learn that vulnerability is a good thing, and it was scary at first, but i learned that vulnerability means change. for me, it was a great change. >> i want to go back to that moment in 2014, when you got a dui. you have spoken about this. you say you are locked in a room for four days. you had suicidal thoughts. your family did rally around you. how did you find the strength to get help in that moment? >> yeah. i mean, i think in that moment for me, there's a lot of shame, and i just didn't want to -- i had the thought it was me i was

putting my family through all of this stress. i was just like, okay, maybe it's better if i leave. at the time i was prescribed ambien from our doctors on our team trips, and i was happy i only had three pills left. i took them all that night and i woke up the next morning and i didn't eat anything or drink anything for two or three days. after those two or three days, i didn't want to talk to anybody. i didn't want to see anybody. it was to the point where i knew i needed help. the thoughts that i was having were too much. they were overwelming, and they were scary. for me, i checked myself into a treatment center. >> for 45 days? >> for 45 days. >> what happened? >> i say that and imagine a mother board of a computer, and you just take everything apart. you just kind of rebuild and talk about whether it's, you know, my childhood, things that

i'm having difficulty with. good times, and piecing it all back together. >> but you emerged stronger, not just emotionally, but as a competitor. >> yeah. i'm lucky to be here. i'm lucky to have everything i have. i'm going to go down swinging no matter what. i just had a conversation with a buddy of mine the other day. >> take your time. it's okay. >> so, for me, this is all fresh. so, a friend of mine, he's my mental health buddy, and he knows who i'm talking about. i'll just say it. okay, jay glazer and i are mental health buddies. we both struggle. when we're both having our bad

days, we go through similar ups and downs and we do similar things when we're down. if that makes sense. and, we both have this conversation the other day. because when it happens, for me, i reach out to him. when it happens for him, he reaches out to me. i have a couple friendships like that, we've been able to form a bond. and to what we were saying before is, i literally sent a text to him. i'm never quitting, every in my life. that's not who i am. >> when you say i'm not a quitter. you mean, you're not quitting? >> anything. i won't quit anything. i will never give up at anything. there are so many goals of mine that i have and want to accomplish. no matter how hard it gets, i'm never giving up. there's a reason why i was able to win 23 olympic gold medals. i'm determined. i'm stubborn. yeah, laundry list of things. i just don't give up. >> what is your advice, for

someone struggling, who feels alone. who doesn't feel like they have the strength or community to help them. >> i would say one, reach out to a loved one you can trust. you know, and i would say, one, reach out to somebody you can trust. two, i would say you're not alone. without question. you know, there are times, even though i have a rolex of people i can reach out to, i feel like i'm all alone. >> still? >> i still know, i'm like all right, pick up the phone. who can i call? just go through and make a phone call. >> the u.s. olympic committee has said that it has made advances, particularly in the wake of your speaking out. other athletes speaking out. how do you assess the changes that the u.s. olympic committee has made, has the committee

gone far enough? what have you seen happen? >> there needs to be more. flat out. the abc organizations have done some steps in the right direction to get help and care that us as athletes need, but they are not doing everything they can. and that upsets me. >> what do you want to see them do specifically? >> i want to see them put the athletes first. that's it. nothing else to say. >> and that means providing better mental healthcare? >> it's everything. the athletes need to be first. >> and you didn't feel that way when you were on olympian? >> i walked into training rooms at the u.s. oc and couldn't get care. this is six months before the

2008 olympic games. >> you were denied care? >> i couldn't get access. no physical trainer would help me. so, if that's happening with me, it's happening with others, too. so, if we're supposed to be these athletes that are representing our country, then put the athletes first. >> if one of the representatives of the olympic committee were sitting here instead of me, what would you say to them? >> nothing that can be recorded. there's a lot of -- there's just a lot of emotions there. there's so much passion for me and i want what's right, period, that's all. and i won't stop until everything is done that i think needs to be done. >> at just six years old, ruby bridges became a civil rights icon, simply for attending her school, which was newly

desegregated in 1960. bridges and her mother had to be escorted by federal marshals under the segregationists who protested her pursuit of a basic education. over the past 25 years, bridges has been visiting schools around the country and replying to the letters of students who have sought her advice. some of that correspondence is collected in a book. dear ruby, hear our hearts. i sat down with ruby bridges. she describes the painful experience she had as a little girl. words she heard at the time, as she speaks in deeply personal terms. >> i want to start off by talking about this beautiful book that you have written in which you answer the letters that children have written to you. what do you hope people will take from your book? >> you know, it took me back to being six years old and thinking about what i was going

through and i think we, as adults, we under estimate the minds of our little ones. because i know that i was having these really grown up, adult thoughts. i mean, i was thrust into the middle of a situation that no six-year-old should be put in. and i was really thinking about all those things. and so when i started to read some of these letters, i thought, wow. things really haven't changed all that much. we are still under estimating our kids. they are still concerned about grown-up issues, and i heard their hearts. >> take me back to what that was like for you when you were six years old. you were being escorted by u.s. marshals into a school that was newly desegregated. you had to sit in a classroom all by yourself. what was that walk to school like for you? >> you know, my parents never

explained to me. they said, ruby, you're going to go to a new school today, and you better behave. and being in new orleans, we see that during mardi gras. huge crowds screaming and yelling. so, i often say what protected me was the innocence of a child. i thought that day, i was venturing into a mardi gras parade. so i wasn't afraid. it took awhile before i really found out that the crowds were out there for me and that happened when i finally had an opportunity to meet another child. >> tell me about that. >> kids were being hidden from me. there were some while parents who tried to send their kids to school with me. but they were never protected by federal marshals like i was. they had to cross that picket line and they were being

attacked. so even if they were not races, it would be very hard for them to send their child. but they did. a few of them. and the principal was part of the opposition, so she would take them and hide them. so they would never see me and i wouldn't see them. once i got into the classroom and met these other kids, a little boy said, i can't play with you. my mom said not to. and the minute he said that, everything sort of came into focus for me. it wasn't mardi gras. that the crowd out there was out there because of me. and the color of my skin. >> after you realized what these crowds were saying to you, how did you feel going to school every day walking past them? what was that like for you? >> i would not really focus on them. i would blot them out.

and mainly because i loved school. i never missed a day. that was because of my teacher. i had an amazing teacher who came from boston to teach me. she was white. barbara henry. there were days, if you opened the window, you could hear them screaming and shouting and chanting. she would go to the window and close the window and say, today we'll have music. you know, it was little things that she did that made me love school. i knew that if i just got past the crowd, it was a short walk and into the building i was going to have a great day. >> what goes through your mind when you hear these debates unfold in schools across the country about what should be taught, what should be read, what shouldn't be, access to books. what do you think about?

>> i think that's ridiculous. most of my books have been banned. the excuse is that my story actually makes, especially white kids, feel bad about themselves. but i believe that it's just an excuse not to share the truth. to cover up history. i believe that history is sacred. that none of us should have the right to change or alter history in any way. >> are you afraid that not just your history, but the history of civil rights is being threatened in this country? >> yes. those things are what we live with today. the history, all the subject matter that they want to ban. it's happening in the world. we cannot live in a bubble, put blinders on like it's not happening.

and if we think that we are actually fooling our kids by banning books, oh my gosh, where are we really? because kids have computers. they have so much information at their fingertips. i have to go to my grand baby to say, tell me what happened. open my phone, do this, whatever. all of us. so we're not -- we're not hiding anything from our young people. >> if you could talk to the six- year-old ruby bridges, what would you say to her on that first day of school? >> i would just say, ruby, it's okay. don't worry. it's all going to be fine. it's going to work out. when we come back, the fight for justice for the wrongfully convicted. j.j.valasques spent more than 26 years behind bars for a crime he did not commit. >> there are hundreds and

thousands of wrongfully convicted people on this earth and they are suffering just like i suffered. and they are not being heard.

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virginia and now a cl k at our system. vete welcome back. now, n a closer look at our justice system. veteran date line producer first met john adrian valasquez in 2002. from his cell, j.j. aided slepion in his investigations until he was granted clemency, after two decades in prison. the sing sing finals, one journalist, and a 20 year fight

for justice, tells the relationship, and to reform the legal system. in september, manhattan district attorney, alvin bragg, announced that his office would vacate valasquez's murder conviction. i sat down with them for a meet the moment conversation right before that announcement. >> i didn't know if he was innocent. i didn't know if he was guilty. and i said to him what i say to everybody who says they are innocent to me. i said to him, look, i don't know if you're guilty or innocent. i am not your friend. i am not your advocate. all i care about is the truth. and if i find evidence of your guilt, it's coming out. >> j.j., what was it like from your perspective when you first met dan and you heard those words? >> initially, you know, it's always painful when you are telling the truth to someone and they are not trying to hear

you. but it's always expected, because of the circumstances that i was under. i'm being accused for taking a police officer's life, which is one of the most heinous crimes one can be charged with, so as a young journalist, which dan was when we first met 22 years ago, you know, i can't expect him to just not know me from anywhere or not have any credible sources and expect what i'm saying is the truth, right? so the reality was in that moment as he was saying that, the only thing i could come up with in my mind, how do i get this guy to really believe i'm not playing with thisment i'm serious, i'm innocent, and i need help. i challenged him to prove me guilty. and that's what caught him. >> it's not just that you're a singular case. you started covering the wrongful conviction of, again,

someone who you were in jail with, david lemus, also wrongfully convicted. and you were in disbelief that there could be two people in such close proximity. >> when i came so my own certainty, that david lemus was probably innocent, i visited him at the prison he was at on thanksgiving day, on the anniversary for the murder for which he was wrongfully convicted. i walked into the lobby and i see a woman holding the hands of two little boys. she stops me and says, are you dan? i hate to tell this part of the story, bro. >> because you can see those two little boys. >> i wasn't there and i can see them. j.j.'s older son was on maria's right side. john, jr., and jacob, was on

her left side. they came up to her waist, you know? and i didn't know who these people were. and maria says, my son, j.j., he's innocent, can you help us? and i didn't believe her. but it was the little boy, jacob, who looked up at me with these eyes. these huge, beautiful saucer eyes, and my wife wasn't even pregnant yet. i was about to be a father. i have known j.j. longer than i know my daughter who is in college. and i looked at that boy's eyes and my immediate thought was, i don't care if his father is innocent or guilty. this little kid should not be in a prison on thanksgiving morning. that was the beginning for me. what happened there were

letters from j.j. and a relationship that insued that today, 22 years later, i would put myself in front of a train for him. i would take a bullet for him. >> i know. it's emotional. >> he's among the closest people in my life. >> j.j., and i want to talk about your relationship. i want to talk about those little boys, because from that moment on, you were behind bars for another twenty years. what was taken from them in that time and how hard was it for you to be away from them? >> i would say it starts with the fact that what they took from both of us. they took the right to be a father from me and they took the right to have a father present from them. our lives were lived in

pictures. not in real time. the only real time we had was on visits. where you can barely do anything. and for the first ten years of my children's life, as a father, i'm scared, because they spent five days in school and one day in prison and only had one day to build their social lives. and that's just not the life for a child. they deserve better. >> through all of that pain, j.j., you never gave up. >> no. >> you continued to give every piece of evidence you could to dan for his investigations. you continued to ask for retrial after retrial. you were never granted freedom at that moment. how did you keep going? >> hope. purpose.

during the early part of my incarceration, i read this book and it's called, man search for meaning. it's a very thin book, but it's so powerful. it was about victor frankel himself, who was at the concentration camps and he was studying the people around him. and what he found was that the people who survived the holocaust survived because they were tied to a sense of purpose. and so that led me to believe that i had to find a sense of purpose while i was in prison. it took awhile for me to figure it out, but when my mother approached me on a visit one day, she's just like, i can see you slipping. i see that you're changing. don't let this place change you. you need to grow. they can lock up your body, but they can't lock up your mind. >> in 2021, you did learn that the governor granted you clemency. in the eyes of new york, you

are still a convicted criminal. but what was that moment like when the gates opened and you walked outside a free man? >> when that gate opened, my purpose was right in front of me, because my family was waiting for me right there. my children, my mother, that was my hope. that was my purpose. i think that as hard as it is for me to swallow what about about to say, i realized that as much as i've been through, there was a need for me to go through that. to be in a position that i'm in right now, to have this conversation with you, and to be able to touch the world. i'm not an anomaly. there are hundreds and thousands of wrongfully convicted people on this earth and they are suffering just like i suffered. and they are not being heard.

when we come back, with millions of fans and billions of dollars, women's sports are breaking records. our conversation with sports icons, sue byrd and megan is next. >> we came to the excuse. everybody watches women's sports.

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. >> welcome back. 2024 has marked what might be the biggest year on record welcome back. 2024 has marked what might be the biggest year on record for women sports in america. from the wnba finals, breaking records for viewership, to american women winning more than half of the country's gold medals at the olympics in paris. if american women were their own country, they would have placed third in overall medal count. two trail blazing athletes say the talent and the fans have always been there, but now the rest of the country is finally catching up to what they've

always known. everyone watches women's sports. i sat down with rapino and byrd for a meet the moment conversation. >> let's talk about where we are in women's sports. the women's ncaa basketball tournament had more viewers than men's this year. women made up 50% of team u.s.a. for the first time in olympic history. megan, when you think about those numbers, what does that say about where we are as a country? >> you always say this, but everybody is catching up. everybody knows now what we've known for a long time. like when sue played in the final four, her stadium was sold out. and that was already happening then. the u.s. national team has been winning medals for a long time. u.s. women in the olympics dominated for a very long time. and now you're seeing the investment match the quality and the ability of the players.

you're seeing the investment match the appetite that the fans have and the demand from the fans. the demand from the fans have been there, but things haven't been available, whether that's on streaming or on tv or whatever it may be. this moment is like, i feel like that came to an end of why nobody watches women's sports. turns out, everybody watches women's sports. we're really entertaining. we are really amazing off the court. we care about our teammates. we care about our community. we care about politics. we care about making the world a better place, and it's an incredibly desirable product for people to watch, for players to play in. for sponsors to sponsor. for people to put on tv. we always just feel like we've been knowing this is ready and i feel like everyone else is now ready for that. >> and i think about other stars, like kaitlyn clark,

angel reese, these women who are now, like the two of you, in the spot light and superstars and at the top of their game. i wonder what you would say to them, what you have said to them, about how to both be focused on your sport and your craft, but also manage all of that pressure, which is a lot. >> yeah, it's really fun, rewarding, and also interesting to watch these younger athletes step into their professional careers. kaitlyn and angel are two great examples. what i see immediately. i think some of this has to do with college, like so much earlier, these athletes are thinking about themselves as businesses, as brands, and it's amazing because they are carrying that with them. everything is bigger. they seem so much more self- aware than i ever was at that age. i would say that you ever were. that wasn't our world, but now

they are in that world. my only advice is usually just to make sure they keep basketball the main thing, because at the end of the day, that is your vehicle. it's your vehicle to -- angel reese has a podcast. it's the vehicle to get you to that point. you always want to make sure that part doesn't fall off. >> well, of course, sports is a business as well. last year, forecasted that 2024 would be the first year that revenue for women's elite sports would surpass a billion dollars. but where do you put it in the ark of what you are hoping to accomplish? does more need to be done and what more needs to be done? >> megan and i talk about this all the time. a lot of times, we're not looked at based on our potential. whether it's a young athlete, someone who accomplished a lot. it's never like, oh, let me invest in this and see what happens in five to ten years, because i see something.

it's always, okay, what have you done and do you deserve to be paid now based on what you did to. i challenge corporate companies, businesses, tv networks, to start looking at us based on our potential, what they think is going to happen. not, let's wait and see if this is real. >> what is your message if you could speak to lawmakers. to people who have the ability to change things, not just in sports, but across all industries. what's the message to them? >> i would love for people to just believe in it. that would be reflected in the policies they craft up. that's obviously not the case and it's been entrenched. public investment is in the hundreds of billions. stadiums, practice facilities, investment around building, you know, the restaurants and the scene around the stadiums. a lot of that is done with public money. show me the area where billions

of dollars have been invested into women sports, women, young girls, education, any of that. so, i think from a holistic perspective, there's so much we need to do. >> you have both been celebrated and recently your number was retired by the seattle rain. and the you have a street named after you in seattle. sue, what are those moments like? >> so those are powerful. they are powerful, they are meaningful. i think where i've landed with it is, you know, you play the game. you set some records, you win some championships. the memories always stay, but there's an athlete that comes and breaks one of your records or wins more gold medals and you start to realize, okay, so what's this other impact that i've had? when you're go honored, those last for ever. and that really, i think is an

indicator of your legacy and more than that, it's a see it, be it moment for a young girl out there, right? we actually changed the world in that way, because i didn't have athletes that had jerseys retired or streets named after them to be like, i want to try to do that one day. now there's a younger generation that can see us and try to do that. >> you use that word, legacy. what do you think your legacy is and will be? >> that's a good question for other people to answer. i think part of the legacy is, growing our individual teams. growing the sport. to think about where the sport is now for a rodman versus where it was for me. and there's a million people involved in that. to have our fingerprints on it, i think when i think about legacy. i think about seeing openly gay people in the stands and stands and seeing black lives matter

in the stands. continuing to win, which has always been the legacy. which is the legacy i picked up. now these players get to take it to a whole new level and blow us out of the water and i feel like that's exciting for us and meaningful for us. we built something that was sturdy to stand on, now they are flying. when we come back, nbc savannah guthrie opens up about her faith journey. >> the number one thing i say, bring those doubts to god. bring your whole self to god. he's not afraid of her questions. and poetry from one of the greats. our meet the press minute is next. >> we write poetry, because poetry has been written for 20, 30, 40,000 years, and it's in us.

. >> welcome back. we introduced "meet the moment" just last year.

but this broadca welcome back. we asintroduced meet the moment just last year, but this broadcast has been a form for cultural icons for more than 77 years. on christmas day there 1955, robert frost joined meet the press, asked which of his poems best captured the spirit of america, frost shared these memorable lines. >> the lamb was ours before we were the lambs. she was our lamb more than 100 years before we were her people. she was ours in massachusetts, in virginia, but we were englands. still colonials possessing what we were still unpossessed by. something we were withholding made us weak until we found ourselves we were withholding from our land of living and forth with found salvation and

surrender. such as we were, we gave ourselves the deed of gift was many deeds of war, to the land vaguely realizing westward, but still unstoried, unenhanced, such as she was, such as she would become. and it all lies in that first line, the land was ours before we were the lands.

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. >> to learn more about the books featured on "meet the press," go to nbcnews.com/books. you'll also find new releases on history, biography, and more. nbc news receives a commission for sales made through our website. >> welcome back. you know her as the co-anchor of the "today show." but no welcome avback. you know her as the coanchor of the today show. now, savannah guthrie is

showing the world a new side of herself, her relationship to her faith. while she doesn't consider herself a theologian, savannah says like so many americans, she has had a spiritual journey. from sunday school to choir practice. she always saw god as the sixth member of her family. in her book, mostly what god does, savannah explores her relationship with god and how it impacted the biggest moments of her life. i sat down for a very special meet the moment conversation with my nbc news colleague to discuss what she's learned while reflecting on her deep beliefs. >> why did you want to write this book now? >> no one is more surprised than me that i wrote a book about anything, let alone about faith and about god. it's the most personal and vulnerable thing i've ever done. >> as someone who has known you for a long time, i have to say one of the most beautiful parts of reading this book is i hear your voice in every word. >> really? >> i felt like i was sitting

with you. >> for better or worse. >> and i think the world gets to hear your voice every morning on tv, but how did you find your written voice? your literary voice? >> i love to hear you say that, because we are dear friends. i've had many of my friends say, this is so funny reading this, it's like sitting coffee with you, or more like wine in my case. i just wrote my own thoughts. i tried to make it very simple, very plain, very down to earth, very accessible. it's not a religious tone. i'm the first to put the disclaimer on. i'm not a biblical scholar. i'm not offering myself up as some great example of religious learning. i'm just a regular human who has walked in faith and out of faith over years and years and these are some of the things i learned. i learned them mostly when things went wrong. mostly when they were disasters

and disasters often of my own making. the book is very simple. it's simple, but it's not easy. mostly what god does and the rest of the senses. mostly what god does is love you. >> as you say, you are a person of faith. you grew up with god as the sixth member of your household. you say. what do you say to people who feel like they lost their faith? how do they find it again? >> i understand, and i think god understands. we live in a broken world. this is not the world that god intended. there are hard questions. and i try to talk about those things. where is god in a world that looks to be full of injustice and despair and suffering. whether it's what we do in our business, looking at the news every day, and lives lived, disappointments mound, and struggle seems constant. i ask those questions. what are we supposed to believe about god? how are we supposed to find him? i don't answer all the

questions of the universe that are unanswerable. spoiler alert. if i did, the book would be longer and i would charge more. but, i don't think it is a mistake and i don't think it's a lack of faith. the number one thing i say is bring those doubts to god. bring your whole self to god. he's not afraid of our questions. >> you write candidly about one of the hardest times in your life, losing your father. at the age of 16, you say i remember my friends asking if i could still believe in god if his sudden death at the age of 49 made me doubt my beliefs. no, i said, this is when i need god the most. but savannah, a lot of people still wonder, how were you able to keep your faith and find such a strong relationship with it all these years later despite such a devastating loss at such a young age? >> when i said that to my friends, i was 16 years old. that was my first reaction.

i can't give up god. i can't lose my dad and god at the same time. the rest of my life is a story of any kind of relationship, where there's been a breech of trust. and when we have things that come to us that are hard. when we have suffering, it is a breech of trust. i write about this. i don't think that god is the author of evil, suffering, and death. this is not the world he intended. but, the fact of the matter is, this is the crucible of faith. for whatever reasons, he does permit it. this world is still going on in a broken way that is full of heartbreak and it is very understandable to ask where is god in those moments and that is what my life has been about. asking those questions. and i think that what i've learned is r i believe, and this is my leap of faith. we will one day have a better world on earth as it is in

heaven. the one intended. until that day, we are asked to believe and just draw close to god and believe that he will draw close to us. >> you're very candid about the moments in your life when you did not feel close to god. when you could not access your faith. you are doing the hard work. you started that very early with vail by taking her to church. i love your mom sent the hymns to you on your cd. >> people keep asking me, do your kids go to church? yes, i drag them to church. yes, i do. >> and you do the work yourself. >> you have to do the work, but you're right, it's very candid. i write about taking not months, not days, not a few weeks, but years in which yes, i believed in a distant kind of way, but it's not like i was waking up every morning doing bible study or practices or was living a life i would want to

hold up to some religious scrutiny. no, i was a regular person. there were times in my life where i was disappointed with the way things turned out, that i probably did blame god and i just kind of checked out. and what i learned is that it doesn't matter how much we think of god. it does not matter what we think of god. it doesn't change how he thinks about us. it does not matter. it does not change how he treats us. so, this is the big, i think for me, the big ah-ha. the big message of the book. mostly what god does is love you. his love has nothing to do with our thoughts of him. it has nothing to do with our actions, good or bad. it has nothing to do with who we are. it has everything to do with who he is. >> you said having children made you understand god's love for you. how did that revelation happen? >> i mean, you know this being a mom, it's a revelation in

every single way. but spiritually, it really was, too. there was a moment when i realized when my daughter was born, of course, this love that was unimaginable to me before. and unlike any other i experienced. because it's the closest i think we'll ever come to understanding how god relates to us. because a mother or father's love for their child is unconditional. again, it doesn't matter how they act. on their worst day, your love is not any different for your daughter. on their worst day, no matter what she does, if she's a teen, there's not one thing you could do or say for or against that she could do that would make you change your mind about her. when you realize that's how god feels about us, it is stunning. it's stunningly intimate and tender. it's almost too good to believe. >> and savannah's children's book, mostly what god does is love you, will be out in february. that is all for today, thank

you so much for watching. happy new year. we will be back next week, because if it's sunday, it's "meet the press." ♪ ♪♪ we know this grateful america. we are strong. we ca