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christmas ♪ good morning and welcome to this special new year's eve edition of "morning joe," bringing you some of our best segments from the past several weeks. first up, a closer look at one of the first things that donald trump has said he'll do when he takes office. >> donald trump's immigration and border policy plans continue to come into sharper focus, a centerpiece of trump's campaign was his vow to carry out mass deportations while in office. during his interview sunday on nbc's "meet the press," the president-elect said his administration would first focus on convicted criminals, but he did not rule out that american citizens would be caught up in the sweep and be deported with family members who are here illegally. >> well, i don't want to be breaking up families so the only way you don't break up the family is you keep them together and you have to send them all back. we don't have to separate families. we'll send the whole family very

humanely back to the country where they came, that way the family is not separated. if they came here illegally but the family is here legally, the person has a choice. the person who came in illegally can go out or they can all go out together. >> trump has hired larry homan to help carry out his immigration enforcement plans. he will serve as border czar in the incoming administration. meanwhile, trump's pick to lead i.c.e. is an agency veteran who will be able to start the deportation effort on day one. one official told nbc news that caleb vitelo grew up in the enforcement and removal operations division. he even received praise from the chief of staff at i.c.e. during the first two years of the biden administration who called him, quote, a thoughtful, good

leader. the president-elect also said on sunday he was willing to work with congress to protect dreamers, those who were brought to the country illegally as children, despite his efforts to gut the program during his first term. >> the dreamers are going to come later and we have to do something about the dreamers because these are people that have been brought here at a very young age and many of these are middle aged people now. they don't even speak the language of their country and, yes, we're going to do something about -- >> what does that mean? what are you going to do? >> i will work with the democrats on a plan. if we can come up with the plan, but the democrats made it very, very difficult to do anything. republicans are very open to the dreamers. >> so, it is very interesting, jonathan. i wonder about your reporting, what we're hearing from people in the trump team is he wants to focus on the criminals, the violent criminals, basically

those that 80% of americans would agree need to go out. he talks about wanting to do a deal with democrats. i'm also hearing that behind the scenes that the dream thinks there is actually a deal they can make. of course, as we heard last time from last administration he'll talk about this deal and you get close to the deal, he pulls back because the base gets angry. what are you hearing about what they want to do? >> there is at least some appetite in the trump team for a deal, thinking there can be -- there is an opening for something. we have to keep a couple of things in mind. as discussed, there are other times where he was close to a deal and pulled back, sometimes simply because he was criticized on the news by a host there and suddenly changed his mind, didn't want to seem as selling out the base. there are voices, influential voices in the trump team, stephen miller, chief among them, who do not want a deal.

they want a full on mass deportation plan. we would see protests from people in the street, businesses, saying you're destroying the economy, you can't do this. this is a typical trump move where he yields the worst case scenario, really overheated rhetoric and creating an opening for a deal, but so many times in the past, that deal didn't get struck. the issue will be is there with -- now that he doesn't face voters again, will he make a deal? we said for months, we have to take him at his word, he's also talking about mass deportations. the truth is somewhere in the middle. >> that interview with kristen welker, he said he would try to end birth right citizenship, you're born here, you're a citizen, as soon as he gets into office. let's bring in democratic congressman robert garcia. congressman, thank you for being with us. a lot to sift through there as we talked about proposed immigration policy. let's start at the end there with birth right citizenship.

president-elect trump says to get rid of it. what is your reaction? >> all the new ideas that trump is coming out with, his proclamation over the weekend, besides being unconstitutional are quite un-american and shameful. i'm an immigrant myself. i was not documented. this idea that somehow we're not contributing to the country is really sad to see. frankly most of his ideas are out of step with most americans want. his claim he's going to separate families, who is going to be doing that work? police officers have a job to do. we have a police shortage across the country. they don't want to spend their time separating families. so whether it is birth right citizenship, mass deportation, separating families, we have to be principled and oppose this, not only is it not good for the economy, it is actually quite un-american and quite frankly democrats are going to strongly oppose every single step of the way. >> and birth right citizenship

has been enshrined in the constitution in the 14th amendment for a long time anyway. it would take a major act. you can't wave a magic wound and get rid of that. how are you approaching as you think about the trump administration more broadly the sort of tension between his rhetoric, the things he may say at a rally during a campaign or an interview, or to talk to his base and to keep them on board, versus what you actually believe he's going to do? where does that middle ground live for you? >> look, i think a couple of things. one is we have to expect that trump is going to try to do the absolute worst. he tried to do that obviously in his first term. i take him very seriously when he says he wants to separate families. he wants to deport families that are here, working, contributing to this country. so we have to take him at his word. we also know he has a hard time putting together a competent government. both those things can be true.

but we have to be prepared. all of these ideas, particularly on immigration, are unconstitutional. he does not have the authority or the power to make it happen. what he does have unfortunately is people that follow his every word. so we got to be very, very realistic here he's going to have a lot of americans agreeing with these issues, and we got to call out the constitutionality of what he's trying to do and ensure we remind people, these are shameful actions when talking about real kids and families. >> no question, congressman, a lot of people living in fear because of these promises. he obviously won on the basis of at least in part this issue. there are polls that uggest a lot of americans, democrats included, have concerns about the immigration issues in this country. beyond resisting what trump wants to do, what are some efforts that democrats can put forth to actually put solutions to these problems? >> well, i'll start with something that republicans and democrats agree on. that's border security.

we had a bill that had bipartisan support in the senate, we could have got it done, we understand, we want a secure border. we don't want people to create the -- causing crimes here, if they're undocumented, causing crimes, of course they shouldn't be here. we want to support our border patrol agents, make sure there is guest worker programs. these are sensible bipartisan solutions that we can come to. beyond a border security plan, we should also be very clear that, yes, we need a comprehensive immigration reform package in this country. the president is talking about dreamers. we would welcome a plan on dreamers. do i think he's going to follow through with it? absolutely not. we would welcome a plan on dreamers. those are the types of issues that we're ready and we're at the table on, but what we're not going to do is stand by and have them separate families and put kids back into detention camps. >> robert garcia of california, thank you so much. jonathan, this conversation is interesting where it is moving.

you look at "the washington post" editorial board, which i'm sure this morning their editorial is guided by what they're hearing behind the scenes from the trump camp, which is the trump camp wants to do a deal on immigration. and what "the washington post" editorial board said today is, plan for the worst, expect the worst, but when you can get a deal, if you can get a deal, take that deal and i think your question really framed it perfectly, that's what i think democrats on the hill right now are sort of sifting through, what's for the base, what's rhetoric and what deal can we have? democrats should take him up on this offer to negotiate a legislative solution for the dreamers, for example, even as they resist any effort to politicize law enforcement. jonathan? >> yeah, no, i think that's right. as a congressman, even this summer, s and some very

conservative republicans put together a deal on border security. trump walked away from it, told republicans to shoot it down because he wanted to preserve it as a campaign issue. they did so. so with that as sort of past it prologue, a lot of democrats feel is he going to come to the table, start talking, and then walk away because he'll bow to the base? that is something certainly he's done in the past. i do think there will, the congressman said it, democrats will make good faith efforts. if you make a deal, let's do it. will there be follow through because trump in the past sometimes his own worst impulses would submarine what could have been real legislative accomplishments but he was too afraid to stand up to his base. we'll have to see if this time is any different. up next, the president-elect says another one of his campaign promises may be tougher than expected to deliver. we'll dig into that. than expected to deliver. we'll dig into that. done nothing wrong in the wo rld, and they end up having to go through all of this to survive. speaker 3: is your throat sore? speaker 2: your donation, it means everything.

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donald trump's often repeated campaign promises this year was to bring down the price

of groceries very quickly. >> because people can't afford their groceries and they're going to be affording their groceries very soon. >> and i want to lower groceries. very simple word groceries, like almost -- who uses the word? i started using the word, the groceries. >> a vote for trump means your groceries will be cheaper. >> it will also bring your grocery bill way down. i have more complaints on grocery -- the word grocery, sort of simple word, but means like everything you eat, the stomach is speaking, it always does. and i have more complaints about that, bacon and things going up, double, triple, quadruple. >> i don't like the tags very much. look at that, up 46% eggs, wow. up 65%, wow. school lunches up 65%. how can a family afford that? i haven't seen cheerios in a long time. i'm going to take them back with me. bacon is through the roof. they're all through the roof. the milk, everything is bad.

everything we're going to straighten it out, we're going to bring prices way down and we're going to get it done fast. >> marveling at his own discovery of the word grocery. in his "time" person of the year interview, he act knowledged lowering the price of groceries won't be so easy, saying, it is hard to bring things down once they're up, you know, it's very hard, but i think that they will. jonathan lemire, there is so much to plow through and dig through in this "time" person of the year interview, all the admissions of, well, i said a lot on the campaign trail but it is going to be tougher once i'm in the white house. we'll dig into a whole bunch of that as we go. but obviously, no one, no president, no person can come in on day one and bring down the price of eggs, bacon and other groceries. it is a word, you know, it is a simple word that people are using now.

groceries. >> groceries, all the rage. such a tell when trump is reading something for the first time and reacts to it in real time like he was with the price tags and saw the cheerios on the table, and realized, yeah, that might be his lunch there at bedminster that day. mike barnicle, you have been for months, if not years, have been singularly focused on the price of groceries. you got there before trump did. those at the market basket franchise you and so i -- >> he goes early mornings on his day off. >> near and dear to our hearts. >> 6:30 a.m., market basket doing the grocery shopping. it was amazing to me during the past campaign that the democrats didn't focus more on the actual cost of groceries. they kept talking about the national economy, in terms of global economies, the strongest in the world, yes, but the lived economy, the way people actually live and pay for things, nowhere does it occur more in reality

each and every day than in grocery stores and at gas stations. and i'm wondering, what do you think, elise, what do you think the over/under is on the last time that donald trump was in the grocery store? 40 years, 50 years? >> wow. i mean, does 7-eleven count on the campaign stop, maybe on the campaign trail he wandered in. i would add fast food to your list of concerns too, which merges with groceries. it is insane how expensive fast food has gotten and so much of the country relies on it. just the other day, getting a chick-fil-a, $4.75, that's insane. >> mcdonald's has semi happy meals. >> he effectively appeared at mcdonald's, those and his team thought that was effective.

this will be a moment where trump acknowledged, look, it is hard to bring the prices down. do we think that he faces -- will face any sort of backlash from supporters if he doesn't? will we see that reflected in his poll numbers? president biden would drag down his poll numbers more than anything was high prices, right, inflation, it costs so much more to go to the store, to go to mcdonald's, whatever it might be. in the past, his supporters have stayed with trump and he made this such a signature promise, one wonders if six months from now, a year from now, 18 months from now, things are still high what that does to his aprfl. >> "the new york times" has a new piece on president biden as he is a little over a month away from leaving office. it is titled "a weary biden heads for the exit." in his final weeks, the president is determined to finish on a high note and shape his legacy. a sprint to the finish line as chief of staff jeff zients puts it. the biggest box left is a

cease-fire in gaza. and if he manages that, it would be a validating triumph for a departing president. otherwise, he's wrapping up his time in office by claiming credit for the healthy economy that he is turning over to his ungrateful successor and by getting money previously approved by congress out the door for roads and bridges and for arms for ukraine abroad. >> jonathan, this gaza cease-fire has haunted him for some time. i mean, it has been front of mind now for a year. do they think -- we just talked to jake -- sounds like they're optimistic they may get it by the very end. >> they're hopeful. as jake told us a short time ago, they have been close before and have seen it fall apart. there is no question president biden for more than a year now deeply frustrated by the situation in gaza, at times frustrated with prime minister netanyahu, not believing all the time that he was a good faith

partner in trying to get a deal, trying to get a cease-fire and those hostages home, believing that the war was a political albatross for him as well, believing that was a real obstacle to his re-election campaign even before the disastrous debate there in atlanta. but the fallout, he believes, impacted the vice president's chances as well. it is interesting, biden kept a pretty low profile here in these final weeks. he is an institutionalist, he does believe in not wanting to criticize the incoming administration, he's made his feelings about donald trump clear in the past. but he is largely working behind the scenes trying to get this deal done with a few other events to try to shape his legacy and trump proof his accomplishments before his successor comes. >> it is fascinating, you look at presidents that leave with lower approval ratings, whether it is george w. bush, go back historically to harry truman, a lot of times they have economic problems and a lot of other things that are going in different directions. said it before, five years from

now, people are looking back most likely at the numbers. the economic numbers that joe biden has. and they're going to go, wow, okay, what was that all about? sort of like george h.w. bush. we found out a couple of years later that actually the economy started growing again in the fourth quarter. but with biden, you have actually two or three years of really good economic numbers. you have bipartisan legislation, did a better job on that than any other president in the 21st century. it is interesting right now, he is leaving that picture head down, sort of slowly heading for the exits, not saying a whole lot, i'm wondering what that legacy looks like in five years. >> well, i don't know, joe, i think history will be at the lead of that story will be looking back on his time in office will be that he was the person who beat donald trump in

2020 and helped to end the pandemic. and there will also be a very -- in that double barrel lead, there will also be that he was essentially forced off the ticket by his own party late in the presidential election here, which is a pretty extraordinary thing. i don't think that a good economic numbers or anything else will obscure how singular and how central that will be to his legacy and there is still democrats who think he never should have left the ticket, there are democrats who thought he never should have run for re-election at all at his age and that will be pretty fiercely debated for a long time. i will say to jonathan lemire's point, he has not been low profile, he pretty much ceded the stage to donald trump. he went on that foreign trip recently where i believe i saw some reporting that said he said exactly seven words to the traveling press while out of the country for almost two weeks. it is kind of amazing, even for george w. bush, you think back,

he left office in 2008, with a lower approval rating than joe biden has now, approval rating in the 20s, but he was still out there trying to shape his legacy, giving farewell addresses and trying to frame his accomplishments. we don't know if biden will do that or not. it has been kind of amazing the degree to which he said not only there is one president that the institutionalists would say, there is one president at a time, he's still the president, but for a lot of people it felt like donald trump has been president since election day. coming up, a new documentary is shedding light on how the criminal justice system impacts children whose parents are incarcerated. the co-directors of the film "daughters" will join us straight ahead here on "morning joe." " will join us straight ahead here on "morning joe. and believe me, i know all about slow. that's why i'm here to tell you about jardiance — it's a little pill... ...proven to slow the progression of ckd... ...and reduce the risk of kidney failure, which can lead to dialysis. serious side effects include increased ketones in blood or urine, which can be fatal.

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my daughter was born when i was in prison. i had to see her through the glass. couldn't kiss her. couldn't hold her. >> my mother was incarcerated. it was, like, my daughter is going through the same thing i've been through. >> it is not okay. i'm just getting older and, like, won't be here to see the memories. >> one girl said, my dad can't come to the dance because he's in jail. and one girl suggested why don't we just take the dance in the jail? >> a golden opportunity to see your daughters and spend time with them. >> i'm going to be very honest with you guys, it is going to be

an emotional roller coaster for you. >> i like it. >> the award winning netflix documentary "daughters," the emotional film follows four daughters of men incarcerated in a washington, d.c. jail who through the date with dad program are able to spend quality time with their daughters at a dance put on inside the detention center. the documentary spans over several years. capturing the burdens each family must carry while they navigate the criminal justice system. and joining us now, the co-directors of "daughters," angela patton and natalie rae. this looks so powerful. angela, i'll start with you. >> yes. >> how did you all come to this project? how did the idea happen? >> yes, i was able to do a ted woman talk about this experience

i was able to have with girls in my program in richmond, virginia, girls for a change, where they're part of social change projects, thinking about ways they can tackle issues in their community. and this particular project was about the narrative of black fatherhood. and these girls decided that they needed to really celebrate their fathers by creating a dance of their own. and during this event planning, they discovered that one of their friends had a father that was incarcerated. and they really wanted him to attend. and when they found out about the criminal justice system that he could not come out, they asked the sheriff in our community, could they come inside have and this special dance that would be rare, but would be necessary to connect girls to their fathers in spite of their incarceration. >> two things comes to mind here hearing about the film. one is i think people do not understand that when someone goes to jail, their family also does the time. and the family may not have

committed any crime. i'm not making excuses for people who should go to jail, but the kids grow up during the same time, they're just out on the other side of the bars. talk about, though, how this kind of bringing the kids in that you and angela do in this documentary also helps to reform some of the inmates because they start feeling the love and the bonding that maybe they should have felt more of before they did whatever crime, if they were guilty, many were, that it helps to reform and redirect them. >> right, so, the core of this program and of the dance is about bringing families together and building a connection back that is gone. and we see throughout the film and through our experience with these girls that the system is actually set up really to divide families, visitation is largely shut down, now families are being charged money to do video

conference calls, so within a matter of months in a child's life that can be devastating and impacts are so deep in terms of how their mental health, school, it goes on and on, what that really does, even in the short amount of time. so this is a place where touch, celebration, love, connection, is really nurtured and it is incredible to see what just those five, six hours can do for a long time. and we're seeing that the fathers, 95% of fathers that have gone through this program have not returned to jail. >> angela, these are very young girls, age 5 to 13, the four girls in the movie. some of them don't know their fathers very well because they're locked up. so, i didn't realize, i don't think most people realized how difficult it is for them to see their mother or father in prison. what was the reception initially from the warden, from the people at the jail? was there resistance to this idea? >> fortunately when the girls

wrote the letter to the first sheriff, he understood when families are connected, most likely they would not return. he had an open mind, and then we actually received a call from a social worker, miss chapman, in washington, d.c., and she saw the ted talk as well as natalie and she said, i believe this could be expanded because i see the results and i understand that if we were able to convince our sheriff and warden that they could see that this would not only be great for the fathers because they need the connection, but the morale of the inmates doing their time. and also, you know, the cultural climate of the facility officers. it helps everyone, you know, go back to the humanity, right? and that at the end of the day, no one should be disconnected from their family because it is

a correctional facility. and we're not correcting anyone when we have unforgivable practices that destroy our communities. >> and we heard the clip of the father talking about not being able to hold his daughter, not being able to hug her, just basic things that we all take for granted, that's one of the remarkable things about this film is there is nothing pad about it. it is not like you end with a dance and everybody is happy. talk about the different reactions. for some of the girls it was joyous. for others they struggled. and then you made the decision, both of you did, to continue this film even after the dance. talk about that. >> yeah. so there is four girls in this film, and they all had really different relationships with their fathers. so it was important for us to show a span of daughters and, of course, every father/daughter

relationship is different. so some go through the dance and they -- it has been a year, they love each other. this is a nice reconnection moment, they have lots of memories. some haven't, don't remember even meeting their fathers so this is the first time they're starting a bond and maybe a friendship. for another one it is a good-bye for maybe 30 years, you know, the stakes are very high and everyone's story is different. so, it is just to show the span of what different families are going through and how much this dance means to all of them. and it would have been easy to end after the dance, just this emotional climax and wrap it up, but truly we wanted to dedicate the film to what this one day would do for the years to come. so we follow the girls for another five years after, and in the film you'll see really what this does long-term having this one day of connection. >> the documentary "daughters" is streaming now on netflix. co-directors angela patton and

natalie rae, thank you very much. >> thank you. >> incredible. still ahead, a new movie seeks to retell the ancient greek epic poem "the odyssey," focusing on the hero's return to ithaca. it starts academy award winning actress juliette binoche, she and the director join us to discuss their new film "the return." that will be next here on "morning joe." the return." that will be next here on "morning joe." insurance to good use — at america's best. book an exam today. my name is brayden. i was five years old when i came to st. jude. i'll try and shorten down the story. so i've been having these headaches that wouldn't go away. my mom, she was just crying. what they said, your son has brain cancer. it was your worst fear coming to life. watching your child grow up is the dream of every parent.

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i am odyssesu's wife. >> he is dead. >>ed no to me. >> he took the best man with him. >> all years suitors have been turning up. >> scoundrels are here for your wealth. >> look at this island. >> it is a wasteland. >> gangs of thugs terrifying people. >> they need me alive. at least until i choose my husband.

>> mother, you can't live with the saveages anymore. >> i will choose whom. >> making a fool of you. of us all. >> i know who you are. >> that was a look at the new movie "the return." the film is giving a fresh look at homer's 3,000-year-old epic "the odyssey," focusing on king's odysseus' return home. it features juliette binoche as queen penelope. they're reuniting on screen for first time since their performances in "the english patient" 30 years ago. juliette joins us now with the director and writer of the film, uberto pasolini. thank you for being here this morning. uberto, you went deep into history for the source material here. the scholars believe that this portion of the odyssey was

written between 725 and 675 bc. why do you think it still has resonance today? >> i think homer has residence today as it always did. it is timeless to understand what it means to be human, what it means to be a husband, what it means to be a wife, what it means to be a son, what it means to be part of a family what it means to go to war and come back from war, he's timeless. his understanding of what we are all about is wonderful. it is surprising that not more people have taken the challenge to bring him again in front of contemporary audience. >> and, juliette, this is what ralph fiennes says about you, she's fiercely and intuitively and profoundly -- about situations, emotions. i love acting with her. i love what i receive from her as an actor. it's beautiful to work with her. i just have to ask, how is it to

work with a guy that is so -- how hard is it to work with a guy that is so -- so grudging in handing out compliments? >> oh, my lord. >> it has been a wonderful reunion, right? >> it was great. after 28 years and we have done -- it is our third film together. and it was great together again and have the joy of acting, which is really listening, and opening your being, your heart, and yet having a purpose. and uberto, as a director and writer, he really worked on that on the script. it was just when i read it, it was just -- i was taken by it and i just wanted to be in it. and the fact that he chose me as the possible wife was even better. >> uberto, i'm wondering if you could talk about the challenges in bringing to life, bringing to the screen and modernizing an

ancient text. i'm sure in some ways it was fun because you had even more creative license, but many haven't tried this, so can you talk a little bit about that? >> i think first of all it is homer. i think in order to think about the attempting a new fresh style with homer, you have to be arrogant and clearly i am. you have to be foolish. you have to have luck, good fortune of being able to work with talents like juliette and ralph. not just unbelievably talented but generous with their talent. and the issue, as i was saying, it is modern, we didn't have to make him modern because he's timeless. but we did make some choices and what we focused on was on the family stories specifically. this is an odyssey of the soul. it is not an odyssey of travel, of monsters, of gods, but a people like this us, in situations like we encounter every day, friends of ours who come back from war.

i did a lot of reading about vietnam vets and that reading very much influenced this fresh version of "the odyssey." but homer is fresh and should not be left to the schoolteachers that maybe -- >> juliette, let me ask you, what do you hope this film, this story, what impression do you hope it left with audiences? >> wow, questioning the purpose of wars and why we go to wars. questioning, you know, how long it takes for human kind to go back to their soul, to their home, their inside home and the outside home. it is a reflection on relationships and family and looking for your father. i think it reaches so many

important questions and also a joy of the scenery because it's wide, it's a large landscape and skies and seas. and so the magic of the image of the film also -- is also very important. and the combination of so many different actors as well that i think is really nourishing the film. >> a timeless story and the new movie "the return" premieres in theaters nationwide this friday. juliette binoche and uberto pasolini, thank you for being here this morning. >> thank you for having us. still ahead, the play "oh mary" has been a hit on broadway since it started earlier this year. now the emmy nominated betty gilpin will join the cast. they discuss the comedy's wild premise right here on "morning joe." he comedy's wild premise right here on "morning joe. since high school.

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few plays in recent years have taken broadway by storm quite like the new comedy "oh, mary," written by and starring cole escola. it takes some creative liberty, imagining the life of a frustrated drunken mary todd lincoln in the weeks leading up to the assassination of abraham lincoln. cole is now handing over the reins to emmy nominated actress betty gilpin who will play the former first lady starting january 21st for a limited eight week engagement. the show will be extending its run deep into next year, late june and cole and betty join us now. so great to have you here. >> thank you for having us and for breaking this scoop. >> yeah, that's the scoop. i guess i stole some of the thunder, cole. i'll let you dive in a little deeper. this has been so well received as we begin to explain what has happened. this is the show on broadway, this is the must-see show right now. i saw it last week.

it blew my mind. i like what "the new york times" wrote about it, cole escola's unhinged historical fantasia. i think that describes it pretty well. >> thanks. thank you. >> tell me about handing over the torch. >> well, you know, she just wouldn't leave me alone. she's been hounding me for -- ever since the show started. >> since birth. >> since birth. no, i have to take a break because i was -- i have to write some scripts that i've already been paid to write, like, two years ago. and i was, like, i'll get to them after the play finishes downtown. and then here we are almost a year later and people are angry. and so i called the most talented actress i know. >> she wasn't available. >> she wasn't available. >> she said, do you know a little gal named betty gilpin?

but i couldn't be more excited about betty. >> so, betty, tell me from your side about that phone call what it was like to get the offer? >> strangely i was doing a movie series about james garfield, another assassinated president, i was playing the first lady lucretia. i was in full lucretia regalia, petticoat and all and got the call to come play mary todd and i hit the floor in tears. this is a total dream come true. i had been obsessed with cole forever. their brain is one of the most brilliant on the planet and i'm also completely obsessed with "oh, mary" and i can't wait. >> this all happened so quickly. as you said it was off broadway, started february of this year, right? >> previous start in january, yes. >> but early this year. >> yes. >> and came to broadway in july. >> yes. >> that was the sensation. how have you been able to process any of it or take in what happened so quickly for

you? >> i haven't been able to. i don't think i'll be able to until betty takes over and then, yeah. i mean, it is eight shows a week. it is no joke, you know. eight a week. >> i think a lot of people including myself who watched the show say where in cole's mind was this born? how did you even conceive of this idea? >> i had the idea, i thought what if abraham lincoln's assassination wasn't such a bad thing for mary? i think for a lot of husbands -- for a lot of women, the prospect of their husbands being assassinated is, you know, maybe a hope or a dream that they have. and i wanted to give women a place to come and live out that -- >> feel recognized. >> feel recognized. >> to put that feeling you described in the middle of the most famous assassination of all time, what gave you the idea to place it in that time and place around lincoln? >> just because people have,

like, a concept of how it all happened and i wanted to fill in some of the blanks. yeah. >> betty, with that as the backdrop, what is it like to then step in to what has become so quickly an iconic and popular role and production? >> i mean, i'm very excited. i think that cole and i share some demented brain dna. >> mm-hmm. >> a love of what is ridiculous and wonderful about theater and old hollywood and being -- trying to be profoundly stupid and smart at the same time. >> yes. >> and, yeah, i just feel -- i think so many people, as ridiculous and silly and joyful as the play is, it is also a brilliantly structured and written play. and the role of a lifetime. so while i'm so excited to go be ridiculous and make choices and have so much fun, i'm also just really excited to play one of

the great roles of our time. >> cole, you are obviously very different actors. >> even with the same roles, for years. >> what made you think betty was the right person? >> there are some videos of betty doing a character, an actress in her dressing room, getting ready for a show. >> losing her mind. >> and losing her mind. she just speaks the same demented barbara stanwyck language that i speak. >> yeah, yeah. shirley temple as cruella deville. >> wow. it is all in there. what are you doing to prepare for this? you take over in january, as i said, running through june at least, maybe longer. >> yeah. >> how are you getting ready for it? >> well, so far i'm just running my lines to myself and i have a 4-year-old and she's, like, why are you talking to yourself right now? i'm performing. but you're with me.

well, yes, of course, but first and foremost i'm a performer. so, right now i'm just running lines quietly to myself like a crazy person. >> mommy's working. >> yeah, mommy's sparkling. >> sparkling, yes. don't worry, you can still see cole for a little while here and then in the capable hands of betty from there. congratulations on what you created and all the success of the show. "oh, mary" playing now on broadway through june of next year. writer and star, cole escola and the next mary todd lincoln, betty gilpin. thank you, both. >> thank you. >> betty also soon will star in the western limited series "american primeval" on netflix. we'll look forward to that too. x we'll look forward to that too protect against rsv with arexvy.

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hello. welcome to the special holiday edition of "morning joe."

happy almost 2025. we're on tape this hour, bringing you some of our top recent discussions, including one about how president-elect trump is already claiming some preemptive policy victories before even taking office. we spoke to "the washington post" opinion columnist dana milbank about that. as you point out in "the washington post," the president-elect doesn't take over for six weeks, but magically, he's already made america great again. you write in part this. "he has solved the border crisis. mexico's president has agreed to stop migration through mexico, and into the united states, effectively closing our southern border, trump tells us. this will go a long way toward shopping the illegal invasion of the usa. he has brought peace to the middle east. former nato chief says israel-hezbollah cease-fire, a direct result of incoming trump administration, was the headline

trump posted on his fledgling social media site on monday. he has scored a breakthrough against the opioid epidemic. he announced he has secured the commitment of the canadian government to work with us to end this terrible devastation of u.s. families. and he has already turned the u.s. economy into the envy of the world. the stock market just recorded its best month this year in the wake of trump's landslide victory, proclaimed the headline of another trump social media post." dana, pretty neat trick here for trump to take credit for things before he actually wields the levers of power. tell us more about what you found. but is there any truth to the idea that just the looming presence of trump might be changing at least some things, maybe not the victories he's claiming, but at least some things both at home and abroad? >> well, sure, jonathan, it may be changing things at the margin in terms of the way allies and foreign governments act, but,

you know, basically what's happened here is the fantasy that trump portrayed on the campaign trail is colliding with reality here. look, he said we're a failed nation. now, he's going to inherit this supposedly failed nation. well, what is he going to do then? i mean, on day one most likely, he is going to proclaim victory and start talking about all the greatness of america. it's fairly easy to do since america didn't stop being great in the first place. now, it's kind of a neat trick, except that his supporters seem perfectly willing, like they're in on the joke to some extent. as soon as trump was elected, you saw the polls swing suddenly. republicans are optimistic about the economy. things aren't so bad after all. so, you know, it was a lot. it was a charade going on that trump's own supporters were in

on. at some point, you have to adjust to the reality of the situation, which is that our country is not the disaster he portrayed it to be. so why not preemptively take credit for it? >> dana, you had an interesting podcast yesterday about americans just not believing in experts anymore. what has to happen for experts to win back any faith in their solutions and in their process? >> gosh, i can profess to you right now that i am not an expert on anything, but, you know, look, this is a much bigger problem, what we're having at the moment. you're seeing it in the trump confirmation battles. qualifications really are important, and i think it is an extension of sort of a rejection of expertise. this has been years and years in the building. it's been a discrediting of traditional media. you know, it's hand in hand with the sort of anything goes

alternatively. we'll have to have more of these collisions with reality and, unfortunately, we're going to have to presumably see some disastrous results during the trump presidency that would make people rethink their predispositions. >> susan, in your latest piece for "the new yorker" titled "donald trump is picking fights. will anyone hit back?" you talk about the ways you see leaders appear to be capitulating to the president-elect instead of standing up to him. tell us more about what you found. >> well, look, obviously, there was a lot of surprise, i think, that greeted the decision this week by chris wray to preemp preemptively announce his resignation from the fbi rather than wait for trump to fire him on the spurious grounds of essentially not being personally loyal to donald trump himself. i think there is a robust debate

about how best to deal with the challenge of donald trump coming in, you know, here in europe at a conference. officials in nato, allied government are extremely nervous about trump coming in. they're worried about him making a peace deal with russia, essentially on putin's terms, that would potentially undermine the nato alliance. in the past, trump threatened to walk out of nato all together. what are they doing? they're preemptively signaling, well, hey, we're going to raise our targeted spending to 3% of our gdp on defense. to a certain extent, they're negotiating with themselves at this point. trump hasn't even taken office. is that the right thing to do, to mollify trump, to not get in his sights? or at the same time, is it a disastrous mistake, pause becaun trump will ask for more. you see this to an extent with canada. it was a remarkable thing, to have the president of the united states openly taunting the

leader of canada, saying, you know, maybe you should just become our 51st state. what i thought was interesting was that you didn't hear canadian prime minister justin trudeau clap back at trump and say, wait a minute, not only are we an independent, sovereign county, we may have many advantages over the united states. i mean, that is an insulting as you can get to a foreign government, and i think the response has been notable for how much people are wary of confronting donald trump. >> susan, actually, i completely agree with you, and it goes beyond t even. you see some of the tech giants who have been in crosshairs with trump now turning around and donating heavily to his inauguration committee. i'm wondering if you can dig deeper here. what do you think is the sort of psychology happening right now? think back to 2016 at this time period, going into 2017. you know, if i'm recalling correctly, there was a lot of talk about, you know, how do you fight this? what are the protest movements

going to look like? you know, lawyers are getting ready for the muslim ban. obviously, you had immediate pushback. scenes at airports, the women's march, et cetera. i don't sense any of that in talking to democrats or people who would be involved in the pushback you traditionally see. why do you think that is the case? are people just worn down by it all? >> yeah, you know, there's so many potential explanations. one of them is sheer exhaustion. we are eight years into this, not one month but eight years and one month into it, so exhaustion is a part of it. i think there appears to be a collective conclusion among some of trump's critics, some of trump's opponents, that, somehow, the early resistance framework did not produce the results they wanted it to. that certainly is notable here. in terms of foreign leaders, as well. i remember angela merkel's statement when trump was elected, lecturing trump and

saying, i'll be on the watch for violations of democracy. you don't see any statements like that this time around from foreign leaders, who are eager not to be in trump's crosshairs. you know, the question is, is that going to serve as a deterrent to trump in any way or constraining him in any way? while he has so many partners to work with, you know, it's a big question. there are many people who look at what's happened in countries that have gone through democratic backsliding in recent years. people like the yale historian, timothy snider. they have the frame of, listen, don't obey in advance. i was just speaking with a leader of the turkish opposition, interestingly, you know, to erdogan for all these years. i asked him about christopher wray resigning. i asked him about, you know, what do you think about this debate that's happening in washington? he was uncategorical, which is interesting. he said, don't do it. don't obey. fight as long as you can. don't resign until you absolutely have to.

i just thought it was really interesting that that was the perspective of someone who has been resisting erdogan's authoritarian moment for a long time in turkey. >> yeah, a very important moment and an important piece.glasser yorker," thank you. it's an important piece, and we'll be reading it this morning. dana, it seems different than the aftermath 206916 16 electio least so far, in terms of the lack of protest at home and overseas. do you see things that could change that? domestically, some democrats think if trump were to follow through with the mass deportation plan, that might be the spark that changes things. what do you think? >> well, i agree with what susan was saying about this exhaustion. you're seeing it, you know, as our newspaper readership is down. your viewership is down. i think people having been through this once are saying, oh, we have to do it again?

that is the slippery slope that we're talking about. it all becomes normalized. we just accept it and say, maybe it won't be so bad this time. so what does it take? you know, there's a chance that we'll start to see this when the confirmation hearings begin in january. some of the more outrageous characters may spark some. you're right, it may be round-ups at the border. it may require some other policy failure, you know, setting off a trade war, for example, or something we don't know. if we know anything, the trump administration will be unpredictable. there is a chance around the inauguration in january, that energy of, you know, the quote, unquote, resistance returns. it is, you know, a sign of how beaten down i think the left and the never trump republicans are, that it's just so quiet right now. >> 2017, it was the inauguration

that sparked rises in newspaper subscriptions and cable viewership and the like. we'll see if that happens again. "washington post" opinion columnist dana milbank. latest book, "fools on the hill, the conspiracy theorists and dunces who burned down the house." it is on sale now. up next, we'll be joined by one of the several democrats currently vying to become the next dnc chair. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back.

welcome back. the race is on for the democratic national committee chair. the young democrats of america held the first candidate forum of the race during the winter meeting last week. former maryland governor o'malley. minnesota chair martin. ben wickler and new york state center james skuofis all took part. new york state senator skuofis joins us now. welcome to "morning joe." >> good to have you here. we have the most powerful democrat of america sitting next to you. why don't you ask the first question? >> reverend al, take it. >> james, over the last three decades, we've seen the fight in the democratic party back in, say, the late '80s, '90s, it was the democratic leadership council against rainbow coalition. then howard dean and i ran in that cycle against the more

moderates. how do you see you running as a new face nationally, trying to bring the party together rather than having these torn sides which only leads to ultimate defeat of the democratic party when you have the conservative or the so-called moderate side against those that are more progressive? >> this is the core question, right? how do we rebuild the once big democratic tent, the tent that's fraying on both edges? i've done this for the past 12 years daily. i come from a district that donald trump just won by 12 points. >> but you won by 14. >> i won it by 14. he's won my district three times. i live and breathe every day coalition building. how do we bring back folks under that big tent that we used to? we haven't dominated in a national election since 2008. it's been 16 years since we've had a dominant performance. we've either white knuckled it across the finish line or we've lost. the next dnc chair, i believe

the single most important thing that he must do or she must do is throw out the old d.c. playbook. it just hasn't worked in a long time. if you're a candidate in this race who has been at the table, who has been a dnc lifer, and you haven't delivered that change in the 5, 10, 15 years you've had a seat at that table, who is going to expect change from the chair? this calls for an aggressive outsider who can win. >> bc's katty kay has a question. >> i'm interested about what you said, moving fast. we're in a moment of realignment, antielite, anticorporate, and strictly populist. can you talk not so much about the policy side of things, because i think the harris campaign had policies that were on the books that were helping working class americans, but maybe they didn't cut through.

can you talk about the character and the style, what my kids would call the vibe of the candidate, that can seem authentically connected to working class americans at the moment? how important is that to you, and what does it look like? >> that's right. the next dnc chair, this isn't a policymaking role. i'll give an example i think -- >> but you represent hoye w youe the aura of the party. >> of course. i spoke to a dnc member in arizona a few days ago, a battleground state. she told me that she got upwards in the heat of the campaign 16 big glossy mailers a day, daily, from the national democrats. i've run a lot of campaigns. i've won all of them. there is nothing that the 16th mailer is doing that the 15th mailer was not doing. so we have to get away as a party from the d.c. consultant class, from, you know, the folks who i'm referring to as the

cocktail circuit, and shift our attention and our focus and our resources to the boots on the ground. the party loyalists, the faithful who are actually moving the needle and are in the trenches. friends in organized labor feel they've been taken for granted for cycles and cycles. i don't just want to be the dnc chair who picks up the phone and frantically calls them when i need boots on the ground, folks in the rally. i need them in the room to develop the strategy, the guidance, how to move forward with rebuilding the working class we've lost. i come from a union class, a working class household. you know, we need to get back to talking to the folks who, quite frankly, feel completely disconnected from the democratic party. we use overly academic language as if we're running for university chancellor sometimes. we've got to start becoming relatable again as democrats. >> senator, you've won your district each time donald trump

has won in your district. if you become the chair of the dnc, how do you go to washington and get the collective brainiacs at the top of the democratic party, and i say that lightly? all you hear from them is how could people vote for donald trump, or the alternative they use is, how can people be so stupid? how do you tell those other democrats that the people who voted for donald trump are not stupid? >> you're 100% right. we've gotten into this bad habit as a party of lecturing people, telling them what they should think, how they should feel if they don't agree on the border, they're racist. if they don't agree on x, y, or z, they're stupid. as you just stated. look, the next dnc chair has to do a lot of rebuilding of our coalition. the perfect example is the conflict in gaza. because we've walked on eggshells and not engaged

meaningfully in this conversation, we've managed to p iss off every stakeholder. i represent jews who voted for me but feel disconnected from the democratic party. the arab-american party, precipitous declines on election day. college campus activists, they feel disconnected from the democratic party. so, you know, the next dnc chair needs to go with contrition to groups like this, leaders in these communities, stakeholder groups, and explain, look, we haven't gotten it right the last couple of cycles, and we want to do better. we want you back under our once big democratic tent. it starts with reaching out to these folks, ing respect. look, if you're been part of the dnc apparatus for 5, 10 years as some of the other candidates have, and you haven't been doing these things, who is to expect you're going to start now suddenly doing these things as dnc chair? i've done this daily in really difficult terrain, and that's

what i look to scale up as dnc chair. >> one of the most striking things about donald trump's win this time around were the gains he made. we can start in new york city, queens or brooklyn, among african american voters, among latino voters, asian-american voters. what do you read into that? that was a trend we saw around other cities and across the country, as well, border counties in texas, with latino voters moving toward donald trump. what do you see in the numbers and how do you bring the numbers back? >> it starts with showing up. it's not paying a celebrity or tiktok influencer to wrangle 18 to 29 young black or hispanic voters. we as democrats have to show up. the candidate, the next dnc chair, democratic party leadership. if you look in our urban centers, there wasn't so much a shift in support from arris to trump, we just didn't come out. these are voters who feel we've taken them for granted. the way i overperformed in my

majority-minority communities, places like newberg and middletown in the hudson valley, i show up and listen and do something about the issues they care about. maternal health, general health care access, the rent is too high. we have to stop as democrats putting people into different academic buckets and categories. we've become too concerned with that and lost sight of doing work on the issues that they care about. so they didn't show up to vote for anybody. >> it's one of the things bill clinton told me last week, rev. you've got to meet people where they live. too many people believe the democrats didn't do that. bill clinton believed the democrats didn't do that. you know, mike barnicle asked a great question about trump voters. you call all of them stupid, you'll lose the next election, too, because even if you don't understand why somebody may have voted for donald trump, there's a reason why you and i say all

the time, we're in the conversion business. we don't care when somebody converts. we just want them to convert. if the democrats are going to win in two years, in four years, in six years, they need to feeds the conversion business. don't go judge. we can talk about the spiritual. you don't go in and tell somebody, you're going too hel. come to my church. meet them where they live and then move them over to your side, right. >> absolutely right. one of the things a good minister understands is jesus did most of his ministry outside of the synagogue. in fact, he was only in the synagogue maybe twice in the bible. >> he was criticized by religious leaders for being with the, quote, sinners. >> that's right. >> the tax collectors, the adulterers, the people the religious leaders wouldn't be around. >> those in civil rights, what i do, the best ones are those that

reach out for converts, to bring people in to what we're trying to fight for, and see it as right. not try to beat them down and say, you're just a bad person. then they'll confirm it and say, i'll be a bad person. >> and self-righteousness is not going to get the people democrats need to get to win the next election. >> new york state senator and candidate for dnc chair, james skoufis, thank you for coming on the show. nice to meet you. up next, a lion of the republican south passes. when we come back, the life well lived of mississippi' clark reid. reid

check in time is 3:00 it's 2:55. i know. is this what he's doing now? as your host, i have some rules. first, no showers longer than 5 minutes. this isn't a spa. no games. no fun. yes, coach. (♪♪) meanwhile, at a vrbo... when other vacation rentals make you share your turf with a host, try one you have all to yourself. narrator: at this very moment, children at st. jude are fighting to survive. with a gift right now, you can join the battle to save lives. katy: without saint jude, i don't know where we would be. can we see snuggles? they have given children with cancer, like my winston, a chance. christine: she has neuroblastoma and it has spread to her liver. i try to enjoy every minute with her

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let's say you're deep in a show or a game or the game. on a train, at home, at work. okay, maybe not at work. point is at xfinity. we're constantly engineering new ways to get the entertainment you love to you faster and easier than ever. that's what i do. is that love island? we want to close by remembering mississippi businessman clarke reed, who developed the republican party in the state and across the south beginning in the 1960s. he's died. he was 96 years old. reed was chairman of the

mississippi republican party from 1966 to 1976. at a time when democrats still dominated the region. he is credited with helping president gerald ford win the 1976 republican nomination, when during the convention, delegates were divided between ford and california governor ronald reagan. and remembering reed, senator roger wicker of mississippi wrote, "there is no more significant figure in the development of modern day mississippi republican party than clarke reed. our state has lost a giant." >> yeah, i mean, we lived in mississippi in the late '60s and early '70s. carmichael and clarke reed, two republicans in the entire state. jon, you knew him well. he was the father f julia reed. think of taking the republican

party from nothing to a dominant force in mississippi was tough? i think he'd tell you raising julia was more difficult. >> that is correct. >> you wrote an absolutely ing reed. "handsome, charming, peripathetic, reed, who spoke in a delta patois that was best described in a drawling mumble or a mumbled drawling. he was big, consequential, fascinating life. reed was not only present at the creation of republican south, he was one of its creators, and his politics seems quaint now. never an extremist, he believed in an america that was engaged in the world. you could disagree with clarke, but his motives were not petty but patriotic, not reflexively partisan but civic minded. in 1957, he married julia brooks, known as judy. she had been pinned or

pre-engaged in the manner of the time, to another man, a fellow student at vanderbilt university, when she met reed. she was interested, as was he, but he did not move with dispatch until, during a phone call with judy, he heard a dog barking in the background. when he learned that the vanderbilt boyfriend had given judy the puppy, he hung up. a dog, reed thought, is a serious thing. reed drove to nashville and proposed. the reeds' house became a conservative salon, a stopping-off point for visiting politicians and journalists, many of whom were brought over to be feted with little to no notice. judy reed became expert at whipping up scalloped oysters made with ritz crackers when her husband called from the airport to announce that bill buckley or dick cheney would be over in a few minutes. into his 90s, he'd be working the phones, weighing in with republicans and journalists

across the country. with brown bags of bourbon and wine, reed hosted a flow of visitors. he could hold forth, at some length, on subjects ranging from the agrarian thought of andrew lytle and robert penn warren to the virtues of the large plastic clips that sealed opened but unfinished bags of potato chips to the details of the alger hiss perjury trial. presidents, senators, congressmen, and governors depended on this political pioneer for counsel and leadership, karl rove said. he had a broad smile, a twinkle in his eye, and a talent for friendship. he made politics not only consequential but interesting and fun. the light that brightened many a political backroom and convention hall is gone." >> jon, you've expressed many of, in the past, said many of

the things he had said, some of which we will not repeat here. but a dog is a serious thing. sticks out in this beautiful, beautiful obit. tell us about your friend. >> well, thank you. let's point out that the most formidable women any of us know went to my dearest school. >> of course. >> julia reed and our leader, ms. brzezinski. he was from ohio, part of the northern delta. wanted to be -- was at a military school in tennessee. very much wanted to fight in world war ii. was a little too young. became a businessman in the delta. building grain bins and scaring birds off of fields. got interested in politics in

the '50s. voted for eisenhower in 1952, which as you know, was the first time a lot of southerners allowed themselves to do that since the civil war and reconstruction. what's important, i think, for us is that clarke loved delegate counting and precinct cutting and thrusting. you know, loved all the pettiness of politics. he reveled in it. but he was a russell kirk, william f buckley, edmund burke kind of conservative. his way into politics was not just mindless con mpetitiveness but was the idea. the ideas that maybe the state did not have all the answers. america needed to be standing strong against fascism and communism. he was someone who came to the

arena with a creed. in that, he believed that there should be a two-party system. remember, the democratic party was -- had a total monopoly. one of the reasons jfk was in dallas in 1963, remember, was to bring peace, not between democrats and republicans, that wasn't where the race was. it was between the liberal democrats and the conservative, more segregationist democrats. clarke, with carter iii, a liberal newspaper editor there, wanted to break the power of the conservative democrats. he became this remarkable power broker. also, just had a lot of fun doing it. >> yeah. >> all right. >> historian jon meacham, well done. >> thank you so much, jon. >> thank you. coming up, award winning actor david alan grier joins us with a look at his new series. we'll be right back after this.

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with the antibiotics i put you on. >> i didn't take them, waiting for when i really need them. >> life largely disappoints, mostly in big ways, but i find the simple pleasures always deliver. every day at 2:00 p.m., i get a nut ragous bar and eat it in the stairwell. some people smoke, some meditate. i slowly nibble through a peanut and caramel-filled miracle of american ingenuity. >> that was a clip from the new nbc show "st. dedenis medical." it's an underfunded staff and hospital whose doctors and nurses try to treat their community without losing their own sanity. joining us now, award-winning actor david alan grier. he stars as dr. ron leonard in the show.

he sat down doing bits for us, which we appreciate very much, hitting the ground ready to go. talk to us about -- good to see you. talk to us about the show. what drew you to it? >> yes. my coat is not natural fur. let's get that out of the way. >> it is chilly in here. >> i asked for a great script. shooting in town. i was a young daughter. you know, you have your wish list. i give this to my team. days later, they gave me the script. i had 24 hours to decide. it was easy. for once, it was easy. >> you earned it. tell us about how much fun it was day after day. stellar cast. >> i'd never worked with anyone, but for the first time in hi my career, i got emails from nbc. we would love you to do this. i'm used to going, hey, if you say no, we have other options.

a friend of mine, anna, who worked with the show creators, sent me a note and said, we love these guys. you should do it. i was like flooded with you should do it. it was always the script. i didn't know any of the actors. i knew the work of wendi and allison. i knew they had my back, and i trusted. that's what you have to do sometimes, trust. >> this looks really fun. it does involve trust. it feels like a lot of improv going on here. i'd love for you to answer that -- no? okay. i'm going to be wrong about my next question then, as well. it also feels like, in the best ways, a mix of "the office" community and "modern family." >> wrong! >> mika, 0 for 2. >> okay. >> wrong again. >> 0 for 2. >> what color is your jacket? >> oh, i don't know. >> green. >> what kind of green? i don't know. what'd you call it?

>> olive. >> i'll go with olive. >> i'm going to call this a muted forest wilderness green. that's a neutral. a muted wilderness green. >> good luck, mara. you're next with questions. let's get one out of three right. go. >> listen, i think we are in a moment where lots of americans need a show to bring them some joy. can you just talk a little bit about that experience and what you're hoping viewers take away from this experience? >> well, it's comfort food. there won't be a lot of talk about the desperate situation our health care system is in. we allude to it, but our thing is comedy, entertainment first, rooted in a base of reality. a rue of reality, if you will. but it's not going to be like, a heavy political statement. but i think we give that. >> right.

>> with a lot of sugar. >> i can't wait to see it. >> politics and a loath t of la. you can catch "st. denis medical" tuesdays at 8:00 p.m. eastern on nbc. streams the following day on peacock. david alan grier, thank you. >> no, thank you. >> mika, thank you! >> thank you. thank you for confirming the color of your jacket. coming up, we'll speak with the actors julianna and peter gallagher here in studio to talk about their broadway play, "left on tenth," which brings to life the extraordinary, true story of reconnection and love. "morning joe" will be right back with that. t. here's to getting better with age. here's to beating these two every thursday. help fuel today with boost high protein, complete nutrition you need, and the flavor you love. so, here's to now... now available: boost max!

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someone who believes the unconscious can be a source of joy and creativity, who believes in confluence or, as we call it now, synchronicity, in the mysteries of life, joining and flowing together as rivers do. >> the opposite of what my

freudian shrink told me in my 20s. that two people falling in love across a crowded room with simply spotted their neurotic match. >> exactly. >> i began to believe i'd fallen into my romantic comedy. >> that was "left on tenth," adapted for the stage by acclaimed screenwriter, delia efran, from her memoir of the same name. she reconnects with an old flame, peter, who reaches out to the writer after reading a moving 2016 op-ed she penned in "the new york times" about the pain and frustration of disconnected her deceased husband's landline with verizon. joining us now, the co-stars, julianna margulies, who plays delia, and golden globe winning and tony nominated actor peter gallagher, who plays peter. you guys --

>> this is big stuff. >> welcome. >> thank you for having us. >> this is so fun. >> i have to say, knowing nora and loving her as much as we did, and seeing how she always would be bringing people together at dinner parties. you sit there. you go. the least surprising thing about this story is that it was nora ephron who put you two together. >> absolutely. delia didn't remember any of it, but when peter rutter, delia's now husband, had reached out to her after she wrote this great op-ed in "the new york times," "love and hate on hold with verizon" is what it was called, and she got all this mail on her website from people who had had the same issues. >> right. >> and this man reached out, peter, and said, actually, your sister, nora, set us up when we were 18. delia's husband had just died.

peter rutter's wife had just died. they fell in love over email, which is another confluence of events. delia ephron wrote "you've got mail," which is all about people falling in love over email. >> of course. let's read from delia ephron's "new york times" op-ed entitled "love and hate on hold with verizon." she writes in part this, "i know it's not a good idea to hate anyone. i know from an article i read that negative emotions are bad for my health. i would hate to have a heart attack because my internet isn't working. but i do hate verizon. this all began because i disconnected one of my two landlines. i doenlt need two landlines now that i don't have jerry. this is the only chance i have attempted to make in my entire life since my husband died, and it has obviously not gone well. one of my friends, not a

psychic, suggested that jerry did not want me disconnecting his phone, but honestly, that doesn't sound like jerry. his voice was on the answering service, and i recorded it on my cell phone before asking for the disconnect." >> so this is where it all began. >> yes. >> talk about how peter connects. >> well, he read that piece in "the new york times," and as we say in the play, it turns out everybody hates their cell provider. it was a spectacularly successful piece. but he had just lost his wife. he remembered quite vividly the dates they had. of course, delia had no recollection of any of the date, much less that there was more than one. so he'd been looking to reconnect with her and did through the website and wrote to her. she wrote back. what began a lengthy email exchange, which culminated in -- >> a romance. >> -- a meeting. >> wonderful. >> are you finding this story is resonating with people you're

performing in front of each and every night? not just responding from the crowd, perhaps people who have similar stories? >> it's been overwhelmingly joyful and incredibly moving to see the audience's reactions. when we go out the stage door afterwards, we're probably there for half an hour talking to people. >> wow. >> we've had everyone -- also, it is a romantic comedy, but it also deals with -- nora ephron died of myelodysplastic disease. it can morph into leukemia, ml. delia was a match to be her donor. but when they tested delia's blood, they found out her marrow was a little wonky. those are her words. >> yeah. >> she couldn't be nora's match for a bone marrow transplant. nora died in 2012. her husband died of cancer in 2015. she was in this incredibly sad place in her life.

when peter comes into her life, she says, i'm not sure i want to do this because i could get what nora had. but he came blissed by nora. she'd set them up years ago. the events that happen, peter rutter is a psychoanalyst and sees the world very differently. the people who respond to this play, first of all, transplant patience. science is amazing. six years after nora died, you don't have to have an exact match. they do a half blood cord transplant, taking a donor from a baby cord blood a mother donates after giving birth, and an adult donor, and you can -- it's a very, very -- it's a 20% chance. she made it. >> yeah. >> wow. >> this is a story about grief, right, and carrying on through grief. i've been writing about it.

i'm curious, as you do this, it's both joyful and, right, there's this idea that we have these long second acts, third acts. do you feel reflective by it? >> absolutely. it's a roller coaster. it's joyful, sad, moving. there's so much hope in this play. i think people walk away. the other night, we were on the autographing line. this widower and a widow, they were like, i'm a widower. i'm a widow. we met. we found each other. this play is us. >> it's gratifying to see the extent to which the people in the audience, not necessarily accustom to identifying with what they might be seeing on a broadway stage, if it's all of a sudden, they recognize themselves, and people they love or people they've lost. it hits them in a powerful way. it's not what they were expecting at all. when you're at our stage in life, no one is really writing too many shows for you. usually, you're trying to catch up to what the popular culture thing is.

instead, here is your -- you suddenly have permission to grieve. you have permission to not feel alone. permission to sort of give those coincidences, those confluences, as we call it in life, you know, validity and value. ultimately, where there is life, there is hope. there are second chances. it's powerful to see it. i had no idea what the show was, and i lost my wife two years ago. >> yeah. >> it's what i love more than anything, contributing to a story that has a place in the world you live in. it's gratifying. >> looks like you guys are having so much fun, too. >> we are. >> no point doing it otherwise. >> exactly. >> it's sort of a real-life version. you talked about "you've got mail." >> 100%. >> i think i've seen that about as much as i've seen "it's a wonderful life." this is the real-life version. >> it's true. >> everything is true. >> everything is true. even their emails they're

writing that we had to rem memo, it's their emails. >> peter said, i wish i hadn't used some of that language. he has to hear it every time. >> "left on tenth" is playing now at broadway's st. james earle jones -- james earl jones theater for a limited engagement through february 2nd. james earl jones theater. not st. james theater. >> he was a saint. >> deserves it. >> you were asking about how long. i mean, we have been doing this 18 years. this is the end of four hours. you're allowed to call him a saint. >> hour and 40 minutes, no intermission, which people really love. >> i love that. >> oh! >> you're in and out. >> that's the catch. >> co-stars. >> i know. >> i will stay. >> we know joe. >> it's over before you know it. >> peter gallagher and julianna margulies, thank you very much. good morning. welcome to msnbc's live