1-800-290-7477 now or visit us at mso fund.com. >> that does it for us. make sure to tune in tomorrow night for special coverage of president biden's farewell address to the nation. coverage begins at 8 p.m. eastern, right here on msnbc. and on that note, i wish you a very good night from all of our colleagues across the networks of nbc news. thanks for staying up late. i'll see you at the end of tomorrow. >> tonight on all in. >> so are you saying that you would stand in the breach and push back if you were given an illegal order? >> i start by saying i reject the premise that. >> president, i understand you've done your jen psaki illegal orders at all. >> donald trump's choice to run

the pentagon faces senate confirmation. >> you are no longer on fox and friends. mr. hegseth, i hardly think you are prepared to do the job tonight. >> illinois senator tammy duckworth, on today's bruising hearing for pete hegseth. >> how can we ask these warriors to train and perform the absolute highest standards when you are asking us to lower the standards to make you the secretary of defense? >> then house democratic leader hakeem jeffries, on loyal opposition in the new congress. and jen psaki joins me with her exclusive interview with california governor gavin newsom on the fires burning in his state and the misinformation making it harder to fight them. >> but somehow, there's a magical spigot in california and northern california that just can be turned on, and all of a sudden there will be rain or water flowing everywhere. it's not helpful when all in starts right now.

>> good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes. i want you to mentally bracket out for a second. the very serious allegations of sexual assault against pete hegseth, the man donald trump wants to be his secretary of defense. yes, it is an allegation borne of an actual police report filed after his accuser went to the er seeking a rape kit. yes. hegseth denies that allegation. he says he had consensual extramarital sex with his accuser and made an undisclosed payment to her to settle the matter, a payment he concealed from everyone, including the trump transition team. but for the moment, just indulge me here. let's just forget that. pretend none of that happened, okay? and just imagine the process of sorting through resumes for a candidate to run the pentagon. one of the most important jobs in the entire country and in the world, a job that oversees the nation's largest single workforce. a job that starts and ends with keeping americans safe. there is

no universe in which pete hegseth resume gets him into the let's interview him pile. none. he is manifestly unqualified for virtually any high ranking government position cabinet position, much less the one he's nominated for. and he demonstrated that frequently today in his senate confirmation hearing. >> what is the highest level of international security agreement that you have led? and can you name some that the secretary of defense would lead? there are three main ones. >> do you know i have not been involved in international security arrangements because i have not been in government. these managers meet quotas to have a certain number of female infantry officers or infantry enlisted, and that disparages those women. >> commanders do not have quotas for the infantry. commanders do not have to have a quota for women in the infantry that does not exist. senator. >> anonymous false charges.

>> they are not anonymous. and i'll just conclude and say this to the chairman. you claim that this was all anonymous. we have seen records with names attached to all of these, including the name of your own mother and how many nations are in asean, by the way? >> i couldn't tell you the exact amount of nations, because i know we have allies in south korea and japan and in aukus with australia trying to work on submarines with them. >> mr. hague said none of those countries are allies across. none of those three countries that you mentioned are in asean. i suggest you do a little homework before you prepare for these types of negotiations. >> now, what did this guy do to deserve such an important job? i mean, really one of the most important jobs in the world. he did serve in the national guard. he deployed to iraq and afghanistan like literally hundreds of thousands of americans. he also ran a dark money republican group called vets for freedom and ran up such massive debts, the group's board had to save vets for freedom by merging it with another nonprofit and stripping hegseth

of his responsibilities. he then went on to run another koch brothers backed right wing group, concerned vets for america, but a few years later he was forced to step aside amid multiple allegations of open drunkenness, sexist behavior and financial mismanagement. now, i just want to be clear here. lots of political activists, including on the right, have actually built huge nonprofit organizations from small beginnings. pete hegseth is not one of them. he took two organizations, arguably custom built for him, and he drove them into the ground so hard, both groups distanced themselves from him. that is the sum total of the man's career qualifications. well, that and he is a fox weekend news host that donald trump likes to look at and no shade at cable news hosts. but i wouldn't just be picking them at random to run the us military. the fact that he's there on your

screen, recognizable, obviously, i think quite handsome. that's the reason he is in line for one of the most important jobs on earth. republicans are announcing, as always, what they intend to do. we are going to put manifestly unqualified, intentionally unqualified people into these positions. we don't have to. there are trump supporting people who would be qualified to run the pentagon, obviously, but no. and if they're willing to do this, if they're willing to put someone this obviously like ludicrously unqualified in charge of the pentagon with the united states armed forces and the security and safety of the nation on the line, there is no limit to how abject they will be in their pursuit of donald trump. keep this also in mind if and when, god forbid, something terrible happens. we've already been through this once. this is not a hypothetical. we all lived it.

we've all blocked it out of our memories. but we've been through it. once with covid, we saw that who runs the government actually really does matter. it's a life or death question. thousands and thousands and thousands might die unnecessarily if a bunch of incompetent jabronis are running things, and now they want to put a guy who shouldn't have made it past the first cut of resumes to run the most powerful military that's ever existed in the history of human civilization. the irony of all of this, of course, is that maga republicans keep banging on and pretending that dei and diversity hires of women, of people of color, of lgbtq people, of anyone they see on the television who isn't a white straight man, that they're filling government with unqualified officials. they did it again in today's hearing, displaying a poster that really sums it up. really. sometimes image is worth a thousand words that suggested dei has killed military standards. a poster in

which republicans misspelled the word military. it's like misspelling the name on your cover letter or misspelling something on your resume. it should get thrown out. it doesn't get into the pile. it doesn't pass the standard. that's an embarrassment for everyone. all while hegseth sat there enjoying the perverse republican version of affirmative action for lackluster associates of donald trump, who he sees on television a gross, indeed genuinely dangerous hypocrisy that got called out today by one of the most decorated veterans in the senate, tammy duckworth of illinois. >> how can we ask these warriors to train and perform the absolute highest standards? when you are asking us to lower the standards to make you the secretary of defense, simply because you are buddies with our president elect. and by the way, he has filed for bankruptcy six times. i'm not quite sure he's

the kind of ceo you want to refer to as a successful businessman. >> senator tammy duckworth is a democrat from illinois who serves on the armed services committee. she's an army veteran who received her purple heart for injuries in iraq after a rocket propelled grenade crashed her blackhawk helicopter. and she joins me now. senator, thank you for joining us on what is a very busy day. >> thanks for having me on. yes, it was a very busy day and very insightful day, i think. >> well, let me ask you there, did you learn something new? did your mind change at all on anything? what was your takeaway from from the lengthy hearing today? >> well, my mind didn't change and unfortunately it further solidified my opinion that mr. hegseth is not qualified to be secretary of defense. he couldn't even answer some of my very basic questions about our alliances in the indo-pacific region. and he, you know, made it clear that he'd never let an audit, for example, even though he says he wants to audit the pentagon, and yet he never in fact, he never let an audit in

any of the businesses that he ran before. and in fact, he's so badly mismanaged the finances of the not for profits he ran that they had to bring in a forensic accountant to figure out what all that he messed up. and now this man wants to run an $825 billion budget. >> i want to play that exchange you had about, because i think if you're just looking at, does this guy have the resume? like, does he pass the resume test if you were sorting resumes, you were sitting in an office like you got an open position, you got a bunch like, oh no. does he even make it into the we should interview him pile? here's here's the exchange you had about whether he'd ever let an audit. take a listen. >> yes or no? have you led an audit of any organization of which you were in charge? >> senator? in both of the organizations i ran, we were always completely fiscally responsible. yes or no? >> did you lead an audit and the way yes or no? did you lead an audit? yes or no? >> completely. are you afraid of. >> you can't answer this question. yes or no? did you lead an audit? do you not know this answer?

>> there was a lot of that today. i have to say even questions about a straightforward question about did you sexually assault the woman that accused you of sexual assault? he said, it's a smear, anonymous smear. but he wouldn't answer it, which was strange to me. you could just say no. you could say no. i'd never let an audit like it seemed like there was a lot of that. >> there was a lot of that. he was basically trying to tap dance his way through the hearing. and, you know, at one point he was asked if you were under oath, would your answer still be the same? and he wouldn't even answer that. look, here's what i'm afraid of. he's already had to pay off a woman who accused him of sexual assault in order to keep his last job at fox news. right. what is he going to be willing to do to pay off the next accuser, who might show up after he becomes secretary of defense and has access to the nuclear codes and the location of u.s. troops around the world? what happens when he wants to keep that job and somebody comes forward? he's already told us that he's willing to pay off somebody. does that mean that he

is now going, we're not going to have a secretary of defense who potentially is vulnerable to blackmail. is that where we're headed with this nomination? >> there is reporting about concerns about his drinking. he has denied that those concerns have any merit or basis. he has also said that he would quit drinking if he becomes secretary of defense. but i guess my takeaway from his answer is that they won't if he doesn't, which i think is a little strange. and i wonder what you thought of that answer. >> well, it's more of the same today. and in fact, the other part of the questioning today was if somebody was found to be drunk, passed out, had done any of these things, would they be qualified to be in command of a military unit? and we're not even talking about him. and he would not answer that question either. remember this whole hearing? he kept talking about how he wanted to uphold, uphold the highest standards for women who want to serve in combat and for military men and women. and

yet, throughout the entire hearing, he made it clear that he wanted us to lower the standards so that he could be secretary of defense. and i'm just not willing to do that. >> let me ask you this almost as a devil's advocate question. there's part of me that thinks there's a kernel of truth here. the us military is one of the most fearsome and sophisticated militaries in the history of human civilization. i think it's fair to say, does it matter who runs it? like maybe it just sort of runs by itself. and, you know, you've got a lot of very smart, very competent people with a lot of experience at the upper ranks and the joint chiefs of staff and in the services themselves. and, you know, you could survive a guy who's a weekend news host who got the gig because he's buddies with the president. >> well, but you can't ultimately, this is the secretary of defense. that's why i asked him the question about what is the highest level of international negotiation he has engaged in when it comes to his

security agreement with a foreign nation, because that is actually conducted and led personally by the secretary of defense. and i ask him, name three. i mean, there's three main ones. name at least one of them, a status of forces agreement, which would be one, for example. and he couldn't name a single one. this is basic 101 level stuff, and he couldn't name even a single one. so he's coming to be asked to be confirmed and he hasn't even bothered to do his homework. so there are absolutely things that the secretary of defense must be. donald trump talks about wanting to invade greenland and wanting to invade maybe the panama canal if donald trump said to hegseth, you know, on january 20th, i want you to prepare a plan to, you know, invade greenland. could he lead that mission? my answer is no. he's not qualified. he wouldn't know what was a good mission and what was a bad mission. he wouldn't know who to put in the room to do, to come up with the plans. and, you know, more importantly, i think he personally is a compromised

individual whom our adversaries are watching and digging the dirt on. and this makes him somebody who is vulnerable to our adversaries. and we don't need that person in charge of, as you say. and i agree with you, the greatest military on the face of the earth. >> yeah, i'm not quite sure who i'm rooting for, what i'm rooting for in the hypothetical you gave, maybe i am rooting for incompetence there, but there's other places where i would be rooting for more competence for the secretary of defense, senator tammy duckworth, thank you very much for your time. thank you. coming up, donald trump thinks the hegseth nomination is shaping up to be one of his boldest performances yet. rebecca traister joins me next slotomania. >> the number one free slots game presents straight from the vegas casino floors to your phone. the iconic cleopatra two slot featuring cleopatra's symbols that give you double down on sodomania now and start 2025 with 25 free spins. >> it is a entire transformation. it's like we have a new home. >> real customers share their stories about empire today. >> it's just that above and

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information, this moment of transition in our country? >> the rachel maddow show, five nights a week, beginning monday. >> whatever your political views or your partizan affiliation, i think anyone who's being honest can see that pete hegseth is just manifestly unqualified for the job of secretary of defense. but after donald trump's pick of matt gaetz for attorney general only lasted a week, maga world decided to get hegseth over the hump through sheer will to power, according to multiple reports, including threatening to primary any republican senators who oppose him and threatening to sue the woman who accused hegseth of sexual assault if her allegations prevent him from being confirmed. as rebecca traister writes in new york magazine, trump understands the possibility of cementing power by performing power. and the hegseth nomination so weak on the merits, so vulnerable to so many lines of attack, is shaping up to be one of his boldest performances yet, an exercise in domination not only of his party in the opposition, but the government itself. joining me

now, rebecca traister, writer at large for new york magazine, who has a piece out about the hegseth nomination. rebecca, i want to just read a section. you focus on senator joni ernst, who is both a veteran herself and a survivor of sexual assault. and you say this trump has put ernst in an excruciating position, a woman who is deployed as a commanding officer in kuwait during the iraq war is caught between holding on to her seat and selling out her own history of service on behalf of a nominee who has called men more capable. as one senator told me, joni ernst is being made to eat the s sandwich in public. she is going to be made to vote for somebody who thinks what she did is dumb or wrong. and i want to play you now, this news that just broke a little while ago about joni ernst announcing that she will support hegseth. here's that sound. >> i am breaking news, simon. i figured you would ask this. so yes, i will be supporting president trump's pick for secretary of defense, pete

hegseth. >> what did you learn in your reporting about this trajectory? >> well, it's really interesting. you pointed out at the beginning of the show that there are so many competent candidates who could have been nominated for this position. >> and a lot of people in my reporting on the senate armed services committee noted that joni ernst herself, yes, would have been a you know, my politics are very, very different from joni ernst. >> i would not have liked her as a nominee, but i think there's no question that she would have been qualified and competent to carry out a hard right, donald trump focused agenda and probably do it very effectively where i don't. i think there are really open questions about whether pete hegseth is capable of doing anything effectively. so the fact that joni ernst has, in fact, decided to fold in the way that she has. she initially expressed concern about this nomination. she has a strong history of advocating for women in the military. she has written about her own experiences of sexual assault, domestic

violence, pete hegseth and all the reporting about him is anathema to things that joni ernst has genuinely spent her career advocating for, and i expected actually for her to perform a little bit of rigor today, to sort of ask him tough questions and do the i'm very concerned about this nomination thing. and she really didn't. she was incredibly nice. if anything, she said she did this thing where she said, you and i have spoken before this meeting and, you know, i was very frank and i pulled no punches. and all it did was sort of emphasize in a kind of neener neener neener way that he had not, in fact, taken any meetings with democrats on that committee, breaking precedent, turning it into like a disjointed partizan situation. and she she underlined that and then was very pleasant in her questioning of him. so it's very clear that she has bent to donald trump's will to maga pressure and is going to support him. >> the i want to linger on one point about the use of the word anonymous smears today, i think is important. when asked about

it was interesting when he was asked if he ever has been violent against any of his his previous wives, he's on his third. he he flatly denied it. he said, absolutely not. and he answered right away. clear. it was a clear denial. when he was asked about this allegation of sexual assault, he said it was anonymous. anonymous smears, a phrase he repeated time and time again. and just like senator tim kaine pointed out, but like, it's not we know who the woman is. we know because her name was on the police report when there was a police report filed, and he knows her name because he made out a check to her, he gave to her, and she signed her name on a contract. like it's not just some source somewhere and a lot of anonymity. >> anonymity is enforced by the nda clause. >> right. >> his the deals that protect him ensure anonymity. and so the fact that these are anonymous sources is not some accident. and as we know you know, there are a lot of reasons why including incredible

intimidation and, you know, sort of violence laced pressure and threats against people who would come out and speak on the record about their experiences with him. but it is also true that he himself ensured anonymity when he asked for nondisclosure agreements with perhaps multiple of these people who could be speaking right now. >> one of the things that comes out in your reporting and in some of jane mayer's reporting here is that, you know, senators genuinely as partizan, they are do take the advice and consent thing seriously, partly because it's their turf and they have big egos and they don't want, you know, they don't like to roll over, like they take it seriously. and i know millions of stories, both on the record and off of democratic senators giving democratic presidents a hard time on nominees. i mean, a really hard time that this process has been a bull rush intended to essentially break any inclination senators might have to exercise that, that

judgment. >> yeah. it's also meant to break the functionality of this committee. this is a committee that historically has operated in a bipartisan fashion, where there pretty decent relationships between people. when you talk about joni ernst, you're talking about somebody who just, you know, within the past year, i think, passed legislation alongside elizabeth warren. this is a this is this is a committee where they have taken bipartisanship very seriously, where it's been relatively friendly. and what this particular confirmation hearing did was ensure that partizan rancor was at a high, that there was enmity and that the functionality. so we're not just talking about the department of defense, we're talking about the senate armed services committee, the functions of advise and consent, and also purely the functionality of the senate itself has been badly impeded. and i think that is we have to understand part of what donald trump and maga wants. >> rebecca traister, great reporting. people should check out the piece. appreciate it. >> thanks. >> still ahead, as house republicans move to enact donald

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leader hakeem jeffries. and i'm joined now by leader hakeem jeffries, democrat of new york. congressman, it's very good to have you on the program. >> evening, chris. great to be with you. >> i want to talk about peace, and we'll start with legislation today. there was a vote today in the house, and i want to read your quote on it and your characterization of it. it would be a nationwide ban on trans youth in sports, or at least in sports of the gender they express. the house republican, you called it the house republican. child predator empowerment act does not promote fairness and safety in sports. it will unleash horrific child predators on girls and young women throughout america. unacceptable. there are only two democrats that voted in favor. it passed on a fairly narrow party line vote. why? why do you characterize it this way? >> well, house democrats believe that fairness and safety in sports, particularly as it relates to our children, our girls and boys who are playing

either noncompetitive sports, recreational sports and competitive sports all across the country. these are important principles, and we support that. however, house republicans are not serious about addressing any issues related to competition and safety. their legislation is irresponsible. effectively, what it would do is sanction without any guardrails. adults, including predators, for engaging in inspections of genitalia and children as young as four years old, now in the sports arena, we've seen repeated instances of sexual abuse, gymnastics. that's been the case in wrestling. that's been the case in football. that's been the case. and in many other areas. and to have

the federal government weigh in aggressively and sanction this type of invasions, you know, invasive inspections clearly would create a situation where childhood predators would be unleashed on the children of this country. and that's why you saw a significant number of democrats say this is federal government overreach. and it's unacceptable. >> yeah, there's many, as you've noted, many stories, of course, michigan state and gymnastics, a very famous story out of ohio state with a wrestling team there with a doctor on the wrestling team of the men's wrestling team at ohio state, an enormous scandal that did lasting trauma to many of the men who were victimized there by a doctor associated with that team. the enforcement mechanism here is essentially genital checks, and this law would essentially give any adult cover to do that under the guise of the law's enforcement, is my understanding. >> that's correct. that's the

plain reading of the bill, and that's why we characterized it as such, particularly in this sensitive area as it relates to sports activity, where, as you pointed out, chris, there have been repeated instances of massive sexual abuse that has taken place, and this would lead to that occurring in spades all across the country. >> you have your work cut out for you as the leader of the democratic party in the house. obviously you are in the minority, although it's a very slim minority. there is reporting that the house is going to undertake this big, beautiful bill. politico today saying that the speaker, mike johnson, the house, would need to coalesce around a strategy and write a budget resolution by february 10th, setting up floor debate adoption, that the senate would then debate the measure and adopted the following week. all of this is meant to create a reconciliation vehicle, in which every single priority of the

republicans can be put into one bill and passed. i think they're banking on this by a 2 or 3 vote party line margin. what's your plan to stop that? >> we're willing, as house democrats to find bipartisan common ground with the incoming administration and our republican colleagues on any issue, whenever and wherever possible, in order to make life better for the american people, particularly as it relates to driving down the high cost of living. but at the same period of time, it appears that our republican colleagues aren't really serious about lowering housing costs. they're not serious about lowering child care costs. they certainly are not serious about lowering health care costs or bringing down the cost of groceries. we've not seen a single plan since the election. what they do want to do, chris, is to pass massive tax breaks for billionaires and wealthy

corporations, and then they want working families and middle class folks and the poor, the sick and the afflicted to pay for it. saddle us with trillions of dollars of debt and at the same time cut things like medicaid or nutritional assistance for children and families and veterans benefits. we're not going to tolerate it. the votes will not be there for this type of scheme on the democratic side, and we believe that we're going to have to take this fight to the public domain, make sure we can win the battle for public sentiment. and the reality is, if we're successful in that endeavor, then i don't believe with their narrow republican margin, they can pass anything close to what is being discussed by the speaker or by house republicans. >> i mean, on the upside, elon musk, jeff bezos, mark zuckerberg personally and their companies would probably pay a lot less in taxes. so there's always that. the other side of the on the other side of the ledger, i want to ask you about

relief for the folks in california, obviously, governor newsom saying, and i think this is proved to be true, this this is likely to be the most expensive natural disaster, climate disaster in the history of the country. i've already seen multiple republicans, both in the senate and the house say, well, we got to see what we're going to get back from these californians. well, we're going to put some strings attached. we're going to put we're going to tell california how california should govern itself, because we don't we don't like the way california does it. of course, nothing like that for the folks in north carolina or in the southeast who were hit by disasters earlier this year. nothing like that in texas after the freeze, as there should be, right? you should get relief. what is your position in the caucus's position on strings attached to disaster relief to california? >> we had a discussion about this today in the house democratic caucus and the consensus position, i think it's fair to say is that we do not support conditioning any aid to

everyday americans whose lives have been wiped out as a result of extreme weather events and in this case, in california by these raging wildfires. homes have been destroyed, schools have been destroyed, small businesses have been destroyed, churches and synagogues and mosques have been destroyed or are in harm's way. and it is unconscionable that republicans are suggesting imposing right wing partizan conditions in order for california taxpayers to receive their tax dollars. california is one of those states, in fact, that sends about five times as much to the federal government every year than they get back in return. and so we've got to be there for the people of california. we will be there for the people of california, just as we have been for others across the country. >> that is the social contract, in my view. senator tommy tuberville of alabama should

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the wildfires have picked back up, leading to extremely critical fire conditions. until at least tomorrow night. at least 24 people have been killed. 90,000 are under evacuation orders. more than 40,000 acres have already burned across the los angeles area. the sheer destruction of the wildfires is genuinely difficult to comprehend. officials estimate at least 12,000 structures have been destroyed. here's what that looks like in just one of the affected neighborhoods. this was in the new york times today, using data from a few days ago. and it shows the altadena area, which has been devastated by the eaton fire. now, every single one of those orange dots, the orange part of that map is a building that has been damaged or destroyed. i mean, look at that. blocks upon blocks, homes, schools, places of worship, all damaged or destroyed. jen psaki was in altadena tonight where she met with california's governor, gavin newsom, to talk about the fires and how his state plans to rebuild following the unprecedented damage. she dangerous ladders. gutter muck. the unprecedented damage. she joins me live with that

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at fund.com. >> a deadly california wildfires continue to burn across the los angeles area with no end in sight. the state is already working on a plan to rebuild. tonight, msnbc's jen psaki was in altadena, california, where she spoke to governor gavin newsom. they discussed the process of rebuilding the attacks and misinformation coming from president elect trump, and threats by republican lawmakers in congress to put conditions on emergency aid. >> house speaker mike johnson suggested additional aid might have to come from with certain conditions. senate majority whip john barrasso said he expects funding to have strings attached. senator tuberville even said california doesn't deserve anything, saying, quote, unless they show us they are going to make some changes. you have been here on the ground in communities for the last week. what is your reaction to the response from leaders in washington? >> well, if that's leadership, i have a different definition. i imagine it would be universally

felt here. it's a i'm not meeting democrats. i'm not meeting republicans. i'm not meeting californians. i'm meeting american citizens desperate in need. and what they need is empathy, care, compassion, understanding. they need support, not rhetoric, not strings attached. i mean, i met families who lost not only their home, but their business and their church, their sense of self, place, community. they had a zoom the other night and everyone broke down crying because all they wanted to do was see the faces of one another. and yet that's the face of leadership in the state, the united states of america. conditioning aid to the american people in need. politicizing this tragic moment. so i'll spare any more commentary on it, except to say i would encourage these people, their human beings, they're parents. i respect that. come out here, visit, visit with these folks

and let's have a conversation after that. >> i'm more interested in how damaging it is when you have somebody with that type of a platform who is next week going to be the president of the united states, is injecting inaccurate information about a the worst wildfires in in american history. >> let me answer that by. thanking president of the united states joe biden, who within 36 hours supported a major disaster declaration by text. within a few minutes, later committed 100. he could have just committed 75% 90. he said 100% of all the costs for disaster recovery that took the time to meet with first responders was here on the ground. i want to thank president joe biden, and then i want to offer that as an example to the incoming president of presidential leadership, a president of the united states of america being

here for the american citizens. he didn't ask me, is this a conservative part of california? altadena. did they vote for me? what? you know, he didn't ask for his staff to look at the last election, you know, election and see how many were for kamala or how many were for donald trump said, how you got it. we have their backs. express empathy. i have firefighters that went up to him and they had tears in his eyes after meeting joe biden, who was consoling them. i think that's an example for the incoming president. what's not, i think, helpful or beneficial is the string of consciousness, these these wild eyed fantasies that somehow the state water project, we have reservoirs that are at or near historic highs, full, completely full, that somehow there's a magical spigot in california and northern california that just can be turned on. and all of a sudden there will be rain or water flowing everywhere. it's not helpful. it's damaging to

the very foundation of the notion of what our facts, what our truths. and the fact of that asymmetry that's profound and consequential, amplified by people like, let's be candid, elon musk and others. and that one two punch is real. and it's not just about this fire. as a hurricane force. winds of mis and disinformation that can divide a country on a myriad of issues. this is serious. and, you know, i get it. they want to take us. i get it, i'm not naive. i get the california derangement syndrome. i've been living with that for years and years. new scum, you know, the same seventh grade. i remember the guy on baltimore avenue that called me new scum. i was in seventh grade. i can handle that. we'll leave that aside. i understand what they're trying to do. i want to work with them. it's not about me. it's about people that we both represent. he represents and i represent. and i'm honored and proud to

represent these folks. and i desperately plead with them, come out here. help us, and we will help you. you'll be elevated, mister president. at the end of the day, you'll be the one we all will go to and say thank you. thank you, sir. thank you for living up to the values of this country. thank you for having the backs of these families and these kids. i met a kid the other day, literally was driving away. their house was on fire in the palisades, and the young daughter said, daddy, do you get my bunny? and he said, i didn't get your bunny. i got four kids. that's what i hope that the president of the united states, president trump, has an opportunity to meet with that family and jen psaki host of inside with jen psaki here on msnbc joins me now. >> jen, great interview today. hey, chris, let's talk first about just the your sense of right now. so there's sort of two stages right. like they got to get the fires under control. and it is very difficult if not

impossible with the winds going as they are. what what your understanding from the interview is about how feasible that is. and if there's a time frame they can even put on it. >> well, we talked about that a little bit in the interview too. chris, as you mentioned earlier, there is an expectation of increased winds over the overnight. we talked about the preparations they're putting in place for that. he has what he needs in preparation for that. but there are two stages right now. there is dealing with the weather and mother nature. and then there is also planning for the recovery and the rebuilding, which is happening at the same time. there's 100,000 people who have lost their homes, people who have lost their schools, lost their churches, lost their communities. there also. there's also predatory, predatory, excuse me behavior that's happening out there that he's learned from people in the community as well. so these are all of the things he's he's navigating. we talked about all of them. it is also happening at the same time where you're dealing with the worst wildfires in american history. and he's dealing with the worst

disinformation space happening at the same time. and republicans in washington who want to condition aid and push this disinformation. so these are all the challenges that he is facing. i've interviewed him a number of times. i know you have two. i've never seen him as emotional and as distressed as he is in this moment for good reason, for understandable reason. but it is. it is whack a mole in trying to get information out to the people in the state, the people who are impacted by these fires because of forces like the incoming president and his best friend elon musk, who are working on the other side. >> the thing i've talked to a bunch of people in california, of course, like we all have, you know, everyone i think is 1 degrees at most removed from this in many respects. so many people's lives have been touched. you know, aside from the profound loss of the deep emotional level of like losing your home, there's also then just the sheer hassle that you are staring down. and this is a

state that is under produced housing for a long time where housing supply has been constrained. you've got stories of zillow prices being through the roof. you've now got, you know, 1600 households that are all now looking to rent at the same time, like any sense of how you how you essentially deal with that from a governmental perspective. >> well, they're going to need tens of billions of dollars, is what he said. they don't have an exact number. there's been a lot of numbers thrown out there. president biden said tens of billions. some have suggested 50 billion. they don't know exactly yet. right. because they're doing a survey of the damage without knowing the full extent of the damage. and then there's this question of home insurance, which, as you know, has been a long, challenging issue in the state of california. insurers, major insurers pulled out of insuring homes in california. they have a program in california. but is that going to have enough funding to cover the cost of what everybody needs? and how long is that going to

take? and it's going to take months and months and months, even to clear the debris and clear the damage. the other tough question. i know you've talked about chris and i talked with the governor about is, is it are there tough conversations that need to happen about where you can rebuild, which is difficult? some of these communities have tremendous. altadena is one of them histories. right. and is there going to be need to be in addition to the funding, a response from the federal government that is like in the years after katrina, which we talked about as well, which is rebuilding the infrastructure and the waterways and making sure that it's safe to build upon. so those are all of the challenges. and that's the stage after containment, after these fires are stopped. those are all things that he and the government are certainly contemplating at this point in time. >> did you get a sense quickly, just in the last minute here, of how much, just how much the sort of national conversation matters there, or is it just such a different situation on the ground that, like the nonsense

on cable news doesn't penetrate? >> i mean, by nonsense, do you mean the suggestion that aid should be conditioned and that they don't deserve assistance? that kind of nonsense, that kind of stuff? i think what we talked about a bit also was the role of somebody like elon musk, who had to firefighters had to explain to him what the facts on the ground are. that's what they're dealing with. so it doesn't feel good. and we talked about this too. when you've lost your home, you've lost your school, you've lost your church, your place of worship, and you are dealing with absurd political debates when that has never historically been the case. i mean, louisiana is a place where and he talked about this. he was proud to support funding after hurricane katrina. mike johnson is a person who's saying aid should be conditioned. that's not lost on people. >> jen psaki. thank you. you can see more of jen's conversation with governor newsom later tonight on the 11th hour with stephanie ruhle. jen will be