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the social media giant with china's president, xi jinping. >> mr. trump also posting moments ago monday's inauguration, will move indoors with below freezing temperatures expected here in d.c. there is precedent for that, most recently ronald reagan in 1985. also, south dakota governor kristi noem, trump's pick to run the department of homeland security, is under the senate microscope today at her hearing. the controversial trump policy of mass deportation, expected to be run separately by another trump appointee, tom homan, and israel's security cabinet, accepts the gaza ceasefire deal, overriding opposition from two far right ministers after expected approval by israel's parliament. hope for today. the first three hostages, all israeli, could be released by israel time, potentially leading to the release of hostages. 33 hostages in the coming days. now it's in the hands of the israeli government. some on the far

right are still raising objections. >> and good day, everyone. i'm andrea mitchell in washington. >> a lot of breaking news. begin today with the breaking news from the supreme court on the massively popular social media platform tiktok. the high court upholding a ban set to begin sunday of the chinese owned app in the u.s. over national security and privacy concerns. president elect trump says he will make a decision on tiktok in the not too distant future, after speaking to china's president earlier this morning. tiktok ceo zhu xu will attend. president was scheduled to attend president elect trump's swearing in ceremony monday. that ceremony, the swearing in, will now be held indoors because of the freezing weather, according to a post just now by the president elect. joining us now, nbc news correspondent savannah sellers, white house correspondent aaron gilchrist. also with us, former u.s. attorney barbara mcquade. so,

aaron, first to you. you have just reported on the freezing temperatures, subfreezing temperatures expected on monday. sunday night, some more snow. and now the apparently the decision a safety decision really a security and safety decision. and the president elect announcing on truth social that the swearing in. and what about the speech? is the speech also going to be indoors. >> so a lengthy post here in just the last couple of seconds, andrea from the president elect about the events that are happening on monday. yes. he notes that because of the temperatures that are expected here for safety reasons, he is moving the effectively. everything that would have been outside is being moved inside. the swearing in will happen inside. he says that the capital one arena here in washington will be opened on monday for live viewing of the swearing in ceremony. he says that prayers and other speeches will also be delivered in the capitol

rotunda, instead of outside on the west front. and he says that various dignitaries and guests will be brought into the capitol for this experience. that will be, as he says, a beautiful experience for a large tv audience. the capital one arena is the large the huge arena venue here in the district of columbia. it is where the president elect will hold an event on sunday afternoon. now, we understand that because the events are being moved indoors, they're now going to open up that facility to, to, to folks to be able to watch the swearing in. there is still some. i'm going to try to get some clarity on on one part of this, he says that the capital one arena will also host the presidential parade. so there's a question about what exactly that means. is it just the, the portion of the day where we would see the president move from the capitol along pennsylvania avenue to the white house? or is it the parade that would follow that movement? the thousands of marching bands

and other groups that would move from the capitol down to the white house and past the reviewing stand that you may be able to see over my shoulder here. we're going to try to get some clarity on whether all of that is going to somehow be moved inside to a venue, to an indoor venue. andrea, it's just not clear at this point. >> and we should point out that the reviewing stand in front of the white house on pennsylvania avenue is heated. so that's a heated place where the president, his family, top cabinet members, top guests could watch a parade of the bands and all marching down pennsylvania avenue from the capitol, of course, to the white house. but it's a huge disappointment, of course, for invited guests. and, you know, for all of these young people who are coming and the bands. however, this is a security issue as well as a major national security issue, of course, and a safety issue for the health and welfare of people, you know, potentially hundreds of thousands or more

people expected here, including protesters. we should point out former homeland security secretary jeh johnson is also here with us. this is historic. it's happened before, certainly in 1985. it was freezing. i can attest to that. i when ronald reagan and i think he was sworn in in the east room. >> correct. and. obviously, this is disappointing for a lot of people, but it involves movement of thousands of people outdoors with magnetometers, screening through checks, checkpoints, members of congress, members of the supreme court, former presidents expected to be outside. so it's obviously a wise decision. >> it is a good point about the reviewing stand in front of the white house and the and the procession that normally takes place. >> is that going to still take place, or are they going to try to move that elsewhere? but this is probably the right decision to make, and it's a decision.

>> let's just talk for a moment. >> and michelle grossman is going to join us in a moment to talk about the weather itself. jay. but you have helped to plan inaugurals. you know, how much goes into this? i was just thinking about all of the personnel, secret service personnel who check us all in as we move with our bags and our cameras and all our equipment. i was going to be on one of the stands in front of the capitol. i've always done that and it's an exciting time. but you're also out there for hours. they're out there for even longer. so we're talking about the personnel itself, the, the, the first responders and all who have to be out in this weather. >> right? it's not just simply stepping out of a vehicle and standing outside for an hour during the actual ceremony. to be involved, you have to be out there for hours. >> and you're correct. >> i was involved in planning for the security of the 2017 inauguration just as i was. i was leaving office. i got held over to be the designated

survivor that day, but i was involved very much in the security of the inauguration. >> tell me one more thing about that, because we don't know who the designated survivor is. and just as in a state of the union message, there's always one cabinet member who stays behind. what is the protocol for that? as you have experienced, it is there because the official swearings in for even those who might be confirmed, like marco rubio, might be confirmed in a meeting on monday or later on inauguration day. but since there is technically no president for me, a matter of moments or no officials, who was the designated survivor? is that or how does that work? >> so good question. i had this job twice during the state of the union 2016 and then the inauguration 2017 during an inauguration. it's fundamentally different because the entire cabinet, everybody in the line of succession, except for the speaker and the president pro tem of the senate, are all resigning. so somebody in the

outgoing cabinet needs to stay on until the incoming president's cabinet is confirmed. and so on january 20th, 2017, i was secretary of homeland security for an extra seven hours, 32 minutes after noon, i make a great trivia question who was donald trump's first dhs secretary? that was me. >> that is a great trivia point. stay with us, jay. i just want to bring in nbc meteorologist michelle grossman joining us. so, as they say, how cold will it be on monday? >> yeah. hi, andrea. it's going to be cold. and not just your everyday cold. it's winter. we're looking at dangerous chill. we're looking at temperatures well below freezing. it's going to be important to wear lots of layers, kind of cover any exposed skin that you may have. wear them. you know as much layers as scarves and gloves because we are looking at temperatures 20 degrees at 9 a.m. the good news is we're going to have some sunshine. but notice the wind chill. we're going to see the winds pretty

gusty and that's going to bring the wind chill down as well. so by 12:00 looking at 22 3:00 21, the temperatures are not going anywhere throughout the day. we're going to remain right around the 20 degree mark. winds gusting up to 25mph with a wind chill of 5 to 10. that's what it feels like to expose skin. that's what it feels like on your body. so we want to keep that in mind as we're out and about. this will be the record coldest record since 1985, since ronald reagan, at seven degrees when the ceremony was held indoors. so, andrea, it's going to be a tough one. >> and michael steele joining us now as well, is this surprising given the fact that donald trump likes to talk about not only the pomp and circumstance, but there was all the issue about how large his inaugural crowds were compared to president obama's before him. >> well, so much for crowd size, right? andrea? you know, this now boils down to the tv viewing audience, which will be the metric that donald trump will focus on the largest audience to ever watch a presidential inauguration. et cetera. those

are the things that matter to him. you know, look, i understand wanting to move this indoors. smart, given the weather situation and condition, there are certainly a lot of members of that will be on the dais. and members of congress and guests who are older and, you know, that cold could have an impact. and so i really appreciate that. i think that, you know, in the broader spectrum of how this is going to play out, having it inside the capitol will be a very nice touch. it's a very intimate setting, for sure. and the fact that they're opening up the arena down the street to allow folks to go and view it from there, it's good to have some place to put everybody who is coming into washington with celebrations beginning tonight, you know, through the weekend leading up to monday. >> well, and in fact, jeh

johnson, you know, the rotunda. well, it's an absolutely beautiful space. it's an historic space. it's one of the spaces that was trashed on january 6th as, of course, four years ago. but jeh johnson, let's talk about what this means, just in terms of the impact of the president's speech. jay, if you're still there. >> yeah, i'm i'm still here. yes. i would assume that he's going to give the very same address. he just won't have the thousands of people responding and reacting to his address. and i know that's something that president trump draws energy from, shall we say. so it'll be you know, it'll be different in in character, but likely the same in substance. >> and what about the protesters who are expected and the parade and all those other outdoor, you know, events? and you know, well, the protesters are not events, but they are all planning to come. so this does change the security climate as well.

>> it certainly, andrea, as i'm sure you know, the inauguration is an nsc national special security event. we plan for months in advance for this. they know how to do this. the protesters would have if it had been outdoors, the protesters would have been kept blocks away. anyway. now that it's indoors, it probably makes it much less attractive given the cold. also, for any demonstrations or protesters to show up, jay, we're going to take a quick break if you can hang in, because we want your legal expertise as well, because in just 90s the other big news of the day here in washington, the supreme court upholding the tiktok ban. >> you're watching andrea >> you're watching andrea mitchell reports on msnbc. when bad allergies attack... trust claritin to keep you in the game. nothing is proven more powerful for continuous non-drowsy allergy relief.

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ask your rheumatologist about cosentyx. when you really need to sleep. you reach for the really good stuff. zzzquil ultra helps you sleep better and longer when you need it most. its non-habit forming and powered by the makers of nyquil. >> so let's go back to what was thought to be our top story. the tiktok ban upheld by the supreme court today. back with us, nbc news correspondent savannah sellers, former u.s. attorney barbara mcquade. savannah, you've been covering this throughout all the ins and outs. what does it mean, in a practical sense, for the 170 million tiktok users, including a lot of small business people who rely on this for their income, can bytedance still divest, sell, or is this a matter of lack of enforcement?

and the president elect, having spoken to xi jinping just today about it? >> yeah, andrea, you might have just hit on exactly what could end up being the real decision maker for tiktok on what to do, which is this question of enforcement. so, you know, you'd think, especially with the fact that look at the banner under me right now. breaking news supreme court upholds tiktok ban. you'd think, okay, the supreme court upheld it. it went to the highest court in our nation. tiktok is being banned. it is much more complicated than that. and the fact that we were able to break here at nbc news yesterday that the biden administration is saying that they are not planning to actually implement this. what that means is they are not going to collect the fines that a bunch of companies. this is how it's written in the law. apple, if it's in their app store, or google if it's in their app store, oracle if they continue hosting the data for tiktok, all of those companies could have been fined billions like $850 billion. is our math roughly what that would be should they actually have been implementing the law? the fact that they are now saying they're not going to

that was a stunning reversal yesterday. and they've they've said in some statements, you know, it's a holiday weekend. the government is shutting down. inauguration is monday. this date has been on the calendar for a long time. it was explicitly defined in the law signed by president biden himself, with an exact number of days, that this was the day it would go into effect. and the holiday weekend and the inauguration have also been on the calendar. so the fact that they just are announcing that is what really potentially could change a calculus for tiktok here. now, that being said, we did get a statement from the white house and we got a statement from the justice department, both of them sort of applauding. the national security is being upheld by the supreme court upholding the ban. but notably, they were pretty vague, but did reference the fact that there's, you know, it's a little confusing, too tough to really implement in light of the change of administration, if that is to happen, if they don't implement, what that essentially means is that there isn't a ban in practice, tiktok and its server providers, service providers could essentially continue going on without penalty. but the

question now will be, will those service providers feel that what they've seen on paper from the justice department, from the white house, is that enough protection? do they feel confirmed there will not be a penalty if tiktok is still tiktok on sunday? we are still waiting word from the company itself, from tiktok, on how they do plan to handle this. tiktok has told me. we will hear from them today. we will obviously bring that to you as soon as we have it. but right now for 170 million users, limbo continues. i would go ahead and say, though, that it's probably looking a little bit better than you might have thought, given the supreme court upholding this ban because of this question over enforcement from both administrations. >> and, barbara, how does that work? i mean, if you're the general counsel of a major corporation of one of these service providers, do you take the word, which is not a legal matter, that this is not going to be enforced? aren't there? isn't there potential liability to ignoring a supreme court order? >> absolutely, andrea. and of course, this is the will of congress. congress passed a statute that said there is a

significant national security risk here from a hostile foreign adversary in the form of china collecting users information. this isn't about messages that people might find objectionable. this is about capturing data. and if even if someone were to say, i don't care, who am i? >> i'm not worried about being compromised. >> that is a governmental interest, because it could be that somebody who's 18 years old today is a government employee of the future, and they could be used to for leverage purposes in a way that could be harmful to the united states government. so if i'm the general counsel, i would be very concerned because the statute also imposes hefty fines of $5,000 per user. and so with 170 million users, that could be billions of dollars in fines. >> and so i think that i would proceed cautiously and say, let's wait and see what happens. >> i also want to note, andrea, one really important thing, donald trump's flip flop on tiktok, saying that, you know,

now he welcomes them because he used it during the campaign and it was helpful to him, is a really disingenuous move, because it was he who first designated tiktok and bytedance as a national security threat during his first term. and so it seems more about his own expediency than about his national security interests in changing his position on this statute. >> and it's not tiktok per se, but china has also, according to all the top intelligence officials, has launched the most aggressive hacking against the u.s. treasury and our telecom companies. so typhoon against the telecom companies is still unresolved. those that you know, that's still going on, they don't know how they got in, how to get them out, how much damage has been caused. and only today, the u.s. treasury sanctioned several chinese people involved with that. those salt typhoon and the us treasury hack. not tiktok, but it's chinese government. and it all goes back

to the communist party of china. so that has been the main concern. savannah, just what is the cultural impact? there's a huge political impact, which is likely why donald trump flipped on it, and why all of those members of congress who voted for this are now flipping on it, starting with, you know, the democratic leader giving a speech last night saying we need more time. they voted for it. >> yeah. >> i mean, i think culturally right now, in terms of what you're seeing on tiktok, is a lot of like what is going on? why are all of these lawmakers switching their tune? because, andrea, to your point, what is so notable here, and i think maybe most important is the national security concern has not changed. this had broad bipartisan support to ban the app because of a national security concern. there has been no change to that. suddenly there is bipartisan support to not actually enforce this ban. it's really quite stunning. i do think it it's a little bit more of the political nature of nobody wants to be the person that 170 million americans are not happy they have their tiktok

because of, but the cultural impact is a good question. we've been asking questions of tiktok and not getting answers like, what happens to all these videos, right? i mean, it's kind of like this time capsule of the last five, six years or so. tiktok really took off, especially during covid. lots of people making videos about that kind of time in our history. what happens to that content? a lot of creators have been choosing to download everything they can from tiktok, start posting it on other apps and we will see, should a ban go into effect, how other tech companies and applications? i'm certainly thinking of meta. i'm certainly thinking of reels. we just got an announcement from instagram that they're making changes to reels that essentially makes it look a little bit more like tiktok. i wonder why that timing is right now makes it be able to function more similarly. and they continue to say, hey, creators, come here, make money. it's a stable environment. so, so culturally, if it were to be banned, there will certainly be a shift for something that a lot of americans make their living on. also, by the way, thanks so much, savannah sellers. >> barbara mcquade, to both of you. and next, a live report

from capitol hill on kristi noem's confirmation hearing to lead dhs. you're watching andrea mitchell reports on msnbc. >> buying a car is kind of a big deal. >> there's like a million options, and you deserve something you love. at cargurus, we get it. as the number one most visited car shopping site, most visited car shopping site, wwhen you really need to sleep. you reach for the really good stuff. zzzquil ultra helps you sleep better and longer when you need it most. its non-habit forming and powered by the makers of nyquil.

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my terms. thanks. medical guardian, five foot nine men not included. >> the first week of confirmation hearings for president elect trump's expected cabinet picks up his picks, rather is wrapping up on capitol hill. south dakota governor kristi noem, trump's choice for homeland. security secretary, fielded questions this morning. her expected role in top trump aide stephen miller, in charge of implementing the president's immigration policies such as mass deportation. >> i would say there's no authorities being planned to be taken away from the department or or myself if i'm in the role, and we'll continue to mixed signals, you can understand how, you know, people in my home state, maybe around the country, when they hear mr. homan saying, i'm making the decisions, when they hear president elect trump

say he's in charge of our border. >> and joining me now is nbc news congressional correspondent julie sirkin. back with us, former homeland security secretary jeh johnson, former republican national chairman michael steele, co-host of msnbc's the weekend. so, julie, governor noem said she would not politicize disaster funding under fema, which is also under her management, and insisted that cisa is off mission, misdirecting its resources. that's a controversial shift. it's her position on the border and immigration that many americans were waiting to hear. but she's really not going to be in charge of that. >> and that's exactly what andy, kim, andrea, who is the most junior democrat on that panel, was pushing her on because, of course, we all know that tom homan is going to be the border czar. >> so in that case, what is kristi noem's role here? and i think it's important to point out that there were some questions about her qualifications for this role. she has never worked in law enforcement. she is obviously not from a border state. she's never handled immigration and

border policies. >> and so when you have someone like tom homan, who has the experience to lead on that, that calls that very issue into question. >> i will say, though, i think in terms of the hearing, she does have support on the republican side of the aisle. she made it extremely clear that, of course, she's going to be following what president trump wants to do being aggressive on the border, aggressive on immigration, and certainly the department and the agency which she will lead will be extremely relevant in the coming months. just today, the senate took the next step to advance, for example, the lincoln riley act, which would crack down on illegal immigration, migrants charged or not, who commit crimes related to theft or burglary, also having to do with bodily harm against others. of course, that's going to cost a lot of money and it will be up to the dhs under trump and under kristi noem, if confirmed, to enforce those policies, as well as, of course, the many others that republicans are looking to tackle in the coming weeks. those executive orders that we've been talking about that trump may or may not be pursuing in his first few weeks of his administration. so she is as crucial and as key as it gets. the question is, does she get

any democrats? look, it doesn't really matter. she has the votes in the republican side anyway. rand paul, who is the chairman of the homeland security committee, teased that a vote in committee could happen as soon as monday, and he urged democrats to support her as well. >> andrea and jay johnson, let's just talk about the implications of all of that. steve miller, one of the real hardliners on the muslim ban on other immigration policies, as well as what tom homan has said about the southern border. how concerning is that it's a $100 billion agency. that is very complicated. fema, disaster relief, everything else that's under it, secret service. what are your concerns about her ability to lead this? >> so i thought governor noem came across as a confident and poised witness with convictions. she she displayed a firm

understanding of all of the different roles and responsibilities within dhs, which you just outlined. as noted, the most interesting exchange was with senator andy kim. he asked the question that i'd ask and that if i were the nominee, i'd want to know who's the boss when it comes to border security. tom homan, as border czar, is essentially white house staff. stephen miller is white house staff. she is the senate confirmed presidential. and bory exists wholly within the responsibility of the secretary of dhs. so if tom homan calls her up and says, i want you to do x, does she have to respond and comply with the direction from someone who's white house staff? and i'm not sure. we got a whole lot of clarity on that today. >> and, michael, as we look at these hearings, it does look as

though right now at least hegseth has the votes. some of these more controversial choices. we haven't yet had a hearing for tulsi gabbard because they haven't finished the background check, apparently, and there may be some problems there. nor for rfk jr is one scheduled, i think, as of now. so there is still a couple of controversial choices. and kash patel, of course, at fbi. but so far, pam pam, bondi, hegseth and others, certainly marco rubio, who is not controversial in terms of the republican majority and many democratic senators who admire what he did on the intelligence committee and think he's a 14 year veteran. and, you know, senator, and that he's certainly one of the most qualified people to lead foreign relations. if even if you disagree with him on some policies. but there are still a couple. do you still think that maybe tulsi gabbard or rfk jr might have some problems? >> well, they have problems, but the republicans don't care about

their problems, just like they don't care about the fact that kristi noem isn't qualified to be in the role. they're putting her up for it. nor is pete hegseth. but they will they will bow and say yes and pass their nomination. she will not control the immigration policy of this country. she has the title. and this is typical in trump world for women. you have the title. but i don't know how much power you're really going to have, because homan is the one who's going to call the shots. donald trump's specifically selected him for a purpose, and stephen miller is a part of that purpose as well. and so they're going to drive this this immigration policy, this deportation policy. and so, you know, senator kim was exactly right to ask the question to get it on the record. and she couldn't she could not answer it in a way that would not displease donald trump, because we know what's going on there with respect to hesseth and the others. look, the bottom line is the things about him, the allegations of

his his lewd behavior, his drunkenness, all of that didn't matter because that's not germane to what they need him there for. and so this is going to be the setup for what is going to come on the back end with the more controversial picks. and i think you'll just see republicans kind of, you know, backslide away from, you know, really addressing the problem in front of them because they don't want to be on the wrong side of donald trump, and therefore they will not. and just as we saw with hegseth, every time the democrats level up the charge, they will submit to the record a prepackaged response with a letter or or some article that, you know, confirms that individual to be of right character in mind. >> and jay johnson, i want to also bring up something that real shakeup in house intelligence because the speaker apparently, after a conversation with mar-a-lago has removed or

is not reappointing the highly respected ohio republican mike turner, to be chair of intelligence, and he's not even going to be on the committee. and apparently this has upset a lot of the moderate republicans, the so-called moderate group. and there could be some problems, some fallout for the speaker from that in terms of the reconciliation bill. but it's really quite stunning. one of the things that was notable about him is that he called the shots as he saw them, and turner went to the floor and criticized fellow republicans for repeating russian propaganda, propaganda about who started the war in ukraine and whether ukraine should, you know, whether it was ukraine entering nato, which was not about to, which was what putin said, and that that has just been repeated by the president elect as well as by the foreign minister lavrov. that same four year old propaganda. so that may have been the breaking point for him to keep his lot. j the house and

well regarded. >> yeah. the house and senate intel committees are in my observation, like the last two committees of congress that show some, some element of nonpartisanship. i always took a lot of comfort in seeing the chair and ranking of the house intel committee do joint media appearances together on the sunday shows or what have you. and i'm worried that this is a step backward from that when it comes to the intelligence community, intelligence assessments we really do need in this nation for the sake of our national security. a bipartisan, nonpartisan approach to legislative oversight. >> jeh johnson, michael steele and julie sirkin, of course, as well. thank you all. and up next, the latest from israel as we await a vote by their full government on the future of the cease fire deal in gaza. this is

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israel's security cabinet approved a cease fire agreement that officials hope would permit the first three hostages, all israeli, to be released by sunday or at the latest monday morning. it's now being considered by the full cabinet. then it goes for final government approval to israel's parliament, known as the

knesset, paving the way for a six week truce, they hope, potentially ending 15 months of war. we've just learned that the full cabinet meeting is actually underway, and in the first six weeks, hamas would release 33 hostages, including two americans. israel would trade several hundred palestinian prisoners and then permit aid to surge into gaza, as well as pulling troops out of populated areas into buffer zones. joining me now is michael oren, the former israeli ambassador to the us. ambassador, thank you very much. are you confident now? there are a lot of twists and turns. israeli politics are notably confusing, but bibi netanyahu, benjamin netanyahu, known as bibi, is the master of survival in these contexts. what we've been told and certainly read from minister ben uyghur on twitter, was that he is against this deal, that he will not bring down the coalition, but he will resign if it goes forward with the trading of the

prisoners, because the prime minister will not agree to resume hostilities, resume the war, in other words. and he thinks that that is a dangerous step. that said, from my understanding, netanyahu has had support from several other members of the knesset, opposition leaders lapid and benny gantz. and so this will not bring down his government. is that your read of it? >> it is good to be with you, andrea. >> and there's nothing about this that isn't immensely complex and deeply agonizing for the people of israel. keep in mind that, again, they may get 33 hostages back over the course of six weeks. we don't know, at the end of the day, how many of those 33 are alive, how many are coming back in an ambulance, and how many are coming back in a box. and that will leave almost 60 hostages dead in the live in gaza over the next two phases of this plan, very, very complex. and hamas is still fighting. hamas is still shelling border communities. hamas is still killing soldiers. something

between 40 soldiers killed over the last six weeks in gaza. so hamas is very much there and hamas will declare victory. so it's immensely, immensely painful. and on top of all that, freeing these palestinian prisoners, it looks like a one line on the screen here. but it's hundreds and hundreds of palestinian prisoners who have killed israelis and the families of those people murdered are have to understand, you know, why is this guy going home and getting a hero's welcome when our loved ones are still on the ground? and in addition to getting approval from the inner cabinet, the broad cabinet and the knesset, you also have to approve from the israeli supreme court because the relatives of those victims are now going to appeal this decision, this deal, to the israeli supreme court. with all that, i think you're absolutely right. benjamin netanyahu is a political genius, the ultimate survivor. if he wants it, it's going to go through. the question is, what does he want in the long run? yes. the first phase calls for a 42 day cease fire and israeli withdrawal from certain parts of gaza. but hamas wants a complete

withdrawal. it wants the end of the war, which means hamas wins, and it's going to hold on to those hostages, the remaining 60 hostages, until that's done. so the big question is what happens after this phase, the second phase, the third phase, and a bigger question after that. what is the position of the trump administration? >> and a lot of credit is being given by many people, including hostage families, to donald trump for really laying down the hammer as much on netanyahu as on hamas, over which he has less influence. they're more influenced by the israel's successful efforts against iran, hezbollah, the syrian collapse. so they've lost their they've lost their patrons, or pretty much. but in any case, donald trump and his envoy, steve witkoff, were given credit from a lot of people, including. i talked to secretary blinken this week, and he said that witkoff was terrific in helping close the deal. that said, and the three hostages who are coming

out first, potentially on sunday, are three israeli women who we're told are is in terrible shape, have been abused, assaulted, this unspeakable crimes against them and that is going to have that is going to reverberate among the israeli public as well. but the americans are going to have to wait. and there are three surviving americans. we've been told that two of them will come out in this first period. they're going to have to wait days, even weeks into this first 40 day period before they come out. and then there's a third american, ethan alexander, who would be in the second phase. and getting to that second phase is going to be difficult. so indeed, there's a lot of angst, frankly, among the american hostage families. but what they're saying publicly and privately is that they're just happy for the families who are getting their loved ones back, as well as the four americans families that are waiting and hoping and praying for the remains of their loved ones to be returned home. >> and this is why this event is so mixed with with joy and anguish and anger and pain.

think about all the literally hundreds of thousands of israelis who have fought in this war, who have lost friends. many of them come back irreparably maimed and saying, okay, what did we fight for? if hamas survives? so there's going to be there's going to be anger, there's going to be confusion and regret. and then the big question is, will hamas actually keep the cease fire? remember, there was a cease fire in place on october 7th, 2023. there was a cease fire in place in november 2023. during the first hostage exchange. hamas broke all those cease fires. it has broken every cease fire there has ever been there we've reached. so will hamas keep the cease fire? you could have a situation where all of a sudden there'll be some rockets on an israeli community, and hamas will say, well, it's not us, it's somebody else in the gaza strip. and we know how that game works out, or there'll be an ambush of israeli soldiers and they'll say, well, it wasn't us. it was some other breakaway faction. i don't know whether the israeli government, benjamin netanyahu, are counting on the fact that that hamas will break the cease fire, and then they'll

have an arrangement with the incoming president, president trump, that says, okay, the united states will give full backing to the israeli and israeli forces to complete the destruction of hamas. and that is what some ministers are actually saying in the state of israel today, or whether it's even a broader understanding about iran. >> yeah. let me also just posit that a lot of anger about the prisoner exchanges, and once they see the names and the identities and the crimes of some of them, yahya sinwar was one of those prisoners who was exchanged by israel, as you know, some 11 or 12 years ago. but also we have to talk about the 46, 47,000 palestinians who have died. this war has been horrific. it was started by hamas, 1200 people killed, you know, hundreds taken hostage. but the horrors of it all have just been profound and throughout the region. and you're absolutely right. the next step could well be iran. we're going to have to leave it there on this very busy day. michael oren, as always, thank you. thank you so much. and next, we'll break down a very

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1 prilosec a day... beats taking up to 10 antacids a day. it's that simple, for 24 hour heartburn relief... one beats ten. prilosec otc. tiktok on national security concerns. whether or not that ban goes into effect on sunday remains to be seen. you've got both president biden and president elect trump opposing the ban now and saying it, or at least president biden saying it's not going to be enforced. joining us now is democratic oregon senator ron wyden, a member of the intelligence committee and also the author of the new book, it takes chutzpah how to fight fearlessly for progressive change. what a great title. congratulations on the book. you talk about that in a moment, but so you would introduced legislation earlier to delay the ban. and there's a lot of support, senator schumer and others for delaying the ban,

which was just approved. everyone knew the date, the date of january 19th was embedded in the legislation. it was signed. so what's changed, other than the fact that just today the treasury has sanctioned other chinese actors for the telecom and treasury hacks? you know, i was i was the one to blow the whistle on salt typhoon because we wrote a law, incredibly, 20 years ago that said that the phone companies were supposed to have real security. >> and it wasn't until people caught, most recently, the chinese climbing around in our telecommunications systems that we had the. >> so with all this aggressive chinese behavior online and the fact that they have so much influence in terms of shaping the minds of our younger generation, why, why with, you know, why postpone the ban? >> well, first of all, i think it is in the interest of our country to find an american buyer. >> i mean, there are 170 million

people. >> and it's not just the jobs, but it's young people. there's tremendous enthusiasm for tiktok among kids to learn. and i'm going to have town hall meetings this weekend in oregon. i'll be hearing a lot about it. so what? i hope we'll do two things. one, find an american buyer. and second, on salt typhoon as it relates to protecting americans from chinese influence. finally, do what i proposed years and years ago, which is get those phone security systems cleaned up and get rid of the chinese influence. >> and senator secretary mayorkas was sitting right in the seat in two weeks, two weeks ago, saying that they have not even figured out how it's how they got in, nor how to get them out, nor what the damage is. so typhoon is an ongoing threat. >> some of the most conservative members of the senate, andrea, say that this is the biggest hack in american history. >> so if that doesn't wake people up, i don't know what is. >> but i'm going to get this

done. and i'm starting with the argument is we wrote this law 20 years ago. why in hell haven't we implemented it? >> well, the incoming president, president elect trump, spoke to xi jinping just today about it. as invited the head of bytedance to the inauguration. so it does seem that he has changed his position because he was against it initially. >> well, he's been all over the map with respect to the whole question of tiktok. >> now we know what we need to do. >> the two steps that i outlined protect american interests and the first amendment. remember, the founding fathers really thought that the first amendment was the most important. some of them thought it was more important than government. >> and that's what many people in journalism think as well. you're the ranking member on member of finance. yesterday you heard from the nominee for treasury. what is your takeaway? >> i'm particularly troubled by his position on tariffs. and the stakes are so high here. you know my state one out of four jobs revolves around trade and

economics. and you know, the trump people lied all the way through the campaign. they said foreigners were going to pay the tariffs, which is just not true. they're going to be paid for by workers and by small businesses. and what we said, and i've articulated it as the position i hope democrats will follow, apropos of having some hutzpah is it is appropriate to look at tariffs in a careful focus, one at a time, to try to figure out where it could be a useful tool. but where the trump people go wrong is they use tariffs as a blunt instrument across the board. tariffs. and besant yesterday tried to give everybody a big academic explanation about how everything would be hunky dory. no way that's going to be a burden on working people. it's going to cause more inflation. >> and talk to me about your book, because you write in the book that advancing protections for seniors and advancing health care coverage for all americans

is a big concern. what concerns do you have that you've outlined in the book? well, first i got to tell everybody what chutzpah is. yeah, please. >> chutzpah. >> it's grit and it's determination, and i call it the indispensable instrument for making america a better place. for example, i think when you talk about chutzpah in america, the founding fathers basically told the british to go fly a kite. so we have a big tradition on it. and apropos right now is it's going to take a lot of chutzpah for congress to say no to these special interests that are going to try again, to get a whole bunch of loopholes into the tax debate. we've got a hugely important tax debate coming up. the people who are able to punch loopholes into it, the 2017, they're going to come back and try to make them even bigger, and i'm going to stop them. >> well, congratulations on the book. thank you. lots of luck going forward. thank you. >> 12 rules of chutzpah. so that we can say everybody has

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>> from the gaza cease fire and hostage deal, if it holds, is

going to allow for a surge in desperately needed aid. aid to gaza, where there is famine, near famine conditions, a lack of medicine, water, fuel, shelter, doctors. joining me now, usaid, usaid administrator samantha power. of course, the former u.n. ambassador from the united states. thank you so much for everything you've done. there's been a lot of news today with everything changing on capitol hill. but let's quickly get to the humanitarian aid for the palestinians in gaza. if and when this goes into effect. do you think that some of the barriers that, frankly, that israel has put up along the borders and the closures can be eliminated, we can get more truckloads in and move it quickly? thank you, andrea, and thanks for all the attention you have paid to the humanitarian situation in gaza from the beginning. >> the short answer is yes, we really hope to be able to surge humanitarian assistance. we have sent a team from washington to

the region. they're working through the modalities of how many more checkpoints can be opened at one time, how the hours can be extended, where the trucks can be sourced from. we have had stockpiles in the region for a long time that we have been trying to push in. the end of conflict is going to make a profound difference. i mean, just in terms of the ability to move from north to south in gaza, which has been severely impeded, the ability to reach people in northern gaza, who are surely the worst off of any of the hungry civilians. obviously, shelter is still a huge issue. getting winterization supplies in only 20 or 30% of the things that we thought were needed for winter have reached civilians who are mainly living kind of out, away from homes, given all of the destruction that has occurred. so we've got to take advantage of this, and i think we're well positioned to do so. but we also need more resources to be mobilized. if we can bring up the number of trucks that are going in, we're going to want

there to be a consistent, steady pipeline. and the next administration, of course, has been absolutely pivotal in helping secure the ceasefire. and we're hoping in the implementation and in the humanitarian emergency assistance, but also in the reconstruction phase that will come later, that they will also be deeply engaged. >> and you've traveled all over the world endlessly and dealing with all of these disasters. but i just want to leave this on a positive note. you've also managed to make sport diplomacy part of your regimen in 50 countries. playing rugby, baseball, trying to bridge divides. how important is that? >> how important is that? well, i think it just comes down to meeting people where they are. i think usaid is america's ground game. in our foreign policy, we show that our model is different from that of the prc. we give grants, not loans. we're out there in communities actually listening to young people to find out what their aspirations are to tailor our programing in digital, in education, in

agriculture, you name it. and so getting out there and meeting young people on their terms, there's nothing quite like the equalizer of getting schooled by a 12 year old in in soccer or in cricket, or by a 17 year old in basketball. and, and so that kind of opens up a space for a different kind of engagement and to show america and that what we do is on behalf of the american people. >> samantha power, thank you for your service. thanks for all you do. we really appreciate it. thank you andrea. and that does it for this edition of andrea mitchell reports. remember to follow us on social media at mitchell reports. you can rewatch best of our show anytime on youtube. go to msnbc.com slash. andrea, i'll see you back on monday. i'll be in the field somewhere as part of msnbc's inauguration coverage, which is changing as we speak. it all begins at 6 a.m. with rachel maddow picking up at ten to bring you the key moments of the day. chris jansing report