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the nightcap. tonight we are just three days away from donald trump's inauguration, and for only the third time in u.s. history, it will be held in the capitol rotunda because of freezing weather. on his social media site, donald trump said he announced that this move and noted it has not happened since ronald reagan's second swearing in. and while president joe biden warns of an american oligarchy on the horizon, trump will be flanked by the world's richest men at his inauguration ceremony. the group includes elon musk, jeff bezos, mark zuckerberg and now tiktok's ceo. this is what's odd. earlier today, the supreme court upheld the ban on the chinese based app that is set to begin on sunday. president biden has already announced he will not enforce it, leaving the fate of the tiktok app to his successor. and trump has already signaled he does not want it to be banned. with that, let's bring in our nightcap. it's a great one. former republican congressman christopher shays of connecticut, msnbc anchor chris jansing, david gura, bloomberg

correspondent and host of the big take podcast, and pablo torre, espn analyst and host of the meadowlark media's pablo torre finds out podcast. all right, christopher, if tock. tick tock gets shut down. right. president biden said, let's punt it. trump can decide. but still, the supreme court upheld it. the doj could say, let's shut this thing down on sunday. will this not create, even in the short term, a pr disaster for democrats? because this ban was brought by house republicans, voted on, passed on a bipartisan basis. president biden signed it. supreme court upheld it. but millions and millions of americans do not want it. and donald trump is clearly signaled he wants to save this thing. it's got the tick tock ceo with him on monday. if this thing gets shut down on sunday, donald trump brings it back on monday. will this not create the worst pr disaster for democrats looking like we were the heavy handed, you know, big government overreach and that outlaw donald

trump? he saved the day. >> the answer is yes. what's your next question? >> so what do they do. >> what do they do is just make sure they don't shut it down right now. and frankly, i think americans didn't pay much attention to it when it was happening. and since 50% of the american people are using it, i don't think they want to shut down. and i will say i don't use it. so i'm wondering, what are they going to, what information are they going to learn about me? and if you use it, you have agreed to take the risk. >> and i will say that all the 20 somethings i talked to are like, all my information is out there anyway, and neither side, to be fair, neither republicans or democrats have made the case that people can understand about why this is a national security threat. >> yeah, we've punted on caring about privacy. yeah. >> when it comes to the sunk cost of all of us just being on these apps. and again, when i say on these apps, i feel so much older than the people who are protesting the tiktok ban.

but it's true, steph. >> it's true. people of all ages are protesting the tiktok ban, right? and lots of people say, oh, it's just for dancing and cooking videos. lots of people. that's where their business is. that is where they make their money. and lawmakers have not made the argument to them successfully over these last ten years. of all that we're giving up in terms of our information, 150 million people, monthly active user base in the us, to your point, absolutely enormous. >> the thing, though, when it comes to how much do we care about what china is doing and how much do we care about who's getting our data? that concern has been so abstracted and generally true of every other thing we have in this that i think the question of what's the unique argument that that makes people say, this is beyond the pale versus this is the thing that is just deeply inconveniencing me and my happiness, because tiktok has the reputation of the thing among all these apps that does poll well among its users. shockingly, that's kind of its

reputation. it's better than the other one. >> and aren't people just going to move over to a couple of other apps? that's the point. that's the point. >> but but what about the argument that people make where they say, haven't i already given my information to facebook and twitter? how do i know that you know, my information is being protected by them? there are no laws protecting our information because democrats or republicans, people, our lawmakers have barely put any regulations on this social media universe irrelevant of who owns it. >> there's that facet of it. there's also this disconnect, i think, within the republican party as well. there are republicans who say the primary reason for banning this is that it's owned by a chinese company. >> they say, and the chinese could use this for nefarious purposes. but to your point, i think we've seen the evolution in the criticism of it over these last many years, and nobody exemplifies that better than donald trump, who for such a long time was calling for a ban of this app. and then he had a moment where he went the opposite way. he's, you know, making making friends now with the ceo of this company who lives in singapore, has brought him over for, for his

inauguration. so we see that about face and it just serves to make more convoluted. again, i think whatever republican whatever whatever lawmaker opposition they have to it. >> but are republicans really split on it? right. yesterday, josh hawley, who was a big proponent of the ban, was asked about it and he kind of sheepishly said, well, you know, overturning it or not, not enforcing it, not my favorite thing. but at the end of the day, we're watching republicans day after day get in line with what donald trump wants, because if they don't, it is they fear, you know, political death. >> for them, it's not going to be banned. i mean, we can all agree it's not going to be banned. >> and can we talk about one reason why? and the ceo said it in the video that he put out today. yes, donald trump has had 6 billion views, 6 billion views on tiktok. donald trump believes that that helped him get elected, he says. melania trump says it was their son, barron, who went to him and said, dad, the young men, if you want to

reach them, go on to tiktok. he did, and 6 billion views later, he thinks ■that was a contributing factor to him. and he's right. >> if it's not banned, perhaps it will be bought. and that will be the next delicious chapter in this political story, because all of the men that you mentioned at the top of the show, who are going to be accompanying their of them, there are many viable candidates. why would they sell it or buy it if they're forced to? >> yes, yes, it goes through if they're forced to sell it. and i made a mistake. josh hawley was talking about the tiktok ceo going to the inauguration. not his favorite thing, but still same thing. if they potentially sell it to us hands, it could go to the likes of an elon musk. and that begs the question. >> turns me off. >> okay, because wasn't there a time when lawmakers really cared about concentration of power and wealth and industries? i don't know, something that we once cared about called antitrust, which is worse than having the chinese have it. but but it's the reason so many people, in at least the banking world today are thrilled about trump's win

because they think this is going to be a mergers and acquisitions bonanza. you know this, i know that. >> yeah, i mean, that's very much what the zeitgeist is on on wall street. that even without any detail of what that regulatory landscape is going to look like, they feel like the gates will be open and it will be much easier for these companies to come together. and any of the opposition to what you're describing is going to vanish come monday at noon. >> okay. so politically speaking, yeah. right now, since the supreme court is holding up the ban. right, donald. president biden has said no, no, no, punt it. if this thing really is at risk of getting shut down on sunday, would that be a disaster for democrats? sure. >> but i also think, look, can i connect it to the scene that was painted by you at the top that was just referenced about all of these tech ceos just gathering? it's a remarkable thing that the through line, the common thread is that the tech companies get what they want here. so when it comes to what are democrats doing here, they are losing to a coalition in which the richest people in the world have been cosplaying as the rebel

alliance, and what they're doing is ruining genuinely, i say this knowing the full freight of it. they are ruining american culture, making all of us unhappier, and they are now going to be in control of politics. so the question is, when joe biden references the oligarchy, couldn't that have been articulated a little bit sooner? maybe. couldn't this have been something that we coalesced around, because this seems to be the story of our time and also this administration? okay. >> then the question is, or i'm starting to think, could the next biggest storyline of the next four years is how much and how often donald trump hoodwinked his actual base, the many non-wealthy voters, right? once we see fat corporate tax cuts, once we see tariffs, once we see potential cuts to entitlements and government departments that could potentially get completely wiped out, is there. when will we start to see donald trump's actual base, right, or his populist base, the ones who are

the reason he's in political power today? will they realize i just got hoodwinked? the three richest men in the planet are standing next to him, having huge influence over policy over the next four years. >> i'm smiling at you because when you talked about all the things he's going to do, he's not going to be able to do it. >> okay, tell us why he's not going to be able to get it through the senate. >> you know, the american people are really unhappy with these big bills that come out. there's only two big bills that come out. it's basically reconciliation. the only way you can get anything passed without a filibuster is to attach it to the budget bill. and so whatever he does, he's got to get in the budget bill. and if he doesn't get it in the budget bill, he ain't getting it. >> and can i also remind people that one of the things that donald trump said that was successful, when i stood in line at his madison square garden rally toward the end of the campaign, and you spent about 12 hours at msg, i did and talked

to a lot of people there. so many of them mentioned the cost of food, right. that was not a surprise to anybody that this was motivating a lot of voters. donald trump said over and over and over again, i'm going to bring down the cost of groceries. it's simple. he got elected. the next thing you know, it's going to be hard. >> his first interview with kristen welker, he already started to say, i don't know about grocery prices. it's hard. >> yeah, it's an insane coalition. >> the richest people in the world and the america first nativist base. and that was, i think, illuminated when there was the h-1b visa thing with my with my guy, vivek ramaswamy, who, by the way, college buddies. >> college buddies, yes, so to speak, college classmates, the next governor of ohio, perhaps. perhaps that's your home state. >> but the point being, they have when i talk about silicon valley, what they have done is decided to give on culture, right? all the soft stuff. you want us to talk about the world and what you are afraid of in

the way that you do. great. they have no shame about that. but in exchange, they want actual policy. they want to do some stuff. and so this whole thing about, okay, well, what if we bring over inexpensive labor from india? and vivek goes on and articulates this in this insanely long tweet that feels like the realest thing he has ever felt. and guess what happens? the dude is basically shamed and disappeared from that issue because it is so deeply unpopular to the base that donald trump and elon musk now all realize we need to tend to. but there is a car crash coming because the rubber and road of we want to enrich ourselves and do stuff that is not in your best interest is so inevitable that they're just trying to keep this together. but it's going to be a giant, corrupt mess. >> there was a moment this week during the confirmation hearing for scott bessent, which i think was the sleepiest of all the confirmations that we've seen where bernie sanders, who's now a member of that committee, asked about income inequality and scott besson couldn't really respond to it. and i think it

highlights this issue, that they don't have a good response to criticisms of how wide this income gap is. and so there's this gauze that they layer over these billionaires, they're immigrants, they're self-made. that's going to only resonate for so long. and scott besson was really caught trying to defend the fact that there is this wide gap. and i think it indicates it's going to become more problematic as time goes on. >> but scott besson actually just failed on that answer because bernie sanders asked him over and over, you know, minimum wage in this country is $7.25. is that enough? blah, blah, blah, blah. >> he doesn't want a federal. he doesn't want any changes to the federal minimum wage. >> but scott besson could have simply said what most republicans feel this should be regional. this should be right. he kind of fumbled it in the end. let the states decide, because the cost of living in different states is different things, and lots and lots of people could hear that and say, okay, i could buy that. but instead he was tongue tied. and when you think about the donald trump's true base, right. donald trump's true base came from a group of people who said, life isn't fair for me here. i don't have the job. i don't have the opportunity. my family doesn't.

someone else does. and now the people who are the closest to donald trump, right. and let's be clear, democrats have all sorts of mega-rich donors, too. like, let's be really honest about that. also true. but these people that are now in these huge positions of power know nothing, care nothing about those people who are donald trump's true base. >> yeah, but these these very rich people are saying foolish things to say that we can reduce and get rid of $2 trillion of waste. it's just an absurdity. it's an absurdity. i mean, there is lots of waste to get rid of, but it ain't true. 2 trillion. and furthermore, the only way you're going to get it done is if you can pass the filibuster. good luck. or stick it in the budget or executive order. this, to me, is the real crime. >> talk about this because donald trump supposedly has 100 executive orders ready for day uno. you know why? that's one. if you don't speak, you know why? >> because you can't get it passed through congress. you you

congress is not able to do what it needs to do. it's a serious problem that has made the president he misses. >> what's that? yeah. yeah. you miss it. >> i do miss it. i would love to be there. and you know, i think of the moderate republicans who have just lied down. and now what they have is they have turner who's out of a job. >> okay. talk about that. what does that say? that mike turner is was publicly fired as intel chief. and the reason they cited concerns from mar-a-lago, i.e. concerns that you support, you're being honest about it. >> but the reason is, is they've had to have made a deal to make the speaker. speaker by getting rid of mike. >> but don't you think? >> but my point my point is there are some moderate republicans. where the heck have they been? >> they're going to lose their jobs if they continue to be moderate. think about what this is like for mike turner. right. you're not you know this better than me. you're not the house

intel chair anymore. think about all all that he will lose in terms of a public position fundraising ability. >> so what should moderates do? the same thing that the conservatives did. if you're going to do this, we ain't voting for the speaker. in fact, if i had been there, you'd got me thinking about this. if i had been there wistful. if i had. now here we go. if i had been there, i would have gone to the most conservative members and said, so you want to get rid of the speaker and have johnson be the speaker? well, if you're going to do that, what i'm going to do is i'm going to get two of my colleagues or three of my colleagues, and we're going to vote to make hakeem jeffries the speaker. and then what we're going to say to hakeem is, we don't want any committee except we want to be on rules committee. we don't want to be chairman, and we want to make sure that whatever you try to do as a democrat, we agree to christie. >> how do you think that's going to work out? that's not why not? >> look, so here we are in a situation where the republicans

clearly are not going to go against donald trump. >> the question or elon musk, who elon musk has unlimited budget to primary. right. >> but the question really is are the democrats. and what did we learn this week from the confirmation hearings? donald trump say what you will about him. he is the master of the delay tactic. fo'sho he has even where he got convicted. he did not get a sentence right. so now he has all these folks that the democrats were up in arms about, people who were going to potentially be in the cabinet. pete hegseth pete hegseth can't be in the cabinet. he's been accused of sexual assault. lots of folks who worked with him said he came to work drunk. you know what all the accusations are? to which he replied, not, no, i didn't do that. but he said anonymous. >> anonymous. source. anonymous. >> smears. so his delay tactics

worked again, i don't know. do you see anyone who's been in the confirmation hearings this week? and that hearing was not going to get incredibly anticlimactic. >> i mean, even joni ernst, when she was embarrassed and a charm offensive. >> so. so where were the democrats on that? now, some people i talked to said, well, just wait, because there's some other people we're really concerned about. you have to pick and choose. so robert f kennedy, tulsi gabbard, kash patel, they still have to have confirmation. doctor oz, are they saving their fire for that? is that what's happening? >> i am struck by a key insight of donald trump's, which is that the american attention span is only so long it all will pass. right? the question of we're going to cut 2 trillion out of the budget or from government, i agree, or we're going to have to weather the storm. democrats have such a sensitivity to a headline in the moment that is so out of whack with what this has done, which has made an infinite scroll of scandal such

that guess what? yeah, pete hegseth a lot of a lot of horrible things that people will stop talking about because the other horrible things will come along infinitely forever. >> what did we learn in the last administration? i remember when i talked to people in the first administration, they used to just say, we just got to wait out the news, right? pete hegseth had an embarrassing confirmation hearing, but guess what? he denied the accusations. and come monday, we'll forget about those. >> but it was embarrassing for the committee as well. they did a terrible job. they did a terrible job. >> but as any member of that committee going to pay a price for it, right? >> no, but i happen to agree with your point. but my theory about donald trump is there's no final straw that breaks the camel's back. he whatever he does, i can think, well, finally he's going to get it. he can just keep doing it. there is no final straw. >> there are so many fun metaphors. i prefer the bed of nails, you know, like a million, a million problems. i'll just rest the topic. you know, in my in my high thread count blanket of scandal. sure. >> well guess what? it works for him right now. today he is

richer than he has. he is wealthier than he has ever been in his entire life. we could all say he was bankrupt six times. when he is sworn in for the second time, he'll be worth $7 billion for real this time. all right. nobody is going anywhere. when we return, we are going to talk more about the busy week of confirmation hearings. and later we're going to go back to mark zuckerberg, the man who says we need more masculine energy and aggression in the workplace. we're going to give him some aggression. we're going to find out what he's really talking about. when the nightcap about. when the nightcap cwhen you really need to sleep. you reach for the really good stuff. zzzquil ultra helps you sleep better and longer when you need it most. its non-habit forming and powered by the makers of nyquil. (auctioneer) let's start the bidding at 5 million dollars. thank you, sir. (man) these people of privilege... hoarding the financial advantages for far too long. (auctioneer) 7.5 at the back. (man) look at them — unaware that robinhood gold members now enjoy the vip treatment — a 3% ira match

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deals for first responders, military and law enforcement only@gov.com. >> who's going to be in charge of the border? >> well, the president will be in charge of the border, but i guess i got confused when trump made the announcement about tom homan. >> he said, quote, i'm pleased to announce that tom homan and said that he's in charge of our nation's borders. i'm trying to get a better sense of who's in charge. yeah. >> tom, tom homan is an incredible human being who has

over 30 years of experience, incredible experience at the border. i'm just trying to think through insight and wisdom decision making process when it comes to your work. >> for instance, will he be giving orders directly to cbp, ice? >> uscis tom homan has a direct line to the president. >> okey doke. we just talked about it before, and now you got to see a little bit a very busy week on capitol hill for president elect trump's cabinet picks. that, of course, was south dakota governor kristi noem, who has been nominated for trump's homeland security secretary. nightcap still here, chris, we had kristi noem, pete hegseth, scott benson, marco rubio seems to be, you know, kind of the standout. what stood out to you? and i'm just going to say real quickly, like my third rail, whenever any of them answer with like the i love my wife so much and or reference jesus, it becomes a third rail for these hearings because like

and let me and as somebody who loves their spouse as well as jesus, i don't understand why that keeps entering these types of venues, because then those asking the questions are kind of like thrown off, like, well, what do you say when either one gets thrown around? >> yeah. and then there's the woke, which we heard a lot of this week. that just makes me want to fall again and again. but can we talk for a second about kristi noem? because i talked to a couple people after that, both of whom have, you know, some skin in the game. one said, yeah, she's in a hell of a pickle. the other one said, she is in an unenviable position. i mean, she's got tom homan, never been a border czar before, right? she's got stephen miller. we know what he thinks about doing for border security. and yet if a policy goes into place and it all goes bad, she's going to be the one who gets hauled in in front of the committees to answer questions. and if you're known operationally, who do you

take orders from? >> you honestly unenviable. you get what you get and you don't get upset. sister. you wanted the job. but how is it, chris, that truly she's up there and she's basically like, oh, stephen miller and homan, they're going to be in charge. like on what planet does that work for? homeland. >> well, that was their point. >> yeah. how does that how does that work? >> i'd rather be governor. and if i was being asked to be secretary of state, i'd stay as the senator from florida. >> really? >> yeah i would. >> isn't that funny, though? think about all these people. right. and people were clamoring this time around to join trump's administration. and i talk regularly to a to a member of trump's former administration who's sitting back laughing, saying, these people are yucking it up with him at mar-a-lago. they have no idea what they're in for, but don't they? we watched every single day of it for four years. >> it rarely ends well. >> is it? almost? you always think you're going to be people.

there's three people. it has worked out well for. their names are ivanka trump, jared kushner and donald trump. everyone else has kind of like just road rash from just getting mowed down. but so many people wanted to be part of this administration desperately. >> i'm laughing because he demands loyalty, but he doesn't return loyalty. so why would i take a chance wanting to work for him? >> the standard on what is acceptable has been depressingly relocated. so during the whole campaign, it was like clear to me at least, that the only people who were willing to stand up and say proudly, at least for the bulk of it, that they were with donald trump, were people who were largely considered politely freaks and outcasts, just in terms of the politicians who were willing to do this right. there was a clear line of like, this is this is too much. this, again, is too much. i think this connects, though, to the money. right? so the money

has washed all of this stuff. it's remarkable. and the money is washing all of this because it's going to work for the money. and so if you don't have shame i say this to you all the time. it's pull the string in my back and i'll say it. shame for these people, for the richest people that we're talking about is a market inefficiency. once you don't, carelessness is donald trump's superpower. >> however, if you're an elected official, i get this. there's this threat that elon musk is going to find somebody further to the right, and they're going to primary you. that actually didn't work in the last four years. lots of these far right candidates. they're doing nothing right now. they're attending maga rallies. >> but i think that the fear is palpable. you saw that in each of these hearings. and i think what stood out to me is the level of hubris from a number of these nominees. pete hegseth among them, who was asked, what's the largest organization you've managed? one was eight. one was fewer than 100. there were basic questions about how the defense department worked 47 push ups, i believe. >> sets five sets of five sets.

yeah. that day. yeah. that day. yeah. >> so that didn't happen in the hearing itself. but you know, these are not jobs, frankly, that i think a lot of us would agree are ones where you want to be learning on the job. and so when he's asked what countries are in asean or how do these relationships work historically. and he said, i'm eager to learn about that, that doesn't cheer me. as a citizen of this country, i assume that it amuses or surprises foreign leaders who are watching all of this unfold, thinking, this is a guy who put aside, if you can, all of the allegations against him. look at this resume. it is totally unlike anything that would have been put forward by a president from either party in the hundreds of years leading up to these hearings. >> but what i'm realizing is, if i was the senator, i'd be thinking of two things. if i vote against trump, can he defeat me in two years? or if i vote for this nominee, will they make such fools of themselves that i'll have so and be so embarrassed when i run in the next race, when the democrats running against me? >> this is such an important point that i feel like we missed this week, right? let's just say

all of donald trump's nominees get rubber stamped through. you know what happens next? they're going to do these giant public facing jobs, and it will be for all of the american people to see every day. isn't anyone concerned that they are putting people in these positions of power? and they signed off on it, and they haven't answered the questions right. i wouldn't even say if donald trump won the election. all she would say is joe biden is the current president, aptly wearing gangster pinstripes. >> more than that, she went a step. she went a step further, and she said, i went to pennsylvania and i saw some things. what did you see? >> because a bunch of what was like, what did you see in the 2020 election? >> they've been saying they're going to present the evidence. donald trump has said, we're going to show you the evidence, rudy giuliani, we're going to show you the evidence. she went to pennsylvania. i went to pennsylvania. like there there's nothing there that says that you

can get a really good idea of who this person is or how they are going to be. i think the number one phrase, and it's not unique to this year, but it was used. i'm not going to respond to a hypothetical. well, you're yes. you're not in that position yet. so everything technically is a hypothetical. but if we ask you a direct question, why are you saying it's a hypothetical? >> okay, one more question for you. donald trump is able to bend and circumvent lots of rules because he is the president. and presidents are in a unique position that they don't have a lot of rules on them. however, he has all sorts of very, very wealthy people in positions of power. >> there's going to be a hard question. >> no, it's not okay. david sachs, who he selected to be his ai and crypto czar, has already decided he's going to scale back his responsibilities because he doesn't want to divest himself from all of his businesses. how is it going to work? all of these people who donald trump has selected, right? they have

big, big, complicated businesses. and we've already reported some of them are tapping trump, saying, maybe you could like, executive order me out of having to divest. they can't. there are i mean, you served in congress. there are serious rules and regulations, but it's different now. >> it's different now because donald trump didn't do it. so why should anybody else? >> so they just get ignored. what's that? they just get ignored. >> yeah, exactly. cool. exactly. i'm sorry, but no, it's depressing. >> it's more than depressing. it's undemocratic. but i forgot people didn't want to talk about losing our democracy during the election. that wasn't exciting enough for voters. all right, everybody is. >> when i. when i ran for public office, there was a door you had to go through, and the door was, are you honest? are you truthful? are you thoughtful? if you could do that, then you could run for public office. there's not that requirement anymore, honey. >> that door don't exist. yeah, okay. everybody is staying right here. when we return, we're going to talk about mark

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weight with a formula from eli lilly. see if you qualify at irokotv. >> okay, it has been getting a ton of attention this week and yes, a lot of it from me. mark zuckerberg chris is laughing. mark zuckerberg believes that corporate america needs more masculine energy. i love that he's the messenger to give it. and since he and a lineup of some of the biggest ceos on the planet are flanking donald trump at the inauguration and beyond, i want to discuss what we are in store for. my nightcap is still with us. let's talk about this because yes, i have. yes, made fun of it throughout the week because i do not think of mark zuckerberg as a super masculine alpha male. but that's neither here nor there. he's clearly the wrong messenger to talk about masculinity and maybe taking it too far. but underneath that,

right, david, you and i talked to c-suite executives, ceos every day. there is definitely a feeling out there. we know that labor gained a lot of power in the last four years. look at look at union contracts over the last four years. look at all that happened. and there are many people in the boss universe who are saying, i don't want to rule by committee anymore. i want to be in charge. when i tell all my employees it's time to get back to the office, i want them to get back to the office. they're saying, i run a company. i want to care about my shareholders, my customers, and obviously my employees. but i don't want to have to weigh in and take a stand on every social justice issue. and if i don't do it, suddenly my name is going to end up on a list and i'm going to get attacked. so. so while zuckerberg is absurd for saying this, and i'm not defending the ceos who have this view, it's a more popular view than people realize. and is this not an example of the pendulum swinging on back?

>> yeah, we were joking a little while ago about woke being thrown around these hearings. i think this kind of masculine management is another kind of squishy plastic term that people would have a hard time defining. i think maybe he would as well. but i think you're getting at something which is boss energy, boss energy, and a retrograde attitude toward work and not wanting to have to be distracted or worry about these other facets of what it's like to think about other people and what a workplace should be like, how people should interact with with one another. he's showcasing that, i think a fatigue sort of where we've been headed. and as you were saying, i think that there are executives for whom this comes naturally. they're able to think about the rights of all people and how we should treat one another. that's a part of their personality that they can easily bring to bear in the workplace. i think there are many more examples of executives. i'm sure you would agree. yes. who feel like this has been kind of shoved down their throat, haven't been able to deal with it. and over these last many years, i think they've seen it as a pile on. has it resulted in them making any less money or

businesses not being successful? no. absolutely not. has it resulted in another thing for them, of them running giant companies? >> no. i mean, i love that. like we need to bring the men back and it's a bunch of dudes saying it. >> yeah, i'm familiar with the patois, right? i come from sports. they don't say patois very often in sports, which is why i guess i'm at this table. but i'm here to say that, look, when mark zuckerberg says dana white, guess what? you're on the board of meta. >> hold on. do you know dana white was put on the board of meta? january 2025. do you know who stepped off the board of meta? january 2024? >> no. >> sheryl sandberg. oh, yeah, sheryl sandberg. and so, so for years, mark zuckerberg needed perfect sheryl sandberg to be the outward facing person to interface with the world because he was unable to sit up and look you in the eye and do it. and almost like a year to the date since she leaves. and mind you, she's still an advisor to the company. so sheryl, we love to

hear from you on this. who does he put? >> dana white it's a costume, okay. and yes, it's no longer leaning in. it's now rear naked choke holding. >> can i tell you what? >> like please. and you. i can't even believe you just said naked choke holding because now i'm just going to. that is the rest of the show. >> my takeaway when mark spoke was that he looked scared and that he was having to reverse himself, and i sensed that he feared, oh, you're caving into trump. so the exact opposite of masculinity. >> but chris, can i just make this point? i completely get that donald trump is the president, and if i was the ceo of a company, i totally get that. i need to play ball, right? if i sell a product, i want to make sure i'm not getting slapped with tariffs. i don't want him to. i don't want to be the next disney. i don't want him coming after me. but there is a line between saying, i'm going to play jamie dimon just this week. jamie dimon is going to go to the white house. if he gets called, jamie dimon is going to work with the

treasury secretary is going to go to joe rogan's man cave in austin. >> no, but but he never he looks scared because we knew he was reversing himself. and to me, he looked weak. >> he looked scared and weak because he's not telling the truth. because no, at no point in his whole life, while he was wearing spf 900 and for wakeboarding, did someone say, look at that masculine man. >> well, the other thing about this is, is even if he was meaning to say boss energy, that's not what he said. and so for a lot of folks out there, what they hear is let's get the men back in charge. women have been working for decades to try to get in charge. it's not like the tech industry is doing great. they are probably one of the main poster children for not promoting women. what is it like 35% of the workforce? 11% of managers. and so all i'm saying is he's sending a message. whether you think that's the message he meant to send or not, and he is somebody who is in a position where people listen and he gets a lot of attention. and that's why you've been talking

about it all week, stephanie. but come on, okay. >> come on. where those companies are doing great in making money and having power. and the specific business people that are with donald trump right now, the interests they have in things like artificial intelligence, cryptocurrency media, take your pick, the influence they could have over regulation in the next four years is staggering. and i don't know that the american people realize that. they just say, i don't know kamala harris. she raised a gazillion dollars. rich people are always involved in politics. this one smells different. >> you're absolutely right. you mentioned david sax. you're absolutely right. david sax, you mentioned a moment ago, is invested in ai in ai companies. so like, yes, he's making money. he's making money off the things that he's now ostensibly going to regulate or give regulatory advice on. >> yeah. and even if he puts his investments in a blind trust, which he won't do, but even if he does, he will have direct influence over how ai gets regulated and can make himself exponentially wealthier. >> he looks at who's in the oval

office and he's doing the same thing. so you said that donald trump is more wealthy than he's ever been. part of that wealth comes from cryptocurrency, whatever kind of shambolic token he's invented and whatever that company is doing by him doing it, there is a message being transmitted, yes, to the american people that crypto is okay now again, but also to the regulatory apparatus that this is okay now, but we are now in a new stage. >> you do want people with actual expertise, which david sachs, for example, has in these roles. so how do you find the line that i'd love to have industry experts, but not people that can just get hot, damn richer off of it? >> i would like to be very clear that i think these people, as a matter of processing power, are very smart, and they are highly competitive and they are playing chess beyond what the vast majority of us are contemplating. the perfect match, though, the reason why this insane coalition, which is what i called it before, is also perfect is because donald trump doesn't care at all about any of the policies we're talking

about. i sure do you think so? it's just this guy who is a vessel who's whose primary motive is literally profit with people who see the opportunity to actually enact a vision. and when i say, why are we trusting the people who ruined the american mind with the american government? i'm talking not about their lack of intelligence, but their lack of understanding, of understanding consequences. there are so many unforeseen consequences that very smart people are blind to. yes, this i keep on pointing at this because this is the story. >> yes. okay, we're going to leave it there. but guess what? if you've got your own rocket ship, which two of the three people i've been talking about all night have you can just hop on it, fly to mars and leave a scorched earth behind you. okay. the nightcap is staying with us. when we return, everybody is going to share their mvp's. do going to share their mvp's. do you think mark when i was diagnosed with h-i-v, i didn't know who i would be. but here i am... ...being me.

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as long adon't be. the best. ♪ you know, at verizon, we'll pay off your phone. and you'll get iphone 16 with apple intelligence, on us. now with genmoji. that's a value of up to sixteen hundred dollars. only on verizon. >> i'm told i only have a minute. >> damn, that's a lot of time. >> okay. don't laugh. i love congress. my first day in the hearing in 1987, jack brooks was the chairman of the government oversight committee, and i was asking questions. and the witness wasn't responsive. and jack brooks hit the gavel and he said to the witness, congressman

shays is a member of this committee. he may be a republican. he didn't say it. i'm a republican and he's a democrat. he's a member of the committee. and you will show him all the respect he deserves. mr. shays, you have as much time as you need to get your questions answered. that's my hero, and i wish i had seen it in this hearing last week. this past week. >> do you think there's any universe in 2025 when it doesn't matter who the chair is, republican or democrat, that you would see that happen? >> no. jack cared about his committee, and he cared about the process and oversight. and i love the man. i will always thank him. >> doctor guerra thomas austin is my mvp. this is an unknown. i'm sure a lot of people, the architect of the capitol, and he and his office are responsible for all of the setup for the inauguration. so these last many weeks have been filled with building all kinds of scaffolding, bleachers, platforms outside the capitol, all of which will not come to use because everything is now being moved inside the capitol itself. i bring him up as

somebody who these are appointed now in a new way. ever since what happened last time, there's an argument anyway, picked by congress, longtime army colonel logistician. he's done he's overseen that. i think people in government who do that kind of work are amazing. and now in what is what, just a minimum amount of hours is going to have to move everything inside the capitol. >> and so 250,000 people have tickets. how many can fit inside the rotunda? >> logistically, i don't know, 20,000 in the capital one arena. i know that to be a fact. >> i felt like i should pick somebody from the la fires because a remarkable work has been done. but i'm going to choose david lynch as a stand in, a brilliant one for the entertainment industry, who across covid to the la fires, to political divisions to for half of america, what's going to happen on monday with the inauguration have made movies and television shows and music and art that have taken us away even for half an hour or 27 minutes. now, a lot of them 27 minutes or a couple of hours to

a place where we can realize that everything doesn't have to feel so heavy. so david lynch, brilliant, brilliant man. that's great. and all the people who work in industries that lift us up a little bit. >> you have a special one too. yeah. >> bob uecker again. >> yes, please. >> your representative of sports world and bob uecker died yesterday at age 90. bob uecker was never close to an mvp as an actual baseball player. but i remember discovering him when he was on mr. belvedere, among many fine turns that he had on stage and screen. he was also the pitch man for miller lite, famously, but the point being that this guy was the patron saint of self-deprecation. he was the guy that you wanted when the game was bad, right? it's a blowout. nothing exciting is happening, but it's story time with bob uecker, and he was the best, a no doubt hall of famer and mvp in every sense other than the one on the field. and we all we all miss him.

>> well, thank you all so much for being my nightcap tonight. you have to stick around because i have an mvp on the field for mine this week. work, play, blink. >> relief work, play. >> blink. relief. >> the only three and one extended relief formula for dry eyes. >> blink. why is navage trusted by millions? >> before navage, i was not living my best life because i could not breathe. constant nasal congestion, constant blowing of the nose. the huge difference is the fact that navage pulls it out. it's very gentle in the sense of when that suction happens, it's literally grabbing that water and that mucus, and it's bringing it out into this tank. it's worth every into this tank. it's worth every penny that you pay for it. ( ♪♪ ) my name is jaxon, and i have spastic cerebral palsy. it's a mouthful.

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>> the first 100 days it's a critical time for our country and rachel maddow is on five nights a week. >> now is the time. >> so we're going to do it. >> settle in the rachel maddow show five nights a week, beginning monday. >> okay, my mvp this week is for my children. it is jayden daniels, rookie quarterback for the washington commanders. sunday night, he led the commanders to a victory over the tampa bay buccaneers for washington's first playoff since 2006. the commanders have won their last five games in the final few seconds of the game, largely because of this young man's skills. as my 18 year old son said to me, it is his poise and calm decision making that is absolutely unheard of for a rookie. and i want to share this incredible stat about this young man. prior to this season, no

rookie quarterback in nfl history has ever led his team to a game with no turnovers and no punts. this season, jayden daniels has done it three times, and for those diehard redskins now commanders fans, it has been 19 long years since your beloved team made it this far. whether or not they beat the lions this weekend. congrats. you are back, baby. all right. that's great. >> that's great. >> it's really great. it sure is. all right. pablo. david chris chris, thank you both so very much. and for you at home i wish you a good night. remember, you can catch the nightcap again on saturdays at 11 p.m. eastern right here on msnbc. if you love tonight, watch it again tomorrow. tell a friend. but for now, from all of our colleagues across the networks of nbc news. thanks for staying up late. i'll see you at the end of monday. >> for two presidents. >> president elect