>> you learn the limits of power. >> and donald. >> trump believes that his. >> 1.5% margin. >> of victory over. >> kamala harris. >> gives them this radical. >> mandate. >> which he does not have. >> he was hired to. >> do two things work. >> on the cost. >> of. >> living and. >> and the and the crisis. >> at the border. that's it. all the. >> rest is overreach. >> and it's going. >> to come. >> back to snap. >> at them quickly. do you think progressives are getting back up off the couch? >> pretty slow, pretty slow. >> and a lot of distractions. look, i don't know if elon musk is a nazi or autistic, but i know it shouldn't be what we're focused on when he's pardoning criminals that are violent and he's going after people at the border. >> john lovett, patrick gasper, great to have you both. thank you both. thank you. that is all in on this wednesday night. the rachel maddow show starts right now. good evening rachel. >> good evening chris. chris. >> thank you very much. >> for setting. >> up. >> teasing, telling. >> everybody about the fact that i've got the episcopal. >> bishop of washington. >> on the show tonight. i said on my call, i was like, god, what an incredible woman. and i'm just so curious, like, what's her deal? i'd love to hear more from her. and then

someone's like, rachel has her. i'm like, well, that's perfect. >> i was absolutely. >> shocked that she said, yes. i have to tell. >> you. >> i had. >> no no expectations. >> as soon. >> as we heard about what she did yesterday at. >> the national cathedral. >> obviously we. >> immediately started. >> moving mountains. >> to try. >> to get her. >> i never. >> thought in a million years. >> that she would say yes, and. >> she's going to be. >> here live, and i'm just really looking forward to it. that's just in just a few minutes from now. all right. thanks my friend. >> much appreciated. >> and thanks to you. >> at home for joining. >> us this hour. i'm really. >> really happy to. >> have you here tonight. >> we are going to be speaking. >> with the episcopal bishop of washington yesterday, who. >> had that incredible moment at. >> the national cathedral. speaking directly. >> to donald. >> trump and vice president j.d. >> vance about human dignity. >> and decency. >> and mercy. >> in a way. >> that seems to have. >> short circuited donald. >> trump a little bit. >> just an incredible moment. >> we're going to be speaking. >> with her live here tonight, just moments. >> from now. >> we also tonight look like. >> we might be. having a. >> good old. >> fashioned debacle unfolding

in washington. >> this is. >> the second full. >> day of. >> the second. >> presidential term. >> for donald trump. >> and you will recall that he received less. >> than 50% of the popular vote. >> to win this term. >> he got more. >> of the popular vote. >> than kamala. >> harris did, but he. >> was still under 50%. >> he was at about 49.8% of the national. popular vote. >> today. >> we've got the first. >> national polling. >> on how. >> the country. >> feels about. >> him as he starts. >> his new term. >> and this first. >> national polling. >> shows that trump's support. has already fallen. >> even below. >> that level. >> of support that. >> he had in the election. reuters ipsos today finds that trump is. >> starting with a national approval rating. >> of 47%, and. >> for context sake, that. >> is historically. >> low for new presidents. most presidents. >> start over 50%. >> this is supposed. >> to be the. honeymoon period after all. >> right. >> you actually. >> expect that. >> the number. >> of people who. >> voted for them will continue.

>> to be for them. >> but then you expect sort of other people who. >> didn't. >> vote for them or who didn't vote at all to. >> also come over to. >> their side. >> with all of. >> the momentum. >> and the positive press that they. >> get for the start. >> in donald trump's. >> case. >> it has been the opposite. he has fallen from the amount of support. >> that he had in the election, and what he had in the election was less than 50% anyway. >> again. >> most presidents. >> start over. >> 50% at the start of their term. joe biden, for example, at. >> the start of his presidency, he was. >> up at 55%. >> at this point. >> but trump is starting. >> with low approval numbers. >> and. >> you. >> know, he may. >> or may. not care. about that. >> he had. >> pretty dramatically. >> low approval numbers for almost. >> all of his. >> first term. >> in. >> office, and it didn't. >> seem much. >> to bother him. >> that said. >> i bet he does mind. that the tv ratings. >> for his. >> inauguration were way down. >> way down. >> like down by a. >> third from. >> what. biden had four years ago. >> down by. >> a. >> third. even from what he himself. had at his first inauguration back in 2017.

>> i don't know if he cares about his. >> approval ratings. >> but, you know, he cares about his tv ratings, and they just. >> dropped. >> like a stone. >> so he's starting out. >> with the american people. >> not particularly liking. >> him. >> and people not. >> particularly wanting to watch him. >> on television. >> that said. >> the bigger. >> issue. even if you if you take those numbers away, the bigger issue for him on this just the second day of his new term. >> is that. >> he really does appear. to have stepped in it in terms of public. opinion coming right out. >> of the gate. >> with this dramatically unpopular. decision about pardons, this dramatically unpopular decision to free. >> from prison. >> all these. >> people who physically attacked police. >> officers with. >> baseball bats. >> and two by fours. >> and bear spray. and flash bang explosives. >> while they. >> were attacking the. >> u.s. capitol in trump's name. the same. >> new reuters. >> ipsos polling. >> shows that a large. >> majority of.

>> the public. >> 58% of the public. >> disagrees with. >> trump issuing this. >> this blanket pardon and. commutation for everybody. >> convicted of. >> crimes related to. >> january 6th. >> and we're going to. >> talk more about. >> that tonight as one of trump's january 6th violent felons, who he released yesterday. was then. immediately rearrested. >> today on. >> gun charges. that's not a good look. >> we've also. >> had another day of republicans just being fundamentally. >> unable to. >> answer questions about what trump did here and. whether or not they really support it. republican house speaker mike. >> johnson today. >> earned. >> laughter when he tried. >> to. >> say that he didn't. >> want to. >> talk about the pardons anymore. >> he didn't. >> want. >> to look. >> back, didn't want. >> to look. >> back at those pardons from yesterday. >> he only. >> wants. >> to look forward. >> and then right. after he said that, he. >> announced that. republicans are going to go. back and re investigate. >> all. >> of january. >> 6th all over again. >> house speaker mike. >> johnson not able. >> to.

>> get out of his. >> own way, not. >> able to figure out how to. >> answer questions about. these pardons yet. and they're not. >> going away. >> former house speaker newt. >> gingrich criticizing. >> trump's pardons. >> today, the pro-trump. >> right wing. >> editorial page. >> at the wall street journal criticizing the pardons. >> today. >> calling them rotten. senator john. >> thune, the. >> republican leader in. >> the senate. >> pilloried for trying to insist that the. >> pardons were. >> considered on a case by case basis. >> when they absolutely were not. >> everybody with a. >> january 6th conviction. >> everybody got a pardon or commutation. there was no case by case consideration. senator. >> and on top of all of. >> that. >> now, tonight, there has been an extraordinary rebuke of these pardons. from the court system. >> and again, we're going to talk. >> about this. >> more a little bit later on. >> but i just want you to. listen to this. i'm not sure this is widely circulated today. >> i do. >> not. think you will have heard about this. but this is

from. >> judge beryl howell of the federal district. >> court in. >> washington, dc. >> just listen to this. >> i'm just quoting. directly here. the united states government moves to dismiss with prejudice the nine. >> count superseding. indictment against defendants. >> nicholas dicarlo and nicholas. >> okes. >> the two defendants in this case, one of whom founded the hawaii chapter of. >> the proud boys. >> and served as a senior. >> leader of the group. >> both admitted. >> under oath their. >> criminal conduct at the us. capitol on january 6th, 2021. both men admitted. >> throwing smoke bombs at law enforcement while on the grounds of. >> the capitol. both men admitted. >> to breaching. >> the. >> capitol building and. >> defacing the capitol. >> building and. >> stealing equipment from law enforcement. >> officers. >> responding to protect the building. >> and its. >> lawful occupants. >> from the rioters. the current. >> posture of this. >> case is that even after. >> the. defendant's admission. >> of egregious criminal. >> conduct both outside. >> and inside the us capitol building. >> and the government expending. >> significant time and. resources in. >> identifying defendants and investigating their criminal conduct, and filing. three

separate indictments against these defendants. the government. >> now seeks to dismiss. >> the pending indictment against. >> these defendants. judge howell then explains that. >> while the. >> court under law. >> doesn't have. >> much of a choice to continue a. criminal case, if the government decides to drop it, she's sort of compelled. to drop it. if they want to wanted to drop it. >> she says. the law. >> does. >> quote. vest some. >> discretion in the. >> court in terms of how to handle the details of this unusual situation. and check this out. >> this is astonishing. >> quote. to ensure that the government's. >> request for. dismissal of criminal charges sufficiently protects the public. >> the government may be. required to submit a. >> statement of reasons. >> and underlying. >> factual basis, which must be substantial. >> to justify. >> the dismissal of an indictment. >> here, the government's cursory. >> motion provides no factual. >> basis for dismissal. >> the only reason provided for

this instruction is the assertion that this action, quote, ends a grave national injustice that has been perpetrated upon. >> the american. >> people over the last four years and. begins a process of national reconciliation. that was in trump's order that all of these cases should be dropped and. >> a national ends. >> a grave national injustice. judge howell continues. quote. >> no national injustice occurred here. >> just as no. outcome determinative. >> election fraud occurred in. >> the 2020. presidential election. >> no process. >> of national reconciliation can begin. when i'm. >> quoting the judge. >> here directly. when poor. >> losers whose. >> preferred candidate loses an election. >> are. glorified for. >> disrupting a constitutionally. >> mandated proceeding in. >> congress, and doing. >> so with impunity. >> that merely raises the. dangerous specter. >> of. >> future lawless. conduct by other. >> poor losers. >> and undermines. >> the rule of law, she says, quote, having. presided over

scores of criminal cases, charging defendants for their criminal conduct. >> outside and inside the u.s. capitol. >> building on january 6th, which charges were fully supported. >> by evidence. >> in the form of extensive videotapes and photographs, admissions by. defendants and testimony at trials. this court, she says, cannot let stand the revisionist myth relayed in this presidential pronouncement, quote, the prosecutions in this case and others charging defendants for their criminal conduct at the u.s. capitol on january 6th present. no injustice. >> but instead reflect the diligent. >> work. >> of conscientious public servants. >> including prosecutors. and law enforcement officials and dedicated defense attorneys, to. >> defend our. >> democracy and rights and preserve. >> our long. >> tradition of peaceful. transfers of power, which until january 6th, 2021, served as a model to the world. all while affording those charged. every protection guaranteed by our constitution and our criminal

justice system. as to these two defendants, she says, as to these two defendants specifically, both admitted their criminal conduct under oath after consultation with their attorneys and pursuant to plea agreements to which they agreed, bluntly put the assertion offered in the presidential pronouncement for the pending motion to dismiss is flatly wrong. judge beryl. >> howell. >> goes on to grant the government's demand that she dismiss this case because she has to do that, but she refuses to. >> do what trump's order said she had to do, which was to dismiss it with prejudice, which means these charges could never be brought again. she just refuses to do that. the judge says, quote, nothing about the government's reasoning for dismissal warrants entry of dismissal with prejudice, dismissal with prejudice, she says, would bar any further, any further prosecution of defendants for their offense. conduct at issue. this result would be improper here when the

defendants own admissions of criminal conduct, including throwing smoke bombs at law enforcement officers who were trying valiantly to prevent rioters from entering the capitol building. that conduct provides ample basis for criminal. >> prosecution. >> judge howell then orders this case dismissed. this case effectively closed, but she flat out refuses to order the case closed forever. this directive from trump effectively told the judge to close it with prejudice, so the case could never be brought again. she said no, you're wrong on that, on the law and i won't do it. and also in so many words, by the way, what you're doing here is obscene. this is one of three rulings by a federal judge today. absolutely rebuking donald trump and his new justice department for trying to make

these january 6th cases disappear. to try to make it like january 6th didn't happen. the decision to spring these guys from. prison and to stop the ongoing trials of people convicted or charged with physically attacking police officers, this is a this is a debacle. i mean, morally, it's obviously a debacle strategically in terms of our country holding itself together. it's a debacle, but it's a political debacle. the public doesn't like it. the police don't like it. not even the trumpy police like it. even the fraternal order of police, which endorsed trump and initially appeared flummoxed by this pardons decision. they've now come out and denounced it as well. the violent felons who trump ordered freed yesterday are already today starting to be arrested for other violent crimes. his political allies. >> on capitol. >> hill are supposed to start carrying major water for him on everything he wants to do. they are already finding it totally

untenable to carry water for him on this first thing, that he has decided to blow all his capital, all his political capital on. i mean, some of the felons he freed, including one of the paramilitary leaders who trump just freed from his 18 year federal prison sentence, this guy turned up at capitol hill today, turned up on capitol hill. there are rumors circulating that trump had wanted to bring his felons, had wanted to bring these guys who violently attacked police and were convicted for it. he wants to bring them all to the white house to. that's the sort of thing that probably sounded great at a trump rally, probably sounded like it was something the people wanted when you were stewing about stuff like this at a trump rally, at one of your fidel castro's castro esque 3.5 hour long, rambling speeches where most of the people left before you were halfway through. it probably sounded like a great idea that everybody would love you for. >> but you know what? >> the country is not a trump

rally, and the country appears to be repulsed by the very first big thing that donald trump has done in his new presidential term. and whether or not he can see it, every other republican in washington is learning it very quickly. at least all of them who can read polls are learning it very quickly. any of them who can read polls or who can hear the questions from their own constituents back home and from reporters about the what about what the heck is this mess with freeing these convicted violent felons? and does the senator support it? does the congressman support it? and can you explain why and saying you haven't seen the details or you don't have you don't know exactly what's happened here, or you want to look more into it? that answer isn't going to fly. it's an absolute debacle. and i think importantly, as my good friend chris hayes often says, politics did not stop when donald trump

was elected. the laws of political gravity still apply, and donald trump's first major action in his second presidential term on political grounds is a political debacle. and that matters. and we will have more on that ahead this hour. but over the course of this week, thus far, over the course of these last few days, we've been trying to keep an eye on where the bumps in the road are, where the friction comes from, where the things are, what things are happening in the country that might make the things that trump wants to do harder to do. and along those lines, there's news tonight from another power center in this country, a power center that sits sometimes uncomfortably alongside our political system. but it's one that when it's at

its best, it can be a source of deep moral suasion, deep moral force. when we think about the constraints on the powerful in this country, when we think about things that might stop people from doing bad things, that might persuade people to turn back or change their minds. when we think about what's available to us as a country, things that might instill some bravery in those who are weak or wavering or afraid. when we think about things in our country that can move public opinion and move public attention, don't sleep on religion as one of those things in this country. and i mean that in the broadest possible sense. i mean, just generally speaking, organized religious life in america in all of its stripes. this was this weekend in chicago. >> today, priests. >> on chicago's. >> southwest side held a mass to

stand in solidarity. >> with local immigrants. >> community members. filled the pews of saint rita of cascia parish in chicago. lawn. >> it was really. >> important to be present, to let people know not only that we're praying with them, but will be there, you know, wherever we can to support them. >> priests blessed. >> pastoral packs. >> for families. >> who may. >> face deportation. the packs include a prayer shawl, rosary and a statue of the patron saint of. >> immigrants. >> well, that. >> catholic parish in chicago stood up for and stood up with its immigrant members this weekend, their archbishop gave a big chicago broad shouldered speech in mexico city on the same day, calling the trump administration's plans for mass deportations targeting chicago, quote, an affront, saying the catholic community in chicago would not stand for it. the new catholic archbishop of washington, who was just named to the post by the vatican. he

also has said that mass deportations of the type described by the by the trump campaign during the campaign and now by the trump administration now that inauguration has happened, he has described those mass deportation plans as incompatible with catholic doctrine. again, this will be the arch. this is the new archbishop of washington, d.c. he says the church will fight with all it has to stop those mass deportations. and it isn't just the catholic church. you know, in trump's first presidential term, hundreds of churches responded to his inauguration almost immediately by declaring themselves to be sanctuaries for immigrants and immigrant families who needed help and needed shelter. in los angeles, the episcopal diocese of los angeles. in the summer of 2017, they declared themselves a sanctuary diocese for immigrants. that's a diocese with 150 congregations in los angeles alone in 2019. two years later, the entire evangelical lutheran church nationwide

declared itself a sanctuary church body that's 9000 congregations nationwide and 3.5 million members. yesterday, we saw the national leaders of the episcopal church in america, which is a huge church in america. we saw the national leaders of the episcopal church send a letter to their membership explicitly opposing trump's mass deportation plans and more than that, calling on their millions of members to contact their member of congress and tell their member of congress to oppose trump's plans, quote, to our siblings who are at risk of deportation or of being separated from those you love, know that your story is our story, our our story and your dignity is inseparable from our own. we stand with you and we will face these challenges together. it's yesterday from the national episcopal church. also yesterday, the episcopal bishop of washington, dc looked into the front row of the

national cathedral in washington during the national prayer service, looked into the eyes of the incoming president, and very calmly, very clearly gave us the illustrated dictionary definition of what it means to speak truth to power. >> let me make one final plea, mr. president. millions have put. >> their trust. >> in you. and as you told the nation yesterday, you have felt the providential. hand of a. >> loving god. in the name of our god. i ask you to have mercy upon the people in our country who. >> are scared now. >> we played a lot of this sermon for you last night here on the show. it was played all over the country. it ran on

autoplay on the front page of the washington post, literally by the overnight hours last night, president trump had responded by demanding an apology by calling bishop mariann edgar buddy a, quote, so-called bishop, and by insulting her in personal terms. you all right, big guy? today, of course, what has followed has been a day of threats and invective directed against bishop buddy from the president's supporters, including what she describes as lots of death threats. nothing is inevitable. nothing that they want to do necessarily just gets done. they have to do it. and you don't necessarily know what every action will cause in terms of a equal and opposite reaction. none of us know where grace or power or bravery or hard work or luck might come

together to change the course of where the country is going to render, for example, as a debacle. some of the worst ideas, or to change minds or change hearts about what might otherwise seem a fait accompli. bishop mariann edgar buddy yesterday at the at that prayer service, she surprised everyone at the national cathedral. if that tells us nothing else, it should tell us that we should all be ready and open to more surprises that might come from very surprising places. bishop very surprising places. bishop buddy joins us live here my kids can't hide anything from me. i'm home! especially when they've been using toilet paper that doesn't hold up. new charmin ultra strong has a diamond-weave texture that's more durable and it cleans better* so you can use less. enjoy the go with charmin. no matter who you are, where you live, or what you believe, there are things we all have in common

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will enter a cease fire. >> in the nation's capital. >> philadelphia and. >> el paso. >> the palisades. >> from msnbc. >> world headquarters. >> stay up to date on the biggest issues of the day with

the msnbc daily newsletter. get the best of msnbc all in one place. sign up for msnbc daily at msnbc.com. >> they they may not be citizens. >> or have the proper documentation, but the vast majority of immigrants. >> are not criminals. they pay taxes and are good neighbors. they are faithful members of our churches and. >> mosques, synagogues and temples. >> i ask you to have mercy, mr. president, on those in our communities whose. >> children fear. >> that their parents will. >> be taken away. >> that was the episcopal bishop of washington yesterday at the national cathedral, talking directly to the president, directly eye to eye about compassion, humility, kindness,

honesty, honoring the inherent dignity of every person, talking to him about respect, about mercy. this is not his usual bailiwick. it is hers, though. joining us now is the right reverend mariann edgar. she's the episcopal bishop of washington, d.c. bishop. buddy, i really appreciate you making the time. i know you have a lot of options where to be, and i appreciate you being here. >> it's great to be here. >> thank you. what made you decide to make that appeal the way you did? to ask him for mercy in that way? >> well, as i was. >> as you summarized. >> so well as i was thinking. about at the end, toward the end of my preparation, the pillars of unity, it struck me. >> that that. >> i was missing one and that one, that last one was mercy. to have mercy and compassion. and rather than stated in sweeping terms, i thought i would. acknowledge to the. >> president, acknowledged. >> that he had come.

>> to the highest office of the land. >> that he had. millions of people had entrusted him with this power, and i wanted to make, as you heard. >> a plea. >> a request that he broaden his characterization of the people that are. >> are frightened. >> now and. >> are at risk. >> of losing everything. >> and i thought. >> that that would be the more respectful way to say it, and also to appeal to. >> not only. >> the president, but to. all who might be listening, to appeal to what we know to be true about. our immigrant neighbors, who they are, the kind of people that we're blessed to be among, and to remember them in our. understanding of what it means to. be america. >> your opportunity in that moment to minister directly to the president is a very unique

moment. i know that you've been the you've been the bishop in washington for a long time, and you were there for his first inaugural as well. but i wanted to ask about the broader question of the role of the church right now in moral leadership. in this moment. we have seen the catholic church, the episcopal church, elements of the lutheran church, other congregations all over the country, very diverse types of churches offer themselves, for example, as as sanctuaries for people who are facing deportation. what do you see as the role of the church in in in helping lead the public and helping us understand what our moral responsibilities are right now? >> right. that's a great question. i would say the first and primary role that we have is by example, you know, to take the teachings of our faith to welcome the stranger, to love as we've been loved, to be compassionate and to live that out in, in real terms with real people in our communities. so

that's. >> that's foundational. and then. >> when given the opportunity to speak. to speak and to be at times a conscience, at other times a consolation to be present, ministering or pastoring the common good. and so it takes many forms. it depends on the moment. we're in a particularly. harsh moment now when it comes to conversations. around immigrant populations in our midst. and so that was the reason for. >> the for the. >> tone i took now. but it could have been a very different tone in a different context, depending on depending on how compassion needs to be manifest in a given time. >> even before we had the sort of and you wouldn't use these terms, but i'll use it sort of nasty reaction from the president in the overnight hours in which he demanded an apology from you and insulted you in personal terms, even even before

we got that reaction from him, a lot of people were describing what you did as brave, and i wanted to get your reaction to that. i mean, as a as a high ranking church leader who's been doing this job for a long time, i imagine that speaking in public isn't difficult to you, and speaking on difficult truths isn't difficult for you. but what do you make of the fact that i think a lot of people are feeling are seeing in you a form of courage that they hope they would have themselves? >> well. >> just a slight correction. i'm i'm afraid every time i step into a pulpit. right. it's that really never goes away. large or small, it doesn't matter. it's a huge responsibility, tremendous vocation. and how many people get that amount of time and uninterrupted speech. right. so it's a it's a really big deal. and i take it i take it very seriously every time. so yeah, i was nervous, i was scared. i think perhaps the reason why it had the effect that it did is because for a while now, there

has been very little public. there hasn't been much of a narrative outside of the narrative that the president has. been describing. right? it's people have gone quiet or they've been ignored. and so this was a moment, you know, and i had no idea who was paying attention. i mean, the inauguration was the day before there. you know, there weren't that many people in the cathedral. it wasn't crowded. it was a group of people who had gathered at his at his invitation. but it wasn't something that was. in the in, in public discourse. and so i think in some ways that was perhaps the reason why it had the effect that it did. it is also an audacious thing to address anyone directly in from the pulpit. i typically do that for weddings, you know, when you talk to a couple for do you know what i mean? for funerals, you talk to the, you know, to the family you're seeking to console. this was a service of

prayer for unity for the country. but it was on the occasion of the inauguration of a president. and if you go back to other sermons in those moments, there's almost always a word to the president. so it wasn't unusual in that way. but in the particular moment we're in it, it filled a space that hadn't been occupied for a while. >> bishop, buddy, i'd like to just ask you one last question, and i'll give you from the outset an opportunity to not answer this if you don't want to, because it's perhaps not fair of me, but we did get that nastygram from the president in the middle of the night, in which he did insult you and demand an apology. and i know i've seen remarks that you made today that you've received a lot of not just invective, but threats, including death threats over the course of today since that happened. and i would just ask if you wanted to respond either to the president or to the people who have wished you ill in response to this? >> well, i've been i've had people wish me dead. i'm not

sure they've threatened to kill me, but they seem to be pleased if i met my eternal destiny sooner rather than later. and i would simply say i you know, i was trying actually to encourage a different kind of conversation that you can certainly disagree with me. you can disagree with what i've said or did, but could we, as americans and fellow children of god, speak to one another with respect? i would offer the same to you. i would i would listen to your views and i would honor them. but we can. we don't have to go to the highest extremes of contempt when we are in a position of, of disagreement. and i think if we could get that back as a country, we would go a long way in being able to work together to the to address the many problems that we face. >> well, at its best, no matter your religious faith or lack thereof, the ministry is both teaching and leading. and that, i think, is why you're having such a strong reaction from so

many americans to what you did yesterday. and i'm sorry for the vitriol and the negative reaction that you've had from some quarters. but i hope you know that there's a lot on the other side of that as well. the right reverend mariann buddy, bishop of the episcopal diocese of washington, dc. it's an honor to have you here. come back anytime. >> thanks so much. >> thank you. all right. much more ahead tonight, including senator elizabeth warren joining us live. stay with us. >> lumify. it's kind of amazing. wow. my go to is lumify eye drops. lumify dramatically. reduces redness in one minute. and look at the difference. my eyes look brighter and whiter for. >> up to eight hours. >> lumify really works. >> see for yourself. >> your cardiovascular system is at the center of your heart health, and. >> at the center. >> of every blood pressure. supplement from. >> human, clinically studied, plant based. ingredients inspired by groundbreaking inspired by groundbreaking science. for all the moments [♪♪] are you one of the millions of americans who suffer from an upset stomach after a big meal? try pepto bismol.

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>> this is the headline from nbc news. quote senators receive affidavit containing new allegations against pete hegseth who denies the claims. pete hegseth, of course, is a fox news weekend co-host and currently donald trump's nominee to be secretary of defense. because sure, why not? nbc news was first to report yesterday on this sworn affidavit concerning mr. hegseth that has been filed by his former sister in law. she submitted this at the request of the top democrat on the armed services committee in the senate, senator jack reed. nbc news reporting, quote, daniel hegseth describes in the affidavit allegations of volatile and threatening conduct by pete hegseth that made his second wife, samantha, fear for her safety. in the affidavit, the former sister in law details instances in which she says she was, quote, a witness to and even a victim of emotional abuse by pete hegseth. she says she personally witnessed him abusing alcohol numerous times. quote. among the allegations are that

samantha, the ex-wife, hid in a closet once from hegseth that she developed escape plans for use if she felt she needed to get away from hegseth, escape plans that would be activated with a code word. she did once put that escape plan into action. you should know that. hegseth ex-wife. she tells nbc news that she will not be commenting on her marriage to pete beyond saying, quote, there was no physical abuse in my marriage. nbc news further reports that as part of their divorce, both pete hegseth and his second ex-wife signed a court document that said neither parent claimed to be a victim of domestic abuse. asked for comment by nbc news, an attorney for pete hegseth denied that he was ever abusive to his ex-wife. the attorney said in part that mr. hegseth, his ex-wife, quote, was. excuse me. has never alleged that there was any abuse. she signed court documents acknowledging there was no abuse and recently reaffirmed the same during her

fbi interview. now, this is hardly the first time pete hegseth has faced and denied very concerning allegations. allegations concerning enough to, like, conceivably threaten his fox news job, let alone his secretary of defense nomination. in november, we learned through his attorney that mr. hegseth had paid off a woman who accused him of sexually assaulting her in 2017. mr. hegseth denied the sexual assault allegation. prosecutors did not bring charges against him for it. the woman did. the woman was treated at a hospital and had a rape kit examination done, though in december, jane mayer reported in the new yorker on hogarth's work for two veterans groups, writing that hegseth was, quote, forced to step down by both of the groups that he ran in the face of serious allegations of financial mismanagement, sexual impropriety, and personal misconduct. a lawyer for hegseth

said the new yorker's reporting was based on claims from a disgruntled former associate just a few days after that report, ten current and former fox employees told nbc news that pete hegseth drank in ways that were concerning. two of them said they smelled alcohol on him before he went on the air. on more than a dozen occasions. did i mention it was a morning show? a spokesperson for the trump transition team said the allegations were, quote, completely unfounded and false. after that reporting, hegseth reportedly told republican senators that he promised he would stop drinking if and when he was confirmed as secretary of defense. and maybe he would do that. maybe he would be able to do that. maybe. maybe that promise alone helped to settle the qualms of republican senators who would be considering whether or not to put him in charge of the pentagon. but then came these new allegations. a new round of allegations, this time from his former sister in law. in her

sworn affidavit, mr. hague's sister in law says she made the same claims of abuse and drunken menace to an fbi agent last month as part of mr. hegseth background check, the trump transition team briefed the top two senators on the armed forces, on the armed services committee, on the contents of that background check. but two sources with knowledge of the briefing tell nbc news that these allegations from the sister in law weren't brought up, even though the sister in law conveyed these things to the fbi. and the trump transition was supposed to brief senators on what the fbi knew. they didn't mention any of these claims that are now detailed in this affidavit that has been given to the senate committee directly. none of this, neither the content nor the process, is helping pete hegseth nomination to be secretary of defense. one closed source to the armed services committee says more than 20 senators have now seen the full, unredacted affidavit

from the sister in law. as of this afternoon, also this afternoon, fox news reported that three republican senators may vote no on hegseth. that would be enough to force vice president jd vance to have to break a tie. if all the democrats stick together, which on this nomination they will. if it's three republicans that are already knows, that means that his nomination will fail. if only one more republican senator balks. now, the expected timing on the full senate vote for hegseth has been pushed back from thursday to possibly friday or even saturday. meanwhile, the hard push on this from senate democrats is gaining some momentum. senator elizabeth warren today joining a call for more information from pete hegseth himself saying, quote, it would be irresponsible and contrary to our constitutional duty for the senate to vote to confirm this nomination. without it. senator elizabeth warren it. senator elizabeth warren joins us mopping is hard work, but then i tried the swiffer powermop. it has a built-in solution

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uphill climb from the start because obviously. but where does it stand now? joining us now is senator elizabeth warren of massachusetts. senator, i really appreciate you being here with us tonight. thank you. >> good to be. >> with you. >> so help us understand the process here. the allegations that you were talking about there in that video. these new allegations that are detailed in this affidavit from mr. hegseth, former sister in law. she says these were conveyed to the fbi, but then somehow they never made it to senators, except just now, upon invitation from senator reid, that the senate sister in law should talk to the committee directly. what happened here? well, it's clear. >> that the. >> fbi did. not do. >> a thorough job in. >> tracking down. all of the stories. about drinking and all of the stories about sexual abuse. >> it's obvious, in part because we have a file of.

>> different from different people. >> and the fbi. report just hasn't really covered everything. and that's. >> clear now. >> with the former. >> sister in law. >> but understand this about it, rachel, when people are talking about what what did. >> we learn with. >> this affidavit? >> it's all the same pattern. >> it's story after story after story after story about drunk. and i don't mean, you know, a couple. >> of drinks. >> before dinner, i. >> mean drunk. i mean, the. >> kind of. drunk where standing outside a hotel. >> and peeing drunk. >> i mean. >> someone had to get you upstairs and into your hotel room. the kind. >> of drunk that. >> you take work. folks to a strip club and so. >> drunk then. >> that you. >> try. >> to get up on. >> stage and. >> dance with. >> the strippers. the kind of drunk. >> that is, stop the uber because you're going to vomit drunk. so we're talking about out. >> of control.

>> drunk, passed out dead cold drunk there. story after story after story. and the republicans. many who have looked at this have said, oh no, no, no, these are just anonymous efforts. >> to smear mr. hegseth. that's been. >> his response. none of it's true. it's all just anonymous. now. it's not anonymous. >> but these are. >> not people who've gone out there in public and. >> put their names. >> in public for a lot. >> of reasons that are. >> personal. >> not wanting to do that. what we have here. >> that makes. >> this different is it's. >> the stories with all the receipts, the dates. >> the. >> documents, when it happened, who was there. but now it's someone has said. this in a sworn. >> affidavit with her name on it and under. penalty of perjury. so there's not even a fig leaf. >> to hide behind. this is really about whether. or not republicans are.

>> going to confirm a secretary of defense. >> who has a serious alcohol problem. >> senator, do you believe that there are republicans who are considering what you just described there in good faith, that there are a handful, potentially four republicans, who may vote against him, either because they feel that the process hasn't been appropriate here, given the severity of the allegations made against him, or just that they've heard enough, and what they hear means that he's not suited to this job. >> you know, look, i never want to speak. >> for someone. >> else, but tonight has got to be a real soul searching night for people to be saying. >> i could. >> vote to make that guy. >> secretary of defense. >> remember. >> secretary of defense. >> is a very. >> very special role. >> in our government. >> this is the person. >> who gets. >> the call. >> when things are truly spinning. out of control. when really scary data has come in,

when. >> information. >> when something. around the globe has really gone in a bad way. >> because it is the secretary of defense who. >> makes the call on, is now the time to call the president? if so, what am i going to tell the president? is now the time to call. >> in. >> other experts to get our. >> allies involved? secretary of defense. >> has to be ready to go 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. look, i understand there are people who have alcohol problems, but. >> we cannot. >> trust the safety of our country. to someone. >> who has demonstrated. repeatedly using. very bad judgment. >> with alcohol. >> and doing it in ways that truly have. >> incapacitated him. this is. >> not a moment. >> to take that. >> kind of risk with our national security. >> and i hope that all. 53

republicans are. thinking very hard about that. >> senator elizabeth warren of massachusetts, thank you for your time tonight, senator. thanks. we'll be right back. >> i wish my tv. >> provider let. >> me. >> choose what i pay for. >> sling lets you do that. >> i wish my. >> tv provider let. >> me. >> choose what. >> i pay. >> for, and let me. >> pause my subscription. >> when i want. >> sling let you. >> do that. >> yeah. >> i wish my tv provider let me choose. >> what i pay for. >> and let me. >> pause my. >> subscription when. >> i want and have hundreds of free channels. >> sling let you do that too. name it. >> choosing customize your channel lineup or watch for free. sling lets you do that. lumify. >> it's kind of amazing. >> wow. >> lumify eye drops dramatically reduce redness. >> in one minute. >> and look at the difference. my eyes look brighter and whiter for up to. eight hours. lumify really works. >> see for yourself. >> try. >> one of my favorite supplements is qunol turmeric.

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♪ ♪ with so much great entertainment out there... wouldn't it be easier if you could find what you want, all in one place? my favorites. get xfinity streamsaver with netflix, apple tv+, and peacock included, for only $15 a month. dot msnbc.com at blue sky. i'll see you again tomorrow night right here at 9 p.m. eastern. now it's time for the last word with lawrence o'donnell. good evening. lawrence. >> you can find me at