send info kit. >> com physicians. >> mutual. >> physicians mutual. >> we have a jam packed show for you. tomorrow we will be joined by the new junior senator from delaware, lisa blunt rochester, and former d.c. police officer michael fanone. and we have many, many, many more. it all starts back here tomorrow, 8 a.m. eastern. be sure to follow us on social media at the weekend msnbc. but don't you go anywhere because velshi continues our coverage right now. take it away, ali. >> good morning, friends, and thank you. i'm glad you got michael fanone tomorrow. i'm glad you had harry dunn this morning. it is. it's a it's a sort of a different and important part of the story to hear. we all get it. we all get how how we feel about these these these convicts who who tried to, you know, overturn democracy, getting released. but to hear it from these police officers who were on the line and what this means to them and the threat that they feel, i think it's crucial that you're doing that. and i thank you for

that. >> i mean, when harry dunn said he is not going to live in fear because that is the point, and he you're not going to get fear from him. i was like, yes, harry. >> that's that's some brave stuff. so thank you for that. have a good rest of your day. and velshi starts right now. hey, good morning to you. it is saturday. what is it, january. it's sunday in january. today, donald trump took office less than a week ago, which i know was the 20th. so we're somewhere, let's call it the 25th. donald trump took office on monday. we're already seeing a new trumpian vision for justice taking shape as his administration enacts swift, sweeping changes aimed at fulfilling his campaign promise of retribution, for one thing, a purge of civil servants is happening across the agencies and departments across the federal government. now, there's brand new reporting this morning, led by the washington post, that at least 12 independent inspectors general in major federal agencies were fired late last night. they were

told, in most cases by email, that they had been terminated immediately, which the post notes appears to be a violation of federal law since congress is required to get 30 days notice of any intent to dismiss a senate confirmed inspector general. although not all inspectors general are senate confirmed now. this is in addition to a memo that was also sent out last night, instructing the heads of every agency to terminate all d e i offices and positions within the next 60 days. additionally, donald trump sent a clear message on day one about his priorities, which he followed through with with his promise to promise to issue a blanket pardon for every single person who was charged in connection to the january 6th insurrection. more than 1500 in all, the sweeping order of clemency also means that people who were convicted of violently assaulting law enforcement officers at the capitol, like harry dunn, like michael fanone, are now free. they'll have their voting rights and their gun rights restored. the release of some of these offenders from

prison is understandably causing some people to fear for their safety. shortly after january 6th, jackson reffitt, who was only 18 years old at the time, contacted authorities to report that his father, guy reffitt, had taken part in the riot. now that his father has been freed, jackson says he's terrified about what that means for his personal safety. he told msnbc this week that trump supporters feel validated by this new administration, that he gets, quote, death threats by the minute. now, former dc police officer michael fanone, this man, you've seen him. he shares similar concerns. fanone served in law enforcement for more than 20 years, and he was one of the many officers who was assaulted at the capitol on january 6th. five men pleaded guilty to assaulting him that day. and now those men are free. fanone is now trying to get information about the five men who assaulted him, so he can file a protective order against them, and he's encountering obstacles doing that. here's what he told my colleague joy reid just the other night.

>> well, that doesn't do very much. >> in order for the protection order to take effect. >> for. >> a full two. >> years. >> these individuals have. >> to be served well. >> that requires. >> me to. >> know their home address. >> when i reached out to the. >> department of justice initially. >> i was told. >> that. >> they would provide me. >> with that information. >> 9:00 this morning. >> i get a phone. >> call. >> and i'm told that because. the cases. >> were pardoned. >> there is no longer any criminal charges, and i'm. >> not entitled to. >> that information as i. >> am no longer. >> a victim. >> according to. >> the department. >> of justice. and just moments ago, former capitol police officer harry dunn spoke to my colleagues on the weekend about his reaction to the pardons. >> it's a slap in the face to the officers. those officers are the real patriots, are the real heroes. like the judge said, those are the people that are patriots, the people that honor their oath to this country, that

that to the constitution, that are faithful to that and not an individual. donald trump told us, well told. yeah, he told the world stand for the proud, the proud boys stand back and stand by. and that's exactly what they're doing. he's keeping them on standby in case he needs them again. >> he needs them again. the department of justice is one of the many agencies that's been undergoing major changes since trump took office on monday. within hours of being sworn in, the trump administration fired four top officials at the justice department's executive office of immigration review, which oversees u.s. immigration courts. it's also ordered the doj to step up its immigration enforcement efforts. and the acting deputy attorney general, emil bove, instructed federal prosecutors to investigate and potentially prosecute local officials who obstruct the administration's mass deportation efforts, which are underway. perhaps most troublingly. the doj this week ordered the civil rights

division to halt its work. it had been told to stop working on many of the ongoing biden era cases, and to not pursue any new complaints or take any new actions until further notice. now, here's the thing. i've mentioned the civil rights division a lot over the years, but it's more important than you think. it's historically been tasked with enforcing laws regarding discrimination of all kinds, including cases involving race, sexual orientation, immigration, disability rights. the former attorney general, eric holder, once described the division as, quote, the conscience of the justice department. end quote. its lawyers have played critical roles in pivotal cases like school integration during the civil rights movement, the prosecution of the men responsible for the 1963 church bombings in birmingham, alabama that killed four young girls just weeks ago, the biden administration finalized consent decrees to reform police agencies in louisville, kentucky, following the fatal police shooting of breonna taylor, and in minneapolis, minnesota, after the murder of

george floyd, both of which sparked nationwide outrage in 2020. for more on this, i'm joined by barbara mcquade, former u.s. attorney for the eastern district of michigan. she's also the co-host of the sisters in law podcast and author of the book attack from within how disinformation is sabotaging america. also, i'm joined by charles coleman jr. he's a civil rights attorney and former prosecutor and a writer for slate. they're both msnbc legal analyst, and charles and i have almost never been in the same room at the same time, because you're often here to help out when i'm away. thank you for that, charles. let's just talk about civil rights. there's so much to unpack here, but i want to talk about that just for a moment. we hear about it. they are often thought of as the civil rights defender of last resort. they are better resourced in some cases than states are to prosecute some of these things. but often when crimes fall under the radar or don't get prosecuted, the civil rights division comes in. it's a very, very important thing. why would why would trump want to get a get rid of it? >> ali. >> what we are seeing right now is this administration stripping away the guardrails that

protect. all of. >> the. >> institutions, upholding our. >> democracy. >> and the civil rights division of the department of justice is. >> one of. >> the enforcers that makes sure that that happens. it is an independent division that operates within the department of justice. it has the resources available to it of the fbi to conduct thorough investigations and utilize resources that other agencies, on a state level and on a local level, do not have access to. when you take that away and you put forward the type of agenda that donald trump and this administration is advancing, you literally put crosshairs on all of the bedrocks of our american democracy. and that's what this administration is doing with this move. i talked about this a little while back in a piece that i wrote for newsweek, and i noted the fact that with kristen clarke out as the director of the civil rights unit in the department of justice, we had to brace ourselves. and everything that i warned people of is now coming true. >> barbara, this is an important thing because in an

administration where people worry about the fact that some of their civil rights might be violated, the idea that there was a division that exists within the department of justice to actually look into that, and it's had successes and failures over time. but fundamentally, that's what it does, actually has real impact on, on, on everyday americans. >> absolutely. and, you know, sometimes we see new administrations come in and they'll have different priorities for the civil rights division maybe some want to use it for hate crimes. others are more focused. >> on the. >> americans with disabilities act, for example. we've seen those kinds of priority shifts. but nonetheless, the group is there to investigate and enforce civil rights laws. and what happens without that? we already had consent decrees in several. cities based on findings that. police departments were engaging in patterns and practices of violating the constitutional rights of the citizens of those communities. i dealt with one of

those when. >> i was u.s. attorney. >> in partnership with the civil. >> rights division. >> in detroit. we had abuses, excessive use of force. keeping people in deplorable conditions of confinement, even arresting witnesses. without probable cause. and we came in and got a consent decree and reformed the detroit police department, which today not perfect but is a model of constitutional policing. so what does that say to people who are victims of over of, of abuse by police departments? you're on your own. >> right. and this is important, charles, you've studied this a great deal in many of these cases that we've seen, prosecutions headed by the civil rights division, including in addition to state prosecutions in some cases, but in some of the police killings of the last few years, there has been some sense amongst the lawyers who represent the families of some of these people who were who were killed unjustly, that there is someone who will take this case on, there is someone who will prosecute it. sometimes it takes a lot longer than you would expect, but there is someone to lean on. >> absolutely. i think that when you're talking about these sorts

of cases, ali, these investigations are not easy. they are very complicated because you have to figure out a way to pierce the blue wall, if you will, if you're talking about police misconduct. and so you have to have very well-resourced entities that are participating in these investigations. but beyond that, because most people won't take these cases, the question becomes looking forward. if we were in a society where i could predict or you could predict with any great degree of certainty that we were done with the notion of police misconduct, even if it was only left to the notion of human error, then this would be a different conversation. right? but we know that we're not. and because we're not, the fact that these protections are being removed, the fact that this this agency is basically being disempowered by the minute is very, very scary because the real world impact that it has on the most marginalized of americans will be felt and it will be felt to a very, very great degree. >> barbara, you heard what harry dunn had said to my colleagues on the weekend talking about donald trump sending a signal to

the proud boys. you've had some experience with this, these these so-called militias. i say so-called because you're not actually allowed to have a militia in the united states. if you'd like to be involved in protecting your state, you have to join the national guard or join the police or something like that. but there has been some signal. you saw enrique tarrio of the proud boys, you saw stewart rhodes of the oath keepers. they're out there talking about a resurgence, about coming back, about about retribution, about about getting, you know, getting back in the game. it is the federal government is our only bulwark against these illegal militias. >> yeah. and you know, you're right to question the. >> term militia. our constitution. >> uses the term militia, well-regulated militia, which means under the supervision of the u.s. government, these paramilitary private groups are anything but. it's a group of people loosely formed with some sort of allegiance to fight against the united states or against factions of the united states. they are lawless and

completely dangerous. and now we have donald trump not only issuing pardons to say they. shouldn't be punished, but suggesting there might be a place for them in. >> his administration. >> this is acting outside of the law. the president has federal law enforcement. the president has the military. why does he need private paramilitary organizations? and the real harm that's going to come here, i think, is that they're going to see, just as we saw when donald trump said in the debate, proud boys stand back and stand by a surge in recruitment. once again, we're going to see that same kind of thing that we are the favored group. and what i worry about is these are groups that engage in vigilante violence. they are not acting according to the rule of law. they are acting according to their own whim. >> what is your sense of this, charles? that barbara's been very, very good about how she describes these things, because they're not really they're not legally formed militias. in some cases, they're gun clubs, but some places they've got some

nefarious undertones to them. and in these particular cases, white nationalist undertones. >> right. >> i don't see how anyone looking at this, particularly after the notion of these january 6th pardons, does not feel that an alignment or an allegiance to these groups gives you a free pass, not only for vigilante justice, not only to disrespect democracy, but to proudly and openly exercise your your statement of being a white nationalist in plain view of democracy, literally on the footsteps of democracy. >> we're talking about. >> something that happened at the us capitol. and so if you can do that, if you can assault law enforcement, if you can essentially try to take over the us government and derail an entire free and fair election, and then the president of the united states lets you go, what else can't you do? >> what else can't you do? that's the question we've got. thanks to both of you friends, i appreciate it. barbara mcquade is a former united states attorney, author of a very important book, attack from

within how disinformation is sabotaging america. charles coleman is a civil rights attorney and an msnbc legal analyst, and a great friend of our show. thanks to both of you for being here. all right. coming up, one of president trump's first actions back in office was aimed at ending constitutionally protected birthright citizenship. i'll talk to state attorney general keith ellison and william tong, who are part of a group of democratic ags who sued the trump administration to block his efforts to end birthright citizenship. plus, more on the breaking news i mentioned at the top of the show. president trump has reportedly fired at least 12 independent inspectors general. i'll talk to one of the reporters who first broke that story for the washington post.f breaking promises in the cease fire deal. we'll go to tel aviv fire deal. we'll go to tel aviv live after the break on velshi. if you're frustrated with occasional bloating or gas, your body's giving you signs. it's time to try align. align probiotic was specifically designed by gastroenterologists

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>> all right, now to the breaking news out of the middle east, where earlier this morning, four israeli hostages held by hamas were released. it is the second such release under the current cease fire deal, which began last sunday. the released hostages are all female soldiers karina, ariana, daniella gilboa, naama levi and lira alba. they were abducted from an israeli military base near the border with gaza, where they were serving at the time of the hamas attack on october 7th. in a highly choreographed show of force. you're watching some of it right now. hamas militants this morning marched the hostages across a stage in gaza city before handing them over to the red cross. the red cross then handed them over to israeli forces, who then took them across the border to the idf base, which is, by the way, where they were serving when they were abducted. they were then flown via military helicopter to a hospital in petah tikva, israel, which is just north of tel aviv. in exchange, israel has released 200 palestinian prisoners, several of whom were serving

long prison terms. 114 of them were released into the west bank, 70 were sent to egypt, 16 were taken to gaza. video shows several of these hostages, these prisoners being released, and the celebrations around that in the west bank city of ramallah. in total, as part of phase one of the ceasefire deal, hamas is releasing 33 hostages out of the roughly 90 to 100 being held because dozens are believed to be dead. israel is releasing a total of 737 palestinian prisoners, in addition to 1167 gaza residents arrested during the war. we've also seen a significant increase in the amount of daily humanitarian aid that's been allowed into gaza. under the cease fire agreement, it calls for 600 trucks per day. israel is also gradually supposed to withdraw from the populated areas in gaza, allowing gazan civilians to return to their homes. however, since the hostage release this morning, israel has accused

hamas of breaking promises in the deal, claiming that all female civilians were supposed to be released before soldiers. israel has specifically identified this woman, 29 year old arbel yahud, stating that until she is released, israel will not allow palestinian civilians to return to northern gaza. and that was supposed to begin today. the question here is whether yahud is a soldier or a civilian. islamic jihad is saying that that she is a soldier, and the ratio at which you trade prisoners, palestinian prisoners for israeli hostages differs depending on whether one is a civilian or a soldier. joining me now from hostage square in tel aviv is nbc news international correspondent daniele hamamdjian. daniele, good to see you this morning. what's happening now for you? it was pretty noisy where you were earlier. it was right as that helicopter was landing and those hostages were were getting off at the hospital north of where you were in petah tikva. tell me what the situation has been, both where you are and in the

west bank, because i know you're keeping in touch with folks there to see how that's going on. >> yeah. well, good evening to you from tel. >> aviv, ali. >> it's pretty quiet behind me. >> as. >> you can see, but we're expecting quite a big gathering tonight, as has been the case every saturday night for 477 days now. you mentioned the four soldiers in that very choreographed handover. they waved to the crowd on stage in gaza city, smiling, hand it over to the red cross, who then hand it over to israeli forces. they are now being medically assessed. they've been reunited with their families, but certainly at a distance they look well. these were women who were part of the surveillance unit at the nahal oz military base. their job was to be in that watchtower and monitor the border, the gaza border. and i have interviewed some of the family members of the female soldiers who did die that day. and i remember them telling me that, you know, they were highly

trained and they had to keep their eyes on the screen at all times. they, in fact, could not drink normally. they had to drink through a straw because they couldn't leave the screen, and that they had reported in the months prior to october 7th that they. >> had noticed. >> unusual activity at the border. they told their superiors that hamas was training and it was up to something, and their family members later told the media those warnings went, they were ignored. and so no doubt one day, if and when there is going to be a commission into october 7th, this will be a part of it. now over to the west bank. you saw the scenes of jubilation. these are prisoners who have served long sentences, who are meant to serve long sentences. in the eyes of israel. they are terrorists with blood on their hands, having killed israelis, two palestinians, to many palestinians are heroes who have played their part in the resistance against the military occupation of the west bank. this is very much the case of one man's terrorist is another one's freedom fighter. and so, again, throughout the

six weeks, we are going to see hundreds and hundreds of prisoners released. and if everything goes according to plan, if the terms of the deal are met, we are going to see all hostages 26 now remaining back on israeli soil. ali. >> daniel, thank you for your excellent reporting from there. it's a tough circumstance to be in. daniele hamamdjian in tel aviv for us. i want to take you to the eisenhower executive office building across from the white house, where right now, pete hegseth is being sworn in as secretary of defense by vice president j.d. vance. this comes just 12 hours after vance was forced to cast a tie breaking vote to confirm hegseth in the senate. three republicans, susan collins, lisa murkowski and mitch mcconnell all voted against his confirmation, as did all democrats. this is the smallest margin for a defense secretary's confirmation since the position was created in 1947. hegseth is just the second cabinet secretary in history to advance on a tie breaking vote by the vice president. the other

was betsy devos, trump's pick for education secretary in his first administration. pete hegseth, being signed in, sworn in as the secretary of defense. we'll be right back. >> pet owners. know the struggle. your best. >> bud can track. all sorts of gunk indoors. now there's a simple solution. it's muddy mat. >> the anti mud. >> mat that keeps your dog's paws clean before they make a mess inside. use muddy mat under your pet's food dish in. >> the bathroom. >> even catch spills. >> in the kitchen. >> call or go online to order your muddy mat right away. >> through. >> this introductory offer. >> order two and. get one free. >> for only. >> 19.95 each. >> hi, i'm caleb and this is my story. i was born with osteogenesis imperfecta. or brittle bone disease. i have broken my bones almost 200 times

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and what better way of spending time than traveling, continuing to educate ourselves and broaden our minds. (vo 2) viking. exploring the world in comfort. independent inspectors general. this was first reported by the washington post overnight. according to the post, inspectors general at the state defense, transportation and energy, veterans affairs department and others received emails friday night that they would be terminated immediately. a senior white house official confirms to nbc news that trump fired multiple inspectors general. when asked why the igs were fired, the official said this was an effort by the president to let go of past parts of the past biden administration that don't, quote, align with the new trump

administration. they added, quote, we're cleaning house of what doesn't work for us and going forward, end quote. let me get back to that in a second, because that's kind of interesting, one fired inspector general told the washington post, quote, it's a widespread massacre. whoever trump puts in now will be viewed as loyalists, and that undermines the entire system, end quote. now, most. here's here's the interesting part of the story. most of those who were dismissed were actually appointed by donald trump in his first term. but that's almost besides the point, because inspectors general are meant to be experts in their field and to monitor and report to congress about their assigned departments, they're either appointed by a president and senate confirmed, or by the heads of their departments. some of them are not senate confirmed. they typically serve terms across presidential administrations as a way to avoid politicization. joining me now is one of the reporters who first broke the story for the washington post, lisa ryan. she covers federal agencies in the executive branch. lisa, thank you for this very, very important piece of reporting

here. the council of the inspectors general on integrity and efficiency wrote a letter to the white house saying trump's actions might be illegal because they failed to comply with a 2022 law that requires 30 days notice to congress. if that inspector general has been approved, has been senate approved, the white house has told us no laws have been broken. what what does your reporting tell you about this? >> hi, ellie. >> thanks so much for having me. yeah, that law was put in place after trump's. first term, in which he ousted five igs in the in the course of two months and did the same thing, did not give notice. so congress did pass a law requiring this 30 day notice. but, you know, honestly, i think in many what we've seen in the last week is that the administration has been willing to really kind of work around the law in some of these cases.

and i'm not sure that this will really make a huge difference. but yes, they did. they did not follow a statute that congress put in requiring them to give notice. but this is really what we're seeing. ali is just a real assault on a fundamental principle of transparency and accountability in the federal government, which is what the new trump administration says they want. >> you say something very interesting in your reporting. you say the remaining federal watchdogs, meaning the ones who have not been dismissed or fired, now face the vexing decision of whether to soften their oversight of the new administration or pledge to their staff that they will not back down on tough investigations at the risk of being fired. so it's kind of like one of these things you don't have to fire 100% of the people, you just have to fire a percentage of them. and everybody else, generally speaking, gets the message. i think most people don't think about inspectors general on a daily basis, but they're an incredibly important watchdog of our federal agencies, of our

federal departments. >> absolutely. and every big agency has one that is confirmed by the senate. all small agencies have them as well, although they tend to be appointed by the head of the agency. and the staff said at inspector general's offices are very, very experienced investigators. some of them are federal law enforcement investigators. they root out. i mean, we've heard this term so many times, but it's really meaningful in this context. waste, fraud and corruption. and, you know, without them, you know, i don't think the public would really have any, any way to, to hold agencies accountable in whatever administration you're talking about. and a lot of these watchdogs who were who were fired, who were republicans, were very hard on the biden administration. for

example, mike missal, the ig at the at the department of veterans affairs, did a scathing report just within the last six months or so on on denis. denis mcdonough was the va secretary, a biden appointee. his staff gave massive bonuses to, you know, huge hundreds of people at va to administer the pact act, which was a benefit for veterans. and this was really shocking and a huge embarrassment. and denis mcdonough took this very, very seriously and stopped it. >> thank you, lisa, for excellent, important reporting. more importantly, i'm sure you were up pretty late last night, and then we asked you to join us at 7:00 this morning to talk about this. and of course, we ended up covering the hostage release, which which sort of took the hour. so we've taken, i don't know when you last slept. and so i hope you get a bit of a

nap. thank you for your important reporting. lisa ryan is a staff reporter at the washington post covering the federal government. all right. coming up, why we can't assume that donald trump's gambit to end birthright citizenship is doomed to fail and how it's designed, even in the meantime, to create division. and so a new imaginary subclass of people to imaginary subclass of people to be othered. the first time you try bounce, it hits you. your laundry feels way fresher, softer. so you start to wonder. if i put a sheet of bounce on the finance guy, will it make him softer? bounce can't do it all but for better laundry, ♪ put a sheet on it with bounce. ♪ no matter what kind of teeth you gotta brush, oral-b electric cleans better with one simple touch. oral-b's dentist inspired round brush head hugs em, cleans em, and gets in between em, for 100% cleaner teeth. your perfect clean starts with oral-b. the new york times calls klein

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states citizen or lawful permanent resident at the time of said person's birth, or two when that person's mother's presence in the united states was lawful but temporary, and the person's father was not a united states citizen or lawful permanent resident at the time of said person's birth. end quote. that was what was actually written into the executive order. now, that is super convoluted, largely because trump is trying to make this distinction that simply does not exist in the law. he's trying to create a new subclass of people born in america who are constitutionally entitled to citizenship, to strip of that lawful citizenship. these are not dreamers. these are not green card holders or h-1b visas, or undocumented immigrants, or documented immigrants for that matter. they are citizens of the united states. let me be very clear. by every conceivable understanding of our legal system and executive powers, trump does not

have the right to do this. in 1868, congress ratified the 14th amendment to the constitution, which established, quote, all persons born or naturalized in the united states and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the united states and of the state wherein they reside. end quote. end of sentence. this earliest iteration of the law excluded native americans, arguing that native reservations were not, quote, subject to the jurisprudence, end quote of the united states. the birthright citizenship clause of the 14th amendment met its first major test, about 20 years after it was written. a chinese american man named wong kim ark, born in san francisco with a california birth certificate, and all of the proper documentation, went to china china to visit some family. when he returned, he was denied reentry into the united states via the chinese exclusion act and was held on steamships

off the california coast for nearly five months. while the us government insisted he was not a citizen, wong kim ark took his denial of citizenship to court in san francisco, and eventually his case came before the supreme court. the court agreed with wong kim ark. the supreme court reaffirmed in 1898 that under the 14th amendment, he was a citizen. the 14th amendment was ratified in 1868, three years after the end of the civil war, to address this country's original sin of slavery, to reverse previous law and court precedent that denied the citizenship and basic humanity of nearly 4 million formerly enslaved people, it said. what it meant if you're born in america, you're an american citizen. but it was wong's case that made it clear that the 14th amendment applied to almost all people born on american soil, regardless of race or ancestry. as i mentioned, the 14th amendment did not initially apply to native americans until the indian citizenship act of

1924. 100 years ago. since president donald trump signed that executive order on monday, six separate federal lawsuits have been filed representing a combined 22 states and two cities. on thursday, a reagan appointed federal judge in washington state, judge john kunau, said, quote, i've been on the bench for over four decades. i can't remember another case where the question presented is as clear as this one. this is a blatantly unconstitutional order, end quote, the filing in that case in washington lays out not just the dubious legal reasoning behind the order. it also highlights the cruel nature behind it, as it seeks to reestablish the very divisions and striations of our society that these constitutional amendments aim to heal. the filing reads in part, quote, the individuals who are stripped of their united states citizenship will be rendered undocumented, subject to removal or detention, and many will be stateless. that is, citizens of no country at all. they will be placed into

lifelong positions of instability and insecurity as part of a new underclass in the united states. in short, despite the constitution's guarantee of their citizenship, thousands of newborns and children will lose their ability to fully and fairly be part of american society as a citizen, with all its benefits and privileges. end quote. after a break, i'll be joined by two men who've been instrumental in the fight to maintain birthright citizenship. they're part of the lawsuit against donald trump's executive order. attorney general for the state of minnesota, keith ellison and connecticut william tong, for whom this fight is personal. more velshi in a personal. more velshi in a moment. advil liqui-gels are faster and stronger than tylenol rapid release gels. ♪♪ also from advil, advil targeted relief, the only topical with 4 powerful pain fighting ingredients that start working on contact and lasts up to 8 hours. (man) mm, hey, honey. that start working on contact

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>> get a personalized. treatment plan 100% online@forhours.com. >> before the break, i told you about donald trump's efforts to get rid of birthright citizenship in the united states. a law, by the way, that's enshrined in the us constitution. it's a 14th amendment of the us constitution. joining me to discuss this is keith ellison, minnesota's attorney general. he's a former congressman for the state. also with me, william tong, democratic attorney general for the state of connecticut. aj tong is a first generation american born to immigrant parents. i'm finding it very. thank you, gentlemen, both for being here. you're both great friends of the show, attorney general tong, i. it's so hard to take that executive order and make it make sense because it's so convoluted, convoluted and so complicated. and it is creating a class of people who are not distinct, who don't exist. like, there's no there should be no distinction

between. keith ellison, a natural born american citizen of american parents, you or me? i'm a naturalized immigrant to the united states. we're all citizens. citizens are the same in theory. we're all citizens. the 14th amendment is clear by its terms. justice gorsuch. right. the textualist. >> just read. >> the language. and that's why this. executive order makes. >> no sense. >> and as. >> you. >> said in in your bit beforehand. this will. >> create a. >> class of. >> people that. have no status. >> right. what will. >> happen to these kids? the 7400. >> children born in. >> connecticut this. year with parents. >> who are not citizens like. >> me when i was. >> born. >> i have birthright citizenship, and there's no. daylight between me and them, and. i can't. imagine what life would. >> be like. i wouldn't. >> be sitting here if. >> i wasn't. >> a citizen by right of my birth. >> so, attorney general ellison, if we're sitting at dinner and we're saying, what's the real takeaway here is the takeaway that it's not legal, but that the supreme court's kind of

weird these days. and so if it gets to the supreme court, birthright citizenship is actually in danger. or is the takeaway here that this is another element of a culture war? this is another othering of people. what's the what's what's your takeaway? you're both you're both lawyers and experts. attorney general ellison, what do you what do you make of it? >> it's both. >> actually, we should view this as aspirational. i mean, look, the people who drafted this aren't dummies. they're doing this for a reason. it doesn't make sense legally, but it makes perfect sense from the standpoint of great replacement theory. what they're trying to do is drive a narrative that there are deserving, accepted, and approved americans. and there are others who are not. >> and. >> they may not win this round, but they want to keep on pounding at the door. i mean, and then, of course, you know, we know we know that they probably got thomas and alito, no matter what they propose, they don't have kagan, brown and

sotomayor. so now what does kavanaugh do? what does coney barrett do? what does roberts do? roberts will probably do the same legal thing, but it is sort of up in the air and it injects immobilizing the hope, fear into the population, into the population. and so that's what it's about. it's about it is culture war. it's aspirational from the standpoint of great replacement, which is the racist theory that brown immigrants are taking over america from anglo-saxon protestant christian whites. it is a lie. it's untrue. we're all americans, but they're doing it. and here we go. >> ag tong, you recently. so let's go back to the legal argument for a second about what what sort of success you can have, because both of you are involved in the legal fight. you talked about judge kavanaugh's temporary block on the order you

wrote. this judge got it right. this was a blatantly unconstitutional order. the 14th amendment could not be more clear. if you're born on american soil, you're an american. there is just zero legitimate legal debate on this question. the facts and the law are clearly on our side. but this fight is far from over. are we? we are ready to keep fighting for american families and the essential character of our nation. i ask you this because there's this weird little thing at the end of the 14th amendment that some have interpreted to say, if you're somehow if you're not subject to our jurisdiction or you're subject to or loyal to some other jurisdiction, you don't really you're not as much of an american citizen as you and i have discussed. there was a chinese man more than 100 years ago who proved that not to be correct in front of the supreme court. the supreme court decided this in 1898. >> yes. >> this is. >> rooted in our. >> history and the original. >> sin, as you said, of slavery. right? >> dred scott. >> treated slaves. >> and african. >> americans as. non-citizens

and less. >> than human. >> and so we passed. ratified the 14th amendment, which is clear. by its terms. and then. >> the supreme court said. >> in wong. >> kim ark. yes, absolutely. if you're born on american soil, you're an american citizen. >> and. >> ali. >> the last. >> time i was on. >> the show. >> i said we. >> were ready. keith and. >> i and our. >> fellow attorneys general. >> he issued. >> this executive order on. >> monday night. we sued on tuesday. we got. >> the temporary restraining. order on thursday. >> why? >> why so fast? because it's so clear. >> it's so blatantly. >> unconstitutional. >> and you. >> can't flip these words. >> in different ways. >> and try. >> to create ambiguity. >> in what is not a statute. >> not a. >> law. >> not a regulation. >> it's the. >> constitution. >> folks. >> and you can't change it. >> by. >> the stroke. >> of a pen. >> attorney general ellison, it is a temporary restraining order, which means it's valid for 14 days. what? tell me how this plays out, how this largely plays out in a normal world that would play out where some court gets this and says exactly what

a.g. tong just said. this is nonsensical. goodbye. what's the other option? >> well, i see the i see us prevailing at the trial court. i see us prevailing at the circuit court because they're going to apply the law. as i alluded to a moment ago, trump thinks he probably has a 3070 chance at the supreme court, depending on whether he can provoke the maga mob to intimidate those questionable justices. you know, the ones i already mentioned coney, barrett, roberts, kavanaugh and gorsuch. and so that's the shot that they want to play. they probably i think they will still lose there, but they will have made a critical statement about belonging. and let me just say this, and i want to thank my courageous friend william tong, when he told his story to his fraternity of ags, we were all in tears because we like, we care. we of course we care. but our own brother is facing this. and so, william, we're right with you, man. but but i just want to say, if

birthright citizenship is in question, then the citizenship of black american descendants of slaves is in question because it is a direct refutation of dred scott, wherein chief justice taney said blacks have no rights with a white man is bound to respect. so they want to flip the entire table. and may i also note, this is two years after plessy versus ferguson proving that this court of wong kim ark was no wilting violet liberal court. this was a segregationist court. but even they were bound to the rule, the words of the 14th amendment, and had to rule as they did. so this thing now is more extreme. >> this is. and one just needs to read a pamphlet on this, that dred scott civil war, 13th amendment, 14th amendment, wong, kim ark plessy ferguson. like

this is this is an unbroken line of conservatives and racists actually coming to the same conclusion that we've decided more than 100 years later, we're going to overturn. thank you both for this. this is an important matter. and i think people have to remember this is a slippery slope. if something goes wrong with the 14th amendment, there's nothing in that constitution that will protect you. thanks to both of you, connecticut attorney general william tong and minnesota attorney general keith ellison. all right, straight ahead. how justice is already being reshaped just days into the new trump era. another hour of velshi begins right now. and good morning to you. it's saturday, january the 25th. donald trump took office less than a week ago, and we're already seeing a new trumpian

vision for justice taking shape as his administration enacts swift, sweeping changes that are aimed at fulfilling his campaign promise of retribution. for one thing, a purge of civil servants is happening across all agencies and departments across the federal government. there's brand new reporting this morning, led by the washington post, that at least 12 independent inspectors general in major federal agencies were fired late last night. they were told that they had been terminated immediately, the post notes, which appears to be a violation of federal law because congress is required to get 30 days notice of any intent to dismiss a senate confirmed inspector general. although not all inspectors general are senate confirmed. the inspectors general of the. the biggest agencies and departments are. that's in addition to a memo, by the way, that was also sent out last night instructing the heads of every agency to terminate all die offices and positions in the federal government within the next 60 days. none of this a big