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>> welcome back. >> to the weekend. so nbc news has now confirmed that donald trump fired 18 inspectors general across the federal government in a late. friday night purge. the inspector general act says the mission of an ig is to conduct independent and objective audits, investigations and inspections, as well as to prevent and detect waste, fraud and abuse. so, in short, igs are vital for keeping america's agencies honest. >> now. >> trump's spokesman said. kind of defended the firings, telling nbc news.

>> quote. >> we're cleaning house of what doesn't work for us. and going forward. but the failure to notify congress before the firings puts the move on legally shaky ground. joining us now is former cia director and msnbc senior director. director. brennan, good morning to you. just talk to us about the security risks. if donald trump now installs partizan inspectors general. >> well, first of all, it's a clear violation of the law which requires that congress be notified 30 days before the removal of any inspectors general. but also, these are individuals who are there in order to ensure that there is not going to be that waste, fraud and abuse within the government and to prevent any type of malfeasance. and they have a reporting responsibility to congress. and by removing all of these inspectors general, this is donald trump's way of further consolidating his control over the executive branch. he is appointing individuals, many of them unqualified, to lead these

departments and agencies. he's going to put other loyal minions in the various departments and agencies. but having the inspectors general office now under his control really is, you know, quite worrisome. and i'm just hoping that some republicans in congress are going to find the courage to be able to speak out and up against what he is doing here, which, again, is trampling upon the foundations that try to keep our executive branch strong and to prevent any type of corruption from going into these departments and agencies. and i think during a trump administration, the need for independent, objective inspectors general has never been greater. >> you know, senator grassley said that he wanted to take a look at it because he was he he had just found out about these firings. senator john kennedy and other republican. we let's just play this out of what senator kennedy said. >> i know the allegation has been made that that the president is required to give congress 30 days notice, and he

did not. but president trump has some very, very, very intelligent lawyers around them. and i'm sure they have a counterargument to that. and i want to hear i want to hear it before before i weigh in on it. >> okay. well, the council of inspectors general chair, hannibal mike ware, he, he he got a little counterargument. he says, as he writes, as the chairperson of the council of inspectors general on integrity and efficiency, i recommend he's writing to the president that you reach out to white house counsel to discuss your intended course of action. at this point, we do not believe the actions taken are legally sufficient to dismiss presidentially appointed senate confirmed inspectors general. the hedging that is happening when there are just when it is very clearly black and white to me, is of grave concern. >> yeah. i think senator kennedy's comments are a good example of how the republicans in the congress are abdicating their responsibilities from the

standpoint of making sure that our legislative branch of government is going to actually be a check on executive branch authority or overreach. and this is clearly what has happened here. so again, i think they're going to be looking at this very, very carefully. and you know, but if the republicans in congress who have a majority in both the senate and the house are unwilling to stand up to donald trump, and the word from the white house is that all of these senators, in particular, have to support all of his nominees. so, again, the signal is being sent to republicans in congress that you need to follow the president's line, irrespective of the law, irrespective of what's appropriate and irrespective of what's good for the country. meanwhile, in the backdrop. >> are a lot of other things that are going on relative to our national security that we should be concerned about, particularly the ongoing manipulation by russia through various means and certain useful idiots here in the united states

to push up and push out propaganda. i want to recall for you a letter that you were a signatory on regarding hunter biden's emails, in which quote from the letter, the arrival of the us political scene of emails purportedly belonging to vice president biden's son, hunter, much of it related to his time serving on the board of the ukrainian gas company burisma, has all the classic earmarks of a russian information operation. i pulled that because one of the things that i think is still worth noting. director brennan, is you're very sensitive to irrespective of pulling your your security clearances and other things, that this threat is still an active threat in this country right now. russia knows while it may have some issues with ukraine and so forth, it still has its its claws, its fingers in in the

sort of the politics of the united states. talk a little bit about how you see that continuing to play out with donald trump sitting down the street. >> well, i think the russians and the chinese are both very sophisticated actors in terms of exploiting the openness of the us society and the media. and so therefore they're going to use that as a way to be able to push out to the american citizens, whether it be disinformation, misinformation, or also amplifying information that may be accurate but is consistent with what their agenda is. and so the more that the us democratic foundations are going to be corroded and eroded by donald trump, that's certainly in the interest of vladimir putin. and it. >> becomes easier for them to do. >> that because they don't want to have a functioning democracy here in the united states. so, again, i think we have to be very wary that the russians and chinese are looking at what's happening here domestically, politically, and particularly the fissures that are existing now between and among americans. this is something that they're trying to exploit and will continue to do that through

social media, through those individuals who either wittingly or unwittingly, are trying to advance or advancing russia's and chinese agendas. >> what a perfect segue into tulsi gabbard and her confirmation hearing this week. >> i was thinking about you, alicia. >> you know, director brennan, if you were one of these senators who were going to have the opportunity to question tulsi gabbard, obviously there are a lot of questions. where would you begin? what are you most concerned about? >> well, i'd ask her to explain why she actually engaged in so many of these conspiracy theories, which really did parrot a lot of the russian statements that were being made about ukraine or about american politics. she claims, still, that trump won the 2020 election. she claims that the us was involved in developing bioweapons labs in ukraine. she, you know, visited assad. all of these things on the international front and the national security front that really are quite worrisome. but also, i would ask her, what why

does she believe that she has the executive experience to be able to lead and orchestrate the very complicated, complex and sensitive operations and activities of the intelligence agencies, the 18 of them that fall under the office of the director of national intelligence. so i don't think she has the experience, the credentials. now, i'm hoping that the senators are going to be able to conduct a confirmation hearing and really get to the bottom of some of these issues. so there's substance, there's leadership. there's also whether or not she is really going to stand up and make sure that there is going to be truth said to power, and that she's not just going to give donald trump what he wants on the intelligence front. >> director brennan, what is people may not understand, just kind of some of the things that fall under the purview of the dni, the role that tulsi gabbard has been nominated for by president trump. what what is the job? >> well, by law, the director of national intelligence is the

senior intelligence advisor to the president of the united states. and as a result, it is the office of the director of national intelligence and the dni, the director of national intelligence, who has responsibility for ensuring the production of the president's daily brief. this is the pdb that is produced six days a week. that goes to the president and other senior members of the national security environment. and so. >> it has all the threats in there. just so people know like it is it has everything. >> on a daily basis. it provides the president and others the insight into what's going on around the world and the threats to us, but also the director of national intelligence is responsible for coordinating and de-conflicting all these various intelligence agencies, making sure that they have the budget, the resources, the capabilities, making sure that their information technology systems are compatible and interactive with one another. so there's so much that falls under it. and so therefore, you want to have somebody who has some intelligence background, but also somebody who really is going to treat the job responsibly and making sure that they have that independence and

objectivity that is required. and because the intelligence professionals throughout the intelligence community want to make sure that their leaders don't care whether you have a democrat or republican in the white house, they want to make sure that they're able to do their job because they realize how essential it is to our national security. >> michael, could you imagine if a lie got into the president's daily brief? >> just imagine if a lie got into the president's daily brief. and i think that's that's an important explanation for people to understand why there there's so much hair on fire about tulsi gabbard in this position because of the things you outlined, her relationships with assad and her her, you know, seemingly seemingly seeming interest in engaging with bad actors out there globally. what does that mean now that she's in the position where she's providing the president with that kind of information? so let's take let's take it a little bit further. let's do a little war game scenario here. what happens if, in the course of getting that information, that coordination,

she decides that this particular bad actor is okay because she's had a past relationship with that bad actor or that country in some form or fashion? how does what she put in that influenced the decisions of the president? it's one thing to say, well, he gets the briefing. we know donald trump don't read. so there is that. but everybody else in that orbit does. how how does the how does bad information in result in bad actions on the other side? well. >> when there are national security council meetings that the president chairs in the white house situation room, usually the first person to speak would be the director of national intelligence and the director of cia. they lay down the intelligence basis for any type of policy discussion that ensues. and so if that intelligence basis, that briefing is going to be skewed or is going to be lacking some very important critical information, the policy decision that ultimately comes out of it

is also going to be quite baseless. and also, you know, it's going to be potentially threatening to our national security. so again, it's the president's daily brief, but also the role that the director of national intelligence, director of cia play, in order to ensure that the people who have to make that those decisions in the security council have are fully informed about what the reality is, what the intelligence is, what our intelligence gaps are, and if they withhold things or if they skew things, it really is going to be detrimental. >> real quick, before we let you go, director, do those agency heads have in that moment you're describing in that room, have tht's not what we told you. i mean, in other words, how how does that coordination come on, become undone when the person who's putting the final brief is skewed? the information? >> well, i like to think that, you know, secretary of state rubio, right, is very familiar with the intelligence

profession, is going to be speaking up because you have the secretary of state, secretary of defense, the attorney general, and others who are going to be there. so you want to make sure again, that you have people who are informed, but also people who want to know the truth, right? and not just people who want to give president trump what he wants to hear. that is so, so dangerous. and none of the six presidents that i work for ever wanted the intelligence community to give them what they wanted. they wanted the intelligence community to give them what they needed, and then they can make the appropriate policy decisions, taking into account what the intelligence says. >> all right. john brennan, thank you, as always, sir, for bringing the information. coming up, folks. he was brutally attacked on january 6th. but according to trump's justice department, he is, quote, no longer a victim. retired retired d.c. police officer michael fanone joins us at the table next. you're watching the weekend. >> i had eight utis in one year.

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eli lilly. see if you qualify at koco-tv. >> well, it was a mix of emotions, frankly. it was everything from disappointment to sadness. the key question here is who does the president appoint in the place of the igs that he's removed? we are the we're so-called watchdogs inside the federal agency. so does he appoint true watchdogs or does he appoint lapdogs? >> that's one of the inspectors general trump just fired. talking to nbc news less than a week into his second term, trump has tried to completely redefine

accountability for him and for his lackeys. deceit in the sacking of independent igs. and you certainly see it in the blanket pardons for january 6th insurrectionists. last night, trump gave oath keepers founder stewart rhodes, whose sentence he just commuted a seat of honor at his nevada rally. joining us now, michael fanone, is a retired dc police officer who was attacked on january 6th. insurrection and one cop's battle for america's soul. >> welcome, michael. >> i feel the need to clap and just and just curtsey. >> when i look. i think the poison that's been put into the public space about january 6th just undermines exactly what you and your fellow officers did. both dc and capitol hill police to hold the line. we talk a lot about that. you know, that that blue line, that that line, that

in the wall, quite honestly, that men and women in military and police service stand on to defend and protect for you. it's more than that because it's the system now being used to go after you, to go after your family in a way that stirs up a lot of noise and ugliness out there. but your voice is still resilient in this, and that's important. and i just wanted to share that. as someone who's watched this unfold since january 6th and watched you consistently hold that line, but we know there's a toll. there's this tough how how are you holding that line for your family right now in the face of efforts of this administration saying you're not the victim, the guy we just saw that the president gave a seat of honor to is the victim, the guy who

fomented insurrection, the guy who brought people to this capitol to attack you and others. those are the victims, men like yourself who stood in the line, who suffered real bodily and mental harm, somehow deserve it, because that's essentially what the president just said, correct? >> yeah. >> i mean, listen, i'm just focused on, like you said, protecting myself and protecting my family. i knew that if donald trump became president again, that this would happen. i mean, he's promised these pardons ever since he announced his candidacy in waco, texas, the scene of a violent confrontation between members of the american extremist movement and law enforcement, which cost several law enforcement officers their lives. that was a clear message to the american people, not a dog whistle. there's not a lot in waco, texas. i've been there. he went there to send that message. and day one, he promised these pardons. that

being said, now, for me, it's all about protecting myself, my family members who have been victimized by trump supporters ever since i testified before congress in the select committee hearing. you know, my mother has suffered some vile and vicious attacks. she's been swatted. she's had harassing phone calls. she's had individuals or an individual throw a brick at her house in the middle of the night. and recently she had an individual pull up in a pickup truck get out, scream at her that i was a traitor, and throw a bag of feces at her. you know, this is a 76 year old woman who lives alone, who dedicated her entire life to working as a child advocate within the criminal justice system. she's a churchgoing woman. she goes to church almost seven days a week. but these are the types of people that support donald trump. and donald trump wanted this. donald trump wants these

people out. he wants them to commit these heinous acts to silence anyone who would stand up against him to wear us down. it's not going to happen with me. >> not to wear. >> to wear us down. i mean, i the moment he actually signed the pardon, i said, oh, he just let his little militia out of jail. and then i had i had state representatives elected across the country in state legislative offices, say that's exactly what he did. and if this were in a south american country or a country that we, we say was run by a dictatorship, that's how we would be talking about it, right? i the, the dc police officers are the reason that the capitol was not overrun that day. and i think that is very important to say, the capitol hill police officers on their own, they could not have held the line. the washington dc, the metropolitan dc police officers under the leadership of chief conte at the time, you all are the reason that the capitol was not overrun, that members of congress were not kidnaped. i

just i it is like an existential like out of body experience for me to see republicans actively working against members of law enforcement, to have the republican president not standing with. >> the blue. >> the blue. i don't that for me, i'm just kind of like, i never thought that i would see that in my in my little young lifetime. is it an out-of-body experience for you? >> no. not really. i mean, listen, if there's one lesson i learned from two decades in the police department is that politicians and parties, they don't support police officers, political parties support public safety. they don't concern themselves with with the individual officers. they're not there now. there are, you know, individual members who, you know, on their own might take. they may be, you know, more interested in the well-being of individual police officers. but as a whole, you know, these

parties are only looking for their political gain. political gain is found in public safety. you know, the republican party has twisted itself in knots trying to find ways to justify these pardons, to justify the violence at the capitol on january 6th. they've embraced a number of conspiracy theories. everything from, you know, it was orchestrated by the fbi, which is a lie that there were members of antifa in attendance, which is a lie. you know, at the end of the day, this was donald trump's supporters. donald trump sent them to the capitol. his surrogates told them to fight like hell. and that's exactly what they did. they fought like hell. they beat police officers, myself included. and they were, you know, many of which pled guilty. i mean, look at the individuals that assaulted me. daniel rodriguez drove a stun gun into my neck numerous times, pled guilty, accepted responsibility for his actions, sentenced to 12.5 years. kyle young. while i was being

restrained and beaten, lunged at my firearm, tried to remove it from its holster. pled guilty. sentenced to, i believe, seven years in prison. albuquerque, cosper head. if you watch my body worn camera footage, this is the guy that put me in a chokehold, pulled me off the police line and screamed out i got one, pulled me further into the mob where i could be assaulted, tased, beaten, restrained, and then finally, oh, excuse me, thomas sebek ripped my badge and my radio from my chest, all while i was being beaten and restrained, you know, pled guilty, accepted responsibility for his actions. now, many of them have, you know, made statements to the contrary after they were pardoned. but, you know, here we are. these are violent individuals. and make no mistake about it, this idea that the police officers instigated this behavior, i was no threat to those individuals. i was helpless, i was out in the

crowd. i was being restrained. i was not an impediment to these individuals. they could have bypassed me and carried on with their, you know, vicious attack on law enforcement. but they chose to stop and beat me because of the position that i was in at the time. these are not individuals that were instigated by law enforcement. these are violent criminals who should be in prison. >> we have a lot more questions for officer fanone. we're going to continue this conversation after a quick break. this is the weekend on msnbc. >> muscle cramps were keeping me up at night. so then i tried slimming the magnesium plus calcium supplement that helps relax tense muscles so i can rest comfortably and slow. meg tablets have a slow release formula that's gentle on my stomach. that's why i use slow meg. >> stay tuned. >> to get this knife set free from granite. stone. does cooking with your old pans feel like a kitchen battle? scratches here, stuck on food, bare and burnt on debris everywhere. you

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i don't ever see anyone coming out to maintenance anything, so it's very scary for me because i have everything i love in this home. so, we've now implemented drone technology. how is that safe for me? it enhances the inspection, so it allows us to see things faster. your safety is the most important, earts. so it allows us to see things faster. i mean, it's worrisome. [dog barks]

to 50 years with my best friend. [sfx: gasp] [sfx: spilling sound] nooo... aya... quick, the quicker picker upper! bounty absorbs spills like a sponge. and is 2x more absorbent so you can use less. bounty, the quicker picker upper. product, motor vehicle accident or medical malpractice caused a catastrophic injury, contact kline. inspector. >> officer michael fanone is back with us. officer fanone, help me understand something. you spoke with our colleague ryan riley on thursday. he reported that you spoke with victim services advocates at doj about trying to get restraining orders against some of these january 6th rioters who nearly killed you. as you just detailed, they refused to give you info on the assailants that would help you secure those restraining orders, telling you

from the perspective of the new doj quote, you are no longer a victim. how then are you supposed to protect your family if you don't have access to that vital information? >> yeah, i mean, it it alleviates the possibility of obtaining protective orders. the way a protective order works is that, you know, once you've applied for it, you're given a two week period. during that time, law enforcement has to make attempts to serve the individuals. these guys were scattered, like sticks to the wind when they were released from the bureau of prisons. and so, you know, me being able to obtain that information on my own is virtually impossible. and so i look to the department of justice, who, you know, prior to trump taking office, had considered me a victim for purposes of, you know, these criminal prosecutions. and literally 9 a.m. the morning after trump's inauguration, i was told that because the

criminal convictions had been vacated and that, you know, there was no pending cases, that i was not entitled to addresses or other pertinent information that i could use to obtain those protective orders. and so obtaining them now is an impossibility. i mean, really, to be honest with you, the only alternative i have is relocating myself and my family members and buying a gun. >> that just let that. >> sit, let that sit, that is. and some might say, oh, well, that's not the only recourse you have. but to be clear, what what are your other options except to relocate and to protect yourself. and the government, it seems, has left you out to dry. i just i wonder have have democratic or not even even republicans because, i mean, lindsey graham was just on meet the press and he said he believes pardoning the most violent offenders from january 6th was a mistake. and it's like, thank you, senator graham.

i wonder if he told the president and like, thank you for about almost a week later, weighing in here. very important, which i think it's important that he said it. but like actions do speak louder than words. have members of congress reached out to you? have people offered your support? because i think for people to hear you say, you feel like your only option is to relocate your family and buy a gun, that is the reality of your current situation. who is reaching out to offer any additional assistance, if you will? >> no one. i mean, all of my family is somebody's constituent, and no members of congress have contacted me offering any type of support. no one in the government, no one in law enforcement. and when you talk about law enforcement, you know, in the past, you know, i always told my family members that they need to report these incidents. and unfortunately, law enforcement has just proven to be feckless in its ability to protect us, to do anything preemptively and or dedicate any

type of resources to despite the level of threats, the vicious viciousness and vile threats that we've received, they're completely indifferent. and so, you know, my mother, myself included, have just stopped reporting it because there's nothing that they're going to do to protect us. we are on our own. it's up to us to protect ourselves. >> yeah. and that's just that's just not how that should be. i mean, but this is the new landscape that donald trump's doj is going to have on, on these processes where they'll just decide, well, you don't need that protection. it's what we were talking about with director brennan just pulling pulling his security clearances. >> yeah. no, i'm not alone in this. >> right. >> you're not. there are hundreds of americans who have done similar things to what i've done and spoken out, who are experiencing the exact same level of threats and who have no

protection other than to protect themselves. >> the one one little piece that, you know, out of all of these pardons, pam hemphill, who was a january 6th rioter, rejected donald trump's pardon. and on katie fang's show, she had this to say. >> it would be a slap in the face to the capitol police officers. the rule of law, you know, to our nation. i pleaded guilty because i was guilty. it would help their narrative that it was a peaceful protest that day. no, it was not a peaceful protest. it was an insurrection. >> that little nugget of truth from someone who was there, who is holding on to her own accountability. we obviously wish more would do that. and did that. but for me at least, that's that's enough of an

opening to continue to pursue the things that are important about what happened on january 6th, which is why what you're doing by being here, your voice, the voice of so many of your other fellow officers, many of whom were out this week, sort of reminding americans about that. when you hear a j6 rioter say something like that, what what does what do you think when you hear those words? >> i mean, honestly, it has absolutely no effect on me. you know, at the end of the day, it's i'm an eternal pessimist. it's one out of 1500 plus, right? i mean, i appreciate the fact that there's someone out there in this group of convicted criminals that has some level of integrity and honor. that being said, you know, there's many, many more who committed incredibly violent acts that day who are doing nothing than other than celebrating these pardons.

and it's serving to embolden not only them, but many others to commit more acts of violence in the future, knowing full well that donald trump will protect them and issue further pardons as long as the crimes are committed on his behalf. >> michael fanone, it is such a pleasure to have you on the show. thank you so much for being with us. democratic national committee. they are less than a week away from electing their new chair and the chair of minnesota's democratic-farmer-labor party. ken martin joins us after this to make his case for that role. to make his case for that role. we're watching the at harbor freight, we design and test our own tools and sell them directly to you. no middleman. just quality tools you can trust at prices you'll love. whatever you do, do it for less at harbor freight. ♪♪ (children speaking)

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party's voting members. chair candidates need at least 225 to win, and there are about 448 members, so this number is significant. martin believes the path forward for the democrats after 2024 is, quote, getting the dnc out of d.c, recommitting to building from the grassroots, and a strategy targeting all 57 states and territories. and ken martin joins us now. can i just say, mr. chairman, i have i look forward to speaking with you, with my colleagues on thursday at the chair's forum. but i have heard from some of the opponent, your opponents in this race who say they don't believe you have 200 endorsers and they think you all are inflating the numbers. what's your response to that? >> well, look, i've been overwhelmed by the support throughout this entire race, right? and we've rolled out all of our endorsements, at least the ones that wanted to be listed publicly online. my next closest competitor isn't even close at this point, to be honest with you. but that's neither here nor there. you know, my old boss, paul wellstone, used to say that you

you run like you're 20 points behind, even if you're 20 points ahead. we're going to run through the tape. we're going to continue to have great conversations all the way through this. and, you know, we'll we'll know soon enough in less than a week. and whether or not what i said was accurate. i will tell you, we've doubled, tripled, quadrupled, checked the numbers. we've been overwhelmed with the amount of support. look, you know, i've led our state parties these last eight years throughout the country. i have relationships in all 57 of our state parties, deep relationships that go way back. and, you know, i've been again, really overwhelmed by the support coming from all of our state delegations. we're the only ones, by the way, my campaign that have rolled out multiple full delegations of state parties at this point. and so no other opponent of mine in this race can say that. and so, look, you know, i don't want to get into the nitty gritty of all this. i'm not running against them any more than they're running against me. i'm running for this position. i have a vision that's certainly connecting with the voters in this race. and i feel good about

it. >> mr. chairman, as nice to have you on. i just want to know why you what makes you so different from everybody else in terms of what you're going to bring to a dnc that right now is, on its best day, a dysfunctional hot mess. and this messaging and this organization, how do you see yourself bringing that together when you've got so many different coalitions who think what happened in this last election goes in one direction versus the direction some other sees it? so you've got this, these split screen images and views of the 2024 cycle from top to bottom. how do you correct for that. >> well, look, i mean, i think i'm not here to win the argument. i'm here to win elections. and at the core of it and you understand this, michael, the role of a political party at any level, whether it's national, state, local, party,

is, is to win, to build the infrastructure, to not only win the upcoming election, but to build long term power. this is the thing that the conservative movement has understood in this country for the last 30 to 40 years is that to build power, you have to contest races up and down the ballot. you can't just focus on seven battleground states. you actually have to build a party to win and to build a party to last. and that means making sure that you are organized throughout this country. why me? well, look, in 2010, when i took over the minnesota dfl, we had just come off the worst election in over 50 years. the morale was low, the finger pointing was high. our stakeholders were leaving our party from labor groups to other organizations to donors. and it's very akin to right now, right, with all the finger pointing and the recriminations right now, what it requires is someone who's already done this, who brought people back into the fold, who wrote a long term vision, who gave people a sense again, on how we could win. and

you know what? in my time now, over the last 14 years, we haven't lost a statewide election here. and that's because we built the infrastructure in a very purple state to help our candidates win up and down the ballot. we can scale that up nationally and bring that same model to the dnc. you know, look, it does us no good to come in second. and losing by less does not help improve people's lives. i'm the only person in this race has a track record of actually building a party to win, and building a party to last. >> there's vision, there's organization, there's fundraising for democratic donors who are disenchanted at this point. how do you bring them back to the table? >> well, just like i said, you build a plan, a long term plan that gives them a sense of the arc of this work. you know, wayne gretzky, the great one hockey player. i have to use a hockey analogy, since i'm from minnesota, said that you have to skate to where the puck will be, not where the puck is. and i think for donors and other stakeholders in their in this party, they're sick and tired of just this very myopic lens on

how we do this work right in 2030. the brennan center just did a report on this in 2030. almost all the population shift is in the south, the five fastest growing states in the country are tennessee, north carolina, south carolina, georgia, texas, florida, right. all southern states, meaning that we're going to lose power in the midwest. we're going to lose power in the northeast. and so we have to start preparing to meet that moment right now, laying down a foundation of support, starting to organize in those states. so we're prepared to meet the shifting landscape. this is what i'm talking about. the problem for our party writ large for many years has been we're just myopically focused on one election cycle. who's building for the next ten years, who's looking at those opportunities that are emerging and who's starting to lay down a plan to actually address that? that's what the dnc has to do. candidates come and go, but the party remains. the party has to be focused on the future and how we're going to get there. and so that's for me. you know, we've done that, right. i was 725,000

in debt when i took over the minnesota dfl. our donors didn't want anything to do with it. but why did they come back to the table? because they saw that i had a plan to win and they bought into it, literally bought into it. and we'll do the same at the dnc. >> you were asked, should south carolina democrats keep the first in the nation primary, some version of that question and there are candidates are split on this. you specifically said this is from the post and courier and south carolina post and courier, the chair, whoever that is, whoever that is up here should not be guiding that conversation, should not come with that outcome already in mind, should not put their thumb on the scale for a certain state or a certain region or a certain candidate, martin said, concluding, we have to be above reproach. so what will be your. because the dnc, the democratic national committee, has committed to every four years taking another look at the calendar, what is going to be your approach there in terms of

leading? because i agree with no fingers on the scale, but the chair must weigh in in some way, shape or form. >> well, here's what i would say. i was a member of the rules and bylaws committee. i proudly voted to support the last calendar that president biden asked us to support. but let me say this. i really believe firmly that this is not a decision of one person. the chair is one person of many stakeholders that should have input into what the calendar looks like and if f as to whetht the rules and bylaws committee even takes this up again. of course our charter says we need to review the calendar, but there's nothing that suggests we need to change it. but what i would say is, if the rules and bylaws committee decides that we are going to change, that, the process has to be transparent and open. every state that wants to have a chance to make a bid should be able to do that. and then what i think we need to do is have a principle that guides this process, meaning that it whatever calendar we put forward should be rigorous, efficient

and fair. it should battle test our nominees so that we can win the election. no person should have an outcome determined already. we should have an open conversation to make sure that whatever calendar we put forward helps us win. and certainly the chair should not have their their thumb on the scale in any way, shape or form to benefit a certain region, to benefit a certain candidate, to benefit a certain state. i think we need an open conversation, and i've been very clear on that. and unlike some of my opponents in this race, i'm not making promises on any of the calendar because it's not the decision of the chair, it's the decision of our body. and if they choose to do that, we will have a fair conversation. >> it's an important conversation, mr. chairman. i had it inside the party back in 2009, looking at the 2012 cycle and anything you can do to shift the landscape to your point about making it more rigorous for your nominee, but keeping in mind it's not just the person running for president, but everybody else down ballot as well, that that rigorous test

has to apply to those races as well. ken martin, thank you so much for your time and good luck on the race. don't forget, this week you'll be able to hear from even more of the top candidates for the dnc leadership roles. simone, our good friend and colleague, along with our other colleagues jen psaki, jonathan capehart, and luke russert are hosting a virtual forum at georgetown university mama mater on thursday. just scan that qr code, folks. it's going to be a humdinger, trust me. okay, that's an old school word. y'all don't know what that is. go look it up. we'll be right back here on the weekend. >> safelite repair. >> perfecting your swing is hard. >> nice shot. dad. oh. >> safelite replace. >> but replacing your windshield doesn't have to be. go to safelite. com and we can come to you. >> sick. >> our highly trained techs can replace your windshield where

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tingling. >> for her. >> should we. >> experience the thrill of bringing them together? say more than i love you. say i want you with me, yours and mine. >> hey, guys. so before we get out of here, i wanted to share with everybody, sort of going back to director brennan's conversation and the impact that the decisions by the state department and the administration over cutting off foreign aid. a buddy of mine, andrew, sent me a note saying he's hearing from several ngos having emergency board meetings today as their state department grants have been cut off. several organizations have bills that accrue. so the no notice that got no notice this was going to happen is making it a cash management headache for some and extensive existential risk for others. so the work that a lot of these ngos are doing out there to sort of holding that front line in the

nation's foreign policy space has now been disrupted in such a way that you're going to see some real, some real problems. i think, coming online in the next few weeks and months. >> some of the organizations that help vaccinate people, some of the organizations that give like aid, food, water, all the things also, not to mention domestically, apparently getting rid of die means getting rid of history of the tuskegee airmen in the air force. i just can't. alicia. i'm undone. >> this is what happens when you have unchecked presidential power and a system that never imagined someone like donald trump. and we are all watching and waiting to see who is going to hold the line and what the remedy is coming up. coming up next on velshi, ali will be joined by mississippi congressman bennie thompson. they're going to continue the conversation we've been having this morning about trump's retribution tour should not go anywhere. >> lumify. >> it's kind of amazing. wow. my go to is lumify eye drops lumify

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the same day your loan is on deck. >> alicia and everyone at home. i just want people to know that michael steele just asked this. he get to close the show today and i said no, it says simone. that does it for the weekend, folks. we're going to see you back here next saturday, 8 a.m. eastern. be sure to follow us on social media at the weekend, msnbc. velshi will continue our coverage right now. good morning. ali. >> you know, i. >> got to say, michael's getting the last word. >> in here. >> i get it's like. >> even. >> i sometimes even have this argument with myself. >> and i'm the only one in. >> the studio. >> we had an audio issue at the top,