line. >> i will comply with all the ethical guidelines. >> that's not the question you and i you have said. >> you're asking me, senator. you're asking me not to sue a vaccine of pharmaceutical companies. yeah. you are. that's exactly what you're doing. >> look. >> no one should be fooled here. >> i. >> as secretary. >> of hhs, robert kennedy, will have the power to undercut vaccines and vaccine manufacturing across our country. and for all of his talk about follow the science and his promise that he won't interfere with those of us who want to vaccinate his kids, the bottom line is the same kennedy can kill off access to vaccines and make millions of dollars while he does it. kids might die, but robert kennedy can keep cash. >> in. >> senator, i support vaccines. i support the childhood

schedule. i will do that. the only thing i want is good science. and that's it. >> how about beyonce? you won't make money off what you do as secretary of hhs. >> before we go to. senator tillis. >> i think. >> it would. >> be important for. >> me to make it. >> very clear that. >> mr. kennedy has. >> gone through the same office. >> of government ethics. process as. >> every single. other nominee in the finance committee this year. and in. previous administrations. in addition to listing his assets, including. the items that you've. >> identified. >> he has signed an. >> ethics letter that has been reviewed by the office of government ethics concerning any possible conflict in light of its functions and the. nominee's proposed duties. and we have a letter from the office of government ethics that he. has complied completely with all applicable laws and regulations governing conflicts of interest. >> mr. chairman, point of information here. have we had a

single nominee come through who has made $2.5 million off suing one of the entities that it would be regulating and plans to keep getting a take of every lawsuit in the future? have we had that before? >> i haven't reviewed the past. >> documentation of every other nominees. financial interests, and. >> so no. >> but i know that every single time we get a nominee, their financial interests are attacked. that's why we have the office of government ethics. that's why they've reviewed everything that's in his record, and that's why. >> he has. even i think. >> and. >> i don't. >> know. >> that. >> i want to. >> ask him to get into it. >> but he has. >> listed his assets. >> and has. >> gone through a discussion of the responsibilities under the our ethics laws and has complied with all of those requirements. senator tillis. >> thank you, mr. chairman. >> mr. kennedy, how is. >> your morning going. so far, so good. good.

>> you came prepared, and i'm glad. >> that you did. >> i you, i believe, addressed to my satisfaction a question about title ten. >> and. >> the president's priority with respect to planned parenthood. can you just. >> affirm that that you are. >> 100% behind the. president's policy on title. ten and the. >> implementation 100% behind it? >> thank you. >> you know, you it's amazing to me that. people well, first. >> off, you need to. >> understand you're there. i was in a judiciary. >> hearing this morning. >> it's very clear. >> to me that some of these nominations are going to be shirts and skins. >> so no matter what you answer in the affirmative, they're going to ask you one more question. >> so that you won't be able to. >> answer in the affirmative. that's just the way the game gets played when we have. >> nominee nominees. >> like yourself. so i think you're you're handling yourself. >> well. >> i. got a. >> real quick question for you. are you a conspiracy theorist? >> that is a pejorative, senator. that's applied to me

mainly to keep me from asking difficult questions of powerful interests. i was told that i was a conspiracy theorist. that label was applied to me because i said that the vaccines, the covid vaccine, didn't prevent transmission and it wouldn't prevent infection. when the government was telling people, americans that it would. i was saying that because i was looking at the monkey studies in may of 2020, i was called a conspiracy. now everybody admits it. i was called a conspiracy theorist because i said red dye caused cancer. and now fda has acknowledged that and banned it. i was called a conspiracy theorist because i said, laura, i lowered iq. last week, jama published a review of 87 studies saying that there's a direct inverse correlation between iq loss. all right. so i'm going to assume i can go on for about a

week. >> is there any one of them that. >> you can say you got me. >> that really was a. conspiracy theory? or are you. >> in a position. >> to submit for the record? >> i think it'd just be. >> helpful for every one. >> of these narratives for you to submit that. maybe for the record. >> you said. >> something about snap lunch. i was in the state house in north carolina before i came here, and anytime i'd go visit an elementary school, the first thing i would do is go to the trash cans in the cafeteria. and what we have. now are kids that. >> are not. >> eating the food, because the dictates of the federal government have made it something that they don't. >> want. >> but they say, well, it's a healthy alternative and it has processed materials in it, and it's not particularly attractive to them. so they throw it away, trash cans full of food that these kids didn't need. so then what do they do? they go eat snacks or they go eat a shirt, or they drink a sugar drink. the snap program. everything you've said about the snap program, i agree with, i think that we should be very, very strict about that and it's going to make some people uncomfortable. and the food manufacturing

segment produce healthy foods that we can put in the. snap program. that's the way to address it. but we also need to look at the school health program. i was pta president 2122 years ago at my daughter's high school. and i feel like we've we've got these kids that need. >> help and we've. >> got to guide them through a process. many of them are probably on medicaid and medicaid is fell on them. everybody here says medicaid is sacrosanct. nobody's admitted that medicaid is not producing positive health outcomes. is that your problem with medicaid right now and the program are the outcomes. >> is the outcomes. we're spending $900 billion and our people are getting sicker every single year. >> yeah. >> so president trump wants people to have it. americans have high quality insurance. >> anybody who's building a case for the status quo of medicaid is, by extension, saying that they're happy with the outcomes. i think it's unacceptable. i do have a question for you on project warp speed. we supported

the cares act. we had 97 people in the us senate vote for it. everybody here, there was only one member of congress that voted against it, i believe. and project warp speed had cdc, fda, nih, and barda very much in the mix. now, some people think that you're going to come in here and insert yourself into those agencies in a way that's never been done before. let's say that they're they're a part of a future project, warp speed. is that your intent to go in and do something that's that's never been done before? based on my staff's research, and insert yourself in a discussion that the scientists are dealing with in those different agencies. >> no, senator, i what i want to do is i'm not a scientist. i want to empower scientists. i want to make sure that science is unobstructed by vested or economic interests. >> that's good. >> i got that culture. and i'll just say about operation warp speed, it was an extraordinary accomplishment. should demonstration of leadership by

president trump when he when he promoted operation warp speed, he was looking at all of the different remedies, including vaccines. >> therapeutics. >> therapeutics, ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, gemcitabine, even chlorine dioxide all. and he was not looking at shutting down our country for the year, forcing people to wear masks for a year or forcing all social distancing that did not have any scientific basis, which doctor fauci has now acknowledged. he said we took it out of thin air. oh, but my but all of those changed during the biden administration, and it became very narrowly focused. we ended up with the worst, the highest death count of any country in the world. >> mr. chair, if i can just ask one final question, and i think it's a one word answer, i've heard a lot of people complaining about health care delivery, medicaid. on the other side of the dais here, who's

been responsible for health care policies over the last four years. >> the biden. >> i mean, the president, the biden. okay. so that i'd like to have heard more of those and oversight hearings over the last four years. i haven't, but i'm glad that there's an acknowledgment that you're inheriting a problem that needs to be fixed. thank you. >> thank you. senator. >> senator sanders. >> thank you, mr. chairman. mr. kennedy. >> thanks for being with us. >> i very. >> much like. >> the slogan that you coined make america. >> healthy again. >> and i. strongly agree with that. >> effort. despite spending, as. >> you indicated, 2 or 3 times. >> as much. >> per capita on health. >> care is other nations. >> we have. >> 85 million people who are. >> uninsured or underinsured. >> we have all kinds of chronic illnesses. >> our life expectancy. >> is lower. >> than other countries. and for working class people in this. >> country. >> they are.

>> living 6. >> or 7 years shorter. >> lives than the top 1%. we got a problem. okay. and i'm going to. >> suggest some ideas that i think can. >> remedy that. >> last year, the insurance industry in this country made over $70. >> billion, while. >> at the same time 85 million americans are uninsured or underinsured. >> do you. agree with. >> me that the united states should join every other major country on earth and guarantee health. >> care to. >> all people as. >> a. >> human right? yes. >> no. >> i senator, i can't give you a yes or no answer to that question. health care. >> human rights. is health care a human. >> right in the way that free speech is a human right? yeah, i would say it's different because if we're free, speech doesn't cost anybody anything. but in health care, if you smoke

cigarettes for 20 years and you get cancer, do you? you are now taking from the pool and so are you. guaranteed the same, right? or is there also a duty? >> i'm sorry. i i'd love to talk for an hour with you. we got a few minutes left here. all right. every other country on earth says health care. >> whether you're poor. >> or rich, young or old. >> to human rights. >> i'm not hearing. you say that. all right, you've talked about the drug companies, and maybe we agree on this one. as you. >> all know. >> despite the drug companies making over $100 billion in profits, paying ceos. outrageous compensation packages, we in. some cases pay ten times more for the same drug. will you support legislation that i will introduce which says that in america, we should not be paying a. >> nickel. >> more for prescription drugs than people around the rest of the world? yes. no. >> it to equalize it, not. >> to equalize it. that we should not be paying more than.

>> other countries. >> for the same damn drug. >> president trump has asked me. in fact, i had a meeting with president trump a week ago where we showed him the charts. he knows the charts. i questioned paying ten times more from europe. >> that's right. and are you going to commit to us that you will end that absurdity? >> i think in principle we can we should we should end that disparity. good. okay. >> that's great. all right. i happen to. >> believe that. >> climate change is real. it's an existential threat. and it is a health care issue. donald trump thinks that it is a hoax originating in china. the question is, in your judgment, is climate change a hoax or is it real, causing devastating problems? >> president trump and i, from the beginning, from our first meeting, agreed to disagree on that issue. i believe climate change is essential. my job is

to make americans healthy again. you believe that? you think. >> that you disagree. with trump. you don't think climate change is a hoax is what i'm hearing. >> my job here is to just ask you. >> mr. kenny, not a. >> trick question. i answered your question, senator. >> okay. you disagree. >> with the. >> president on that? >> i answered your question. >> okay. >> i want. >> to pick up on a point that senator hassan made. look, there. >> is no. >> question that abortion. >> is a divisive issue in this country. >> i would. >> say a majority of the people are pro-choice. there's a. >> strong. >> minority who are pro-life. a year. >> and a. >> half ago, you. >> went to new hampshire running for president, gave. >> a speech, and you talked. >> about government. >> should not tell a. >> woman what. >> she can do with her own body. that's her choice. >> now. >> i think everybody. >> on that. >> side is pro-life. >> i think everybody here is pro-choice. i have never seen any major. politician flip on.

>> that issue quite as quickly as you did when trump asked you to become hhs secretary. tell me why you think people should have. confidence in your. consistency and in your. >> word when. >> you really made a major u-turn on an issue of that importance in such a short time? >> senator, i believe, and i've always believed that every abortion is a tragedy. >> but you told the people. >> in new hampshire. >> that it was. >> their right. >> all right. >> let me do it. >> last question. >> because i'm running out of time. >> i think the gist of what you were trying. >> to say. >> today is. >> you really pro-vaccine. >> you want to ask. >> questions. >> you have started. >> a group. >> called the. >> children's health defense. you're the. originator right. >> now. as i. >> understand it, on their. >> website, they are selling what's called onesies. >> these are little things clothing. >> for babies. >> one of them.

>> is titled. >> unvaxed unafraid. >> next one in the sold for. >> 26 bucks a piece, by the way. >> next one. >> is no vax. no problem. >> now you're. coming before. >> this committee. >> and you say you are pro-vaccine just want. >> to ask some. >> questions, and yet your. >> organization is making money selling. >> a child's. >> product to. >> parents for 26. >> bucks, which. >> casts fundamental. >> doubt on on the usefulness of vaccines. can you tell us now that you will, now that you. >> are pro-vaccine, that you're going to have your organization. take these products. >> off the market? >> senator, i have no power over that organization. i'm not part of it. i resigned from the board. i was just a few months ago. >> you founded that. you certainly have power. >> you can make that call. >> are you supportive of this? >> i've had nothing to do with. are you supportive. >> of. >> these onesies? i'm supportive of vaccines. are you supportive. >> of these? >> this clothing, which is.

>> militantly anti-vaccine. >> i am supportive of vaccines. i will i want good science and i want to protect. but you will. >> not tell the. >> organization you founded not to continue selling that product. >> thank you, mr. chairman. senator blackburn. >> thank you so much, mr. >> chairman, and. >> thank you. >> so. >> much for being. >> with us today. and i have no. >> doubt that you will be confirmed. >> and you are going. to do. such a. solid job for the people of this country. >> and i. >> do have several. >> issues i wanted. >> to talk with. >> you about. >> and didn't have time to cover them. >> all when we. >> met prior to the meeting, but. >> rural health care. >> is very important to me and the people of tennessee. 78 of our 95 counties are rural counties. now. >> over the last. >> few years. >> we've seen. >> hospital closures. >> so we have focused on access

in rural areas. and my. rural health agenda, which is bipartisan, focuses on innovation. telehealth access points. it focuses. on work shortages. and also, senator warner and i have together focused on making certain that we address the area wage index and do that fairly for our citizens that are in rural communities. so i would like a commitment from you. that when confirmed, you and. your cms administrator will work with us to make certain that the area wage index. is balanced and that it is. fair to rural areas. >> are you. >> senator, both doctor oz and myself recognize that rural health care is in crisis in this country, and that is catastrophic for our entire country. and i talked a little bit about my commitment to rural health earlier in this hearing.

the regional price points, as you know, are set by congress and not by hhs. i will certainly, and i know doctor oz will certainly work with you to make them sensible. >> we look forward. >> to that. >> and also. >> you and i, before. you came forward as the secretary, the. nominee we. >> had talked. >> in years past about overmedicating youth and. concerns over that. and i was looking at a report from tenncare, which is our medicaid program in tennessee. and i was concerned when i. saw a number. that tenncare had spent $90 million. >> in 2024 alone on adhd. this was. 417,000 of. >> our children and $90 million. to me, that is heartbreaking.

what is happening there? so how will you prioritize oversight of. prescribing practices. while promoting alternative. >> solutions such as. >> counseling, behavioral therapies, community. based interventions. >> for. >> our youth? >> exactly. and that's the solution. 15% of american youth are now on adderall or some other adhd medication. even higher percentages are on ssris and benzos. we are not just over medicating our children, we're overmedicating our entire population. half the pharmaceutical drugs on earth are now sold here. 70% of the profits from pharmaceutical companies are from the united states, even though we only have 4.2% of the world's population. not only that, but a recent study by cochrane collaboration founder peter gosh found that

pharmaceutical drugs are the third largest cause of death in our country after heart attacks and cancers. oh, they're not making us healthier. we need community health initiatives. we need access to treatment. we need exercise. we need better food. >> okay. let me. talk to you about one of those access points in treatment. and this highlights a problem we have in the federal medicaid law. since medicaid's enactment, states have been prohibited from using medicaid funds for care provided by institutions for mental disease. we refer to them as imds. these are psychiatric hospitals, residential treatment facilities with more than 16 beds. this is a discriminatory exclusion and it denies payment for medically necessary. care based on the illness that is being treated, and it has perpetuated unequal coverage in

mental health care. so if. >> you're confirmed. >> when you're confirmed, will you commit to working with me on repealing this discriminatory exclusion and ensuring equal access to mental. >> health care. >> for medicaid beneficiaries? >> yes, senator. >> thank you so much. i've got a question on pbm reform, one on artificial intelligence in health care. in the interest of time, i will yield back. i look forward to seeing you. help make us healthy again. >> thank you senator. >> i think it's bad enough. >> senator lujan. excuse me just. >> i made a mistake. >> it's senator cantwell. >> thank you so much. thank you, mr. chairman. and just

congratulations on your nomination, mr. kennedy. and i've been absent only because i've been in another hearing with the nominee to be the commerce secretary. so i will review everything that you've said today. >> and. >> and look at that diligently. but one of the things that i wanted to discuss with. >> you is i represent. >> a very big. innovation state. >> and innovation. >> in healthcare. >> specifically innovation like. >> nih funding to the fred hutch cancer. center that helped develop. >> the hpv. >> vaccine. >> which has. >> the. >> potential to eliminate over. >> 95% of cervical cancer. >> nih also funds. >> a lot of jobs. >> and grants nearly. 11,000 people. >> in the. >> state of. >> washington. >> and over 1.2. >> $1.2 billion worth of grants. so while i agree with you on healthy foods, i. definitely am troubled by the medical. >> research side of innovation and some of the things. >> that you have said. >> in fact, this. >> issue about. >> laying off 600 employees.

>> at nih or. >> giving the fact that. >> to, quote. >> give infectious. disease a break for eight years. >> so i. >> we've had. >> a chance to talk about this a little. >> bit. >> but the most. >> striking example. >> of. >> this is when covid hit and we were the first in the nation, we had the first case and it really was the. fast response. by the university of washington that really helped. >> save lives. >> so i just want to know that. are you. >> aware of. >> how harmful. >> these issues could. >> be for. public health? >> that public. >> health in and of itself could be affected by these kind of anti-science views? >> senator, i have always been a science person, a pro-science person. i believe in evidence based medicine and gold standard science. when i said, and i've explained this before, you came

in at 600 people out of a population, out of a workforce of 91,000 is pretty typical. last year alone, president biden replaced 3000 people at hhs 700 at nih. i want to say this. i said, give infectious disease a break, because that's been the principal preoccupation infectious disease, a chronic disease is 92%, accounts for 92% of deaths in this country, and almost nothing is studied at nih about the etiology of our chronic disease epidemic. but right now, money is going to infectious disease. >> and i get. >> i get your point. >> it's an interesting point. >> the problem is we had to respond. >> and it's actually the gates foundation and a flu cove cohort. >> that figured out what. >> was wrong and that we had an outbreak of covid that was going beyond the very first case. and so we had to build a very fast

response. so i take this to the university of washington has conducted groundbreaking stem cell research on fetal tissue. to me, i know there's probably a lot of people that may not agree with this, but we're making regenerative heart tissue now at the university of washington. so yes or no. do you commit. to protecting stem cell research for scientific agencies? if confirmed. >> i will protect stem cell research. i'm a stem cell research today can be done on umbilical cords, and you don't need fetal tissue. >> you'll protect the laws that are on the books today. and the research. >> that's done. my job is, senator, to enforce the laws. >> okay. so i want to move to pbms because pbms are driving up drug prices. and one of the biggest things that we need to do here, i think, in a new administration, is get a handle on everything that is driving up prices and lower them. the report found that pbms generated

$1.4 billion from spread pricing. that is where they are able to basically set the price, not reimburse pharmacies and then pocket the rest. we've had bipartisan legislation in several different committees now to get at this. what do you think the solution is? >> well, i think one of the really notable achievements of this panel was the pbm legislation that they put together in a bipartisan way. i haven't met a single senator. well, actually, one only, but of the 60 odd senators that i talked to, all of them talked about pbms and how important it was and work. president trump, during his first administration, pushed through a law or pushed a law to give transparency to pbms. it got overruled during the biden administration. luckily, this panel is resuscitating that he's president. trump is absolutely committed to fixing the pbms.

>> my time is running out. so i just want to clarify. you believe that we should pass these laws that now have been proposed in the senate? >> i haven't read the entire law, so i don't know. but i think that we need to reform the pbms. i think we need but somebody rid of all of these vested interests that are draining money from the system. >> okay. somebody suggested, though, that you thought we should you should convene the pbms and talk to them about some sort of self regulation. so i am trying to distinguish between these people who basically are doing illegal activities and ripping off really, they're creating pharmacy deserts in my state. so i'm asking you whether you believe that we have to legislate in this area. >> i again, i'm not being evasive. i just don't know exactly what the law says. i met with the pbms. i met with phrma. my job is to meet with all the stakeholders. i've been meeting with stakeholders for 40 years. people i was suing, people i was. you want to hear from the

other side? well, that doesn't mean i would let the pbms write their own ticket. i think i support the i support the efforts of this committee to come up with bipartisan legislation. president trump wants to get the excess profits away from the pbms and send it back to primary care, to patients in this country and high quality health care. >> i'll ask you, for the record, since my time has expired, to look at the legislation that came out of the commerce committee that defines the legal activities that they are doing to drive up prices and get us an answer. for the record. thank you, mr. chairman. >> in principle, i support that legislation. >> thank you. and let. >> me just. >> tell you. the list as we have to move forward to the ending here. senator lujan will be next, followed by senator. >> marshall, senator warnock, senator. >> smith. >> senator young and senator welch. >> and let me just say again, mr. chairman, this is a matter of such importance. a number of

my colleagues would like a second round, and i think it would be important to offer, say, a modest amount of additional time to get into this on both sides. i know i have some questions, but i want my colleagues to have the opportunity to raise their concerns as well. >> well. >> i've said. >> as i. >> have. >> indicated to you, senator wyden, and i'm not. >> going to do a. >> second round. >> i have. >> been very. generous with. >> the senators. >> i think almost. >> every single senator. has had seven minutes at least. and i. >> will. >> give you. >> a second. as is our. >> practice between the two of us. >> i'll then divide my time up with my colleagues. okay. >> you are welcome to do that. thank you. senator lujan. >> thank you, mr. chairman. >> mr. kennedy, when we met, you stated to me that it is not your goal to take away programs that work for americans. do you stand by that statement? >> yes, senator. >> mr. kennedy, do you know how

many americans rely on medicaid? >> it's about 72 million plus the 7 million kids who are on chips. >> i appreciate that. >> 72 million, yes or no? is it important that expectant mothers and newborns have access to health coverage? and is it important that expectant mothers and newborns have access to health coverage? >> absolutely, senator. >> mr. kennedy, do you know how many babies born in this country are covered through medicaid? do we have a roadmap? >> i would guess i don't know the answer i would guess about. 30 million. >> i have it, mr. >> kennedy, about. >> 41% or 1.4 million babies. births are financed by medicaid, according to the national center for health statistics. yes or no? do you believe that medicaid is a critical program?

>> i believe that medicaid is a critical program, but that it's not working as well as it ought to be. and president trump has asked me to make it to make it work better that most americans are not happy with it, that the premiums are too high, the deductibles are too high, and everybody is getting sicker. too much money is going to the insurance industry. >> i have a series of yes. >> or no questions. >> that are pretty simple, because you heard we're not going to get a second round of questions. i ask for your indulgence to be able to get through them, yes or no. in new mexico, as you know, medicaid is often measured state by state. it might surprise you if you look at some of those surveys in new mexico, the response was 90% of new mexicans on medicaid report satisfaction in getting care, 80% getting specialist care, 85% getting urgent care, 95% ease of filings out. >> of focus. >> not to pick on any one of my

colleagues. but in louisiana, 86% of people on medicaid are satisfied with their interactions. 83% are satisfied getting care, 85% are. satisfied getting specialized care, 82% getting urgent care. i can go on state by state, but we don't have the time today. yes or no? >> do you. >> support cutting medicaid or reducing? and especially in an area where you and i spoke about with the federal investment in medicaid, which is known as fmap, i call it a restroom break. >> president trump has not told me to that he wants to cut medicaid. he's told me to make it better. >> do you support. >> cutting yes or no? let me ask you this way. since you're it's only about. >> i support making it better. senator. >> if. president trump asked you to cut medicaid. >> will you do it? >> well, it's not up to me to cut medicaid. it would be up to congress. >> and i'm going to work. >> i'm going to work. >> kennedy. mr. kennedy, you want to answer? i'll move on. do you know. how many.

>> states will end? >> mr. chairman, if i may pause my time. so i understand. >> that people. >> are getting asked to leave if they. stand up with signs. but there's a lot of other as well. mr. chairman, so it needs to be extended to everyone. as mr. kennedy said, we should respect each other when we have. >> a difference of opinion. >> we're just trying to do our jobs here and trying to ask questions, that's all. and that's all i'm doing with mr. kennedy, folks. so, senator. >> senator. >> you are right. and i ask the. >> audience to please be respectful. >> thank you, mr. chairman. >> i appreciate that very much. mr. kennedy, do you know how many states will end their medicaid expansion if the federal share of medicaid drops? >> well, there's 40 states that have signed onto the expansion. so, you know. >> it's a smaller number. so it's nine states would quickly have to end their expansion because of the laws that they have. that's about 4 million folks across the country. and in new mexico, iowa and idaho. they have triggers that it would

immediately have to go into effect if, in fact, that gets cut. the reason i'm asking those questions is there's been a lot of chatter and conversations around medicaid. now, i agree we can always do better and we must be doing better in america. but medicaid has been shown to improve health outcomes, including mortality, quality of life, and access to preventative care. as well. and there's some areas, mr. kennedy, that you and i touched on specific to native american communities. one of. >> the. >> concerns that i have are these these programs matter to folks. you shared your passion about caring for folks. i believed that passion. my question in this area is, as you know, when folks are doing research and they're going to check to see if. >> medicine works. >> on someone, if they're not included in that trial, it often doesn't help them. that's what all the evidence shows. so what

are you going to do when programs are eliminated to require the inclusion of native americans in clinical trials? when it comes to life saving, saving medicine? >> i'm going to do everything i can to make sure that there's native americans in clinical trials. as i said to you when i visited your office, i spent 20% of my career working on native issues. my family has been deeply involved with them. my family, my father and uncle were big critics of the indian health service. failure to deliver good health results or health care on the on the reservations. i'm going to bring a native and for the first time in history into my central office that all the major decisions in my office will be that he will have. he already interviewed candidate, a very, very good candidate will

have direct impact on all the major offices. and one of my priorities is. >> to improve. i appreciate. >> that i have a follow. >> up in that space. specifically, will. >> you commit. >> to finalizing the congressionally mandated fda guidance to increase clinical trial diversity? >> well, just repeat that again. i'm sorry. >> will you. commit to finalizing the congressionally mandated fda guidance to increase increasing clinical trial diversity? yes, i appreciate that. will you commit to reinstating all of the pages that that were eliminated and people that were fired from this administration that have this responsibility? >> i, i cannot commit to that because i don't know who they are. >> well. >> there's i'll commit to working with you to make sure that those positions are adequately staffed. >> i will follow. >> up in writing in. >> those. >> specific areas. because i think there's some commonality here. but answers matter. and so i'd like to get those as timely as possible. the last thing, mr. chairman, that i'll say is one

of the conversations i had last before this hearing was with the family that i've been working with, to work with my republican colleagues when it comes to autism and federal programs, and making a difference in these families lives and this little girl's life. what i'm asking now, mr. chairman, is unanimous consent to enter into the record. an article from autism speaks titled, quote, do vaccines cause autism? end quote. >> and i'll note that. >> the first. >> sentence states. >> quote, vaccines do not cause autism. end quote. thank you, i yield back. >> without objection. and before we. >> move on, we've had a request from. >> several quarters for a quick. >> restroom break. >> we will take a five minute recess. >> i'm sorry. >> to those remaining 5 or 6 senators who must wait a few minutes, but we will. >> have. >> a quick break. we will be back. >> as soon as we can. >> thank you. thank you.

>> good day. i'm andrea mitchell in washington, where one of president trump's most controversial cabinet picks. >> robert f kennedy jr. >> a vaccine skeptic. >> nominated to. >> lead the health and human services department, just. finished fielding tough questions from democrats about his anti-vaccine. >> record, including. >> a lucrative side. >> business campaigning. >> against vaccines. and democrats. >> are doubtful of his recent conversion to opposing abortion. after being a lifelong. >> advocate for abortion choice. >> there's no vaccine that is, you know, safe and effective. news reports have claimed that i'm anti-vaccine or any industry, i am neither. vaccines play a critical role in health care. all of my kids are vaccinated. >> if confirmed, he. >> would oversee a nearly $2 trillion. budget and 13. critical divisions like the cdc, just as a new strain of the bird flu is being reported. he would also oversee food and drug. safety at the fda and medical.

research at the. >> nih. >> which also runs a full hospital and one of the more heated exchanges, democratic senator michael bennet blasted kennedy for his. >> shifting positions. >> peddling in half truths, peddling in false statements. did you say lyme disease is a highly likely militarily engineered bioweapon? >> i probably did say that. >> did you write in your book? and i it's undeniable that african american african aids is an entirely different disease from western aids. yes or no? >> mr. kennedy? i'm not sure. >> and on the eve of his. >> hearing, his first cousin, president. >> kennedy's daughter. ambassador caroline kennedy, issued a video excoriating his lack of medical background. >> or management experience. while also. >> calling him a predator. >> i've known bobby my whole life. we grew up together. it's no surprise that he keeps birds of prey as pets because bobby himself is a predator.

>> joining us. >> now, nbc's vaughn hillyard on. >> capitol hill, nbc's brandis. zadrozny. well our investigative. >> reporter, doctor. >> kavita patel, a physician and former. >> policy advisor to. >> president obama. and doctor paul offit. director of the vaccine education. >> center at the children's. >> hospital of philadelphia. >> he's also the co-inventor of a rotavirus vaccine. so. >> vaughn, first. >> to you. >> you interviewed. >> rfk jr. in the past, he has indeed flip flop, changed his positions on vaccines and on abortion at this hearing. what stood out to you? >> right. i think that that is where you saw some of these democratic senators, particularly ron wyden and michael bennet and maggie hassan, try to implicate effectively robert f kennedy jr. s level of trust on this committee, and it was ron wyden that specifically asked him, are we to trust that you are telling the truth now under oath in front of congress, or were you telling the truth on those podcasts over the last several

years because they run counter and contradictory to one another? it was the day after the election when i talked to him. he was down in palm beach. they're going through the transition process right before he was nominated, and the words that he spoke then were very much what he echoed here, and that the articulation that vaccines are safe. and that is where you saw several of these democratic members go to his past comments, in which he was very explicit in saying there are no vaccines on the market that are safe and effective. that's what he had said at one time. that runs counter to what he's articulating in front of this committee today. but it was notable the what democrats chose, in particular michael bennett and maggie hassan, what they chose to draw out of their effort to suggest that the other members on the committee that he should not be trusted. and it was on reproductive rights and his past comments as late as 2023, in which he is very explicit in saying that women should be granted bodily autonomy and that reproductive rights are important, and that it runs in stark contrast to his

position today, in which he said that he would defend president trump's position that limits and restricts women's reproductive rights. take a listen to one of those exchanges with new hampshire senator maggie hassan. >> when was. >> it that you decided to sell out the. values you've had your whole life in order to be given power by president trump? >> senator, i agree with president trump that every abortion is a tragedy, that we can't be a moral authority in this country. >> and this is where it comes down to the reality that republican senators have not staked out positions at this point in time, andrea, on how they intend to vote. democrats believe that they have an opening to try to open up the door to republican members being able to reject kennedy, not because of his past controversies or conspiracy theories, but on the premise that they cannot trust his positions that he is making and claiming today in front of them in order to be confirmed.

>> and doctor patel, as a. >> practicing physician. >> there are. >> some 15,000. >> physicians and nobel laureates included, who have come out against this nomination. what stood out to you? >> what concerns you? >> i think three things. number one, there's a lot of areas that rfk kind of has, like making america healthy again, food, kind of talking about the drug supply. but then there are a lot of gaps in his knowledge. he confused medicare, medicaid, huge programs that he would be overseeing, essentially, as well as some of the nuances about those health care aspects. so i think that along with just kind of it took about 20 senators in to talk about equity, inclusion and grants as well. also big programs that are under fire. >> and i think they are resuming. the hearing is about. >> to start again. let's listen. >> to senator wyden. i understand he. >> has distributed that five minutes to a few of the other senators. so we will have a few more quick questions, and then we will proceed. and i would like. >> to thank. the audience again. >> i know we had a couple of outbursts earlier, but i. >> want to thank the audience.

>> for being respectful and encourage the audience to continue to be respectful as we conclude. >> the hearing. >> with that. >> senator marshall. >> thank you. chairman. obesity, diabetes, heart disease, obesity. >> diabetes, heart. >> disease account for. probably 80%. of health challenges in america. you know, many. times i heard my. >> friends across. >> the aisle mention any three of those. >> i don't know. >> if we've lost the forest. >> for the trees here. >> vaccines is a critical issue, i understand that. i don't see how mr. kennedy's position could be any more clear that he's going to support the vaccines. he's going to support the science and empowerment to parents. >> and their doctors. >> to make these choices. >> 60% of. >> americans have a chronic. >> disease. >> that there's an epidemic. >> of chronic diseases across the country. >> and this make america wealthy again movement is palpable to

me. it started on the campaign trail in 2020, when moms had never met, that never involved in the political process came up to me and said, look, i want to make these choices about my children with my doctor, not the federal government, that it's a very real thing. moms, dads, grandparents across the country grabbed me and say. >> look. >> why are why do 20% of our children now? why are they on a prescription drug? so, mr. kennedy. >> what what is your prescription. >> to help make america. >> wealthy again? what is. >> what's your vision? what does that look like to you? >> thank you, senator marshall, the we're we're having epidemics of all these chronic illnesses, autoimmune diseases, neurological diseases, allergic diseases, obesity. when i when my uncle was president, 3% of

americans were obese. today, 74% of americans are obese or overweight. no other country has anything like this. in japan, the obesity rate is still 3% and epidemics are not caused by genes. genes may provide the vulnerability, but you need an environmental toxin. oh, something is poisoning the american people. and we know that the primary culprits are are are changing food supply. the switch to highly chemical intensive processed foods. we have 10,000 ingredients in our country, in our foods. europeans have only 400. if you buy a mcdonald's french fries. in our country, there's 11 ingredients. my understanding in europe there's only three. if you buy froot loops in our country, they're loaded with food dyes with yellow dye, red dye, blue

dye, and many other ingredients. the same company makes a the same product with different ingredients for canada and europe. and at age we don't have good science on all these things. and, and that is deliberate. that's a deliberate choice not to study the things that are truly making us sick and are not only contributing to chronic disease, but to mortalities from infectious disease. we need to get a handle on this, because if we don't, it's an existential threat. our country is not going to be destroyed because we get the marginal tax rate wrong, or because we get one of these culture war issues that we've been talking about today. wrong. it's going to be destroyed if we continue down this trajectory of chronic disease, we need to fix our food supply. and that's the number one. >> thank you. >> thank you, mr. kennedy. certainly, i share your concern with ultra processed. >> foods. >> on the other end of this food

chain are my farmers and ranchers back home. would you just take a second and share your compassion, how you feel about farmers and ranchers, that they respond to the market. they don't dictate the market. they grow what the market is wanting them to, to grow. and as senator hawley told me the other day that his brother in laws are all farmers, and he said four out of every five of his brother in laws has parkinson's disease. and that kind of cluster we're seeing across farm country of cancers, autoimmune diseases, obesity. et cetera. oh, it's and we can now not export american food to europe because the europeans won't take our food. that's not good for farmers are also destroying our soil because some of the chemicals that farmers use destroy the microbiome. and that causes the erosion of the soil. you can't

get water infiltration water pools up and wash the soil off. agronomists now estimate that we only have if we continue doing these processes. only 60 harvests left before our soil is gone. we farmers have are using seeds and chemicals that are, over the long term are costing them and us. and what we need to do is we need to support the farmers. we need to we need the farmers as partners if we're going to make them work. and i don't want a single farmer to go out of business under our watch. i don't regulate farming. if i'm privileged to be confirmed, i'm not regulating farms. that's under usda. but i want to partner with all of my decisions with usda and with the farmer farm community to make sure that

we don't lose more farmers in this country. but we also transition. we offer and incentivize transitions to regenerative agriculture to no till agriculture and to less chemically intensive. and by the way, i've also met with the chemical industry and the fertilizer and herbicide companies. and they want to do the same thing. oh, and i think we're on the trajectory to do that. and we need to incentivize a initiatives to accelerate that trajectory. >> mr. chairman, if i could, i you know, the great news is that my farmers in kansas are selling products to europe, that today's regenerative practices, soil health, all those things are priorities for kansas farmers. we are many of us are doing many of those things already. we just need it to be more, more widespread. if i could just wrap up my remarks, though, is that

again, going back to the big picture here, 60% of americans have a chronic disease. mr. kennedy, i believe for such a time as this that you're not just one of 300 million people. i think that you are the person to lead hhs to make america wealthy again, that god has a divine purpose for you. and i look forward to your confirmation and working with you to make america healthy again. >> thank you senator. >> thank you. senator warnock. >> thank you. >> thank you so much. >> chairman crapo and ranking. >> member wyden. >> and it's great. >> to be here. >> mr. kennedy, welcome. welcome to you and. >> and to your family. thank you for meeting with me. >> a few. >> days ago. i'd like. >> to follow. >> up, if i might, with. >> some of the issues that we. >> discussed in my office. i want to. >> talk to you first about. >> the cdc. >> or the centers for disease control and prevention. >> i'm proud. >> of the work that the cdc does. proud that it's located.

>> in georgia with more than. >> 10,000 employees. >> in my state. if confirmed, you would be. >> the cabinet secretary over the cdc representing hhs is. about 29% of the federal budget. cdc is a part of that. >> do you. >> agree that the cdc's. work is critical. >> to georgia. critical for. >> our country. >> and the health of the entire world? >> yes, senator. >> senator isaacson. my republican predecessor. >> would would agree would have agreed. >> with that. >> bless his memory. >> he. >> was a. >> fierce advocate for the cdc. >> as am i. >> the cdc is an agency. >> filled with hard working. >> dedicated public. health servants. >> they wake up every. >> single day working to keep us safe. i think. >> we don't think often enough about. >> their work, because.

>> it's easy not to celebrate the folks. >> who. >> are protecting you from that, which doesn't appear because of the work that they're doing. so grateful for the work that the cdc employees do. some of them are members of my church. >> i saw. >> that deep commitment firsthand when. >> i visited. >> the cdc just last summer. mr. kennedy, you have compared the. cdc's work to nazi death camps. you've compared it to sexual abusers. in the catholic church. you've also said that many of them belong. this is a direct quote. many of them belong in jail. for me, those are disturbing characterizations of the cdc workers that i know who are trying to keep the american public safe every single day. and as you. are presented as the nominee for this position, i need to know, do you stand by those statements that you you made in the past, or do you

attract those. >> previous statements? >> senator, i don't believe that i ever compared the cdc to nazi death camps. i support the cdc. my job is not to dismantle or harm the cdc. my job is to empower the scientists. if i'm privileged to be confirmed. >> so you so you retract those statements? >> i'm not retracting it. i never said it. well. >> well. >> actually, i have a transcript. >> of me saying that it's a nazi death camp. >> let me let me read your words. >> it says that the. >> institution, cdc. >> and the. >> vaccine program is your description. >> of their work is more important. >> than the children that it's supposed. >> to protect. >> and, you know, it's the same reason. >> we. >> had a pedophile scandal in the catholic church. it's because people were able to. >> convince themselves. >> that the institution of the church was more important than these little. boys and girls who were being raped. >> that's pretty. >> provocative language. you said. >> in another.

>> statement to me. this is like nazi death camp. >> i mean. >> let me. >> let me finish. i'm just reading your words. i mean, what happens what happened to these kids? 1 in 31 boys. in this country, their minds are being robbed from them. >> yeah. i was not comparing the cdc to nazi death camps. i was comparing the injury rate to our children to other atrocities. and i wouldn't compare the, of course, the cdc to nazi death. kansas to any extent, to the extent that any statement that i made has been interpreted that way. yeah, i, i don't agree with that. the in 2003, the united states congress government oversight committee ended a over a year investigation that cdc had used almost that same language. they said that the

cdc, just one division, one branch was the immunization safety office, had put institutional self-interest and pharmaceutical profits ahead of the welfare and the health of american children. so that was a conclusion by congress? no. and i and i repeated. >> that i'm asking you because you're the nominee for hhs. >> it sounds. >> like you stand by those statements. >> senator. my objective is to support the cdc. there's nothing i'm going to do that is going to harm cdc. i want to make sure that our science is gold standard science so that it's free from that same government oversight investigation committee, and that the panels, the acip panel and within cdc, i think 97% of the people on it had conflicts. i don't believe that. that's right. i think we need to end those conflicts and make sure that scientists are doing unobstructed science.

>> so i you know, i want to enter. this statement, by the way, into the record, without objection. >> without objection. >> last week, the white house gagged hhs. >> and the. >> cdc. >> preventing them from communicating all important public health information to anyone, including all of our allies, including our allies in the united states and global disease prevention. can you just answer yes or no? because i'm running out of time. do you agree with that action? >> i was not consulted on it, but that's pretty much standard operating procedure for incoming administration. >> so you you agree with the action that. that gagged hhs. >> and cdc. >> from communicating important public public health information. >> to that directive made sure that no. you said public health, that only nonessential travel and mass communications were temporarily suspended pending the pending the confirmation of a new hhs secretary. this is

standard operating procedure for every administration. >> i get it, you you. i don't think what we've seen over the last several days. is standard operation for new administration. i think we're seeing some unprecedented actions. but you agree with it. last night, members. >> of the cdc. >> along with other federal employees, were actually invited to resign these these buyouts. and i got text messages and folks i know work from the cdc for the cdc that do this important work, who got that note? and it's really important. because my experience. is that when you send out that kind of note, the folks who resigned are the folks who you least likely want to see resign. they got other options. they're gifted folks. they've got a lot of expertise. they have options. a lot of them are doing this work because of their patriotism, because of their commitment. do you agree with the buyouts that were presented to cdc employees just. >> last night? i agree, at the

time, the vast majority of the scientists and experts at cdc are patriots and good government servants. >> i can you tell me. >> i don't think anybody is going to resign who's committed to keeping america healthy? >> can you just answer? yes. >> okay. you agree with the buyouts in our meeting. i asked you to confirm your support for the affordable care act. you also mentioned that you and president trump want to fix the aca by making premiums more affordable. can you answer me yes or no? as i don't have a lot of time. did you know that tax. credits that help families afford health insurance and save georgia's an average of $531 per month per person are set to expire at the end of the year. did you know that. >> i do. >> we need to. >> move on. >> do you support congress extending these tax credits so that americans can continue to

afford health care? >> i you know, congress has to make its own decisions about that. my instructions for president. >> trump, you're saying. >> is to. >> make the i'm having a lot of trouble getting the witness to answer yes or no to a yes or no question. >> well. >> i've got one more question. >> i'm you're almost. >> at nine minutes. >> well. >> i need him to answer. yes or no? yes or no? >> i'm not going to answer yes or no to a question that's not susceptible to an honest yes or no answer. >> we need to move on. i think. >> that the fact that you find it difficult to answer basic questions is deeply troubling for me, as you present yourself as a nominee to run hhs. >> thank you so very much, senator. >> i've been in courts all over the country. and as the. >> chairman, you told me i'm out of time. the witness continues to filibuster even after i said i'm done. >> senator smith. >> mr. chair. thank you. >> thank you, mr.