administration was temporarily or and to some extent still just flat out refusing to spend money that congress appropriated and authorized to be spent because they don't want to. >> yeah. it's one thing to fight over whether or not spending is allowed to go out. it's another thing to seize the checkbook on which you know by which payments are, are are effectively made. isaac arnsdorf, senior white house reporter for the washington. post i can tell this is a story that we have not heard the end of. thank you for helping us understand it tonight, and we look forward to talking to you about it again. >> thank you. >> all right. that does it for me on this very, very busy night. i will see you again monday and every night next week at 9 p.m. >> good morning. i'm alicia menendez in washington, d.c. it is 7 a.m. on the east coast, 2 p.m. in israel, where we are following breaking news. three hostages, including one american citizen, have been released in the fourth hostage exchange between israel and hamas.

american keith segal and israelis jordan and ofir calderon today are reuniting with their loved ones. they were held captive in gaza for nearly 500 days. bibas was captured with his wife and two young sons in october 2023, his youngest only nine months old when he was taken. at this time, it is not clear whether his wife and his children are alive. as for american keith segal, his family released an emotional statement this morning saying in part that they are, quote, filled with indescribable excitement. finally, after 484 long, terrifying days and nights full of immense worry for our father, we can breathe again. as we begin this hour, we are waiting for keith segal to be reunited with his family. nbc news correspondent yasmin vossoughian joins us now from tel aviv. yasmin, tell us you spent some time with keith. >> segal's family. >> what did they tell you? how are they feeling? yeah. >> they were.

>> incredibly emotional. we were at the kibbutz where some of his family members and friends actually live, about 30 minutes outside of tel aviv. we were there. >> early this. >> morning. emotional, happy. >> elated. >> cautiously optimistic. >> just some of the words. >> to kind of. >> describe alicia. >> and what they were feeling this morning. and the. >> lead up. >> to his release. >> they were worried was it. >> going to. >> go. >> through when it would happen? >> would he. remain safe? >> and the. >> moment alicia. >> the room was. >> silent. >> watching him being handed over to. >> the. >> red cross and then just total. >> and absolute elation, as if just. >> a weight had. >> been. >> lifted off. >> of their shoulders. >> the stress of 484. >> days of captivity. >> in which keith. >> segal was kept by hamas in gaza. that stress now relieved, it seemed, for so many of his family and friends that were there at the kibbutz. >> gathering there. >> in the. >> family home. >> to watch.

>> the exchange. >> and we know now. >> keith segal. >> making his. way into israel, being reunited. >> with his. >> wife, who we know also had been taken hostage. >> had been. >> released much. >> earlier than he had. >> he's going to be brought. >> here, alicia, to this hospital. let me kind of just show you where i am right now in tel aviv. he's being brought by helicopter from southern israel. >> he'll be landing on this. >> helipad above me. >> and then be brought into the building. >> behind me. they have to kind of all of the hostages. >> that have been exchanged. alicia have to kind of go through this process, right. >> in which they're. >> brought by the red cross across the border, handed off to the idf, in which they kind of do a debrief and also a general check of health and. welfare before they are then put on a helicopter and brought to a local hospital here. >> in tel aviv, all. >> the while obviously reunited with their family. >> you mentioned the two other. >> hostages as well. >> and important to note there, right? yarden bibas and.

>> offer calderon the two other. hostages that were released early this. morning in khan yunis. >> i think it's important to talk a little bit about yarden bibas because he came back. however, we have not yet seen any evidence of his wife or two young children. i'm sure many of you remember the pictures of the two. young redheaded children. they were supposed to have been released early on in this ceasefire deal. there was some back and forth early on in which hamas had pointed. >> to israel and saying that. >> they had died. >> as a result. of israel fire, israeli fire. israel has not yet confirmed their whereabouts. and or their welfare. >> and so. >> bibas obviously coming back on his. own without his wife and children. so certainly a bittersweet. moment for. >> him, to say the least. >> but nonetheless, this country, israel, the people here elated today for three more

hostages returning home. >> alicia i was also struck, yasmin, by the. >> fact that the. >> statement from. >> the segal family sort. >> of tempered their. excitement and their relief. >> with the fact. >> that there are still. >> hostages remaining. >> that they. want to see them all. >> returned home. and there. >> is a long road to. recovery for. >> for all. >> of these hostages. what did you hear. >> from his. >> family about. their greatest concerns for him as he returns and begins to reintegrate? >> everybody is really tempered. i'll say that because i think that nobody wants to make any assumptions as to what they experienced while in captivity. and how they plan to recover. i had actually. >> spoken to. >> a family member of keith's while we were in the home, and i want you to take a. >> listen to what she had. >> to say, and then we'll talk on the other side. >> now that you know.

>> he is safe. >> now that you know he has made his way back. >> to. >> israel, is reunited with his family. with your family? how does that make you feel again? >> relieved. >> a sense that. >> i can let out a breath and. >> somewhat phyllis lee. >> and my sister and the rest of the family to start getting. >> back to. >> normal life. >> and i think that, you know. >> that sense. >> of relief does exist amongst so many of the families of hostages that have returned home, but also the sense that there are still so many families out there awaiting the return of their family members as well, and hoping for the return of the 70 plus hostages that are still being held by hamas in gaza. that is a real concern amongst israelis as we continue this. phase one of this cease fire deal, and a real concern as

well, that there could be a. breakdown in this cease fire deal and that all the hostages may not, in. >> fact, return. >> and why that breakdown may in fact happen. that's a real concern, i think, amongst israelis wanting really kind of this conflict and this war to come to an end, wanting some kind of full circle moment for many of them, right, to see. all of the. >> hostages return. >> and, and, and a real, real end to the conflict that we have been seeing going on since october 7th. >> yeah. >> yasmin. >> we are. >> watching behind you. >> flags being set up. clearly, we've talked a lot. >> about these. >> hostages, about the family. but but to your point. >> there is an entire nation. >> got a little. >> wave there. there's an entire nation. >> that is processing what this. >> is going to mean for them. >> and you know, when you hear. >> the. >> expression a return to normal, the truth is there is no return to normal. >> yeah, there is no return to normal. and everybody.

>> has. said that. right. >> they said this will never be the israel that it once was. right? i mean, for our entire lifetimes, we have known in israel a gaza, palestinian territories, israelis, palestinians that have been at odds, that have been in conflict. if you were born after 1967, i mean, this has been an ongoing conflict for a very long time, but nonetheless, the normal and i put that in air quotes that they knew before october 7th and the normal that they know now, they will never go back to that. and i have not heard anything different from anyone, as you mentioned, kind of the signs and the flags that are going up behind me put up by these young girls. alicia, one thing i want to show for you guys, do you mind if i show something here? so you see. ariel bibas and kfir bibas. am i saying the name? right, kfir bibas. yeah. these are the. two young children of yarden. bibas. these are the two young children that i was talking about. so? so

imagine a father returning home, alicia. after being held in captivity for 444 eight 484 days, i should say, not knowing the status, the health, the welfare of these two young babies. and maybe he does. and we don't know the answer to that question. but i think a lot of kind of israel and the people that i've been speaking to understand the complexity of the situation for him and returning home and yet returning. without his family. and it's just representative of what you just talked about, which is life will never go back to normal pre october 7th, not for the palestinians that are in gaza, not for the israelis that are here in tel aviv and in israel. >> complexity that. >> is top of. >> mind. >> for all nbc news yasmin vossoughian, thank you so much. >> joining us. >> now nbc news. >> chief foreign. >> affairs correspondent. andrea

mitchell. >> andrea, is. >> my understanding. you are. >> joining us. >> from panama, where. >> you are following. the new. >> secretary of state. i wonder. >> what you are hearing from. >> the. >> state department. >> about. >> the release of these hostages. >> i'm not. >> hearing anything yet. >> from the state. >> department, but i. >> have to tell you. >> that we who have covered this in. >> israel and here. >> in. >> well, in the united states. >> as i await the arrival. tonight of marco rubio here, this. >> is such a moment. >> because aviva siegel and the whole. >> family, her daughters. >> keith's brother, whom i've met with in israel and in the u.s. on. >> my. >> program on msnbc. >> you know, just. >> for more than a year. aviva got. out last november. she had been held for 53 days. >> she has been. >> one of the most. >> passionate advocates. >> among the hostage families, the american hostage families. keith was born in north carolina, came from north

carolina. he's now 65 years old. she was, you know, so emotional in many. many months when he was not released. and he's the first american to be released in this whole new the new agreement that was. negotiated under tremendous pressure. first, of course, from secretary blinken on 13 separate. >> missions and from. >> his top negotiators, negotiators, as well as. >> of course. >> brett mcgurk, the key negotiator who was in doha for weeks and weeks and months repeatedly. >> working on. >> this for president biden. but most importantly, i think. >> in these in. >> this transition, it certainly has been president trump on december 2nd, he issued a truth social post which said to hamas, if they'll be held to. >> pay in the middle. >> east. >> if you. >> don't release these hostages. and so up until then, there was on and off agreements, hamas at the. last couple of weeks of

this deal was, of course, according to u.s. officials and other officials in the. >> region. >> in the gulf, the qataris, hamas was the chief obstacle. but there was also pressure being put by donald trump and his his incoming administration on netanyahu. netanyahu, under huge pressure from two right wing members of his coalition, ben-gvir and smotrich, who had enormous power, more power than their numbers would indicate and not as much, you know, popular support as the rest of. >> the american, the. >> israeli public, which is divided but mostly interested in the hostage release. but there was so much division over continuing the attacks in in gaza, which was opposed by the idf, opposed by the former defense minister, who was fired as a result of it, yoav galant. so in multiple meetings here and in israel, as i've covered this for more. >> than a. >> year, there was just so much

political division. but the closer really was steve witkoff. steve witkoff, the business guy. he describes himself as just a real estate guy from new york, but he did know how to put pressure. and on a key saturday, he went to netanyahu's. you know, he went to netanyahu's home and it was a saturday. it was the sabbath. negotiations don't usually happen then. and he really said, according to nbc news reporting, you know, do you want it or not? i'm going to say the same thing to hamas. and then this week he went into gaza, the first american official to do so since the war began. of course, a year ago, october 7th. and that was the finish line. by then they had the deal, these three phases, but a lot of frustration among the american hostages, that there was no american in the first group's release. so finally today, one american,

keith siegel, the oldest. and then we're expecting at least hamas has said that sajid khan, whose father jonathan has been another fierce advocate for the hostage releases he leaves both in israel and in florida. and i've talked to him so many times, interviewed him over so many times, and we're waiting, of course, for that next group to be released and hoping in this phase that it will be sajid khan. then there's alexander, the third american hostage that is on the list. he's not supposed to be released until the next phase. and then there are other americans involved, you know. ruby, khan, omar neutra's sons, they have been told, even though their mother's, in some instances, do not believe it's true until they until they have them back, they have the remains. and, you know, they can have suitable burials. so we're still waiting to hear when they will be released. but this is a day of victory and

celebration for the siegel family, certainly, as the others still await the good news and it's going to be celebrated, i can tell you by the state department and the white house as the hours progressed today, because this white house has a lot and president trump is going to have a lot to say about the closing days of this deal, it ran out of time for the biden administration, despite all of their efforts. and it was clear that within israel and the israeli government, as well as some of the arab governments, there was more pressure that could be brought to bear on both sides by president trump. and hamas also had lost its key allies. and it's very important to stress here that israel's israel's defeat of hezbollah leaders, the assassination of hezbollah leaders, the assassination of other hamas leaders, one of them, haniyeh in tehran, which was very explosive and aggressive politically. and

it did set back hostage negotiations for quite a while. but hamas has lost a great deal. iran is weakened by israel's strikes against retaliatory strikes against iran, which were the iran strikes were not successful. with the help of the u.s. military, jordanian and other militaries in the region, and iran has lost a lot of military power and key air defenses. the collapse of the syrian regime, the transformation of the middle east in these past months by the israeli military, israeli intelligence targeted assassinations for all. the criticism has weakened hamas, for despite the show of force that you've seen in these hostage releases, where the fighters are coming out of the woodwork, coming out of the tunnels, hamas is regrouping. that's another big fear. but so far the deal has held, and 183 palestinians released. now, as we're told here, i'm told by my colleagues, by your colleagues over there that that part of the

deal has held as well today. >> and we. >> know that the. >> next several phases of the deal. >> still incredibly fragile. >> and that comes. >> as. you have. >> prime minister. >> netanyahu set to meet. >> with president. >> trump at the white house on tuesday. what do you expect. >> to be the fundamental. >> dynamics of that meeting? >> well, president trump kind of threw. a political grenade, if you will, last week. just a week ago, he was on his way back from nevada and on the plane, he suggested that gazans, three quarters of the surviving population of gaza, of this hideous war where more than 45,000 people, according to palestinian health authorities, were connected, of course, to the hamas, you know, leadership there. but the numbers are horrific, according to the un and human rights groups of their deaths. and, of course, the 1200 people that died in the massacre on october 7th and others who have died since and hostages who

have died. but the situation now is a political situation, and netanyahu is getting his first meeting in the white house. he wanted one for four years. and president biden, because of political disagreements with netanyahu, with the expansion of settlements in the west bank taking land from palestinians and other policies did not grant him a meeting. they met, but they met at the un meetings in new york. and he didn't get the washington celebration, political celebration that he wanted and that he had had in previous administrations. so that is going to take place on tuesday. but president trump, as i was saying, said that these that three quarters of the gazan population, a million and a half people should be moved out of gaza. those who survived moved to egypt and jordan, to allies, american and israeli allies, neighboring israel. and that's the last thing that egypt and jordan want. just, you know, the

very, that very day, minister sarfati, the deputy prime minister and the foreign minister has both titles very well. highly respected jordanian diplomat around the region, around the world. he came out forcefully saying that this was simply not acceptable. president trump has spoken with king abdullah. we haven't gotten a real clarity on that conversation, but i don't think it was terribly positive from king abdullah's perspective. they've been hosting, you know, you know, thousands and thousands, actually, millions of refugees from syria and from surrounding areas for all of these years at great expense and great political peril, especially since the turmoil in gaza and a lot of anti-american, anti-american spirit among the palestinians and others in jordan. from my trips there and my conversations with leaders there. so there is a lot of

anger in jordan at even the prospect of taking, you know, these people and of the palestinians, because every time they're told and over all of these decades that you're you're leaving one area and but you can return, well, they don't get to return to the land that they say is theirs. and these are disputed lands. and now there's also support in the administration from the new elise stefanik, the new un ambassador, in her testimony at confirmation that she supports the expansion of israeli settlements to take over the west bank to the borders with jordan, that's also unacceptable to jordan. it's unacceptable to the palestinians in the west bank. they were supposed to be given the right to a separate state all those years ago in camp david and in successive u.s. administrations, both republican and democratic presidents over the years. that was part of the deal. but it

collapsed completely under the trump the first trump administration. and now it's just a hope. the only thing that president trump has in terms of leverage, or the biggest thing that he has in terms of leverage with prime minister netanyahu, is that both of them have a common goal of saudi arabia. and being the biggest and most important of the arab nations who have yet to recognize israel. that was always the hope. that was the hope in september and october, before october 7th, when i was in new york talking to all of these leaders at the un meetings, at the annual un meetings in october and september of 2023, that there was a possibility that president biden was really hopeful for a treaty between saudi arabia recognizing israel. the u.s. would help the saudis get, you know, peaceful nuclear

power, which they have long wanted a nuclear power reactor to start a nuclear program, not a military program, but a peaceful program. that's something that they had long wanted. that's very controversial. it would have to go through the senate. so there was negotiation all around, and there's thought by the israelis, by by a lot of u.s. officials. that's why hamas attacked on october 7th to blow up that deal and make it impossible for that kind of negotiation to take place. well, the bottom line is now on the talks on tuesday. getting back to your original question, this is a big piece of it, because if that deal is going to ever happen, the saudis are saying there has to be a pathway to a palestinian state. and that is something that netanyahu's hard right ministers are against. and it's something that president trump's advisers, the incoming u.n. ambassador stefanik, when she takes office with her confirmation, seems

assured as well as the un. the us ambassador, mike huckabee, who's going to israel, has talked about the israelis taking the west bank back from the palestinians. that is unacceptable to qatar, to egypt, to jordan, but importantly, to the saudi leaders and to mohammed bin salam. so that's a critical piece of these conversations on tuesday. i think it's going to be quite a celebration from netanyahu's perspective. he just in the last month or so, had a fairly serious surgery. it was announced to be prostate surgery. they said it was benign, but it was a serious surgery, according to officials i've spoken to from diplomatic sources. and so he's appearing very healthy, so he'll be coming here triumphant. there are

republicans in congress. there were republicans in congress, in the house, at least the last time that he had a big reception in washington. and without telling president obama, agreed with the republican house leader, the speaker, to go to congress and address a joint meeting of congress. leaders don't usually do that without also having notification to the white house that that created a real rupture with the obama biden administration and then with president biden as well. so netanyahu has always used these republican connections in political circles in washington, and now he has. but the leader in the oval office on his side. and i think that those talks are going to be, you know, critical for the future of israel and for the palestinians and the arab world, because it will be really interesting to see how president trump balances israeli interests with the broader interests of what he himself has, has launched the abraham accords in

his first administration, which he's widely credited with, which brought recognition and diplomatic connections. flights to arab countries. at least before the october 7th, there were a lot of economic benefits to israel and to the leaders in the region, and that is something the saudis really want. they want the military protection. they wanted a security agreement with the us. they wanted the nuclear power. and in return, they were willing to recognize israel and deal with the criticism on the arab street. and that will only be amplified exponentially now after the, you know, the devastation of gaza. what also at stake is who's going to rebuild gaza? will the arab leaders kick in? and to do that, israel is going to have to make some concessions on palestinian rights. >> nbc's andrea mitchell for us in panama. >> city.

>> where she is awaiting the arrival of secretary of state marco rubio. andrea, as always. >> thank you. we go. >> now to. nbc news's yasmin vossoughian. yasmin, you are in tel aviv. >> you have eyes. >> on that helicopter. what are you anticipating? yeah. >> the chopper. the chopper. >> is just. landing now. >> alicia. on top. >> of the hospital with. >> keith eagle. >> the first israeli. >> american hostage. >> as we just. >> talked about earlier. >> to be. >> exchanged to be released by hamas after 484 days in captivity. obviously, there's a lot of emotion even here by these two young girls behind me. but in the streets here. >> of israelis. >> happy to see keith siegel released after so long. >> arriving here at this. >> hospital, which will then have to go through a thorough. >> health check. >> as so many. >> hostages before him have. of course. >> it is bittersweet, as we mentioned before. >> because there are. >> still 70 plus hostages that are still in captivity being held in gaza today. so with. >> the arrival of keith siegel here alongside his. >> family, you remember his wife

as well was also. >> held hostage. she was released. >> after 52 days in captivity. so them being reunited. after 400. >> plus days. >> apart, an emotional reunion for them as a couple for keith siegel with. >> his children as well. >> who met them. >> in the south. >> of israel, along with the family members. >> that i spoke to earlier at the kibbutz. >> an emotional day not only for the family members. you're hearing the honking in the streets here in israel and tel. >> aviv as well. >> but for. >> this. >> country and seeing yet another hostage. returned from hamas. >> from gaza to here. >> in israel, at least one other thing i wanted to mention, because i thought you were having an interesting conversation there with andrea, especially about the involvement of the trump administration, along with prime minister bibi netanyahu and the confidence they have in getting through this ceasefire deal. i've been having a lot of conversations, especially in hostage square, just a little. ways away. >> from. >> here, about. >> how israelis feel about their. >> confidence in their. >> prime minister, along with president trump. >> and they feel, actually some

positivity when it comes to president trump, some positivity. and they feel as if he can have. some more control over the situation, especially because of his. >> close relationship. >> with prime minister bibi netanyahu. and they're hopeful that he can. help broker this kind of second phase of this ceasefire deal, especially with the visit. >> of steve. >> witkoff, his middle east envoy, who took a trip a couple of days ago into gaza and then also met with the families of hostages. >> that were still being held. >> in gaza. and so with that, of course, as you mentioned. >> to andrea, everything. >> is incredibly fragile. >> but again. here in tel aviv. >> today, obviously, a. >> lot of jubilation, a lot of happiness. >> and seeing keith siegel. arrive here. at this hospital. >> to get a thorough health. >> check after. >> being released. >> by hamas. one other thing i want to mention as well, alicia, that we cannot forget, is along with this exchange. >> we saw the release. >> of 150 plus palestinian prisoners released by israel, now being making their way back

into the west bank and gaza as well. so certainly some celebration and jubilation both in gaza and the. >> west bank today, seeing those prisoners return home. >> nbc's yasmin vossoughian. yasmin, thank you. joining us. >> now. >> former arab-israeli negotiator aaron. david miller is also a senior fellow at the carnegie endowment for. international peace. aaron, you know, earlier this. >> week, a. >> more chaotic. >> scene in the handover of some of these hostages. it threatened to undermine. the deal. >> moving forward. your assessment. >> as you watch these hostage. >> releases today. >> actually, i'm. >> quite surprised. >> that it's. >> going as smoothly as it is. >> it's not an agreement between the united. >> states and switzerland. it's an agreement. >> between two combatants, both of. >> whom have. >> tried to inflict. >> as much pain and suffering on the other. >> as they possibly. >> can over the last 15 months. >> and this is the fourth. >> exchange in a multi-phased exchange, which, yes, there have been i wouldn't call them hiccups. they're they're serious

issues in implementation. but in essence, the limited. >> withdrawal of israeli. >> forces, the. surging of humanitarian assistance into gaza that is going actually quite well. >> and the centerpiece of the. >> deal. >> the trade for hostages, for palestinian prisoners. the real problem. >> is going. >> to be starting next week, when. the negotiations over the. second phase of this deal are due. >> to. >> take place, and whether or not the most right wing. >> government in israel's. >> history and hamas, which is designated by the united states as a foreign terrorist organization, can actually make the decisions that are required in phase two is much less certain. >> can we i. >> know. >> we have this visual. >> up on the. >> screen. >> but i want to just. >> talk us through. >> these three phases. phase one a complete cease. >> fire. >> hamas to release. 33 hostages total. israel to release about 1900 prisoners. israeli forces leave populated areas. displaced

palestinians. >> return home. there is. >> that aid that you spoke about that is allowed to flow into gaza. >> these phases, while. >> each separate. >> and distinct. >> aaron david miller are. >> all interconnected. you cannot talk. >> about the reconstruction. >> of gaza without first talking about the. >> aid that. >> is currently flowing. >> through rafah. what is that aid going. >> to do in. >> these initial days? >> how important. >> is it to the overall deal? >> i think i think it's critically important. before october 6th, there were excuse. >> me, for october. >> 7th. there were. 600 trucks which provided extraordinary support to gaza. given the limitations. >> that the. >> israelis imposed and. israeli concerns over hamas using dual dual use items to ramp up their military effort, you are now seeing the real possibility of continued aid flow of more than 600. we're talking largely about humanitarian assistance. >> next phase. >> of reconstruction.

>> which even according to the. trump administration's special envoy, steven witkoff, could take anywhere from 10 to 15 years. an additional, i mean, five to clear away all the rubble and demining that's going to have to take place in gaza. and that, frankly. >> is. >> going to depend on gaza not being a free fire military zone, which is why phase two is critically important. phase two compels both sides, hamas, to release all of the hostages. they will, after. >> phase. >> one, probably retain 65 israeli soldiers, half of whom the. >> israelis judged. >> to be dead, and the they're obligated to release those. and the war. >> the israelis. >> are obligated to end the war on their part and withdraw all israeli forces from gaza. right now, i think. >> it's very. >> hard to imagine the implementation of that deal. and that's why the netanyahu meeting with president trump next week. >> is. >> going to be critically important, because donald trump owns these agreements. he deployed his key mediator to

push them over to the final stage. and he's claimed. credit for the release of the hostages. now it's up to trump on the american side to basically ensure their implementation. that's going to. >> be. >> a very bumpy road, and i think we're going to get some of that this week in washington. >> if you are. >> just. >> joining us, we are following breaking news. from israel. american keith siegel, one of three hostages just released. from hamas captivity. in gaza. we're speaking with aaron david miller. i want to. >> bring into our. conversation journalist. >> noga tarnopolsky. noga, let's start with where you are. >> it's a momentous day for those. >> waiting for the release of these hostages. tell us what you are seeing, what you are hearing, what the mood is there. >> yeah. >> it is a very. momentous day, one. >> in. >> a. >> series here. this used. >> to be. >> the plaza. >> outside the tel aviv. >> museum of art. >> and it has. become known as. hostages square. >> you can see behind me. each

community. >> that was attacked. >> during the. >> hamas assault. of october 7th, 2023 has its. >> own tent. >> here. its own. >> community. >> and the crowds have just. been mounting since the morning, despite. >> the. >> fact that. >> at this point. >> the exchange. >> the freeing of the hostages. >> is done. people keep. >> screaming into the square. >> and just. a couple. >> of minutes ago, honestly. >> keith. seagulls chopper. >> the mil chopper. >> bringing him to hospital. >> overflew the square. it seemedo linger. >> and a huge. >> cheer went up and waves at him. so there's a lot, a lot of emotion here right. >> now. >> a lot of emotion. >> we've also been talking. about the upcoming trip prime. >> minister. >> netanyahu set to meet with president trump on tuesday, and your sense of the dynamics. inside israel that the prime minister is going to be bringing. >> into. >> that meeting with president trump?

>> prime minister netanyahu is. >> in a difficult. >> spot once again. >> at the moment. >> his several. >> of. >> his leading. >> ministers. >> active incumbent ministers. >> have said. >> flat out. >> in public there will be no phase two to this deal, full stop. >> and netanyahu. >> has not contradicted them nor reprimanded them. >> so that. >> is lingering over the air in the israeli public space. at the same time, we saw steve witkoff, prime minister trump. >> sorry. >> president trump's new envoy for the middle east here, literally at the same spot where i'm standing. >> now. >> two days ago. >> and he said. >> the opposite to israeli families of hostages. he said, we're going to get them all back. >> and he. >> said, your government is. >> involved in. >> this, too, to. >> make them understand. >> it wasn't just an american initiative. and netanyahu basically has been saying opposite things to the americans, who. are the most important mediators here and to his. own very hard right public.

i think it's important to remember his finance minister, bezalel smotrich, said flat out this week that if israel does not return to war to annihilate hamas, that he will topple the government. so prime minister netanyahu is in a fragile spot. in addition, he is on trial for corruption. he had to request permission from the court's judges to be able to take this trip to the united states. and, you know, while. >> it's easy. >> to see him. in contempt of court or scornful before court, many, many israelis, around 80% of israelis feel that he should go. so his hold on power right now is fragile. and that's why the expectation here is that he and his hard right ministers will do everything to hold on to power and to try and persuade the trump administration that maybe a delay could be found, that more or less, anything could be done ahead of israel

completely withdrawing its forces from the gaza strip. >> aaron david miller. >> you have an amazing. >> piece in foreign policy where you talk about the fact that. >> there are good. >> optics but empty pockets. i'm going to read you just. one line from your own piece. netanyahu will go home with good optics but relatively. empty pockets, either in material. >> or commitments. >> tell me why. >> you know. >> look. this is not. >> joe biden. this is donald trump whose conception of the national interest, frankly, is tethered to his politics, his vanity, his financial interests and getting his way. and while i think the optics here will be good, i mean, look, donald trump. >> gave. >> benjamin netanyahu a huge gift by inviting him to washington, the first foreign leader to host at the white house. given the tensions that existed between the two men at the end of the first. trump administration and. prime minister netanyahu's congratulatory call to joe biden and his refusal to embrace the former president's false narrative of a stolen election.

i don't think there's much trust, frankly, or love lost between these two. i think right now they need one another. i think the optics will be good. the president has self styled himself as the most pro-israeli president in the history of the universe, and netanyahu needs that in order to. demonstrate his indispensability before the israeli public. but there are very tough decisions in line, not just on the issue of the phasing in phase two, what to do about iran, what to do about the israeli saudi normalization agreement, which will demand a significant concession on the part of the israelis with respect to palestinians? all of these things are netanyahu government making decisions. and i suspect if his m.o. is any perceived as any consistent with his future actions, he's going to play for time. he's going to try to persuade the administration. they have a letter that's reported to have been given by the biden administration, endorsed by the trump administration, assuring the prime minister that he can

continue the war against hamas if there are violations and even to satisfy israeli security needs. so, again, i think optics will be good. i'm not sure we're talking about a transformational meeting between benjamin netanyahu and donald trump. on the positive side. >> aaron, i'm going to ask you both to stay with us. we're going to talk with you a little later in the hour. up next, with prime minister netanyahu, just days away from heading to washington, d.c, we're going to talk to nbc white house correspondent yamiche alcindor about the administration's response. you're watching msnbc. i told you, i don't need these anymore. i have sling, okay. >> morning. >> i only left sling, deliver the news. i need to stay informed. thank you very much. nice one. >> nope. >> sling gives us all the news we want in a quick and reliable manner. >> and at a wonderful price.

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of all hostages being held by hamas. the trump administration has also sought to take credit for the cease fire deal that was broken just days before president trump took office, and we know that his middle east envoy, steve witkoff, was in gaza this week, really overseeing the implementation of that cease fire deal. the other thing is, next week, we expect israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu to become the first foreign leader to visit the white house since president trump came into office. the white house press secretary spoke specifically about bibi's visit. netanyahu's visit. she said, quote, president trump's working meeting with the israeli prime minister next week emphasizes his continued support for israel and ensuring that brutal terrorists in that region have hell to pay. so that tells you that the white house is continuing to prioritize the middle east and the issues going on there. and i do expect the white house at some point to put out a statement applauding the release of keith siegel, alicia. >> and yet a more tenuous and tense relationship than that statement would lead you to believe. there are reportedly still. >> two americans.

>> yamiche, who are alive, were being held by hamas for american bodies that have yet to be released by hamas. what role have u.s. citizens played in these cease fire deals? >> well, we know that the. that the last administration and, of course, this administration has talked about those americans, has met with those families, has made it a point to say that they are. and the american government overall is very much involved in making sure that those people come home. we know again, that the biden administration was meeting frequently with those families. the trump administration, again, has just really vowed to stay in this because they have their people, steve witkoff on the ground. so we expect to see a statement from the white house pretty clearly here at some, at some point in the near future. what role specifically these american hostages are playing is really, i think, a big question here. what we do know is that they really have vowed that all hostages being held by hamas should be released, and they're working toward that end. alicia. >> phase one. >> of the steel. phase two and three. >> remain tenuous. >> nbc's yamiche alcindor. yamiche, thank you. we have more

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>> our hope rests with you. i wonder the degree to which noga that sentiment is being repeated and echoed in hostage square. >> is to. >> me very, very. much is as it was regarding president biden before the, i would say, before the election. it's really difficult to describe, but i think very important to try and transmit the extent to which israelis, about 80% of israelis, not just hostages, families, do not have any faith that their government is pursuing the return of these hostages, above all other concerns, and in particular, with prime minister netanyahu's hold on power so weak, with his popularity hovering at around 20%, and with his finance minister, without whom he can't stay in power, saying, i'm going to topple this government if we don't return to

war immediately. there is, i would say, something close to desperation and panic. certainly here in hostage despair about the possibility that prime minister netanyahu will again, again choose his own political survival over the survival. and right we're talking about now of mostly young men, young conscripted soldiers did not choose to be kidnaped. i want to mention, also last night, the former head of the mossad, israel's, you know, vaunted secret agency, tamir pardo, gave an interview here that hasn't been translated into english. and it was just a bombshell. he said the army has won the battles both in gaza and in lebanon, but the government has lost the war for the people of israel. he said it flat out openly, and that is the fear, and that is the feeling here among so many israelis. >> aaron david miller, if you are the trump administration who

comes both from. >> an. >> america first supposed standpoints when it comes to foreign policy, when you have self-styled yourself as the most pro-israel. >> president in american history. what does. >> that dynamic in israel, the fact that the populace. >> may. >> not be where the prime minister is. play into your consideration of how you move forward. >> you know, governing is about choosing, and this administration is going to have to make some decisions about how important an israeli saudi normalization deal is, how important it is to contain iran. they're going to need israeli cooperation for both of these things. but the first order of business is to prevent, i would argue, the israeli hamas deal from cratering. and the reality is so far, so good. you know, a guy jumps off a ten story building and he's passing the fifth floor. somebody yells out, how you doing? and he says, so far, so good. the question becomes, is donald trump who has

taken credit for this hostage deal, who has in some respects dissed. >> the biden. >> administration for not bringing up bringing it about sooner? is donald trump ready to own this agreement? and if so, the question is how much space is he going to give? and no is absolutely right. the prime minister will try to use and play for time. how much space is he going to give benjamin netanyahu as we approach the second phase, this is not joe biden who had this deep, abiding love for the security of israel, the people of israel, the idea of israel, not so much for the netanyahu government. this is donald trump transactional president who wants a nobel peace prize. and if he does, the road to that prize lies through gaza and something for the palestinians. and he's not going to have much patience, i suspect, for benjamin netanyahu, if he sees him delaying, let alone manipulating. >> noga, i have less than. >> a minute left, and i. >> have wanted to push this.

conversation forward to tuesday, to the latter phases of this deal. >> because the. >> stakes are, of course, so high for these. >> families, for the region. >> but i do want to live just for a moment in the celebration of this, of this moment and what it means to the folks you are with in hostage square. >> could you please repeat that question? there's a lot of noise here. >> you got it. i just i want to just give you a second to reflect on the celebration that is happening around you. it's. >> a muted celebration. i just have been talking to people. most are not willing to speak on camera. people are very fearful for the future, very sad for jordan davis, who came back from captivity without his wife and children, very fearful. seeing keith seagull in clearly frail physical health. so it's, i would say, a muted and complicated celebration here in tel aviv.

>> how could it not be noga polanski? aaron david miller, thank you both so much for being. >> with us. >> throughout the hour. i want you to stick with msnbc throughout the entire day as we continue to follow this breaking story out of the middle east. after a quick break, i'm going to be joined by my colleagues, michael steele and symone sanders townsend for the weekend to cover. major breaking news out of washington as the trump administration begins its purge administration begins its purge of the f business. it's not a nine-to-five proposition. it's all day and into the night. it's all the things that keep this world turning. it's the go-tos that keep us going. the places we cheer. trust. hang out. and check in. they all choose the advanced network solutions and round the clock partnership from comcast business. powering more businesses than anyone. powering possibilities.

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