also a huge source of revenue for panama. but they say that the canal is theirs by treaty with the united states, approved overwhelmingly by the senate back in 1997, and that they have administered it independently, that china has ports at either end. but there are ports along the way of the canal that are run by the united states, by taiwan, by singapore. countries from all over the world use this canal because it is such an incredible shortcut between the atlantic and the pacific. so they say that why, since they have been operating it effectively, and why since it's been part of panama for all of these decades, is president trump now saying that china controls the canal? from what we've seen, china does not. it is run by an independent authority that has been in charge for years. we interviewed someone who was in charge here and had spent 44 years working here at the canal, escorting vice president pence in 2017 on a tour here. and they say, why

is the united states going after panama and perhaps its closest ally in the region? secretary rubio here is going to see the canal later today. he's already met with president molina, who is pushing back strongly against the u.s. but the u.s. has all of its power. and we've seen how colombia's president had to back down when president trump asserted his authority, economic authority. so it remains to be seen how this is going to wind up. we'll be here, of course, covering it all for you and everyone else at nbc and msnbc. alex. >> andrea mitchell. thank you so much for that. coming up next, the big breaking news, the trump tariff war with canada and mexico and what's going on behind the scenes as negotiations are underway between the two countries. our next hour starts right now. good day to all of you from msnbc world headquarters here in new york. welcome, everyone. to alex witt reports. we begin with the

breaking news. the president launching a trade war with america's closest neighbors. trump slapped 25% tariffs on most products coming from mexico and canada, another 10% tariff on items from china. and democrats fear food prices will rise. >> call this the donald trump super bowl tax. with the big game coming next week. if you, you know, avocados, tomatoes, beer from mexico, prices are going to go up during the trump first term when president trump put tariffs on canada and the eu and mexico. what happened? it was a tax on virginia consumers. prices went up. and then when those nations retaliated, they retaliated against critical virginia industry. >> canada responded with its own 25% tariffs against $155 billion worth of american goods, including alcohol, furniture, orange juice. and here's new reaction from vice president j.d. vance.

>> the problem. >> with this. >> whole idea that they're. >> going to. >> retaliate is they have already. >> been taking. >> advantage of america. >> for decades. the retaliation is. >> donald. >> trump saying. >> no more. >> and breaking news on the trump administration's purge of doj lawyers and fbi agents who worked on the january 6th cases. new questions about what they why they are being targeted. >> by the way, these are line agents, line agents that are just doing their job. why are they they got assigned to a case because a violent felon went in and assaulted a police officer, and they are now getting put on a list. >> a new nbc news report says a senior fbi official resisted the trump administration's firings so forcefully that some feared he would be dismissed. here's some new reaction from senator lindsey graham. >> i'm looking forward to some of these people finding a new job. now, if you're an agent

working on january 6th case or some other case, and you are assigned to do it and. you know you shouldn't be punished just for doing your job. this idea of keeping everybody in place in the government after trump won the election is insane. >> also breaking today, the senate finance committee says it will vote tuesday on the nomination of robert f kennedy jr for secretary of health and human services. but democrats remain skeptical. >> he believes. >> continues to believe that. >> autism is. >> caused by vaccines, despite the. >> fact that there have been a dozen studies over the years which disprove. >> that when he has other conspiracy theories, when. >> he cannot acknowledge. >> that if you're going to make america healthy, you got to guarantee health care to all people. >> a new video released by president trump on social media purports to show military airstrikes that he says he ordered against a senior isis attack planner in somalia. we

have got reporters and analysts in place covering all of these new developments for us. we're going to begin with nbc news white house correspondent yamiche alcindor, who is with the president in west palm beach, florida. welcome again. yamiche. i know you have new reporting today on the continuing purge of federal workers. so what's the latest? >> that's right. well, we know at nbc news that the acting fbi director really resisted any more firings or more firings than have already happened at the bureau. and he did so, so forcefully that people thought he was going to end up being removed. this all comes as the fbi, at least eight of the most senior executives, have been forced out by the trump administration. multiple heads of fbi field offices have also been taken out. and also, we are hearing that dozens of federal prosecutors who worked on january 6th cases, they've been removed. and there's now this investigation going on, the list being made of fbi agents. that's thousands of them who worked on january 6th cases. they're very worried that they might now be put on a list to be removed from

the bureau. i also have to tell you that i've been talking to sources in the last few hours who say that at the department of energy and the department of education, people who did not have jobs are being put on paid administrative leave because they're trying to root out dni programs. i talked to one person who told me, a union leader who told me at the department of education, there was a diversity program that happened during the first trump administration. this was betsy devos, trump's pick for the department of education. she encouraged people to take diversity trainings. now we're hearing that as many as two dozen or more employees who took that training, they've been put on administrative leave. they're very worried that they could be fired. it's again, they had a whole goal that said they wanted 400 people to take this training. so very worried in the department there. and then you also have usaid. we have elon musk saying that it's an evil agency and that it should be shut down. so there's a lot of eyes going there because there's also senior officials being removed there as well. >> alex. >> let me quickly get to you. the talks of a trade war underway after trump announced

he's going to hit mexico, canada and china with sweeping tariffs. what are you hearing from the administration about it? >> well, the president has been doubling down on his new tariffs. and i want to read to you part of what he posted online because he's acknowledging that prices might go up. and this is, of course, coming after he campaigned on lowering prices for americans. he wrote make your product in the usa and there are no tariffs. will there be some pain? yes, maybe and maybe not. but we will make america great again and it will all be worth the price that must be paid. i also want to play for you some sound of the new department of homeland security secretary, kristi noem. listen to what she had to say. >> these countries have an. opportunity to get on board with. >> the president of the united states, and. >> to partner. >> with us to deal with illegal. >> immigration. >> to take. back their. >> individuals that have been in. our country illegally. >> we want to repatriate. >> them home, and they can be partners. so economically, yes, they will. they will feel pain. they will feel. >> what this. consequences are and. >> will.

>> be able to continue. >> to go forward with a president who's strong, who's putting. >> america first. >> now democrats are blasting these new tariffs. they're saying that it's going to hurt american families. we also heard from foreign leaders who say that they are going to be putting their own tariffs on u.s. goods from that's in mexico and in canada. and china is also saying it might now file a lawsuit with the world trade organization. so a lot going up in an escalating trade war here, alex. >> oh, 100%. okay, yamiche, thank you for that. and joining me for more on how these tariffs will impact your wallet is nbc news senior business correspondent christine romans. give me a sense, my friend, on what the u.s. leader reaction has been throughout the country, and also the extent to which from canada and china, these are going to target specific areas. like what? >> so what's so interesting is you're hearing from democratic governors, you're hearing from mayors. they're concerned about two things. they're concerned about the prices that their constituents will have to pay because of tariffs. a lot of

tariffs are passed on, of course, to the people who consume the goods. right. tariffs are an import tax paid for by the u.s. importer, not by the foreign government. and that's something that that president donald trump often conflates. but you listen to senator tim kaine, for example. he's worried about the prices his constituents are going to pay, but also the businesses in his state that could face retaliation. listen. >> if. >> it was. >> a tax on virginia consumers, prices went up. and then when those nations retaliated, they retaliated against critical virginia industry sectors, especially agriculture and forestry. i remember going out during the trump first term to talk to my farmers and foresters, who by and large, were trump supporters, and they were saying, for god's sake, senator, help us. this is hurting our businesses. >> and he's pointing out this is an academic. i mean, we've gone through this before. they've seen how this plays out in the first trump administration, and they don't think it will be any different this time around. >> how long does it take for this kind of thing to go into effect? so i'm thinking you've got dow futures, the open what,

6 p.m. tonight. >> yeah. >> so he the thing about the market is that he has been saying this for a year. so it's not exactly a surprise that trump is doing this right. so you've got companies and investors who've been preparing. and i think the fallout remains to be seen. i think the bigger fallout is for what it means for what has been until now, a very strong consumer and the car industry. you've got these estimates, $3,000 for the price of a new car. i'm looking at estimates from the consumer technology, you know, groups that are saying you're going to add laptops, a couple hundred bucks to laptops, $100 to video game consoles, stuff that's coming in from china. and then you look at canadian oil. the u.s. imports canadian oil at 4.2 million barrels a day. and we have refineries in the u.s. that are built specifically to handle canadian oil. and then that oil is turned into gasoline that goes into americans cars. and so you're talking 15 to $0.25 extra a gallon. some of these estimates are for what americans will pay. as mr. trump, president trump wants to completely refocus how the american economy works in the

very near term, and maybe the medium term. that will be painful. >> and how long do you think it takes for, say, avocado prices to go up from mexico? i'm just curious. the logistics. people can say, start putting away some money now for your grocery bills. >> you've heard democrats talking about, you know, they want to call it the trump, you know, super bowl tax. it might be that many of these things are already contracted at a certain price in the near term. but but relatively quickly, you're talking about fresh produce, 40% of the fresh produce that comes into this country is imported. right? i mean, you can't make us, you know, us production overnight to replace that. so those things coming in will cost more. and there are very thin margins in the grocery business. in the food business, there's no reason to believe most if not all of those import taxes will be passed to consumers who will pay more in their grocery bill. >> thanks for the great news, christine. >> sorry, josh. >> yeah. all right. appreciate you. nice to see mls. joining me now is molly ball, senior political correspondent at the wall street journal and the host

of the new podcast trump 2.0. molly good to see you my friend. so let's get into this. i spoke with the canadian ambassador earlier today and here's her reaction to the tariffs. take a listen. >> canadians across the country, all levels of our government are determined to respond to what canadians feel are unfair actions based on the actions that we have taken and are willing to take to address the concern that the president has expressed. they feel that this is this doesn't make a lot of sense. >> i mean, molly, throughout my entire interview with her, the canadian officials in general, she of course, representing them, seem unclear on the reasons for these tariffs. is anything the trump administration saying clarifying, or is it more just muddying up this issue? >> i yes and no. i mean. >> they've been saying that. >> america has been. >> getting taken. advantage of,

and that's why these tariffs have. >> to be imposed. >> i think. there's also a sense. >> among many in. >> washington that. >> trump's bluff was. >> sort of called. because he has been. threatening these tariffs for so long and not getting the reaction. >> that he. >> sought, in part because people. >> weren't sure if he was serious. >> so he sort of had to make a move to show that he. >> was really. >> going to do it. and the question now, as you were just discussing with christine, is, is there. >> going to be widespread repercussions in the economy? will people and politicians. >> in particular, will their constituents start to feel this in a way that. >> starts to. >> affect them? and that is the fear that a lot of politicians, including republican politicians, currently have. >> let me ask you, though, you said trump was expecting a certain reaction. what reaction was he expecting that he's getting or maybe not getting? >> the idea was that i believe that these countries would come to the negotiating table and seek some kind of better deal. now, of course, trump already

renegotiated nafta in his first term. he already reopened the north american free trade agreement, got some sort of not extensive, not to say cosmetic changes to it, and rebranded it as the usmca. the us-mexico-canada trade agreement. and that was ratified, in fact, on a bipartisan basis. and he declared victory for having renegotiated nafta. now he's saying that that was not good enough. and they. need even more of an advantageous situation for the united states. and so but but look, you know, everyone from capitol hill to wall street has never been quite clear on whether trump really was determined to do these tariffs or whether they were a negotiating ploy in order to secure a better trade agreements. and now i think we have part of the answer to that question. >> so in terms of the word negotiating, we have a day and change until these take effect. molly, is there any way that things can happen, be negotiated

that they don't get implemented? on tuesday? >> of course. and there's going to be a mad scramble, i suspect. i mean, this entire weekend, as the ambassador, i'm sure alluded to, there have been calls back and forth. there's been frantic diplomacy happening. the whole idea behind this, this tariff push is that it's the united states that has the leverage in this situation that america is able to throw her weight around because we are the biggest economy in the world. we're the biggest consumers in the world. in most of these trading relationships. the trade imbalance is somewhat in our favor in the sense that we're the consumers of most of these exports. we're the market that people need. so either they're going to suck it up and pay the tariff, or they're going to try to negotiate a deal that puts the united states on better footing. we'll see if that happens. >> so donald trump was defending his tariffs online earlier today, molly saying that the tariffs could maybe then he

threw in maybe not cause some pain. they are set to go into effect tuesday. but in terms of politically if he faces pressure from rising prices from americans getting angry for paying a lot more, does he then backtrack or does he need to? i mean, he's been elected for four years. he's not going to run again. >> i think that's the million dollar question is if these tariffs have the consequences that economists almost unanimously believe that they will. trump has a different theory. it's somewhat exotic, but he has one. but if these tariffs do have dramatic economic consequences, will there be a lot of political pressure on the administration. and will they then pull back? you know, the whole stance of this administration, particularly the second time around, has been, hey, we're serious, we're not bluffing. we're actually going to do all those things that we talked about that you said we couldn't do in the first term, and we're going to clear out all of the

obstacles in our path, and we're going to prove that our theories work. we're going to see that play out. we're going to see if the theories work. and but, you know, as you said, trump is not the one who's going to be on the ballot in less than two years time. it's every republican member of the house of representatives and some of the ones in the senate. so they're the ones that i would expect. we're going to start hear hearing grumbling from if, in fact, this has negative economic effects. >> let me switch topics here as we turn to the democrats, who on saturday elected ken martin as the new chairman of the party. and you attended that meeting and you wrote in a new piece today, molly, as the would be leaders bickered over party mechanics, the very pathologies that many critics argue of alienated democrats from the american heartland were on display. a party captive to leftist activists obsessed with divisive litmus tests, out of touch with regular people's concerns and in thrall to a patronizing identity politics that alienates many of the very minorities it is meant to

attract. do you think any of the newly elected leaders, molly, are suited to address these issues, especially with trump now in office? >> well, i think we're going to see whether someone like ken martin is able to successfully improve the democratic brand, which has literally never been worse, according to some polling. but it's going to take a lot. and, you know, the signs in this meeting were not necessarily positive. now, look, rnc meetings are no picnic either. the most extreme activists in both parties tend to come out for these types of party committee meetings. and the democratic national committee's ability to turn around the way the entire party is perceived has got to be somewhat limited. at the same time, there is no other institution that represents the democrats as a whole. and it was ken martin himself who, as i quoted him in my piece, was saying, if we don't do it, who's going to do it? who is going to

represent the democratic party and who is going to fight for the things democrats believe in at a time when they look at what trump is doing in washington and are horrified. and i've heard from many democratic activists across the country that they're worried that the party doesn't have what it takes to stand up to trump. and i've heard from a lot of the smartest, you know, democratic operatives that they look at what happens in party meetings like this and think, oh my god, we're still in denial. and we are not in fighting shape when it comes to the fights that we have to have. >> so as you said, we shall see what happens. molly ball, thank you so much. we'll see you soon. congresswoman jasmine crockett joins me next with reaction to the trump tariffs. plus why she's joining the doj's she's joining the doj's committee. we're back in 90s. this charmin ultra soft smooth tear has wavy edges. it's no ordinary square. charmin ultra soft smooth tear has wavy perforations that tear so much better, with more cushiony softness. enjoy the go, with charmin.

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mucinex 2-in-1 saline nasal spray. spray goodbye. aaaaaaahhhhh! mucinex 2-in-1 saline nasal spray with a gentle mist and innovative power-jet. spray goodbye to congestion. it's comeback season! new york times that the so-called department of government efficiency team now has access to the federal government's payment system. this comes after the highest ranking treasury official resigned friday following a clash with elon musk over giving him access to the payment system. >> we want to know exactly what is elon musk's role? is he a member of the administration? is he a private contractor? is he there as a government contractor? what function is he serving? >> we've been having to assemble this like a jigsaw puzzle to see the extent of what the musk

activities have been, and we need to push back and we need to get information. >> we got. >> elon musk. >> and our. >> friends. >> at doge. >> who are working very hard to find a lot of. >> waste. >> fraud and abuse in government. >> joining me now, democratic congressman from texas, jasmine crockett. she is the vice ranking member on the house oversight committee and now a newly minted member of the doge subcommittee. welcome, my friend. it's good to see you. let's get to what you'll be doing serving on this committee. it's led by congresswoman marjorie taylor greene to provide oversight to doj's efforts. do you know why they went after access to the federal government's payment system? >> i have no idea. but i don't have any positive thoughts. when it comes down to it. i appreciate that you played the clip of jamie. >> raskin. >> and as you know, congressman. >> raskin asked. >> why. >> do you. >> need access? >> i mean. >> here it is. i'm a. >> wholly fully. >> elected member of congress. i don't have that kind of access.

>> so when you start. talking about who. >> should have access. >> to literally the system that controls approximately. $6 trillion. of our dollars, i. >> don't really understand because the people. >> that worked in those positions. >> could only distribute. >> money per the law. so why is it that the doj's committee. >> would have. >> to have access. >> and that's not the place that you go to look for cuts. you look at. >> our budget. >> which it. >> is congress. >> that has the power of the purse. >> you look at our. >> budget, you help the president come up with his proposed budget, and then the house and the senate will decide what we send to his desk. and he gets to decide whether or not he signs it into law. he should not have access to this. and with people already having angst about elon musk and the things that he does as it relates to technology, this is not instilling anything more than another layer of fear, especially since normally when you are going to be in a position like that, you have to go through security clearances. and let me tell you, some people think security clearances are all about whether or not you have a warrant or not. no, they

look at whether or not you have some sort of divided interest. they look at whether or not you have good credit. they look at so many other things, and we're talking about someone who's unelected, unvetted, and definitely unconfirmed. that is now literally sitting atop our $6 trillion. and we don't know what it is that he's doing, and we honestly don't know what role he has. >> look, you have well articulated some of the bad thoughts as you described them at the top here. the question is, does musk's team now have the power to actually disrupt federal payments? >> in my opinion, they do. but i honestly don't know. we still don't know really what doge is in the first place. i mean, listen, think about it like this, alex. you know, everyone in congress, that's just what it is, right? but as a sitting member of congress, i mean, i had to give up my ability to practice law. i am prevented from being able to practice law to prevent potentially somebody

dropping a load of cash on me. and i do something that is nefarious. as one of 435. and now we're talking about a guy who literally gets government contracts from the united states and has not had to divest, has not had to. i mean, it is it is really awful. and i know right now people are asking whether or not their irs refund checks are going to be affected. we don't know if this is more dye. are you going to say if it's somebody that's a person of color, then for some reason, whatever they paid in to the federal government, they're not allowed to get it back. like we don't know. but there is no reason for any political appointee, if you can even call him that, to have this kind of access. there's none. >> let me to the fact that you are also a member of the judiciary committee. and since donald trump took office, multiple top fbi officials and federal prosecutors who all worked on january 6th cases, they're out of a job. and now

the doj wants names of those who worked on the trump or january 6th investigations for possible firing. what do you make of this apparent cleansing? >> i mean, you just you just called it what it is. it's a cleansing. i mean, this is listen, when democrats got out there and we said that our democracy was really at risk, people were like, oh, democrats, you're out there. you're gaslighting. it's not our democracy. well, he did say he'd be a dictator on day one. oh, democrats, you know, it's just trump. he just talks. well, let me tell you something. he is doing more than talking. we talked about project 2025. we talked about the consolidation of power. we talked about how he wanted to be a king. we talked about in a democratic republic. that is not what it is. we have some sort of checks and balances, and he is doing everything that he can to get rid of those checks and balances. the doj and the people that he's going after were simply doing their jobs. the

problem is that americans thought that it was okay to take a full fledged criminal and make him the president of the united states, and then they want to act aghast when he does criminal things. let me tell you, we have a thug in charge of the united states. and if we don't wake up, we may not have a united states, because right now, he has only been successful in being a divider in chief. >> can you tell me what you're hearing about him from republicans, from colleagues that will speak to you off the record? do they have concerns about him? no names, but are you hearing concerns? >> i do hear concerns. and let me make sure that i get this timeline together for the american people. number one, he was sworn in on january 20th. that was on a monday. we were supposed to be in session from tuesday to friday of that week. they canceled our friday votes. so we have only been in session

tuesday, wednesday and thursday of the week that he was sworn in. no other days. they decided to take advantage of the fact that congress was not in, and started to unravel and break as many things in our democracy as they could without us being here. but i can tell you that even when we went through the cr vote, there were republicans that silently or in the background were cheering us on and saying, this is wrong. like they knew we had negotiated. and all of a sudden this guy who's not elected makes a tweet on twitter. and so, no, can i tell you, the republicans want to see elon go down? i can now will they come out publicly and say that? no, because they're concerned about whether or not he'll spend money in their next elections. but there are some. but i need them to understand that this is their time to rise up and do what is right. this is the time to honor the oath that we all took. listen, today i had to enter into agreement with rand paul, something that i

never saw on my bingo card. but this is a guy who made it clear this stupid tariff war is just that. it is dumb. and i have to agree, even when it's somebody like rand paul, i have to agree that he is absolutely correct. >> so just specifically, what is rand paul saying that you said, yeah, i'm backing you up on this. >> on the tariffs. he said that deciding to put these tariffs on mexico as well as canada, i don't think we'll ever scream too loudly about tariffs on china, but that's a whole other issue. but he was saying that it is going to take the cost of things up, and that we should just call it what it is. this is a tax. it is a tax on americans. and his attitude about it was allegedly the republicans don't like to do taxes. so why are we raising taxes on the american people? but that's exactly what it is. it's a tax on us. we are the ones that are going to pay. >> can i just ask you, didn't you hear donald trump say many

times during the campaign he was going to lower prices for the american people? won't this have the opposite effect? >> now? you know, i tried to i tried to ignore a lot of the things that he said. but yes, he did say that he did tell that lie. and we know we've got historic prices right now on eggs for everybody that said, they voted because of the price of eggs. they have only gone up. and just saying that you're going to lower something with only offering concepts of a plan was really the giveaway that he did not have a plan to help you lower the cost of food. instead, as we are seeing these raids that are taking place, we know that we've heard from farmers that people aren't showing up to work. and the reality is that every single city that i've campaigned in, i would ask people, tell me, how many of you plan on going into farming or sending your kids into farming? so you explain to me how that food is going to make it to the grocery store. if there's no one that is actually willing to go out and work the fields. and now let's talk about the foods that we get out of mexico, whether it's our avocados, whether it's

our strawberries, the things that we import. let's talk about what that's going to look like when mexico says, oh, okay, well, they put a tariff on it. we're all that's being passed on to us. and then when it comes to people, especially in my state of texas, where we are one of the largest traders in the world, not just the united states, but in the world. texas is our own economy. and now our biggest trade partner, mexico, is saying, you know what? we're going to slap these tariffs on. what does that mean? those businesses that are doing trade are now going to be hit, because people in mexico may not be buying those items, because now they are going to be too expensive. >> it's always sobering to talk with you, i have to say. but but you also managed to bring a smile to my face with your energy and personality. so thanks. got to say thanks for that as well, representative jasmine crockett. we'll see you again soon. defending the president's latest move that is expected to affect hundreds of thousands of people. what kristi noem said today on meet the press.

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>> is reporting that president trump has revoked temporary protective status for hundreds of thousands of venezuelans. venezuelans arriving in the united states, with even more set to lose the status later this year. let's go to nbc's jorge solis. joining me now from miami. so, jorge, what is the impact here? could those who were legally here in this program now be deported? >> yeah. hey, alex, good to be with you. so what we have here is basically the new dhs secretary. >> making good. >> on a. >> promise to revamp tps, starting with venezuela. we saw. >> that earlier. this week. on wednesday. >> when they. >> announced that they were going. >> to basically undo the extension of tps for venezuelans that were. >> extended by the biden administration. >> so what you have now are hundreds of thousands that are set to lose tps in april. >> that announcement set. >> to take place formally. >> tomorrow. >> on monday, and then at which point 60 days after that, those hundreds of thousands that have tps will lose it. now, secretary noem was asked on meet the press

earlier today about the decision. >> to. >> end the program. revamp it however you want to phrase it. here's what she told our kristen welker. >> well, the. >> the tpp program. has been abused and it doesn't have integrity right now. and folks from venezuela that have come into this country are members of tda. and remember, venezuela purposely emptied out their prisons, emptied out their mental. >> health. >> facilities and sent them to the united. >> states of america. >> so we are ending that extension of that program, adding some integrity back into it. and this administration is evaluating all of our programs to make sure they truly are something that's to the benefit of the united states so that they're not to the benefit of criminals. >> alex, the next deadline to keep an eye on is september. that is when the next group of venezuelans. again, hundreds of thousands. the secretary has until july of this year to make a decision. but of course, she could do something much sooner than that. we'll just have to keep a close eye on it. >> alex. >> count on you to do it for us. george solis, thank you so much. deciphering what's in the black boxes and why they may never

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and their sensations. to get started today at sitter city. >> new details on the midair collision near washington, dc, where investigators are looking into conflicting data about the altitudes of the plane and helicopter. at the time of the crash. nbc's aaron gilchrist is at reagan washington national airport with more on this. so, aaron, when are officials expecting to learn some more information about the data

recovered from the black boxes, and when are we going to hear about it? >> well, the expectation is that they'll be able to learn more information very soon from all three of the data points, data collection points that they're trying to assess. i do want to mention, though, that we expect a news briefing to start here with dc unified command. the people who are in charge of the search, recovery and salvage operation, that should start in about 20 minutes or so. and i think what we'll hear them talk about is what you're seeing on your screen here. now, this is a large crane that we've seen come in on a barge in the last hour or so. we knew that the expectation was they would need to use one of these large cranes in order to lift the fuselage of the airplane out of the water. here, along with the wreckage of the helicopter as well. and so we expect to get an update on when that process might get underway. we've been told by the fire chief that the 25 victims who remain unaccounted for at this point, they believe they'll be able to find them once

they're able to lift the fuselage out of the water. you referenced the ntsb investigation that we got an update on last night from the ntsb. they were able to share with us some of their early preliminary data. and we should note that this is very preliminary data because they don't have full data sets at this point, but they were able to retrieve from the cockpit data recorder in the airplane, as well as the voice recorder in the airplane revealed that that aircraft was at about 325ft of altitude as it was coming in when this collision happened on wednesday night, the radar inside the control tower here at dca indicated that they were that the that the helicopter was at about 200ft. so there's a 100 foot discrepancy between the two data retrieval with the data retrieval that the ntsb has been able to do at this point, what we were told is that they really need to get into that black box from the helicopter. they have it. they're trying to access that information now, but that should be able to tell them what

the altitude was for the helicopter and hopefully reconcile the differences that they're seeing right now. you also asked about the questions that still remain as it relates to who was working in the tower that night. i want you to hear what the new secretary of transportation had to say about his remaining questions. >> i'm going to leave the investigation. >> and the details to come out to. >> the ntsb. >> but i'll tell you this. the questions i have is, you know what was happening inside the tower? were they understaffed? was it a right. decision to consolidate the positions of the. >> air traffic controllers. >> from 2 to 1? those are questions that we need answers to. >> now, we know from the ntsb that there were five people working in the tower here at the time of this crash. they've been able to interview some of them. we're told that they intend to interview all five of them. there may be multiple interviews with them that they hope to have completed sometime tomorrow. again, alex, this is really about gathering as much information as is possible from as many sources, people and

machinery as possible in order to come to some conclusion about what happened here and to make some recommendations to prevent this from happening in the future. >> yeah, it's a pretty wide investigation, understandably so. aaron gilchrist, thank you, my friend. joining me now is archer, aviation chief safety officer and former acting faa administrator billy nolan. billy, i'm curious what your sense is on how long the investigation is going to take to complete. and are there any challenges to finding evidence based facts because of the intrusion of water into the black boxes? does that worry you? >> no. >> not at all. >> thanks. >> alex, for. >> having me on today. >> let me. >> just say. >> this is. >> these are. >> the that. >> the. >> ntsb is. >> very good at. >> it is. >> it is absolutely. >> you know, without without. >> a doubt, the. >> best investigative. >> agency in the world. >> and they. have done this for a very. very long time. they know how to do it. you know, whether you get. a black box that's in salt water. >> they're very. >> skilled at getting at that data. so. >> you know.

>> going back to. the points raised. >> right. >> the integrity of our system depends on this. we have this. layered approach to. >> safety. and it depends. >> on controls by controls. you've got regulations. you know you've got atc procedures. that said maintain x altitude. >> you've got procedures for. >> what you can and can't do. you have technical procedures like the things you have on board an aircraft. so right now we're just we are at this stage where the ntsb is waiting to, to be able to read out the data from the black hawk helicopter that will give them a sense and be able to say, because so far, what we've gotten is the data from american eagle. 5342 right. so that ability to just be able to correlate that and say, why is there a difference? tower shows, you know, the helicopter at 200ft obviously is at the at some point is at the same altitude with the airplane and thus the collision. so those are the things that they will work to resolve in the coming days. >> give me a sense of how

dangerous it is, though, to speculate about the cause of this crash before this data is obtained and confirmed. is it wrong to presume there are growing holes in the country's aviation safety system that led to this tragedy? >> absolutely. >> and i'm just going to say that emphatically. i have been in aviation for 45 years. i was in the military. i flew both helicopters and airplanes thousands of hours in both. i was an airline captain. i have been an executive for a long time. you know, it takes a while. and one of the axioms of accident investigation is that everything we think we know today may be disproved tomorrow by the revelation of additional facts. so this is that's just one reason to allow the process to play itself out. the ntsb has all the stakeholders have a seat at the table. you've got, you know, the ntsb, you got the airlines, you got the military, you've got the manufacturer, you've got labor. everybody is there. and there's a series of different groups. there's an

operational group, there's a data group, there's a human factors group. and so when i when i talk about controls and control effectiveness, we don't expect i mean, we've come a long way in this country. we don't expect to have accidents at all. in fact, we've worked hard to try to get rid of even near misses. so it's been nearly 16 years. that's a pretty doggone good record. but we never rest on that record, right? you're you're forever thinking, you know, how can we continually assess how close we are, what we're doing and how safe we are? that's what we owe and what we owe the american people. and that's why we should allow this process to run its course. and then i can assure you that that chair and a very capable team at the ntsb will get to the bottom, and they'll have answers most likely sooner than we were expecting. you know, they're already expecting to come out with a preliminary report within 30 days. >> okay. i'll let that be the final word. billy nolan, thank you so much for weighing in. one of the first and biggest tests

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>> the strength to make. >> their voices. >> heard and try. >> to. >> help create a climate. >> of opinion. >> that enables. >> these institutions, these people who run these institutions, to do. >> the right thing. >> well, jon meacham, you are certainly in my light tonight. >> after a week of testy hearings on capitol hill, the senate finance committee says it will vote tuesday at 10 a.m. on robert f kennedy jr. s nomination for health and human services secretary, republican senator bill cassidy, chair of the senate health committee, who also sits on the finance committee, said he has been struggling with rfk jr. s nomination. well, joining me now, natasha korecki, nbc news politics reporter. natasha, welcome. i know that you covered the hearing. so is the senate finance committee announcing this tuesday vote because republicans believe they have enough support for rfk jr. s nomination. >> well, what. >> sources tell us is that they do believe he has. >> he can't he may have enough votes. >> however.

>> we do know that bill cassidy. >> as as. >> you just. >> noted. a republican, a physician. >> he he also. >> chairs the. >> the health. committee that. >> that was a you know, it was. >> a. >> courtesy hearing. but it. >> was a follow. up hearing. where where rfk jr. was really grilled. >> we do know. >> that cassidy. >> has significant issues. >> he raised those. >> and we do know. >> that other senators. >> have significant issues. everything from. financial disclosures, potential. >> conflicts of interest when. >> it comes to finances. his, you know, past comments on. >> vaccines and. his inability. >> to. >> really explain. >> what. medicaid and medicare does and. >> answer questions. >> on that, which is. >> going to be a huge part. >> of that job. >> should he be confirmed? >> huge. let's move from that one to fbi director nominee kash patel, shocking some senators with the degree to which he departed from the maga flamethrower persona that he has

exhibited for years. what was the reaction to him denying comments he's made on video from both sides of the aisle? the reaction, right? >> i mean. >> democrats were. >> just taken aback. >> by how. overt it seemed to be. you know, they're quoting. >> him and. >> saying, this is what you said. >> then why. >> are you saying. >> something different now? >> what he did was. >> really backtrack from a lot of those flame. >> thrower comments that he made. >> in the. >> past about, you know, capitol police officers who spoke up about the violence, you know, breaking the. >> chain of command. >> instead. >> he. >> took much. >> more of a tone that was supportive of law enforcement officers. and also what really rattled maga was. his saying that he disagreed. >> with commutations. >> and pardons. >> for those taking. >> part in violent acts. and we understand that caught. the attention of the president. whether that is enough to scuttle. >> anything, it does not seem to. >> be the case yet, but

definitely. that was an issue for him, and it came from both. >> sides of the aisle. >> give me a quick sense only because i'm running out of time. tulsi gabbard, her hearing for dni. what is the likelihood that she passes? of the three, is she the most vulnerable? >> absolutely. the most vulnerable. >> we had. >> reporting yesterday saying. >> 50 over 50 chance senators, republican senators did not. >> like her answer. >> on edward. >> snowden, did not. like that. >> she could not say that he was a traitor. >> they wanted. >> to hear that that caught the eye of the president himself. and he he he. >> wondered aloud. >> according to our reporting, about whether that would harm her. and we have somebody from the. >> white house saying. >> of all. the nominees, hers seems to be the one that's biggest in doubt of the of those three. >> controversial of those three. natasha korecki, it's good to talk with you. thank you so much. and that everyone's going to do it for me on this edition of alex witt reports. we'll be back next saturday. sunday, 1 p.m. eastern. deadline white p.m. eastern. deadline white house weekend. next. before you go to extremes to fix sagging and wrinkles

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