right where you are. thank you for joining on way too early. that was way too early for tuesday morning. we're staying because morning joe starts right now. >> over the weekend, president trump. >> announced new tariffs on. >> canada and. mexico that are. expected to start. >> a. >> trade war. >> people are. >> wondering why. >> trump would. >> start a war with our closest allies. >> and he was like. >> i didn't say anything about. >> russia and north korea. >> president trump is delaying tariffs on canada and mexico for at least a month after speaking with leaders of. >> both countries. >> but he is moving forward with across the. >> board tariffs. >> on chinese products. we're going to go through china's overnight response. >> and the economic implications. >> of all of this. >> also ahead, we'll dig into elon musk's. >> massive influence. >> over the federal government at the. >> moment as the. unelected billionaire works to. >> shut down. >> a key. >> humanitarian agency. >> and on capitol hill today,

there will be key votes for two of the president's most controversial cabinet nominees. we'll take a look at where support. stands for rfk jr and tulsi gabbard right now. and good morning and. >> welcome to morning joe. it is tuesday, february 4th, along. >> with joe, willie and me. we have the co-host of the fourth hour, jonathan lemire. he's a contributing writer at the atlantic covering the white. house and national politics, us special correspondent. >> for bbc. >> news, katty. >> kay, the host. >> of way too early, ali vitali and president emeritus of the council on foreign relations richard haass. >> he's the author of the. >> weekly newsletter home and. >> away. >> available on. >> substack. >> and former treasury official and morning joe economic analyst steve rattner is here. >> and willie. >> was just listening to. >> katty on way too early. >> talking about. >> how donald trump sort of plays it by ear. the people around him talking about how,

you know, he will go out, he'll say he's going to do. >> something. >> see how it works out, and. >> then move around. >> anybody that's read the first three pages of art of the deal know that's what he says he does. he shows up in his office, he sits down, he takes phone calls, and he sees how things are going to shake out. i'm sure he also is looking at the markets yesterday premarket trading. and so we get this of course wall street journal talking about how the trade deal is delayed certainly. on mexico and canada. our two closest trade allies. and of course with mexico we got a positive deal. and mexico feels like they got a positive deal. fentanyl, you know, stop fentanyl coming to the united states. and the united states does its best to stop high capacity guns going

going to mexico. so sort of this standoff both sides can claim victory. the wall street journal actually lead editorial which we're going to talk about in a second, says president trump blinks. but of course, that's not what his supporters are saying right now. >> yeah. >> and that. >> art of the. >> deal style. >> works in new york real estate. or if you're hosting a reality show. but when you're the president of the united states, it tends to throw the world into a bit of chaos. now his side and he are arguing that that big tariff announcement got him to a place where he wanted to be, which was to push mexico into a corner and get them to make concessions on the border. same goes for canada. but meanwhile the markets and our international relations suffer for it. and also now we're talking about china because president trump's 10% tariff on all chinese goods now is in effect. and china has retaliated immediately, announcing overnight a series of measures, including its own levies on american products. beginning on

february 10th, china will impose an additional tariff of 15% on coal and liquefied natural gas and a 10% tariff on other items like crude oil and agricultural machinery. but mika, so this is what everyone expected. of course, an escalation from whoever you put the tariffs on, whether it's mexico or canada or china. again, the president saying this is basically a negotiating tactic and we'll see if it turns out to be that way in china's case as well. >> and was the deal that was struck with canada a deal that we've seen before? president trump is backtracking on 25% tariffs for canadian and mexican goods. now, the move comes after the leaders of canada and mexico announced plans to ramp up security at their borders to help combat the transport of drugs and illegal immigrants into the u.s. regarding canada, trump posted on social media yesterday the tariffs would be paused for 30 days to see if a

final economic deal can be reached with the country. additionally, canadian prime minister justin trudeau revealed that canada would implement a $1.3 billion plan to reinforce the border with new technology, equipment and nearly 10,000 frontline personnel to coordinate with the u.s. to stop the flow of fentanyl. one interesting note trudeau's announcement yesterday was a repeat of the same border plan the canadian government unveiled in december during the biden administration. and earlier yesterday, mexico's president announced that her nation would immediately reinforce its northern border with 10,000 national guard members to address drug trafficking. trump stated the u.s. will continue negotiations with mexico over border security during the 30 day tariff delay. >> you know, an. >> interesting thing. >> happened yesterday. during the. president's signing. ceremony inside the white house.

>> rupert murdoch was there and somebody asked what he thought about the wall street journal editorial page, calling this the dumbest. i think that the dumbest trade war ever. and he. >> said. >> sometimes they don't agree with the wall street journal editorial page. today would be one of those days as well, because, of course, the wall street journal editorial page, like most economists and people that read the wall street journal, have. have long been opposed to the idea of tariffs. and so, in its latest editorial titled trump blinks on north american tariffs, that editorial board writes in part this if north american leaders need to cheer. about a minor deal so they can. all claim victory, that's better for everyone. the need is especially important for mr. trump, given how much he boasted that tariffs are a foolproof diplomatic weapon against friend or foe. mr. trump can't afford to look like the guy who lost. mexican president

claudia. >> sheinbaum. >> in particular, seems to recognize this, and so far she's playing her trump cards with skill. none of this means the tariffs are some genius power play, as the trump media chorus is boosting, writes the wall street journal editorial page. certainly about other people within their own media conglomerate, news corp. but they. >> go on and. >> write mr. trump's weakened tariff broadsides against a pair of neighbors has opened a new era of. economic policy uncertainty that won't calm down until the president does. as he warned many times before election day, this is the biggest economic risk of donald trump's second term. and that's what as as they warned beforehand, katty, i thought it was very interesting. your take again politically on how this was all going to go down there were there were people that were close to. donald trump who always had said, it's always an

opening bet. if he talks about 25% tariffs, it's an opening bid. and i spoke to some people at the white house yesterday and also some supporters of his yesterday who who laughed and said, we told you so. we told you so. he was never going to impose 25% tariffs on canada or mexico, which seems to line up with what you say. he'll talk about it, he'll put it out there. but if things start going south, if the stock market drops, he's going to find his way out of there. >> yeah. and the timing was interesting right. we saw the stock market open. we saw it drop in that first half hour or so. it fell by about 5600 points. it didn't look good. the market wasn't happy. and quite quickly we got an announcement following that from mexico that there had been a resolution. immediately the market bounced back up again. that's what the white house would like to see. now, maybe the president was gambling that if he announced

this on friday, by monday, the markets would be happy with this. there is still the question of what happens in 30 days. and there's the longer term question of if you are now canada or mexico, who, by the way, have not really given up very much to get this pause. i mean, i think mexico, canada is sending a border czar. that's it. the rest of their program they'd already announced. same with mexico then. do you then has to some extent, the damage been done even by the announcement of this? is there a feeling that if you can, you're going to diversify your relationships, your trade relationships, to the extent that it is possible make those more friction free because you don't know whether in 30 days, actually donald trump will decide he is going to impose these tariffs. and the eu, who have already been put on notice by donald trump over the weekend, even to some extent the uk, they're now going to have to go through this same process as well. so whether or not this leads to an immediate tariff war, right now, there is an eroding of relationships that

have benefited the united states. i feel like i know i'm preaching to the converted here, joe, and i don't need to tell you this, these relationships and these trading relationships have benefited the united states enormously for the past 30, 40, 50 years. do other countries with donald trump in in power for the next four years start thinking, okay, we do need to try to do something to weaken our reliance on the united states and look elsewhere, right? >> yeah. jonathan, let me, let me let me just say, though, this is a powerful, potent political issue for donald trump. and i can say firsthand, when i was running in 1994, i was shocked at one point, i went over to the rural part of my district in defuniak springs, and i was talking about tax cuts and balanced budgets and a strong national defense and a rising china and what the united states

needed to do. every question was about nafta, nafta, nafta, national sovereignty, nash. it was nafta. if i could think back to 94. and this is a world we still live in. if you if you look at donald trump's face, it was about nafta. it was about gatt. it was about the world trade organization. and anybody in the media that looked at what donald trump was saying yesterday in that in, in, in the white house, in the oval office and didn't think that was connecting with, with the rank and file base saying, you know, we need to push them harder here. we need to push them harder there. he talked about germany. he said, hey, we've got a lot of bmw and mercedes that are going around driving around in the united states. you don't see any chevys in berlin, do you? that sort of talk, you know, dick gephardt used it in the democratic party. you have

populists in both parties using it. i'm just saying we all we all understand what the wall street journal editorial page says. what steve rattner is about to say. but democrats need to understand this is a powerful, potent issue. when you talk about economic nationalism. >> yeah, there's no doubt trump. >> for. >> a long time. >> now has had his finger on the pulse of economic nationalism, economic populism. and he believes the tariffs are a way to do that. now, as. >> katie said, there's. >> a risk. there's a downside here. these are two of the united. >> states closest allies. >> and there's. >> some real hard feelings. >> we heard prime. >> minister trudeau talk over the weekend. >> a real sense. >> of betrayal. >> that the united states would do this, considering. >> how canada has come. >> to the. us's aid time and time again in times of need. so we will see what that relationship looks like going forward. even as this crisis briefly passes. as someone put it to me yesterday, close to president trump, at the end of. >> the day. >> it is showbiz like this is

something he is going to make. >> a show. >> he's going to claim some sort of win, even if there aren't really significant changes to mounties at the border up north. and we should note the 10,000 troops the mexican government has agreed to place at the southern border of the united states. it's exactly the same deal that gave president joe biden back in 2021. so that that also familiar not breaking new ground, but at least in the short term, joe, an economic and economic win. the issue will be as that same person close to the president put to me yesterday is how much risk is trump willing to take with the markets? we saw them open up badly yesterday. you know, this was just a one day trade war. you know, if you will trump reaching those agreements with mexico and canada both before the closing bell. the markets recovered somewhat. but is he going to want to do that again in 30 days or 30 days after that, or 30 days after that, when such, he stakes his popularity and success to wall street? >> yeah. and i will say, even after we backed down on canada and mexico as a nation, as the

wall street journal business and finance page say, steelmakers are hiking prices ahead of tariffs right now. and willie again that, you know, it reminds me a lot of the campaign where you know i sat here i won't talk about everybody else. i sat here talking about how the united states economy was the envy of the world, how jobless rates were at record lows over a period of time, how the dollar was. all of these positive things were going out there. americans weren't feeling it. they weren't feeling it because of inflation, because of rising gas prices, grocery prices up 20, 25% over the past four years. that's when i talk about this economic nationalism that is a strong sell in middle america. we all know we can all talk about tariffs and especially against canada and mexico, how bad that would be for us, how bad that would be for consumers. but for a lot of americans, they see they see

economic wreckage. since nafta was implemented back in 1994. so this is again, it's a challenge for democrats. it's a challenge for free trade republicans. it's a challenge for people. the wall street journal editorial page to make these arguments and explain to americans who, who, who are economic nationalists what their view is and why tariffs against mexico and canada would be so shortsighted. >> yeah, despite what we know from economists. and we'll talk to steve in a second here about what tariffs do to cost to consumers in the united states. these moves were cheered during the campaign. and then when he proposed them a couple of days ago by his supporters, one other note, as john mentioned, that the biden administration had struck a deal with canada. this deal that canada announced yesterday and the response to the tariffs about what they're going to do with the border, 10,000 troops stop fentanyl, more than $1 billion was already

put in place, negotiated with the biden administration in december. and they sort of re-announced it yesterday to placate donald trump. so just fascinating management of the president here. let's get to steve rattner and some of his charts. steve, we talk about how tariffs disrupt the markets, how they raise prices for consumers. show us what excuse me, what it means in charts. >> sure. >> well, first of all, let's take a look at what both katy and jonathan. >> alluded to yesterday. >> which was the performance of the stock market. since all this. >> all this began. >> it was it was. >> sort of. >> pre-announced on friday and the market. started down on friday. and then over. >> the weekend, on saturday, when he actually announced. >> the tariffs, you can see there. >> that the market just plunged. >> and then it came partway back. >> so why only partway back? >> because the market is. now scared and worried about where trump is actually going. what does this. >> all. >> amount to? it's not even. >> really clear. >> exactly what. >> trump wants. >> he talks about fentanyl. >> he talks.

>> about immigration, but he also talks about cars coming in from china. and why aren't. >> we making these cars here? >> so who knows where he's going? to the point that a couple of people have referred to already. these three countries are our three biggest trading partners. we import $1.3 trillion. >> a year. >> of stuff from them. and as you can see on the chart on the right, that has just been going up and up and up and up. and so. it's not just china, mexico and canada really are critical to our economy. and so the stock market is saying we're not sure this is over. we're glad it's been on pause. but now we've got a very volatile president. it's a little hard to know where this is going next. >> so as you know, steve said, so president trump yesterday of course. and throughout the rhetoric surrounding these tariffs and needing tougher borders is talking about fentanyl and migration. but these are already starting to ease are they not. >> they are actually. and that's part of what you guys were referring to that steps have been taken by mexico and canada in the past to deal with that. well, first of all, let's start with canada. there is no issue

in canada with immigrants or with fentanyl. something like 1.9 kilos of fentanyl crossed the canadian border last year. you could put that in my coffee cup, basically. >> i wouldn't recommend that though. >> no, i wouldn't drink it, but you could put it there and we have no noticeable immigration across the northern border. so all of this is complete hocus pocus just to somehow placate trump on the mexican side. there are there are issues and we have been trying to deal with them. if you look at the fentanyl situation on the left chart, you can see fentanyl use actually peaked a couple of years ago. it actually went up a lot during covid. covid was a big driver of overdoses and opioids and things like that. it's been coming down and the amount crossing the border has also been coming down a bit. amlo, the previous mexican president, frankly, wasn't that great about the border and fentanyl. but the new president, sheinbaum, is really has been focused on already again, before trump showed up. if you look at the right side, you can see on immigration, yes, it went up a heck of a lot under

biden. but interestingly enough, people crossing the border between legal ports of entry, between official government posts is now lower than it was when trump left office. though those the rest of the people are coming in here effectively, legally, they're going to a customs official. they're saying, i want to come here and they're asking for asylum. and so there's more we can certainly do on the border. but this is a bit of a problem and a solution in search of a problem. all right. >> so much. >> going on. we haven't even gotten to trump's attempt to shut down the u.s. agency for international development. we will talk to richard haass about that. also coming up on morning joe, a showdown in the senate today with a key vote on robert f kennedy jr. s nomination to be health and human services secretary. and it could be a key test for at least one republican senator. we'll talk about that. and where some of president trump's other controversial nominees stand this morning, plus, the single most important

battle democrats must wage, the washington post reports. eugene robinson joins us to explain that. we're back in 90s. >> you may ask yourself. >> you may ask yourself. >> well, need a shipping solution that'll grow with you? with shipstation, you can manage and fulfill all your orders in one place. plus, you get more carrier options, at the lowest rates. keep your business growing. head to shipstation.com to start your free trial. (♪♪) some people just know they could save hundreds on car insurance by checking allstate first. duke versus unc. what a storied rivalry? like you know to check your outfit first before meeting your girlfriend's family. that's a tough one to recover from steve. the disappointment on their faces says it all. uh-uh. yeah, checking first is smart. yeah. so check allstate first for a quote that could save you hundreds. you're in good hands with allstate.

sling. >> okay. >> morning. >> i only left sling. deliver the news. i need to stay informed. thank you very much. >> nice one. >> nope. sling gives us all the news we want in a quick and reliable manner. >> and at a wonderful price. >> this critical time. calls for the critical news coverage. >> that sling provides. >> okay, see you tomorrow. >> the most important news at the best price. sling lets you do that. >> i'm howie mandel, the. >> newest ambassador. >> of skechers. funny story, how i became an ambassador. i went to the store and. >> i lied. >> and said i. >> was an ambassador. >> do i get a discount? the owner called me and said, would you like to. >> be an ambassador. >> for skechers? and i said, yes, try skechers slip ins. >> it's 21 past the hour. the senate finance committee will vote today on whether to advance the nomination of robert f kennedy jr for health and human services secretary. the fate of kennedy's bid could fall upon

republican senator bill cassidy of louisiana. senator cassidy, a medical doctor, is a member of the finance committee and chairman of the health committee. the other panel that held a hearing for rfk jr. he has openly struggled with kennedy's nomination. meanwhile, another of trump's cabinet picks just picked up a key endorsement ahead of her committee vote. later today, republican senator susan collins of maine has announced she will vote in favor of tulsi gabbard for director of national intelligence. she explained her decision to reporters yesterday. >> after extensive consideration, conversations with her in my office, attending the hearing, questioning her there and listening to her in the closed session, i decided to vote that i will vote for her. i

believe she's committed to strengthening our national security, and i questioned her extensively about her views on edward snowden, and i am now satisfied that she will not seek in any way to have him pardoned, which was a question that i answered in open session. >> you know, there's an old. >> saying in. >> soccer in in english football, it's the hope that kills you. yeah, i suspect they have a similar saying in maine about susan collins. it's a hope that can i wonder, richard, if she was assured, by the way, tulsi gabbard handled her relationship with the butcher of syria, assad responsible for the

murder of 500,000 syrians, also, who used chemical weapons against his own people or are again edward snowden, where she refused to condemn snowden in one question after another question after another question. susan collins, supposedly a traditional republican. there is no way she would ever vote for tulsi gabbard except for political expediency and fear. is there richard? i'll put that in question form. thank you for that rhetorical question, joe. no. what comes to mind, joe, is remember abba eban, the former israeli foreign minister, and he once famously said about palestinians, they never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity. well, susan collins never misses an opportunity to disappoint. she is a serial disappointment, and tulsi

gabbard rarely misses an opportunity to get it wrong. you know, the only good news is this is not the most critical job in the us government. the office of the director of national intelligence has a you know, i'm not saying it's insignificant, but there's more important jobs. secretary of defense, the head of the cia, and so forth. but that said, she's not qualified to the job. she's been, shall we say, consistently wrong in her judgments and the idea that she might be confirmed for this is another what, just another disappointment. and it's a head shaker. yeah. >> she also has endorsed the russian view of the war in ukraine, among many other things that people are concerned about. but it appears she now has senator collins's vote. meanwhile, there's rfk jr. in his latest editorial titled rfk hearings remove all doubt. he is not fit to lead a key federal health agency. the new york post editorial board writes this this morning, quote robert f kennedy jr. s two day senate confirmation hearing should remove all doubt he is

absolutely unfit to head the department of health and human services. look, it's never wrong to ask questions, even about settled science, but kennedy has spent a near lifetime promoting a dangerous, outright lie about vaccines, even in the face of hard proof that they work. that might have dissuaded many people from getting them and then later contracting illnesses they could have prevented. oh, and by coincidence, his anti big pharma claims just so happened to supply ammunition for fellow lawyers suing those companies. most of all, kennedy lacks basic skills to run a large federal agency, particularly one where following the science is actually vital. senators need to block rfk jr. s nomination and keep america healthy again. the new york post editorial board. ali vitali so are there republican senators willing to block rfk jr. s nomination in a way that they have not been willing to for any other nominee so far? >> maybe. we watched the public struggle for one of the key

republican senators here, bill cassidy of louisiana. he, of course, chairs the health committee, but he's also on the finance committee. so we'll get a little bit of instruction later this morning about if the struggle actually ends up yielding anything in terms of saying no to rfk's nomination. now, the initial test is going to be in the finance committee later this morning. they're going to vote. rfk jr. out of that committee, they can either recommend him favorably or unfavorably. so if cassidy decides that's where he wants to show his cards, that's where he wants to say no. then we'll see it be reported unfavorably, but it doesn't really do anything. that nomination still goes to the floor. and then, of course, there's the question of if cassidy would keep that kind of a no vote on the floor. and all of this is really theoretical, because cassidy has told reporters time and again in the halls of congress that he doesn't want to talk about this. but the thing that has the common thread for all of the people that we talk about during these confirmation battles, whether it's joni ernst with pete hegseth, thom tillis with

pete hegseth, bill cassidy for rfk jr. susan collins for tulsi gabbard. the common thread is all of these people are going to be on a ballot in 2026. some of them have already received primary challenges, but that threat is something that comes up in every conversation that i have with my sources on the hill about this. the politics looms so large over everything elon musk and the millions that he could throw into a primary challenge. others who can ignite the maga base online and direct their ire at some of these senators. all of that is factored in, and it really is a sign of how palpable the politics of a primary is in this maga era. and frankly, as much as we talk about trump and elon's relationship and its potential to fray or fracture, this is actually one of the things that continues to work in elon musk's favor within the trump administration is that he, in addition to the work that he's trying to do in government, is also the guard dog of the

maga agenda because he can leverage millions at primary challenges. and all of that is in in the mix here on capitol hill. >> i mean, it's the same catch 22, though, that republicans have faced for some time. people like susan collins. susan collins is going to be carrying tulsi gabbard around on her shoulder. if she gets through a primary in maine and then runs in the general election, she's going to have to justify that vote. she's going to have to justify a lot of other votes. the same with thom tillis, who's going to have to justify a vote for pete hegseth and katty kay? the question is, we talked about the doctor, bill cassidy, down in louisiana, but every republican is going to have to justify a vote for rfk jr. who again, has has has been what appears to be anti-science and just on the just on the working

knowledge appears not to know the difference between medicare and medicaid. he couldn't even answer that question when asked about the difference between medicare and medicaid. >> yeah. and remember, tulsi gabbard and kennedy are both democrats. you'd think that they might be easier for senators to vote against with their own constituents saying that, you know, we disagree on principle or ideology. the wall street journal had a fascinating tiktok of the 24 hours that it took for thom tillis to go from a no on pete hegseth to a yes on pete hegseth. and the amount of pressure that was put on him. and that's not even the joni ernst style online pressure that could or could not be orchestrated by elon musk if he chose to. some members of congress that i've spoken to said, listen, it's not just the primarying that we have to worry about. it's actually our own personal safety that we now have to worry about. i have to worry about the safety of my spouse,

the safety of my children if i defy donald trump. and when you've got don jr. coming out very forcefully and saying, we want all of these to be a yes, there is no exception for tulsi gabbard. there is no exception for bobby kennedy. he is speaking for the maga base. and literally i've had members of congress say, look, you know, you do have to worry in this day and age. you have to worry about your own safety as well. it's not just the primary factor. >> yeah. and guys, i was on the hill last thursday during that day where they had hearings all happening at once for kennedy and patel and tulsi gabbard, and they're talking to congressional aides. the thing is, it's about the math. what's so hard for these republican senators is being that one vote who can be blamed? it's hard to be that fourth vote. if you are assuming that collins and murkowski and mcconnell, who showed a willingness to defy trump, are going to be three. now, tulsi gabbard's case. susan collins didn't even get there. but we know there are some other republican senators who have real concerns about her. we're watching todd young from indiana

as well. but the issue is it's so hard to do it. with four. and these aides were saying what they would really need would be to a bunch of senators to come together to say no. so therefore it could be five, six, seven, or eight, and therefore that one person doesn't get all the blame, and potentially that elon musk backed primary challenge. >> well, and let's let's again underline what katie just said. members of congress are telling her that they're not only afraid of primary challenges, they're afraid of violence. they're afraid of violence. if they vote against people who are unqualified to run the most important agencies in america. >> that's definitely not how it's supposed to work. now, let's turn to the latest efforts by the trump administration to shut down the u.s. agency for international development. secretary of state marco rubio said yesterday he is now the acting director of usaid. he has appointed pete morocco, a state department official, to review all of the work done by the

agency. morocco held several national security positions during the first trump administration, including at usaid, where his attempts to consolidate power and slash funding drove officials to write a dissent memo that ultimately pushed him out of office, according to multiple sources who spoke with nbc news. morocco was also among those who stormed the capitol the day of the january 6th insurrection. people familiar with the agency's operations say. morocco has largely directed the recent downsizing of the agency from afar. yesterday, staffers were told to stay out of the agency's washington headquarters after elon musk said president trump supported closing the agency. democratic lawmakers protested the closure. >> you cannot wave away an agency that you don't like or that you disagree with by

executive order, or by literally storming into the building and taking over the servers. that is not how the american system of government works. >> they're shuttering agencies and sending employees home in order to create the illusion that they're saving money in order to do what? pass a giant tax cut for billionaires and corporations. >> we talked. >> about trump. >> wanting to be a. dictator on. >> day one, and here. >> we are. >> this is what the beginning of. dictatorship looks like. when you got the constitution and you install yourself as the sole power. that is how dictators are made. >> so dictators also, though, don't have to deal with federal judges in the d.c. circuit,

which, you know, richard, this will obviously go there because this is an organization, this is a bureaucracy that was founded by congress. these programs are funded by congress. you can't write that away with a pen. you can you certainly you certainly can go through the actions. and again, you can make that appearance. but who knows, maybe the courts will buckle. they certainly haven't shown that over the past month or so. but there will be legal challenges starting this week, i'm sure. and i'm curious. richard, yesterday i brought up harry truman's meeting with herbert hoover after world war two ended. and of course, herbert hoover was the butt of every democrats joke for 15 years before that meeting, democrats blaming herbert hoover for everything. but harry truman

understood that the united states had to get aid to those left destitute and starving after world war two, or as hoover. herbert hoover said to harry truman in the oval office that day. he said basically, starving europeans, equal europeans that become communists. you can say the same thing in africa, whether you're talking about al qaeda, whether you're talking about isis, whether you're talking about china's influence on the continent, whether you're talking about russia's influence on the continent and all across the global south. take us. take us through the importance of these programs, these aid programs and, and let's just leave the humanitarian part of this to the side, because i know there are a lot of people that want to destroy this agency that don't care about that. let's

talk about the security. let's talk about how these programs help us get intel on al qaeda, whether it's in the ivory coast or across the global south. help us get intel on isis. help us get intel on what the chinese are doing and where the chinese are moving for a pittance as as katty said, for a pittance of our budget. but it is a pittance. we're talking about one half of $0.01 on the dollar for the budget, one half of $0.01. when you look at this in this humanitarian and developmental aid. we'll put aside the humanitarian, though i will say there are hundreds of millions of people arguably alive around the world because of what the united states has done over the decades. and by the way, some of the people who are alive are americans. one of the things we have to think about is outbreaks of various diseases. we lost a million americans over covid. one of the lessons we ought to have derived is these two things we call

oceans are not moats and disease. viruses, bacteria, and so forth can reach the united states. if you have disease outbreaks, we could have one with avian flu coming up soon. the united states is vulnerable. so that's one of the areas of narrow self-interest. joe, you were pointing to the strategic. what we're doing in many cases strengthens weak states, weak states, weak countries are are grounds where terrorists, pirates, other such groups take take control. and again, we are incredibly vulnerable to the to countries where the governments cannot police their own territory, cannot make sure that their, their territory is not used for attacks against us. as we learned the hard way on on nine over 11. let me say one other thing here. since i'm talking for a second, it's easy to go through any budget, including including the usaid budget, and find what william proxmire used to call. if you remember, joe, the golden fleece award type things or the

pentagon budget, you have the $800 screwdriver. so, sure, like the white house spokesperson did the other day, you can find two or 3 or 4 things in the aid budget that should not have been funded. but let's not kid ourselves. most of what they're doing is good. most of what they're doing saves lives, and most of what they're doing is not just good for them, it's good for us. in the way of influence, pushing back china, strengthening these, these countries. so talk about something that's penny wise and pound foolish. if these people were serious about approving our aid policy, they'd let it go. and they would they would reform but not shut down. they would improve but not destroy. and this is really shortsighted and dangerous. >> yeah. to that point, richard, the white house put out a memo yesterday itemizing some of those things, like $32,000 for a transgender comic book in peru as justification for shuttering the entire agency. and, steve, as we talk about how much america actually pays in foreign

aid as a percentage of the budget compared to other g7 nations, what do you see in your chart? >> yeah. look, i think to put this in perspective as as richard and katie said, this is a very small part of our budget. there's been a negative attitude toward foreign aid for a long time. and joe made a reference to harry truman and herbert hoover. if you go all the way back to the end of world war two, when we rebuilt europe through the marshall plan, we were spending about 2% of our gdp on foreign aid. that, as you can see on the chart, dropped precipitously. and in 1980 it was about 0.5%. now it's about 0.2% of our gdp that we're spending on foreign aid. and to put that in perspective, look at the chart on the right and compare what we're spending on foreign aid compared to what the g7, the six other major countries that try to run the world basically spend. and you can see where all the way at the bottom below italy and well below the average of about 0.45%

or thereabouts of gdp. so this negative feeling and i'll tell you one interesting fact actually, and this is there have been polls done where people have been asked, americans have been asked how much do we spend on foreign aid out of our budget? and they come up with numbers like 20%, right. you've got this, this visceral, negative view of foreign aid that is really disappointing to most of us and all of us here who understand, as richard said, so clearly, the good it does around the world. >> all right. >> steve rattner, richard haass, thank you both very much for your insights this morning. we appreciate it. all right. coming up on morning joe, we'll dig into the legality of some of president trump's executive orders, as one of our next guests argues, the law is not fully trump's yet. plus, we're just days away from the super bowl. we're going to dig into the cost of this year's ads and show you some of the ones that have already been released, morning joe. we'll be right morning joe. we'll be right back.

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>> physicians mutual, physicians mutual. >> 45 past the hour. time now for a look at some of the other stories making headlines this morning. american intelligence believes iran is exploring a faster, cruder approach to developing a nuclear weapon, looking for a shortcut that would enable scientists to turn nuclear fuel into a workable weapon. that is, according to

reporting in the new york times, the biden administration shared that intel with the trump team during last month's transition. u.s. officials believe iran has not yet made a decision to develop a weapon, but the country remains on the threshold. california is on watch for flooding and mudslides, with heavy rain in the forecast over the coming days. it poses a significant threat to areas decimated by the recent wildfires around los angeles. officials are urging people to secure their property with sandbags and stay informed about the incoming storm, and prices are dropping for tickets to the super bowl. the average price to see the game in person is about $6,800. that's down more than 28% in the past few days, and well below the cost of a ticket last year. experts say the larger seating capacity at caesars superdome is pushing prices lower, while others point

to a possible sense of fatigue as the chiefs play for their third consecutive title. a little fatigue, willie. >> i don't know, $6,800 sounds like a lot to me. that's unreal. yeah. we're also learning about the cost to run a 32nd ad during the super bowl. the price tag about $1 million more than they cost last year. cnbc is reporting more than ten super bowl commercials have sold for $8 million apiece. fox, which will broadcast the game, says it's sold out of ad time for the super bowl in november, citing record pricing for the space. and we're getting a look at some of those ads before the big game. duncan released this new spot starring ben affleck and his brother casey, a few of his famous boston friends. >> jeremy is a method actor. what is that coming. >> out to his? >> ready? >> the acting method. >> from the book. >> this is a book. >> he's preparing. he's doing his research. >> i never.

>> did no. >> research on nothing. look where i'm at. >> exactly. >> we're big. >> time now. you ruined it. do i. >> ruin it, or do. >> you have a. >> breakfast named after you? >> oh, hey. >> what are you doing in there? >> we're doing a dunkin donuts commercial. >> right? right. >> i'm just trying. >> to find. >> the character. >> i think i found a. >> way in. you're from boston? >> i'm from boston. duncan is boston. >> boston is. paul revere. >> one if. >> by. >> land, two if by sea. >> redcoats are coming. >> you're an artist, and i know what that's like. but how long is it going to take for the bean method? >> i mean. >> i'll be ready. >> in, like, three hours. you should have paid for matt. >> i told you that. >> the bean method lamiere. you're a boston guy. i mean, last year's was fantastic, but i love the tagline. we should have paid for matt. we should have paid. >> for matt. matt damon, of course, was in the ad last year with ben affleck. we also had tom brady and a j.lo guest appearance. i'm guessing she won't be around this year, but that's jeremy strong, famously

intense with his preparations for each role, and they're hinting at that there. but these are great. and i will say, those tracksuits that they wear in the ads, those went on sale last year after the super bowl and sold out instantly. you couldn't get your hands on them. not that i tried, i swear. >> all right. here's one from hellmann's, the mayonnaise company. they reunited billy crystal and meg ryan with an homage to their classic scene from the 1989 film when harry met sally. >> i can't believe they. >> let us back in this place. >> no good. >> no no no. >> there we go. oh my gosh, so good. >> oh. >> it is. >> so this one's real. oh, oh. whoa. >> now that is a sandwich.

>> i'll have what she's having. >> wait. so good. katty kay. i love it. i love the younger woman at the end. >> that wasn't in the original script. apparently that line i'll have what she's having wasn't even in the original script. the woman just adlibbed it. the actress just ad libbed it. so good. they're still so good. one of my favorite movies ever. that casablanca is still so good. >> and sydney sweeney, i mean, to have her in that sort of cameo role at the end. ali. perfect. >> so good. absolutely. i think everyone's like, oh, sydney sweeney is here too. but i was so pumped for this reunion when they teased it online and someone said to me, it's going to be a super bowl ad, you know that, right? and i was like, yeah, but honestly, i don't care. i just love seeing them back on screen together. >> and you know, willie, what was so fantastic about the original movie was the woman that delivered the line was rob reiner's mom. >> just so good? >> yeah. >> that story is fresh in my

mind because i just had billy on the sunday show, and he was telling the story of he was with meg when they were going through the script, and she said, meg ryan said i should just have one in the restaurant. and he said, really? okay, good. and then he's. billy said, i'll have what she's having. so billy sort of wrote that on the fly, and then the woman who delivered it so perfectly was, in fact, rob reiner, the director's real life mother, sitting at that table and now recreated by sydney sweeney. >> yeah. >> so good. a lot of fun. all right, still ahead on morning joe, we'll speak with house agriculture committee ranking member, democratic congresswoman angie craig, about president trump's pausing of tariffs on canada and mexico and what constituents in her state are bracing for. plus, save the last dance, ten things i hate about you and the bourne identity. these are just some of the iconic movies. emmy nominated actress julia stiles has starred in, and now she's stepping

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the hour. a beautiful shot of the capital. we'll take a look

now at this morning's must read opinion pages. for that, we bring in pulitzer prize winning columnist and associate editor of the washington post, eugene robinson. and gene, you've got a piece that ali vitali. i'll let you take it to gene, but it's really looking at all the fear there is to go around of trump and how to how to push back within that. ali. >> yeah. this really fascinating piece, mika, for the washington post titled the single most important battle democrats must wage. and eugene, you write in part, this constant barrage of executive actions and outrageous rhetoric coming from the white house is meant to overwhelm, intimidate, and distract. don't let it distinguish the signal from the noise and focus on stopping a power grab. that would fundamentally change the nature of our democracy. unlike during his first presidency, when mature adults. quote unquote, tempered president trump's instincts, this time, no one has stopped him from making a claim that plainly violates article one of the constitution. he insists that he, not

congress, has the right to decide how the federal government spends the people's money. this is the most important battle that democrats must wage. republicans ought to join them in the fight, but they're too frightened of trump to make a peep. so if that's the case, what can democrats do? >> well. >> we still have congress. >> you know, and, you know, and. >> there are there are. >> it is under. republican control. but it boggles the mind why republicans. >> aren't up. in arms over this. >> because if congress. >> doesn't have the power of the purse, then. >> congress is. >> useless, right? >> i mean, you know, you show me your priorities and your policies. >> you know, i. >> won't believe you. >> until i look at your budget, because that's that's how we make decisions as to what. >> we're going to spend money on. >> and that specifically is reserved for congress. and donald trump is. >> i mean, he's making. >> just a. >> very frank. >> effort to. >> take that away. he always.

>> pushes to see. >> how far he can get, and. >> he might. >> get there this time. >> i mean, you know. i'm not going to fund this. >> i'm canceling all grants. >> i'm going to, you know. >> do away with aid and somebody try to stop me. well, somebody had. >> better although they aren't at the moment. my impression that from democrats, gene is that they are putting what resources they can into the midterm elections. so they've already the house majority pac has already designated quite early on 50 million or something to advertise in 10 or 12 congressional districts where republicans might be vulnerable. so they are they are actually organizing in some ways, but they seem to have made a strategic decision that trying to defend anything to do with washington, the institutions, the federal employees, the aid budget is actually a losing wicket for them. >> yeah. and, and maybe that's i. >> kind. >> of agree in, in that that's probably not the way they should look at it as we're defending

washington, it's not a very popular. >> or even defending democracy. >> i mean, it didn't work. >> for them last time. >> and there. >> is a school of thought that says, great, you republicans, you got the house. >> you got. >> the senate, you got the white house, and you got a friendly supreme court. let's see how you do. >> right. >> and that in a couple of years, everyone will have soured on this sort of republican rule. and democrats will have an opening. and that may be true. but in the meantime, right. you know, we talk about norms, and norms are not popular, but this is more than a norm. this is the way the constitution works. and to cede to presidents basically the ability to, to just like cancel spending and order spending and essentially run our budget in addition to faithfully executing the laws. that's something that we as a nation will regret. republicans will

certainly regret it the next time a democratic president. >> so a perfect time to bring in professor of constitutional law at princeton university and director of the princeton university program in law and public policy, deborah pearlstein. and deborah, you have a guest essay for the new york times entitled the law is not fully trump's yet. and you write in part this mr. trump is hardly the first president to claim broad executive power. the difference this time is not only the enormity of his claims, a level of authoritarian aspiration that far exceeds any other in the modern american age. it's that the administration hardly even bothers to try to craft legal justifications for its actions. presidents have enormous power under the law. part of what mr. trump is doing is just invoking the breadth of that authority. for those worried about the fate of our democracy, it would be

foolish to rely on the rule of law alone. but it would also be wrong to simply write it off as a meaningless, meaningless check on presidential authority. that kind of pessimism becomes our self-fulfilling fate. the new president may be aiming for authoritarian control, but the law is not fully his yet. >> deborah, thanks so much for being with us. there are several things that you wrote in here that really jumped out at me. first of all, first of all, just just a quick summary. 63 of 63 federal courts rejected in 2020 donald trump's attempts to overturn the election throughout the first term, federalist society judges, time and again on all levels, pushed back against him. and i just wrote down really briefly the 11th circuit overturned the district court judge cannon to release a january 6th report. the supreme court rejected his immunity

claim, made him go to his sentencing hearing, at least by video, to be sentenced right before the inauguration. and, of course, the d.c. circuit has has put a freeze on on his spending freeze, an injunction on the spending freeze. but, deborah, the line that you wrote that jumped out at me was that part of the belief that our, our, our third branch is going to kowtow to donald trump is based on a misunderstanding of the immunity case. and mika will tell you, i took the entire case out a couple about a month ago and reread it. and you are right, it was oversimplified. it wasn't the supreme court kowtowing. there are three silos. i also heartened by amy coney barrett's concurrence. i see i see some

evidence that the courts just may do their job over the next four years. talk about talk about why you believe that as well. >> well. >> first. >> thanks for having me. but so. >> on the. >> immunity decision. right. i think the immunity decision. was a terrible decision. >> and wrong as. >> a matter of constitutional. >> law. >> but it was really limited to the question of. >> a. >> former president's individual criminal liability under the law. most of the way we enforce constitutional. law in this country. >> is not. >> by holding people criminally liable when the constitution is violated, but by telling government officials they have to stop doing what they're doing. and already what we're seeing in the more than two dozen cases that have already been filed against various actions that the new administration has taken, the first three courts off the bat at the district court level have said one with respect to the birthright citizenship executive

order and two, with respect to these attempts to engage in across the board spending freezes in the government. you have to stop that. you can't do that. the courts call them temporary restraining orders. but that's what we're seeing so far at the district court level. those things have nothing to do with criminal liability for anybody, but they're. enormously important in keeping the constitution on the right track. that is to say, they're enormously important in preserving the separation of power system we have congress's power of the purse is its and its alone under the constitution. and if it loses that, if it cedes that to the president, then we have a government of whatever the president says goes, that's not a constitutional system, that's an authoritarian system. and that's something that i think not even this supreme court is prepared to do. i certainly don't think that the trump versus united states decision speaks to that issue one way or

another. >> well, it does. and it also, though, again, i think it's a terribly a terrible decision. i just i do think that it was presented in such a way that people thought, oh, the supreme court will just like you said, the supreme court is going to bow down on every single issue. i mean, talk about specifically these funding issues, whether you're talking about u.s. aid, whether you're talking about whether you're talking about this, this, this general phrase, which, you know, the trump administration is, is saying, well, we're just we're doing it temporarily. we're going to take a look at what best practices are and see if we can save some money. but but talk about the court challenges that will come forward there and what the d.c. circuit, what the supreme court will most likely do. >> so first, i should say a lot of these cases aren't being

filed in the first instance in washington, d.c, one of the injunctions comes out of a federal district court that sits in rhode island. one of them does come out of a federal court that sits in d.c, the first birthright citizenship case to get to the courts is one out of washington state. so there are federal courts across the country. all of these ultimately funnel into the us supreme court. but the spending issue is really quite striking. and like the birthright citizenship question, one of the unusually clear parts of the constitution. so what we'll see in these challenges, whether it's usaid or some of these across the board spending freezes that still seem to be, at least to some degree, in effect in some agencies. and the courts are sorting that out. now, what we'll see are at least two different kinds of challenges. one is just a simple, straightforward constitutional challenge that the spending power is. congress is under article one. but more directly, there's also a separate federal statute called the impoundment

control act that was passed after richard nixon's presidency when nixon attempted very similar techniques to try to pause or what he called pause federal spending. but what we're really cutoffs the same thing that trump tried in the last administration when he tried to withhold money that congress had appropriated for aid to ukraine. and the issue is, congress has said very clearly we mean it when we say under the constitution, the power is ours. there are a few very limited circumstances when presidents are permitted to pause spending. but this administration isn't even attempting to invoke that law or that those circumstances, they simply don't apply here. and as we're seeing, i think very quickly from these initial courts to hear these cases, they're not they think and they have said that the plaintiffs in these cases, some of them are states of the united states, some of them are ngos who are

affected by the spending cutoffs. they've said, look, the plaintiffs here have an enormously high chance of prevailing on the merits. when we get when we get to the question of constitutionality, when we get to the question of legality. so while we sort out all the details of exactly what we're doing, we're putting in place a federal court order that tells you to stop. and we saw over the weekend the department of justice circulate a memorandum inside the administration saying this federal court order is in place. and while it is in place, you must comply. and we are interpreting these orders very broadly, not just to extend to programs that are identified by the plaintiffs in those particular cases, but to extend to spending pauses, whether they were put in place by a memorandum or an executive order across the system. so that's where things stand now. as it stands, the administration is precluded by federal court order

from extending these spending pauses again over time. we'll see how the courts address this. but at least on these very broad, the president has the power to wave a wand and take away congress's power of the purse. i'm not seeing any indication. and i'm not i'm not confident that the administration will prevail. >> so. >> professor, you point out in the piece something i'm sure most people aren't aware of, which is that in the first trump administration, more than 200 federal judges were appointed, and he had the three justices on the supreme court on his watch. but his administration had a kind of historically bad track record in front of the supreme court. and in a lot of these cases, do you feel that something is different this time around than it was during donald trump's first time? obviously, we've seen the impact of the kind of people he's put around himself who are loyalists and willing to execute whatever he says. but in terms of the judiciary system, is it different this time than it was the first go round? >> so there are a couple of

differences, one of which may make it more likely that trump prevails. but the others, i think, make it much less likely. the one difference, of course, is that during part of trump's first administration, ruth bader ginsburg was still on the court, and the republican majority on the court was roughly as the votes tended to go or as the votes in the closely divided cases went 5 to 4, not 6 to 3. and that makes a difference, right? the additional justice makes a difference. that said, there are now more biden appointees on the federal bench than there were during trump's first term. and i think maybe most important here, the at least as so far as we're seeing in these initial round of executive orders and memoranda, they don't have the legal aid team on their side this time. they're not really trying to make legal arguments. they're not really trying to set these cases up in a way that the courts, even the supreme court, are likely to embrace them. they're making mistakes. they're

making, in constitutional terms, silly mistakes, and those make their actions much more vulnerable to legal challenge, even in front of this court. if i could make just one last point, right, we're seeing this court not change, right? it's a it's an extremely conservative court. there's no question about that. but even over the course of the last term, we've seen some of the justices begin to shift their views, not on questions of abortion and guns and so forth, but on questions of holding the line against these fundamental issues of power under the constitution. and that's really what this administration is pushing on so far, not the major social issues, but things that are bedrock principles that keep our country, one that remains a constitutional democracy as opposed to an authoritarian regime. >> yeah, exactly. and that's the thing that has to be divided, you know, whether you're talking about abortion or affirmative

action, there are positions that justices now on the supreme court have taken throughout their adult life, except for the moments that they were actually in front of the senate judiciary committee saying that they would respect, of course, precedent, which they did not. but the important thing to remember is on these bigger constitutional issues, certainly during the election challenges of 2020 and 2021, they certainly all ruled unanimously against donald trump's challenges. i will say also that even close allies of donald trump will admit that those presidential executive orders, they were not written for the purposes of surviving legal challenge. they were written for the purpose of holding it up and getting the message out there and sending delivering a political message and not a legal one. because, again, most of these don't look like they were written to survive even basic legal challenges. >> professor of constitutional

law and director of the princeton university program in law and public policy, deborah pearlstein. thank you so much for your insights this morning. we appreciate it. thanks for coming on. so the 25% tariffs that president trump was set to slap on canada and mexico today have been postponed for at least 30 days as the nations negotiate border security and economic deals with the u.s. during that time, nbc news senior business correspondent christine romans has the latest. >> just hours. >> before a trade. >> war was. >> set to commence. >> a partial step back. >> from. >> the brink, president. >> trump saying. he'll delay 25%. tariffs on. >> mexico because. >> mexico's president made concessions. >> involving the. >> border, including. sending more soldiers. >> to. >> patrol for drugs. >> and migrants. >> they've. >> agreed to put in. 10,000 soldiers permanently. like forever, 10,000 soldiers at their side of the border, and

stop fentanyl. >> and illegal. >> aliens from coming into our country. >> president trump. >> delaying the tariffs. >> for 30. >> days while. >> talks continue. >> mexico's president saying, i'm sure in this month we'll be able to. >> give results. >> while late this afternoon. a 30 day delay. >> on tariffs against canada. >> too, after canada's. >> prime minister. >> said he will also beef up border. security following. >> president trump's. >> tariff threat, including spending. >> $1.3 billion reinforcing the. >> border with. >> 10,000 frontline personnel. >> president trump, posting canada has agreed to ensure we have a secure. >> northern border and to finally. >> end the. >> deadly scourge. >> of drugs. >> like fentanyl that have been. pouring into our country. >> u.s. officials say 43. >> pounds. >> of fentanyl. >> were seized. >> on the. >> northern border. >> last year, a. relatively small amount compared to mexico. >> meanwhile. >> there's still a midnight. deadline for 10% tariffs on china. >> if tariffs are. >> imposed, economists warn. they could hit the wallets of almost. >> every american.

>> because these. >> are our top. >> trading partners. >> from canada. >> the u.s. imports 4.2. >> million. >> barrels of oil a day. tariffs could add 15 to $0.25 to a gallon of gas. and with mexico supplying 42% of auto parts imports, you could pay $3,000. more for a new. >> car because of tariffs. if tariffs. >> last for. >> several months, the nonpartisan tax foundation estimates it could cost american. households more than $800 this year. >> in michigan. union auto worker joseph knowles voted. >> for trump. >> and praises. >> his tariff. >> plans, saying they. >> protect american businesses. >> it keeps company from taking businesses out of the u.s. i believe. >> that it's going to create more jobs, and. >> i do believe. >> that it's. >> going to protect myself. >> but in california. zach davis co-owns six ice cream shops. >> he says tariffs would raise the prices on equipment. >> even sprinkles. >> it may mean that our business doesn't even make any money this year. can you. >> eat any. >> of that. cost increase or does it.

>> have to go. >> to your customers? >> so if. >> the cost goes up. >> $0.10 to put sprinkles on your ice cream cone, we cannot eat that cost. we will have to pass some of that along. >> nbc's christine romans with that report. overnight, a 10% tariff on chinese imports did go into effect. and china is now promising retaliation with tariffs of their own on u.s. goods set to begin february 10th. you know, jonathan lemire, just reading the wall street journal here, editorial page, trump blinks on north american tariffs. the president pauses after minor concessions from canada and mexico. of course, minor concessions that were already set to be in place, according to some reporting. jerry baker, pray for surrender and trump's dumb trade war after tariff threat canada follows mexico's lead and gives him a deal that he can trump it, and a story to tell. and here's

here's, of course, the front of the wall street journal news section. and it really, at the end of the day, it really does look like it was a story to tell more than anything that he delays imposing of tariffs on mexico and canada obviously would have had a really negative impact, not just on the stock markets but also on consumers. >> yeah, there. >> was always an element of political theater to this. donald trump had for so long during the campaign, and then after he was sworn in again, promised that these tariffs were coming, these big, beautiful tariffs. in fact, there was an interview he gave this fall where he said tariff was his favorite word in the english language. he ranked it ahead of love. he said it was more beautiful than the word love tariff. so he was going to have to do something. and he did. and i was talking, as relayed earlier, talking to some trump aides who suggested there was always an element of showbiz to this. he had to follow through on this threat because he had made it so often, but was

willing to take a minor victory. and that's what he got. and as you noted, some of this was already done. it was already baked in. joe biden got a similar deal when he was president back in 2021. in terms of policing the southern border, now it's a 30 day pause. we'll see how they revisit it. perhaps it's a few more minor winds and then make this go away. willy. but this is something where we there was always a sense of inevitability on a the tariffs were put in place and b the trump would probably back down pretty quickly if the markets reacted badly. they did. we know how much emphasis he puts on the stock market. he uses that frankly as as a bellwether, not just on the economy but the success of his presidency. and as soon as they started to go down, well, deals were struck, tariffs were paused. >> then, of course, entirely predictable that the markets would go down with the announcement of widespread massive tariffs. let's bring into the conversation democratic congresswoman angie craig of minnesota. she is the ranking member on the house agriculture committee. congresswoman, thanks for being with us this morning. you are focused on farmers and

agriculture on that committee. so as you look at the prospect of these tariffs that are on pause for now, we'll see if they go into place in a month or so. what would be the impact, starting with farmers in the state of minnesota and across the country, but then on down to the consumers who live in your district? >> well, i don't. >> think that we can underestimate willie. the impact. >> of even. >> the threat. >> of tariffs. >> to our family farmers, because, as we saw in the last president trump administration. and by. >> the. >> way, i got four bills signed into law. i am not a knee jerk democrat who automatically. opposes this president. but what i can tell you is the retaliatory tariffs on our family farmers come first, and that truly hurts our farm economy and our farm community. last time it had about a $30 billion impact and family farmers across minnesota. they're already on you know on borrowed time. costs have gone up. their margins are very thin.

and we're talking about second, third, fourth generation farmers. no one wins in a trade war. and you just can't underestimate what the threat of these tariffs are doing as well. those countries, they're looking for other markets to source from right now. we're still not back when from our corn perspective in minnesota, from where we started five years ago under the first trump administration. >> congresswoman, there is a lot of concern, even though this tariff threat is staved off in the short term, of what the impact on consumers could be. it takes me back to the central messaging point that helped president trump in the 2024 election. i'll lower the cost of eggs. i'll lower the cost of milk. that hasn't happened. but when you listen to voters like christine had in her piece who voted for him and said, well, this is actually going to help, it reminds me of this idea on the economy, of the visceral reaction of voters versus the reality. so for democrats who missed on messaging on the economy, how do you, as the head of the ag committee on the dem

side, make the argument without dismissing voters concerns, who say, well, there could be an upside to us on this? >> well, i think. >> we have to be very candid about that. there are reasons why you would want to impose tariffs when you think about illegal dumping of aluminum, aluminum or steel into the american markets, there may be a good reason to do that and we could support it. but at the same time, the across the board nature of these tariffs are really very, very damaging. and as i was just about to say a moment ago, look, even the threat of tariffs is causing our neighbors to the north and the south to look at alternative countries to source their goods from. and if we do end up importing these products with retaliatory tariffs in place down the road, you know, the cost of gas is going to go up. for americans, the cost of food is going to go up at a time when you can't go to the grocery store without paying 100 bucks just to walk through the door. these are the issues that my

constituents are talking to me about. they're the issues that i think were front and center in the last election, the issues that we missed as democrats. so we have to acknowledge that not all of this administration's objectives are wrong. we have to be thoughtful about where we point out the policy discrepancies here, but we have to be there to fight and point them out. because, look, our family farmers are depending on us to do that. and, you know, i think we have to stand up to this administration when it's wrong for our constituents as members of congress. and i have to and i think we have to be thoughtful about where we push back and acknowledging that there are some points he's making that the american people agree with. that's why they voted for him. >> yep. ranking member on the house agriculture committee, democratic congresswoman angie craig of minnesota, thank you very much for your insights this morning. good to have you on. we appreciate it. all right. thanks. still ahead, we'll be

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it brings people together in meaningful ways. the courage of our soldiers have redrawn the map. but i believe that working closely with president trump, we can redraw

it even further and for the better. >> israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu, speaking to reporters on sunday ahead of his trip to the united states. today, netanyahu is set to meet with president trump at the white house, where they will discuss the ongoing ceasefire with hamas, among other topics. netanyahu's visit is the first by a foreign leader in trump's second term. and joining us now is israel's deputy foreign minister, sharren haskel. minister haskel, thanks for being with us this morning. we appreciate it. >> hello. good morning. >> during phase one. good morning of this ceasefire, 18 israeli hostages have been released. 583 palestinian prisoners have been released, some of them serving life sentences for very serious offenses. from your vantage point, how has phase one gone? and are you confident in these new negotiations that are set to begin, supposed to start today? actually, that phase two will in fact go into place. >> so, you know, we are

committed and our goal is to bring back all of our hostages, all of our family members back home, safe and secure. the first stage has been very difficult for us because hamas has broken a lot of the settings or the rules. >> that we've set. >> they've been delayed. they didn't release certain hostages that were meant to be released. it's been very, very difficult to deal with them. but this is a terrorist organization, so it's very difficult to trust them as well. we are waiting for saturday for more hostages to be released as well. and we're looking. >> forward for. >> the next stage to see whether it is a possibility. i think that yesterday netanyahu described the meeting with witkoff, which is meant to set the outline or the framework for the next stage from the israeli side, and he described it as a good meeting. and witkoff will go to qatar, i think, today or tomorrow to continue the

discussion about it. and we are hopeful. we want to bring back all of our family members, and we need to make sure that israel's security can be guarded. this is our main goal. we cannot go back to the 6th of october, where our communities and our people, our children are vulnerable, and something like that can actually happen again. >> steve witkoff, of course, president trump's emissary to the region trying to work on this agreement. president trump, prime minister netanyahu meet at the white house today. in fact, we'll hold a news conference later on around 5:00. but president trump yesterday told reporters, and i'll just quote him. he says, i have no guarantees that the peace is going to hold, suggesting that the cease fire is indeed very fragile. what is the expectations from the israeli government about whether indeed it will stay silent? >> so the biggest question is whether we are capable of guaranteeing the security of our country and our people. we are fighting a terrorist

organization, a murderous one who committed crimes against humanity, raped little girls, burned our grandparents, executed our sisters and our brothers. and we cannot go back to the 6th of october. we don't want a war. we don't want to fight. and if we can meet these expectations in a diplomatic solution, we will do that. and i think that, you know, netanyahu is coming here is a great deal for us israelis, because this is going to determine the next few years for us, but not just for israel, for the entire middle east. these have been extremely difficult years for us. instability, war, death. our region is in a serious crisis, and these meetings are going to determine whether we can bring back stability and peace for the region. so we have very we're very hopeful. and we have, you know, high expectations. and we'll see how it goes in the

next couple of days. >> so eugene robinson is in washington and has the next question. >> prime minister, president of excuse me, prime minister netanyahu has talked about redrawing the map further, redrawing the map of the middle east. so what does that that redrawn map look like? does it does it have israeli military or security forces permanently in lebanon? permanently in syria? what what what does the map look like? >> so what we want and the map that we want to see in the middle east is the map of stability and a map of bridges with more countries that we can share borders as friends and not as enemies. we want stability because stability bring peace, stability bring prosperity, stability bring economic opportunities. and you know, with the abraham accords, not many people thought that that is

actually possible. real peace in the middle east. but trump actually thought outside of the box and brought a deal that changed completely the middle east. can we expand that map of the abraham accords? i'm really hopeful for that. and i really hope that in the next few years, we'll be able to see that map expanding. >> israeli deputy foreign minister sharren haskel, thank you so much for coming on the show this morning. we really appreciate it. >> thank you. >> thank you. all right. the washington post, eugene robinson, we thank you as well for coming on this morning. coming up, design the life you've always dreamed of. our next guest has created a blueprint for how to build your life around five types of wealth. we'll dig into what those are straight ahead on morning joe.

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morning, salvage crews are back to work battling gusty winds and pulling the wreckage of american airlines, 5342 from the potomac river. >> we transferred debris from the water to a be out of here on the eastern shore. >> emerging from the water on monday, the plane's right engine, fuselage and right wing divers also recovered. additional remains of victims who died in last. >> week's. >> midair collision with that army helicopter. >> it's tragic and everything imaginable that you can think of. >> newly released. ntsb drone. video shows boats surrounding a significant chunk of the jetliner. the chopper's wreckage resting in the water nearby. the investigation now focused on how the collision happened at roughly 325ft, according to the plane's black box, well above the 200 foot maximum allowed for helicopters. >> it's important for us to not speculate because. >> there are there. >> are all kinds of reasons that

you could deviate from an altitude. >> for now, the airspace near the airport remains closed to all helicopters except police and medevac choppers. captain jason ambrosi is the president of the airline pilots union. >> everything adds. >> risk to aviation. taking a layer of risk out of it, taking the helicopters away is a step in the right direction because it mitigates that risk. >> earlier in the day, the nation's new transportation secretary, sean duffy, visited the site of another deadly plane crash in northern philadelphia, where a medical transport jet plunged to the ground shortly after takeoff, killing all six people on board. the learjet 55 and one in a car on the ground. investigators say at least 24 were injured, including two in critical condition. >> if you look at the impact. >> and how deep that crater is, it was a very steep angle at which. >> that aircraft. >> came down. >> all right. that was nbc's tom costello with that report. up next, we're going to bring you the story of an amazing medical

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boys are playing. >> for the first. >> time ever, a brain implant is being used to help a paralyzed patient regain use of his limbs, and artificial intelligence is helping the process. nbc news correspondent sam brock has the story. >> for years, keith thomas lived out his dream in manhattan, managing hundreds of people for a wall street firm and few worries weighing him down. >> where did you like to do? >> play tennis? >> go jogging. >> on the east river. >> but a long island pool accident in 2020 changed his whole life. paralyzing the 45 year old from the mid chest down and robbing him of sensation and movement in all of his limbs. at least until a medical breakthrough at northwell health's feinstein institute for medical research, where lead bioengineer chad boughton and his team developed a technology they call a double neural bypass. chips are implanted in a patient's brain, and the signals

for sensation and movement are sent back and interpreted through artificial intelligence, and then redirected to the body and spine, creating a loop that could prove life changing. taking someone who had. >> lost the ability to move. >> their limbs. >> to sense or touch things, and actually feel the sensation of that to restore. those abilities to the patient. >> yes. >> that's. >> exactly right. we have finally discovered that the signals in the brain are still there and strong, even after a traumatic injury. >> other neurotechnology companies like elon musk's neuralink, have implanted chips in patients to assist functionality, but recovery and restoring damaged neurons appears to be new ground. we watched as keith managed movements that only months ago would have been impossible. >> that's actually. >> sensory data. >> from picking up a cup. >> what are you feeling, keith? >> like a jolt of energy. >> to navigating a quick bite of twizzlers. >> got it. wow. >> last year, surgeons managed to place those chips in keith's brain in areas that they spent months mapping out, leading to

incremental improvements. and then a watershed moment. >> i'm ready. >> when keith actually felt his sister's palm for the first time since the accident. >> that was an incredible moment. >> and there wasn't. >> a dry eye in. >> the lab. >> and with 5 million people living in the u.s. with paralysis and 100 million worldwide, the significance is hard to overstate. >> it really hit me in that moment, i felt like. >> he's experiencing. >> something he hadn't. >> experienced in. >> a long time, and. that there's hope. >> there's hope for the future. >> in the midst of a lot of misfortune. do you feel pretty fortunate? >> yeah, i do feel pretty fortunate. >> a story whose next chapter is only beginning to be told. >> there you go. one example of some of the positive uses of ai. that was nbc's sam brock with that report. all right. joining us now, author and entrepreneur saul bloom. he's the author of the new book, the five types of

wealth a transformative guide to design your dream life. so congratulations on the book. i guess when you look at the definition of the word wealth, or you think of the word wealth, you think of financial wealth. but walk us through the four other types of wealth that you're writing about today. >> absolutely. and thank you so much for having me. this idea is that. >> the scoreboard is broken. >> the way that we've traditionally. >> measured our lives. >> has just been about. >> money. >> and money is. part of a wealthy life, but it's not the only. >> thing these other. >> four. >> types of wealth contribute to you. >> living that happy, fulfilling. >> existence that you want. >> those other four types are time. >> wealth. >> which is all about the. freedom to choose how you spend your time, who. >> you spend it with, where you spend it, when you trade it for other things. it's about an awareness. >> of time. >> as your. >> most precious asset. >> the second. >> type is social wealth. all about. the people. >> the people that you love, those close, few deep relationships, and then the extent of the broader network,

something bigger than yourself that goes beyond that. the third type is mental wealth. >> this is about purpose. >> it's about growth. it's about the ability to create space, to wrestle with some of those bigger, unanswerable. questions in your life, whether. >> through spirituality. >> religion, meditation. or solitude. and then the fourth type is physical wealth about your health and vitality, your ability to actually take the controllable actions on a daily. basis to fight against the natural decay that your body. goes through as you age. >> so as you sit down here and i wasn't asking you about just your time on the stanford baseball team, i asked you what of these five is the hardest wealth to obtain? and you said time. tell us why that is and what are some steps people can take to achieve it? >> we live in a busy, obsessed culture. we use the word busy as something of a status flex in society. today. when people ask you how you're doing, the first thing you say is, i'm good, busy. ask yourself, how many times have you done that in the last month? it starts to become crazy. the reason that happens

is because we say yes to too many things. we're taking on more and more, we're running faster and faster, but we're becoming almost a rocking horse, rocking back and forth, moving all the time, but never actually getting anywhere, never making progress on the things that we care about. a lot of growth comes from leaning into the things that actually create energy in your life. the opportunities that are creating energy are the ones where you're going to create the best outcomes, and leaning away from the things that are draining energy in your life on a daily basis. >> sahel. you talk a lot about time spent with family and how it changes after the age of 20. i really want to give this book to my kids to make sure that they cherish every minute that they do spend with me. now they're over the age of 20, but when you when you are asking young people to realize what is happening to their own state of being as part of a community and then of loneliness, that's a hard thing for young people to be aware of and to cherish in the way that you're recommending. i think. >> i do agree with that, and i think we're all aware now of

this loneliness epidemic that we're facing as a society. the impact of social media on the actual time that we're spending in person with the people that we love, is dramatic and leaning into those things, recognizing that you are quite literally a time billionaire, you literally have billions of seconds left in your life when you're a young person and leaning into the fact that time is truly your most precious asset, you start to live differently. when you recognize that. >> book is the five types of wealth the transformative guide to design your dream life. saul bloom, thank you very much for coming on the show this morning. thank you for having me. we appreciate it. take care. all right. still ahead, we'll bring you the latest on today's confirmation votes in the senate. as tulsi gabbard, president trump's controversial pick to be director of national intelligence, gets a key republican endorsement. morning joe will be right back. >> you jump in front of my car

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expected to start a trade war. people are wondering why trump would start a war with our closest allies. and he was like, i didn't say anything about russia and north korea. >> president trump is delaying tariffs on canada and mexico for at least a month. after speaking

with leaders of both countries, but he is moving forward with across the board tariffs on chinese products. we're going to go through china's overnight response and the economic implications of all of this. also ahead, we'll dig into elon musk's massive influence over the federal government at the moment as the unelected billionaire works to shut down a key humanitarian agency. and on capitol hill today, there will be key votes for two of the president's most controversial cabinet nominees. we'll take a look at where support stands for rfk jr and tulsi gabbard right now. and good morning and welcome to morning joe. it is tuesday, february 4th, along with joe, willie and me. we have the co-host of the fourth hour, jonathan lemire. he's a contributing writer at the atlantic covering the white house and national politics, us special correspondent for bbc news, katty kay, the host of way too early, ali vitali and president emeritus of the

council on foreign relations richard haass. he's the author of the weekly newsletter home and away, available on substack, and former treasury official and morning joe economic analyst steve rattner is here. >> and willie was just listening to katty on way too early, talking about how donald trump sort of plays it by ear, the people around him talking about how, you know, he he'll go out, he'll say he's going to do something, see how it works out, and then move around. anybody that's read the first three pages of art of the deal know that's what he says he does. he shows up in his office, he sits down, he takes phone calls, and he sees how things are going to shake out. i'm sure he also is looking at the markets yesterday premarket trading. and so we get this of course wall street journal talking about how the trade deal is delayed certainly

on mexico and canada our two closest trade allies. and of course with mexico we got a positive deal. and mexico feels like they got a positive deal. fentanyl, you know, stop fentanyl coming to the united states. and the united states does its best to stop high capacity guns going going to mexico. so sort of this standoff both sides can claim victory. the wall street journal actually lead editorial which we're going to talk about in a second, says president trump blinks. but of course, that's not what his supporters are saying right now. >> yeah, and that art of the deal style works in new york real estate. or if you're hosting a reality show. but when you're the president of the united states, it tends to throw the world into a bit of chaos. now, his side and he are arguing that that big tariff announcement got him to a place

where he wanted to be, which was to push mexico into a corner and get them to make concessions on the border. same goes for canada. but meanwhile the markets and our international relations suffer for it. and also now we're talking about china because president trump's 10% tariff on all chinese goods now is in effect. and china has retaliated immediately, announcing overnight a series of measures, including its own levies on american products. beginning on february 10th, china will impose an additional tariff of 15% on coal and liquefied natural gas and a 10% tariff on other items like crude oil and agricultural machinery. but mika, so this is what everyone expected. of course, an escalation from whoever you put the tariffs on, whether it's mexico or canada or china. again, the president saying this is basically a negotiating tactic and we'll see if it turns out to be that way in china's case as well. >> and was the deal that was struck with canada a deal that

we've seen before? president trump is backtracking on 25% tariffs for canadian and mexican goods. now, the move comes after the leaders of canada and mexico announced plans to ramp up security at their borders to help combat the transport of drugs and illegal immigrants into the u.s. regarding canada, trump posted on social media yesterday the tariffs would be paused for 30 days to see if a final economic deal can be reached with the country. additionally, canadian prime minister justin trudeau revealed that canada would implement a $1.3 billion plan to reinforce the border with new technology, equipment and nearly 10,000 frontline personnel to coordinate with the u.s. to stop the flow of fentanyl. one interesting note trudeau's announcement yesterday was a repeat of the same border plan the canadian government unveiled in december during the biden

administration. and earlier yesterday, mexico's president announced that her nation would immediately reinforce its northern border with 10,000 national guard members to address drug trafficking. trump stated the u.s. will continue negotiations with mexico over border security during the 30 day tariff delay. >> an interesting thing happened yesterday during the president's signing ceremony inside the white house. rupert murdoch was there and somebody asked what he thought about the wall street journal editorial page, calling this the dumbest. i think the dumbest trade war ever. and he said, sometimes they don't agree with the wall street journal editorial page. today would be one of those days as well, because, of course, the wall street journal editorial page, like most economists and people that read the wall street journal, have have long been opposed to the idea of tariffs. and so, in its latest editorial

titled trump blinks on north american tariffs, that editorial board writes in part this if north american leaders need to cheer about a minor deal so they can all claim victory, that's better for everyone. the need is especially important for mr. trump, given how much he boasted that tariffs are a foolproof diplomatic weapon against friend or foe. mr. trump can't afford to look like the guy who lost. mexican president claudia sheinbaum, in particular, seems to recognize this, and so far she's playing her trump cards with skill. none of this means the tariffs are some genius power play, as the trump media chorus is boosting, writes the wall street journal editorial page. certainly about other people within their own media conglomerate, news corp. but they go on and write mr. trump's weakened tariff broadsides against a pair of neighbors has opened a new era of economic policy uncertainty that won't calm down until the president

does. as he warned many times before election day, this is the biggest economic risk of donald trump's second term. and that's what as as they warned beforehand, katty, i thought it was very interesting. your take again politically on how this was all going to go down there were there were people that were close to donald trump who always had said, it's always an opening bet. if he talks about 25% tariffs, it's an opening bid. and i spoke to some people at the white house yesterday and also some supporters of his yesterday who who laughed and said, we told you so, we told you so. he was never going to impose 25% tariffs on canada or mexico, which seems to line up with what you say. he'll talk about it, he'll put it out there. but if things start going south, if the stock market

drops, he's going to find his way out of there. >> yeah. and the timing was interesting right. we saw the stock market open. we saw it drop in that first half hour or so. it fell by about five 600 points. it didn't look good. the market wasn't happy. and quite quickly we got an announcement following that from mexico that there had been a resolution. immediately the market bounced back up again. that's what the white house would like to see. now, maybe the president was gambling that if he announced this on friday, by monday, the markets would be happy with this. there is still the question of what happens in 30 days. and there's the longer term question of if you are now canada or mexico, who, by the way, have not really given up very much to get this pause. i mean, i think mexico, canada is sending a border czar. that's it. the rest of their program they'd already announced. same with mexico then. do you then has to some extent, the damage been done even by the announcement of this? is there a feeling that if you can, you're going to diversify your relationships, your trade

relationships, to the extent that it is possible make those more friction free because you don't know whether in 30 days, actually donald trump will decide he is going to impose these tariffs. and the eu, who have already been put on notice by donald trump over the weekend, even to some extent the uk, they're now going to have to go through this same process as well. so whether or not this leads to an immediate tariff war right now, there is an eroding of relationships that have benefited the united states. i feel like i know i'm preaching to the converted here, joe, and i don't need to tell you this. these relationships and these trading relationships have benefited the united states enormously for the past 30, 40, 50 years. do other countries with donald trump in in power for the next four years start thinking, okay, we do need to try to do something to weaken our reliance on the united states and look elsewhere, right? >> yeah. jonathan, let me let me let me just say, though, this is a powerful, potent political

issue for donald trump. and i can say firsthand, when i was running in 1994, i was shocked at one point, i went over to the rural part of my district in defuniak springs, and i was talking about tax cuts and balanced budgets and a strong national defense and a rising china and what the united states needed to do. every question was about nafta, nafta, nafta, national sovereignty, national. it was nafta. if i could think back to 94. and this is a world we still live in. if you if you look at donald trump's base, it's about nafta. it was about gatt is about the world trade organization. and anybody in the media that looked at what donald trump was saying yesterday in that in, in, in the white house, in the oval office and didn't think that was connecting with,

with the rank and file base saying, you know, we need to push them harder here. we need to push them harder there. he talked about germany. he said, hey, we've got a lot of bmw and mercedes that are going around driving around in the united states. you don't see any chevys in berlin, do you? that sort of talk, you know, dick gephardt used it in the democratic party. you have populists in both parties using it. i'm just saying we all we all understand what the wall street journal editorial page says. what steve rattner is about to say. but democrats need to understand this is a powerful, potent issue. when you talk about economic nationalism. >> yeah, there's no doubt trump for a long time now has had his finger on the pulse of economic nationalism, economic populism. and he believes the tariffs are a way to do that. now, as katie said, there's a risk. there's a downside here. these are two the

united states's closest allies and there's some real hard feelings. we heard prime minister trudeau talk over the weekend, a real sense of betrayal that the united states would do this, considering how canada has come to the us's aid time and time again in times of need. so we will see what that relationship looks like going forward. even as this crisis briefly passes. as someone put it to me yesterday, close to president trump, at the end of the day, it is showbiz like this is something he is going to make a show. he's going to claim some sort of win, even if there aren't really significant changes to mounties at the border up north. and we should note the 10,000 troops the mexican government has agreed to place at the southern border of the united states. it's exactly the same deal that gave president joe biden back in 2021. so that that also familiar not breaking new ground, but at least in the short term, joe, an economic and economic win. the issue will be as that same person close to the president put to me yesterday is how much risk is trump willing to take with the markets? we saw them open up badly yesterday. you know, this was just a one day

trade war. you know, if you will trump reaching those agreements with mexico and canada both before the closing bell. the markets recovered somewhat. but is he going to want to do that again in 30 days or 30 days after that, or 30 days after that, when such, he stakes his popularity and success to wall street? >> yeah. and i will say, even after we backed down on canada and mexico as a nation, as the wall street journal business and finance page say steelmakers are hiking prices ahead of tariffs right now. and willie again that you know, it reminds me a lot of the campaign where you know, i sat here i won't talk about everybody else. i sat here talking about how the united states economy was the envy of the world, how jobless rates were at record lows over a period of time, how the dollar was. all of these positive things were going out there. americans weren't feeling it. they weren't feeling it because of inflation, because of rising gas prices, grocery prices up

20, 25% over the past four years. that's when i talk about this economic nationalism that is a strong sell in middle america. we all know we can all talk about tariffs and especially against canada and mexico, how bad that would be for us, how bad that would be for consumers. but for a lot of americans, they see they see economic wreckage. since nafta was implemented back in 1994. so this is, again, it's a challenge for democrats. it's a challenge for free trade republicans. it's a challenge for people. the wall street journal editorial page to make these arguments and explain to americans who, who, who are economic nationalists what their view is and why. tariffs against mexico and canada would be so shortsighted. >> yeah, despite what we know

from economists. and we'll talk to steve in a second here about what tariffs do to cost to consumers in the united states. these moves were cheered during the campaign. and then when he proposed them a couple of days ago by his supporters, one other note, as john mentioned, that the biden administration had struck a deal with canada. this deal that canada announced yesterday and in response to the tariffs about what they're going to do with the border, 10,000 troops stop fentanyl, more than $1 billion was already put in place, negotiated with the biden administration in december. and they sort of re-announced it yesterday to placate donald trump. so just fascinating management of the president here. let's get to steve rattner and some of his charts. steve, we talk about how tariffs disrupt the markets, how they raise prices for consumers. show us what excuse me, what it means in charts. >> sure. well, first of all, let's take a look at what both katy and jonathan alluded to yesterday, which was the performance of the stock market. since all this, all this began. it was it was sort of

pre-announced on friday and the market started down on friday. and then over the weekend, on saturday when he actually announced the tariffs, you can see there that the market just plunged. and then it came partway back. so why only partway back? because the market is now scared and worried about where trump is actually going. what does this all amount to? it's not even really clear exactly what trump wants. he talks about fentanyl. he talks about immigration, but he also talks about cars coming in from china. and why aren't we making these cars here? so who knows where he's going? to the point that a couple of people have referred to already. these three countries are our three biggest trading partners. we import $1.3 trillion a year of stuff from them. and as you can see on the chart on the right, that has just been going up and up and up and up. and so it's not just china, mexico and canada really are critical to our economy. and so the stock market is saying we're not sure this is over. we're glad it's been on pause. but now we've got a very

volatile president. it's a little hard to know where this is going next. >> so god no, steve. so president trump yesterday of course. and throughout the rhetoric surrounding these tariffs and needing tougher borders is talking about fentanyl and migration. but these are already starting to ease are they not. >> they are actually. and that's part of what you guys were referring to that steps have been taken by mexico and canada in the past to deal with that. well, first of all, let's start with canada. there is no issue in canada with immigrants or with fentanyl. something like 1.9 kilos of fentanyl crossed the canadian border last year. you can put that in my coffee cup, basically. >> i wouldn't recommend that though. >> no, i wouldn't drink it, but you could put it there. and we have no noticeable immigration across the northern border. so all of this is complete hocus pocus. just to somehow placate trump on the mexican side. there are there are issues, and we have been trying to deal with them. if you look at the fentanyl situation on the left chart, you can see fentanyl use actually peaked a couple of

years ago. it actually went up a lot during covid. covid was a big driver of overdoses and opioids and things like that. it's been coming down and the amount crossing the border has also been coming down a bit. amlo, the previous mexican president, frankly, wasn't that great about the border and fentanyl. but the new president, sheinbaum, is really has been focused on already again, before trump showed up. if you look at the right side, you can see on immigration, yes, it went up a heck of a lot under biden. but interestingly enough, people crossing the border between legal ports of entry, between official government posts is now lower than it was when trump left office. though those the rest of the people are coming in here effectively, legally, they're going to a customs official. they're saying, i want to come here and they're asking for asylum. and so there's more we can certainly do on the border. but this is a bit of a problem and a solution in search of a problem. all right. so much going on. we haven't even gotten to trump's attempt to shut down the u.s. agency for

international development. we will talk to richard haass about that. also coming up on morning joe, a showdown in the senate today with a key vote on robert f kennedy jr. s nomination to be health and human services secretary. and it could be a key test for at least one republican senator. we'll talk about that. and where some of president trump's other controversial nominees stand this morning, we're back in 90s. >> i was drowning in debt. >> i had over $36,000 in debt. >> if i would have just made the minimum payments, it would have taken me 59 years to pay off. >> national debt relief can significantly reduce the amount you owe. >> national debt relief reduced my debt by over $27,000. >> with national. >> debt relief, you have a powerful team that knows how to talk to your creditors. >> national debt relief. they got me out of debt. >> call or. >> visit national debt relief.com to get started. >> you'll be back.

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>> the senate finance committee will vote today on whether to advance the nomination of robert f kennedy jr for health and human services secretary. the fate of kennedy's bid could fall upon republican senator bill cassidy of louisiana. senator cassidy, a medical doctor, is a member of the finance committee and chairman of the health committee. the other panel that held a hearing for rfk jr. he has openly struggled with kennedy's nomination. meanwhile, another of trump's cabinet picks just picked up a key endorsement ahead of her committee vote. later today, republican senator susan collins of maine has announced she will vote in favor of tulsi gabbard for director of national intelligence. she explained her decision to reporters yesterday. >> after extensive

consideration, conversations with her in my office, attending the hearing, questioning her there and listening to her in the closed session, i decided to vote that i will vote for her. i believe she's committed to strengthening our national security, and i questioned her extensively about her views on edward snowden, and i am now satisfied that she will not seek in any way to have him pardoned, which was a question that i answered in open session. >> you know, there's an old saying in soccer in in english football, it's the hope that kills you. yeah, i suspect they have a similar saying in maine

about susan collins. it's a hope that i wonder, richard, if she was assured by the way, tulsi gabbard handled her relationship with the butcher of syria, assad, responsible for the murder of 500,000 syrians, also, who used chemical weapons against his own people. are are again, edward snowden, where she refused to condemn snowden in one question after another question after another question. susan collins, supposedly a traditional republican. there is no way she would ever vote for tulsi gabbard except for political expediency. and fear, is there, richard? i'll put that in question form. thank you for

that rhetorical question, joe. no. what comes to mind, joe, is i remember abba eban, the former israeli foreign minister, and he once famously said about palestinians, they never miss an opportunity to miss an opportunity. well, susan collins never misses an opportunity to disappoint. she is a serial disappointment, and tulsi gabbard rarely misses an opportunity to get it wrong. you know, the only good news is this is not the most critical job in the us government. the office of the director of national intelligence has a you know, i'm not saying it's insignificant, but there's more important jobs. secretary of defense, the head of the cia, and so forth. but that said, she's not qualified for the job. she's been, shall we say, consistently wrong in her judgments. and the idea that she might be confirmed for this is another what, just another disappointment. and it's a head shaker. >> yeah. >> she also has endorsed the russian view of the war in ukraine, among many other things that people are concerned about. but it appears she now has senator collins's vote.

meanwhile, there's rfk jr. in his latest editorial titled rfk hearings remove all doubt. he is not fit to lead a key federal health agency. the new york post editorial board writes this this morning, quote robert f kennedy jr. s two day senate confirmation hearing should remove all doubt he is absolutely unfit to head the department of health and human services. look, it's never wrong to ask questions, even about settled science, but kennedy has spent a near lifetime promoting a dangerous, outright lie about vaccines, even in the face of hard proof that they work. that might have dissuaded many people from getting them and then later contracting illnesses they could have prevented. oh, and by coincidence, his anti big pharma claims just so happened to supply ammunition for fellow lawyers suing those companies. most of all, kennedy lacks basic skills to run a large federal agency, particularly one where following the science is actually vital. senators need to block rfk jr's nomination and

keep america healthy again. the new york post editorial board. ali vitali so are there republican senators willing to block rfk jr. s nomination in a way that they have not been willing to for any other nominee so far? >> maybe. we watched the public struggle for one of the key republican senators here, bill cassidy of louisiana. he, of course, chairs the help committee, but he's also on the finance committee. so we'll get a little bit of instruction later this morning about if the struggle actually ends up yielding anything in terms of saying no to rfk's nomination. now, the initial test is going to be in the finance committee later this morning. they're going to vote. rfk jr. out of that committee, they can either recommend him favorably or unfavorably. so if cassidy decides that's where he wants to show his cards, that's where he wants to say no, then we'll see it be reported unfavorably. but it doesn't really do anything. that nomination still goes to the floor. and then, of course, there's the question of if

cassidy would keep that kind of a no vote on the floor. and all of this is really theoretical, because cassidy has told reporters time and again in the halls of congress that he doesn't want to talk about this. but the thing that has the common thread for all of the people that we talk about during these confirmation battles, whether it's joni ernst with pete hegseth, thom tillis with pete hegseth, bill cassidy for rfk jr. susan collins for tulsi gabbard. the common thread is all of these people are going to be on a ballot in 2026. some of them have already received primary challenges, but that threat is something that comes up in every conversation that i have with my sources on the hill about this. the politics looms so large over everything elon musk and the millions that he could throw into a primary challenge. others who can ignite the maga base online and direct their ire at some of these senators. all of that is factored in, and it really is a sign of how palpable the politics of a primary is in this

maga era. and frankly, as much as we talk about trump and elon's relationship and its potential to fray or fracture, this is actually one of the things that continues to work in elon musk's favor within the trump administration is that he, in addition to the work that he's trying to do in government, is also the guard dog of the maga agenda because he can leverage millions at primary challenges. and all of that is in in the mix here on capitol hill. >> coming up more than 30 years ago, our next guest delivered this warning. >> we are on the way to becoming. >> a two. tiered society composed of. >> a few winners. and a larger group of americans left behind. whose. >> anger and whose disillusionment is easily manipulated. once unbottled mass resentments can poison the very fabric. >> of society. >> the moral integrity. >> of a.

>> society replacing. >> ambition with envy, replacing. >> tolerance with hate. >> former labor secretary robert reich reflects on that message today, as billionaires extend their influence over society. their influence over society. morning joe is back in a moment. shipstation lets you keep up with the growth of your business. you can sync inventory and manage returns across all your sales channels. so you ship the right products, to the right customers. ♪♪ head to shipstation.com to start your free trial. ever feel like a spectator in your own life with chronic migraine? 15 or more headache days a month, each lasting 4 hours or more. botox® prevents headaches in adults with chronic migraine. in a survey, 91% of users wish they'd started sooner. so why wait? talk to your doctor. botox® effects may spread

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>> where do people find the strength to speak truth to power? right now? you've got an administration. you've got a president ready, willing and able to take legal action against people doing their jobs. >> i think in 2025, politically. >> engaged people. >> can find. >> the strength to make. >> their voices. >> heard and try to help create a climate of opinion. that enables these institutions, these people who run these institutions, to do the right thing. >> well, jon meacham, you have certainly my light tonight. >> now, let's turn to the latest efforts by the trump administration to shut down the u.s. agency for international development. secretary of state marco rubio said yesterday. he is now the acting director of usaid. he has appointed pete morocco, a state department official, to review all of the

work done by the agency. morocco held several national security positions during the first trump administration, including at usaid, where his attempts to consolidate power and slash funding drove officials to write a dissent memo that ultimately pushed him out of office, according to multiple sources who spoke with nbc news. morocco was also among those who stormed the capitol the day of the january 6th insurrection. people familiar with the agency's operations say. morocco has largely directed the recent downsizing of the agency from afar. yesterday, staffers were told to stay out of the agency's washington headquarters after elon musk said president trump supported closing the agency. democratic lawmakers protested the closure. >> you cannot wave away an agency that you don't like or

that you disagree with by executive order, or by literally storming into the building and taking over the servers. that is not how the american system of government works. >> they're shuttering agencies and sending employees home in. >> order. >> to create the illusion that they're saving money in. order to do what? pass a giant. tax cut for billionaires and corporations. >> we talked about trump. >> wanting to be a. >> dictator on day one, and here we are. this is what the beginning of. dictatorship looks like. when you got the constitution and you install yourself as the sole power. that is how dictators are made. >> so dictators also, though, don't have to deal with federal judges in the d.c. circuit,

which, you know, richard, this will obviously go there because this is an organization. this is a bureaucracy that was founded by congress. these programs are funded by congress. you can't write that away with a pen. you can you certainly you certainly can go through the actions. and again, you can make that appearance. but who knows, maybe the courts will buckle. they certainly haven't shown that over the past month or so. but there will be legal challenges starting this week, i'm sure. and i'm curious. richard. yesterday i brought up harry truman's meeting with herbert hoover after world war two ended. and of course, herbert hoover was the butt of every democrats joke for 15 years before that meeting. democrats blaming herbert hoover for everything. but harry truman

understood that the united states had to get aid to those left destitute and starving after world war two, or as hoover. herbert hoover said to harry truman in the oval office that day, he said, basically, starving europeans, equal europeans that become communists. you can say the same thing in africa, whether you're talking about al qaeda, whether you're talking about isis, whether you're talking about china's influence on the continent, whether you're talking about russia's influence on the continent and all across the global south. take us, take us through the importance of these programs, these aid programs and, and let's just leave the humanitarian part of this to the side, because i know there are a lot of people that want to destroy this agency that don't care about that. let's

talk about the security. let's talk about how these programs help us get intel on al qaeda, whether it's in ivory coast or across the global south. help us get intel on isis. help us get intel on what the chinese are doing and where the chinese are moving for a pittance as as cathy said, for a pittance of our budget. it is a pittance. we're talking about one half of $0.01 on the dollar for the budget, one half of $0.01. when you look at this in this humanitarian and developmental aid, we'll put aside the humanitarian, though i will say there are hundreds of millions of people arguably alive around the world because of what the united states has done over the decades. and by the way, some of the people who are alive are americans. one of the things we have to think about is outbreaks of various diseases. we lost a million americans over covid. one of the lessons we ought to have derived is these two things

we call oceans are not moats and disease. viruses, bacteria, and so forth can reach the united states. if you have disease outbreaks, we could have one with avian flu coming up soon. the united states is vulnerable. so that's one of the areas of narrow self-interest. joe, you were pointing to the strategic. what we're doing in many cases strengthens weak states, weak states, weak countries are are grounds where terrorists, pirates, other such groups take take control. and again, we are incredibly vulnerable to the to countries where the governments cannot police their own territory, cannot make sure that their, their territory is not used for attacks against us. as we learned the hard way on on nine over 11. >> coming up, a preview of today's committee votes on two of president trump's nominees. tulsi gabbard for director of national intelligence and rfk jr for health and human services. a live report from capitol hill straight ahead on morning joe.

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...than who i am on paper. feature film, emmy nominated actress julia stiles joins our conversation with a look at her movie, wish you were here. that's straight ahead on morning joe. >> limu emu. >> and doug. >> you'll be back. emus can't help people customize and save hundreds on car insurance with liberty mutual. you're just a flightless bird. no. >> he's a dreamer, frank. >> and doug. >> well. i'll be. that bird really did it. >> only pay for what you need.

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now.com. >> physicians mutual. physicians mutual. >> stay up to date. >> on the. >> biggest issues of. >> the day. >> with the. msnbc daily newsletter. each morning, you'll get analysis by experts you trust. video highlights from your favorite. >> shows. >> i do think it's worth being

very clear eyed, very realistic about what's going on here. >> previews of our podcasts and documentaries, plus. >> written. perspectives from the newsmakers themselves. >> all sent directly. >> to your inbox each morning. get the best of msnbc all in one place. sign up for msnbc. >> daily. >> at msnbc.com. >> every relationship is a story. hopefully it goes something like this. >> tell me about us. >> how do we meet? >> hey. >> i'm adam. >> charlotte. >> we met at a museum. >> we laughed. >> so hard i almost got kicked out. and then you asked me out

and i said yes. >> we've come this far. >> do you want me paint something? >> what? >> well, we have to be quick. >> i've never felt so. >> connected to anyone before. >> oh. let the dark have. >> its way. >> are you okay? >> yeah. just. >> you're not really. >> my girlfriend. >> trust me, i wasn't confused. >> ha! >> that whirlwind night long romance doesn't end there. and the touching new movie, wish you were here, the film, which later reveals the tragic reasons charlotte and adam's new relationship stopped before it really started, marks the directorial debut of actor julia stiles and is based on author

renee carlino's book of the same name. and julia stiles joins us now. believe it or not, she is co-writer of the film as well. so great to have you on the show. thank you for coming on. congratulations on this movie. i'm curious why you chose this for your directorial debut or did it choose you? >> a little. >> bit. >> of both. >> i fell. >> in love with the book. >> it was sent to me five years ago. >> by an. >> actress who's. >> in. >> the film, who plays. >> the best friend. i had been looking for. >> the right story. >> i wanted to direct for a while. >> and it. >> just grabbed me. >> it was. >> it made me laugh. it made me cry. >> it made me laugh while i was crying. and i could totally. >> picture it. >> as a movie. >> and how did it feel to be the director? you've wanted this for a long time. how was the transition? easy. tough. challenging. what was surprising about it? >> i'm hooked. >> i absolutely loved it. i got on set. >> and i was like, wow.

>> i've been in this. i've been on film. >> sets for 25 years. >> this feels. >> right to me. >> and i just really believed in the story. i, i. >> feel like we need. >> a movie that's. >> hopeful and about love. >> nowadays. and, you know, it's gotten only deeper and more meaningful for me in the five years since we set out to make it. it's very much. a classic love. >> story that these. >> star crossed lovers. >> so to speak, have. >> the thing that is going to tear them apart. in this case, it happens to be that adam is sick, but it's his will and determination that is, i think, what sets the movie apart, he says. at one point in the hospital, he says, i cannot just sit here and wait to die. i have to do something. and he asks her to go on a trip and they do. >> so. julia, congratulations. i mean, obviously your filmography is so extensive, so. but from the other side of the camera. so talk about lessons you learned from your time as an actor to elicit such great performances as director. >> i feel like i did everything that i swore i would never do to

my actors with the camera. you know, the technical stuff like where to point the camera and lenses and all that. i was, i felt like i had a handle on it, but when it came to the actors, i feel like, you know, i had all these lofty ideas about saying to them, you know, let's, let's rehearse and we'll take our time and i won't be too intrusive, and let's think about our inner motivation or whatever. and then when push comes to shove, you just don't have time. so it was like happier, faster. just do it faster. >> do it better this time. so the movie is an emotional roller coaster, but there are certainly some funny moments. here's one featuring charlotte's mom, played by the actress jennifer gray. >> i ordered pizza. >> don't judge me. why would i judge you? well, it's vegan. >> anyway. >> if that's even possible. i just figured your brother's out on a date, and we should make it like a girl's night. treat ourselves, you know. >> so you don't. >> feel like a fomo. what? charlotte, i know what a fomo is. i learned about it on reddit.

>> i'll be right down. >> hello? >> i'm looking for charlotte. >> sure. >> hang on. >> a second. is it a boy? yes. for you? yes. why didn't you tell me? i'll hide in chuckie's room. and when the pizza comes, can you please just slide it under the door? no, mom, i need to rinse her hair out. i can do it. do you think i don't know how to wash my own hair? no, mom, that's not how it works. it'll be fine. >> just pretend i'm. >> not here. mom. oh, also. >> i like. >> hot sauce. >> that's not going to go well. kelsey grammer, also part of. >> the cast. >> and so many others. tell us, tell us about that cast. what was it like working with them? >> i so isabelle fuhrman, who plays the lead i had worked with on a movie called orphan first kill, and she i played her mom, but she was a 23 year old, 23 at the time, playing an 11 year old. and i remember being on set while i was adapting wish you

were here. and i just looked at her thinking, oh my god, this girl is so talented and she has so much stamina to be in every scene, every single day, which is what i needed for wish you were here. and then kelsey grammer i worked with on a movie called the god committee, and in his i could hear him in his dressing room when we had downtime singing opera, and i was like, oh my god, he is an amazing voice. and when he agreed to do this movie, i had to write a scene with him singing while he's making dinner just so he could hear kelsey grammer, kelsey grammer's wonderful voice. jennifer gray i was a fan of. and same with mena massoud, who plays adam. jimmy fells was in that clip. he was in a movie called the last black man in san francisco, and he plays kind of the guy that her friends and family are pressuring her to get on a dating app and get over the other guy and get her life together, and he's kind of waiting in the wings and he's he's just very sweet and patient with her and not very demanding. >> so it sounds like this won't be your last time directing, but talk to us about whether you see

this being part of your future going forward, but also what are some lessons you hope? what are some what do you want the audience to take away from this film when they leave the theater? >> i don't want to say the last line of the movie, but i definitely was thinking about young women watching this. there's an appreciation for the love and care that she gives this man in his final days, and just the power of storytelling to, again, i don't want to give too much away, but i feel like, you know, it's a hopeful film, even though it will. it is heart wrenching. it's very hopeful. >> all right. the new movie wish you were here is out now on digital now. director julia stiles, thank you so much for joining us. congratulations on your directorial debut. >> thank you. >> thanks for being on this morning. we appreciate it. take care. all right. up next we're going to bring you the very latest on president trump's trade wars. after he backtracked on the tariffs for two of the

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we're going after canada. >> i mean, i looked at some of the deals made. i say. >> who the. >> hell made these deals are so bad. >> so bad that. the trade deals with canada, they're so bad. >> he's just looking and. >> saying, who made these. >> ladies and gentlemen. don't. >> don't get ahead. >> of me. >> ladies and gentlemen. >> for your. >> dining and dancing pleasure. come with me. >> into the. >> wayback machine. >> to 2018.

>> i give you. >> the culprit of the terrible deal with canada. >> this morning, president trump signed a new. >> trade deal. >> to. >> replace nafta. with the leaders of mexico and canada. >> the best. >> trade deal. >> they say ever made. >> don't. >> a deal done by. trump's greatest. >> nemesis, trump. >> and welcome to the fourth hour of morning joe. it's 6 a.m. on the west coast, 9 a.m. in the east. the bbc's katty kay is still with us, along with jonathan lemire and me. president trump's 10% tariff on all chinese goods is now in effect. china retaliated immediately, announcing a series of measures against u.s. products overnight. this as questions surrounding elon musk's role in the administration and his efforts to downsize the federal government. we have two reports for you, starting with nbc news senior business correspondent christine romans. >> this morning. >> the trade war heating.

>> up. >> china retaliating after the first of president trump's tariffs kicked in. >> at midnight. >> the u.s. imposing. >> a 10% tax. >> on all chinese. >> goods, aiming, the white house says to stop. >> the trade. >> of narcotics in the u.s. >> they're sending. >> massive amounts of fentanyl. >> that price hike coming on top of preexisting tariffs could raise. >> the cost. >> of medications with ingredients made in china, including cancer drugs. >> antibiotics and. blood thinners. and affect a whole. >> range of chinese goods. >> that americans. >> use, from groceries to computers and video games to popular brands like sheehan and temu china quickly hitting. >> back overnight, saying it's worked on controlling fentanyl and china. >> imposing its own tariffs. >> on u.s. >> coal and natural. >> gas vehicles. >> and farm equipment. beijing also targeting. >> major american companies. >> opening an investigation. >> into google, restricting. >> the company. >> that owns fashion. >> brands like calvin klein and tommy hilfiger, and adding controls on materials that the tech industry depends on. >> trump saying.

>> he'll continue the negotiation. >> that was just an opening salvo. >> while yesterday pulling back from the brink of tariffs with canada and. >> mexico. canada's prime minister justin trudeau. announcing proposed tariffs will be paused for at. >> least 30 days. >> while we work. >> together and. >> moving ahead with a plan to beef. >> up security on the northern border. >> tariffs against mexico also on hold after mexican president claudia sheinbaum agreed to deploy 10,000 troops to the. >> u.s. border. >> to address drug trafficking. >> and migration. >> we're going to have a big negotiation with mexico. >> now, pressure. >> is with. >> both countries. in the next. >> month, some members of congress, which technically has tariff power but usually hands it over to the president, raising concerns. >> about. >> the trade war with. >> two u.s. allies. >> it will hurt. >> american consumers long term. >> the battle over who controls government spending. >> now centered. >> on. >> the u.s. agency for international development. president trump's ally elon. >> musk placing. >> the.

>> agency and its more than. $40 billion budget in the crosshairs of. >> the newly. created department of government. >> efficiency. >> or doge. >> it's beyond repair. we're shutting it down. >> usaid. >> a humanitarian organization created by congress in 1961. >> as a. >> tool of american diplomacy. >> spends much. >> of its money. >> on vaccinations. >> medicine and food. >> the trump administration saying some. >> of the money goes to. dea programs abroad. >> as an american taxpayer, i don't want my dollars going towards this crap. >> on monday, secretary of state marco rubio, declaring usaid now reports to him. >> we have rank insubordination. >> so we have no. >> choice but to take. dramatic steps to bring this. >> thing under control. >> with agency. >> workers and lawmakers locked out of their. >> headquarters and many relief programs frozen. >> and under. >> review. >> the immediate impact in the field is that people will die. >> democrats blasting musk's moves at usaid and his doge team being granted access to the treasury department's payment systems, confirmed by the president monday. >> doge is not a real government

agency. >> it has. >> no authority to make spending decisions. >> all as nbc. news learned yesterday, that musk is officially part of the federal government, serving as a, quote, special government employee. in the administration with. >> top secret. >> security clearance. president trump, defending musk's actions. >> elon can't do and won't do anything without our approval. >> the president, also targeting the department of education for possible closure, according to reports overnight in the washington post and wall street journal, citing sources familiar with the discussions. the move, a frequent campaign promise from mr. trump. >> i'm going. >> to close the department of education and move education back to the states. >> but closing a cabinet department would require an act of congress, all but impossible. with narrow republican majorities in both chambers. >> all right. nbc's garrett hake with that report. joining us now, former labor secretary under president clinton, robert reich. and, secretary rice, your

latest substack post focuses on trump's tariff battle with canada, mexico and china. and it's entitled what you need to know about trump's tariffs and the rest of trump's madness. and you write in part, this the real reason trump has raised tariffs on canada and mexico is to show the world that he is willing to harm smaller economies, even at the cost of harming america's very large economy. the point is to show so the world knows it's dealing with someone who's willing to mete out big punishments. trump increasing his power by demonstrating he has the power and is willing to use it. you go on to write, look behind what's happening, and you'll see that trump is employing two techniques to gain more power than any u.s. president has ever wielded. the first is to demonstrate that he can mete out huge punishments and rewards. the second technique trump is using to

expand his power unpredictability. a lot of that we saw in his first administration. but of course, sir. this administration, this incoming administration, and potentially the cabinet nominees as they get, as they get put through the senate, they are prepared to make sure that trump is successful in what he wants to do. and so i'm i'm curious beyond what we need to know, which you laid out perfectly here, what it is for those who are concerned about the immediate destructive nature of this to our government. can anyone do. >> mika. >> first of all, good morning. secondly, in terms of what we. >> can do. >> between now and the midterm elections of 2026, there's not a great deal. i mean, you know, presidents do have some authority and some power, obviously, a separate branch of

government. he was elected even though it was a squeaker of an election, one point 1.5% of americans in terms of that margin. but i think it's very important if americans are concerned about our democracy. and i think you should be concerned to write your members of congress to make as loud a noise as possible. if you are a democratic lawmaker, it's very important for you to stand up for democracy and for the prerogatives that the constitution gives congress in terms of making laws and the power of the purse and everything else that we've come to take for granted. i mean, donald trump is a bully, and what he's trying to do is bully everybody. i mean, what does a bully do? a bully picks on his weakest and most dependent neighbors. for example, canada, mexico, denmark. with regard to, you know, we threatened by to

buy greenland. i mean, this is all crazy talk, but we have come to expect it from trump. and many world leaders now say, well, we're worried because we don't know what he's going to do next. so let's give him a very wide berth and see what happens. >> so, mr. secretary, good morning. let's let's speak a little further about the implications and ramifications of these tariffs, not just economically obviously they're paused. but if they were to return, let's say in 30 days time, but also the strain it puts on alliances. i mean, you just sort of hinted at it. both of these countries are nearest neighbors. you know, prime minister trudeau of canada over the weekend talking about the real sense of betrayal that he and his people felt when they when trump announced the tariffs would be put in place. these leaders perhaps might be moved to reevaluate their relationships with the united states and seek comfort elsewhere. >> i think that, you know,

canada is not only our most important ally in many, many respects and our neighbor, but we rely on canada. we've always relied on canada, and canada is very dependent on us. many canadians are just like many mexicans, i'm assuming are reevaluating their view of the united states and americans generally. i mean, can we rely, they say, on this gigantic kind of force, either to our to our south or to our north in terms of relying on their their rationale, relying on their reasonableness, relying on their their friendship. and again, the bullying techniques used by trump are undermining very, very long, very, very important established relationships. >> so, mr. secretary, what would that reevaluation look like in practice in terms of both imports and exports for, say, a country like canada or mexico?

what are the alternative markets that they could develop to potentially replace or at least supplement the united states? do they exist those markets? >> well, they are very important markets around the world. and trump is talking about his next target being europe and slapping big tariffs on europe. well, the potential trade between canada and europe and mexico, already very significant, could get much larger. one of the big beneficiaries here that's not being talked about is china. china would like nothing better than to have canada and mexico and europe and the european union all battling the united states, because that would give an opening to china, southeast asia, where many, many of the goods that are coming into the united states and are going to canada and mexico and europe originate from, well, southeast asia is a major player here as

well, and i'm sure is reevaluating the trade routes and the trade relationships. >> so these tariff wars will continue perhaps branch out. and what are your predictions slash concerns about the impact on the health of the us economy. >> well, it's not only the health of the us economy, it's the health of americans. i mean, the fundamental issue here is not only jobs, it's wages. it's americans access to the kind of medications we need around the world. it's the problem of prices. my worry here ultimately is that in in terms of trump's drive to show himself as very powerful, that nobody can stop him, that he is the bully of bullies, he is going to increase prices. i mean, tariffs are essentially, as we now are learning, as most people know,

taxes, they increase the costs of goods coming into the united states. a lot of americans are going to be paying much more or could be paying much more. a lot of the suppliers to many of our companies are getting nervous, are already raising prices even as we speak. it's not just the stock market i'm talking about, really jobs, wages and prices. the basics in terms of our economy, a lot of people could be very hurt and some people are being very hurt right now. >> seeing it already. yeah. former u.s. labor secretary robert reich, thank you very much for coming on this morning. we appreciate it. see you soon. all right. let's bring in pulitzer prize winning author and presidential historian, doris kearns goodwin. and doris, you've been following all of the recent news surrounding the civil workforce. and you say we're witnessing an attempt to return to the old spoils system, one which was heavily utilized by president andrew jackson, in which workers were hired and

fired based on party loyalty rather than merit. tell us what you're seeing and where you're seeing it. >> yeah. >> i mean, when you. >> think about it, there's a real. >> echo to. >> today in president jackson. >> he came. >> in in a. movement of the. >> populist movement. >> against the elites. he decided that. >> once. >> he won. >> the. >> election to the victor. >> goes the spoils. >> so he replaced many. >> of. >> the civil servants. from there with his own people. party people. >> friends of them who. >> were loyal. >> to him. and it. >> lasted then, from that time, from the 1830s until after the civil war. and then the situation was that the government. >> became much. >> more complex. they needed experts in what they were doing. they couldn't just have friends of the party. so they became a movement for civil service reform. and mark twain was one of the great advocates of the move of the of this movement. he said, would you really hire a secretary who didn't know the alphabet? would you really hire a blacksmith who didn't know how to use a sledge hammer? we have

ignoramuses in our government right now, and we've got to change it. so the movement began. it gathered steam, but it just never could gain traction because this other system was so entrenched until finally, in 1880, president garfield ran as a reform candidate, and six months later he was assassinated by a disappointed job seeker. so that finally created the emotion. and then when the guy was hung, there was more emotion. the guy who had assassinated him. and finally, in 1883, the modern civil service was created where you had a merit system, you had to take a civil service exam, and you were appointed on who you were. you're not who you, who you were, what you knew rather than who you were. and that system has lasted until 130 years, until right now. >> doris, first of all, congratulations on your lunch with the ft. i loved reading it last weekend. it made me smile from start to finish. that was so much fun. thank you. >> he's such a character. >> he's. it was great. i would recommend it to everybody. and you were wonderful. the

obviously presidents throughout history have tried to test the limits of their power and push it as far as they possibly could. donald trump is not the first to do so, but some constitutional lawyers are suggesting that it's almost that he is defying the supreme court and the courts in this moment, partly because, as bob reich was just suggesting, some of these executive orders are rather sloppily written. and we heard that earlier in the program, too. do you see any parallels in history to what donald trump is doing now in terms of expanding as far and as fast as he can, even perhaps thinking, well, i don't really care whether i'm stepping outside the law on this one. >> well, certainly in my lifetime i really have not seen this kind of an urge for changing things and changing them in such a way that is so hurtful to the people who are being involved. i mean, you can't even imagine what the federal workforce feels right now. morale was already down because trust in government has been diminished over a period of time. and now people who are veterans. i mean, you know, a

lot of people in the federal workforce are military people who went into civil service afterwards. they don't know what's happening. there's uncertainty. there's a better way of doing this. i mean, if you wanted to really look at the civil service and see if there was some sort of bloatedness, then you go to congress. you you have the agency do its own internal thing. but to just say, we're closing these agencies down and they're no good. and people have given their lives for this kind of work. you don't make a lot of money. what they do in terms of national parks, what they do in terms of cybersecurity, it's a really important thing. and we should be valuing these people who've come into public life. and instead he's just with a broad stroke, using his power to say they're all bad and we're going to take them away and take the protections away. there are protections. the courts will get involved. but once you have a public sentiment that says these people aren't doing their job, what we really need now is a fighter who fights for telling us what the government workers do. i mean, that's what teddy roosevelt did. he finally came in. the civil service still wasn't working very well. he becomes commissioner for six years and he fights on behalf of

civil service. he finds the corruption in the system. he finds that all the civil service workers were being taxed 3% of their salary to give to the party in order to stay in that they were fixing the exams. and he said that a central tenet of democracy, and we should remember this today, is that a merit system is there. so the farmer's son and the mechanic son has an equal chance to get a job as the friend of the president or the friend of the party in power. and he made that system work. and as i said, it worked for 130 years, and it's still working. and we need somebody. we need teddy roosevelt to fight for that civil service today. it is a central tenet of democracy to have that merit system work. >> so, doris, that civil service, that bureaucracy that's under fire, that trump is targeting his hatchet man, elon musk, he's the one who's behind the buyout package offered to so many of these federal employees. he's the one who's in usaid. he is he and his team have accessed the computer systems at the treasury department. his influence goes on and on. i wrote about it today and note that, of course, musk did not

receive a single vote. he didn't get confirmed. he does not even receive a government paycheck, though he is technically a white house employee, a special employee. can you think of any comparisons? any other private citizens who wielded this much power in shaping, reshaping, slashing the federal government like musk is doing now? >> no, i mean, i think what happened in the old days where there would be party bosses in all the states and the party bosses had alliances to business, and then they had alliances to government. it was kind of a triple alliance and they would have power. but not like this. not not in a day of media as we are today, where every day we're seeing him making statements. and i think you're right, he's unelected. even if this were going to be a look at the federal government and look at what could be changed, that should be done in alliance with the president and the congress and the people who are part of all this, to do this shock and awe thing. it just is going to create such uncertainty and such sadness among the people who are there, that you may be losing them even before you start shaving them from the thing. you've lost their morale,

you've lost their spirit. it just incomprehensible to me why it's being done this way. if it's going to be done at all. >> presidential historian doris kearns goodwin, thank you very much for your insights this morning. and coming up, the growing concerns about a potential fbi purge by the trump administration as officials force senior leadership to name names. also ahead, president trump ordered the release of billions of gallons of water in california in response to the recent devastating wildfires. the only problem it failed to actually help anyone and may have caused more significant issues. we'll have those details for you. plus, one major restaurant chain is raising prices due to the bird flu outbreak. we'll tell you who that is. straight ahead. you're watching morning joe. we'll be right back. >> on new year's day.

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>> welcome back. time now for a look at some of the other stories making headlines this morning. the average teen with a smartphone spends nearly a quarter of each school day on their device, with 1 in 4 spending more than two hours on their phone during school, according to a new study. teens overall averaged nearly six hours a day on their phones. the most used apps include messaging, instagram, video streaming and email. elsewhere, waffle house has implemented a temporary 50 cent per egg surcharge as the restaurant chain faces increased costs due to soaring egg prices triggered by the bird flu outbreak. the restaurant chain said the surcharge will be applied across all menus, and stated they cannot predict how long this shortage will last. the average price per dozen eggs nationwide hit $4.15 in december. the department of agriculture has

predicted that prices will soar another 20% this year. and president donald trump directed the u.s. army corps of engineers to release 2.2 billion gallons of water from reservoirs in central california to ostensibly help farmers in the state and fire ravaged los angeles. however, experts say the effort provides zero benefit and actually puts the state's farmers at risk. farmers in the in the region rely on that water in the summer to irrigate crops, and not during the wet winter season. a release this time of year means that there will be far less water stored for later. in addition, the water release serves the eastern san joaquin valley and typically does not reach the los angeles area. so it's worth spending one more moment on this. this is something that president trump, when he went out to california a week or so back, promised to

help. he vowed that he would get water to them even. but these reservoirs that the federal agencies ordered opened don't serve los angeles at all. it seems to be just a show akin to how he tried to reverse engineer the hurricane map in alabama the first time around. and yet, the consequences here are far more real than just an embarrassing photo op. this could deprive farmers of much needed water this summer. >> from the summer right in the drought. this is the wet season, so this water is not helping anybody. it's not even going to the right place. and he keeps saying, i've released the water. i release the water. he did to the wrong place at the wrong time. and it's not helping. it's making things worse. i don't understand. it's an interesting pronouncement to make that you release the water when it actually made things worse. in the middle of a disaster. we'll be following that and keep asking the questions about it.

other stories to cover here. el salvador has offered to house dangerous american criminals, including u.s. citizens, in its jails. the department of state made the announcement yesterday following secretary marco rubio's meeting with the president of el salvador. the department explained the country is willing to take in u.s. citizens as well as violent illegal immigrants, calling the move, quote, an extraordinary gesture never before extended by any country. the president of el salvador also posted about it on social media, saying his country will take in convicted criminals in exchange for a relatively low fee. it is not clear if the trump administration will actually send incarcerated u.s. citizens to el salvador, but any effort to do so would likely face legal scrutiny. meanwhile, we've learned there are approximately 300 service

members assisting with operations to house undocumented immigrants at guantanamo bay, according to u.s. southern command. that number will fluctuate as time goes on and will scale based on guidance from the department of homeland security. and as the trump administration ramps up its immigration crackdown, some of the people arrested during operations across the country have been released back into the united states. significant space constraints within ice detention facilities, along with laws forbidding indefinite detention, have forced the agency to release some immigrants back into the u.s. while on a well into the u.s. while on a monitoring program. now, ice has not disclosed how many people have been arrested and then released. but again, jonathan released back into the u.s.

>> this, of course, one of president trump's signature promises. but there's a lot of confusion as to who exactly was rounded up, deported, what they crimes may have been. so far, the focus seems to be on these sort of splashy raids. we've seen. homeland security secretary kristi noem on the ground here in new york. there's been some chicago, other places. more, more headlines right now than hard data. and this certainly raises questions as to the effectiveness of this program elsewhere on the trump agenda. of course, installing his cabinet in about a half hour. the senate finance committee will vote on the nomination of robert f kennedy jr to be the next health and human services secretary. and then later today, the intel committee is scheduled to vote on the nomination of tulsi gabbard to be the next director of national intelligence. her chances rose yesterday after the somewhat surprise endorsement from republican senator susan collins of maine. joining us now with the latest nbc news chief, capitol hill correspondent, ryan

nobles. ryan, of course, these are the committees. these are not the full votes, but important all the same. walk us through what we should expect today for these two nominations. and what's the latest whip count you've heard as to whether they each have the votes needed to be confirmed? >> well, jonathan, we have two. >> separate. >> hearings today and. >> there's going to be two different. republican senators. >> that were. >> going. >> to be keeping a close eye. >> on that likely hold. the fate. >> of both. >> robert f kennedy. >> jr and tulsi gabbard. >> in the palm of. >> their hand. first. at 10:00 eastern time, it is going to be. >> the finance committee. and senator bill. >> cassidy, who is, of course, from louisiana. he is a physician by trade. he is someone who has expressed very publicly his concerns about robert f kennedy jr. s vaccine stance. >> he had hoped. >> in the committee. >> hearings, there were two. separate committee hearings. >> to try and allow. kennedy the opportunity. >> to explain. >> where. >> he is on vaccines in a. way that would make cassidy. a physician who. >> strongly supports. >> vaccines, feel comfortable. >> about voting yes. >> for him. kennedy did not do that. in fact, he fell well.

>> short of that mark in both hearings. >> that led. to a weekend of. >> conversations between rfk. jr and cassidy. >> where cassidy, even yesterday, was still yet to signal whether or not he would vote yes. >> or no for robert f. >> kennedy jr. >> and the chances. >> are if. >> cassidy were to vote. >> no, that. >> would kill. robert f kennedy's nomination. right? >> at that point. >> he would. >> not be able to go any further. now. there is a scenario, perhaps, where cassidy votes yes in committee, but then signals that he votes no on the floor to give his fellow republicans the opportunity to vote yes. but there's. >> no doubt at. >> 10:00, cassidy is the man. >> to watch. and then at 2:00. >> in the senate intelligence committee, we'll. >> be watching todd. >> young of indiana very closely. >> there were. >> a. long list of republican senators that had real concerns about the answers that tulsi gabbard had on a wide range of questions in that. >> intel committee hearing. >> at least a public portion of it that the public was able to see from her position. unwilling to call edward snowden a traitor

from her answers to questions about the foreign surveillance program known as section 702 two, the questions about that. mysterious meeting that she had with bashar al assad. >> she didn't. >> really quell a lot. >> of the concerns that the. republicans on this panel had. >> yet many of them are starting to fall in line. >> you saw susan. >> collins. >> yesterday say that she planned to vote yes. >> james lankford, who initially was a yes vote, but then. >> was among the senators. >> raising serious concerns about the way she. answered questions related to edward snowden, said yesterday confirmed definitively that he will vote yes for. >> her as well. young is the. >> only one on the intelligence committee. >> who has yet to. >> say which. way he plans to vote, and he received. >> a great deal of online. >> scrutiny, particularly from elon musk, who is, of course, donald trump's right hand man right now in the white house. >> then musk. >> signaled on his platform x that he and young had spoken and that things were resolved. no one said anything about how that impacts tulsi gabbard's vote, and young has continued to say

that he is still trying to figure out if he's a yes. >> or a no. >> if young votes no in committee, that's likely enough to kill gabbard's vote as well. >> but jonathan, i think. >> the important point here is if past practice is any indication about this young new congress and their relationship with donald trump, they will likely fall in line. i think that we should be very surprised if we see either cassidy or young stray away from this vote and vote no. >> and. >> especially be the person, the one individual that takes the brunt of what will likely be an enormous amount of backlash from the maga community if they are the ones to vote no. so i'd be very surprised if either of these nominees at least don't make it until the next stage and that full floor vote. but there will be a lot to watch here today. and one. >> other last point. >> i'll make about this, jonathan, bill cassidy up for reelection in louisiana. if you were to vote no, he would likely face a very. stiff challenge from the maga world. >> and keep. >> in mind, he may face that challenge anyway. given the fact that he voted to impeach donald

trump during his last term. so there's a lot at play here today, and it's going to tell us a lot about the future of these nominees and also the future of this republican congress. and if they have any plans to stand up to donald trump in the near future. >> yeah, there'd be there'd be safety in numbers. but being that one lone no vote that makes a difference is very, very challenging. i will say trump officials i've spoken to in recent days feel very bullish about their chances to get everyone through. nbc news chief capitol hill correspondent ryan nobles. thank you. busy day ahead for you. meanwhile, amid growing fears of a purge within the fbi. nbc news has now learned that top bureau executives will comply with the trump administration's request for a list of agents involved in criminal cases related to the january 6th capitol attack. according to fbi officials, those executives had contemplated resisting justice department demands for lists of names, but ultimately decided that they must comply with what lawyers deemed a lawful order. meanwhile, democrats on the

senate judiciary committee are pressing the white house for more information about whether any of president trump's cabinet nominees played a role in the recent removal or reassignment of fbi and doj officials. in a letter to the acting attorney general and acting fbi director, democrats called recent ousters an alarming threat to national security. and all that comes as the senate has yet to schedule a vote on kash patel's nomination for fbi director. yesterday, the judiciary committee narrowly voted to advance pam bondi's nomination to be attorney general to a full chamber vote. joining us now, former state attorney for palm beach county, florida, dave aronberg. dave, good to see you again. let's just start first with with the purge at the fbi top already shown the door. and then this remarkable week seems like unprecedented effort to get the identities and presumably

investigate any agent who had anything to do with any january 6th case. mind you, the largest investigation in doj history. >> why would they want those names to give them a medal? they deserve a medal. it's actually to give them a pink slip or to name and shame them so they can be open to abuse and threats and attacks. the last time trump supporters attacked law enforcement, they got pardoned. so what does it say? this whole thing doesn't repeat itself. so it's a very dangerous precedent to give up this information for what i think are nefarious purposes. these people did their jobs, they upheld the rule of law, and yet they're being seen as the bad guys here. it's like a bizarro world where we're taking the side of the fire, not the firefighters. i'm very troubled by it. as a former prosecutor myself, and i worry that even if they survive this and stay in their jobs, they're going to be assigned to like, count paperclips in the basement. they're going to get such bad assignments and locations that they're not going to want to work there anyways. and we're going to lose their

expertise. >> dave, what kind of future impact could this have on fbi agents asked, you know, in 2 or 3 years time, whether it's under a democratic or a republican president asked to get involved in a sensitive investigation, what kind of impact could this case have on that? >> katie, i worry that anytime there is a political figure as a target of an investigation, the fbi agents will back away. they cannot do that. they're supposed to do their jobs without fear or favor. but here you're punishing them because the target was donald trump. what's interesting is that trump is not asking for the names of the fbi agents that were involved in his cases, but the ones that were involved in investigating the january 6th insurrectionists. i mean, that's something we all agreed with, that these people needed to be held accountable. so if you're going to punish them for that, then what won't you punish them for? it's a really bad precedent. i worry that you're going to lose a lot of dedicated professionals, because the people in charge of this

investigation were really the best, the brightest, the ones involved with counterterrorism, because it started as a domestic terrorism investigation. and so you worry that this could lead the way down the path to some other tragedy in the country. remember, the fbi was asleep at the wheel, which led to nine over 11. that's why they had all these reforms. now, if you scale that back, you could have another tragedy, god forbid. >> so, dave, let's talk about the potential conflict, or at least complications with attorney general pam bondi. and you have said you believe she will do a good job in that role if she is indeed fully confirmed, versus kash patel, who, you know, has the enemies list. and in his book, who is someone who, you know, i think nomination is now acquiring additional scrutiny because of what's happening at the fbi right now. how would these two work? how does that coexist? >> the ultimate decision to seek an indictment is pam bondi would be the attorney general. but you can beat the rap, but you can't beat the ride. kash patel as fbi director can create a lot of problems for people just by

investigating them. that casts a lot of money, gives them a lot of hassle, and he has an enemies list. this is not a made up enemies list. he has one. he calls the media the media mafia. so i do worry that the kash patel will see is the ultra maga. kash patel, the one who wrote the children's book about the hero king donald against the evil villain queen hillary. i worry that's the one you're going to see. not the one we saw at the confirmation hearing where he was more conciliatory. that's the kash patel i knew. i knew him years back before he became ultra maga. so ultimately, though, pam bondi does have the ability to serve as a guardrail, but she can only do so much, and she'll get a lot of pressure from donald trump to do his bidding. so i'm hopeful that she'll slow down this rush to destroy our democracy and rule of law. but once you have kash patel in place there and donald trump putting his thumb on the scale, who knows? >> yeah, we'll be watching that. dave, while you're here, i wanted to turn away from politics for a moment. a story

we've been covering out of hollywood, actually, a federal judge overseeing the lawsuits with it ends with us stars blake lively and justin baldoni. he's issuing a stern warning to their defense teams. the us district judge told lawyers for both actors that he will move up their trial date from next year if the teams continue their public comments in order to avoid a tainted jury. you've been following this back and forth. this has been cascading in so many different directions, dave, and also a great lesson in not to make conclusions about what you see in social media, especially what we're learning from what went down in this case. but what do you make of the judge's comments? >> mika? the judge is like a parent on a road trip with two children who are fighting with each other, saying, i'm going to turn this car around unless you behave. that's essentially what he did. he's tired of the parties playing this out in the court of public opinion. but after all justin baldoni, he

released a 179 page statement of facts in his lawsuit. i've never seen that before. and that shows that the target audience is not the judge. it's all of us. this is a pr counteroffensive and the judge wants to get ahead of it. let's make it a legal matter and not one that's tried in the court of public opinion. >> so maybe we'll see this sooner rather than later happen. former state attorney for palm beach county, florida, dave aronberg, thank you very much for being on this morning. we appreciate it. and coming up, we'll show you the shocking courtroom video from what was supposed to be a routine hearing in new mexico. that's straight ahead on morning joe. >> doctors recommend colon stool softener for gentle, dependable relief from constipation. it's so gentle. doctors even recommend it during pregnancy

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>> 46 past the hour. a man accused of killing his ex-girlfriend was attacked mid hearing on friday by a member of the victim's family. nbc news correspondent liz kreuz has more on the courtroom. chaos in albuquerque, new mexico. >> what started as a routine. >> hearing friday morning in albuquerque, quickly erupting into chaos. >> when. >> a man got up. >> from his seat in the courtroom, jumped a partition. >> and tackled the. >> defendant right. >> in front of the judge. the brazen attack caught by courtroom cameras, the defendant. alexander socorro ortiz, is. >> accused of. >> fatally shooting his 23 year old ex-girlfriend, aliana farfan, last january and has pleaded not guilty. the men who attacked him in court, now identified. >> by. >> authorities as farfan's uncle carlos lucero, and her stepfather pete yazzie, who also joined the brawl. the two men can be seen throwing punches in the pileup that, according to criminal complaints, includes. >> the defendant. >> and his father, who also joined the fight from the

gallery. a court officer who tried to break it up was battered during the brawl. the incident finally ending when a corrections officer pulled out his taser and armed deputies rushed in to detain the attackers. both lucero and yazzie arrested and charged with assault on a jail and battery of a peace officer. >> how common is. >> it to. >> have. attacks or threats like this in a courtroom? >> attacks like. >> this, these these emotional. >> impromptu acts of violence. occur probably. daily in courtrooms. >> across the country. >> last january, a terrifying incident in a. las vegas courtroom during sentencing, a convicted man launching himself over a nevada judge's bench and attacking her before being subdued by a law clerk and court marshals, the judge escaping with minor injuries. but the violent scene leaving a court marshal with a head injury. and just last april, this brawl in a main courtroom caught on camera. it started moments after a convicted murderer was being sentenced, and the brother of the victim leapt across the courtroom in a rage. these shocking attacks on the halls of justice, raising questions about

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east coast. beautiful shot of the white house this morning and for more than 100 years, the white house correspondents association dinner has become a washington tradition since it began back all the way in 1921. the dinner was started by journalists who covered the white house, and it's known for its lighthearted moments. in recent years, the featured entertainer, usually a comedian, roasts the commander in chief

and, well, basically everyone else in washington, leading to some memorable moments and big laughs. joining us now, white house correspondent for politico and coauthor of the playbook, our friend eugene daniels. eugene, also, though, the president of the white house correspondents association in eugene, my friend, you've got some news to share with us this morning. >> i do. >> we have an entertainer, and i'm. so excited to announce. >> that amber. >> ruffin, the. >> fabulous amber. >> ruffin, will. >> be joining us. on april 26th. >> and joining. >> us right here and. >> joining us here. >> that's right. >> i'm joining everybody everywhere. just look to your left. >> i'm there. >> amber, congratulations. >> yay. >> thank you. we'll be glad to see you there. it is certainly a highlight of the washington social calendar there. that's a joke in itself because. but this time, i mean, eugene, you as you sit down, you say you have invited president trump and the first lady to attend in his first term. he never did. >> he didn't, he didn't. he had. >> four shots. >> four shots. >> he missed them all. >> do you hope to see him there?

>> no. for us at the association. >> it is it. >> is an important part. >> of the process that. >> we invite. >> the president, the. >> first lady. >> and the press secretary. to kind of join us up there on the dais. >> and we look. >> forward to an answer. i know that they they've received the invitation. and i think a lot of people are looking forward to it. i honestly, this is a president trump as a reporter that i know is feeling quite emboldened. >> d.c. feels. >> a little different, i think, than it did his first go around. so we. >> will we will see. so, amber, what made you say yes? >> i said. >> yes because. >> it's one of the coolest gigs. >> a comedian. >> can get. like it is a. >> great opportunity to shine a light on the bla. bla bla and to make. >> sure that. >> we all. >> are on. >> the same baba bu. >> but it's also so fun. >> like it. >> is. the challenge of writing this show is extremely hard. like i got the call and i was like great! and then panic wrote.

>> a lot of pages. >> but then. >> with this presidency, you could write. i could write. >> something this morning. >> that would be nothing by tonight. so it's really going to come down to. >> the wire. >> and the and the reason i chose amber is because of that. because she gets it right. like you wanted someone who understands that it is about the freedom of the press. it's about the scholarship recipients and the awardees. but it's also about poking fun at everybody in that room, including us, the media. >> yeah. >> like it's going. >> to be like, journalists. >> don't get celebrated enough. >> and you. feel me? you feel me. but. and now they're about to become so extremely important. >> and i. >> just want to make sure that they know that we appreciate them and honestly give them a pat on the back as they very well might go out the door. >> yes. well, there. >> there is that. >> so it's a big spot and it's sort of a tough room at times. but let's take a look at some of the dinners. previous headliners. >> i have to. >> admit, it's not easy following. >> president biden.

>> i mean, it's not always easy following what he's saying, like. but before i begin tonight, can we just acknowledge. >> how. >> refreshing it is to see a president. of the. >> united states at an event that doesn't. >> begin with. >> a bailiff. >> saying. >> all rise. >> this has been. >> one of the strangest events. i have ever done in my life. i'll be honest with you. like, i feel like i'm a tribute in the hunger games. like if this goes poorly, steve bannon gets to eat me. >> since i'm only a comedian. >> i'm not going to try. >> to tell. >> you politicians how to do politics or whatever. that's not my job. >> that'd be. >> like you guys telling me what. >> to. >> do with my body. i mean, can you even imagine? >> and then, of course. >> there's donald trump. donald

trump has been. >> saying that he will run for president. >> as a republican, which is surprising since i just assumed he was running. >> as. >> a joke. >> and that last joke there by seth meyers? well, some suggest partially responsible for donald trump running for president. so amber stakes are high. >> yeah. >> i. i mean, what is what's your process going to be. my process is going to be to write out, i mean, the same process that. >> i used to. >> use for the amber ruffin show is i write out exactly how i feel, and then all the most depressing stuff gets thrown out. >> okay. >> but some of that harder stuff stays. >> in there, especially. >> when i know we have it in common. >> then i try to. >> write jokes around those feelings and i. but i feel like this is a special case where i feel like we all need a little bit of hand-holding, and we all need a little bit of encouragement, a little bit of attaboy, a little bit of go get em, and then just. >> some light. >> to heavy roasting. >> yeah, light to. >> heavy roasting. well, we're looking forward to it. this year's white house

correspondents association dinner will be held on saturday, april 26th. eugene daniels and amber ruffin, thank you both. congrats to you both. and that does it for us this morning. we'll see you back here tomorrow at 6 a.m. eastern. ana cabrera picks up msnbc's coverage in just 90s. ta shopify. sell more with the world's best converting checkout. turn analytics into opportunities so you can scale further faster. take your business to a whole new level. switch to shopify. start your free trial today. save hundreds on car insurance with liberty mutual. you're just a flightless bird. no. >> he's a dreamer, frank. >> and doug. >> well. i'll be. that bird really did it. really did it. >> only pay ♪♪

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