for me. thanks for watching. tune in tomorrow to the sunday show. when nevada attorney general aaron ford joins me to discuss how he and other state leaders are trying to keep elon musk from accessing americans personal data. i'll also speak with congresswoman becca balint of the budget committee about what congressional democrats are planning to do to fight donald trump's agenda. that's tomorrow at 6 p.m. eastern, right here on msnbc. follow us on instagram, tiktok and threads using the handle at weekend capehart and blue sky using at capehart, dot, msnbc.com and catch clips of the show on youtube. but keep it here. ayman is next and live from new orleans. >> good evening everyone. tonight on ayman, ddos expands its grip on government, now tasked by the president to examine spending at the a membee armed services committee is here to discuss that and more. we're going to talk to a lawyer

working to prevent musk and doge from doing harm to our government. and the promise from the white house that is not calming fears throughout the fbi and the cia. i'm ayman mohyeldin. >> let's do it. >> we are three weeks into the trump presidency, and we are seeing the same strategy he has used since day one. he is still flooding the zone with as many moves as possible to overwhelm his opposition, including democrats and the media. he did this during his first term. but what's different now is the speed at which he is doing it. since inauguration day, he has signed 54 executive orders. they target everyone in this country transgender americans and immigrants. they threaten constitutional changes, dismantling anti-racism initiatives. they pause foreign aid, you name it, he's doing it. and many of them have paved the

way for the blatant power grabs happening right now. which brings me to the biggest difference elon musk, someone who is not appointed by the president nor confirmed by the senate to head any of the arms of our government. he is now running this brand new, made up department called doge. but it's not just musk clawing his way through all the way to do trump's dirty work. no, it's the team that musk has hired himself. the same people trump can't stop praising. listen to what he said when a journalist asked him about what many view as musk's unlawful power grab, and whether there's anything musk cannot touch. >> what? we haven't discussed that much. i'll tell him to go here. go there. he does it. he's got a very capable group of people. very, very, very, very capable. they know what they're doing. >> now let's take a moment to talk about musk's oh so capable team. there's the doge staffer

who didn't even bother deleting his racist social media posts before taking on the job. and then you have the 19 year old who was fired from a previous internship for leaking company secrets, and many of his employees came from spacex or x, or have job descriptions so vague they're irrelevant. so it's not just musk who now. has access to highly sensitive government information. these people do as well. people the american people know nothing about. and honestly, it doesn't seem like the president knows much about them either. nor cares. even with musk in this role, trump's intent hasn't changed. he and maga are flooding the zone to make it appear like he's fulfilling campaign promises, regardless if his actions stick. take birthright citizenship, for example. trump claimed he'd undo it on day one, but his executive order is now struck down in multiple courts. and same goes for his attempt to dismantle american institutions. again. take usaid, for example. us

employees, yes, they are recipients of foreign aid. they're still at risk, no doubt. but courts have intervened. our guardrails for now seem to be working. now, musk is threatening to take over the department of education, and that was a direct order from trump. but he also added another department to elon's list, one that could create a rift in between musk and maga. >> i've instructed him to go check out education to check out the pentagon, which is the military. and, you know, sadly, you'll find some things that are pretty bad. but i don't think proportionately you're going to see anything like we just saw now. >> so far, musk has gone after the easiest targets, the smallest agencies. you know, the low hanging fruit of the federal budget, usaid, and perhaps the department of education, the department of labor, and so on, agencies that if you actually add them all up, barely, barely make 1% of total federal spending. now, if doge was really about trimming costs, the

pentagon would have been first on its list. the department of defense takes up one of the largest chunks of our federal budget, between 13 to 20% billions of taxpayer dollars flow through it. it has never fully passed an audit. and it's not just new weapons and military gear we're talking about here. the dod has spent millions on crab and lobster, $9,000 on a chair, thousands on fancy toilet seat covers. and that was all during trump's first term in office. and of course, the dod is notorious for wasting maybe trillions in overseas wars. yet musk isn't saying that this department doesn't exist like he did on x with the department of education. in fact, since trump's comments last night, he actually hasn't said anything about the pentagon. and i wonder why musk's silence suggests he's not thrilled about where this may be heading for him. maybe it's because the dod has billions of dollars in contracts with musk's own companies, going after it could be a direct hit to his bottom line, or a clear

conflict of interest. and not to mention oversight of the pentagon is far from easy. there are always political obstacles, despite example after example of reckless spending since the department's creation. you see, for musk, it's easier to tear down an agency that most americans don't hear about every day. and let's not forget that musk is not getting paid to run doge. as i see it, his real payoff here is keeping his business flush with government money and with a few guardrails as possible. you see, targeting the dod would be bad for his business. and the bigger point i'm making here is that musk is using his unchecked powers to attack agencies that americans and people around the world need, and in my estimation, he's doing so to feed an illusion that he and trump are unstoppable. dismantling usaid doesn't just cut foreign aid, it actually hurts american farmers who rely on the agency to buy their produce. dismantling the department of education strips access to critical resources to kids in this country, kids with

disabilities, and to funding to rural districts who need help. the very districts that handed trump the presidency and who he claims he cares about. kicking us off this saturday night is california congressman john garamendi, a member of the house armed services committee. congressman, it's great to have you back on the show. i know this attack on usaid is very personal to you. you and your wife both worked in ethiopia with the peace corps, and you've spent your entire career working with the agency. you've also protested doj's attempts to dismantle the agency and other institutions. we know about the impact usaid abroad has had. but i want you to tell us a little bit about dismantling this organization and the impact it will actually have on us here at home. >> well. >> there will be several different ways it will impact you mentioned one of the very important. >> ones, and that is agriculture, the. >> food for peace program buys american. >> grain and other products and ships. >> those overseas to. >> famine camps and other.

>> places around the world. where support and food is necessary. that's just. >> one of them. >> but also, usaid. >> is a major player in preventing. outbreaks and pandemics. they're working in some of the. >> most difficult, dangerous places in. >> the world. these are american. >> people that. >> are. out there. >> trying to stem it right now in kampala. >> uganda. >> there's an ebola outbreak. and last week, perhaps not this week because of the shutdown. but last. >> week, americans. >> were working. >> in the clinics stemming and. >> trying to stop that ebola outbreak. >> and keep. >> in mind, it's only 15 hours. >> from kampala. >> to new. >> york city. >> and somebody that has that infection could wind up. and so this is part of the work. the vaccination programs, more than 26 million people are alive today because of. a program called pepfar, which is dealing with hiv aids. so these programs

deal with. >> medical services. >> they protect us here in the united states from. infections and pandemics that could come our way. and also, we are feeding people that are in desperate trouble. i often i've been saying that before. musk puts the usaid in the wood shredder. he ought to go to a. >> famine camp. >> and hold a starving baby in his arms, and then come back and decide whether usaid is appropriate in us. usaid has figured out and is actually producing an emergency supplemental program that could save that baby that's on the way to dying from starvation. it is a horrendous issue, but also it goes beyond we're talking economic development. we're talking about the support for the ukrainian government. all these things are part and parcel of usaid, and shutting it down is a major hit to national

security, guaranteed. we pull out china moves in, russia moves in. we know that china wants to establish a base in western africa, on the eastern part of the atlantic ocean. why? so that they can threaten nato and the supplies of oil and other shipments around the world. it's a major issue, but that's just one issue. that's the usaid. i cannot wait to see how musk deals with the pentagon. he is embedded. he has hundreds he has billions of dollars of contacts with the pentagon. it is unbelievable. >> about that. >> i mean, we'll see. >> yeah. >> you're on the armed services committee. elaborate a little bit more. i mean, you voted against wasteful pentagon spending numerous times throughout your career. what do you make of trump's directives for musk to go after the pentagon? what do you think it means? that musk hasn't said anything at all about it since last night, especially since it's such an obvious conflict of interest for him?

>> well, have you heard of starlink? guess who contracts for starlink to provide communication services? certainly in ukraine and other parts of the world. the military. let's see, shall we put a satellite in orbit? who's going to launch that satellite? well, it's going to be elon musk's program, his space program, billions of dollars of contracts. it's going to be enormous conflict of interest. the corruption angle is extraordinary. that's not to say it's not necessary that the pentagon be carefully reviewed. i could probably name a $200 billion saving right off the top of my head. and that's the replacement of the minuteman missile with the new sentinel missile. not necessary. $200 billion over the next decade, 20 billion a year. and by the way, a new bomb to go with it. not necessary for the protection of the united states, and certainly not necessary for nuclear

security. beyond that, there are numerous programs and a careful look. but if elon musk wants to venture into the pentagon, he best be ready for a conflict of interest and a corruption charge, which would probably be appropriate. >> musk also promised to kill the consumer financial protection bureau, and hours ago, russell vought took over as the acting head. of course, everybody knows him from project 2025. this bureau works against big banks and has helped many working families. how dangerous is it to have the coauthor of project 2025 now in this, you know, powerful role, having come from one that is obscure? >> well, let's just take an example. it's been very, very clear that banks often and inappropriately are charging fees that are not known to the

consumers. the consumer financial protection bureau has placed these banks on the, on the, on the table and saying, you can't do that. so consumer protection, banking, other kinds of economic activities that all of us engage in are going to be forgotten. so we don't have somebody out there, a federal agency that's helping us make sure that we're not being cheated by one or another of the financial organizations. and it's a very serious i was the insurance commissioner in california for eight years over a 16 year period of time. and i know that the insurance industry does cheat, does pay its claims late and pays little. so somebody has to watch over and to hold these institutions accountable. we might also look at the fec. why would excuse me, the fcc, the federal

communications organization, why is musk taking that on? does that have something to do with x? the former twitter program? probably. so we do know that elon musk is working in areas that are clearly a conflict of interest to him. and this is a major problem. we could talk about the treasury and giving musk the keys to the treasury. why would he want to have information on every single american, all of our social security, all of our addresses? so what would it mean? well, it means it's the beach. it is the biggest data breach ever. china would certainly be looking at this and going, well, if only they could do it. but trump and musk have managed an extraordinary data breach. >> and it's not it's not reassuring when he has one of his employees who already is alleged to have stolen company

secrets. so not a reassuring situation at all. congressman john garamendi, greatly appreciate your time as always, sir. thank you. next up, we're going to dig in more on russell vote and how all of doj's plans are playing right into his are playing right into his ha if you have heart failure or chronic kidney disease, farxiga can help you keep living life, because there are places you'd like to be. (♪♪) serious side effects include increased ketones in blood or urine and bacterial infection between the anus and genitals, both which may be fatal, severe allergic reactions, dehydration, urinary tract or genital yeast infections, and low blood sugar. stop taking and tell your doctor right away if you have nausea, vomiting, stomach pain, tiredness, rash, swelling, trouble breathing or swallowing. tell your doctor about lightheadedness, weakness, fever, pain, tenderness, redness or swelling between the anus and genitals. ask your doctor about farxiga today. ♪ far-xi-ga ♪ (♪♪) where ya headed? susan: where am i headed?

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>> saturday. >> and. >> sunday mornings. >> at. >> 8:00. >> on msnbc. elonusk and his mit doge have managed to get donald trump behind their crusade against usaid, and now they have another key agency in their sights. musk signaled last night that he is seeking to dismantle the consumer financial protection bureau, as he and his advisers burrowed into the federal watchdog that actually protects americans from scams and corporate abuse. a short time ago, nbc news received word that they a key ally, with trump tapping russell vought co-architect of the far right project 2025 blueprint to serve as the agency's acting director. that is now official, according to an omb spokesperson and a source familiar with the

situation. vote, who is a key proponent of the unitary executive theory that trump should have sole control of the government, was confirmed by the senate to be the director of the white house omb. all senate republicans voted in favor of the vote. joining me now is molly jong-fast, msnbc political analyst and vanity fair special correspondent. also with us, rick wilson, co-founder of the lincoln project and author of the best selling book, running against the devil a plot to save america from trump and democrats from themselves. great to have both of you with us. molly. it's no surprise musk is setting his sights on the consumer financial protection bureau. he's even tweeted it out or posted with the acronym rip, which works to protect americans from scams and corporate abuse. is this really about wasteful spending or something more sinister? >> well, if it were. >> about wasteful. >> spending, wouldn't he. be auditing the pentagon? wouldn't he be? i mean, the department of defense has, you know, 3 million

plus people working there. spend billions of dollars on some. >> of his products. >> i mean, look, you know, again, russ vought is or has been at omb. he was at omb, though. he was the head of the omb during the first trump term. he has used impoundment before. >> and remember. >> there is a law, a post nixon, you know, anti-corruption law. that was put in. >> after watergate. >> impoundment act of 1974, which said that, in fact, the omb cannot do this, that they are tasked, that they cannot use congressional funds as a carrot and a stick for the presidency. but look, russ vought wrote a chapter, project 2025. this was always the plan. they told us this was what they were going to do. we should not be surprised that they're doing it. >> you know, republicans, you know, during the campaign trail, rick, and we're old enough to remember this. they ran against project 2025. trump said he

didn't know anything about it. the republicans said they'd never heard about it. they played dumb about it. and yet here we are. trump and musk doing exactly what the blueprint called for in going after these agencies. and you now have the coauthor of this far right playbook in charge of this consumer protection bureau. >> i mean, i can't tell you the number of. >> times during the campaign. >> i had reporters say, how dare you say he's going to do project 2025? he just he said he would never do that. oh, okay. if by now, eight years, practically a decade into this game, you don't understand that donald trump will lie about anything at any time. you know, i wake up, but but look, the damage that russ vought seeks to do here isn't simply to individual programs in the current moment, which are having and will have a terrible impact on a lot of people that that neither congress nor the president have. really fully weighed yet. it's easy when it's a drawing room game in washington, d.c, for people like russ vought. it's a lot more difficult when you're going to have universities around this country shutting their doors,

because the federal programs that fund their research are going to go away because these guys are capricious and malicious in how they're approaching this. but the consumer protection bureau is going to go away. and who's going to get hit hardest? it's going to. >> be maga. >> voters will get hit hardest. >> they will be. >> the ones paying 40% credit card interest rates. they will be the ones paying thousand dollar late fees. they will be the ones paying in the way of rapacious companies that have proven time and again that they will squeeze any possible metric advantage out of out of their customers. without the financial protection bureau, i may not have agreed with everything elizabeth warren's ever done, but we have become unbalanced in this country. on the equation between the protections for individuals and the power of corporations to abuse them both

in, you know, health care being one of the largest areas of that insurance. and certainly credit card companies were having a blast charging people, you know, interest rates that you could probably get a better deal from, like a, like an arms merchant, you know, in somalia somewhere. the crazy levels of interest and. >> penalties. >> they're going to hurt maga voters most. congratulations, guys. good. good job. >> yeah. >> it doesn't seem like they've ever cared about maga voters or that base. and now, molly, you've got democrats trying to sound. i mean, they're already sounding the alarm on someone like vote heading the omb. now he's serving as the director for the cfpb. talk to us about the dangers that someone like him heading both and whether that is, you know, customary. >> so what we're. >> seeing here. >> is the central tenant of project 2025. >> which is. >> dismantling the administrative state. right. taking the federal government,

stripping it for parts, doing what elon did to twitter, to. >> the federal government. >> and i think it's important to realize that part of this and where vought really comes into it, is that part of this is about not letting about the president having much more power over the federal government. so things that are were meant to be not part of not, you know, to be nonpartisan, to be just a sort of, you know. bureaucracy filled with nonpartisan. >> bureaucrats. >> those kind of things will now be arms of the presidency. and that means that trump has a lot more power. it means that it will be much harder for, you know, sort of just pure science to get out for things that are not in the service of trump and trumpism. and that is a real paradigm shift. it's going to mean that people can't really

trust a lot of federal agencies for information, because they may be sort of, you know, changed to fit a narrative, a more trumpian narrative. and i think when you think about agencies that like monitor. the air or monitor the weather, that's pretty intense and. >> quite scary. >> so i think that is going to be an underlying thing that we're going to see happening. >> i think that's right. >> i mean, rick, in short, is there anything that can be done at this moment? by any i mean, look, we already saw the republicans basically roll over the so-called moderates, like, you know, susan collins, lisa murkowski, they didn't even hesitate to vote in favor of vote. but is there anything that can be done right now as this takeover of government or dismantling of these different departments and agencies accelerates? >> look, i think for individual voters, the things that you can do now and i know this sounds cliche, but members of congress are slowly waking up and

starting to call the white house saying, oh my god, don't cancel this agricultural research grant at the university of alabama. oh my god, don't cancel this thing here. they're going to start realizing that a lot of what they bring home to their districts every year and their states every year come out of programs like usaid for agriculture programs across the country. the national science foundation, for national laboratories across the country, at least medical research and scientific research, nih for disease research. those things are those things make a difference in the states. not to mention these these members of congress should be burning down the white house phone lines, hearing from their people because they're going to cancel all of the infrastructure spending that every one of these members of congress went back last year after voting against it and bragged about how much infrastructure spending they were bringing home to their districts. this, folks, is actually going to come down to a moment where where if americans start beating the door down on their members of congress and on

their u.s. senators, it outweighs what they're seeing right now, which is their incel, 20 year old staff member going, yeah, boss, you're good on twitter. they need to be they need to know that people in their districts are. get out there, folks, and ring the bell. >> it is a part of our democracy that has to work, and has to work even more aggressively than it normally has in the past. rick wilson, molly jong-fast, thank you to the both of you. greatly appreciate it as always. next up, we're going to head to tel aviv for an update on tel aviv for an update on today's hostage and prisoner struggling with the highs and lows of bipolar 1? ask about vraylar. because you are greater than your bipolar 1 and you can help take control of your symptoms, with vraylar. some medicines only treat the lows or highs. vraylar treats depressive, acute manic, and mixed episodes of bipolar 1 in adults. proven full-spectrum relief for all bipolar 1 symptoms. vraylar is not approved for elderly patients with dementia-related psychosis

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crescent reporting that seven were taken to hospitals. msnbc correspondent yasmin vossoughian is in tel aviv with the very latest details. >> emotions were high across the region today, both in israel, in gaza, in the west bank as well. let's talk about the israeli hostages first. we had already 34 years old whose wife was killed on october 7th. he was reunited with his family, also coming back to a young child, we had ohad ben-ami reunited with his three daughters along with his wife, who was also held captive for 54 days. and then we had elie sharabi, 52 years old, whose wife and daughters were killed on october 7th, reuniting with his family after being released, all of them thin and gaunt when they were released, before being handed over to the red cross for the first time. during these hostage exchanges, they were told to speak on stage in central gaza. they said they wanted the war to end, that hamas did in fact not harm them. when we're talking about the palestinian prisoners, 183 palestinian prisoners were released, some of them to gaza,

some of them to the west bank. in the west bank, seven of them went straight to hospital because of malnourishment, starvation as well. in gaza, many of them went to a hospital in in southern gaza, to a european hospital there. humanitarian aid, 600 plus trucks are coming in to gaza every single day because of this cease fire deal that is currently ongoing. but what is needed right now is caravans, is mobile, homes is tents. we have had horrible weather here over the last 72 hours. i'm talking high winds, rain as well. for those gazans that do not have a roof over their heads, tents, caravans, mobile homes are desperately needed. we also heard from doctors without borders in the west bank, who said the humanitarian situation in the west bank is becoming more and more dire. you have 50,000 refugees who have been evacuated from their camps in the west bank, along with medical needs that are not being met in the west bank. so across the board, emotions are high both in israel, gaza and the west bank. and then we have these fragile, ongoing ceasefire

talks for phase two happening in qatar right now. >> yasmin vossoughian, thank you for that report. still ahead tonight on ayman, a personal thank you to the president for finally speaking the truth about the war in gaza. but right after this break, the legal resistance to trump and musk's widespread to trump and musk's widespread takeover of ever feel like a spectator in your own life with chronic migraine? 15 or more headache days a month, each lasting 4 hours or more. botox® prevents headaches in adults with chronic migraine. in a survey, 91% of users wish they'd started sooner. so why wait? talk to your doctor. botox® effects may spread hours to weeks after injection, causing serious symptoms. alert your doctor right away as trouble swallowing, speaking, breathing, eye problems, or muscle weakness can be signs of a life-threatening condition. those with these conditions before injection are at highest risk. side effects may include allergic reactions like rash, breathing problems, dizziness, neck and injection site pain, and headache. don't receive botox® if there's a skin infection.

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moves by the trump administration. in response, the nonprofit advocacy group public citizens has filed multiple lawsuits to challenge trump and elon musk's efforts to reshape our government. they've sued d.o.j, the treasury department, the office of personnel management, and the department of education, among others. joining me now is robert weissman, co-president of public citizen. robert, it's great to have you on the show. first, let me start with your response to the judge's decision yesterday to pause the trump administration's attempted purge of usaid. your organization filed the lawsuit over the effort to put thousands of workers on leave this week. how significant is this temporary pause, and what does it tell us about the efficacy, or perhaps limits of our current guardrails? >> it's just a temporary restraining order. we're going to have to get a permanent. injunction to. >> uphold the law. >> we're having musk and trump pursuing. >> lawless activity. >> lawless and unconstitutional.

>> activity. >> and we're. >> going. >> to have to. >> rely on the courts to bring. >> them to heel. and we intend. >> to do just that. i do think. >> the lawsuits. >> are not everything, and. >> we can't stop. >> everything they're going to do with. >> lawsuits. >> but they're a. >> vital tool both to stop what they're doing and also. inspire people. that resistance standing up makes a difference. >> what is the legal argument that you made that allowed you to get this temporary order that could potentially become a permanent one? >> it's really simple. usaid. >> the international agency for humanitarian. >> work, was created. >> by congress. it is funded by congress. >> president can't just decide to close it down. elon musk definitely can't just decide to. close it down. this is like, you know. >> 11th grade. >> civics, fifth. >> grade civics. >> schoolhouse rock. >> so we're charging that. >> they're violating the separation. >> of powers that the president is violating it. >> violating his duty to take.

>> care of the laws. >> are enforced. >> and we expect the judge to side. >> with us, ultimately. >> how does it how does it play out next? i mean, walk us through a little bit of the timeline. is this something you suspect will go all the way up to the supreme court? >> well, we're a little. >> ways away from that. >> we're going to be. back in court next week, where the judge is. >> going to consider it for a longer injunction, and. >> the government will have. more opportunity to defend what it's doing. they were a little bit at a loss to explain the rationale for what they're doing. then the judge will issue an order that. >> hopefully permanently. >> enjoins the shutdown of aid. >> i do expect that. >> the government will appeal. trump administration will appeal whether. >> this goes to the supreme court or not. >> i don't know if the musk. >> project of. >> doge is going. to go. agency to agency and shut down things that are congressionally, congressionally created and congressionally appropriated. i think it's highly likely. that one of those cases will get to the supreme court. >> your group, as well as 19

state attorneys general, also sued the treasury department for granting doj's access to confidential data. and just today, a federal judge has temporarily blocked political appointees and special government employees, including those at doj, from accessing that data. as i mentioned, we also have the birthright citizenship, which has also been temporarily paused. tell us a little bit about how you read these initial first stage wins, if that's even the right word for it. what can you tell us about these temporary orders? >> well, they're all temporary, but. >> hopefully they're going to. >> be permanent. >> and block these lawless efforts of the trump musk administration. they're going to play out over time. and it's obvious that the administration. >> is willing to take. >> a lot of losses and assume that some stuff will get through. the other limitation we face is that even when we win. real destruction can be done. so aid. >> is a decimated. >> agency right now. if we get it back going again, it's not

going to be the same place. it was because of the harm that's been inflicted. >> over. >> just these few weeks. so they're going to do real damage in the best case scenario. but the lawsuits can make a real difference in blocking it. and in cases like birthright citizenship, i think they're going to shut down the administration's effort altogether. >> we've just learned that russell vought, a project 2025 architect, is now the director of the omb. he's also the acting leader of the consumer financial protection bureau. what do you think our viewers should know about him specifically now heading this agency? >> well. >> russell, vote. >> is a. >> dangerous man inside the administration. he obviously doesn't have the profile of elon musk, but he's going to have the reach, seriousness and aggressiveness and ruthlessness that musk is already displaying. he describes himself as a christian nationalist. he was one of the key authors of project 2025. he helped lead the american first policy institute, which planned a lot of what's now happening in the trump administration. he announced

that his purpose was to make federal workers feel intimidated and hated. so he is an aggressive, radical extremist pursuing a christian nationalist mission. he's going to go to the consumer financial protection bureau and very, very likely try to shut the agency down. i think he's going to fail again. that's a congressionally created agency with its own independent appropriations. it's not a choice whether it exists or doesn't exist. and i think what's going to be important about that fight is it's going to make very clear who is on whose side. we're hearing a lot about the populist administration, so-called of donald trump. well, they're right on target right now to close down the most effective consumer protection agency that we've seen in the last 50 years that has saved consumers $20 billion. that's cracking down on everything from big banks to predatory lenders. and he's going to go to bat for them and

against everyday people. and we're going to have to tell that story and then beat him in the courts. >> robert weissman, i greatly appreciate your time and your insights. look forward to having. unfortunately, i look forward to having more of these conversations with you as we track all of these different developments and legal cases as they wind their way through our court system. thank you so much. >> well. >> we're going to be here. thanks so much. >> our next up, we have new developments regarding the fbi developments regarding the fbi agents who investigated my mental health was better. but uncontrollable movements called td,tardive dyskinesia, started disrupting my day. td felt embarrassing. i felt like disconnecting. i asked my doctor about treating my td, and learned about ingrezza. ♪ ingrezza ♪ ingrezza is clinically proven to treat td, quickly reducing td by greater than five times at two weeks. number-one prescribed ingrezza has dosing that's always one pill, once daily. and you can keep taking most mental health meds. ingrezza can cause depression, suicidal thoughts, or actions in patients with huntington's disease. call your doctor if you become depressed,

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week again. >> read and listen. >> staying up half the night reading executive orders. >> for. >> this defining time in the second trump presidency. stay with msnbc. >> lock in a whole. year of peacock for only 29.99. experience the joy of staying in and watch all this. >> for less. >> than $3 a month. don't miss your chance to lock in a whole year of peacock for only 29.99 a limited time offer. >> terms apply. >> no, but i'll fire some of them because some of them were corrupt, i have no doubt about that. we had some corrupt agents and those people are gone or they will be gone and it will be done quickly and very surgically. >> that was president trump. when asked whether he would fire fbi agents who worked on january 6th cases, providing absolutely no evidence of said corruption. this comes as tensions remain high at the bureau, while trump and his allies continue their

revenge and bullying tour. after days of resisting, the fbi was forced to hand the justice department the names of agents who worked on the january 6th case. now, in a rare win for privacy, these names will not be made public, at least for now. this after a group of fbi agents who sued the justice department won an illegal agreement prohibiting anyone in the government from releasing those names. and while these agents might be safe from public scrutiny for the time being, the same cannot be said about some cia officials. after the agency sent an unclassified email with names of employees hired over the last two years to the trump administration. joining me now is former cia officer andrew barclay. he's also the chief legal counsel to whistleblower aid and served as the attorney for the whistleblower in trump's first impeachment trial. andrew, it's good to have you back on the show. you know, last weekend, you and i talked about the courage of people like brian driscoll, the acting director of the fbi, and his attempt to kind of hold the line against the trump administration. what do you make of where things stand this week, of him being forced

to hand over these names? he tried, you know, just to submit a list of employees identification numbers in order to protect their privacy. but that obviously was not enough for those that sought it. >> look, i think. >> there's a. >> lot to unpack here. a lot of things. >> are moving. relatively quickly. >> i think it's. >> unfortunate that. >> that's what's happened. >> i know. >> that agent. >> driscoll. >> acting director. >> driscoll. >> isn't. >> everything that he could and everything. >> that he. >> can to. protect the rank and file. fbi agents at the bureau. >> but the fact that this. >> happened is really. >> really unfortunate. >> what more can be done to protect these agents safety now? i mean, all these january 6th riders have been pardoned. we know how the right wing media operates in this country. when they sometimes dox these people. we know what the consequences of that. you know, in civil society workers that we've seen in the past, the poll workers, for example. under the agreement, their names are protected, but only up until late march. >> you know, that's why. >> my colleagues and. >> i, we. >> had this case filed here in district court. >> in d.c.

>> to try and protect and ensure that the identities of the fbi agents don't become public. the threats are real, right? it's not just the individual folks who are supportive of the president and january 6th who are going to try and potentially try and harm these agents and analysts, by the way. it also involves agents who are working in other unrelated cases. fbi agents work on criminal investigations all around the world. counterintelligence investigations. they testify in court against and against folks who are found. >> guilty for committing. >> heinous crimes. there are in. absolute danger, and that is why we need to protect their identities. >> you know, speaking of foreign influence, let's talk about kash patel for a moment. he's obviously awaiting his senate confirmation as the director of the fbi. he's actually coming under renewed scrutiny for some of his foreign business dealings, namely, holding more than $1 million in stock in a fashion company founded in china that even a pro-trump nonprofit

has accused of slave labor. talk us through the conflicts of interest here and why that is dangerous for somebody who would hold a position as the fbi director. >> i mean. >> the fact. >> that he has these. >> conflicts of interest calls into question. >> his ability to. >> be completely. >> disinterested in which way. >> investigations are being conducted in the federal government. but let's step back for a moment and think about. what's been happening across the government throughout this entire week, right. you mentioned that. >> you know, we've been just. >> discussing the fact that cia officers. had their names pumped up to leadership. >> or to the white. >> house and unclassified manner. right. >> that creates an entire. >> problem for. >> the ability. >> for our. >> partners abroad, the united kingdom, canada, etc, to trust us with. sensitive information. i just want to let. everybody think about this. >> one of the things. >> that led to nine over 11 was. >> the fact that there. >> was a gap in information. >> sharing between the fbi.

>> and the cia and others. >> it was. >> an. >> intelligence failure. >> and what we're seeing here is. our inability to. >> protect our own information, which can restrict our partners overseas in sharing critical information that can prevent horrible things from happening here on american soil. >> so the fact. >> of the matter. >> is. >> is that the way that things are being handled within. >> the. >> community by. >> this, by doge and others is. >> completely creating an absolute. risk for every. >> american here in the homeland. >> let me get your thoughts on excuse me. let me get your thoughts on some of the more what i would say, like they're superficial things that president trump is doing, although they're symbolically important and that is revoking the national security clearance of a former president like joe biden, or denying him the ability to access intelligence briefings. biden, of course, did that back in 2021 against trump. but tonight we have the new york post reporting that trump is also stripping the security

clearances of letitia james and alvin bragg, and that actually has real life consequences on people still in positions of law enforcement in their in this country, in their role in keeping the public safe. >> oh, absolutely. >> and actually. >> in. >> that article. >> one of my colleagues. >> who was co-counsel with. >> me on the ukraine matter. >> has apparently had his security clearance stripped. as well. i have yet to hear about mine, but. the fact of the matter is, it's a chilling effect. it's a tool to target individuals and intimidate people from doing their jobs. that's what we're here to do is. >> to use. >> the judicial system, the process, to make sure. >> that people are. >> held accountable. >> one of the. >> things that i also want to talk about today, that. >> i don't think has been reported. >> and it's really. >> important to just. >> to grasp the significance of what's happening. so we know that, for example, doge has been in the department of treasury sucking up information and. for what reason, right. >> i have. >> talked to. to individuals within the intelligence. >> community and have. heard that doge is also within the ic.

what are. >> they doing there? >> what are they. >> rummaging through? >> and again, it goes back to my. larger point about how. >> this has a direct effect on our national security. and for a lot of people, that may be more of a theoretical or ethereal thing. but the truth. >> of the matter. >> is, is that how. >> it goes. >> back to what i was saying before. how we how our credibility is at stake and our partners trust in us is at stake. intelligence sharing is. fundamentally based on trust, right? >> and if people. >> if our partners can't trust us and they don't share critical intelligence and information that we need, it is a direct impact on every american citizen. >> our partners won't trust us. our enemies and adversaries will look at us and say we are in chaos, an opportune time to exploit all that is happening. andrew barkai, thank you so much. it's great to see you and have your insights. as always. >> thank you. thank you for having me on. having me on. >> a new hour for more than a decade farxiga has been trusted again and again, and again.

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