friend sold their policy to help pay their medical bills, and that got me thinking. maybe selling our policy could help with our retirement. i'm skeptical, so i did some research and called coventry direct. they explained life insurance is a valuable asset that can be sold. we learned we could sell all of our policy, or keep part of it with no future payments. who knew? we sold our policy. now we can relax and enjoy our retirement as we had planned. if you have $100,000 or more of life insurance, you may qualify to sell your policy. don't cancel or let your policy lapse without finding out what it's worth. visit coventrydirect.com to find out if your policy qualifies. or call the number on your screen. coventry direct, redefining insurance. >> good to be with. >> you, i'm katie tur. >> we start. >> today with prices. >> as in the prices you are

paying for goods and services which are going up again after months of declining inflation reports today, economists were smacked with a doozy. the consumer price index. >> jumped half. >> a percent month over month, the biggest hike since august 2023. it's now up to 3% year over year, a red hot signal that inflation is not entirely under control. groceries are up, gas prices are up, airfare is up, hotel rates are up, meaning that if you were waiting for a quick fix for your pocketbook, you're going to have to wait some more. because despite what politicians say, no president is fully in control of the economy. it is too complicated, too dependent on global forces. and that's what makes it so tricky for politicians. because when you say things like this. >> so when i win, i will immediately bring prices down. starting on day one.

>> you're going to be held accountable. see this question from cbs's latest poll as evidence. 66% say he's not focused enough on lowering prices. and now take that and understand why both trump and his administration are quickly trying to adjust expectations. >> so if all goes to. >> plan, when do you think families. >> will be able to. >> feel prices going down, groceries, energy? or are you kind of saying to them, hang on, inflation may get worse until it gets better? >> no, i think we're going to become a rich look. we're not that rich right now. we owe $36 trillion. that's because we let all these nations take advantage of us. >> and i do believe that means consumers are going to see lower prices at the pump and at the grocery store, but it's going to take a little bit of time. rome wasn't built in a day. >> or is it a year? >> and will. >> americans have. >> the patience. >> to wait for it? >> i don't. >> have a i don't have a timeline, but the president is doing. everything that he possibly can to reduce cost of living for americans at home.

>> adjustment noted there. okay, now for what the administration can control. and that is legislation, specifically legislation to either help strengthen the social safety net or legislation to cut taxes. and that is where president trump could have some real trouble. his big goal on that front is, as you know, to lower taxes, but you can't get there without some major cuts, which is why republicans are having a hard time getting on the same page. joining us now to break it all down, nbc news senior business correspondent christine romans, nbc news senior white house correspondent kelly o'donnell, and punchbowl news co-founder and msnbc political contributor jake sherman. christine, i will begin with you explain what happened today. >> well, inflation is still not under control and in fact, is ticking up again. and when you look inside these numbers, it's shelter, it's gas prices. it's stuff like airfare, a lot of stuff that you feel every day. auto insurance also going up. i mean, these are things that american families really feel.

and these are putting pressure, i think, on the white house, to try to explain why those very big promises made for, you know, cutting your insurance costs, cutting your food costs, cutting your energy costs, why that isn't happening yet, and in fact, is going in the other dire y eggs get all of the attention because it's just this, this, this feeling, you know, this, this real feel indicator of how how bad the economy is for people who are living paycheck to paycheck. look at egg prices there from 252 last year to 4.95. they may go back down maybe sometime next year when the bird flu is over. but there are a lot of different forces at play here. >> there's also what donald trump wants to do. we talked about legislation, but let's talk about his other executive orders or the power that he solely has tariffs, the immigration policies that he has in place, stuff that economists will say can also make inflation worse. >> almost everyone agrees that tariffs are inflationary, at least in the near term, because those are import taxes that add costs for importers and for manufacturers and for consumers. i've been looking at all of the

forecasts. there's still a lot of uncertainty about how these tariffs will go into play. but you've got $3,000 more for a new car. for example, you've got a homebuilder saying maybe $5,000 more on a new home. if there are 10% tariffs on canadian crude, that's 15 to $0.25 more on a gallon of gas. those are the kinds of real kind of forecasts out there for what could come if some of these, some of these policies go into. >> play about the fed. how does the fed work with this? because donald trump has been very clear that he wants the fed to lower rates. jerome powell has stayed steady so far. it's a month in. what sort of pressure is on the fed? and what would the fed be doing under circumstances where a president wasn't so involved? >> well, the fed chief today actually is speaking to congress and was asked, you know, what are you doing to lower costs for the american families? and the fed chief saying, look, we're doing what we're supposed to be doing, make sure the job market is strong and making sure we're getting prices under control. prices aren't under control yet. so that means the fed can't be cutting interest rates when inflation is too high. that sets them up for conflict with the white house.

>> kelly, i wonder if the if the white house and the president believe that they they have a little bit of runway with the american public because the american public voted them in to change things in washington to, to install the tariffs as he campaigned on to go at immigration, as he campaigned on to work through government, as he campaigned on all of these things. when you look at the cbs poll, broadly speaking, it is good for donald trump. there is that one number that i showed a moment ago that 66% of americans wanted to focus more on prices. do they believe that they have room that rome wasn't built in a day as as j.d. vance mentioned a moment ago? well, interestingly. >> at the press briefing today, caroline leavitt used some of the data from the same poll, the cbs news poll, but not this particular fact. so she highlighted other areas where the public has been supportive of the flurry of activity that the president and his team are putting forward day after day. and part of their strategy is to overwhelm and flood the zone with actions on a variety of

things, and that fills a lot of the space while people are talking about and experiencing high costs, they're not able to address that instantly. at the briefing, she also said, of course, the president wants to see interest rates lower and prices decline, but there isn't a specific remedy for that at this point. and so they are asking for patience in a way, but also focusing on other things that they are accomplishing and things that they are ticking off. the list of things that the president had campaigned on, that they are achieving. and he's not talking much about reductions in costs. and so also don't expect prices to drop. it's slowing. the growth of prices is the more likely outcome when market forces begin to show some, perhaps cost savings, as the president likes to talk about energy cost reductions and how that might pass to consumers. but the plan is still to go forward with tariffs, which was certainly talked about extensively during the campaign. voters knew that was coming, but many don't understand or may not

have considered how that could have an impact on the prices that they pay as consumers when those import taxes are levied. >> yeah, and i think one of the things we learned from 2016, and we should have learned again with the reelection of donald trump, is that the people who vote for him do give him a lot of runway, not to be held accountable for some of the things that he says on the campaign trail. so if prices start going up, you might hear people say, no, it's okay. he's got time. we're going to let him sort it out. or you might hear them say what donald trump says, which is that it's the biden administration's fault. they do give him a lot more space, at least initially, than they might give other politicians, republicans and trump voters. that is, democrats are obviously very up in arms. jake, the other aspect of this is what's happening in congress legislation, tax cuts are something that donald trump wants that can potentially be pretty inflationary. add to the debt. how does the republican congress conference stand on this right now? >> a few things to think about,

katie. if and. i do. >> think they will. >> extend the 2017. >> tax rates. >> which were enacted during donald trump's first presidency, that is going to come a very long time from now. i mean, speaker mike johnson, who's meeting with hard line house republicans just down the. hallway from me right now. he hopes to have this done by easter. i am taking the over. so any whatever you think. >> the impact. >> will be, that impact is not going to be felt for some time, good or bad. that's number one. >> number two. >> house republicans and senate republicans, but mostly house republicans want to cut. >> up to. >> $2 trillion. >> of federal. spending in. >> the next. >> ten years. >> where is that going to come from? it's going to come. we saw today the house republican. >> budget resolution. >> the majority of. that is going to come from the education. >> the energy and commerce committee, which has purview over. >> things like health care, like. >> medicaid. >> a big federal. >> program that republicans. >> said they. want to find

savings and they want to cut. now, they say it will not be benefits, that. >> they will be. >> cutting medicaid benefits, but they would rather. put in work. requirements to ensure that, in their words, able bodied people. >> 40 and under are required to work to be on federal. >> benefits. >> so they're. >> not going. >> to get. as much. money from that as they think. but we're in a period where where it is a if you are looking if you're looking at this honestly. >> to be honest. >> with you, cutting is a difficult thing to do that you don't ask the government. it's very difficult to take away benefits that the government. >> has already given to you. >> that's the message challenge. and to be honest with you, this is going to again. >> take a long time. so you're going to have to fill the next. several months. >> talking about the bounce that you may or may not get from these programs when they're. >> put into place. >> there are a lot of frontline republicans who are in positions

in blue states. even that, that they're not in a position to want to make those cuts to medicaid and medicare. there's also republicans in red states that have gotten a lot of money off the inflation reduction act that might not want that sort of stuff cut. then there's the salt tax, which again, republicans in blue states, blue cities specifically would like added back. there's no margin here for error among the house conference. they can lose one vote right now. one because of all of the vacancies that are currently in that conference. when it gets filled up, i think the margin ends up being two votes that they can lose. what is the dynamic between the house and the senate? because the senate clearly wants to move faster than the house can. >> the senate wants to give trump an early victory on energy policy. >> border policy and. military spending. they are passing. >> a two. >> step what we call reconciliation process. kelly and i have spent way too much time in our lives thinking about this process. >> but a two step process that would give.

>> trump a win on the. >> front end, and then taxes they would do later. so that is the house says, let's do it in one package, let's get it done. let's get it done quickly. that's a very difficult challenge. now you get to the margin. you're right there. there were, if you remember back in 2017, there were 22 house republicans who voted against the budget resolution. that early step that unlocks the reconciliation process. you can't you could have one now. and it depends on the day if someone's out sick, if elise stefanik resigns and goes to the administration, there are all these variables that you need to take into consideration. and i'll be honest with you, what you said on medicaid. now, the trump administration, house republican leadership, senate republican leadership says they're not going to touch medicare and social security. medicaid has been expanded so much over the last couple of years, last decade or so, that it is not only now for low income or impoverished people, it is. >> for a. >> whole host of people. because of that expansion over the last

decade or so, jeff van drew, republican from new jersey, formerly a democrat who represents southern jersey, has expressed those concerns. he told us last week to the administration, to his leadership, that he doesn't want to get into deep cuts on medicaid because he worries about the impact, both the political impact, i assume, and the policy impact. so this is an extraordinarily narrow bridge that they have to that they have to navigate over the next couple of months. >> here is the message. the economy is complicated. no one person can control it. getting your agenda through congress is also complicated. when many parts of your agenda are in conflict with each other, or when your conference, even though you might have one, isn't all on the same page because they've got their own constituencies to worry about. all of this is much more difficult than it might be displayed on the campaign trail described on the campaign trail. christine romans, thank you very much. kelly o'donnell in a very beautiful white house setting

today. kelly, thank you. and, jake, don't go anywhere. i'm going to i'm going to pick your brain a little bit more after this next break. still ahead, tulsi gabbard has officially been confirmed as the director of national intelligence. intelligence? excuse me? what? the sole republican to vote no said about her the warning that he gave. plus, what we know about today's quote, highly productive phone call between donald trump and vladimir putin. what did they discuss and who wasn't on that call? and later, what new lawsuit was just filed against the trump administration in response to its ongoing effort to dismantle the federal effort to dismantle the federal government? we are back in want a next level clean? swish with the whoa of listerine. it kills 99.9% of bad breath germs for five times more cleaning power than brushing and flossing alone. get a next level clean... ahhhhh with listerine. feel the whoa! this is where you are. but this...is where you want to go. (♪♪) we give you the rewards

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>> can replace your windshield. >> right at your home. >> safelite repair. >> safelite replace. >> go to. safelite.com and schedule. >> a replacement today. >> this afternoon, the senate voted to confirm tulsi gabbard as the new director of national intelligence. the final tally was 52 to 48, with all democrats voting in opposition, while senator mitch mcconnell was the only republican who voted no. and in a in a sharp statement that he released after the vote, the former leader of the republican party said this, quote, the senate's power of advice and consent is not an option. it is an obligation and one we cannot pretend to misunderstand. the nation should not have to worry that the intelligence assessments the president receives are tainted by a director of national intelligence, with a history of alarming lapses in judgment, adding, quote, edward snowden's treasonous betrayal of the united states and its most sensitive law. intelligence

activities, endangered sources, methods, and lives japan is among america's closest treaty allies in the indo-pacific, and the risk of conflict in the region is the product of chinese aggression, not western threat inflation. russia's escalation of its unprovoked war of aggression against ukraine threatens american interests and is solely the responsibility of vladimir putin and trusting the coordination of the intelligence community to someone who struggles to acknowledge these facts is an unnecessary risk. jake sherman still with us? that is pretty sharp from mitch mcconnell. >> i would say. so. mitch mcconnell unplugged. >> i guess you could say, katie. >> i mean, listen, this. >> is. >> somebody who's. >> now voted. >> against pete hegseth for. >> defense secretary and. for tulsi gabbard for dni. next up is robert f kennedy jr, who. >> has, as we all. >> know, we don't need to relitigate the whole thing, but has been skeptical, skeptical

rather about the efficacy of vaccines. mitch mcconnell, of course, is a polio survivor. i don't know how he's going to come down on that, but he's clearly not encumbered. by the idea that he's a republican. he is a republican, and that he needs to vote down the line for the for president trump. but, i mean, listen, the entire rest of the senate republican conference to a person is supporting his nominees. and trump has had a clean sweep here. i mean, he has got through after the matt gaetz episode in which he nominated matt gaetz to be attorney general, trump has moved. >> the trump. >> white house has moved really, really efficiently to get his cabinet in place in. >> i think, ways. >> that i didn't, definitely in ways i didn't expect. and a lot of people didn't expect up here. >> the senate is doing a lot with these confirmations. they're moving them as quickly as they possibly can. we're going to see rfk soon as well. you're also talking to me about budget reconciliation. is there anything else happening on the hill? usually by this point we have a better idea of what the

agenda is going to be going forward for a new administration because after all, political capital wears out and you never have more political capital than you do at the very beginning. >> yeah. that's right. >> i mean, the. >> president has signed into law the lincoln riley act, which was that piece of legislation that the house passed last congress, which stiffens penalties and makes it easier to detain undocumented immigrants who have been accused of crimes. so that was one. >> bill. >> that the house and senate passed early on, actually, during the biden presidency. but donald trump was able to sign the difficulty, katie, is that the president and his administration, coupled with congressional leaders on capitol hill, have decided to put everything into this reconciliation package to circumvent the 60 vote threshold in the senate, because reconciliation is considered at a 51 vote margin, a majority plus one. so they have done that to the i. >> guess. >> detriment is one way you

could say it of anything else that could pass on a bipartisan basis. i mean, listen, trump is not terribly interested, i don't think, in bipartisanship. and i think he wants to get his agenda through. but, i mean, there's going to be plenty of opportunities, katie, in the next couple of weeks, march 14th, the government runs out of money. there's going to be a california wildfire aid package at some point soon. we would imagine those are are items that are going to need to be keeping the government open, the aid package that are going to need democratic votes to get over the finish line. so i think you'll see some of that then. but as as for a proactive agenda, everything is just wrapped up in this reconciliation package. >> let me ask you one more question about tulsi gabbard. she's going to get confirmed on that, that subject of her. you got to bring up russia. she's been pretty warm toward vladimir putin much as donald trump has been. donald trump was able to secure the release of some americans, they say, for low level criminals here in the united states in exchange of

russians. but it makes you wonder what else he might be working with vladimir putin on in order to get vladimir putin to work with him on these exchanges. we got some word about a conversation that vladimir putin and donald trump had about the war in ukraine. how is that conversation and a desire to negotiate a peace, even though vladimir, vladimir zelensky was not on that call? how is that conversation so far, news of it going over in congress? >> well, listen, katie, it doesn't have to be explicitly stated. it's mood music, right? i mean, the president president trump is and his vice president and his and his secretary of defense, pete hegseth, are much more willing to enter into settlement agreements over the war in ukraine with ukraine getting not having the totality of its country and its control. that's something that they acknowledge as the reality. and the borders are not going to go

back to where they were. so ipso facto, maybe the kremlin is more willing to cooperate on some of these prisoner swaps, more willing than the biden administration, which basically said, our appetite for giving money to ukraine is effectively unending, and we want ukraine to be able to defend itself. >> all right. jake sherman, thank you very much. still ahead, more executive orders are being challenged in court today. what decisions could come down on the futures of u.s. aid and fema? plus, where is the line for democrats as the trump administration continues to, quote, flood the zone? what one former congressman is urging his former congressman is urging his colleagues to do? the democrats, -honey... -but the gains are pumping! dad, is mommy a "finance bro?" she switched careers to make money for your weddings. oooh the asian market is blowing up! hey who wants shots, huh?! -shots?? -of milk. the right money moves aren't as aggressive as you think. business. it's not a nine-to-five proposition. it's all day and into the night.

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1-833-735-4495. >> or visit homeserve. >> com. >> donald trump is defending the mass firings of federal watchdogs. >> our federal. >> government now can discriminate against the citizens of the country. >> we are. >> all watching. and waiting to see who is. >> going to. >> hold the line. don't miss the weekends, saturday, and. >> sunday mornings at. >> 8:00 on msnbc. >> president trump's first 100 days watch.

>> i'm going to be. >> here. >> five days a week again. >> read and listen. >> staying up half. >> the. night reading executive. >> orders for this defining time in the second trump presidency. stay with msnbc. >> i was. >> a. >> public defender. i defended bad people. i got assigned to. those cases, and i assume that you respect the fact that i took the assignment. >> absolutely. >> it would never hold it against. >> a public. >> defender that they were defending in the court of law, a person who was accused of a serious crime. right. >> i would not. >> right. and my view on the fbi is it's. >> the same. >> thing if an fbi agent, i'm a worker there, and i get assigned to a case by my boss. >> is there any. >> reason in the world that i should pay a price? because i did my job as assigned? >> i don't. >> know, and i don't think that that's what's happening. i'm not there. >> i see the.

>> same memo. >> the same articles, but i don't think that i get. >> let me. i know you weren't there, but let me just ask you. we have. >> got to stand. >> up for those folks. my hope is you're going to defend the men and women of the fbi who just did their job. >> the men and women of the fbi that just did their job. >> of course. absolutely. >> that right there was senator peter welch earlier today, using his own experience as a public defender to challenge donald trump's pick for deputy attorney general, todd blanch. so far, two anonymous sets of fbi groups have sued the administration to prevent the doj from releasing the identities of those who participated in the january 6th investigations. those suits are among the more than 50 that have been filed against the administration's efforts to fundamentally reshape the us government from attempts to end birthright citizenship to freezing federal spending. joining us now, msnbc legal correspondent lisa rubin and nbc news justice and intelligence correspondent ken dilanian. i

thought that that sound right there, that moment, that exchange between senator welch and todd blanch was so informative. can you tell us what's happening within the fbi? i mean, todd blanch says he's not aware of that happening. he doesn't believe that's what's going on. what can you tell us from your reporting? >> well, katie, we know that there was a plan to fire. >> a. >> large number of january. >> 6th. >> agents, agents. >> and employees. >> who worked on january 6th cases. the acting fbi director, brian driscoll, essentially resisted that, pushed back. >> on that plan. and then the justice. >> department requested a list. >> of all. >> the names of everyone. who worked on these cases. that's around 5000 or more fbi employees, including acting director. driscoll himself. and driscoll resisted. >> turning over the names. >> he turned over employee id numbers. he was subsequently ordered to turn over the names, and he did that. and there is a widespread fear inside the fbi

that. maybe not all of these people, but a good chunk of these people are going to be targeted and are. >> going to be fired. >> or demoted or somehow disciplined because of their work on january 6th. >> now, blanch is saying, you. >> know, that anybody who just did their job has nothing to fear. but that's. >> not what i'm hearing. >> from inside the fbi. >> they are. >> people are very, very scared right now that because they worked on a case that donald trump and his supporters didn't. >> like. >> that they are they're going to pay the price. >> for it. so interestingly, ken, you have some, i think, pertinent reporting on the guy that's currently in toddanche'st he's going to take over. that's emil beauvais, who was also one of donald trump's defenders when he was a private citizen. what does the reporting on beauvais? >> so beauvais. >> has. >> been the face of this effort to go after these january 6th case. agents and support employees. he's the one signing the memos demanding the information. and it turns out that he actually played. >> a pretty. >> important role in new york city in overseeing. efforts to

hunt down january 6th defendants in the weeks and months after. >> the capitol riot. >> and i talked to. >> people. >> who worked with him who said he never expressed any qualms about the investigation. in fact, he was an aggressive participant. in it. he helped the fbi get arrest warrants and to monitor people's phones. and he was up all night. in the case of one high profile defendant they arrested in manhattan. now, through a spokesperson, he is saying essentially that he did come to believe that in other districts, there was some overzealousness going on in the way these cases were prosecuted, but that he acted with integrity. he makes no apologies for his work on january 6th, but it wasn't widely known. i have to say, even within the fbi, that the guy who was actually leading the charge on going after these january 6th people demanding their identities himself, participated in this investigation. >> oh, that's really interesting. lisa, i mentioned at the top there are a number of lawsuits against the federal government right now for basically violating the rules of the federal government for

illegally trying to fire people, for illegally trying to freeze spending, for illegally shutting down an agency. give us the status of just in bulk these these claims and what we should expect next. >> well. >> and many of the cases where the plaintiffs have sought emergency relief in almost all of them, they have obtained some form of emergency relief, be it a stay, a temporary restraining order, a preliminary injunction. i can think of only one case, katie, that involves the department of labor, where there was a challenge to doge access to data there where the plaintiffs lost. but for the most part, they are getting these pauses on the initiatives by the trump administration. >> why are they getting them? is it on the merits, or is it because the administration so far is not following procedure? >> well. >> i would i question the assumption in your in your question to a little bit. >> you're a lawyer. never ask a question of a lawyer. because they're going to question the premise. >> i think the process is the merits. right. and part of what they're saying here is if you ignore process and you just

focus on substance, which is what trump and elon musk have said, for example, from the press conference they held yesterday in the oval office that like, who would want to stop them from rooting out corruption and waste? but many of these people are saying, look, we have these statutes and regulations that govern who can have access to this data, for example, or who can fire people and under what conditions. we have them for reasons we have them for national security reasons, for personal privacy reasons. we have protections for civil servants because the continuity of government depends on them. so i wouldn't draw that distinction between process and merits. but i would say in many cases this is about process, or at least slowing things down enough that a judge can even get their arms around what this dispute is. >> they're doing so much all at once right now. lisa rubin, ken dilanian, thank you so much. and speaking of doing so much all at once, we've got to talk about one man in particular. as the trump administration continues to dismantle the federal government or to attempt to dodge chief. elon musk was asked about any conflicts of interest

he has while he was in the oval office yesterday. >> mr. musk, the white house says that you will identify and excuse yourself from any conflicts of interest that you may have. does that mean that you are, in effect, policing yourself? what are the checks and balances that are in place to ensure that there is accountability and transparency? >> well. >> we actually are trying to be as transparent as possible. in fact, our actions, our actions to the doge handle on x and to the doge website. so all of our actions are maximally transparent. in fact, i don't think there's been i don't know of a case where an organization has been more transparent than the doge organization. >> the follow. up to the. >> pentagon contracts, if you have received billions of dollars in contracts from the pentagon, and the president is directing you to look into the department of defense, is that. >> we definitely need to do. >> and are going to do. at the president's request. >> does that present a conflict of interest for you? >> no, because you'd have to look at the individual contract

and say, first of all, i'm not the one, you know, filing the contract. it's people at spacex or someone that will be voting for the contract. >> all right. joining us now, washington bureau correspondent for the new york times, eric lipton. eric, let's talk about these conflicts. you did some reporting today about all the ways that that elon musk is tied up with the federal government financially. can you help us understand the conflicts that currently exist? >> yeah, his. >> companies have. he is one of the largest federal contractors in the united states. his companies over the last five years have received more than $15 billion worth of contracts. and just in fiscal year 2024, there was approximately. $3.8 billion worth of contract awards, most of it going to spacex from the pentagon and from nasa, which is relying upon spacex to get almost everything both astronauts, cargo, spy satellites and other, you know, products into orbit. so he is, he is. and then at the same time, he also has dozens of different investigations of his

companies. and tesla is the subject of, you know, auto safety investigations. the faa is looking at the explosion of the starship launch that happened in sent debris over the caribbean. the national labor relations board is looking at employee complaints. the sec has a lawsuit against them. there are there are enforcement matters across the range of acronyms of the federal government. so he's simultaneously one of the largest federal contractors. he's the target of dozens of enforcement actions. and he has these powers over the federal government in terms of. >> spending. >> employment and regulations. >> is it clear that donald trump is involved in any of these decisions that elon musk is potentially behind? i mean, when you talk about the mass firing of inspectors general, you got to bring up, as you did, that among those dismissed was phyllis fong at the agriculture department. her agency had opened an investigation in 2022 into mr. musk's brain implant startup. it's called neuralink.

the inquiry was an inquiry was in progress. progress as of late last year, you report, according to two people familiar with it. i mean, this is just one of the instances where the person that was in charge of something that was overseeing elon musk no longer there. is it clear if donald trump knows about the nitty gritty here? >> i mean, we don't have evidence that musk himself has played a direct role in the firing of folks that oversee these investigations. we don't know just how much the president knows about, you know, the individual matters that that his companies that that the musk companies are. you know, facing right now. so most of the actions that have taken place that have benefited musk, that we examined in our story, kirsten and i, my colleague, you. >> know. >> they they happened because trump fired people or people have left because of the change in the administration, the national labor relations board, because of the people that trump fired, no longer has a quorum. it cannot take actions to, you

know, on on new enforcement matters or to settle matters. so we you know, but whether or not, you know, trump is taking those actions to benefit musk is unclear. but what is not what is totally clear is that there has been significant benefit for musk and his companies from all of the things that have happened so far. >> well, it's not totally clear. it means it's not fully transparent. and while there might be quite a bit of federal government waste that you can clean up, i'm sure there is the transparency here about how it's how it's being handled. it's just not there. we don't quite know what's going on, who's making the decisions and who exactly is benefiting. thank you so much for joining us eric lipton really great reporting. appreciate it. and still ahead, my next guest advice for his fellow democrats still in congress, what he says they need to actually start doing. plus, what does calling yourself a quote patriot really mean? what maryland governor wes moore says

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run your game. >> since president trump took office, democrats have taken to the podium to protest, delivering speeches outside of government buildings, appearing on news programs and introducing bills that attempt to curb the administration's power. but is any of that working? one former

congress member says no. he says it's time to get aggressive. and a new piece for the bulwark. former new jersey congressman tom malinowski writes, quote, the key now for democrats is to fight back, not with complaints which project weakness, but with actions that reclaim the initiative, inspire confidence and force trump to play defense. joining us now, former new jersey congressman tom malinowski. all right. action. what does that action look like? >> well. >> thank you for having me. look. >> i think a lot. >> of what we're seeing from the trump administration is just psychological warfare. it's designed to make democrats. and everybody who's trying to defend democracy in america feel helpless, feel powerless, demoralized, dispirited, and therefore paralyzed. but donald trump doesn't. >> have any more. >> power than any president had. >> before him, other than the. >> fact that members of his own party are scared of him. and democrats do have power. we have power in terms of using the

courts, and we're already seeing a lot of success there, and we need to keep going and to talk about that with confidence, because i think at the end of the day, the courts are going to uphold the law and the constitution. and second, democrats, particularly in the house of representatives, have a lot of leverage because there's really nothing serious that republicans and the trump administration can get through the house without support from democrats this year. do they use that power? >> they don't have the power to single handedly shut down government, obviously. but do they get on board with budget reconciliation? >> well. >> reconciliation is something. did they get on board with the budget bill? excuse me? >> look, the budget bill, the republicans, at least on paper, control the government, right? they control the house, the senate and the white house. march 14th. funding for the government runs out. and so it is on the republicans to pass a bill to fund the government. if they can't do that, and i'm still in the house of

representatives, and they come to me and say, tom, we need your help to pass our republican spending bill. i mean, it's just a no brainer. i'm going to say no, not unless you can guarantee me that every single penny we spend that we give this administration will be spent as congress directs, whether it's meals on wheels, farm aid, education, feeding hungry people around the world. if we enact it, you have to spend it. >> what about legislative action? other legislative action. we saw senator brian schatz hold up some nominees as protests, much like tommy tuberville did with the pentagon to protest the availability of abortion for people in the pentagon. is there any legislative action or holdups or processes that can happen within congress or within the senate to stall things? is that the sort of action you're looking for? >> some. >> not so much, because, i mean, it's look fine holding up

nominees who don't deserve to be confirmed. as a matter of substance, i'd be doing that too. but it's a bit of a double edged sword because on some level, i think donald trump would prefer not to have confirmed nominees for a lot of positions. if they're acting, then he has even more control over them. and some of the real nut jobs that are currently doing some of the things that we've been talking about are, in fact, acting nominees. they're not nominees. they're not people who could ever get senate confirmed. so yes, do that. but it's somewhat performative and it's not going to stop the administration in its tracks. the real power is in the house of representatives, and particularly beginning on march 14th, when the government is going to need funding to stay open, at least those parts that musk is not shutting down, and they're going to need an increase in the debt ceiling. they can't get that without democrats. >> what about social media? i mean, republicans used social media pretty well to their

advantage over the past four years helped get donald trump elected. are you looking at social media right now? >> well. >> i do think the main reason that we are in this mess is that the information now gets to the american people almost exclusively through these big tech social media platforms, where an algorithm is giving republicans one version of reality and democrats another version of reality. it's incredibly destructive to our democracy, to our society, to our mental health, to the mental health of children. we all know this. most americans, republicans as well as democrats hate this. and so i think the democrats need to start treating these big tech companies as the enemy rather than raising money in silicon valley. i think every democratic run, every blue state should be passing legislation on tech, accountability, on ai safety, on data privacy. i think that would be extremely popular. it would be an agenda that allows us to start playing

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to own the flag. republicans have owned the american flag for so many years now. they've owned this idea of patriotism. why haven't democrats tried to take it back? we saw something of it at the democratic national convention this year. and now there is one person in the democratic party. high profile person who may or may not be a candidate for 2028, come out and say, yes. the democrats do need to find a way to make patriotism their thing as well. listen to maryland governor wes moore on jen psaki first episode of her new podcast, the blueprint. >> there is an ownership of the flag and. patriotism by members. >> of the. >> republican party. >> regardless of. >> what that means, how. >> do democrats flip that? >> how do they regain it? >> how do they. >> address it? >> i think first. >> i think. >> democrats need to care to. >> address it. >> you don't think. >> they care. >> right now? >> i just i.

>> still think it's still so foreign for people. >> to, to. >> wonder why you would why why. >> you are. patriotic or what that means and what it looks like. >> and i think there's been. >> almost this, this conceding. >> of the flag. >> or for the. >> word. >> patriotism which, which. >> which. >> for me. >> is deeply. >> frustrating because, i mean, i. >> you. >> know. >> you know, i again. >> i think. >> about my own family history where, you know. >> my grandfather was born in south carolina, literally. >> his earliest. >> memories was. >> when the ku klux. >> klan ran him and his family, my great grandfather, my great grandmother out of the country, they go back to jamaica. most of my family who was with him. >> said. >> they would never come back to the united states, and a lot of them did not. but my grandfather did. >> and he loved. >> this country. >> he was so proud. >> when i joined the army. so the idea that somehow someone can take that from me, someone can take that from my family, someone. >> can. >> just. >> you know, particularly people who have not put in the work in

the same way that my family has put in the work, in the way of honoring and really loving this country and sacrificing for it, flaws and all. i just think we need to we need to be firm on this. and if you. >> believe in. >> this country, that doesn't mean saying that it is flawless. loving your country doesn't mean lying about its history, but loving your country. >> means you. >> actually have. >> a. >> role in making it better. i just think we need to we need to be firm on this. and if you. >> believe in this. >> country. >> that doesn't mean. >> saying that it. >> is flawless. >> loving your country. >> doesn't mean. >> lying about its history, but loving your country means you actually have. >> a role. >> in making it better. and that means. willing to do the work, knowing that the history that we come from is. >> a powerful. >> and a and a and a and a and a bold history, and that we do have an obligation to do our part to make it better. >> yeah, i do like that. i like that idea that loving your country doesn't mean you have to

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