dave's been very excited about saving big with the comcast business 5-year price lock guarantee. five years? -five years. and he's not alone. -high five. it's five years of reliable gig speed internet. five years of advanced securit. five years of a great rate that won't change. it's back. but only for a limited time. high five. five years? -nope. comcast business 5-year price lock guarantee. powering five years of savings. powering possibilities. comcast business. >> right now on msnbc. >> president trump. >> making new comments this hour on the jobs report as wall street wraps up a roller coaster week after the february numbers fall short of expectations, the president presses pause for now on his aggressive tariff policy. while elon musk's efforts to remake the federal government

run into new legal roadblocks, the president telling his cabinet secretaries they call the shot, not musk. and new concerns about the measles outbreak after a second death. we'll have what you need to know ahead. good afternoon. i'm christina ruffini in washington. any minute now, we're going to hear president trump's take on the jobs report. after what's been a rocky week of trumponomics. just this morning, we learned the unemployment rate ticked up slightly during trump's first full month in office to 4.1%. the monthly report includes a loss of about 10,000 federal jobs, which might just be the tip of the doge iceberg. and only 25 days after enacting a 25% tariff on all goods from canada and mexico, president trump clawed back the import tax on goods that comply with the north american trade deal he signed during his first term to replace nafta, leaving the nation scrambling to decipher what is and what is not

covered. but the exceptions will only last a month, after which trump is vowing reciprocal tariffs on virtually every u.s. trading partner. right now, we're going to take a look at the dow. it is down 311 points, or about 0.7%. we're going to start off with nbc news white house correspondent vaughn hillyard, nbc senior white house correspondent garrett hake, nbc news business correspondent brian chung, and former chairman of the council of economic advisers under president obama, jason furman, and former republican governor of ohio john kasich. vaughn, we're going to start with you. all right. the president has insisted and continues to insist that the short term pain for long term gain calculation will be worth it. where do things stand right now? >> right. and his cabinet officials from commerce secretary howard lutnick to scott benson, his treasury secretary, have defended the president's decisions when it comes to strategy. the way that scott bessent characterized it is that it's organic, effectively acknowledging that these are day to day decisions.

of course, it was earlier this week that across the board, tariffs were placed on mexican and canadian goods. and then 24 hours later, the administration opted to exempt all goods from canada and mexico that fell under the usmca trade agreement that his own administration, the first go around, passed and negotiated itself. and so when you're looking at where the economic forecast is, you are continually seeing indications of a cooling economy, of a job market that had more than 150,000 jobs but less than expected. you've seen the stock market steadily decrease, commodity prices drop questions over the future of the housing market. and so for the trump administration, as you heard from his speech to the joint session of congress earlier this week, he suggested that there could be some discomfort in the american economy. but in so many ways, christina, this echoes what we saw back in 2018 when he initiated trade wars against mexico, canada, the eu and

china. the stock market dropped in 2018. it was the worst stock market dating back to 2008, and we saw commodity prices drop as we saw the united states federal government, the trump administration, willingly entangle itself with some of its most foremost key trading partners. and once again, here in 2025, we are watching the same contest of consequences play out. and so far, the trump administration largely moving forward, though acknowledging and making taking some steps back with some of these exemptions. >> yeah. watching the markets, we are, as we mentioned, waiting for president trump to make remarks any second now, it will be interesting to see what he has to say about both the jobs report and the impact of the tariffs. now, garrett, speaking of, you're in toronto and you just met with ontario premier doug ford. he's had some pretty spicy things to say about what he could do if these tariffs go into place. what is his message to the president and to americans about the consequences of these tariffs? >> yeah, cristina, he's really been at the tip of the spear

here in terms of canada's response on these tariffs. and i got to tell you, it is difficult to overstate just how angry canadians are about this, how much it's front of mind. it's the top story on every newscast. it's all over the radio stations here. it's front of mind for canadians we've been talking to around toronto and for doug ford, it's sort of a whole of government response. they've pulled american goods like american liquor, canadian or, excuse me, californian wines, bourbons from kentucky off the store shelves in state run liquor stores. and they're threatening. not a tariff, but an extra fee, essentially a 25% adjustment to the cost of electricity that's sold across the border in places like new york and minnesota and in other northern tier states. ford took pains to make sure american viewers understand that he is angry, and that this retaliation is aimed at donald trump, not at americans. but he believes americans will feel the cost. take a listen to some of our conversation from earlier.

>> i apologize. >> to the american people. >> it's not them. it's one person. it's president trump. i feel terrible doing it. but we're moving forward on a 25% tariff on monday to new york, michigan and minnesota. we keep 1.5 million lights on in businesses and homes, and we're going to put a tariff on that. >> christina, one of the terms i keep hearing from canadians we talked to is that this moment is something of a wakeup call that they've always looked at the united states as this reliable ally, trading partner. the united states is canada's biggest trading partner anywhere in the globe, and that we are not, as americans, behaving that way in this moment. and they are coming to find a certain form of self-sufficiency. there's a big buy canadian movement afoot all across the country right now, and you're seeing that play out very much in real time. despite the actions taken by the president yesterday to walk back some of the tariffs he had put in place earlier this week. >> all right, garrett, thank you so much. brian, i want to turn to you. now. you know, we got

back here in the states. we've gotten the monthly jobs report. talk us through what the reaction has been in the markets. and we're also starting to see notes coming from the oval office where president trump is speaking. it looks like he is talking about jobs. what more do we know. >> yeah we're. >> getting these feeds out. and again. >> we were trying to get the playback essentially because we won't actually see the video until a few minutes from now. but it sounds like the president is trying to take claim over the manufacturing numbers that we saw in the jobs report. as you mentioned, at the top here, 151,000 jobs added in the month of february. and in the sector of manufacturing, there were 10,000 gain, 10,000 jobs gained in the month. they're touting that as kind of a sign of the tariffs working. but i want to point out that the survey period for this february jobs report was essentially before most of these tariffs were put in place. because, again, what we're talking about is a report that was released today, but it covers the essentially a second or third week of february, where it was kind of well before this round of 25% tariffs were put on both canada and mexico. the unemployment rate did tick up to

4.1%. historically. that's not anything too big. and in fact, some of the wall street banks that have opined in on the jobs report this morning have described this as decent. that's the word that jpmorgan chase described it as. and i was just messaging with an economist that said it was kind of a snoozer, that this jobs report didn't really tell us anything that new or that changing about the structure of this economy. but of course, a lot of focus on those numbers ahead of you about federal government employment. did that, in fact, weigh on this report as you have doge claiming that 75,000 federal workers took them up on their buyout. this particular jobs report says that 10,000 federal workers were rather, there were 10,000 fewer federal workers in the workforce as of february. that doesn't really line up with the 75,000 figure that doge says. but of course, as i mentioned, there is a lag because this report is as of the middle of february. nonetheless, this jobs report shows that the economy is still chugging along. pretty all right. but of course, the question is what does it look like in the months to come? we'll see if the president has any other announcements in his appearance right now with regards to the tariffs, which

could certainly weigh on employment going forward, but not too much to be gleaned from the tariff impact to employment, at least as of the numbers that we got this morning. christina. >> yeah, it's important to remember, and i always have to remind myself these reports look a month backwards. so there's always a bit of a lag. we are seeing a few new reports coming out on the wires that trump has said canada has tremendously high tariffs on lumber, and has also said we may do reciprocal tariffs as early as today. now those are coming out from wire reports, the oval office. obviously, we're going to wait for the full remarks to get context on what exactly that means. but, jason, i want to turn to you. you know, this report says 10,000 federal workers were laid off last month, but does that tell the whole story? because you're still waiting. like, i even know people in d.c. who are just waiting to get fired, essentially, you know, they're on ngos or other contractors that they know are not going to get removed. so technically they're still employed, but they're de facto going to be joining these ranks. are we expecting a much bigger number potentially next month? >> yeah, we're certainly expecting. >> a bigger number of federal employees. this basically tells. us where. >> things. >> were through february 12th.

>> not what's after that. but look, when it comes to the macro economy, frankly, i'd look at private sector jobs. i don't think the federal government should be thought of as a jobs program. when you're thinking about federal jobs, ask what they're doing at the irs. they're collecting taxes that are owed. when we have fewer of them, we're going to miss out potentially on billions of dollars of what will be end up being tax cheating when they're dealing with international aids programs. you're talking about children dying. so around the world. so the point of those federal jobs isn't to help the economy. it's to do the important work that they're doing. and that's what most concerns me there. >> yeah, i mean, it's funny, it's not funny, but i've already heard people, you know, it's tax season. people are already making jokes about, well, do we really need to fire. is any going to be is anybody going to be working at the irs by the time they go to see if we've paid our taxes or not? i also want to ask you, the administration is saying, you

know, the uncertainty is kind of a natural adjustment that this will work itself out. is that necessarily true? and how long can the economy endure this level of uncertainty? >> the uncertainty is 100% caused by the administration. they've said they need to detox, make a change. they didn't need to announce 25% tariffs, then take them off for a month, then put them back on, then partly take them off, then further, partly take them off, then say they're putting them back on. none of that has anything to do with joe biden, anything to do with detox. those are all their choices. that's what's fueling the uncertainty. and, you know, we can debate the magnitude, but the sign for the economy is clear. it's a minus sign. >> and we've got some new reports coming out of those remarks president trump is making right now. we're waiting for that tape to play back. but we've got speaking of tariffs, the president trump has now said eu has been a terrible abuser on tariffs. and india has agreed to cut tariffs way down. so

governor, i want to turn to you. now we've seen president trump, you know, flinch a little bit and bow to pressure. pulling back slightly on d.o.j, pulling back slightly, giving this 30 day reprieve on tariffs. but it seems like this is a really big gamble with the economy, which is why voters put him into office in first place. how much do you think voters are going to be willing to take of this so-called short term pain? >> well, whenever prices go up, christina, they people don't like it. and they helped elect him because they felt that prices were too high. and while they may have moderated a little bit, they were still too high. so it's all about, i think, what you what you said earlier as you were ready to host this program, it's all about jobs, jobs, jobs and also about prices, prices, prices. and so look, the problem we have now is there's so much disruption. i mean, there's disruption now talking about the eu. you know, we know about the disruption connected to ukraine. then we look at the disruption

between canada and mexico and these disruptions. what that really does is it freezes capital. people don't know where to invest. and at the same time, if in fact these these tariffs go through, we're going to pay the price. tariffs are taxes plain and simple. now the idea that we have had countries that have, you know, dumped their products, that means they sold them for less than what it cost them to make. that's part of what china did. that's why president obama went and had put tariffs on solar panels. and he put tariffs on tires because unfair trading practices shouldn't be shouldn't be tolerated. but the way to handle that is to sit down and discuss it in person, you know, country to country and try to get things on a level playing field. but the canada and mexico business and it's on, it's off, it's on, it's off. you know, the auto parts that go back and forth between countries. this is a this is not a good decision. and

i think that's why one day it's on and the next day it's not. and then somebody then he gets riled up and says we're going to put it on. and one of his advisers said, we won't. and then they see the market go down. so it's the instability that creates that creates the challenge. and it's too early to assess where we're headed on this, and it's too early to assess where voters are on this, but we're going to find out soon enough where we are and where this settles. >> and, governor, speaking of that uncertainty, you know, you're from ohio. the auto industry is huge in ohio. i've been to auto plants in ohio. talk about one thing we learned during covid is when you disrupt a supply chain, it doesn't get repaired as quickly as it can break down. if these supply chains start to get disrupted. with all this uncertainty, what could the ripple effects be for a state like ohio, for michigan, for these industries? >> unemployment? i mean, if you, in fact are having a disrupted supply chain and the big companies look, the reason why he provided the 30 day relief to

the automakers is because what are they supposed to do? how are they supposed to make the next year's model? and if they are frozen in place, what are they going to do? they just can't have people sit there and not do anything. so then that leads to layoffs. and so i think that's what the automakers told him. i think that is why he had the response he's had. it's a 30 day response. but again, it's uncertainty. and i can tell you in the business world when there is uncertainty, people won't invest, they won't execute and things get frozen. and that's not good for anybody. but again, let's see where this all comes down. because you know, you don't know what tomorrow is going to bring. christina. none of us do. i mean, it's harder to predict trump than it is to predict the weather. >> you know, i wish that weren't true, but i'm going to move on. look, jason, the other thing, speaking of confusion is speaking to canadian officials, speaking to mexican officials. we've been talking about it all week. they were confused to begin with about what exactly

the administration wanted in response not to enact these tariffs. now there's new confusion over what exactly the usmca covers. now, remember, that's the deal the trump administration did in its first term to replace nafta. but it's unclear what products are in, what products are out by the time they figure this out. these sanctions are going back into place in in sanctions i'm sorry. tariffs are going back into place in three weeks. does the temporary tariff relief even matter if it's going into place by the time they probably figure out what counts and what doesn't? >> yeah. no. it's just incredibly complicated right now to think about the amount of time and effort that companies and lawyers are paying. for example, there were things under usmca that faced a 0.1% tariff, and they'd say, you know what? we'll just pay the tariff rather than figure out whether the usmca applies or not. now, whether the usmca applies or not is the difference between 0 and 25. they're all hiring lawyers. they're all trying to figure it out. and every dollar that a

business is spending, figuring out how to comply with these dollars is $1 less. they're spending investing in american workers, in jobs in the future of our economy. you know, just another reason why this uncertainty is just really, really hurting us. >> all right. vaughn hillyard, brian chung, jason furman, and governor john kasich, thank you all so much. and stand by with us as we await president's remarks in 90s thousands of jobs cut at the already strapped veterans administration, the second largest agency in the federal government. how democrats say they plan to push democrats say they plan to push back next. you're watching when emergency strikes, first responders are the first ones in... but on outdated networks, the crucial technology they depend on, is limited. that's why t-mobile created t-priority... ...the only solution built for the 5g era, that can dynamically dedicate up to 10 times the capacity for first responders.

t-priority. built for tomorrow's emergencies. ready today. (♪♪) experience advanced technology in the buick envision. ♪♪ equipped with the largest-in-class ultrawide 30-inch diagonal display and google built-in compatibility, innovation is at your fingertips. buick. exceptional by design. it can deplete their coq10 levels. i recommend taking qanon coq10. schnoll has three times coq"mr. clean magic eraser.”es better “wow - where has this been my entire life?” “having to clean with multiple products is a hassle.” “trying to figure out okay what am i going to use on the shower, what am i going to use on the bathtub? i don't have to think about that.” “you just add water, and then i'm good to go.” "with magic eraser... i use it on everyday messes.” "i even use it on things that i think are impossible to clean." "if you're a mom,

you need mr. clean magic eraser in your life. it gets the job done." and, try mr. clean magic eraser ultra bath, to cut through 100% of built-up soap scum and grime. the second largest government agency very soon. more than 80,000 people are expected to be laid off by the department of veterans affairs in the coming months, and some vets working for the agency have already lost their jobs. alyssa ellman is a disabled army veteran who served in afghanistan and was laid off from her va job in buffalo this week. >> it's so important. >> that we continue employing veterans at the va and that we continue to be able to even deliver those benefits, because if they fire lots of people, those benefits will be delayed. i don't think that firing va employees is the way that you support veterans. >> all right. joining us now is

democratic congresswoman debbie wasserman schultz, appropriations committee member and the former dnc chair. of course, you brought a veteran as your guest to the president's speech this week. are you at all reassured in any way by the president saying elon musk does not get the final say about these layoffs, especially as it relates to the va? >> not remotely. >> christina. >> and thanks for having me on to spotlight this. i think this important fact should sink in for everyone. donald trump, in his first month in office, has fired more veterans than any president in history. i mean, this is while the va is in the midst of ramping up to serve millions of veterans who now are entitled to pact act health care benefits because they were exposed to toxins during their service. thanks to president biden and congressional democrats. and on top of that, just the other day, a senior advisor of his actually defended the firings, saying that there

are some veterans that don't deserve their jobs. now they're doubling down, and they're planning to fire more than 80,000 veterans. as you said. 80,000 va employees, and i don't. how is it possible that they're going to not cut health care benefits and be able to provide those benefits that we promised them, and the kind of service that we that we promised veterans when they return home, they won't be able to. and it is the most disrespectful, egregious, outrageous decision that is going to be devastating for veterans families. and they've also fired veterans across the federal government there at 6000 and counting. we're going to do everything we can to stop them. >> and there has been over the years, you know, bipartisan criticism of the va not responding fast enough, not being able to serve veterans needs. and there's been a bipartisan effort to ramp it up. you can't help but think this is going to impact operability and some of those shortened wait times that they have been able to succeed. but i also want to

ask you, you know, we've got the new jobs numbers out today. and they're showing job growth was weaker than expected last month but fairly stable. do you think the economy can withstand the uncertainty of what's going on, especially when it comes to tariffs? what are your constituents telling you? what are you hearing from consumers who are already starting to pay more for everyday goods? >> well, we're obviously in the middle of a trump inflicted recession, certainly headed towards one. that same jobs report was preceded by the report that we're actually cutting. employers are cutting more jobs than have been created. i mean, so we're going in the wrong direction. on top of president trump campaigning and saying he was going to make life more affordable and cut prices on day one, he has not done that. instead, he's made things more expensive by imposing tariffs and then made it even more the economy even more uncertain and erratic by the on again, off again tariffs, which are obviously because he

can't stand the political fallout, which is obvious from how much the cost of a of an automobile in this country would go up with those tariffs. so he there's a reason that the stock market is plummeting, that prices are going up, that the economy is on very uncertain ground, that people are losing their jobs. he's cutting hundreds of thousands of jobs, hurting our families and affecting the health, well-being and quality of life for people across america. and that's what this is really all about and what we're fighting to protect. >> well, and talking about, you know, government programs that people have come to depend depend on. you've got a big fight ahead with the republican budget and the debt ceiling. and the cbo came out this week and said that republicans would have to cut medicare and medicaid to get to that trillion dollars in cuts number. social security could also potentially be a target down the road for either trump or elon musk or whoever is actually making these cuts. so

my question to you is, what are what can democrats do to stop these potential cuts? >> there's no question. and now cbo, the congressional budget office, the independent office, has confirmed that the amount of targeted cuts that the republican budget that they passed with one vote by one vote is clear that they have to deeply cut medicaid. they're going to have to cut medicare. they're definitely going to be cutting social security because they're planning to fire half of the social social security employees. how are social security beneficiaries going to get served if that happens? what democrats are doing are aligning with our nonprofit organizations as lawsuits are being filed. we're going to use all the tools in our tool belt legislatively to try to, you know, stop them. when these bills come to the floor, they're going to have to put some of these some of these bills on the floor when they go through the implementation of the budget through reconciliation. so with our votes, with our voices, with our ability to align ourselves with the with the court, court

lawsuits, and then obviously making sure that we can marshal our constituents and to push back and republicans constituents to push back because they are gravely harming our veterans, our seniors, our students, our our educators, our patients who desperately need health care. they're devastating the economy. and, you know, all all in the service of one goal. they're trying to make sure that they can make enough room so they can give massive tax breaks to the wealthy, millionaires, billionaires and corporations. and that's the last thing that people signed up for when they voted for this president. >> all right. congresswoman debbie wasserman schultz, thank you for joining us. >> thanks for having me, christina. >> and one week after that stunning oval office clash, where does the u.s. ukraine relationship stand? the president is making remarks on that topic right now. we'll have them when you come back. you're watching nbc.

>> and doug. >> you'll be back. >> emus can't help people customize and. >> save hundreds on car insurance with liberty mutual. >> you're just a flightless bird. >> no, he's a dreamer, frank. elena kagan. >> doug. >> well. i'll be. that bird really did it. >> only pay for what you need. >>have you always had trouble. >> libewith your weight? me too. discover the power of wegovy®. with wegovy®, i lost 35 pounds. and some lost over 46 pounds. and i'm keeping the weight off. i'm reducing my risk. wegovy® is the only weight-management medicine proven to reduce risk of major cardiovascular events such as death, heart attack, or stroke in adults with known heart disease and obesity. don't use wegovy® with semaglutide or glp-1 medicines or in children under 12. don't take if you or your family had mtc, men 2,

or if allergic to it. tell your provider if you plan to have surgery or a procedure, are breastfeeding, pregnant, or plan to be. stop taking and get medical help right away if you get a lump or swelling in your neck, severe stomach pain, or any of these allergic reactions. serious side effects may include pancreas inflammation and gallbladder or severe stomach problems. call your prescriber if you have any of these symptoms. wegovy® may cause low blood sugar in people with diabetes, especially if you take medicines to treat diabetes. call your prescriber about vision changes, if you feel your heart racing while at rest, or if you have mental changes. depression or thoughts of suicide may occur. common side effects include: nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, constipation, stomach pain, flu, or upset, headache, feeling tired, dizzy, or bloated, gas, and heartburn. some side effects lead to dehydration, which may cause kidney problems. with wegovy®,... —i'm losing weight,— —i'm keeping it off,— —and i'm lowering my cv risk. ask your prescriber about wegovy®. so right when i thought mom'd start takin' it easy with her osteoporosis, boom-

we moved to this cool new place in the city! if you have postmenopausal osteoporosis and are at high risk for fracture, evenity® can help you rapidly build new bone in just 12 months. evenity® is the only bone builder that also helps slow bone loss. and it's proven to significantly reduce spine fracture risk. i knew she started taking evenity®, but she told her friend it builds new bone. builds new bone! [squeak!] so...yeah...we get out, we explore, and do whatever that thing is on the floor. evenity® can increase risk of heart attack, stroke, or death from a heart problem. tell your doctor if you have had a heart attack or stroke. do not take evenity® if you have low blood calcium or are allergic to it, as serious events have occurred with evenity®. signs include rash, hives, swelling of the face or throat, which may cause difficulty in swallowing or breathing, muscle spasms or cramps, numbness, or tingling. tell your doctor about severe jaw bone problems, as they have been reported with evenity®. report hip, groin, or thigh pain. unusual thigh bone fractures have occurred with evenity®. ask your doctor about building new bone

yeah, it is weird that we still call these things phones. with evenity®. [s well, yeah. they're more like mini computers. precisely, next slide. xfinity mobile customers are connected to wifi 90% of the time. that's why our network has powerboost with wifi speeds up to a gig where you need it most. so, this whole meeting could have been remote? oh, that is my ex-husband who i don't speak to. hey! no, i'm good to talk! xfinity internet customers, cut your mobile bill in half for your first year with xfinity mobile. plus, ask how to get the new samsung galaxy s25+ on us. questions.

>> over the future of. >> tiktok in the u.s. >> reporting from philadelphia. >> el paso. >> and the palisades, virginia. >> from msnbc world headquarters here in new york. >> msnbc presents a new podcast hosted by jen psaki. each week, she talks to some of the biggest names in democratic politics, with the biggest ideas for how democrats can win again. the blueprint with jen psaki. listen now. >> speaking in the oval office just moments ago, president trump said he's finding it more difficult to deal with ukraine. but next week, trump administration officials will travel to saudi arabia to speak with ukrainian president volodymyr zelensky. secretary of state marco rubio, national security adviser michael wallace and u.s. envoy to the middle east steve witkoff are expected to attend. meanwhile, in ukraine, hundreds of russian missiles and drones aimed at the power grid there injured at least ten people, including a

child. joining us now are washington post opinion columnist david ignatius and michael allen, former special assistant to president george w bush and now the managing director of beacon global. david, i want to start with you. you write president donald trump's sledgehammer approach to diplomacy has brought ukraine close to the bargaining table. now it's time for trump to begin taking some swings at russia, or lose any credibility as a peacemaker. now, just earlier this morning, president trump said he's weighing more sanctions and tariffs unless russia comes to the negotiating table to end the war, saying, quote, to russia and ukraine, get to the table now before it's too late. so, you know, if i were sitting in the white house right now, i would make the argument to you that you may not like it, but president trump's tactic here might be successful. what's your take? >> so i do think these. >> negotiations are moving. >> into a. >> better phase. >> he spent weeks. >> bashing ukraine. he used that metaphor of sledge hammer. >> pretty tough tactics.

>> but he got what he wanted. he got ukrainian concessions and a commitment to come to the bargaining table under terms that trump wanted. and now, appropriately, he's turning to russia. the truth is, ukraine needs a cease fire more than russia does. russia thinks it's on the front foot, so it's going to take a lot of pressure from the trump administration to get russia into a real negotiating posture. and it's going to take threats of the same kind of pressure. i same, you know, swings of the sledgehammer to, to, to get russia in the mood to actually negotiate. so this is we're now entering what's going to be a much more interesting phase. the meeting on tuesday between us officials and ukrainian officials in saudi arabia, i'm told, is to come up basically with the ukrainian term sheet. that's the phrase that keith kellogg, the special envoy for ukraine, used yesterday, in which ukraine spells out exactly what its

positions are going in to the negotiations. they'll also sign, i think, a deal giving us a substantial share of ukraine's mineral rights. so all the pieces of the negotiation are now moving forward. the big question mark is in moscow. what are the russians going to do? how will they react to pressure from donald trump if he actually begins to bring it? >> well, michael, that's my question for you. i mean, what is this pressure really going to look like? because even today we have president trump just moments ago saying that he could potentially put sanctions on moscow if they don't get to the table. but at the same time, we've also got notes saying, you know, a reporter shouted a question, putin is bombing ukraine. do you still believe him when he says he wants peace? and trump saying he believes him? so where do you go from there? and is it possible that that this president can get vladimir putin to negotiate? >> well. >> first of all, i'm. >> glad that we might be through. >> the controversy. >> with zelensky that. >> went in.

>> to last week. >> because i agree with david. >> putin is going to be the true obstacle. >> to peace. >> in fact. >> he's. already contradicted president trump. when he said that russia would be comfortable with european troops being on the ground. inside of ukraine. he's rejected a european french idea, which was to have a one month trial cease fire in the air and the sea and against energy assets. so now that zelenskyy is out of the way, i hope putin's obstinance becomes center stage. i do think, however, it's going to be tough to get russia to the table on economic pressure alone. i think president trump should maybe revise what his thinking on military assistance and intelligence assistance to ukraine, because ultimately military pressure is needed to get putin to come to the table in a real way. >> and, david, i want to ask you

more about this meeting coming up between marco rubio, steve witkoff, mike wallace and president zelensky. do we expect cooler temperatures, less yelling, and dare i say, you know, some diplomacy to happen? these are these are more, you know, stable members of the administration who tend to be more policy oriented. do you think it could potentially be more productive than what we saw last week? >> i think it will be a more productive meeting. that's what administration officials are saying. it will be productive, in part because ukraine has has basically capitulated on the demands that trump was making. they're prepared to sign over 50% of the proceeds of sale of their critical minerals. that's a big concession. they're also prepared to meet the broad outlines of how trump wants to negotiate this. so yeah, it'll be an easier meeting because the ukrainians are being more, more compliant as, as as mike said, the tough issue is russia. putin

needs to feel that he cannot gain on the battlefield more of his objectives, because ukraine still has the military clout to push him back. and that depends on u.s. support. i mean, trump's really going to have to look again at this cutoff in intelligence support, which which is potentially ruinous for ukraine. >> i want to say we're getting close to being able to see that those remarks in the oval office in just a second. but quickly, michael and i might have to cut you off, but i do want to ask what you make of saudi arabia being the location for this meeting. you know, i know other nations, turkey, i think uae had also kind of offered up their space. how did it end up with saudi and what does that mean? >> well, i think it's definitely a place where we have and feel comfortable with our allies there. i think it's sort of reciprocal. we met there previously, and i just think they're generally comfortable with the saudis as hosts. they're probably more doubtful

about turkey, who plays both sides of the fence on here. i wouldn't read too much into the location, but i know they want to go over there, and i'm sure they want to have separate conversations at the same time about gaza, maybe about how many barrels that saudi arabia can put onto the market and maybe undercut russia eventually. i think that's probably the best read of it. >> all right. we're still waiting for that tape. so, david, i'm going to turn back to you. i want to ask you about the u.s. has not only stopped sharing intelligence with ukraine, but, you know, the ap reported today, it has also halted ukrainian access to a program that shares unclassified satellite images. and it's told allies, including the uk. and i confirm this with some uk officials yesterday that they can't share american intelligence with ukrainians either. first of all, can they even do that? i spoke to a former cia director yesterday who said, you know, the u.s.

really can't tell other sovereign intelligence agencies what they can or cannot do with information they have. but what is an ask like that do to this network of intelligence agencies that until now have worked very closely and worked very closely with the ukrainians. >> so i think the us is in danger of really beginning to anger its key intelligence partners by trying to muscle them. the uk has been very forward leaning on on ukraine, more so even than the united states, especially in its intelligence activities. the ukrainians are able to keep going, in part because they have commercial technology that can make up for, you know, exquisite us intelligence systems. you can dial in satellite commercial satellite coverage that gives you optical imagery, radio frequency, signal data, all the other things that intelligence agencies provide. ukraine can,

by using american technology, in part, if the us moves not just to shut off government intelligence support, but ukraine's ability to fill the gap with these commercial sources, ukraine is in really impossible trouble. and i have a feeling that our allies are going to push back on that. >> yeah. and michael, speaking of european allies, the danish prime minister said it's important to rearm europe and, quote, spend, spend, spend on defense for europe and do it quickly. that seems to me. i don't know about you. a pretty significant change in defense posture from a country you don't really associate with being out front on this issue, if it had to right now, could europe defend itself against russia without the us? and is this a reality europe needs to come to grips with? >> well, it's been a rough few weeks with our european allies for sure, but i suspect the white house is privately glad of just that type of comment from denmark. they're certainly glad

that the new chancellor in germany designate is working away a side hustle, if you will, to increase german defense spending. and of course, starmer from the uk announced greater spending before he visited last week. i think they think that's good, but at the end of the day, i really do believe that we would need to have some sort of us military involvement to back up a peacekeeping force that was made of european troops. i don't think trump was going to agree to it last week in the oval office. by the way. to me, it's almost something for final status negotiations, if you will. if it's the last thing standing between a meaningful, supposedly durable peace with the russians, maybe the united states gets in under president trump and does what people are calling a backstop. sometimes that's called military enablers, which could mean anything from intelligence support to air cover, command and control. if it's a limited us role, maybe at

the end of the day, trump can go for it, but i don't think it's in the cards yet. but i still think europe needs us. >> all right. we'll have to see. david ignatius and michael allen, thank you both for joining us. we'll be right back. joining us. we'll be right back. you're watching msnbc. home. it's where we do the things we love with the people we love. celebrating, sharing—living. so why should aging mean we have to leave that in the past? what if we lived tomorrow in the same place as we did yesterday? what if we stayed home instead? with help, we can. home instead. for a better what's next. if you take or have taken humira for moderate to severe crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis and still have symptoms... you don't have to settle. ask your gastroenterologist if switching to rinvoq is right for you. it's one of the latest treatments from the makers of humira.

rinvoq works differently than humira and may help. rinvoq is a once-daily pill that can deliver rapid symptom relief, lasting steroid-free remission, and helps visibly reduce damage of the intestinal lining. rinvoq can lower ability to fight infections. before treatment, test for tb and do bloodwork. serious infections, blood clots, some fatal; ...cancers, including lymphoma and skin; serious allergic reactions; gi tears; death; heart attack; and stroke occurred. cv event risk increases in age 50 plus with a heart disease risk factor. tell your doctor if you've had these events, infection, hep b or c, smoked, are pregnant or planning. don't take if allergic or have an infection. rapid symptom relief and lasting steroid-free remission are possible with rinvoq. ask your gastroenterologist to switching to rinvoq is right for you. you could pay as little as $0 per month. great. >> things about consumer cellular. they're 100% us based. customer service is also 100% human. you don't have to owe. human. you don't have to owe. >>

known for building special bonds. no one wants to be known for cancer, but a treatment can be. keytruda is known to treat cancer. fda-approved for 18 types of cancer, including certain early-stage and advanced cancers. one of those cancers is a kind of uterine cancer called advanced endometrial carcinoma. keytruda may be used with certain chemotherapies, and then used alone, in adults when your cancer has spread or returned. ♪♪ keytruda can cause your immune system to attack healthy parts of your body during or after treatment. this may be severe and lead to death. see your doctor right away if you have cough, shortness of breath, chest pain, diarrhea, severe stomach pain, nausea, or vomiting, headache, light sensitivity, eye problems, irregular heartbeat, extreme tiredness, constipation, dizziness or fainting, changes in appetite, thirst, or urine, confusion, memory problems, persistent or severe muscle pain or weakness, muscle cramps, fever, rash, itching, or flushing. there may be other side effects. tell your doctor about all medical conditions, including immune or nervous system problems,

such as crohn's, ulcerative colitis, lupus, or myasthenia gravis or guillain-barré syndrome, an organ, tissue, or stem cell transplant, or received chest radiation. keytruda can harm your unborn baby. ♪♪ keytruda is an immunotherapy and is also being studied in hundreds of clinical trials exploring ways to treat even more types of cancer. it's tru. keytruda. see all the types of cancer keytruda is known for at keytruda.com, and ask your doctor if keytruda could be right for you. tap into etsy for home and style finds like custom shelving for less than 50 dollars to make more space. or linen robes under 75 to get you cozy. for affordable pieces to help you welcome big changes, etsy has it. excited? >> yeah. >> doc, but i'm about to lose my. >> dental insurance. >> you can get your own from physicians mutual. i think my

work here is done. >> wait. >> what? >> get the premier dental. >> plan from. >> physicians mutual insurance company. it helps. >> cover everything. >> from cleanings and fillings to crowns. >> and dentures. no deductibles. >> no annual maximum. >> for all. >> the details. >> visit dental now.com. >> physicians mutual, physicians mutual. >> water line broke. replacing could cost thousands not covered by homeowner's insurance. honey. >> wake up. here's tom russin, ceo of homeserve. >> a plan from homeserve pays for the covered repair cost for water lines, and we send a qualified contractor. the american dream of owning a home doesn't need to be a nightmare. sleep well with homeserve. >> plans from homeserve start at just 4.99 a month. call 1-800-355-9395. >> or visit homeserve. com. >> welcome back. we're waiting any second now to see playback of president trump's remarks in the oval office. and joining us now we're going to go to nbc's

vaughn hillyard. vaughn i know we've been seeing top lines and wires coming out of this extended q&a at the end of this, this remarks here. what are we learning so far? what are the big takeaways that you're seeing? >> right. the two big focus points here is president trump's defense of his economic decisions at this point on tariffs. and i actually believe we have that tape in my ear. so i'm going to throw it back. >> to you. >> many to many. this is for 40 years. you know, this isn't just now this built up and got worse and worse. and they just hire more and more people. you look at department of education. it seems like so many buildings i ride by, it says department of education. they're all over the place and we don't even want it. we want the education to be given by the states. it'll be much better. it'll be. it'll move us to the top of the list from the bottom of the list and actually save us money, but not it's too important to even talk about them. it'll save us a lot of money. but we don't want that. we want education to be given. so you go to iowa and indiana and idaho and all these

places. they're so well run, and they're going to be producing education. that will be the equivalent of like denmark is one and norway, sweden, actually, china is one of the better in terms of education. and so we can't blame size anymore. you know china has 1.4 billion people, but they're very high on their list. the one thing we're doing well on, we're number one on the list is cost per pupil. we spend more money than any other country in the world by far. so i jokingly say, the one thing we do well on is the cost. we spend more money, and yet we're toward the bottom of the list. yeah. >> mr. president, i want to ask you the joint address. millions of americans watch your joint address. earlier this week, were you warned that there could be a little disturbance that americans could feel as a function of these taxes, these tariffs? how much disturbance are you willing to accept in the near term as a function of that and to set expectations, how long should americans expect things to cost a bit more? >> well, so far, peter, there

hasn't been very much because these numbers are coming out where we're here for just a little over four weeks. and these are fantastic numbers. i was watching some of the reports this morning. they were surprised there could be some disturbance, a little bit of a disturbance. i solved a little bit of that because i have respect for our auto companies, and i gave them a little bit of a one month reprieve because it was it was unfair. although i'm sure they'll take advantage of it. i see they're driving a lot of cars into the us to try and avoid the tariffs and, you know, taking advantage of it a little bit, but they were they called me, they asked me, they said could they have a little bit of help. and i decided, you know, they're american companies. usmca. and i let them have that. but this really kicks in the reciprocal, as you know, kicks in on let's see, i guess the second and i wanted it to be the first so badly it just didn't want to be on april fool's day.

so i made it the second that's going to cost a lot of money. that one day is going to cost a lot of money, but that's okay. but i don't see it. i don't see anything. i see good reports. i think i think we're going to have good numbers from the beginning. now, globalists won't love this because this brings jobs back to america. so if they're coming back to america, maybe you'll lose some in other parts of the world. but the other parts of the world have done very well, and they'll continue to do very well. but i think the united states is going to be doing record business. we'll bring a lot of those 90,000 factories that have been lost over the last number of years. it's been it's hard to believe 90,000. think of what 90,000 is. 90,000 plants and factories are gone. we're going to bring back many of those plants and factories. >> one day. the tariffs are on, the next day they're off. right now. the markets, as you know well prefer stability. are you done going forward with the pauses and the carve outs. is that it for those. >> there'll always be changes and adjustments. and you know you can't just i could have for instance told the american car

companies, no i'm not going to give you anything. and then you wouldn't have had to say, well, they're getting a little extra. it's just a little bit of a one month reprieve. they're very happy about what's happening. they won't have to go across borders. and you see the zig zag and you have a fender made in canada. you have something else made in mexico. we don't want that. we want it made here. but there'll always be some modifications. i mean, if you have a wall in front of you, sometimes you have to go around the wall instead of through it. but i think very little. i think very little on occasion. if we can do something, we want to help companies. we want to help companies create jobs. so i could have left that, and you wouldn't have had a minor change. instead, i was asked by the major, the real majors, the big majors, if they could do this. and i said, yeah, i'll do it. i want you to produce a lot of jobs and numerous of the people. actually, all of the people i spoke to have already been. they're very much on the way to already doing. that's why you have auto jobs increase. and

the man i don't know him, sean fain, i don't know him, but and i did great as you know, with the auto workers, with the teamsters, with unions. i did fantastically well. best numbers ever by a republican. but and i have a lot of respect for those people. but sean fain, who i don't know but wasn't a supporter, although the auto workers were big supporters. i watched him last night and he said, donald trump is absolutely right on tariffs. he said what he's doing on tariffs is an incredible thing, and it's about time somebody had the guts to do it because we're going to save auto manufacturing. and i said to people when i was campaigning, you're going to have so many auto jobs, you're not going to believe what's going to happen. we're going to load up michigan. i won the state of michigan, as you know. and part of the reason i won it was i got a lot of auto workers that voted for me, detroit, etcetera. but i think people are going to be very surprised. yes. >> thank you, mr. president. you

mentioned in your remarks chips manufacturing. >> how a. >> significant percentage is. >> now in taiwan. you also mentioned it in your address to congress, and. >> you. called on congress to overturn the. >> chips act, which had. >> bipartisan support in the last congress. >> why would you like to see this particular law overturned? >> because it's hundreds of billions of dollars, and it's just a waste of money. now, some people have already taken the money and used it. actually, it's very hard to qualify because they go by race, they go by gender, they go by all sorts of things. nobody's ever seen anything like it. you won't be able to find those people. so i don't even think anybody can qualify. they have so many different categories. in order to qualify, you have to have so many of a certain race, a certain gender, a certain this, a certain and it's i don't think they can qualify, but if they take the money, they better qualify because they'll be watching them. but it's a tremendous waste of money. i didn't give the great the greatest chip company in the world, one of the greatest companies. i didn't give them $0.10. they came here because of

tariffs, because they didn't want to pay the tariffs. and they also came here because they like the results of the election, because they know that i'm very pro-business and pro-jobs. i mean, i'm pro-business, not for business. i'm pro-business because of jobs, because business is producing the jobs. okay. >> if i may, president. >> putin is bombing ukraine. >> do you still believe him when he tells you that he wants peace? >> yeah. no, i believe him, i believe him. i think we're doing very well with russia, but right now they're bombing the hell out of ukraine and ukraine. i'm. i'm finding it more difficult, frankly, to deal with ukraine. and they don't have the cards. they don't have the cards. as you know, we're meeting in saudi arabia on sometime next week early. and we're talking would i find that in terms of getting a final settlement, it may be easier dealing with russia, which is surprising because they have all the cards. i mean, and

they're bombing the hell out of them right now. and i put a statement in it, a very strong statement. can't do that. you can't do that, mr. president, trying to we're trying to help them. and ukraine has to get on the ball and get a job done. michael, could you come up here? i see michael back there. good. i'm glad he's traveling all over the world. i just saw him come in the door. could you give a little definition? >> all right. you've been listening to president trump answering some reporter's questions there in the oval office. with us now is nbc's vaughn hillyard and jason furman, former chairman of the council of economic advisers under president obama. all right. i think i want to start with you. we're going to come back to the economic stuff, which is at the top. but at the end there, we're hearing a bit of mixed messaging about the president's stance on ukraine versus russia, because he was asked by a reporter, you know, russia is bombing ukraine. can putin be trusted that he still wants peace? and, you know, the president said, yes, i trust them. and then said, but, you know, it's very bad what they're doing in ukraine. but then said

he's finding it difficult, more and more difficult to deal with ukraine. what we've heard before, they don't have the cards. talk to us about where the white house is on this, especially going into this meeting with with zelensky and national security officials in saudi arabia next week. >> right. the president, united states in the oval office just now showing sympathies to vladimir putin and russia and the ability to better negotiate with them than ukraine. despite overnight 70 missiles being launched by russia, targeting across four different ukrainian regions, parts of its energy grid facilities, leaving president zelensky to work with the french to launch f-16s in response. this is a moment here in which ukraine, one week after leaving the oval office, in that contentious meeting that led to the cutoff of not only direct communications but also the us cutting off military aid and intelligence support to ukraine at a moment in time in which he is audibly hear from the oval office suggesting that russia has been the easier of the two sides to negotiate with the one

other part on the economic front. i'll leave this to you and jason. more so, but having covered the first trade war, you heard from president trump mention dairy products and the frustration with canada. this was at the heart of the usmca trade agreement and negotiations back in 2018. and at that time, canada did provide larger concessions into access into the dairy market from 3.2% of their domestic market to 3.6% of the market, in which the us was able to access. and at the time, there were frustrations among canadian dairy farmers. but what you're hearing from president trump is essentially a relitigating of that very issue, as we hear him now also talking about automobiles. of course, that was also at the heart of the usmca agreement and ensuring that between mexico, canada and the us, that 75% of values of automobiles would be produced here in north america. and so, in so many ways, fast forward seven years later, we are here. and president trump from the oval office is relitigating the

heart of the issues that were at the forefront of the negotiations to redo nafta and strike what ended up being a usmca agreement that his own administration signed on to. >> that's exactly right. vaughn and jason. one of the things that stood out to me is the president said, you know, we're giving them a one month reprieve, but they're trying to cheat. they're trying to get cars across the border as quickly as possible. but aren't those american cars? aren't those cars going to detroit? aren't those american automakers? >> yeah, absolutely. and when people say american cars, american cars are always a little bit canadian, a little bit mexican, and a little bit american from the united states. and that's, by the way, why we're good at making cars. and that's why we still have a car industry. is that north american integration? that's the way they do it in asia, too. it's not like the cars are made entirely in korea or entirely in japan. there are parts that come from all over asia. same thing in europe. all of these are integrated markets. if we want to compete successfully globally, have good jobs, make

cars, we need that integration. and i thought the president was particularly out of touch when he said the automakers were really happy with all of this, and they thought all of this was really good. of course, they're not happy with it. i mean, they might be less unhappy than they were two days ago, but this is not good for the future of making cars in america. >> he was also asked by a reporter about instability and the fact that markets like stability and, you know, is this is this going to calm down? and he said president trump said there will always be changes. he said, look, you know, we're giving them this 30 day reprieve because that's what they wanted. sometimes when there's a wall. he said, you got to go around it. jason. do the markets enjoy going around walls? would they prefer there wasn't one? and there was a road that had been built that people had agreed upon far in advance. like how if you're an auto manufacturer right now, how are you coping with this? how are you even keeping up with what what the policy is? >> yeah. i mean, the main thing you want in economic policy is

predictability. you want to make it clear, here's the roadmap, here's what i'm doing. here's where i'm going. sometimes that's hard when you have fiscal negotiations with congress. maybe it's the republicans fault. maybe it's the democrats fault. you know, there's midnight deadlines. et cetera. that uncertainty, i think, is bad, but i sort of sort of understand how it happens. this is entirely self-imposed. it's entirely his choice. he could make all of this completely predictable by doing whatever tariffs he wants, getting them done and keeping him in place rather than going on off on, off, on off. i don't know, i don't think there's anyone that could think this was a good idea. >> and vaughn, very quickly, you know, talking about the tariffs, talking about the impact on the economy, i didn't hear a lot about what the us actually wants in return from these tariffs. and i know that's been a point of contention with canada and mexico. are we hearing any more about what these countries can do to get the tariffs to go away? >> not that that caught my ear.

and i think that there has been a lack of specifics offered up by his treasury secretary and commerce secretary. again, actually, the usmca first reauthorization period was set to go into effect a year from this summer, summer of 2026, when many of these specifics on specific goods would be renegotiated and discussed between the three countries. and that is why that is taken aback. mexico and canada. the swiftness in implementing these tariffs a year out from those usmca renegotiations, of course, when prime minister justin trudeau is at the forefront of making some concessions to the united states as part of that usmca agreement seven years ago, and now swiftly within the first month and a half of this administration, going to the lengths to suggest that these key partners have taken advantage of the united states over the last years. >> all right. thank you both. that does it for us this hour. chris jansing report starts right now.