download the app. >> go beyond the headlines with the msnbc app. read, listen and watch live breaking news and analysis anytime, anywhere. go analysis anytime, anywhere. go beyond the what? michael buble - feeling good ♪its a new dawn♪ ♪its a new day♪ ♪its a new life for me..♪ ♪and im feeling good.♪ welcome to the four parks of universal orlando resort. >> good to be with you. i'm katy tur. what happens if donald trump loses the proxy battle he's waging in wisconsin over a state supreme court seat? well, elon musk take the blame. after all, he's basically been the face of the race. musk that is holding a rally to give out million dollar checks while pouring tens of millions more

into super pacs spending. will a loss mean he's suddenly seen less around the white house? well, republicans in congress start to worry about him a little less. if so, will they start to break from trump orthodoxy? we're already seeing signs of that happening over tariffs and signal gate doesn't start happening more. and then what about florida? how close do democrats need to get in two special elections for open house seats? the fact that we're even talking about it is news in and of itself. these districts are deep red, given up by nsa mike waltz and failed ag nominee matt gaetz. on the other hand, though, what happens if they're not close at all? or if the republican aligned state supreme court judge wins in wisconsin? where will that leave democrats? they've already been struggling to find their voice. you know that. how does a loss affect the future of the party, which direction it goes in? there's just so much to chew on here,

which is incredible considering that we are only 71 days into this new administration. joining us now, staff writer for the atlantic and msnbc political analyst ashley parker, national affairs correspondent for the nation, john nichols, and some of our politics reporter, dave weigel. dave, you are the guy to ask this right now. there is so much at stake here for both parties. let's talk about elon musk first in wisconsin. i mean, he has poured so much energy and so much money into this race. if they lose it, will there be consequences? >> yes. although which consequences? you can threaten against somebody with elon's wealth and his power. and this is the umpteenth time we've heard about people inside the republican party being tired of elon, but they're not in a position to do much about it. but you set it up. well, this this race in wisconsin was going to fit into a pattern where democrats have a very good turnout operation in off years. their their base is very energized. it's been voting out

voting republicans in special elections. they just picked up two state senate seats this year in iowa and pennsylvania. what elon did was come in and become a force multiplier and spend more than 20 million by the end of this race, probably closer to 25. on advertising and outreach to republican voters. he was supplementing what turning point was doing, what americans prosperity was doing. he was giving them the resources to match democrats who they were used to, outspending republicans in the state. what democrats did, starting a month ago is, say, this election is now a referendum on elon musk. if you are sick of doge, you can register your opposition to doge by voting for susan crawford. the democratic party backed candidate, and their polling suggests that musk is less popular than trump in wisconsin. there are voters who like trump and what might turn out for him but don't like musk, and that there are people hearing about firings, layoffs in the va, in ag and all sorts of offices that employ wisconsinites. so both

parties are actually quite happy with musk's involvement here. for now, republicans are very happy that he spent the money. democrats are very happy they could frame this election as. do you really want elon musk to buy the court? >> let me play a little bit of a few interviews from voters about elon musk's involvement in wisconsin. >> i don't think elon changed my vote. i was always going to vote the way that i voted today. but again, it adds an additional layer of stakes, and i hope that people see what's happening and see that they're actively trying to buy our government. and i hope that that motivates other people. >> i wasn't a fan of what elon was doing with the money, but ultimately i still support where brad is coming from in terms of pro-life issues. so. so ultimately, that's what i was thinking about when i cast my vote here today. >> it's like they were trying to buy it and it it was upsetting. so i wanted to make sure that i had a little, my little bit of say. >> so you normally wouldn't come out. but elon musk got you out here. >> pretty much. >> yeah, really.

>> it ruffled some feathers. >> i love that from wisconsinites. it ruffled some feathers. john nichols how how emblematic is that sentiment across the state? >> that woman sounded like every one of my cousins. you know, i mean, and that's exactly how a wisconsinite would say it. you wouldn't probably, you know, get real angry or make a lot of noise, but you would say, yeah, kind of ruffle my feathers. it rubbed me the wrong way. it didn't feel right. and my sense is, and we'll know much more tonight, is that for a lot of wisconsinites, that was how it played tonight. i would watch obviously the results from madison and dane county, which is very progressive area. i'd watch the results from suburban milwaukee, which has traditionally been an area that produced a lot of republican votes. but i would watch in particular western wisconsin, which if i can suggest is where a lot of the more traditional wisconsin voters live. i mean, people who, you know, maybe

swing between the parties and might be relatively moderate on a lot of issues, but don't really like big money, aren't particularly satisfied or excited about somebody from out of state coming in and telling them how to vote. and it is in western wisconsin where a lot of our elections are decided. and my sense is that elon musk doesn't know wisconsin very well, and perhaps he doesn't know just how much he rubbed a lot of wisconsinites the wrong way. and that could be have a profound impact. again, we don't know because we don't know what 2025 million will do. but my gut instinct is that there is a very high turnout today, and that at least some portion of those folks are coming to send elon musk a message. >> we're going to get to the other side of this in a moment, but i do want to just drill in on the first question i had, and i'll give this one to you, ashley, which is, you know, dave did such a good job of laying

out how both sides are. seeing elon musk as an elon musk as a positive here. but if elon musk and all the money he spent does not win out in wisconsin, does the white house start to see him differently? i know he's got all the money in the world, but do they start to look at him at somebody who only has limited power? >> well, what's interesting is. >> there were a ton of tensions, not with president trump and elon. >> musk. >> but with people in president trump's. pretty senior orbit and elon musk. and i was talking to. >> someone today. >> actually, for a different story, but about this very question about elon musk. and this person told me, look, people in the president's inner orbit have sort of accepted it. >> is. >> what it is that they may not like elon, or they may find him frustrating. and actually, one of the things i heard most frequently is that a lot of people in trump's circle, at least they agree in broad strokes with what elon is trying to do, what has caused them

headaches and what has frustrated them, or what has ruffled some feathers. to put it more politely in wisconsin, is the idea, you know, that a he's doing it with a hatchet rather than a scalpel, and b that he he's become in certain ways, it becomes a political problem for them, right? when he goes on and he messages it poorly. and, you know, if what he really wants to do, for instance, is an example that was told to me is cut waste and fraud from social security, that's perhaps fine. it's not fine to go on joe rogan's podcast and describe social security as a ponzi scheme that makes every senior citizen and every person in america currently collecting or about to collect it, terrified that this benefit is going to get ripped away. so that's where he has created a headache for them. but, you know, will this race be determinative? the view in trump's inner circle is that only trump can decide when elon musk is cast out. >> yeah. you know, and i'm of the opinion that as long as he

sees elon musk as not just useful, but apparently threatening, given all the money and the power that he has, he might keep him close. and my question is if it if it appears that his electoral power, despite his money, is not as as strong as it has appeared up until now, do they start to see him as more of a liability and less as an asset? look at this. marquette law school polling on elon musk and doge. i can put it all up there. is doge properly carrying out trump's agenda? 47% say yes. disrupting programs, 53% say yes. so underwater on that favorable unfavorable opinion on elon musk, most people have an unfavorable opinion of elon musk, 53%. and here's an nbc news poll. views of elon musk broadly 51% negative, 39% positive. i believe that's a national poll of elon musk's popularity. i want to ask the other side of

this. and that's or the other side, the other side of races, i should say the florida races. dave, these are really red districts. how close do democrats need to get to make it appear that republicans might be in trouble? >> they need to overperform their loss in november, probably by six to 6 to 10 points to get people talking. the expectations game in the sixth district, which is daytona beach, which was mike waltz's seat before that, ron desantis seat that probably got out of hand, out of hand for them. i talked to the democrat in that race, and he actually agrees with desantis on his overall analysis of what happened. republicans ran a candidate who doesn't live in the district, did not do much campaigning, did not raise much money. and josh wild, the democrat, rushed into that gap, raised a ton of money, $14 million and did a ton of canvasing, did very well with early voting. today, we already can see who is voting in florida. republicans have turned back out, and it now looks like not as republican as it was in november, but a safe republican seat. if democrats don't win

that, don't lose that by, i should say, 15 points or less. it'll, it'll it'll look like they got ahead of expectations because dnc chair was in the race. the party did get more interested in that in the last few minutes. is all these races every special election. there's not many left this year. it's going to be a fraction of the turnout in 2024. both parties are saying, what is it that gets most of the harris voters, or most of the trump voters to turn out? because it's very tricky. republicans think the message is vote to support donald trump. they have an ad in wisconsin that that literally shows leah thomas winning a swim competition and riots and says, if brad schimel doesn't win, it'll be like donald trump never won. they tried to do the same thing in florida. democrats think for now, the just usual anger that the party out of power has is intensified, given every everything that trump is doing and their base is going to be easier to turn out, they have a more educated base, college educated base. they they have been running ahead of the baseline every election. so

yeah, probably if they if they don't run ahead of their harris margin by ten points, they, they might say maybe the house map is a little less favorable to us than we thought. >> yeah. they've got to overperform as you said. let me, let me play a little bit of sound from florida voters. marissa parra, our nbc news correspondent, gathered this this is an independent voter. his name is wornell vickers. and he's going to give you his sense of whether he thinks the administration is moving in the right direction. take a listen. >> i think it has more to do with the administration and a lot of things that they're trying to push through, not necessarily the endorsement, but where and how things are moving. and so i don't think that's right. i don't think that we should be having kids who wake up, go to a public school hungry every day just based upon what you might have as far as the misinterpretation of what die

might mean. >> all right. so, john, given all of the policies that we've seen in the past 71 days, and we laid it out yesterday, pretty clearly, you've got immigration stuff. you've got die stuff, as he said, you've got the mass firings. elon musk literally, you know, holding up a chainsaw, talking about a hatchet. he's holding up a chainsaw. you have the stuff that's happening at hhs today. these 10,000 people that have that are getting laid off, the vaccine skeptic running a vaccine research study into autism, which has been disproven time and time again. the immigration stuff. i'm scratching the surface here. there's so much that's been happening. and if democrats don't overperform as dave was laying out or don't win this wisconsin seat, what does that say to the democratic party? >> oh, look, i think we have to be honest about today. this is a very high stakes day. and you don't get a high stakes day if it's if it only matters for one side, it's high stakes. if it matters for both sides and one

way or the other out of wisconsin, with obviously some significant additional messaging out of florida, you're going to get a signal and the signal will be a top line. it will be one headline. it's either wisconsin votes to embrace elon musk and donald trump, and that musk's money helped. but also, you know, trump's agenda wasn't a problem. and somehow a republican backed candidate won a very tough race. and that's that's going to be very beneficial to them. on the other hand, if the message out of wisconsin is that against 20 or $25 million of spending by elon musk, a personal appearance by elon musk, several endorsements from donald trump, and all of the pressure that was brought on this race. wisconsinites voted for a progressive candidate for the court, rejecting musk and trump. that's going to be a very powerful signal. and then when

we dig down from that, if we've got that top line right, and we say, okay, people are going to notice that, then i think it has meaning for the democrats because it suggests that, you know, their message is get stronger, run harder, be more aggressive, don't don't pull back. don't think that you have to go soft on this. i mean, run against trump and musk. for the republicans, it becomes a complex message because obviously there are many republicans, no matter what signal they get from wisconsin, they're going to still fear that musk money will come into a primary against him. so that's a challenge. but some of them are going to start to fear what might happen in november if they stick with trump and musk. so a lot at stake here. >> ashley, i've got some breaking news on the other side of my next break, but i want to give you the last word on this. how closely is the white house paying attention to these races, and do you expect any changing? of course, if republicans lose. >> so the thing the white house is laser focused on in a countdown to the midterms is

this idea that they believe that they will not be successful in the midterms in turning out the trump coalition, if voters don't feel that he has kept his promises and pushed through his agenda. so on day one, they had a list of day one promises of promises longer term that went in a different bucket. and so depending on the reasons why voters give for what happens, i think they're paying incredibly close attention. if this is a referendum on trump's agenda and his and his team's ability to make good on those promises, we heard for the past two years, frankly, on the campaign trail. >> ashley parker, john nichols, dave weigel, thank you very much, guys. i think that was a really smart way to start the show. still ahead, what speaker mike johnson just did the breaking news we just mentioned after a number of republicans defied him and how a, quote, administrative error sent a maryland father with protected legal status to a notorious, notorious mega jail in el

salvador. and now what the white house is saying they will not do despite this mistake. plus, more tariffs are coming tomorrow. you've heard about them. what some republican lawmakers say some republican lawmakers say they're worried about. ♪ ♪ the flag replacement program got started by a good friend of mine, a navy vet, saw a flag at the office that needed to be replaced and said wouldn't this be great if this could be something that we did for anyone? comcast has always been a community driven company. this is one of those great examples of the way we're getting out there. >> we love being outside, but the sun makes our deck and patio too hot to enjoy. >> thanks to. >> our new sunsetter retractable awning, we can select full sun or instant shade. >> it's 20 degrees cooler and

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bill that would have allowed remote voting for new mothers and fathers. joining us now, punchbowl news co-founder and msnbc political contributor jake sherman. jake. what's happening? >> it's a very good question, katie. there was an effort by anna paulina luna to institute proxy voting for new and expectant moms who are pregnant or who have just given birth. and for new dads, this would allow people to vote from home for during, you know, a 12 week period right after they they had a baby. mike johnson didn't like that idea, so much so that he sought to overturn the will of 218 members of the house, including republicans and democrats, way more democrats than republicans. and he lost this bid. he lost it in a pretty spectacular fashion. nine republicans voted against him on a rule vote. that is a just to translate that. that is a typically party line vote that the speaker rarely loses. and after that, he basically folded up his tent and said, go home

for the week and we'll come back next week. it's tuesday, katie. so we've not we've been in the house, has been in session for not yet 24 hours. they came in at 630 last night ahead of this vote. and here's the, the bizarre thing or i guess the interesting thing to me, they're going to try this again next week, but they are going to include in that procedural vote an ability to get on to the president's or to the republican budget. so they're going to say, listen, either you continue to fight for proxy voting or we get on with the president's agenda. so they are really instead of taking the loss and moving on, doubling down. so new moms and dads can't proxy vote from home. >> why doesn't he want it? >> he thinks it's bad and unconstitutional, and he thinks it's a slippery slope. he did himself vote by proxy when it was allowed in the house, and that post covid period and covid period when nancy pelosi was speaker. but listen, there is just a, you know, a thread going through the right wing or

through a lot of the actually the house republican conference, that proxy voting is bad and it shouldn't be allowed and they should, you know, get rid of it at any, at any cost. and i, you know, but the opponents the other view, katie, is that we live in the 21st century and women should be allowed to be at home after their baby is born, to take care of their baby and work remotely. and i think that is a position that a lot of people sympathize with. and we'll see. maybe this vote gets worse for johnson. i don't know. >> i remember having to pump on capitol hill after teddy was born. i was there doing a story and it was unpleasant. >> i remember that, too, actually. i think i saw you on that. you were there, jake. >> jacob soboroff and i were doing the swamp. jake sherman. >> i remember. >> thanks so much. the trump administration admitted a mistake, but says they won't do anything about it. today at the white house in response to the, quote, administrative error ice made in deporting a father with protected immigration status. caroline leavitt accused the

man, kilmar abrego garcia, anew and said the u.s. will not bring him back. >> now that. >> the administration. has conceded that there was an error of one. >> salvadoran national. >> will there be. >> any reviews. >> conducted, and does the. >> president express any. thoughts on the one error that was disclosed in court last night? >> well, first of all, the error that you are referring to was a clerical error. it was an administrative error. the administration maintains the position that this individual who was deported to el salvador and will not be returning to our country, was a member of the brutal and vicious ms. 13 gang. >> garcia was on one of three deportation flights of alleged venezuelan gang members to el salvador, the aragua. you remember that last month his lawyer and his family say he is not a gang member of any sort. joining us now, msnbc legal correspondent lisa rubin and nbc news senior homeland security correspondent julia ainsley.

julia, who is this man? >> well. >> he's a father. he was arrested in maryland just a few weeks ago, katie. and at the time, his lawyer says that his five year old son, who the lawyer says has autism, was in the back seat of that car. the lawyer? this is a public defender we know who has represented a lot of cases recently in the d.c, maryland area, said that he does not have any ties to train de aragua and that he had from an immigration judge order called a withholding of removal, which basically allows ice not to be able to deport someone while someone's case is being played out. or maybe there more details that need to be accrued in order for a judge to make a decision on whether or not they can be deported. but withholding really explicitly prohibits deportation. that's what's at the core here of why they deported someone who had a withholding of removal. now, his lawyer has said if they wanted to deport him, they needed to go through the judicial process and get that order removed. instead, as the lawyer says, they just put him on a plane. >> let me play joe rogan talking

about these deportations. this is him on his podcast on march 29th. >> the thing. >> is. >> like. >> you got to. get scared that people who are not criminals are getting like, lassoed up and deported and sent to like el salvador prisons like that kind. >> of we talked about this with. >> dodge as well. when you do things quickly and you do things aggressively, that's how you get done. but that's also when mistakes get made. and i think a human being being plucked out of nowhere and ending up in a country he's never been in, in a maximum security prison with gang members, seems like a bad thing to happen to me. >> it's horrific. it's horrific. >> i don't think that should be controversial. >> no. >> that's not controversial at all. >> and this is the thing, you know, measure twice, cut once. this is the like this is kind of crazy that that could be possible. >> that's horrific. >> and that's again. >> that's bad for the cause. like the cause is let's get the gang members out. >> everybody agrees. but let's

not innocent gay. >> hairdressers get lumped. >> up with the gangs. >> you know, we were talking to the guy that he's speaking of, his lawyer the other day, and she said, this is a different guy that that he just got lisa rounded up because he had the wrong tattoos. that shows that they mistook for being a part of the venezuelan gang when they were, they were just like art student tattoos. so he's still in that prison and they're having a hard time finding him. then you have this this father, and now they're trying to accuse him of being an ms. 13 gang member. i know there's some court documentation of the accusation. at the very least, although he's never been convicted of it, he's. >> never been convicted of it. but the order of removal that was entered. >> by. >> an immigration court did find credible evidence that he was a member of ms. 13 and put the burden on him, essentially to prove that he's not, as you know, proving a negative is very difficult. he continues to maintain through his lawyer that he is not a member of ms. 13. has he haven't had a chance. >> to prove that. >> he did with respect to the order of removal. however, he

then claimed asylum and that's the basis for what julia was talking about. this withholding of an order of removal in 2019. he got a judge to essentially say he can't be forced to leave the country because if he were sent back to el salvador, he believes that he would be a victim of extortion and other crimes on the basis of other things going on in that country. that is why the onus was on the government in this instance. if they wanted to deport him, they had to apply to remove that withholding of the order of removal. but there is some grounds in the existing legal framework to that. he was a gang member, or at least a judge believed that he was. >> so there is a process in place to make sure that you don't end up getting innocent people rounded up. and i guess going back to the hairdresser. yeah. is there a way to get anyone back from el salvador? >> well, this is a question that we are asking in a larger setting, too. in the alien enemies case before judge boasberg, because there the aclu

has sort of previewed that their argument is going to be that the united states has constructive custody over all of the people who were deported and are now in salvadoran custody. the argument essentially goes, the united states arranged for them to be in salvadoran custody. the united states is paying the el salvadoran government to keep them in custody, and therefore they have the power to unwind the arrangement. this is the same argument that this man's lawyers are making now in their emergency papers, and he'll have a court hearing on friday at 1 p.m. to determine whether or not she has jurisdiction. she meaning the judge and whether he can be forced to be returned to the united states. >> all right. lisa rubin, julia ainsley, thank you ladies very much. and still ahead, donald trump's liberation day, it's what he's calling it is tomorrow, what he's promising and why it's worrying some republicans. plus, that didn't last long at all with the president is back to accusing ukraine of after a short lived

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>> from homeserve start at just 4.99 a month. >> call 1-833-812-1933 or visit homeserve.com. >> tomorrow is what donald trump is calling liberation day, but democrats are worried it will become black wednesday as the markets react to donald trump's new worldwide reciprocal tariffs. economists are worried also. so are business owners, investors, consumers and some republican lawmakers who are fielding calls from panicked constituents. joining us now, nbc news senior business correspondent christine romans and nbc news capitol hill correspondent melanie zanona. melanie, tell me about what republicans are hearing from their constituents. >> yeah, there's. >> a lot. >> of uneasiness. >> right now among. >> republicans. >> particularly those who have a lot. >> of farmers. >> in. >> their states who have these. >> big agriculture. >> industries in their. >> home states. and i caught up. >> with glenn thompson. >> he's the. >> chairman of the house

agriculture committee, and he said that he has already asked the white house to exempt certain products and goods that are important to the agriculture committee and the industry, like fertilizer and peat moss. i also spoke to mariannette miller-meeks. she's an iowa republican. she was traveling around the state yesterday with the agriculture secretary, brooke rollins. and what they heard from farmers is that they are very concerned about the prospect of a prolonged trade war. and the congresswoman said they sought to assuage farmers that there are multiple options at their disposal to help provide some relief to blunt the impact of these tariffs, including potentially a bailout. meanwhile, over in the senate, there's also at least two republicans that we know of who are willing to cross party lines and back a democratic resolution that would essentially block the proposed 25% across the board tariffs on canada. however, obviously, that would be something that would die in the house because it would be largely a symbolic resolution. it wouldn't go anywhere. it still would be, though, a huge rebuke publicly of president donald trump and his trade policies. but most republicans,

by and large, are saying that even though they're uncomfortable with the prospect of a prolonged trade war, they are willing to give some trump some latitude here to achieve his trade objectives, even if that does mean some short term pain. >> we were waiting a little bit earlier when we were talking about this at noon, for caroline leavitt to maybe give some more information about what to expect tomorrow. and you've been on these calls? i've been on these calls like when the biden white house would have an economic policy rollout, they'd call reporters and they'd say, here's what we're trying to do, so that we have an idea of what they believe they're getting through or they want to get through. we can push back, obviously, but they give us an idea of it. donald trump's team, have they been doing that? have have they been calling to say, hey, listen, here's what our tariffs are going to look like. here's the goal here. here's our motivation. a lot. >> of. >> that's happening on television. because that's. >> the way donald. >> trump does it. >> it's he's. >> a. >> different kind. >> of president. we all. >> know that. >> and the. >> bottom line is.

>> he's. >> the one. >> who's going. >> to make the call. so you don't know what the policy is going to be until the policy. >> do they not know what the policy is? >> i think they know what the. >> discussions are around the policy. >> but caroline leavitt. >> said today that. >> they there. >> is a plan. >> and that. >> he's meeting with his trade. >> people right now. >> about. that plan and that when. >> it happens. >> tomorrow, when they announce. >> it at 4. >> p.m, it will. >> be effective immediately. >> that's what. >> she said. and that's when the stock market. >> fell into. >> negative territory, because. >> that that. >> at least her understanding. >> is there's. >> no grace period. there's no more negotiation after tomorrow at 4 p.m. that's where. >> the. uncertainty comes. >> for so many businesses. i guess. >> the. >> uncertainty will be over sometime tomorrow and. >> then they'll. >> know for sure, you know, sort of what. >> kind of burdens. >> and higher costs. >> they have in their system. >> maybe we can put put the dow up on our screen just so we can keep an eye on it. we, we know we were watching a couple of weeks ago. maybe it was a week ago. now i can't keep track of time. after another announcement of tariffs, donald trump made it and the markets just plummeted. i was talking to senator mark warner a little bit earlier today, and he is worried that

this will be a black wednesday. he's going to announce all these tariffs. and the markets are just going to are just going to sink precipitously. i know you were talking to me a little bit earlier about mark zandi and his prediction after all of this. and moody's tell me again. >> so a couple of things i would say. first about the stock market, it was already. >> down a lot in the first quarter. >> so they're anticipating something rough. >> what mark zandi. >> at. >> moody's said in. >> the washington post. >> and we've since confirmed his his forecast basically worst case scenario. he says if there are more tariffs put on tomorrow, 25% decline in the stock market, 5 million jobs lost. yeah, a one year recession and an unemployment rate that goes up to 7%. that's worst case. that's worst case scenario. i mean, you're talking about completely changing the way the global economies work. that will not happen without a lot of disruption. >> does he project farther ahead? does. is this a short term period of intense pain before there's, you know, bliss on the horizon? >> well, there are others who are less pessimistic in the near term who say goldman sachs, for example, cutting, cutting its growth. i mean, everybody's cutting their growth forecasts and they're raising their

recession forecasts. so 1 in 3 chance of recession. plenty of people think that you might still be able to avoid a recession in the near term. and then if you talk to some industries like the steel industry, the shrimp industry, some of these, you know, some some parts of agriculture who are desperate for more, more tariffs because they feel like they've just had their lunch eaten by foreign competitors for decades. so it's just going to be fascinating to see tomorrow if it's across the board tariffs, if it's country specific sector specific we just don't know. >> but you also have i mean there are industries within or agriculture within this country that's heavily protected against foreign undercutting like the sugar industry. what happens to them if there's reciprocal tariffs. and a country overseas decides, hey, listen, we're going to tariff the heck out of you on on your exports. i mean, it's just hard to say that there's going to be an across the board benefit or an across the board detraction or pain when you're imposing tariffs like this that seem to be

scattershot all around the. >> we get this certainty tomorrow and then comes the next waves, which are the retaliation and what is targeted. and we haven't even heard from mexico yet what mexico is planning to target. that's all tbd. the eu has been very clear it plans to target in mid-march, the very places that are going to hurt republican senators. right. >> and kentucky bourbon. >> yeah. and iowa corn, soybeans. menomonee falls, wisconsin, wisconsin where they make harley-davidsons. you know, some really, really important factories with american workers who who would feel retaliation. >> all right, christine romans, always good to have you and i remember john mccain in a town hall with barack obama fighting fiercely to be president of the united state and said to barack obama saying something about being a muslim and he grabs the mike phone. he -- micro phone. he says had that is wrong, this

is a guy who loves his family, is a christian. he loves his family. can you see that from our president now? this is how wrong i was. i will admit, i've made mistakes. i've been wrong. i remember where i was when he said in his campaign that he's no hero. that people who are captured are not heroes. i said to the people that were with me, there goes his 15 minutes of fame. i thought that was the end of trump. but somehow you can be the president of the united states when you insult the veterans that serve. john lewis and john mccain are coming up a lot so far in any 20 hours. i want t what the education secretary is accusing harvard university of that could cost that school billions in

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whiplash sunday. he was, quote, off at vladimir putin for not appearing to want peace. and now donald trump has redirected that anger right back on to vladimir zelenskyy. >> through you. i heard that they're now saying, well, i'll only do that deal if we get into

nato or something to. that effect. well, that was never number one discussed. number two, i think it's going to be very long before putin, they said, you're not going into nato. and it could be. that's probably the reason the war started. >> it turns out this negotiation for peace isn't as easy as donald trump said it would be on the campaign trail. just look now at what putin is doing, ordering a draft of 160,000 more men by mid-summer this year. joining us now, former u.s. ambassador to russia and msnbc international affairs analyst michael mcfaul. you know, when donald trump was saying he was very angry at vladimir putin, i almost had a hard time bringing it up because, okay, how angry is he? what's he going to do about it? and, you know, just barely over 24 hours later, it's all once again about ukraine. >> yeah. >> like you said, he flips and flops a lot, doesn't he? the president on this issue and maybe others. i think what

you're hearing in his voice, he's frustrated. you know, he promised us all he could end this war in a day. many of us said that would be impossible. he then leaned into it, and he had a strategy of concessions to putin. he just thought he would give putin what he wanted, and he gave him all sorts of things. by the way, incredible sanction concessions, in my view. and it didn't work. putin asked for more. he asked for more things. and so i think you're hearing in the president a frustration with his negotiating strategy, and he's lashing out now at both sides. >> this 160,000 men draft for the summer. what does it signal to you? >> it signals to me that putin is going to keep fighting until he's stopped on the battlefield. that fundamental truth, that tragic truth, has to be understood by the trump administration. by the way, it's not just something about putin. that's the way wars tend to end. either one side wins or there's a stalemate on the battlefield. right now, putin sees us

withdrawing our support from ukraine. and so he very rationally thinks that he can take more territory if his opponent is getting weaker. and remember, he on paper, he's already annexed four of the regions of ukraine. they're already part of russian maps if you buy a map in russia. but he doesn't actually control them on the battlefield. and so i think until he stopped on the battlefield, he's going to keep fighting and he won't be serious about negotiations. >> what about this allegation from donald trump that zelensky wants to once again tie the mineral deal to membership in nato? >> well, that's the first i heard of it when the president said it. i don't know that. i do know that they the original mineral deal that they flew to, to washington to sign, everybody thought was a good deal. subsequently, the american side has been adding things that the ukrainian side doesn't like, and they want to get something for giving all these billions of dollars to the united states of

america. and that's, i think, where the impasse is with that document right now. >> you also see senator graham joining senator blumenthal to introduce bipartisan legislation to sanction russian oil, gas and uranium if russia invades after a peace deal or if it's not or if it's not negotiating in good faith. i mean, this is lindsey graham kind of coming back around to his long standing position of not believing russia and not being a fan of vladimir putin, despite having to, i guess, maneuver around whatever donald trump's of the minute wishes are. >> well. >> yeah, as a result of that, senator graham has also done a lot of flip flopping recently. it's kind of embarrassing to me because i've known his position. i've respected his position for a long time. but with respect to sanctions, the sanctions after reinvasion is the wrong strategy. they should be increasing sanctions now to put pressure on putin to negotiate

and then release those sanctions if they get a ceasefire and a peace deal. i just think it's backwards. you've got to put pressure on putin now, not some threat in the future. >> ambassador mcfaul, really good to have you. thank you very much. and coming up. first it was columbia. now it is harvard. was columbia. now it is harvard. don't go any this is what joint pain looks like. when you keep moving with aleve. (♪♪) just 1 aleve. 12 hours of uninterrupted joint pain relief. aleve. strength to last 12 hours. if you're living with diabetes, i'll tell you the same thing i tell my patients. getting on dexcom g7 is one of the easiest ways to take better control of your diabetes and help protect yourself from the long-term health problems it can cause. this small wearable... replaces fingersticks, lowers a1c, and it's covered by medicare. not managing your diabetes really affects...

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spread on its campus. according to the new york times, the administration is also targeting princeton, canceling several dozen grants this after it canceled $400 million in funding for columbia university and 175 million for the university of pennsylvania. joining us now, nbc news national correspondent yasmin vossoughian. let's focus in on harvard. yeah. what does it look like to lose this money? >> so we. >> have to understand. >> what kind. >> of these. >> grants do for these universities, right. and they have. >> these huge endowments. >> harvard's got a. >> $50 billion plus endowment, one of the biggest in the country. columbia, for instance, has a $15 billion plus endowment. >> that's a. >> heck of a lot of money. >> despite that. >> they're getting these major grants, right. but what they're. >> going towards. >> is, is, for instance, medical research. >> right. >> and so. >> far right now it's a threat for harvard. right. we're not cancel $9 billion if you guys don't come to the table on what we see as antisemitism, anti-semitic practices on your campus. if you do. >> not change.

>> things within the week, you will begin to see money canceled. this is what the administration is telling harvard university. but if you. look at columbia for an example that is already dealing with this $400 million in cuts, i spoke to the head of a neural research lab, researching, for instance, the hippocampus, a part of our brain which focuses in on our memory that is a part of the brain that is damaged by alzheimer's, for instance. right. so they're part of alzheimer's research. they've had two major. grants cut because. >> of the $400 million cuts. >> we're looking at. $2 million plus in grants cut. that's not just affecting the research. it's affecting the people that are working in the lab, people that are cleaning the lab, the it department, and so on and so forth. so they're seeing potential layoffs here. >> they're seeing. >> cuts to integral research, medical research in our country. >> like liberal policies and the administration trying to root out the liberalism. what they're doing is they're affecting what everybody is benefiting from, regardless of how you fall on the political spectrum. >> yeah. if you're looking at, you know, upenn, as you just

mentioned, $170 million, the president of upenn said automatically they had sent letters out to the faculty saying, in fact, they also had to cut, for instance, student loan programs. right. >> financial aid. >> to some of these universities, research towards diseases that. >> are acquired. >> within the hospital. so these are things that affect all of us on a daily basis. there was an incredible op ed read written in the new york. >> times last. >> weekend about this, that are being affected by these major cuts that are obviously ongoing and not stopping at harvard. >> all right, yasmin vossoughian, thank you very much. and one more thing before we go. cory booker is still guest to the speech to a joint session of congress delivered by president trump just a few weeks ago? mr. booker: every time i answer the question, we have to go through the same business of the united states. >> senate for. >> as long. >> as i am physically able. it

is maddening in this country. >> to create greater. >> and. >> greater health care crisis, and for us not to solve it, but to. >> battle back. >> and forth between trying to make. >> incremental changes or to tear it all down. with no plan. >> to make it better, leaving more americans suffering. >> what is still one. >> of the most significant ways people go bankrupt, which is not being able to afford their health care. >> you cannot deny. >> fundamental rights to another and not endanger them for yourself. >> we have created. >> a system now of trump is. >> successful. >> where. >> you can just say, you. >> can just claim, you. >> can just. >> point to someone. >> and say they're. >> from x country, or claim that they're part. >> of. >> a gang. >> and without. >> any due.

>> process, without any vetting. without going. >> before any independent arbiter, you. >> are. disappeared because there's just no way to. >> challenge them. >> no due process. >> my voice is inadequate. >> my efforts. today are. inadequate to stop what they're trying to do. but we, the people are powerful. we are strong. we have changed history. we have bent the arc of the moral universe. and now is that moral moment again. it's the. >> moral moment again. >> strom thurmond holds the record at 24 hours and 18 minutes. he was protesting the civil rights act or trying to stop it, filibuster it. and if you haven't seen mr. smith goes to washington, now is a good time to watch it. that's it for time to watch it. that's it for me today. deadline. w incoming dishes. —ahhh! —duck! dawn powerwash flies through 99% of grease and grime in half the time. yeah, it absorbs grease five times faster. even replaces multiple cleaning products. ooh, those suds got game. dawn powerwash. the better grease getter.

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