night. >> thank you.. that's "the ed show." i'm ed schultz. "hardball" starts rht now here onsnbc. the wrld says goo-byeto michaeael jackckn, whe in alaska, sarah palin says good-bye.. let's play "hardbaball." good evening. m sitting in f chriss matthews here e new york. leading of rememberingg mchael jackson. was surely thebiggest, the momo extragant and the most watched show biz memorial rvice in history. thsands packed the sples centnt in loangeles. millions more watched on tv and on video scres around the untry and across the g globe. as the world sd good-bye to michl jackson. >> in fact,t, the mor i thinknd tatalk about michael jackson, i

feel the king o o pop is not bi enough for him.. think he is simply -- i i thin heis simplyly thehe greatest tertainer that ever lilived. >> to the unanimouspprov of thaudience in thehe staples ceer, jackson wawas repepeedly calleded the greates entertaine o ever lived. our guests toninight will talal about t at mad michael jackson ch apopula and enduring figure in ameran music and cucuure. and this beingng "hararall," we wi talk politics. our own anea mitchchell got an inteiew with sar palin last night in alaaska, d she'll join with the latesest on the palin saga. d while thewod's eyes werere on the staples centeter today, a a franken ised his rit hand and was sworn in as minnesota's junioror senator. the democrats' 60thth senato a

the 100th senanar. more on that laterer. we begin witith today's tribute to micichael jackson. our r courtn hazazlett was i ii staples centerer. courey, there's always a different feeeeling inside t t building o on thes eventsts thae can psibly convnvey thrgh tetevision cameras to peoplee watchingt home. what was it like to bebe in the? >> rorter: it was truly mamagical. there's no othth way to put iti. i was veryry honore to be ther. e of t most striking moments to me camevery early o wh therere wasiterally almost a 15-minute period of silence. we were waiting for bebeeen acts, and thehere was someelay in getting some o of the ckson family guesests eated. annobody spokoke. nobody realllly momod. itit was vy solelemn. i've ner seen so many peopople ininne p place jst behave thselves, to tell you the truth. andd then there was just an ebb and fl of e emotionshroughout the 90-minute event.t. there were peperiods o times when, you kn, you c cried with the jacksons. an obviously,, that wou be when paris came fororrd and

talked abobout her dadeing the best dad t there everwas. and there werere lighter moment as well. we hrd stories thatwere j jt so hum about eating fried chken on the flr with michael l jackso and we've e been sayg all along thatne of the magicalal things abt michael, 's a cecelebrity'celebrity, and you dot get to hear ththat ver ofte but for 90 minutetes, he transcended thatat and was sorto a n nrmal person, too. i mean, the stories you hrd were justst real a so human. i don't ththink we'vever perienced that s sort of connection w wh a cebrity and especially with an icon l le michaejackson. courtney,s you mentned, one e jackson's children s spo at the end of the memoriri service. wathat the first time tt his daughter, , paris, has been hea spking publicly? >> reporter: as far r as i know yes, it's the first time. i mean, r goodness ke, we've barely seen thesese childreren without some s srt of ad covering or mask o on the face. so toear her eak in a and of itself was a hugege surprprise. and then for her to say w what e did out her ad, i was so --

you know, i don't k know her, a i'm proud of her. whwhat a brave, braveething for ung woman like her to do. and just really puput a period the e e the sentence r what nd of ther michael jackson was. listen, kids don't put themselvlves outhere like that unss they mean it. to me, itit means michael jacck was a good ather. and so let's j just lee that where it is. and aswe turn ththe pa after today and start making judgmemes and d digging i deeper to the other more serioious rts of the story, at's fifine. but let's s ave it at tthis. he was a g good fatatr. >> let's listen what his daughter hadado say day at the mememorialervice. > i juswanted to say -- >> sak up. >> -- ever since i w was born,n daddy has been the bestt father you u could ev imagine and d ijust want to say i love m so much.

>> cortney, i have fririendsho lilive in los angeleswhose chdren have had play das with michael jackson's children, and they report exact what his daughter had to say today. that in a allof their observatioio of th as a family, , that he wasas the gree dad to thesese kids, andnd thas the way they looked d at himvery day. >> reporter: i i think u're absotely right, rry. it's jt so wonderful to hear that.. i was kind of tryiying to press this w wle thi. i look b back- i've beenhere for ababout ni days now. i've been the neveverland ranch. i've bn outside the cino home. i was at the frest lawn cemetete last night, and i w inside the memorialal today. and you'd thk between that a growg up with mhael jakson d havi -- i got a white glove when i w w a kid, and "thrhrler" w the first tape i i owned. i i ld han in the allegeged human chain aroround t world for "we arthe world.d." i didndn know michael jakson. yoyoknow, you think y you ow ese pele, but unti you have a ment like is and it's so, so re,ou realizee y don't

know theseseeople who are on magane covevers in your ipods s and just such aartof your faic of your memory. and so i thinkall of that came together epecially for me today and dinitely for the hardcore fans whoho flew halfway araroune world some c cases toe here today. >> t thank y, courtnene hazlett. joining us now from sples centnt in loangeles is nbc special corrrrespondentre and profesr tricia rose, professor of african-american culture at brown unersity is also jojoing us. she's also the auth of "the hihip-hop rs." toure, was t tre anything surprising to you inin that memorial service todayay inhe staples center?? there had been a lot of advancnd word about who w was g gng be there, a about how it was goioio be handled, buts you watctcd it, as you we through every minute ofof iit, whatwas the mo momoving ment and thehe most surprising elelents oft for you? >>well, let m gobackwards. e most surpring element, i think you just broke newsaying thatat chael jjkson's children

have play dates withriends of yours. didn't know thatt they d play das with otherer real childrene. so, imeaan, like you just broke news, awrence. >> il tell you, they have play dates,s,ichael would goo on pla dates with themem and visit ott peopop's homes, and kids would go to michael'ss plala. ththey werhaving play dates wiwith -- >> we diidn't knoany of that. >> ty were having play dates with the norma kids ofof l.a. l the time. >> you're making news todday. perhaps i shouould be inrviewing yoyo mean, you know,, it was l le a ack baptist chuhuhservice. i mean,t was very christian.n. it was very sging and exerant, but solemn the ght way. ththe tone w right. sosome fantastic performances. evie wonder, you know, if you wen't crying after stevie wonder and marih, then you were crng after jerine and john mayer, or you u were crying certainly y ter pas took the mikeas courtney sa, that was azing. you know, a the other sidef michael jjackson w not igignore.

the sidedett, you know the pete kings of the woror wa remember, reverendnd shararon said t there inothing strange out your daddyddressing his three children. what was strange isswhat your daddy had to dealwh. that was perhaps the li of the day righbehind -- rht afterer presentative jackckn, lee, saying people e innent in this cuntry untililhey're pren otherwise. , you know,w, you saw lighter moments like brooke shielelnd courey talked about magic johnson, talalking out eati kentuc fried chickekenith michael jackckn and t more serious moments. so fanttic songs. theone was righ i mea this was the perfect send-off, , i thk, for michael jackson. anand if hs watching from heavenenhe' like, oh, my god.d. they did thiso right, andd te whole world is wating, and i' in the m middle staples cente, you know. and this is the greatest thing ever. i me, he wasas a shshowman. and todayas a big howman sese-off. >> professor tciarose, you're

author of "hip-hop wars dedescribe f us the infnfence mimichael ckson has h had on african-americican music andn particular, what' going on today when i listen to wh the yooung african-amamericanrtists are pupuing ou today,y, i n't see the linkage between the workk michchl jackson was doing inhe '70s and '8s and whatat i'm listening to n n. is there a linkage? >> well, youou know, a l has changege but tre are some impopoant continuities. foexample, one of h his most llmark signatures, the moonwalk, was, fact, anearly breakdcing moveve. which heorrow and, of coursese, made his own d brought, you know, extrrdinary individu creatatity toto. but he w constaly in counication and conversatition with the next generation. i will say,though, thatt commercial h-hop culture, what's in the mainstream corpate sponsored music is real an thti theticcal t what

jackson stoodod r. its loss a and a ang and hope describe the cultureess a whoho wh t tt's not generally true. 's misogynistic. it's's n r reay focusing on love and justice in the wha michael stoofor. so in a way, i think there is a sadness, it ses me, that looking at him in relationship to the curren state of, say, commercial black radio, thate brings forth. i' hopingthat with his death, that we'llll really renew ourselves and ask, well, wat is music r? andd wh kind d of community doe want not just whahat d we have? what's the suffering, but how cawe transcend that. d michael's whole life s abou knknledging aiain,eing compassionate,e, bngng i touch with ople, butiging out wayso transcend that individual sufferingng t communities arouou t theorld. >> professor sese, in his --- >> letete -- >> go o aahe, toure, jump inn erere. >> letet m say, everything she id is rightht. at's why i have such admiration foror r. t tre are musicological linkeen what mhael and

jujuin timberlake iss doing, w h beyoyoe e an r. kelly are dog and what chris brownis doing. perhs more importantt is the business link, thehe econic link. jacksounderstood the imrtance of ownining you own master and we talalkabout theeatles catalog he owns. hehe also ownsns all his own publishingngith th myjack catalog which is worth 1 10 $0 million. d that'sery importantntithin hip-hop, ownining yourwn master of course,e,ackson broke the color barrierer at mtv,v, forcem to py his videos, becoming their jackierobinson. and mtv would not bebe what it s ort least wt it was back when they were playi videos without the influen of all these black artists. >>right. >>nd relutionizing what you do with video. >> we're gog to go to a ip of the service and what mown founder berrygordy had to say about micel. >> he wa driven by his hger to learn, to constantly taught himself to be the best.

he was the consummate student. he studied the greats and became eater. he raised the bar and then oke the bar. >> profeor rose, his death, we have discovered tgh itunes sales tt his popularity has surged in the last few days. ll there, y you thi, be an ininfluence hip-hop music and the modern musisic now an the mumusician bmichael jackson? that they'll takee a look back and say, wait a mine, are we missing some o othe things that we could be using,g, somof the inflububss fom im? clearly someone like johnlelend hahas already been influenced b mimichl l jackson, but the kindf het of core hip-h-hop guysys, eyey gng to soften up in any wain michael jackson's direction? >> i mn,n, toure's poininisis important which h ise e ready has s a ofofou impact andnd you

seititn the artists and dancers that he described. the question i think you're getting peaks to this larger prlem which has to do with at's our vision who we are and how d we sort of hold on to that in the face of an iustry that setimes pays us more f selling out or pays us more for articulating a vision of africaamericans that feedshe mo vicious stereoteshat for rsons i can't explain remain profoundly profitable. and michael jackson fnd a way to rmain excellent,excellence, to hit the bar, to break the bar, as gordy said, and t capitulate to that. you kn, i' not sang he did not hais other strgles, but i'm hoping that some of the incredibly lented hip-hop artist r&b artists, new ja muans, come together and think about wt we're doing as culture and e role of artists i imaning community because you real don't have a sense of where you want too and what you're ping for, you get stuck reesenting your own suffering in a way that is

self-desuctive, unfortunately. >> toure,o u see -- go ead, toure. >> you keep talking about hip-hop and old modern music and there's a lot o different black music, r&b as well as hip-hop. hip-hop is not going t be looking to chael jackson for influence. when hip-hop was rst coming up, you saw artists likell cool j dissing michael jackson as a y of sort of estabshing who they wer you know, because hip-hop is ultra masculine, ultra testosterone. there's noort of gray area. and michael jackson was muc more of aomplete human being in that you saw him and you saw little mes brown sort of alpha hepburn minist.e audrey he w rt of a complete human being androgynous in many ways. so no, hip-hop is not lking to michaejackson. hop is lookingto james brown, sly stone, perhaps even the political musi of marvin gay. michael ckson had muc more of th sensitivity that, youknow, hihop is not looking to express.

>> thank you, toure -- go ahea tricia, go aad quickly. >> i have pipe in qukly. e's no doubt thatipop is not looking to michael jackson, but hip-hop has aways femininity. mascinit and coorate main stremme hip-hop ha reduced the genre to that base simplicity. and think if hip-hop ioing to survive as a voice for a continued healthcounity, it'soing to haveto look to ckson or someone like him. >> toure andricia rose, iwant to thank you both. your insights ha been valuable to what we were watching inside the staples center tod. comingup, we'll be back with more from los aeles. we will joine by congresswoman sheila jackson-le who spoke at today's memorial and has introduced a solution honoring michael jackson in the united states house of representativ representatives. you're watching "hardball" only on msnbc. >> the momenthat i wished i didn't liv to see come, buts

much as i can say that and mn it, i do kw that god is good. and i don't -- i do know that as mu as we may feel, andwe do, that we need michael here with us. god must have needed him f more.

>>lots of politicanews ahead on hardball." sarah palin tells nbc andr mitche she's a fighter. andrea joins us wth the latest from alaska and what mighghbe

next for th soon-to-o- ex-governor sasapalin. i believe thahat nn is a renewable resourcece ♪ there se things you'll ever be able to download. ♪ i believe thatat wn we celebrate life. in catures big and small,, we dcover connections... that stay with us forever. discover a place where worlds connect.

♪ why why ♪ tell the that it's human nature ♪ ♪ why why ♪hyhy i'm glad i lid in an era when i got a chance to what everybody's been coming up here saying, the greatest entertaer of all time. >>elcome back to "hardball." after today's movg tributeo michael jackson at the staples ceer, the jackson family is holding private event now at the bever wilshire hotel. nbc's jinah kim is there and joins us no jinah, i assume this for the vips a the family wh were at the stapl center totreat to a more intimate cation afterwards >> reporte that's right. it's a wake or repass, if you will, just an oortunity for the family to get together after such a very public tribute.

you ow, ifhe staples cente was for t publi ts was strictly for those whoere closest to michael jackson. the family choosing t end what's no doubt bn a very ctic, stressful and tiring day by suounding themselves with those who knew michael jackson best. we're told usher, wesleynipes and brooke shields were seen goininside the beverly wilshire whi is one of the most premier hotels he in several hundred more, wre told, were prively and exclusively invitedy the family to take pt with them. you know, ere's no dancing. there's no singing. there aren' really a public tributes. it's just a way for the family to mingle with their closest family and friendsnd just kin of end what's been a ry stressful day. and, ifact, it began a little after 2:00 pacific time. we're told that it's pretty much alrey wrapped up. lot of pple are already leaving the premises. so itill be done here fairly shortly. lawrence? >> thank you for that live updatejinah kim. congresswoman sheila

jackson-lee introduced a resolution honorin michael jackson in the united states congress. and she spoke about it today at his memorial service. we have introduced into the house of represtatives this resolution 600 tat will be debateon the floor of the house at claims michael jackn as an ameran legend and musicalicon, a wld humanitarian, somee who will be honored forever a forever drever and forever and forever. >> joining me now, congresswoman sheila jackson lee. congresswoman sheila jacks lee, y spoke today of your own perience withichael jackson in varus situations. tells about that. >> well, it was really a story of ichael's humanitarian service which i really believe the world and thetion probably will learn more about in the days to come. it was steadfast. it was steady.

it was yearly. experience was his desire to fight ainst the devastatn of hiv/aidsn the ctinent of africa. and sofrican bassadors and represented tis were wiing to come d sit down with michael jackson. he was serious engh, he was knn as such a world nitarian that these representatives of nations came to the united states capitol, visitedith us in my office, and liened to mchl jackson. they ltened to him. he listened to them. then ihink it is important that -- then i ink it is important that t focus was the devastion of hiv/aids. he had done so mucbefore. he helped children. had worked with developing nations. he had sponsored orphanages in africa. as you well know, when heas burned, he wentand gave money for e burn unit. he bought hospital beds. and th, of course, he

recogniz t crifice that r soldiers give when neheas in washgton bvisiting walter reed hospital, the symbol of the difficulty and tgedy that occurred with our menand women onhe front lines duri the heightened pt the iraq war. michael was sensitive and caring. he was a living humatarian. >>ou also made a rence to his troubles and his diffulties. let's list to that. >> we know thatpeople are innocentuntil proven oterwise. that is wh the constitution stands for. congrswan, do you think that your resolution may he some resistance in the hse of representatives, especially having heard peter kin in the last 24 hours, republican congressman from new york, talk about michael jacks's trials anthe accusations agnst him involving possible problems with children? do you tnk your resolution may

run into trouble because of that? >> lete be very clear. this resolution deals with documented, factualcts of humanitari service that michaeloseph jackson gave throughout his life. i n't know anyone that could reject the uth. and so the resolution only speaks tohe truth of h living testimony of how he helped so many. unesco, children that were in need, individuals who were dying. and would just simply say that all legislatio has to be vetted. this will be vetted on the truth. and would hope that my colleagues, in a birtisan way, would represent andecnize the national an international statute that michael hadn putting a face on america, fa of ndness, a fac of caring, and a ce of sharing. that's what we will be addressing. >> all right. thank you, cgresswoman sheila ckson lee. wh w return,ow michael

jackson influenced african-american cture. our coverage of e memorl today to michael jackn continues after this. >> today in tokyo, beneath the eiffelower, in ghana's black starsquare, in johannesburg an pittsbur, in birmingham, alama, and birmingham, england, we are ssing michael jackn. but we do know we him. and we are the world. ♪ don't you know ba yeah ye ♪ ♪ i'll behere

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♪ we are the world ♪ we are the childn ♪ we are thenes who make a brighter day♪ ♪ so let's art giving ♪ there's a choice w're making ♪ ♪ we're saving o own lives ♪ it's true we me a brighter day ♪ ♪ just you and me welcome back t "hardball." journalist stephen a. smit host of his ow and radio show on espn. he's written for "the philadelph enquirer" and frequently appears on msnbc. he joins us from 30k to talk about the life and legacy of michael jackson. stephen, you havto hava heart oftone to not be moved by what went on in the staes center today. i felt like i was watching a hero's send-off, a hero's funeral. was michael jackson a hero to the african-american youth?

>> i wouldn'to that far. i would say was a hero with anne affiliated with the music instry because we all recognized his to the eatest entertainer of alm time. his music wasbsolutely phenenal. i just finished playing it all y long during the fourth of july. obviously some of his dae moves, some the things he did in the music industry, seven ngles with the "thriller" album, 50 millionopies sold, the top of the billboard charts. i mean, he first got on mtv, african-american, you lo at the things he did thrghout his careeras clearly i will lustrous when you look at himn that fashion, it's strictlyn the sense of his mic, noreally anything ee. >> well, i would asme that his relationship tolack america had different chapters to it. >> definily. that's a very, very good point because e reveren al sharpton alluded to that today. heas a pioneer of sorts. you know, staing out his career at age 5, accomishing what he accomplished through the '70s, through the '80s whe he out on his own a leftthe

jackson 5 and obvly what he was able to accolish are "thriller andba off thehe wall"" before that. e alalit is that again, you know, he basically transcended so many babarriersnd just walk right rougthem and ercame th and paved the way for a lot of people. and al sharpn c relate to th.. but in t tes of people this genenetitionall they know is that michael jasosonis one of the greatetest musicicianofofll time, and obviouslyly they knno fefew her thin or think they know a few other thin about him thatre less celebratory. >> and what d it feel like when he started to change his appearance so dramatically, seed not even gnizable? i it depends onon who you ask. to some peop within the african-americicanomomnity, it waflat-out offensive simply causthey felt like wh quincy jones, one ofhehe greatest music prorodursrs o al time, just a aldede to blblic a coup of ys agowhen he said that he felelt likeichael jackson didn't want t beblack, didn't like ing black. heevev believed that he had vititiligo oananytng like that. sosooosome, it was offensivive.

to others, they fefelt sorry fo him simplplybecause it was cle, was crystal clear to us that he had been exploited. you ve to remember that this is a guy that was c chi prodigy. he was a star from t the time was 5 yeyes of age, a megastata and he transcended so mny things that it got to the point where he was living in a bube. he neverad thereedom to go ouout,ararty have a goooo time,o to the movies, thihigsgs o this nature. s brother, malolo said h had to wear a disisguis metimes whwhene e we out in ublic. wh y y have that kind of life from theage of 5 5 on,ou know that this man has been exploited. hehe wasevev allowed too b child, which h is w it was ffffict for him to lett go o of his cchihohood and as a r rulult of thth, you'e looking at ottr r pele and saying they eloited him.. it's not t that t tis guy was bd gu it's not thatt he wa evil,l, h was eloloed and he w was ver gigin n thchance to grow u up io manhood. >> and thiseetwk last ght reran the old martin basash cucumeary about michaeae jackcksowhwhh included details of his chihildodod that i hadad forgotten which arar reallyucuc mo d dficult than ihaha remembered. and i think veryry e elanatory

ee wayhis life occurred in ter years. >> well, i wl say this. thth isn't the d to gett into all of ththa but iilill say, you sesee y joe jackson,the father, snsn'tront and center whennll of thahaststuff was going >> exactly. >> i'll leavevet at aat. >> exaxact.. ththanyoyou,tephen a. ith. >> next, it b bee ausus day in popolics. when w wcocome back, we'll he e the laate o o sarah palin. r r ow drea mitchellgogo an interview withpapal. shshll join us next fomom asaska you're watatchgg "hardball" onl on msnbc. fincial advice you need? where will you find e e stility and resources to keep you aheaead of thihi rapidly evolving world?? where will you find these e ugh questions.ces that's whwhwe broht together two of the mo powerful nam in the industry. intrtring morgan stanley itith baey. here to rethink wealth magent. here to answer... your qions. morgan stanlnley smiththarn. a new w wealth management firm with over 130 years ofxperience.

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anont cfidedence ininin o. caususususlendnds s ve a a a t tcks. ququq n . welclcombabacko "h"haralal" alkaka gernor sarah palin plans toesign in just 19 days.s. so what t ppppenafter that?

nbc's andrea mitchehe tried to get some anerers om the gornor herself today.. sheoins us from ananhohora, asas alaska. 'r'ralso joinin b by politico's chief columnistt r rog simon. here's governor pin tking about hohow ininjohn mccain's runnining tete changed thingsgsi alaska. les listen. i i kw that iasast going to run fofo re-electctio i ew thateveverhing changed onugugus 29th inn pititicin alaska. that's the day that t i s s taed to r runororice president of the united states. things changed. d it was quite obvbviothat nonothg would ever b bthe same forurur administration. >> reporter:rere y sorry now you said yes tooohn mccainin on augugust99th? >> not inin the leastst. absolululyly n. w w a greatononor stand by a trtruememecan hero. believe in john mccainin. i appreciaia h him i honor him. and i would have done all that again in a heartbeat. >> andrea mitchell,, athth azing iierview. anand soundsrerett coconvcici.

i'd haveve t agree with her.r. everything certainly did change thdada john mccain chose her too be vp. > rorter: you know, think that i is ueue i think ththat the democrats who had worked with her herere in anchororagbebere that viewed her asas t attackk dog omom the campaign, whicich t t role th she aad, and were no longerr wiwillg to work cooperatively. the republblanansad always been her e eneeses here. you saw t thetatement from lisa muowowi criticizing her r fo quittiti i in e middle of the term.. and even some p pal supporteters as i pointeded out toer during the interervi i in wasilla wher we were for r a upup of days weelling us eyey felt sh should have stucucitit out. but t shfefelt she had done w w she w waeded to ,, and loloo sh s a much der landscape,e, a much w wid terrrrainn now. shshean make aotot of money. sh doesn't havav t the hassles nning the governmenen and she knows she do n notant totoee governor of alka. shshe s really not h hap inhhis job whwh s she came backck. >> you knowow the l lson inn th deotape we're watchchinririt now, r runngng f f politician,

not try to hideououtrom a area mitctcllll. she'll find you u no matter wha u'u' doing. rorogesisimo where do you thihi she goes from heher >> i think she gogo pretty much anyplalacece s wantsts. i think ifif s wants a a politil futurere, s shewants toun in 2012, , shhahas real shotot at. lo, she's populalaririgh now. i rally believe -- hesesy beefef, thererepuicans were mimiting a p prededentl candidate today, sarah palili would be it. i mean, you know, lolookt t th list. m papalenty, bobby jindal, hailey baouou mike huabab, mitt romney, ll fine menen who might build poporfrful political campaigns, but sarahah pinin is popular right w.w. how pupula she can dodo a intetervw w wi andrdreaitchell wearining wader and make itook reaal. she is not a cookikicucutt candidate. shee looks real. shshe unds real. i t thi that's appepeining. >> ckcky for p pawnty and romney and thohose guys, they'r not picking the nomimineee todo and they'v've got treimer totrt to distinguish ththselves.

heherendrea asking governoror pan about running for esident. lelet'lilist to that one. c canou imagine yourself running for president? i don't know what theheututur holds. can't predict what the nextt fish run's's gngng to lo like much l les w whas going to happn in a a cplplof years. t t my focuss on m my statement still, and it a alys willll be.. >> reporter: s se e pele have said that you saw the bright lightstsrorom the n naonal mpmpgn and cameback,anand it wawas ryryard to readjusus to te nitty grittyty wk k -- > t nitty grittyty l lik you mean the fish s sli a a theiirt under thefingernails and stutuf thatat me? >> reporter: jeaeau,thth state capitol, the hard legislativive slog. >> no, that's not t -- a aa fighter.r. i i thve on challenge.. that is a challenge.e. >> nono dda, wee got a hot new g galpp poll from mondayy nighght. it fininds that overall, 43% sa they'd v votfofo sarah p pinino presidenent she ran for prididt, or theyy m mig vote for her if s sheanan for prprididen % say no, they wowoulnono vote

for her forpresident. onong repububcacans roger ssim, 72% % sa they would vote fo palin. sohahat s suprtrt if she e weth nomination today. andrea, what is s yo bet, if o think you u ntnt u to allas and unund woman who o quitting potiticsr someone who i plananni h h political future? >>epepter: i think i i found meone who is frustrated withh ththolitical situation herer on the ground a and ses a broader political future, but also a different career thth the oo wiwith youknow, paid speeches. she can make aoot of money. she can have auu nicer lilif i i thk k e wtststo be an influence inin s speining for sl coconsvavatis, and she does have a lot of spopo as this poll incacas. and as r rog h has saidid think she hasamamag herself wiwi partrtyleaders,ncludingomome heher n mostervent supporters s and fund-raisers. i think that roger, i know that u wrote inouour column on popolicoco tt,ouou knoow, the

tataishment figures might t no haveiked her statemementeeuse it camameroromhe haefrt because ititwasn't programmed. it wasn'n't neneby, youknow, party straratestst but there was a r rmbmbli quality to it. and, in fact, , sh has to thk mo c carly about theeisissu and b abable t express herself. shshe tt through the debate wl, i thohoug,, with joe bidenen, t she still proved rsrsf lacking, i think,, o othth nationonaltata in terms of articulating i issss tt wentnt beyondnd slogans. that's whereii think her itics, at least w wod say she has a l more hard wo to do if she wtsts totoe e a national candidate. > now, one t the hot rumomr hott possibilities about her i th she might gonto the talk show businesess. let's listst t to drdr asking vernor palin aboututhehe possibility of a a tk k ow. > y startedutut in television a long time ago. can you sesee y youelf doing a ta show? cocoulyou reach rere pple that way? would that be fun? >> i don't know,ain, what thehe future would hohold i ow that i i certaiainl don't need any k kd d of aiie or high position to effeceche change that needsdsoo b effected d our

natitionndndhat has to happen rit t w is we n nee too r rin i government -- obamaass growingn govevernntnt. it's the lasasththinthat we need toto dririt now. >> roroge se's saying she esesn'need any kind of tle. ybe just a tatalkhow w wou do when you listen to that answer. atat dyou think? >> youknow, i g to sayay, ththin ananda's correct in thah gogornrnoralin h h to bebeco more polished and momore you know, up speed on so ings. but t okok a that exchahang rig there. she went from t question autut doing a tata sw to tatackg big govevemement i mean, she's s gososo skills thther yoknknw. and d thihink it was just ne ntnt ago that sarah h lilingave a dastrous i itetervw to katiee couric. anyou figure she's goingtoto hide out fromom n nwork itervies fofoththe st of herlife. noshshe' out ththe.e. e'e'giving itetervws to aneaea she's giviving inttviview you know, s s is quittining h h job b as governor ofof alaska. d d i thinkk andndreis absolutey right, s sates being g gornrn of a alkaka right now. t t don't think she's a a quitter.

i i ink she's willining tootata upup, u know,, and take al ththat towow at her, andnd mayb she will find t as she go around thehe country g givg speecheseshahat politicians over , they get spt away the roar ofof t c cwd. and mamaybththatill convince governor p pal t too o ck into popolicacal fe by 2012. >> well, shehe cldld try tohihi out, but onceendrea mitctcllll was onon ttt plane to alaska, there was no way. thank you, andrea mitchel and roger simon. u upp next,alal f fraenen i senator alfrfrann.n. whatanan presesidt obama geget doneneitith 60democrats in the senate that he didn't have before?? this is "hardball" onlyonon msc.

coming uup, p psident obama and bill clinton both talking about michael jackson today. "hardball" returns a after thihi with a advil pm she's spdings time... lyinawake with aches and pains... he should switch to advil pm.

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and d th y youre well and fafahfully discharged thee duty of the oicice upon whichh y are ababoutotonter so help you god.. >> i . >> congrgrulions, senator. >>haha you. >> we'rere bkk with the p polic fix wthth t g geveve who is thee assistantt m maning eitor for popolicond david cocorn who is ee waington bureauhihief for mother nes. tim green, i i'v seen an awful lot of senate sweweining-s but ththg as extraordinary ass wtt we witneneededtoday. is is, i thnknk,he most anticipated d raininof the r rig hand in mamany,any yearss in th ited states senate.e. so al frankenasas his first day infffficbehind him. anany rprises?

yeyeh,h, one bigig ssurise. his fifit t vo out for all t ti talklk o 60 d demratic votes hihi first vote o out f all of the talks of60ememocticototes in the nne, al fnken ves againsnst rara obama on his very first votete. >> what was thatat ve?e? what was t t item? >> it was vovote--the o oamama admiminiraraon wanted to deduct some of f thfufundg to prevent buses fromom suffering terroror attacks, and a number of democrats votetegainst it, includingg al franken. >et's listen what senator franken n to t the assococteted press, quote, h said,, i thihin they'll get t to used t t idea atat i a senator, that've kikind of chahaededcacares.s. ii st don't think itill take that long. they'll see what i do andwhwhati say. mamaly, i'm going tooutut my hed down and get to work. david co,, first vovo against e obama mmistration. that's p ptttty clearsisial on y oo,hat this isn't the g g whaa lot o peopleere pecting was showing . . >> it's a claration of independence, but t ii tink by d lae, like most ddocrats, most liberal,rogressive democrats,

hel tend too vote with the obama administrationon. so i d't thinkee'r goioing to see him becomiming a maverick a rebel. at he w saying in that statement e. stememen too, is that he doesn't need any more of t the spotlight righght now. he's had it i in a way f for eg monthsuring this recount. he's had itfofor years onsnsn anand her acaces. and ii think he needs, youknow, toto do the hard, heavyifting. u u kn, larry,y, u knowow,e worked in the satat therrudry that comemewiwith being a good llisislar, particicullyly wn you'rehe junior sesenar r fr a state. the senate is alub and ththey expect you to sort o of be see anand tt be -- n be heheardd to much, and al frankenis a guy with a real strongt. c c easily wawalko o t middle of the stagend commandd atatteion, but he's shown a l l ofisisciine in the campaign i in the years up to the campaign, and how -- andn playing byy the rules, i think h hewill be doin

a lototof that in thee comining montnt ahead.. we may not seeee a a lot o o hi >> i tkeked to al franken before and after thelection aboutut what senate c coittees he w waed to bee assigned t t because in e rere work of the ssene, that's where it reallylyets do.. ananitit's also myfafavote qutiti foror novice seetete ndidates, because usually they don't have a an answer. al had answersrsllll the way througug let's take a look atat t mmittee assigngnntntse got, prpret m mucwhat he wanted. the two bigones,ththe committees, asashehey ll it, the judiciary commimieeee and t healththmmittee. atat'she health committee aired by ted kennedy.. anhehe won't bee able to v vot thheheth committee e onhehe maup that they're doing o o the billll ty'y'veeen workingg on beusus he hasn't beennart of working onhahatbil,l, but he's also goingtotoe on iiaian affairs which is a commit yes he wanted because m minsosotaas a lott indian reservatatio a and the agingg committetee. his dbuteally hppppen naonally next week when hee wi have a a chair i inhehe judiciary cocoititte hearings fr the suprpremcocour nominationf ninia tomayor. hehe g goi to be o o o ofhe rare

members of the judiciary committee who o isotot alawyer. i think t the'e' one oheheright now. so hee ll be up against some e other judicial scholarars t t commititteanand certatalyly a judicicialchchar sitting in front of him a wiwitn and al w wilbebe sitting t trer without a law scolol education. tim, how do youu e expct him to hahand that? >> i expect h hto be very soerer a well pprered. look, we've a alleen hatchinin out this s sam story foror at lt twoo yearsnow. wiwi al franken b be the crazy comedidi o or ll he be aererio caidate, sioio senatoror? that sty's been wititn a ousand times,nd at evevery tuturnn this campaign and e eer turnrn ithth appeals process, he been, you knkno would bebe senator seseris. anand think that's what weeill e e wh he shows uporor the mmittee hearings. >>e will betam with tim grieve a a d dav corrn. for more of f th p polics fix,x, you're watching "harardbl,l,only on msnsnbc where it's weak. whwherit's vulnerable. ♪ tylenol arthrititiwowork with your r body to blo t the pn, withouout inteering

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you know what i i do belve is thahat black sports figures d ack enrtainers helped to create a comfort lel with african-americans thatat hadan impact histotocally, datingg bk toeople likeke sidney poitieieor uis armstrong up to michl jacksoson. so i would say he'e's a part of long lin oflack tertainers that h a powerful impact on the culture. >>hat was president obamama in an interview th nbc's chk

totodd in moscocow toy talkikin about michael jackson.n. we'r'rback wh politi's tim grieve a motherjones' davi corn foror more of the p pitics fi david cornrn, that smed like ofessor obama trying t caliate exactly how m much cred toit give michl jackson and not give him toouch c cdit at ththe expense ofof other afririn-ameran culturall icoons. what d d you me of it? >> lilisten, micha jackson remains controvoversial despite all of the aolades thate receiviv toy. i don't thihinkarack obama wants to go too far in praisininhim. but i also thinink historicicale has it rig. my list would i iludeaul robeberson, ttle richard,d,the suemes, harry belbelafontnt jim hendrix. he's's one oa long line andd we heard a lot of hyperbole in t last fewew ys how heroke a lot of barriers. he was part of a ng team o o enentertairs that broke a sies of different bararriers. >> and here'shat's bill

clinton told the associated presabout mhael jackson. quote, he basically helped save myarty f from terrle financial distress, so he was very kind to me p personay. he was a an immensely gifted ma and i ink he basically meantt well. know about all of thee trouble he had i ihis life d i hopepe he ll be membered as his coribution as an artrtist. i hopope his children t tn o ll. that w would be e greatest trute you could have. tim grieve, we have bi clinton weigng in now. we have barack obamama. has this sto gone ababout as far asas it cann terms of penetratating the litical culture? will it quiedown nn? >> no, in fact, i dodon't thi it will. we have this house resotion from sheila jacks lee coming. a lot of conseseative democrats are not going to beeappy about having to choose between -- between joinining thee cocongressnal black caucus and supporting this anandtaying true to their own morere conservave districts, where rt of the dark side ofichael jackson is the side p people ar thinking g, the child moltation chaharges and those sortsof things. >> thank you, ti