. right now on msnbc, a budget busting roadblock. the president's health care bill may cost more than expected. will that kill the historic reform effort this year? more on that. republicans promise a speedy vote on judicial supreme court nominee sonia sotomayor. president obama delivers a tough mess aage to the naacp. now in the bake wake of sarah palin and ensign, are more stars

set to emerge. wr we have a power packed lineup. new jersey senator robert menendez and chargely gonzalez and linda douglas at the white house and "the new york times" reporter mark leebivitch. a bombing in jakarta hotels killing nine. blast happened at two u.s.-based hotel at marriott and ritz-carlton. so far the state department is confirming several american citizens are among the hurt. >> it sounded like the earthquake that we had about a year or two ago that was at about 7 on the scale and then within about five minutes afterwards, there was just a very, very loud noise and i looked up and there was white smoke and i left. >> horrific. pope benedict xvi is in a hospital in northern italy after

falling during his vacation in the alps. a hospital spokesman says the pope is undergoing surgery for a wrist fracture. three more american soldiers are dead, unfortunately, killed in southern iraq. mortar rounds were fired into a military base outside of basra, iraq's second largest city. i want to introduce my guest co-host. you know i offer a spectacular person to join me for most of the show. today i'm pleased to have angela burt-murray of "essence" magazine. you brought us good luck the last time you were here. a lot of people watched the show. i understand last night you were at a dinner with president obama when he spoke to the naacp. >> yes, the naacp centennial dinner last night. the president came. the ballroom was full of enthusiasm for his remarks but he gave a little tough love to the crowd and talked about personal responsibility and finding common ground and the things that everyone can do to help close the achievement gap

for black and brown students. >> interesting. i heard a friend of mine this morning say i feel like when the president speaks to african-american audience, tough love. >> everybody was very open to his remarks. it is a familiar theme, though, he struck both on the campaign trail and early in the administration. so, you know, he talked about parents needs to turn off the x-box and read to your children and be involved in hork and things like that. if you have heard it before the numbers are telling us black and brown children are still falling behind and if they don't succeed, american doesn't succeed. >> did he either in his speech or in any other conversation, was he pressed at all about additional policy prescriptions either on the education front or, frankly, on the job front where "the new york times" is reporting african-american unemployment is at depression levels? and not at recession levels? >> on the flight down on air force one he had seven

african-american reporters on the plane with him. they had a chance to probe some of those specific issues that african-americans are certainly concerned about and most of the answers that they got were the prescriptions that say, what we do for the economy overall will impact the african-american community. he talked about stimulating the economy. he talked about passing the health care legislation which will help african-americans but less likely to have coverage. >> i'd be interested to see the next four years, potentially the next eight years whether he is able to continue to speak in that way not just african-americans but others demand a more specific set of conversations. >> right. >> we'll see. we want to move on for the moment to our first daily brief. developing news in the massive health care plan that the president wants. the nonpartisan congressional office referred to as the cbo would increase not cut the

federal spending on health care. joining us to talk about that is linda douglas, commune kaigs director for health care reform. good to see you again. >> thanks for having me. >> you heard the congressional budget office weigh in and say that this plan is going to potentially hurt the economy and cost more. we know that in 1994 when the then cbo weighed in, that was some of the things people believe helped kill health care reform at that point. how will the white house respond? will there be new measures that you guys will propose and sign? >> first of all, what the congressional budget office was talking about was a couple of bills, one of which is in the senate and has absolutely no jurisdiction over public health care spending, medicare and medicaid, which is clearly one of the driving forces behind the rising cost of health care. one of the bills he was talking about doesn't have the capacity to cut costs. it has to be put together with another senate bill, sort of complicated washington talk. in terms of the bill --

>> linda, i got to interrupt you for just a moment. you and i know even if you add in the medicare and medicaid coverage, the idea that the white house and the federal government will have the ability to negotiate for better drug prices, most analysts still believe that won't cut costs or at least hold the rise in health care to inflation. still a substantive point, even if you add in the ability the federal government perhaps to negotiate better drug prices. >> well, first of all, there is substantial savings already laid out in the house of representatives' bill that is going through three committees right now. let me be clear here. the president is committed to lowering health care costs for all american families and businesses and for putting this country on a fiscally sustainable path toward lowering health care costs which is crushing families and businesses and stifling growth in the economy and crushing our government as well. he is absolutely committed to that. he has made it very clear there are substantial savings already in the house bill that the

president himself, as you know, the budget director has made a couple of suggestions to the hourmts, said that he is open to the idea of a commission that would determine how the rates of payments and certain procedures in the public health care system are going to be paid. that's a very important idea that the president put on a table in a letter that he sent to the congress, you know, several weeks ago. all kinds of proposals already that we are pursuing stressing prevention which will prevent you from getting sick in the first place. computerized medical records which, clearly, are going to be able to cut down costs by making health care more efficient. bundling payments. will you pay for the entire disease, rather than every single procedure at a time? all of these ideas are being included. this will, eventually, not only lower the rising rate of health care costs, but lower health costs for families and businesses. >> linda, i want to bring in angela bert-murray who has a

question. >> linda, we know this is the president's number one domestic policy issue but we also know it's a major pocketbook issue for americans and they want to see change and see it now. the president has said that he wants to see movement before congress breaks for recess. is that realistic? are we going to see something happen and will it happen quickly is? >> that is absolutely what the president wants. he has made it very clear. look. these are tough decisions. health care is the most personal issue for every american. we are closer right now than we have ever been in the last several decades to bringing in the kind of health care that is going to lower costs and expand coverage for americans who feel so insecure about the availability of affordable health care. he wants them to -- both houses -- pass a bill off the floor of each of their houses so the american people can finally get some relief. they've been waiting for 16 years for the government to act and they really don't want to wait any more. >> linda, we've got to go. but final question to you. do you think we will see any further concessions from the

pharmaceutical industry, major concessions north of $50 billion on top of what has been put on the table already? >> what the pharmaceutical industry did in its 80 billion agreement was first of all, lower the cost of health care for seniors who are paying an extraordinary amount for prescription drugs in a certain part of the prescription drug -- >> only because we only have 30 seconds here, but is that a yes or no? do you think we'll see more on top of the 80 billion or no? >> well, all of these bills as you know are working their way through the committee but the 80 billion commitment that the pharmaceutical industry has made lowering costs and expanding coverage is very, very significant. >> linda, thank you. >> thank you. now to judge sonia sotomayor confirmation hearings. after four days of questioning and witness testimony is over. we may not have a full senate vote until august. joining me to talk about this from capitol hill is charlie gonzalez of texas and former judge, if i may say so. good to see you, congressman

gonzalez. >> oh, thank you. >> congressman, gonzalez, how did you view the hearings? is there any doubt that sonia sotomayor will not only get confirmed, but confirmed with a meaningful number of republicans? >> no doubt. you know, my prediction is you're going to be at 75 votes or more. at least that's what i'm hoping. but i thought it was a very positive experience for everyone and that the judge proved beyond anyone's doubt that she's qualified. >> congressman gonzalez, were there any additional issues in these hearings that did not come up that you wish we had spent more time on, whether that's questions of election law, particularly as we head into a census and as we come out having had major questions about our election system over the last several elections? >> well, many things i would love to have asked or had the senators ask but the truth is she would not have been able to respond, carlos. and it is true, a reason we have separation of powers in the

independent judiciary and someone that is being nominated cannot go and tell and guarantee how they're going to vote or decide a case. you can't do that. and that goes contrary to the very fabric of the whole principle of separation of powers in the independent branches of government. so as much as i would have liked to have seen other topics, it really would not have been answered. >> congressman, i switch you to another subject. i feel like i'm seeing the same thing happen again and again. which is you guys in the house move quickly on any of a number of issues, whether it's the stimulus, whether it's education spending, health care issues, and how to pay for it. and your friends over there in the senate, the more deliberative body, much like the founders talk about seem to move more slowly. even though you guys have 60 democratic votes. are we on the edge of some kind of internal brawl among democrats with those in the house saying that those in the senate are being too slow and aren't being responsive to last year's election which was all

about change, after all? >> i think it was meant to be that way. i think our founding fathers recognize that. the most important thing is we run every two years. we're very close to the people. we represent a smaller section of the population than someone who represents an entire state so we do move a little bit quicker. it is the senate's job to slow the process down reasonably and to look at the product that we produce and we're going to reconcile both of these bills. but i do believe it's imperative for the house to move and move quickly, because we're able to do that with our structure and our rules that really don't allow for tactics such as in the senate where you can have -- you have to have 60 individuals just to get the vote on the floor of the senate. we don't do that. so many things, obviously, will accommodate a much quicker process in the house and we need to get it out. it's not so say we're not going to be thorough in the committees because we are, as we speak, considering many different provisions of the bill. >> congressman gonzalez, i want to bring in my guest co-host

today with a question. >> representative gonzalez, cone yeah sotomayor handled the confirmation hearings masterfully and gave the republicans no openings to be able to bash her but critics said that was the real sonia sotomayor. how different could we expect to see a supreme court justice sonia sotomayor on the bench versus what we saw during the hearings? >> you know, i go back to what i say. all you can do is base your vote on the qualifications of the individual. they're not going to tell you about their entire demeanor when they get up there. they're not going to tell you how they're going to vote on a specific case, so it's really hard to tell. but i know her background and her reputation. i have met her in the past and i think she is an incredible asset to the united states supreme court. and it's not solely based because she is a latina. that is personal pride and that is fine but based on qualifications, which i think the entire united states should rejoice that we have someone like judge sotomayor, assuming

that incredible responsibility on the supreme court. >> congressman gonzalez, we have to go. but i've got to ask you whether or not your spurs are going to make a comeback this year down in san antonio. any good news on the horizon for those guys? >> we're coming back, as we say, wait till next year. well, it's here. we're going to do great. >> we'll see what happens. congressman gonzalez, good to have you. >> thank you. >> no meltdowns yet for supreme court nominee sonia sotomayor. while it looks like her confirmation is a done deal, republicans are firing off new warning shots what to expect the next time around. beyond sarah palin. are there new gop rising stars or does the gop party still rest with sarah palin? babe buchanan is next. why the second says he doesn't need nor jets. that topic is coming up next. you're watching msnbc live.

i'm carlos watson. ♪ on this endless ocean

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i'm carlos watson. judge sonia sotomayor has had her day before the senate. let's bring in bay buchanan, republican strategist and president of the american cause and back with me is angela bert-murray. bay, i want to turn to you. did republicans score any points or was that unrealistic to begin with? they only have 40 votes in the senate and the best they could do was not let her have a free pass? >> the key here, carlos, is we always knew she would be confirmed. we don't have the numbers as you pointed out. but that we needed to raise some important issues so we could establish what does obama and

his democratic friends stand for? and we did that through sotomayor. they clearly stand for race-based justice for affirmative action. her whole life was dedicated to demanding special privileges and special preferences based on jex sex and gender. we established that. by doing so, we let people know we don't stand for that. we are against that. we know that is harmful for white americans and we believe equal justice under the law for all and i think we scored quite a bit on that. >> but, bay, hold on a second. you know there was an analysis of all of her decisions on any race-based cases by thomas goldstein at the skotas project and showed only a handful of cases did she rule for. and some 90 majority she ruled against. in those cases. when you say she has always been aggressive advocate on behalf of race-based justice, what evidence is there of that? >> clearly, all that she did --

you know, she was vocal at princeton and yale and went on in speeches publicly. her voice out there was very clear, time and again, saying, you know, wise latino woman is a better judge than a white male. this is her philosophy. this is her public persona is. then of course, the famous frank ricci case confirmed she wasn't interested in looking what happened and the results is what she was content with. we're hopeful on the supreme court she will go back to what the constitution calls for and that is equal justice for all. but it's clear that she has a pattern that she is a proponent, a quota queen, if you like. >> bay, i got to stop you. at this point you're throwing around words. again, the analysis i've seen, unless you have different analysis, says 9 times out of 10 she has voted against plaintiffs in any race-based case and when you mention her at princeton where she came in number two in

her class and the story about her there at princeton she was always in the library, the girl from the bronx always studying and at yale editor of the law journal and always in the library. she wasn't that person who was marching down main street banging on walls. so i mean when you throw these words around they sound like talking points and not analysis of her actual record. >> no, carlos. she was very adamant when she got into yale, that she start opening up the doors based on sex and gender, that they have special preferences. she's very clear about and she was involved and an activist in college and graduate school years. in addition, it's not just frank ricci. that's a huge case. the fact she just dismissed it without even addressing a very important issue that distort fortunately cleaned up for her. that there is also other cases. how about when the people in new york, she said that new york -- the state of new york had violated the rights that felons should be able to vote because,

otherwise, it violated -- it was unfair because so many minorities were taken away the right to vote, as if there was discrimination because the minorities were overly hurt by this decision that they couldn't vote. clearly, again, it's all based on race or on gender, not on what is equal justice under the law. and, carlos, as a result, white men pay the price. >> the last point you bring up there, as a lawyer, myself, there's a fairly bedrock principle called disproportionate impact which often the court looks out when they are meeting out to make sure there is equal protection under the law. >> absolutely. >> i think you're skimming over that when you pointed that out. we only have a minute. i want to leave sotomayor for a moment. >> all righty. >> ask you about the gop's future going forward. now, we've seen some tough times with john ensign and tough times with mark sanford and even sarah palin, things probably haven't worked out exactly the way she would have wanted given the recent polls that say even republicans have soured on her

decision to quit. who are the rising stars? where do you look at? you've been aligned with a number of republican insurgents over the years, including managing your brother's presidential campaigns. who do you look for as the rising stars going forward in the gop? >> i think the strong front-runner right now is mitt romney. he did very well in the last campaign and is prepared, i believe, to run again. in addition to that, next year, you got a lot of governors out there. races are very interesting. we could have some new faces rise. you have haley barbour down there in mississippi. he has done a fine job. maybe looking at it. there are people around the country that we know that maybe nationally aren't looking at but that have some possibility that they might step into this race. we're a long way away. i think we'll have plenty of leaders out there from which to choose. >> bay, i want to bring in angela who has a question. >> bay, good to hear you're looking at new stars to come into the conversation. but what are the party's plan to

unify itself around one message and to be able to speak effectively against a incredibly strong president? >> your question is a good one, how do we unify. the key issue today without question and one i believe is in our favor is the economy. the kind of outrageous, uncontrollable and unsustainable is the word that congressional budget office is using. spending by this administration. we will come back around the issue of smaller government and i believe that's what is going to inspire many, many people to get into the race and thousands and thousands of americans to start looking again at republican candidates. you see right now that the poll numbers are very poor, are dropping, i should say. they are still solid, but dropping with independents. for obama. that is where we will reach out and gain great momentum and i think do very well next year. >> bay, thanks for joining us and have a terrific weekend. >> thank you. >> after years of relative calm, deadly violence strikes in the heart of the world's no populous

muslim country. michael jackson's kids. developing news who could get them and control of the jackson fortune. a surprise twist there and new information. we have that coming up. you're watching msnbc live. i'm carlos watson. denise! you've lost weight! it's just all these giant things make me look small. i eat this fiber one yogurt. (mr. mehta) it has five grams of fiber, zero fat, and fifty calories. please, this is too creamy and delicious. it's true, only fifty calories. (announcer) fiber one yogurt. to stand behind all who serve. ♪ to deliver the technologies... vital to freedom. ♪ to help carry hope to those in need. ♪ around the globe, the people of boeing... are working together -- for what matters most. that's why we're here.

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to schedule your free hearing test or for a free information kit with complete details about hearing loss and how we can help you. call 1-800-336-4990 to take one of these easy steps toward better hearing. that's 1-800-336-4990 call now! . welcome back to msnbc live. i'm carlos watson. breaking news this moment. 50 injured in a hotel blast in jakarta, indonesia. authorities shay members checked into the hotel and set off near simultaneous plogs. ian, my understanding no group has claimed responsibility yet but suspicions. is that correct? >> that's right. no one has claimed responsibility yet, but suspicion has fallen on the

jemaah islamiyah. you will recall the bali bombing in 2002. 200 plus people died in that. a marriott bombing and australian bombing back then and a string of bombings. j.i. has splintered but it still seems to be dangerous. part of its hallmark were high profile suicide attacks. very much like what we've seen today. one american official described today's bombings as thech vech in your as very much in your face and that has been a style of j.i. although they've taken knocks over recent years, suspicion will fall on them. >> ian, any concern that there could be another short-term bombing there in jakarta or elsewhere in indonesia. >> i think people will be on high alert. this is the first bombing we've seen of this scale in four years. indonesia really felt it had put

this kind of thing behind it. between a very effective campaign, a crackdown against militants jihadi extremists here. they've been praised by the u.s. for their efforts and there was really a feeling here that they had turned that corner, that they put this sort of grisly incident behind them. the fact this has happened again has shaken people here and, clearly, they will be looking out very carefully, they will be very cautious for what may happen in the days and weeks ahead, carlos. >> ian williams, be safe as we head out, i want to read this note from the president of indonesia. jakarta has to crack down on poisonous clerics that are still active in indonesia. strong words from the president in indonesia, where eight people dead and 50 injured in a bomb blast at a marriott and ritz-carlton hotel. for more on the topics we're discussing check out carloswas

the. the most advanced fighter jets in the world. how the white house is using the words of defense secretary robert gates to make their case against the world's most advanced fighter. plus will rewriting the health care system break the bank? more on that straight ahead. you're watching msnbc live. i'm carlos watson. if you're taking 8 extra-strength tylenol... a day on the days that you have arthritis pain, you could end up taking 4 times the number...

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billion dollar profit and citigroup, yes, citigroup, is reporting a $3 billion profit. today a funeral for the florida couple known for adopting special needs children. byrd and milne billings were killed in a carefully planned home invasion robbery. eight people under arrest in connection with their murders. breaking news right now. we just heard from the family of the murdered family in florida. they held a press conference as they get ready for the funeral for billings family. let's listen in briefly. >> as mr. spencer said, i'm ed brock, i'm melanie's brother. today is not the day to focus on the vicious crimes that have been inflicted on our family and upon this community. today is the day to celebrate byrd and melanie's lives and a day to remember their laughter, their selflessness and their enduring spirit. today is the day to challenge

ourselves to embrace the differences among us and to find the kindness in our hearts. by example, bud and melanie taught us to overlook disability, to be colorblind, to be patient with others, and to give of ourselves. their lives centered around children, their family, and each other. they loved deeply and unconditionally. they embraced the complexity of raising children with special needs and they were their advocates. they gave these children a joyous childhood and a much-needed voice. their lives were cut way too short. but their legacy will live on. as albert einstein said, our death is not an end if we can live on in our children. bud and melanie will live on in our hearts forever. thank you. >> thank you. and thank you for respecting the family's privacy. >> painful story. byrd and melanie billings,

again, killed and eight people under arrest there in florida. secretary of defense says he is not moved from a hawk to a dove but doesn't need any more of the advanced fighter jets in the world but some in congress think they know better than the secretary of defense and insisting the defense department pony up billions to buy them. now the white house is threatening to veto if congress forces the issue. nbc's pentagon kort is jim miklaszewski. what is going on? i know secretary of defense gates said yesterday in chicago, if we can't defend this nation with a half a trillion dollar budget we need to get out of this business. we got far bigger problems. >> you know, these battles between the pentagon and congress have been going on for years. this one, however, is pretty much reaching epic proportion at this time. i think it's important for our viewers to understand. this is not congress cutting funds or denying money to the pentagon. this is congress forcing money

on the pentagon to buy a weapons system that the pentagon says they don't need any more of. and it's the most advanced stealth fighter jet, the f-22. gates says we have enough of those at 187, but congress has put another 1.75 billion dollars into the budget to buy seven more of those. this is where gates and even the white house have drawn the line, carlos. president obama has already told congress that if that money is in the budget for those seven additional f-22 fighter jets, that he threatens to veto the bill. we'll see. a vote is expected next week. >> mick, where in the world are all of the republicans who are banging the drum and telling us that they're worried about the deficit and worried about spending too much on health care, where in the world are all of those folks not banging the drum here and saying, why in the world when the defense secretary, who served in republican and democratic administrations, is saying we already have enough money, stop

throwing away our money on this thing, where are the republicans on this? >> well, herein lies the rub. that military industrial complex that president eisenhower warned about some 40 years ago has cooked the books in some sense, in that this one weapons program, some of the parts, some of the suppliers, are spread out over 44 states. so if you cut that budget, that could mean a loss of jobs in 44 states. that's an awful lot of senators and representatives who may be reluctant to vote against additional money for that project. and that is exactly the way the so-called military industrial complex has designed a lot of these weapon systems, to spread the wealth, if not the pain eventually, if the money is cut. >> mick, i want you to come back next week. i want to name names. i want us take to you about this seriously. all of those republicans who we've seen speak out against the

deficit, i want to talk next week about those very same people who are encouraging us to buy more jets and we already have 187 of at 43 million a pop. i want to see where the consistency is. have a great weekend and see you next week. >> all right, carlos. senator ted kennedy's health is affecting the fight. a reporter with "the new york times" is with us and i'm joined again by angela bert-maury. good to see you, mark. >> hi, carlos. >> you write that ted kennedy, no one has worked harder on health care the last 40 years. he got close in the early '70s to a transformative health care bill with the nixon administration but there are differing opinions but, fundamentally, the deal didn't happen. you are saying if he wasn't as sick as he was we might be closer to a bill or might be done some what are you saying? >> well, i think a lot of people on capitol hill have said that. i mean, ted kennedy has become certainly an inspirational figure through his absence to a

lot of the democrats. i mean, his name is invoked left and right as let's do it for teddy. you know, on the flip side, a lot of republicans are sort of using him as almost -- using his absence as almost a weapon against the democrats saying if teddy kennedy were here this would be a much less party bill than it is. we have reached middle ground in the past and we don't have any of that now. so, you know, in a sense even though he hasn't been here, he is up in cape cod where he is, you know, obviously, battling brain cancer, you know, he's a very poverl looming presence over this debate. >> mark, i want to bring in angela who is following this conversation. >> mark, we talked to linda douglas from the white house earlier in the program and she said that, obviously, this is the president's number one domestic policy initiative that he wants to push through. americans are certainly waiting for something to happen and need it to happen. congress is getting ready for recess. how realistic is it that we're going to get this done before the recess?

>> oh, boy. depends on who you talk to. i mean, i would say less so by the day. i mean, that's the sense i get from talking to people, certainly on the hill. you know, i think the white house has pushed, obviously, a time urgency on this, although they've been somewhat quiet on what exactly it is they want. i mean, they have been talking on the bills that are floating out there or might be floating out there soon. and i think, you know, realistically, i mean, getting to early august is a really, really tough haul at this point, especially given the moving parts on the various committees. i would say certainly not a lot of optimism on the hill right now but you never know. >> mark, is there a gipper moment here or a brady moment here, i should say? we know in the '90s when president clinton wanted to get the brady handgun control bill passed, former press secretary brady was brought in and helped get a final few crucial votes. is there that kind of role for

ted kennedy here to break the log jam for him to come down to d.c.? >> you know, that is something people are talking quietly about. i mean, they are, obviously, not close now. but chris dodd himself said, yesterday, that if ted kennedy had to crawl through broken glass to get here to cast a deciding vote on health care, i mean, they would figure out a way to get him down here. i mean, it's certainly something in the back of everyone's mind but, right now, they are not close enough to actually have that conversation in a realistic sense. >> mark, great piece in the sunday "the new york times" magazine on the role that ted kennedy could have played and that many wish he was playing on the health care bill that's before congress right now. have a great weekend. >> thanks, carlos. >> up next, with the republicans promising a quick vote, sonia sotomayor is moving closer to be the nation's first hispanic justice. we talk about that more on msnbc live.

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welcome back to msnbc live. i'm carlos watson. when it comes to the price tag for health care reforms the senate finance committee is key to moving the president's plans along. joining me is democratic senator robert menendez of new jersey. good to have you again, sir. >> good to be back with you, carlos. >> senator menendez, interesting articles in "the wall street journal" today talking about the role of the pharmaceutical industry in this whole health care debate and in short, the "the wall street journal" not a very liberal newspaper arguing that congress and the obama administration essentially has given the pharmaceutical industry a little bit of a pass, that in terms of trying to control costs, they haven't been aggressive enough to go beyond the $80 billion that the pharmaceutical industry is talking about offering up as part of financing health care

reform. do you agree that the pharmaceutical industry needs to do more? >> i think the pharmaceutical industry stepped up to the plate early. they came up with 80 billion. it's interesting that the insurance industry that makes nearly 12 billion to 13 billion dollars among ten companies hasn't stepped up to the plate at all in terms of contributing to health care insurance. i would argue that, in fact, the pharmaceutical industry which makes a lot of investments in research and development and life-enhancing drugs has stepped up to the plate and one of the early contributors to the type of reform we want to see. >> senator, the critics, obviously, would say pharmaceutical industry is largely based in new jersey, your state, as well as a lot in pennsylvania. so they would say that maybe you've got -- you're more open to their perspective. is there a world in which even though they did step up early, as you said and put 80 billion on the table, that in order to finance what is likely to cost a trillion dollars we should look to them for yet more still? >> well, you know, the bottom

line, carlos, it seems to me that before we look for more from the pharmaceutical industry -- look. that's an industry that is throughout the nation. yes, we have a great presence in new jersey, we're proud of companies that create life-enhancing and life-saving drugs. they're not only in pennsylvania, they're in north carolina, they're in different parts of the country. so they create opportunities and employment for people all over. but before we ask more of the pharmaceutical industry, there are a lot of major players here who, in fact, are making enormous profits like the insurance industry and they haven't stepped up at all. so let's bring all of the players in towards the ultimate cost of health care and then we can look at whether we need more from any one of them. >> fair enough. i want to bring in angela bert-murray, my guest co-host and a former resident of new jersey. >> yes. thank you so much. looking at the sotomayor hearings, she came through with flying colors and likely to be confirmed. does this appointment have any

impact on the growing hispanic power-base in this country? >> well, look. judge sotomayor in and of herself is an american success story. i'm sure if you asked her growing rapport in the growing public housing projects in new york that she could rise to be a united states supreme court justice in this great country, the highest court in the land, she may not have thought that's possible. but it's the promise of america fulfilled. i think it's a great story for all americans. certainly the latino community is very proud of her, first and foremost, because she is an xempl larry judge. the greatest experience of any nominee in a hundred years in terms of federal experience, that is one hell of a statement. the final line is we, obviously, take pride in that somebody from the largest minority in the community, because of their talents and abilities, and their

experience, can now rise and be on the united states supreme court. i think it sends a great message to young latinos and to young people across the country that with hard work, perseverance, that anything is possible. >> senator ma deny nes menendez, only 30 seconds. i know you oversee the democratic senate committee. do you think sotomayor's extension will lead to more senate seats next year? >> well, you know we certainly hope that people who are highly qualified and who have the ability to represent the interests of their state and strike a responsive chord with the views of the constituency of that state will come forward and certainly we'll consider any candidate who has that high quality, who strikes a responsive chord with their electric and represents the interests of their state as a possibility for the senate. >> all of you potential senate candidates you heard the man say it here today.

senator, thank you for joining us. >> thauchlt. >> ahead, the custody showdown that looms over over michael jackson's children. who will get them? there's fresh information. we've got that straight ahead. our miguel almaguer has been working on the story. that's straight ahead on "msnbc live." i'm carlos watson. it's a... a fork? you're a wombat. ( doorbell rings ) honey, it's the pizza guy. sure. me again. okay, now this is the last te alright? thanks, you know we don't deliver anything like this. this crispy flatbread. mmmm. mmmmm! so delicious! are you like havin' a party or somethin'? ( slam ) hello? introducing the taste that's never been delivered. digiorno crispy flatbread pizza. for deliciously italian-inspired toppings on crispy flatbread crust, it's not delivery, it's digiorno. hello, i don't think we have met.

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welcome back to "msnbc live." i'm carlos watson. now into the latest on the investigation into what actually killed michael jackson. the coroner says it will take up to two more weeks before we actually know what was injected into his system at the time of death. miguel almaguer is live in burbank. what can you tell us? >> reporter: originally that toxicology and coroner's report was supposed to take between four to six weeks, but over the last few days, we had heard this coroner's report would come out sometime this week oar early next week. we have now learned that there

have been some delays with that report and it will come out within the original four to six weeks. we'll still get that under the time line that the coroner's office first gave us, but it won't be this week or even next week, but within six weeks of his death. >> miguel almaguer, thank you so much. we'll continue to follow up with that. right now it's time for my "c" note. we're going to talk a little bit about what we learned today. angela, what did you take away from some of the interesting conversations that we had? >> i thought it was interesting when we talked to bay buchanan that she thinks romney can come back. >> that's a part that's in trouble. they're turning to a guy who couldn't come in first or second place? >> wasn't the pick last time, but we like you now. >> we certainly have seen it before. the seen people who have struggled, who have gotten another chance. i think jeb bush can have -- the thing that intrigued me a little bit is when we were talking off

air. i was told that richard lugar, the republican senator from indiana is actually the first republican to come out and say that he's going to vote for sonia sotomayor. i think that's a big deal, not only because i think sonia sotomayor is going to get confirmed, not only because lugar's not on the committee, but because lugar is a guy that could be an ally for president obama, not just on this, but on a number of other things. we haven't seen him show up on the stimulus or some of the others, but maybe now's the time he helps obama on the health care bill. >> you also have to take a look at what's his real motive here? voting for sarasota mayor puts him in a good position with the hispanic voters. i'm sure there's a lot of that that's playing into this as well. >> angela burt murray, thank you for joining me today. that does it for us on "msnbc live." we'll be back next week. i'm carlos watson. at this point, i want to turn it over to dr. nancy. i've got to tell you again, i really enjoyed your interview with president obama yesterday. thought it was very fresh, very

insightful. >> thanks, carlos. it was a real honor to be invited to the white house. and we'll talk about health care reform. coming up, the battle over health care reform, it's resting squarely on the money. how much will it cost the government? how much will it cost the average american? also, president obama's choice for surgeon general is under fire and it's all playing out on the internet and it all has to do with her weight. we'll jump into the controversial topic. and the newly released video of michael jackson's hair when it caught on fire during that infamous commercial in 1984, did it trigger his trauma and drug addiction? it is approaching noon on the east coast, the doctor is in, and we'll start after this quick break. the chevy open house. where getting a new vehicle is easy. because the price on the tag is the price you pay on remaining '08 and '09 models. surnd. you'll find low, straightforward pricing. it's simple. now get an '09 malibu 1lt with an epa estimated 33 mpg

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