anxiety throughout the city. and it was a stampede of media that suddenly ended. and so it was a relief, very much so. >> all of us were hopeful that this thing was over and wanted to put it behind us. but i think ultimately what made that impossible is because we still had these unresolved cases. >> despite the verdict, williams continues to maintain his innocence. he has yet to be charged with any of the other child murders, because there is no physical evidence linking him to those crimes. >> people were relieved, but they were still vigilant, because they didn't know if he did all of those murders. we were relieved, but we were

still concerned. >> even though it's been a long time ago, it still rests in our hearts in terms of what we went through. it was a very uneasy time for the city of atlanta. and thank god we did get through it. we really hope that the person that truly was responsible is, indeed, incarcerated. but we can never be sure. we were left with a lot of uneasy feelings about it. >> in may of 2005, louis graham, the chief of police in atlanta's dekalb county, reopened some of the cases saying he was never convinced that wayne williams was responsible for all of the killings. graham had been an investigator on the case when williams was arrested. in early 2006, the new investigation had stalled, and chief graham resigned for unrelated reasons. meanwhile, williams remains behind bars. his appeals have repeatedly been denied. that's our report. thanks for watching, i'm john seigenthaler.

and that's the way it is, monday december 5th, 1977. this is walter cronkite, cbs news, good night. >> good evening from paris. >> right now on msnbc, the passing of a ledge en. walter congress kite dies at age 92. a look at his life and legacy. in washington, the fight over health care reform, president obama making a big push, but some members of his own party push back. banks earning billions all of a sudden. how did they go from needing bailout bucks to big profits. >> plus, ♪ sir paul mccartney rocking new york. it's the kickoff to his farewell

tour. good morning. i'm chris jansing in for alex wi witt. welcome. we'll have all those stories plus the latest on the terror bombings in indonesia. first the passing of a broadcast legend. long time cbs ang choreman walter cronkite has died. he passed away at his home on friday in new york. he was 92 years old. from 1962 through 1982, congress kite ang chored the cbs evening news. during that time, he became one of the most famous faces and trusted voices in america. and he made his signature signoff, and that's the way it is, household words. here's nbc's chris clackham with a look back at his remarkable life. >> when walter kronk height veered from his usual straight reporting on the cbs evening news for this 196 editorial against the vietnam war, president johnson was watch in

the white house and he he's said to have exclaimed, that's it, if i've lost cronkite, i've lost middle america. it was instances like that that helped justify cronkite's longtime moniker as the most trusted man in america. walter cronkite was born in 1916 in st. joseph, missouri. after reading an article about a foreign correspondent, cronkite left the university of texas and began his own journalism career, one that led him to cover the european front of world war ii for united press. in 1962, cronkite helped launch the cbs evening news, broadcast into 16 million homes every night. a year later and with a rare glimpse of emotion, cronkite informed the nation of the assassination of president kennedy. >> president kennedy died at 1:00 p.m. central standard time. 2:00 eastern standard time. some 38 minutes ago.

>> reporter: in 1969, cronkite's love of the space program overwhelmed him as he watched with the world the apollo 11" lunar landing it was that on-air emotion, his honesty and impartiality that made cronkite the voice of reason for viewers during the turbulent times of the vietnam war and watergate scandal. cronkite held the anchor chair till his retirement in 19 1, after which the broadcast legend wrote two books and hosted several special news and educational programs, but spent the majority of his time enjoying his sail boat off his beloved new england coast. during his career, cronkite won numerous industry awards, including several emmys and the prestigious peabody award twice. for more than five decades, he brought the news of the world into the homes of americans with honesty, integrity, a calmness only he could deliver. and with a trademark ending that

summarizes his legacy -- >> and that's the way it is, friday march 6th, 19 1. >> reporter: nbc news. walter cronkite's wife betsy died of cancer in 2005. is he survived by their three children. memories and praise for the newsman are pouring in from u.s. presidents past and present. president george h.w. bush said "as a pioneer in television journalism, he was a towering respected figure. many americans heard it from walter first that president kennedy had died or that man had walked on the moon. he is already missed." president obama says he was an american icon and during a time before blogs and e-mail, cell phones and cable, walter cronkite was the news. >> walter was always more than just an anchor, he was someone we could trust to guide us through the most important issues of the day, a voice of certainty in an uncertain world.

he was family. in moments of tragedy, walter looked us in the eye and slayered our pain. in moments of triumph, he rejoiced with us. >> nbc news special correspondent tom brokaw told keith olbermann last night that for a time there was no larger celebrity than walter cronkite and despite his fame, brokaw says cronkite treated him as an equal from day one. >> the nice thing about walter was i hadn't been on the job too long in this superheated environment when i met him at a white house correspondent's din other and he took me aside and he said young man, you're doing too well for nbc and kind of laughed and gave me a slap on the back. and that was the kind of competitor he was. he wasn't patting me on the head in a paternalistic way. he took me as a colleague from the moment we first met. it grew into a very nice

friendship and it meant a lot to me. >> in just a few minutes, tom brokaw will join us with more of his thoughts on the newsman. when cronkite left, he handed the post over to dan rath. last night on the rachel maddow show, rather spoke about how much he learned from his colleague and friend. >> and he never ceased being a reporter. i touched on this before. i think the public recognize this had. walter loved reporting. he loved the news, a passion for it. he talked eloquently about the responsibility and to be passionately involved in the responsibilities of doing the cbs evening news, things like this is not just another broadcast. this is important to the democratic process. >> coming up later in this hour, more on the legendry newsman, his life and the ways he changed journalism forever. now to washington news this morning, president obama pushing the health care reform plan in

his weekly internet address. >> this is what the debate in congress is all about, whether we'll keep talking and tinkering and letting this problem fester as more families and businesses go under and more americans lose their coverage or whether they'll seize this opportunity, one we might not have again for generations and finally pass health insurance reform this year in 2009. >> joining me live now, john dekker, washington correspondent for reuters. good morning. >> good morning to you, chris. >> what a difference a few days makes. obviously the president pushing hard for health care reform. where does it stand right now? >> well, the president got a big shot in the arm this week, the american medical association a very powerful interest group that represents the nation's doctors came out and supported the bill that's emerging out of the house. that is on top of some support the president has already received from a number of other interest groups, including the nurses association, the hospital association, insurers, as well

as pharmaceutical manufacturers. so the president has a lot of interest groups on his side, these are interest groups which were vociferously opposed to any kind of reform more than a decade ago. right now, it looks like he has the stars in alignment. >> let's talk about some of the things that may be working against him, the congressional budget estimate it could add $39 billion to the deficit. there are some moderate and conservative democrats who are voicing concerns about it. and there does seem to be a pushback in some quarters about trying to what some consider to be rush this. why are we trying to get this done and what are the chances it's going to be done before both houses of congress go away for the rest of the summer? >> that's a big question. we don't know the answer to that. as you just mentioned, what the congressional budget office came out with this week presents a major problem for the president because there are a number of

democrats, about 70 or so, that are opposed to this type of bill right now for two reasons. one, it would blow up the deficit, the cbo as you just said, indicated that over the course of ten years, $239 billion would be added to our deficit, which already stands at over a trillion dollars. the other issue is that there are a number of blue dog democrats, conservative democrats who are concerned that not only would it blow up the deficit, but it would pose a big problem for small business which is trying to deal with that add cost and which would have to deal with that add cost because of this health care reform bill. >> let me ask you finally about the speaker because she's back pedalled a little bit on her -- on a key tax increase, and some have suggested this puts her in a weaker negotiating position. what can you tell us about nancy pelosi and her role in all this? >> well, nancy pelosi is

obviously the speaker of the house and wields a lot of power. earlier this week, the house ways and means committee came out of committee with a bill which would impose about $500 billion of the cost on wealthier americans, not only wealthier individual americans but also on small business as well that would meet the requirements of this bill. this is a problem for a number of democrats, and what house speaker nancy pelosi is trying to do right now is to keep all those democrats right now who are wavering on the side of the democratic side because right now, if you lose those 70, you're not going to see this bill come up for a vote in the house, and there's also problems, as you mentioned, chris in the senate in that you don't know whether the senate will take up this bill before that august 8th deadline set by the white house. >> john dekker, always good to see you. thank you. for the latest political developments, be sure to check out first read. it's updated throughout the day

so check back often. logon to firstread.msnbc.com. hundreds of family and friends gathered as a pensacola cemetery to pay respects to a local couple murdered. byrd and melanie billings were shot to death by robbers last week. police have arrested eight suspects in connection with the murder. police revealed the contents of a safe from the home that was recovered from one of the suspect's home. >> the contents of the safe which we will verify are personal items, items such as passports, birth certificates, an adoption papers. some heirloom jewelry and some prescription medication assigned to this family. >> an attorney representing the billings family says she hopes revealing the contents will end speculation about the couple which centered on their background. and we're learning more today about a california school

teacher accused of killing his etch wife on a cruise. robert john mcgill made his first court appearance on murder charges friday. an fbi agent said in a statement that mcgill told him he killed his wife shirley with his bare hands. prosecutors say mcgill strangled his wife aboard the carnivalelation cruise ship as it made its way back to california last tuesday. he was arrested on thursday when the ship docked in san diego. today is going to be a big day for space exploration. the first of five space walks scheduled for 11:58 eastern time. two astronauts will venture outside to help assemble a porch that will be used to hold outdoor experiments. 13 astronauts under one roof is the largest ever to gather in space at one time. and a new word from nasa that falling debris from the "endeavour" during liftoff did not cause significant damage to the spacecraft.

♪ ♪ asked a girl what she wanted to be ♪ >> armor than four decades, paul mccartney is back in new york city making history. he is the first to perform at new york city's brand new city field stadium. he performed more than 30 songs for the sold out crowd and fans went wild when a surprise musical guest joined him on stage. more on that in a live report coming up from city field in just a bit. straight ahead now on msnbc, new developments out of indonesia where pligs are zeroing in on a terror mastermind believed to be behind friday's deadly attacks. plus, big earnings reports from zoom of the biggest banks on wall street. after all the bailouts, where did the profits come from? we go behind the numbers coming up on msnbc. announcer ] introducing the latest

body wash from olay. tone enriching ribbons. two separate ribbons. the white cleanses. the gold moisturizes and has a touch of mineral shimmer to enhance skin's tone. olay tone enriching body wash. for skin that shimmers.

more talks but still no end to the budget crisis in california. it's one of the stories happening now on msnbc. governor arnold schwarzenegger and state lawmakers will resume talks tomorrow in an effort to close the state's $26.3 billion budget gap. most state offices closed friday as part of a three day a month furlough ordered by the governor. in iran, dozens are arrested following fresh protests. witnesses say opposition supporters flooded the streets of tehran after a powerful cleric called for detainees held in post election violence to be free. and secretary of state hillary clinton arrives in mumbai for the start of her trip to india staying at the same hotel attacked by terrorists last november. today investigators in jakarta, indonesia are step up

their presence in response to friday's deadly coordinated terror attacks. suicide bombers pose as guests at hotels constructed the bombs inside their rooms. now concerns a new wave of terror could be underway. let's go to ian williams in bangkok, thailand who has the latest for us. >> good morning, chris. investigators are sifting through the debris of the marriott and the ritz carlton hotels in jakarta looking for clues who might have been responsible for yesterday's deadly bombings, bombings that appear to have been incredibly well planned. little bits of information emerging that possibly the bomb was smuggled in in a laptop computer, there be evading the very elaborate metal detecting security. there was a story today in the indonesian press of a suspect collecting in with a thousand dollar deposit. no credit card. the security at those hotels was incredibly tight. this was well planned.

they went in as guests, appear to have prepared the bomb in a room on the 18th floor. now, suspicion is falling on a faction, a breakaway group that used to be part of the jemaah islamiyah. this group had its most deadly hay day if you like earlier this decade when it bombed the marriott and australian embassy, the bali bomb. suspicion falling on a terrorist mastermind by the name of noordin top, an accomplished bomb maker who leads a breakaway faction of the ji. investigators are not yet openly attributed blame to him, but this is certainly what's being said privately in ja car tashs chris. >> in williams, thanks very much. appreciate the update. the house intelligence committee says it will investigate whether the cia broke the law by not telling congress earlier about a top secret program aimed at killing al qaeda terrorists. the committee says their investigation will focus on how much money was spent on the

effort and whether there was official travel in association with the program. cia director leon panetta revealed the program's existence to lawmakers on june 24th, a day after he first learned about it and canceled it. (music plays) wellbeing. we're all striving for it. purina cat chow helps you nurture it in your cat with a full family of excellent nutrition and helpful resources. purina cat chow. share a better life.

will have an osteoporosis-related fracture in their lifetime. if you have post-menopausal osteoporosis, are you more likely to break a bone? if you're getting calcium, are you sure it's enough to fight osteoporosis? if you exercise, are you sure that's enough? call 1-800-316-4954 to find out more in this free information kit. in it, you'll see the difference between the inside of a strong bone and the inside of an osteoporotic bone weakened and prone to fracture. you'll find ways to help reverse bone loss, and ways to help prevent fractures. call 1-800-316-4954 and learn how to help maintain strong bones and read about a treatment option

for post-menopausal osteoporosis. there's even a discussion guide to use when you talk to your doctor. are you calling now? 1-800-316-4954. we're ready for your call. 1-800-316-4954. you all want to run your businesses more efficiently, so we've brought in a team of experts to help. one suggestion is to make your shipping more efficient with priority mail flat rate boxes from the postal service. call or go online for a free supply and up to $160 in offers from authorized postage vendors. shipping's a hassle! weighing every box... actually, with flat rate boxes you don't need to weigh anything under 70 pounds. if it fits, it ships for a low flat rate. ok, but i ship all over the country. you can ship anywhere in the country for a low flat rate. ship international, too. yes, but i ship hundreds of things, in all sizes. great, because flat rate boxes come in four sizes. call now and we'll send a free supply,

plus up to $160 in offers. when you're ready to ship, we'll even pick them up for free, no matter how many you have. priority mail flat rate boxes only from the postal service. a simpler way to ship. call or go online now to get started. >> dallas, texas, the flash apparently official. president kennedy died at 1:00 p.m. central standard time. 2:00 eastern standard time. some 38 minutes ago. >> and that was just one of the many important historical moments kron kald by walter cronkite who died yesterday at the age of 92. he of course, the legendry cbs anchor. joining us on the phone is nbc news special correspondent tom brokaw. mr. brokaw, good morning. thanks for taking the time to give us a call. >> good morning, chris. >> what was it about walter

cronkite that when he spoke, we just sat up and listened and believed every word he said? >> well, i think it was a combination of things. first of all, he brought with him this long record as a great reporter beginning with world war ii and going through the cold war in the '50s and then on the cbs morning news, a lot of people forget that he was on sunday morning program called "you are there" re-creating great events in history and then you look at that face. this is the quintessential american uncle. he was often referred to as uncle walter, the avuncular figure for all of us. night after night in the cbs evening news, the world seemed to be coming apart, you could tune into walter 5:30 in the midwest or 6:30 in the east or whatever time zone you happened to live in, and there would be reliable walter cronkite with that great team of reporters and producers around him telling us what had happened that day in that unflappable straightforward

fashion that he had, and he seemed to, not just seemed to be, the personification of integrity. >> as i'm reading through reports this morning and so many people are referring to the time he was on television as the golden age of age of television news. i know certainly i learned so much just by watching him in the few times i had chances to talk to him. what did you learn from walter cronkite i'm wondering? and what do you think the lessons are for journalists now because it's changed so much since he started in the anchor chair. >> well, you know, i came of age with chet huntley and david brinkley and walter cronkite as the captains of our industry. they, you know, chet and david brinkley were dominant in the early years. nbc news had a big leg up on cbs and then walter sat in that chair and they built a remarkable team around us and they caught us and eventually passed us.

and in both cases, what i learned from them is that this new form of reporting the news on television was a great gift to democracy because every corner of the country could get the news simultaneously and find out what was going on. the two the great events i think of that time were vietnam and the civil rights movement in which people had an opportunity to join in a common dialogue about the war and then importantly could see what was going on not just in the south but in the industrial north, as well. with the shameful treatment of people of color. and the great eloquence of dr. king moved this country, but dr. king and andrew young and all the others so critical of that movement said it couldn't have happened without television. now, you know, the golden age it certainly was that because they established certain traditions and a great foundation. but we ought not to diminish what we have available to us now. we just have to work harder at

finding it. in those days, there were really only two networks, nbc and cbs. abc was not the player that it later became and if you look at all these file videos of walter cronkite, there are no women on the air. and there are no people of color on the air. it was pretty much a kind of, what i later describe, a white male establishment that was telling us what was going on in the world. that was fine by me. i was going to be one of those one of those days. but i think we have a much richer selection now than we did then. and that we're better off for it, but again, we have to just work harder at it. >> there certainly is a lot more diversity on the air and much greater diversity in the availability of news sources people have and not just here on 24-hour cable obviously but so many americans learned about the death michael jackson through

twitter and people go online and many people, you know, watch portions of newscasts unsatisfied of the entire nightly newscast or the entire "today" show. but even given all that, all these changes, tom, what do you think his lasting legacy will be? >> i think his lasting legacy will be that for almost 20 years, he sat in the cbs evening news anchor's chair during one of the most tumultious times in our history and got it right for the most part. there were probably one or two factual errors along the way, but by and large in the big picture, walter cronkite was not just the voice of authority, but he was the force, the voice of reliability. and i think that's the single greatest legacy that he provided and he stayed true to his calling for all of his celebrity. he always thought of himself first and foremost as a reporter. as a journalist. now, he loved being walter

cronkite. he liked the idea that he could go to broadway openings and with his beloved wife betsy who had this wonderful sar donic sense of humor, there are very few things that they missed in new york. i remember when i was leaving the "today" show to go off to do the nightly news, jane pauly and gary trudeau gave a small dinner. walter and betsy were there. we had become friends and walter dpab me a small toast but he had this very instructive line for me to remember. he said there will be nights when you do the nbc nightly news when you think you've done the best possible job of covering a great and important story and you'll feel so satisfied with yourself, and then you'll walk out onto the streets of new york and there in new york alone will be millions of people wandering around who have not seen anything that you've done that day and you have to keep that in mind. i think that was not only instructive to me but it is

reflective of walter cronkite. >> one of the things he said that i think is very instructive to all journalists, he said never finish a newscast that i was completely satisfied with. so he set the bar very high not just for himself but all of us who have tried to follow in his footsteps. but on a personal level, what is it that you'll remember most about walter cronkite? was it what you see is what you get? was he the guy we all saw on television? >> he was, and that phrase uncle walter, the avuncular figure it, never fit anyone more perfectly than it did walter. it was the essence of his persona. he even looked like your favorite uncle, and he remained a generous man in spirit. he did not become just the most famous, i mean the most trusted man in america but he was one of the most famous men in america and yet, he would always have time when i would see him at a broadway opening when people would rush up to him, he would be courteous and funny and an

tentative to them. he had lots of friends that were famous, but he had a lot of friends that no one knew, as well. so he was a man who lived life every day, and he came out of the heartland and traveled the world, and remained true to who he was as a journalist and as a human being. and i think that's something that we all have to keep in mind. the idea of becoming famous as a journalist had not occurred to him when he began. that was not his objective. he simply and had to be a reporter and that he became famous and handled it with such grace along the way is a great tribute to him. >> but he was a reporter first and foremost, and it's wonderful, tom, to hear your tributes one great newsman to another. it's always good to talk to you. >> thank you very much, chris. what we should all remember is this is not a time for mourning, it's a time for celebration.

a small circle of us have been kind of keeping track of walter for the last couple of months now, talking to each other a lot and reflecting on what a life he had and what a legacy he leaves. and these are times to remember that legacy. these are times to remember all that he meant to this country. and what joy he had in his own life, and that's a reminder, i think, to all of us as we go through another difficult period and for those of us in this business and especially for the younger people, you may get to be famous and you may get to be known when you walk down the street, but that has very little to do with the essence of trying to be a good reporter. >> all good reminders. thank you so much, and you know, i think we should also say about walter cronkite that in addition to being missed, that he lives on in so many people who are on the air today who he inspired to this business. so thank you, tom brokaw.

appreciate it. >> okay. >> logon to msnbc.com for more on walter cronkite, including videos, tributes a slide show of the most trusted man in america. now to the latest on the economy. stocks lifted on the news as several companies reporting better than expected earnings. on friday, we got a progress report on the obama administration's economic recovery plan from the president's top economic advisor larry summers. the take away? but the number of banks being shut down by federal regulators continues to grow. regulators 0 friday shut down two banks in california and two smaller banks in georgia and south dakota. boosting to 57 the number of federally insured banks to fail this year. we'll be right back. ♪ i'm your venus what if embrace... the latest from venus... came with a closeness guarantee. not just a guarantee to shave you closer. but to get you closer... and closer. venus embrace.

get closer or your money back. right now, all over the country, discover card customers are getting 5% cashback bonus at the pump.

new and only from progressive. call or click today.

are enjoying the new palm pre with its revolutionary web os. they're running multiple live applications at the same time. - ( thunder and rain ) - 3 million are using the simply everything plan. each is saving $1200 - over an at&t iphone plan. - ( cash register dings ) together that's over $3 billion. - enough to open a dunkin' donuts in space. - ( walkie-talkie sounds ) from america's most dependable 3g network. bringing you the first and only wireless 4g network. get the palm pre from sprint. only on the now network. deaf, hard of hearing and people with speech disabilities access www.sprintrelay.com. now to the economy and this week, some of the biggest banks

reported profits in the billions. take a look at this breakdown. citigroup reporting a profit of almost $4.3 billion. bank of america $2.42 billion, earlier in the week, goldman sachs reported $3.44 billion, jpmorgan chase, $2.7 billion. all four took in billions in government bailout money. for perspective, i'm joined by katie benner, writer for "fortune" magazine. how does this happen? such a turnaround it almost gives you whiplash. >> it does. you have to separate goldman sachs which is a special case. for the first three, they made money on a unique set of circumstances i don't think we're going to see happen again. they have a wall street businessen a main street business. the wall street business was incredibly helped this quarter by low interest rates. so they can borrow money at almost no cost and any business they do is profitable. and there is a lot of issuance of preferred stocks from the

bailout that they made money from, but they're a main street business. they all said earnings is going to cause them pain down the road. they caused us pain last year. anytime a consumer does not pay their mortgage, misses any payment to the bank, that's a loss for them. as unemployment escalates which they think it will and as losses escalate, they see losses down the road and aring money. so the bailout money they took with the eye of putting it back in the economy they're reserving right now because they see losses. >> one of the things a lot of people look at is again, from the main street perspective, all of a sudden, we gave them all this money, we thought they were in trouble, now they're collecting big bonuses. what's with that? >> well, that's a little different. keep in mind jpmorgan and goldman have paid back the money. i think earnings will deteriorate going forward. goldman sachs is a very special case. they don't have a consumer business. they never deal with you and me.

they only deal with wall street. what we're going to see is state, local and federal government and corporations issuing debt they need money, too. and they're going to be issuing more debt than ever before and goldman sachs will be the go-to sort of midwife to burst that debt into existence and they are going to make a lot of money off of that. that's where their bonuses come into play. >> all four banks together received more than $100 billion total government money. jp, morgan and goldman paid the money back last month. city bank and bank of america still have to repay. what's the timeline on all that? is there a guess. >> i don't think we can guess. it depends and the quality of earnings going forward and how stab the bank is because for bank of america and citi, it almost makes no sense to pay back the money just to get out of the eye of the government so they can pay bigger bonuses and have to ask for more money down the road because they gave it back too soon. >> what's the word on the street people should be looking. >> i'm sorry, the short-term.

>> what do you think people are looking at right now when people are analyzing for the healthy status of these banks, where are they going, these investment banks, what's the prospect overall. >> they're going to be looking at unemployment. that is going to materially affect consumers whether or not we can pay our debts. >> that main street portion of their portion. >> and that portion is only deteriorating. people are going to be looking at unemployment and credit card siebels. are we paying our credit card and mortgages. >> katie benner, good to have you in. >> thank you. >> thanks so much. now the latest from washington where president obama is trying to rally lawmakers amid growing resistance to his health care plan. the president pushing his message this morning in his weekly address. he also made and you scheduled public appearance at the white house late yesterday with a message directed at congress. >> the last few miles of any race are the hardest to run. but i have to say now is not the time to slow down. and now is certainly not the

time to lose heart. >> nbc's mike viqueira live at the white house for us. what kind of battle is the president up against in terms of health care reform? >> it's a battle royale. not a day goes by without the president making some sort of public comment on this huge fight in congress about health care reform, his signature issue in the first year of his administration. we know the story by now. the congressional budget office on thursday dropped a bomb on capitol hill and said the costs of health care are going to continue trending upward even giving some of the health care reform efforts pushed forward by democrats something directly contrary to what the democrats and president have claimed. the president yesterday had no public events on his schedule but saw fit to come out in the diplomatic room here at the white house and sort of an impromptu statement, came out very forcefully saying we are going to get this done. the deadline he has imposed on

the house and senate is to have something out of each respective chamber, not the final legislation by the time they go on august recess. for the senate, that's august 7th, the house july 31st. prospects a little brighter in the house at this point. if i were a betting man or senator or congressman, i wouldn't be making vacation plans just yet. i think it's clear that the white house intends to ask congress to stay here till they get the job done. >> if they're not taking vacation, neither are you. >> thanks a lot. mixed signals, signs the housing market may be getting better, but there's still a disturbing development on foreclosures. you're watching "msnbc saturday."

now i want to warn you about a bone disease you may not feel, can't see and could easily ignore -- post-menopausal osteoporosis. please, don't ignore it. because osteoporosis means that over time, your bones gradually become weaker and can break more easily. see the weakness here? there is something you can do about it. call 1-800-316-4952 now for your free information kit. you'll see the difference between strong bone and osteoporotic bone, weakened and prone to fracture.

you'll find ways to help reverse bone loss and help prevent fractures. you'll learn how to help maintain strong bones, a way to treat post-menopausal osteoporosis and things to discuss with your doctor. so call 1-800-316-4952 now. it's too important to ignore. osteoporosis. you can't see it, you may not feel it. but you can do something. call now. fresh perspective today on the housing marked. first, a signal it could be improve. new numbers show construction was started on more new homes in june than any month since

november. housing starts unexpectedly rose last month by 3.6%. good news for potential buyers. this week, mrt damage rates fell to their lowest since may. the average 30 point rate fell 5.14%, but it wasn't all good news. realty track reporting foreclosures up 15% during the first half of the year. for perspective what it means, joining from us washington, jim papakukis, money and politics columnist for reuters. how are you doing? >> good morning, chris. how are you? >> there we go. pappakukis. i'm still on l.a. time. >> as long as we're in the ballpark. >> it's 4:46. let's talk about the housing start numbers first. how significant is it we saw this jump of 3.6%. it was a surprise, right? >> yeah, listen, it was better than expected and you know, in the housing market any piece of good news you'll take it. that's good news for people who are home builders.

just like the big drop in interest rates and really the drop in prices, it's good news if you're looking to buy a home. what's not so good if you're in a home, trying to sell your home, is the huge drop in prices and also the huge wave of foreclosures which is only getting worse as the unemployment rate gets worse. early on, only subprime people who probably should have never had mortgages to begin with, as soon as home prices started to fall, they were in trouble. now the problem is unemployment, people losing their jobs and homes. >> let's talk about foreclosures, up 15% in the first six months of this year. you mentioned those unemployment numbers we were talking about it in the previous segment as well, that there's an anticipation unemployment could get even higher. so what are the prospects for foreclosure? >> well, that's really the frightening thing. you already have% of mortgages are a month behind. that's a huge pool of potential foreclosures and as long as the unemployment rate continues to

climb the way it has, you're going to have far more foreclosure. now we're talking about people who got the good loans, the fixed loans, the 30-year, 20% down. those are the people who are losing their homes. and that is why there's renewed calls in washington to try to do something about the housing market, try to do something for homeowners to keep these down as much as possible. >> who should be looking right now as the prospect of refinancing getting low mortgage rates, jim? >> listen, if you're not underwater, you know, if your home is actually worth more than your mortgage, now is a great time to refinance. mortgage rates are low. they spiked up a little bit but seem to be fall again. if you can refinance, that's great. the positive problem is that so many people underwater they can't refinance. that's one of the core problems here is that so many people were depending on that in order to afford these homes and now they can't do it. with home prices dropping interest peak to trough, prices will probably be down 40% which

is absolutely who are riv. >> give us the big picture. the take away. is the housing market getting a little bit better? how worried should we be about the next six to 12 months? give us the big picture here. >> listen, again, if you're a young couple looking to buy a home, now is a great time. if you're in the home building industry, you've probably seen about the worst. you might start to see a pickup in new homes. listen, if you're trying to sell your home or you view your home as an investment, it's still a lot of pain yet to come. >> jim, it's good to see you. thanks so much. >> you bet, chris. it was one giant leap for mankind almost 40 years ago. we'll flash back to man's first historic steps in just a moment right here on msnbc. come on in. you're invited to the chevy open house. where getting a new vehicle is easy. because the price on the tag is the price you pay on remaining '08 and '09 models. you'll find low, straightforward pricing.

it's simple. now get an '09 silverado xfe with an epa estimated 21 mpg highway for under 28 thousand after all offers. go to chevy.com/openhouse for more details. the $100 cream. flabbergasted when we creamed the $700 cream! for under $30 regenerist micro-sculpting cream hydrates better than 32 of the world's most expensive creams. fantastic. phenomenal. regenerist. being smart. yep. just booked my 10th night on hotels.com, so i get a night free. you are smart. accumulate 10 nights and get a night free anywhere. welcome rewards. smart. so smart.

we have a lift-off. lift-off on apollo 11. >> the eagle has landed. >> that's one small step for

man, one giant leap for mankind. >> it's hard to believe, but monday marks the 40th anniversary of the apollo 11 moon landing. it took the crew four days to reach the moon after lift-off june 16th, 1969. joining us a former space shuttle engineer. hi there, jim, how are you doing? >> good morning, chris. >> let's talk about the historic moon landing because i'm on your e-mail list and you write the most fascinating e-mails about the misunderstandings related to neil armstrong and apollo 11. what's the most misunderstood part of this whole mission? >> i think the most misunderstood, unappreciated portion is what the small step really was because most videos show him jumping off the ladder down, and saying, oops, that's one small step.

actually he was down on a foot pad, a metal plate the size of a garbage can lid, moved his left foot deliberately off of the pad on to the ground and looking where he was going. 4 t. was a deliberate act like the apollo program. not accident. but first in the blind fall off a lad. >> most of us remember where we were, who were alive at that time, and where we were watching that moment. but let's talk about the lift-off, the apollo 11 launch, since you're somebody whose life has been about engineering and space, do you remember where you were for lift-off? did you watch the launch on tv. >> yes, i did. sputnik saved my academic career because i was a disorganized, inattentive student in eighth grade when something this national education push showed up and a rode that wave all the way through graduate school where nasa sent me for graduate and i was there teaching, that morning of the launch between

classes i watched it. the following sunday afternoon i was in the faculty lounge, sitting next to my future wife, still my current wife, watching the landing and a few hours later watching the first footsteps. >> another emerging of big stories, of course the patting of walter cronkite, also a self-proclaimed space nut. so many people learned about what had happened on apollo 11 from him and called him old iron pants because he spent 27 of 30 hours on the air for the moon landing. what was his impact on the space program? >> a crucial impact, krishgs because he humanized events of space. he made a part of contemporary culture. it's sincere enthusiasm really tied the heart of america to the space program. >> i love him reading quotes, we don't have the clips but some of

the things he said for apollo 11, man on the moon, oh, boy, my golly. it's just sort of what you expect to hear from somebody who is just excited to be witnessing this. >> it would be the story you hear from your uncle, and he was uncle walter. >> yeah. let's talk about the space program today and where we're going because, as we know, before president bush left office, one of the thing his wanted to do was return to the moon, and i think given the fact that this anniversary it's sort of worth revisiting. where is nasa on all of this, and what are the prospects for it? >> yeah. the options, and the possibilities have become almost limitless and undefined because people are revisiting right now what to do next. it's not a matter, i think, of choosing planets of favor, the moon people, the mars people, the asteroid people. you should look back to why you do these activities and we did apollo as people mentioned

during the retrospect trrum we apollo because we were afraid of a world in which the united states no longer was a dominant technological power that would have diplomat, militant implications we didn't want. today we need to look for what are we afraid of in the world? various nation states going their own ways. perhaps competing, perhaps just doing things we'd rather not have them do. there are things we can do with space to tie people together. perhaps tying people together rather than fear is what we need to do in future programs. >> very nice thought to end with. skype is a cool thing. what time is it where you are? >> an hour behind you. it's 7:00 a.m. >> you're doing this from your house, right? >> this is my den. this is where i spy out the world space programs material behind me on my bookshelves and linked to the world from rural galveston county,