i think the purpose was to get a health care bill. i think he moved the ball forward. i think people have to realize that the people are for this. that's why he's president. so he is responding to what he promised. and i think it's going to happen. it may not happen exactly as you want it. i think yesterday's, last night's speech was a negotiation. >> more so with democrats or more so with republicans because you heard our own chuck todd say there's 60 democratic votes in senate, almost a 100 vote margin in the house. he said to president obama in question isn't the real issue your own team? where do you think he's doing the negotiating? >> i think he's trying to get his base in order because he may have to get this bill without bipartisan support. >> once again similar to what he had to do with the stimulus bill as well. what did you make -- we'll it talk more later on, what did you

think about him coming out on this professor gates issue. some think it's natural the president would weigh in on that, maybe he spoke too soon. >> i don't think you can ever speak too soon about injustice and racism. and professor gates, who is also my friend, is not the issue. the real issue is those anonymous black men and hispanic men out there who are daily, constantly hounded and harassed by police officers. this is a historic problem. and obama's election did not erase it. >> it's still there. i want to bring in chuck todd, nbc news political director, chief white house correspondent. chuck, what does that white house say? obviously that was the last of the 13 or 14 questions yesterday but certainly a lot of us in the media have talked about it. what's the white house saying about the skip gates issue and

the president weighing in on it? >> they don't want to say much publicly. for what it's worth, they figured he would get asked about it, so the president was prepared or at least was sort of previewed with it when they were talking about what he could get asked. they knew that was a question that could get asked. i did talk to one adviser who didn't dispute that maybe if the president hadn't used the word "stupidly" in talking about the cambridge police officer, that maybe this wouldn't have bubbled up or we wouldn't have had the hand ringing we've seen going on at least with a few in the media. >> chuck, what did you make -- vernon jordan and i were talking about the president's short speech and the question-and-answer session. vern called it negotiating with the congress as opposed to something aimed at the media or the public. what are your thoughts on that? do you think that the president made headway in negotiating with the congress on the health care bill? >> i want to pick up on what

vernon said. one of these wise washington men. i don't mean wise. he's a veteran of washington battles. he is wise. he does know what's going on. let me tell you what happened before he came out in public. one of the last people in congress that the president spoke with yesterday was max baucus, chairman of the senate finance committee, who is still trying to come up with the only remaining potential for a bipartisan bill. whatever comes out of that finance committee, conservative democrats in the senate are probably going to flock to. that is going to be sort of a potential building block -- a bill that is the building block of what the senate -- eventual senate bill looks like. the fact is i think vernon is exactly right. a lot of what the president said and didn't say last night was as much about placating.

he said millionaires, not $500,000. he singled out that proposal and said it would fit within the parameters i'm comfortable with. singled out the millionaire proposal. he said the word "mandate." that's important. that's something he's comfortable with. he didn't say the word "co-op," but he didn't have a defined way of describing the public insurance plan because that's still in the process of being negotiated by max baucus. >> i want you to know i'm greatly comforted to be on the same page with you. >> you're kind to say that. >> i want to put you both on the same page with another wise person, the senator joining us from the capital. good to see you. >> good to be here. >> we were talking about the president's short speech yesterday and the question-and-answer session.

vernon said why he was making progress. do you think any meaningful progress made in the health care battle yesterday based on the president's 55 minute long speech and question-and-answer session? >> well, as a member of the united states senate, i was glued to it. i know a lot of people must have thought it was a little bit going into the weeds. but for me it was important for me to hear the president reiterate the things that he thinks are most important. the fact that he cares that 46 million of our people are uninsured. the fact that he knows that the u.s. spends twice as much on health care as any other nation. and by the way, i'm not sure he said this, but we don't get our money's worth. we're 29th in infant mortality out of the 30 industrialized countries. we're 24th in longevity out of those countries. the fact is the status quo, as he pointed out brilliantly, has got to go. it is hurting us. >> vernon, do you think the

president needs to be not just negotiating but frankly in some ways does he need to be tougher than he was yesterday with the senate, those in the house. >> there's been allusions he needs to be tougher and harder but he did not get elected being that way. he got elected president of the united states because people saw in him leadership and smarts. you saw that in his presentation last night. he knew what he was talking about. i mean, point for point, he was well versed, he was ready. >> could have been a professor. >> he is a professor. he demonstrated some of that last night. so i think still he's negotiating. he is leading. he is keeping his promise. and i think he's ultimately going to get a health care bill. it will not be everything that

he wants. it never is. but he's going to take us to a place we've never been. >> senator boxer, i want to take you to one of the other big pieces of legislation that the president put front and center in the agenda, climate change legislation. you're the chair of the environmental public works committee and the senate. do you think that we are going to get major climate change legislation? the reality is we spent so much and will continue to spend so much time on health care that that will end up getting pushed to next year? >> i think this young president has shown he's going to keep his campaign promises. the two major ones -- by the way, he's already kept many of them, stem cell research, covering our kids with health care, but i won't go into it. but i think the two big promises, health care reform and making sure we get on the path to energy independence. we're spending $500 billion a year importing oil. that isn't helping this economy. so i think health care reform and getting some good energy

independence, clean jobs legislation through means we'll be attacking this recession, keeping the promises that the president made and frankly that i've made to my constituents. i want to point out one of the things i thought was so brilliant about the president yesterday when he said, you know, the status quo is dangerous. he said what could happen by 2016 is we're going to see another doubling of our premiums. and i have a report that shows many of our families if we do nothing will be paying 40 to 50% of their income on health insurance. and the president really, i think, did make some news in my mind when he pointed out that the insurance companies are the ones that really need to be held responsible. we waall want them to prosper b not on the backs of our consumers. we cannot pay this much more and get these bad results. it isn't good. >> senator, can you tell us a

little bit, if you will, about the california cash prices and what's going on in the state legislature and what has happened and the impact of that on what's going on in washington right now? >> well, that's a great question. i would say this. finally it seems that there is an agreement. you never know until everything is signed. essentially what happened in california, we have a dysfunctional budgetary system. we need two-thirds to pass the budget. when the recession hit us hard, i want to say the only area of job growth that was exceeding anything else happened to be the green clean energy jobs. outside of that, the housing market downturn hit us, everything hit us badly. unemployment has hit us. so the revenues went down. now, what do you do when revenues go down. you have to figure out you're going to cut to the bone or a mix of cuts and revenue increases. well, our republican friends

there just said not one dime of new revenues. at the end of the day they won because we have a two-thirds requirement so we're taking deep, deep cuts. and i think it's going to be very, very hurtful. what i try and do here is get this economy moving again so we can lift up our state again. >> senator boxer, we have to go. i ask you in the last ten seconds, do you think there will be a california constitutional convention approved next year and held in 2011? >> i don't think so. i don't have the time to go into the reasons but i don't think so. >> senator boxer, good to see you. look forward to having you again. >> nice to see you, senator. >> same here. wonderful. straight head, if president obama fails to get health care passed before the august recess, what will it mean for governments. we ask gop rising star haley barbour. straight ahead you're watching "msnbc live." i'm carlos watson. ... ...or if you're already sick... ...or if you lose your job. your health insurance shouldn't either.

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welcome back to "msnbc live." i'm carlos watson. a day after the president's prime time address on health care, it's not likely lawmakers will reach an agreement by recess. house republicans say the only way that will happen is with a changed bill. the meantime the president criticized republicans for refusing to compromise. >> i've heard one republican strategist told his party even though they may want to compromise, it's better politics to go for the kill. another republican senator that defeating health care reform is about breaking me. so let me be clear. this isn't about me. i have great health insurance and so does every member of congress. >> joining me again, my guest co-host today vernon jordan, also joining me republican congress jeff blake. congressman blake, good to see

you. >> thanks for having me. >> good morning. >> good morning. >> congressman, i know you've worked with president obama before on some other issues, mainly immigration. do you think the gop is being as constructive and cooperative as it could be? not necessarily agreeing with everything but constructive on the health care issue? >> you bet. we've offered a lot of solutions on this. we can do things that can keep the economy running and also improve the quality of health care and control costs. but instead we're getting something that simply is not going to improve the economy. it's a major detriment to job creation. that's why republicans are concerned about it. >> congressman, as you look forward, if the president were to come forward and say i'm willing to add a number of things, i'm willing to add taxing of some of the benefits john mccain called for, is there a world in which you can could consider voting for a bill the president supports or is the

president, as some democrats suggest, wasting his time of getting a bipartisan idea done. >> it's taking away terrible ideas contained in the bill now, taxing higher incomerners a lot more. most of those who pay in the upper brackets that would be hit hard with this tax are small businesses. the last thing you want to do, particularly in a recession, is hit them harder. so i think it's more an issue of what would have to come out of the bill. also the so-called public option which would simply drive people out of their insurance that they already have. and so things like that simply need to come out of the bill. >> can you tell us anything about how you're sitting on the foreign affairs committee has influenced your politics, your votes in the congress? you spent some time in africa,

for which you are to be commended. how have these experiences affected your views of politics in this country? >> well, i think on a number of front. i appreciate you mentioning it. i did spent about three years in southern africa. how i view economic sanctions, i'm not a fan. i think we ought to change our policy regarding cuba. every american ought to be allowed to travel to cuba. that's one area where i agree strongly with the president on. >> you won't find much company in your party on that issue? >> oh, i think it's growing. there are a lot of issues that i agree with the president on, on health care and some of the spending that's going on, i'm afraid i have to part ways. we simply cannot sustain this level of spending. the economy cannot grow when government is consuming such a share of gdp. >> in terms of one other thing i

should mention with regard to foreign policy experience and health care, one thing we had in the 1990s was kind of a rosey view of health care in canada, for example, and much of europe. there's a lot of luster off that rose today. canada, the system works partly because of its proximity to the u.s. people could come here for mris and whatever they need. but certainly people don't point to canada or some of the european countries like they used to, as a model for health care reform. >> congressman, thanks so much for joining us. look forward to having you back again. >> thanks for having me. >> thank you. up next, do republicans need took cooperate more with president obama on herk. we'll ask gop rising star haley barbour. straight ahead. you're watching "msnbc live." i'm carlos watson. today there's a way to save more for retirement,

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welcome back to "msnbc live." i'm carlos watson. tech watch, more passengers are tuning out inflight entertainment and tuning in to mp players and other electronic devices. in fact, delta air lines offers an internet connection on board. passengers are able to tweet and update facebook status instead of flipping channels on inflight entertainment. there's plans to install more power sockets on board and to perhaps charge for their use. now the bitter fight over health care is being seen as a sign of success by some republicans. the president struggles to get conservative democrats on board as poll numbers slip. the gop is hoping for a much needed opening leading to key races across the country next year. joining me now republican governor from mississippi haley barbour. governor barbour, good to see you. >> thank you, carlos. good to be with you and vernon. >> we were just talking. vernon was saying you're as well situated as anyone can be for 2012. >> haley, i'm glad to see you.

i last saw you during katrina and you made a hell of a speech. >> vernon, thank you very much, old friend. look, any republican thinking about anything past 2010 doesn't have his eye on the ball. we have two big races in virginia and new jersey. there's 37 governor races in the entire house of the state of virginia. so, thanks for the idea. my focus in politics is focused on 2010. >> governor barbour i know you were chairman of rnc and partnered to lead the republican revolution. is there any part of you that says republicans are too combative right now in their opposition to president obama and that could ultimately backfire as we saw in '95 and '96 with the government shutdown? >> well, i think what republicans need to do is be for what they think is the right policy. there are several republican

health plans just as there are several democrat health plans, there are several republican ideas about health care reform. but the republican ideas are not going to include a gigantic tax increase on small business. i was very surprised that nobody asked the president last night, how do you reconcile your promise that you wouldn't raise taxes on anybody that makes less than $250,000 with an 8% payroll tax on small businesses, the quintessential middle class, for people whose payrolls are as little as $250,000 a year. this is a giant tax increase on the middle class and it's going to clobber small business. the worst thing about it to me, carlos, at a time when we want to create more jobs, his bill is effectively a tax on job creation, because it will tax people for their payrolls.

>> governor, your successor, couple of times removed michael steele made a speech about the health care bill for which he was greatly criticized. would you share with us your evaluation of how well your successor michael steele is doing as chairman of the republican national committee? >> vernon, that didn't get any news coverage down here, so i don't know exactly what he said. >> every day, governor. >> i try not to. the truth is, vernon, when i was chairman and we were six months into my chairmanmanship, a lot of people criticized me. they criticized me that they didn't think i was visible enough in washington. i was spending too much time out in the states trying to rebuild

the party from the bottom up. and i heard that criticism. i thought what i was doing was right and i stuck with it. i've learned it's not fair to judge somebody's term, including barack obama's, by the first six months. >> governor barbour, what else would you like to see on the national agenda right now. we're obviously spending a lot of time talking about health care. climate change is also out there. if you were advising the president or even advising some of the leaders in the house and senate, what are two or three other items you think we should be discussing? >> well, i would be discussing these two big issues very differently. i think what we need in america is more american, more affordable, and more available energy. i was surprised when senator boxer mentioned as a reason for the climate change bill to reduce foreign oil imports. the obama administration

environmental protection says waxman/markey won't have an effect on oil imports. we do need to reduce oil imports, the way to do that is more production in the united states, more conversion to natural gas, more plentiful than united states. we're the saudi arabia of coal. we need to learn to burn coal cleaner. the waxman/markey bill is going to put a huge penalty, cost, tax on using coal in the united states. i think we ought to be talking about energy. i think we really do need an energy policy, but i think the obama administration and the congress or the democrats in congress, are going in exactly the wrong direction. the same thing to me is true with health care. we do need health care reform. i don't think the reform they are proposing is the reform we

need. >> before you go, let me thank you and the citizens of mississippi for naming the jackson airport for my friend and former colleague medgar evers. that is a great thing and a great man. >> it was absolutely the thing to do. i want to tell you we had the honor, this year we gave ten mississippians the metal of service, his brother. i appreciate you saying that vernon. it's always great to talk to you, even though i can't see you. >> governor barbour, good to have you. next time you're in new york i hope you'll stop by and spend time with us in person. >> thank you very much, carlos. straight ahead, new reports the son of osama bin laden has been killed in u.s.-led strikes over pakistan. plus the arrest of a prominent african-american scholar ignites debate on race relations.

straight ahead, you're watching "msnbc live." i'm carlos watson. i'm robert shapiro. over a million people

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welcome back to "msnbc live." i'm carlos watson. time to fast forward through the stories developing. the mayors of two new jersey cities and state legislator are under arrest part of a widening corruption, laundering conspiracy probe. also connected to a human organ selling ring. also arrested were several rabbis, community leaders. vice president joe biden said in an interview more coalition troops will die in afghanistan but the war was, quote, worth the effort. speaking during a tour of ukraine and georgia, vice president biden told bbc the regional border was, quote, a place if it doesn't get straightened out will wreak havoc on the united states. there are reports one of bin

laden's sons was killed in a missile strike earlier this year. believed 27-year-old saad bin laden was not the target of the u. u. u.s. attacks but still among those killed. president obama weighs in on the arrest of professor gates taken into custody by a white police officer who responded to reports of a break in. turned out it was gates trying to get into his own house. take a listen to what the president had to say yesterday in his news conference. >> i think it's fair to say, number one, any of us would be pretty angry. number two, the cambridge police acted stupidly in arresting somebody when this was already proof they were in their own home. >> joined by msnbc contributor and boston native, mike

barnicle. what do you make of the story as it unfolds, the officer, 42-year-old policeman, same guy 15 or 16 years ago resuscitated boston player reggie lewis, african-american, who was dying? >> well, i think it's important we not start demonizing the police officer right away. we don't know what took place in the house. that said, it speaks to the fact too many people in this country, despite the fact barack obama is in the white house have an unfamiliarity with race. there still remains huge obstacles. race remains the third rail in american life. i don't have to tell you, carlos, or certainly mr. jordan. it happens over and over, not just in cambridge, massachusetts, every big city, small city. if you do into a store, an upscale department store and i go in right alongside of you, odds are store security is going to be looking at you with much more of an eye than they would

be looking at me. >> an apartment building, my dad in new york, manhattan, they tried to kick my dad out of the apartment building he lived in, we live in. vernon, how do you see this issue and what are your thoughts on the president's role? did he speak out too soon? you said early he didn't. >> you can't speak out too soon about racism and injustice. i believe, as i said earlier, that skip gates is going to be all right. he's a harvard professor, a friend of the president. he is my friend, a good friend. but i'm thinking about all of those black men out there, unknown, unlearned, who are daily confronted with police officers, many of whom i defended when i was a young lawyer in the south, who -- police officers who did not care and who showed great disrespect

for the person and their rights. and i can cite you many, many issues. that's the point, the respect plaque -- black men treated by police officers in america. >> what's the next step. what should state legislators, mayors do, the police? >> i think the event in and of itself is instructive. it tells us that the election of barack obama did not automatically erase racism. it did not stop behavior in little towns in the south and little towns in the midwest. it is still there. it is with us. >> mike, your thoughts? >> well, one of the most difficult things perhaps if possible to do in this culture of ours, you can't legislate

decency towards other, whether they are black, hispanic, whatever. that said, one element of this that could have come into play and i don't know if it did was the element of class in cambridge, the town versus gown syndrome. the working class police officer, the famous harvard professor. you're going to talk to me that way? i'll show you. the three most powerful words in this country are, you're under arrest. and they can be uttered only by police officers. you're under arrest. vernon jordan, have you a legendary career, if i say to him in an official capacity you're under arrest, you're no longer vernon jordan. you're someone taken, you're going to have to roll your thumb, have your photograph taken. that's what happened to professor gates. the element of class. i don't know it was there. i don't want to demonize the police officer. that's something we have to look at and further understand. >> there's two things i think

i've been taking into account as to skip gates' reaction. number one, after you've shown a police officer your driver's license and your harvard identification, and if he doesn't get it, that's got to upset you. that's number one. number two, he had just flown to boston from china. he had to be very tired and not operating as he would have had he had some rest. but he was jet lagged and he was tired. so he shows his identification and doesn't get what he thought he was entitled to. and then -- >> in his mind, he's confident if he were white he would have gotten it. i'm sure he was sitting there saying if i were white and in my house, i would have gotten the benefit of the doubt. >> only he can explain that. we don't know what he was thinking. so he had to tell us what he was thinking. we were not there.

at some point he will. >> at the end of the day, two things jump out at me. the first is you have professor gates on the front porch, 12:30 in the afternoon, brilliant sunlight day, someone drove him back to his home. what is going by of the woman passing by who thinks a 68-year-old guy, rather slight, is trying to break into a home. he's dressed well. that's one thing. the other thing, at the end of the day, me trying to nudge the door open to my own home, i don't get arrested. i don't get arrested. >> guys, we're going to go to a quick break. when we come back we'll be joined on a different topic "new york times" david sanger as you heard president biden say the situation in afghanistan could get worse. you're watching "msnbc live." i'm carlos watson. we'll be right back. introducing one a day women's 2o.

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live." i'm carlos watson. a lot going onna lot of hot spots. let's bring in chief correspondent for the "times." david, good to see you. >> good to see you, carlos and you, vernon. >> good to see you. we just had dinner. >> we did, indeed. >> great. >> what do you make of vice president's comments over in ukraine and georgia saying afghanistan is likely to get bloodier but still worth the effort? any thoughts on when that could ultimately ripple forth and become a larger public conversation? >> well, i think it already has become one, carlos. i think it's clear when you do a surge, because that's essentially what's happening in afghanistan today, you're going to create confrontations that are going to create higher casualties. we've already just about seen the crossover where the number of casualties in iraq for the u.s. is fewer than the number in afghanistan. my guess is, sad as this is to

say, that trend will probably continue. >> vern, what do you think? you're a member of the iraqi study group in 2006, bipartisan group. you spent a lot of time thinking about this. what do you think we should do not only in afghanistan but next door in iraq and pakistan? >> i worry about it. i'm reminded the brits were not successful, the russians were not successful. hopefully we will be successful. but i think the intensity of the situation, as it is coming forward tells us that it's going to be a long day and it's going to be very tough. >> do you think the president and your good friend secretary of state hillary clinton are being aggressive enough as it relates particularly to iran and north korea, two places that are in some process of nuclear weapon evolution? >> i think they are playing it about as well as they can play

it right now. >> what are your thoughts, we saw secretary of state hillary clinton speak out in thailand about both those hot spots. seemed to be a little new news there. where do we go in both places, north korea and iran? >> in north korea, the secretary made the statement that she wanted to deal with north korea the way you would deal with a wayward child and ignore it. in fact i think the approach of ignoring the north, that led to nuclear test, the north koreans are stuck in a succession struggle. that's going to make it almost impossible to come to any kind of negotiated solution. so the administration has moved, in fact, into a containment policy. what was interesting about comments on iran is for the first time she suggested the united states would create some kind of defensive shield for the mideast. >> the old reagan star wars

program? >> she wasn't talking about a space shield or nuclear shield, what she was saying was there would be a military as well as diplomatic response. what was interesting was the reaction back here. the first one we got from the administration was she was speaking personally. the second she -- no other official has discussed creating a shield in the mideast. we're not sure what that means or how far that would extend. >> david sanger from the "new york times" times, thanks. look forward to seeing you in new york sometimes. >> good to see you. >> rudy giuliani, his thoughts on the obama administration. >> this administration has shown no ability to cut anything. it's increased spending in many areas three and four times in six months. it's increased spending more

than any administration in our history. i don't see how the american people buys the idea that this president is going to turn into a conservative manager of an entitlement program called health care. >> you'll catch the entire conversation of rudy giuliani here tomorrow. back with one-on-one conversation with ultimate presidential adviser vernon jordan. g b

a lot of disappointment right now. and kids graduating from college, they have no jobs, nowhere to go. and they think obama is like, you know, the magic potion that's going to make this happen. and like i said before, you know, the job of president's a tough job and you learn it as you go. and like most politicians, unfortunately, he's a politician. he made some promises, hopefully he can keep them. >> i sat down with academy award nominee samuel l. jackson for a

one on one on a wide range of topics and he was fairly open. in fact, listen to how samuel l. jackson starts his day. >> i watch "morning joe" when i get up, and then i go through "hardball," "countdown," rachel maddow, and even watch the new guy, ed. >> what do you think of ed? >> it's interesting. i'm getting there with him. >> hey, go ed schultz. my full interview with samuel l. jackson tomorrow. vernon gordon served as a closer adviser to president bill clinton. vernon's also the author of two books "make it plain: standing up and speaking out" and "vernon can read!" you've been close to so many different presidential candidates and presidents. the next six months, what's ahead for him? you've told me before it takes

time before a presidential candidate really becomes a president, even if he's already won. >> yeah, what i think is it is a difficult transition from campaigning to governance. and what i think we saw last night is that he has left the campaign mode. he is into the governance mode. and the governance mode is not only about advocacy, and i give him an "a" for advocacy and for leadership, but he is now at the point of execution and implementation. and that's hard. and that requires negotiation, it requires making sure that your democratic base is where it needs to be, where you want it to be, so that you can deal with the other side of the aisle. i think his most incredible quality in these first six months has been leadership. and he has enhanced the presence

of america in the world. he has brought us back to where we used to be. and i think that that is happening slowly, but surely on domestic issues. i think he's going to get his health care bill. >> you do? >> and i think he's going to get it, because the american people not only need it, but they want it. and i think that the opposition cannot be as i think they have been, lick the lawyer who is in the courtroom, and he -- when the lawyer's against you, you argue the facts. when the facts are against you, you argue the law. when both are against you, you pound the table. and i think that's largely what the republican leadership has been doing, pounding the table. and the president, i think, substantively dealt with that last night, when he was negotiating not with them, i think, but with his own party. >> vernon jordan, thank you. you've not only been a terrific

guest, but the ultimate guest cohost. thank you. >> well, i enjoyed being here. thank you so much. >> look forward to having you again. that does it for us. i want to turn it over to dr. nancy snyderman who's up next. what do you have coming up? we have a lot coming up in this hour, including a developing story in new jersey. a roundup of politicians, rab bi buys and others. plus, i'll talk health care with senator john barrasso, one of only two doctors in the senate about, obviously, the president's health care plan. it's approaching noon on the east coast. the doctor is in. it all starts after a quick break. my name is chef michael. and when i come home from my restaurant, i love showing bailey how special she is. yes, you are. i know exactly what you love, don't i? - [ barks ] - mmm. aromas like rotisserie chicken. and filet mignon. yeah, that's what inspired a very special dry dog food. [ woman ] introducing chef michael's canine creations. so tasty and nutritious it's hard to believe it's dry dog food. chef-inspired. dog-desired.

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coming up today on "dr. nancy," a major bust in new jersey. a human organ selling ring has broken up. arrests today includes politicians and even rabbis. president obama continues his full-court press on health care reform, arriving in cleveland this hour for a town hall meeting after last night's

prime-time news conference. >> a lot of americans may be wondering, what's in this for me? how does my family stand to benefit from health insurance reform? so tonight i want to answer those questions. because even though congress is still working -- >> we'll look at whether the president made good on that promise to tell americans what they'll get with health care reform. plus, the latest developments in the michael jackson case. could the late pop star's personal doctor soon face manslaughter charges? hi, everybody. i'm dr. nancy snyderman. first today, breaking news in new jersey. police say they have made a major corruption bust. we're awaiting a news conference following the arrest of about 30 people, including two new jersey mayors and several rabbis. officials say some of the suspects charged today were selling human organs. the suspects were allegedly involved in taking cash payments to help find organs for payments in need of transplants. it is unclear where the body

parts might have come from or how many surgeries may have been done, and we're hoping to get more information at that news conference in this hour. for more on this, joining me now from boston is bill gavin, an fbi veteran of 28 years and a former assistant director of the agency's new york office. and from philadelphia, dr. arthur kaplan, director of the center for bioethics at the university of pennsylvania. and interestingly, cochair of the u.n. task force on human trafficking. and from washington, d.c., dr. berndeen healey. reports right now that 30 people have been arrested, including a couple of mayors, deputy mayors, rabbis, state assembly men. it certainly sounds like a very large dragnet. >> there's no doubt about it, nancy. it is a large dragnet. the case has been ongoing for a couple of years