turbulence. >> reporter: when those passengers who i assume were mott seat belted in went up how high did they go? >> several hit their heads on the ceiling of the cabin. >> reporter: how quickly did this happen? >> about 30 seconds. >> reporter: okay. you're okay? >> yeah. i'm fine. >> reporter: okay. so there is one of the passengers. >> wow. >> reporter: who clearly is no worse for the wear. but again, 14 people transported to hospitals. others who were injured declined the offer to go to the hospital and just wanted to continue on. it's a boeing 767 which is on the ground and will be inspected for any damage before the plane takes off. >> all right. >> reporter: back to you from miami. >> thank you very much. appreciate that. we'll stay on top of it. the controversy over cash for clunkers heating up. last week it was announced the program would end because money ran out but the house quickly voted to add $1.2 billion to the program. now it's in the hands of the senate where some are lining up against it. the program is credited with boosting sales for struggling automakers. in the next hour, the meeting will get into why some want that

program to stall. we may finally find out what will happen to michael jackson's children and his money. at 11:30 a.m. eastern a judge is expected to finalize a custody agreement reached last week. jackson's mother katherine and his ex-wife debbie rowe will apparently have this agreement but the judge has to approve the details. and the judge will also consider who should have a bigger say over jackson's estate, his mother or the two men jackson named in his will. we'll get a live report from msnbc.com in less than a half hour. a florida family's finally learning their loved one was indeed the first american lost in the gulf war. the original gulf war in 1991. captain speicher's plane was shot down in january of 1991 but he was listed as missing action. after 18 years his remains were identified in iraq over the weekend. today a family spokesperson talked about the family's reaction. >> overwhelming sadness is of course the first emotion that

comes to people when you're searching for a loved one who you believe is alive and who turns out not to be. so i would have to describe it in that manner. >> an iraqi citizen led military officials to the location of captain speicher's body. bedouins had reportedly buried it near the original crash site. the question still remains how did he die? the family believes captain speicher ejected from the plane before it crashed and may have been killed on the ground. president obama reportedly is considering cutting off iran's gas imports if that country won't negotiate its nuclear program. the new york times reports obama wants iran at the negotiating table. iran has plenty of oil but few refineries for turning it into gasoline. if successful it would affect about 40% of iran's gas imports. earlier today iran's supreme

leader formally endorsed mahmoud ahmadinejad's second term as president. ahmadinejad will formally be sworn in wednesday. the ayatolla is demanding an end to protests. ruthless crackdowns killed at least 20 people. hundreds have been arrested. demonstrators insist the june 12th election was rigged. the swiss embassy in tehran is working on america's behalf to find out more about three american hikers picked up when they accidently crossed from iraq into iran. we still don't have word on where the americans are being held. all those developments still being watched from iran. >> thank you. joining us now the author of "how to win a cosmic war" and also contributor to the daily beast.com has been writing extensively about the reform movement in iran. also with us for the two hours, the author of "the black swan" and widely essayist at this point on the systems that run our economy and how they have failed us. and more importantly, how we can

fix them. also with us jonathan capehart, msnbc editorial writer for "the washington post" and certainly a panelist here at the meeting keeping us up to speed as he does so gracefully and wonderfully every day on the comings and goings in washington, d.c. and the policy debates. the first part of my question i suppose is whether there is any chance ahmadinejad doesn't ultimately end up in this job. whatever the theater is in getting there, is the end game six months from now president ahmadinejad take two? >> there is no question that ahmadinejad will be inaugurated as president and begin his second term on august 5th. that isn't necessarily good news for ahmadinejad or for the conservative movement in iran. you know, in many ways this is when the real problems begin for him because he has had an enormous amount of time even during his first term in trying to get the parliament to approve his cabinet ministers in making

sure people both on the reformist side and the conservative side are onboard with his agenda and now with all of the election controversy in iran he's going to find this even harder at a time in which he really needs to figure out a way to bring greater investments into iran particularly investment from europe and even north america because iran's economy is really teetering on the edge of collapse. you heard the report about iran's inability to actually refine its own oil. it sits on the second largest supply of oil and natural gas on the planet and yet has to import 40% of its gasoline at a huge economic loss and so at this point right now ahmadinejad gets about two more days before he inherits this mess. >> jonathan capehart, how much momentum, how real is any threat out of washington to try to organize an embargo or sanctions to eliminate flow of refined gasoline into iran?

>> well, apparently the administration is already talking to its european allies and also israel about possible sanctions, but they won't be able to really talk with other allies until they all meet in new york for the u.n. general assembly in mid september. so i think between now and then the administration is hopefully i think from their perspective going to lay the groundwork for possible action against iran. here's the problem. china and russia. they have veto power and are on the security council and if the united states can't bring them along then actually nothing will happen. >> reza, what is your sense of the environment on the ground in iran? in other words, if you look at the imagery immediately following the election the apparent chaos, at least that which is represented through still pictures and video which i recognize as selects for that in many cases, people point the camera at where the problem is, but with that said, where do we stand day to day in tehran, in

iran compared to where we were a month ago? >> well, don't let the diminished numbers on the streets fool you. this protest movement is alive and well and it really feels as though the momentum has shifted to it, primarily because there's been enormous fracturing within the conservative, the hard line movement, itself. some of ahmadinejad's biggest allies during the elections have very publicly turned against him. some of ayatolla khomeini's closest advisors including the speaker of the parliament and the former foreign minister who is a very close personal aide have been very vocal in criticizing ahmadinejad and the way that he's handled the election crisis. so the reformers are becoming more consolidated, more well organized at a time in which the conservatives are beginning to fracture and fall apart. >> understood. >> i think that riots have very

interesting dynamics. >> what do you mean? >> we saw it with the previous revolution in iran that what happened is that you have, and also we saw it in eastern europe, you have a slow movement that can suddenly explode. you never know when. you don't know under which circumstances. >> what the catalyst will be. >> but you know that there is a pent up revolution. >> the energy is accumulating. >> exactly. and then the resistance can stop suddenly. and then the party -- >> so whether it was this election or what happened in eastern europe or whether it 's mid-term congressional elections on a smaller level there are a lot of different ways. your point is the power dynamic will shift as the energy for change intensifies. >> exactly. >> it's a matter of when. >> it can be very sudden. it can take years of build up and then the revolution can

happen. everything can happen in a very short period of time. >> much like we saw with the financial markets with the build up and the explosion. >> identical. >> reza, thank you. nassim and jonathan are staying. we'll take a break. senator jim webb with the new gi bill and, boy, could we use a bill like that at a time like this. we'll talk to the senator. with thousands of course poised to come home from iraq. a man who wrote the bill. does it help with our veterans' problems ranging from high suicide rates to search for work? we'll have the conversation. when i was seventeen summer days were not good to my skin. (announcer) new neutrogena total skin renewal. it's clinically tested to help undo the look of a year's worth of skin aging in just one week. do-overs do exist. (announcer) total skin renewal neutrogena.

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all right. welcome back. two hours from now the president going to speak in virginia. for once it's not about health care but the new gi bill. what are we looking at here? >> already on a roll. tuition payments to soldiers began this weekend but we'll see the formal announcement at george mason university. the government is allotting $78 billion for the post 9/11 gi bill over the next decade. this new legislation offers benefits to any member of the military who served on active duty for at least three months at any time since 9/11. it would cover all tuition and fees for in-state universities plus money for housing and if a veteran wants to go someplace more pricey then the government will match whatever comes out of his or her own pocket. in addition, if the soldier agrees to serve an extra four years the benefits can be transferred to spouses or children. already the va says about 100,000 claims have been processed and expects nearly 500,000 could participate in the coming year. quite a big change from 65 years ago when fdr first started the

gi bill. >> and the education bill sounds lovely. the question is whether it is enough. are military men and women getting not only education but mental health support they need when they get home? are they getting the physical health support they need when they come home? virginia democratic senator jim webb joins from us fairfax, virginia, and will be with the president today for all of these conversations. he, in fact, authored this bill, guided it through congress in addition to which he served with the marines in vietnam, himself. his son also a marine who served in iraq. in addition, nassim is with us as is jonathan capehart. senator, i'm going to begin with you. walk us through, in brief, what makes this -- what changes because of this bill? in other words, what is now available to our veterans because of this bill that was not available before the bill? >> well, basically we're going to be giving our veterans the same educational entitlements as those who served during world

war ii which was the goal of the bill. previous to this, they had a monthly stipend which in many cases wouldn't even cover community college expenses so we've raised the benefit to the level of the service that the people have been giving since 9/11 and it's graduated. it's not quite as simple as it was explained in the preamble in terms of how you get your entitlements. but i believe, i'm going to respond a little bit to the questions that were being asked in terms of helping people through other issues. >> that's where i was headed which is in addition to education what do you do with mental health and physical health? >> well, this is -- on a clinical side those have always been addressed but this is the kind of thing that we need in terms of preempting a lot of these problems. i was the first vietnam veteran to serve as a full committee

councilman in congress 32 years ago and we worked on all of these issues, post traumatic stress being among them. and one of the key factors in terms of the proper readjustment to civilian life after military service is the country demonstrating how they value that service. there is no better way than to say you're going to have a chance at a first class future. for every dollar that was paid into the world war ii program we got $7 back in tax because of successful lives. >> i want to bring this team into this if only because this is the sort of decision making as a country and as a system you love. explain why you love this. >> compare this to cash for clunkers. cash for clunkers, we're rewarding people for having made the wrong decisions in the past. >> right. >> they did the wrong thing. we're giving them $4500 to do something else. >> right. >> you're rewarding people.

so it's a handout to people who made mistakes and -- >> you're rewarding people for making bad decisions. >> people who made the right decisions are not rewarded. same thing with the banking rescue. you're rewarding bankers. >> okay. >> this is very different. number one you're not rewarding people who made mistakes. you are rewarding people who -- >> who risked their lives on our behalf. >> exactly. these people usually have difficulties reintegrating into civilian life and this is a great place to put them. >> okay. >> and three you're not giving them money. you're giving them a skill. it's very different. never give money to a begger. teach him a skill. you're giving him knowledge. you're giving him something. >> teach a man to fish. >> exactly. how to fish. instead of giving him fish. >> senator, if you look at that teach a man to fish and then also the awareness of the trauma

of fighting in a war that you are familiar with. i quite honest liam not. our children have been fighting these wars coming home. how do you reintegrate to a society where sort of this everybody is sitting around having these conversations from a world where, the lawless world, a world in combat? >> well, there's nothing better that a country can say to someone who has had to go through that than we value your service so much that we're going to give you a first class shot at the future. here's something people forget. i serve on the armed services committee now and i hear all the discussions about the iraq war, military service. we are not an all career military. we're all volunteer military. but 75% of the people that go in the army and 70% of those who go in the marine corps leave on or before the end of their first enlistment so these people are

re-entering society and they're the ones who are kind of lost in the shuffle between taking care of the military to go out and go back into afghanistan and iraq and the problems that other people have been having in terms of readjustment. i can't think of a better thing to do. it's not the only thing we should do but i can't think of a better thing than to turn around and say here. you got a shot at a first class future. >> dylan? >> senator, sort of a fly in the ointment question here. is there already a dedicated pot of money to fund what you want to do in this bill? and if not, where will the money come from? >> well, this is a program that passed congress on an appropriations bill last year. and it grew in terms of the transferability provision which wasn't in the original bill, where the career people can transfer benefits to their family members. but, hey. nobody asked at the end of world

war ii how much is this going to cost? what they said is how much do we value your service? and if you want to argue these other kinds of programs we're spending $19 billion a year last year for educational grants for people without any sort of service given. so if you want to start measuring money, this is a place where the money's been earned the hard way. >> no kidding. particularly when you compare the money that was stolen with american capital in the financial markets at the same time. it would be a tragedy if we were able to deploy $14 trillion at the fed and a few trillion at the treasury to support bank thieves but can't come up with enough money to educate our soldiers, senator. i hope you are aggressive in the fight to maintain funding for something like this. >> we'll get that money back. we'll get that money back in quality careers. i'm convinced. just as in world war ii. >> i agree. now if we can solve too big to fail we'll be all set. senator webb, thank you so much. more to come on "the morning

meeting" including talk of new taxes on the middle class. no restructuring in the banking system mind you but new taxes on the middle class. plus, the drama surrounding michael jackson's children continues. let me tell you about...

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to college? oh, you get a degree and a job. come on. ridiculous. >> goodness. >> yeah. you know, remember the tool bag that was dropped from space by the astronaut? she has a long name. she dropped the backpack sized kit november 18th, 2008. finally it's coming home. it's going to re-enter the atmosphere. >> it doesn't burn up? >> no, no. it does. we'll watch for the fireball here. they say no danger in like a wrench being dropped on your head because it'll burn up before then. a $100,000 tool bag by the way. kind of an expensive thing to drop. >> yeah. >> paul mccartney really loves the first lady. in fact, so much that when he was giving his concert nearby the white house he dedicated "michelle" the very famous song to honor the first lady. it says over and over again "i love you."

i think it's meant with admiration. right. you're incredible. i love you. >> you are magical and mystical. >> sing it. >> no, i won't be singing. speaking of singers, still ahead a little michael jackson for you. the family drama continues this time to a courtroom. plus, the morning meeting and the battle over health care continues. before we re-engage we'll get an update as to where we stand, what's been passed and what hasn't. what happens next? [ female announcer ] the results are in. beauty editors and research institutes are seeing results. [ male announcer ] best cleanser, essence magazine. hydrates better than the $350 cream. [ female announcer ] most importantly, women are seeing results. and still no drastic measures. olay regenerist.

all right. good morning to you. welcome to "the morning meeting." i am dylan ratigan. a cash for clunkers controversy, the popular program, the question is whether it's worth another $2 billion of reward paid by the taxpayer to owners of clunkers and for that matter to clear the bad inventory of the carmakers. again on the taxpayers' backs. good idea or bad? i don't know. the jackson family saga continues in court today. will there be any surprises? then facebook coming under fire. why the leader of the catholic church in england says face book and social networking websites like it are killing teenagers.

the opening bell on wall street sounding. you'll hear a lot of earnings and stock market, up stock market, down, as far as i can tell the only number that matters this week is the one on friday which will tell us all that taxpayer money thrown at our banks, carmakers, and economy, is generating jobs or not or if it's simply empowering broken institutions to continue to perpetrate the same broken practices against the american people. watch the jobs number to know whether in fact any of the money taxpayers are putting in is coming out, not just this friday but every first friday of every month. before we get into jobs and economy let's do a little health care and where we stand on that right now the white house intending to keep up the pressure for sure as they go into this recess which includes health and human services secretary kathleen sebelius to hold yet another round table this morning. joining us from washington, d.c. is c.c. connelly, national health policy reporter for "the washington post." c.c., welcome back.

in brief, before we get into any policy debate, will they, won't they, should they, shouldn't they, just give us the update. where do we stand on efforts to reform health care in america? is there legislation anywhere that has been passed being evaluated? what's going on? >> well, dylan, good morning. it's great to be back. what's happened so far is that four different congressional committees, three over in the house, one in the senate, have approved versions of a bill that would extend health insurance coverage to many millions of americans. each has a requirement that every american carry insurance. there are provisions in those that also require businesses to chip into the costs so we're seeing some similarities in those bills. there are different twists to each. and the house has now gone out on a long recess. they won't be back until september so that's as far as we're getting in the house. over in the senate we're watching for this senate finance committee. it's the one committee that's trying to do a bipartisan bill. but they have indicated that

they're going to be back in september working on it as well. >> is the senate finance committee, correct me if i'm wrong, the one run by max bachus and is max bachus the one who has been one of the largest recipients of health? in other words where is the lobbying money going? now connect the legislation to who is getting bank rolled by doctors, hospitals, patients if there are any patient-based pacs, health insurance companies or anybody else. who's paying who to do what? >> well, yes. we do know that senator max bachus is the chairman of that committee, has received a good bit of industry support over the years. that's not terribly surprising. both democrats and republicans on some of these influential committees, so the senate finance committee, over in the house, the ways and means committee, the energy and commerce committee, those are the folks that tend to get a lot of those industry contributions because, frankly, they're always the ones that are passing or stopping the legislation that has to do with those industries. >> understood.

here's the interesting thing. you talk about systems and i brought a bunch of dolls out here the other day and i had a patient, a doctor, a hospital, a drug company, and an insurance executive and the government. and my question was how do you create a system in the interest of the patient? bizarre though that may be, the idea of creating a health care system that serves the patient as opposed to serves the health insurance company or somebody else seems kind of a crazy concept. our politicians receive a ton of money from people who aren't patients. >> yes. >> how do you even begin to form a system that serves the patient when the government is in the control of those who made money at the expense of the patient? >> well, i think you're bringing up -- >> it's a good point because i believe that the health care system acts now in reducing life expectancy of patients. >> why do you believe that? >> over treatment. if you treat someone who needs the treatment you are extending his life. if you go beyond the necessary,

you are over treating patients. and we have the numbers. the numbers are between 120,000 and 400,000 americans die every year from medical mistakes. >> right. >> you see? so the more money you throw at the system -- >> what about the statistics that say life expectancy is doubled. >> that is not because of over treatment. it's doubled because of penicillin. it's doubled because you don't have violent crime as much as we had years ago. if you look at the numbers you realize that if i treat someone with severe symptoms i'm going to extend his life. if i give statin drugs to someone who is semihealthy i reduce his life expectancy. if i operate on you tomorrow you have one in 100,000 chance of dying just from anesthesia. another chance of having paralysis from medical error. hospital viruses. >> sure. >> so you have something that people are neglecting which is

what i call the mistakes made. so when you throw a lot of money at health care, people start getting sicker not better. >> understood. >> that's where we are. the real reason is that the medical establishment is commercially driven. they want to make their money. >> i understand. ceci, here's my question. the insurance guy wants to make his money. he's sending money to washington saying make sure i make my money. then the drug company is saying the same thing. then the doctor understandably, right, the hospital company is there anybody that you can think of that represents the patient? is there anybody in washington, d.c. who is having a patient driven health care conversation as bizarre and peculiar a concept as that may be? >> you mean besides you and me, right, dylan? >> i know there are others. i wouldn't presume that. >> sure. >> but i'm more concerned about the, specifically the people that we pay one-third of our taxes to to run the government for the people by the people of the people. >> right. >> as far as i can tell the patients are the people and yet

they're running it on behalf of this guy or these people. how do we change that? >> well, i think you're bringing up an excellent point. there are a number of consumer organizations and patient groups that are involved in this debate. generally speaking they don't have the kind of big money that those industry players have and i think that's worth pointing out. we can have whole programs having to do with campaign finance. >> right. i get that. so what should the american people do right now? >> here's what you do. >> to make a patient-driven debate this fall. >> their elected officials are home in the districts for the next five weeks. you've been talking about how there are going to be these town hall meetings. i know a number of members of congress who do teletown halls. thousands and thousands of their constituents are participating in these events. and let me tell you, elected officials do pay attention when their constituents complain about something or say they want something or don't want something. they know that they're up for re-election in 2010 and they're

going to be home listening for these next five weeks. >> all right. again, my question is, health care. would you rather have it in the best interests of this guy or the best interests of this guy? that's the only question. ceci, i hope to see you soon. >> thank you. >> national health policy reporter at "the washington post." you want to talk to the insurance man or the doctor? >> the problem is, don't ask a barber if he needs a hair cut. that's the first problem. you should ask someone else if he needs a hair cut. >> but the problem is doctors have a perceived and real level of expertise relative to everybody else. >> yes. >> so if -- i can go to contessa and say should i go get my hair cut but i can't go to contessa and say should i go to the doctor? >> that's the biggest expert problem. >> she'd say yes. you have other news, however. >> yes, i do. let's look right now. we're looking to los angeles, a key day in court for some of michael jackson's legal affairs

at this point a los angeles judge today will try to start unraveling a number of legal issues surrounding the death of michael jackson. among the issues custody of jackson's three children and his huge estate. let's go to msnbc.com's courtney hayes outside the courthouse in los angeles. this custody deal that was reported between katherine jackson the grandmother and debbie rowe the mother, pretty much a done deal? >> pretty much a done deal. it's basically going to be a rubber stamp situation. they figured that out last week which is fantastic because really where the focus needs to go is on the will, itself. what we're talking about there is what michael jackson is worth, how is it going to get divided, who is going to be in charge of his will? we know he is worth about $500 million but the value of his estate is much less only about $100 million. you can knock it up to about $200 million with financial restructuring. another thing the judge is going to be thinking about today, an allowance for katherine jackson. she has no cash on hand to

support herself because michael jackson was the one supplying her with day-to-day living expenses. another really interesting point, contessa and dylan, she is going to find out whether she can challenge the administrators of this will without triggering a no contest clause within the will. if you challenge a will and there is a no contest clause, and you lose, you lose everything you stood to gain in the will so they're going to figure out just how far she can go with that. >> all right. courtney, thanks for keeping us in the loop. we'll keep our eye on it today. >> how much longer do we have to stay in the michael jackson loop? >> at least until the custody issue is decided and until the estate is awarded. >> that seems reasonable. >> yes. >> i think also until you find out what's going to happen to that doctor. >> right. how could i have left that out? >> my goodness. >> the criminal part of this and whether there will be criminal charges. you're so smart. >> yes. >> we're going to find out the cause of death. >> right. nassim is itching by the way to know the cause of death. >> there we go.

over treated. >> we talked about that before. the obama administration is looking to create a prison complex in the united states to house detainees from guantanamo bay. the administration is eying possible locations, a military penitentiary at fort leavenworth, kansas among others. a news conference will be held in about 20 minutes to discuss the reports. a lot of them are saying not in my back yard. after having a beer at the white house last week harvard professor henry gates able to joke about his arrest. he told a crowd he liked crowley, the sergeant who arrested him, and the two hit it off. >> you know, why not? i offered to get his kids into harvard. if he doesn't arrest me ever

again. he came up to me and said you look taller in your mug shot. >> there were some serious moments as well with gates saying he has received death threats and bomb threats stemming from his july 16th arrest. check out this video. we got it in -- from a news source in turkey here. building just totally -- not a good way to start the week. that was supposed to be an implosion actually, a building demolition. >> that was a tipping point. >> i've heard of those before. but it narrowly missed an apartment there when it rolled over. nobody got hurt amazingly. >> what was, they were supposed to blow that building up? >> yeah. it was supposed to implode for demolition and instead kind of rolled over. >> so like those vegas videos when you see the hotel come down. instead they just knocked it over. i like that. it got us our tipping point joke. a lot more ahead at "the

morning meeting." new talk of taxes on the middle class as bankers continue to reap billions and politicians refuse to address too big to fail. an interesting country we live in these days. we'll talk about taxation without representation at the top of the hour. plus, facebook. some argue it's a liability for our children to the point that it is adding to the suicide rate. that's the case being made by the leader of the catholic church in england. we'll have the conversation in the next hour here. (announcer) that ball is going, going, gone! home run! (announcer) he's sweet. even with one third less sugar than soda. kool-aid. delivering more smiles per gallon. 90s slacker hip-hop.hird less sugar than soda. ♪ that can strain your relationships and hurt yourody 'cause we'pride ♪ng a ride ♪ ♪ it's the credit roller coaster ♪ ♪ and as you can see it kinda bites! ♪

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good morning. the head of the roman catholic church in england says sites like facebook are leading to teens committing suicide. archbishop vincent nichols believes teens are more interested in the quantity of friends than in their quality

and this puts kids at risk of suicide when those friendships break down. he says among young people often a key factor in their committing suicide is the trauma of transient relationships. they throw themselves into a friendship or network of friendships. then it collapses. and they're desolate. pope benedict has a facebook page. recently the vatican introduced his official facebook application, pope to you, with a little numeral 2. he is urging young people to use the internet responsibly. what's up with that? >> all right. your thoughts? >> well, just because he is the archbishop nichols and is a religious figure we tend to pooh pooh that and say here is another moral leader telling kids what to do. he is so out of touch. in fact he does have a point. i think he overstates the point. i don't think facebook leads to suicide. >> sure. >> there are kids who have transient relationships, too

electriconically plugged in and need a proper balance but he has a point. we need to be careful the virtual friends do not take over the personal relationships kids should have. >> the problem is not there. the problem is that when you live in 2-d space, you're living on a screen, you're not -- >> i don't think we disagree on that at all. we all believe that two dimensional living, life, is not good for a human being. whether it leads to suicide or not. >> i think to balance that, we know that kids are plugged into that. it's part of their lives. but it shouldn't be the major part of their lives. they do their home work by it. they do research by it. it's a way of living for all of us now but we have to find the right balance. >> weren't children -- when i was growing up the kids who were somewhat isolated and not having normal relationships were down in their basements playing

dungeons and dragons. it seems dragons. is seems like there was always a virtual world. >> or reading comic books. >> right. it's a different way of living a virtual life now. >> i'm not sure. i have the impression a lot of people would stay home and connect on the web rather than just go out and my idea of life is meeting people, human contact. >> there are more people doing what nassim is discussing. jonathan? >> you can't have a conversation about facebook and not allow me to talk about it, since i'm a bit of an addict and a lot of my friends deal with that. >> we're going to introduce healing. >> and intervention. >> yes. >> the problem is i don't allow facebook to replace one-on-one friendships. actually leaving my apartment and sitting across from a real person and having a real conversation. and i think that is the danger here. facebook cannot replace real friends. and these folks who allow

facebook to be their only way of relating to people, i think, sets themselves up for a really painful and isolated future. >> that's right. we shouldn't condemn them because contessa is absolutely correct. back in the day we had dungeons and dragons and kids like me, the in other words who read comic books all the time. >> isolate. >> isolated. we need to rescue them and push them. we need to push them out there and make sure that they have friendships with others, that they are out there playing, that they are not just playing on the internet. >> how to relate to other people. >> jonathan is not a socially isolated person. he has the ability to sit and carry on an interesting conversation, normally, i'm kidding. >> and he is good-looking and a bit of a nerd, i have to tell you that. >> aren't the people you're talking about -- if these kids are at risk of eventually suicide because their online friends disappear, isn't that -- these are socially isolated kids anyway, right? >> but we have to look at something here. those kids who do commit suicide

are kids perhaps who had some mental instability, even though they may not have the mental health history, these are kids, who as you say, were isolated and may eventually lead to depression. >> is there another thing. i think when you meet someone in person, you have the chemistry. >> read the body language and so on. >> whatever is activated in your brain, we don't quite understand, it's complex. >> sure. >> is good for you. when you correspond with someone on the web, you know, the flaming wars, things people write on the web that they would never say in person to your face. >> of course. >> like -- right. >> the -- >> digital universe allows human disengagement and allows assault and racism and anything else -- >> let's not forget cyberbullying. 42% of our kids have been affected by cyberbullying. some of those things like megan meier have led to suicide. we need to be careful and

archbishop nicholas does have a point. >> thank you very much, doctor. >> i am catholic. i have the scars to prove it. >> speaking of computers as your father ask stupid computer questions? well, we've got a guy so fed up by his dad's stupid computer questions, he made a video about it on youtube. that's the next hour here at the "morning meeting." stupid dad questions about the computer. >> has layer russ. >> hilarious. >> imagine that i found an internet. >> a web page? >> is that a thing where i would see a picture of a horse? >> could be. could be. >> great!

contessa, is what is in the

break room? something fun and ridiculous, maybe an animal of some sort from outer space in i don't know. >> this is ridiculous. ryan o'neal apparently hit on his own daughter at farrah fawcett's burial. "vanity fair" said he just put the casket in the hearse when a beautiful blond woman comes up and embraces me. i said do you have a drink on you? do you have a car? she said, daddy, it's me, tatum! i kid you not. "vanity fair" asked tatum about it and she said, quote, that's our relationship in a nutshell. you make of it what you will. yeah. by the way, he said he should have never had kids and after that admission, i am tending to agree with him. you want to talk about computers replacing people? it's happened. this is from japan. look at this. our producer shannon called this the dancing robot.

but this does look like a dancing robot. they are supposed to be making noodles but i don't see how. they say they are turning out bowls of noodles at this japan noodle shop but this really just looks like -- this is not -- >> this looks like a robot that got knocked on his ass and is trying to get up. >> wow. i don't really know what to make of this. where are the noodles? i'm hungry! >> if that's who is taking over, i'm not that afraid, i'll be honest. >> no wonder she called it the dancing robot! okay. it's not dance friday. it's now dance monday but every day should be a dance day. robot is the dance. >> thank you so much for that. ahead in the second hour of the "morning meeting," is the economic rebound from the president's economic team this weekend about the economy improving? also talk of raising taxes on the middle class. i notice no talk of getting rid of too big to fail.

the treasury secretary says we'll do whatever it takes, except get rid of the giant banks that are taking all of our money. we are back after this. good monday morning. i'm meteorologist bill karins. your business travel forecast today. a couple of trouble spots. showers rolling towards chicago and also we've had a couple of showers early today around oklahoma city. but the big cities today, airports should be just fine. boston, d.c. and atlanta and detroit should have no issues at all. hot in phoenix as you'd expect and also warm there in denver. have a great day. for dazzling white teeth, give toothpaste the brush off.

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10:00 a.m. in the east and 7:00 a.m. on the west coast. second hour the "morning meeting" continuing as we reach our agenda for the hour. ter rifg terrifying flight for paerges. no bad weather at the time so what happened? we'll get into the latest plane drama this morning. then is the economic rebound real? the stock market is up. so why is secretary geithner talking about raising taxes on the middle class and why do we have 14 trillion dollars hidden at the fed and a few trillion dollars at the treasury? why doesn't anyone want to talk about that? lobbyists and their dirty tricks. interesting they represent the banks and health care insurance companies. we are looking the tactics the lobbyists use and why it is they so aggressively fight the light of transparency. in fact, some of them go so far

to send fake letters from their constituents to congressmen to try to get them to vote their way. you wonder why our country is a little screwy. michael jackson saga heads to the courts in an hour as a judge will consider who gets custody of jackson's kids and who controls the king of pop's estate. does your dad call you day and night asking stupid commuter questions? we will talk to someone so frustrated by his dad, he made a cartoon about it. it's 10:00 a.m. pull up a chair and join the "morning meeting." lots going on this monday morning. should americans out of work really believe the economy is getting better? should congress approve 2 billion more dollars for the forearm? and why does our program continue to deal with the real problem of too big to fail in our banking system and distract us with all of these

conversations? i do not know. first, contessa brewer has breaking news that we're following on the plane front. >> this is out of miami. turbulence has forced a continental airplane jet to make emergency landing in miami and heading from houston to rio de janeiro. continental airlines said nine people had to be taken on the hospital. on the phone is claudio de campo. what are you learning? >> what can i tell you is that 168 passengers and crew were on board. they were about 30 feet in the air 50 miles north of the dominican republic when fierce turbulence shook the plane. continental airlines flight 120 departed rio de janeiro, brazil and head to go houston, texas. the flight made emergency landing at miami international airport at 5:45 this morning. 26 people had injuried and 22 are in stable condition and four

are in serious condition. in total, 14 people were taken to area hospitals and others were also treated here on the scene. now, the uninjured passengers and those that were treated and released on the scene stayed aboard the plane for several hours while continental officials decided what to do. then later o they were able to deplane and allowed to go through customs and now they are boarding other flights and most passengers that i spoke with are leaving on later flights and those flights going back to houston at about 12:30 this afternoon. the fate of michael jackson's children and his estate are at stake this morning. at 11:30 a judge expected to finalize the custody agreement reached last week between his mother and ex-wife debbie rowe. the judge will consider who has should have a bigger say over the jackson's estate the mom or two men named by jackson in his will. we have a live report coming up in less than half an hour.

attorneys for o.j. simpson will ask a panel of nevada judges to let hichl out of prison. he is serving 9 to 33 years for kidnapping and assault during an armed robbery in september of 2007. white house is working on a tough economic cell trying to convince americans the recession is coming to an end even though unemployment numbers will keep going on. on "meet the press," lauren summers said friday's gdp numbers prove there is light at the end of the tunnel. >> i think if you look at the overall output statistics, the gdp as economists call it, very great likelihood -- and this is was most professional forecasters say -- is that we'll see growth going forward in the second half of this year. >> however, unemployment numbers expected out on friday are expected to show that jobless rate closing in on 10% and neither summers nor treasury secretary tim guy geithner would

rule out a middle class tax hike to pay for the government spending. >> we need to bring the deficit down very dramatically and to a level where the amount we're borrowing from the world is stable at a reasonable level and that is going to require some very hard choices. >> yeah. that's coming amid a renewed effort to clamp down on wall street. the huge bonuses. senior adviser valerie jarrett said this weekend there needs to be checks and balances to eliminate what she called this huge disconnect between what big ceos get paid and what average americans are. on friday, the house authorized the fec to ban incentives if they believe it might endanger the economy. dylan? >> this stuff just makes me laugh. i want to bring nassim into the conversation and bill intersectenstein joins the conversation and jonathan capehart is still here. bill, you're the new conversation in the conversation this morning. when you listen to summers, geithner, et cetera, talk about how the economy is functioning,

how we may need to raise taxes on the middle class, yet, you see they completely avoid too big to fail and they completely avoid the restructuring of wall street, which turned from an engine to drive money into the economy and they basically going back to ten years turning into an engine to take money out of the economy and refuse to talk about the elephant in the room while they talk about new taxes for people. what can we do to crystallize for people what we're talking about so we can get over this game of misdirect? >> well, i think it's hard to get people focused right now because, obviously, the stock market done better and the economy had a little bit of a bounce, a lot is because of the massive amount of money printing, so called easing taken place on the part of the fed. >> that is like vicodin for people. >> exactly. so the economy collapsed as the

financial system collapsed. now, the economy is doing a little bit better because, a, it was due for a bounce and, b, all of this money has been printed, so the stock market is up and all of the people who didn't see this coming now say everything is going to be rosy. now, the economy probably will do a by better but the retractable problem is unemployment because we hallowed out the economy so badly when we had the real estate bubble. which was because of the craziness that went on on wall street as regulators didn't do their job and wall street misbehaved. while it's outrageous that these companies that would be closing down or would be gone had it not been for the government pay these garr gant tuan bonuses. >> i mean, a clear connection between taking money out of the system without introducing value which is what the parlor games and ponzi schemes.

investment creates balance. if i put money to work with a business idea you have and you're able to create jobs that is a beautiful thing. if i create a ponzi scheme where i stick you with the losses and keep the wings of course, the economy is going to collapse because i'm taking money out and putting nothing back in. how do i restructure this or how do i create regulations and/or enforcement so that investment actually pushes money in as opposed to pretending to be an investor and then taking the money out? >> the first thing that we need to look at is that wall street runs the government in a way. they have -- their bonuses -- >> no, no. former ceo of goldman sachs last fall decided not exactly change for delivering trls of dollars of a national capital to the banks. >> exactly. they ran both governments. the clinton administration and

the -- administration. we know the interests of wall street are preserved. you have some kind of bribe. you work for the government and work for goldman sachs later. >> too big to fail and cops working for the crooks. what can we do to force wall street into a value creation as opposed to value extraction model? >> defragilize the economy and definancialize it. definancialize it, get rid of, you know, make it the ratio finance lower and lower the debt. >> sure. don't i definancialize the economy by creating rules on people on wall street to make money by investing? in other words, if i make money by speculating with your money and i keep the winnings and you take the losses that is the awesome game to play who is the richest and i can get richer that way but it's a delts mental to the economy. whereas, if i use wall street to drive the money of this country into our businesses that would

seem to be beneficial to the economy. i feel like we've lost that. >> well, you just said that so well. the tricky part is how do you reorient your -- your question is how do you reorient wall street what it seemed to used to be versus the big casino it seems to be right now where they can lever up and take the gains and we take the losses. the problem is, i think, when government starts to make rules, generally, they make rules that unintended consequences are worse. one thing that -- i think a step in that direction might be to do something whereby if these banks that have been given tarp money should have a am of time amount of time to pay it back and if they can't, they should be liquidated. at least consequences to the last go-round and it ought to be made clear there is no more too big to fail. i mean, if these institutions start to go they will be

nationalized and shut down and not paid bonuses and all that. >> jonathan, i'm three minutes over. >> i had a question for your two guests. what is the likelihood do they think of a jobless recovery? i keep hearing about the fact that, you know, unemployment is a lacking indicator. is it possible that these numbers rebound, but the unemployment numbers continue to go up? >> nassim? >> i agree with everything bill said, except that the economy is doing better. what do you mean the economy is doing better? today, it's sicker than it was last month. we're sick at -- >> measured by what measure? >> number of people employed. by overall wealth has dropped. we are sicker today than we were last month. >> you're saying measuring the economy based on whether wall street can function again, but we're making wall street function by straggling the rest of the economy some. >> wall street is not -- does not indicate anything, except some expectation by the margin of player, all right?

it can collapse tomorrow and rise tomorrow, it should not matter much. let's not look at wall street. look at the number of employed people are dropping and a lot of people running out of benefits, okay? people are not consuming more. we still have the same problem we had before. >> if you could reinstate the rules of capitalism the people with capital could only make money by investing it as opposed to speculating with it as opposed to pushing risk away? i don't see how capitalism works with people with capital don't invest the capital. >> the way i see the solution is necessary to row lower the debt now. we have to lower the debt. if you lower the level of debt you have more robust ground to restart. >> this conversation, obviously, is going to continue for years, i suspect. bill, thank you for the time this morning. much more to come on -- or in this hour of the "morning meeting," including dirty tricks by the lobbyists, how far will they go to influence power and maintain control of the government on behalf of either the banks, the health insurance

companies, the trial lawyers? they will go pretty far, apparently. we'll talk about it coming up. my name is chef michael. and my dog bailey and i love to hang out in the kitchen... so she can watch me cook. you just love the aromas of beef tenderloin... and, ooh, rotisserie chicken. yes, you do. barks ] yeah. you're so special, you deserve a very special dog food. [ woman ] introducing chef michael's canine creations. the deliciously different way to serve up your love at mealtime. chef-inspired. dog-desired. chef michael's canine creations.

progressive. call or click today. how far will some lobbyists go to get what they want? how about forging letters? one website uncovered one case that happened in virginia. tom perriello received five letters supposedly sent by a spanish vaed advocacy group voicing opposition to the measure. turns out at least one was completely forged. an employee at the washington lobbying firm bonner and associates sent a letter claiming to be representing the hispanic advocacy group and bonner and associates confirms it actually happened.

a representative of the nonprofit involved says, quote. the person who sent the letter has not been identified but a partner at bonner and associates went to charlottesville to apologize to the hispanic group and told them the person responsible had been fired. the other letters reportedly contained similar language but were not sent from bonner and associates, so the naacp, dylan, actually supports the legislation and the congressman got letters saying that they opposed it. >> ah, yes. from washington, tim fernholtz joins us. whether you look at health care and the fact it's not a patient-driven debate for health care reform and look at banking and the fact we ended up with too big to fail was because of lobbying money in the '90s that created again the ability for

aig to sell the phony credit insurance and steal the money there. or this most recent example, jonathan, tim, i don't think the american people need that much more evidence that, at the very least, secret lobbizing a problem for all of us. i'm not going to say lob yilg should or shouldn't be but i will say lobbying should be totally transparent and cover our congress as a seven or eight-party system. tim, how do we go about making the activities of the lobbying community, these are the people that actually write our legislation, et cetera, in many cases, how do we make it more transparent so, at the very least, when we feel like we're getting screwed, we know why? >> well, the interesting thing here is bonner and associates, the lobbying firm behind this is a business model is specifically designed to avoid this kind of disclosure and they specialize in astroturfing going out to the country and trying to gin up

support among regular people to move legislation, but because that support isn't always there, they are paid for by business interests to do it. they don't have to disclose because they're not speaking directly to members of congress, they are doing it out through the country. normally, they much more subtle like this. this time by sending these letters by civil rights organizations they have hopefully, gotten caught and shed more light on the practice the lobbyists follow. >> i can't think of anything more important for the american people going into the midterm elections of next year than to be able to see clearly the veins of money that runs from the banks of congress to health insurance to the congress and trial lawyers to congress, i don't care what it is, but at the time when we are dropping trillions of american wealth to benefit special interests effectively and we still can't see how it works. particularly when i hear stories like this, it's beyond me. >> there's a lot going on, but

that doesn't mean that there is the information isn't out there. it's just a matter of -- >> how do we do a better job? >> we do a better job by going to a bunch of the web sites, one that comes to mind is open secret and there are a whole bunch like those that do nothing but go and see, they follow the money, basically. they follow the money and see who is getting money from whom and from which organization. i think it's commendable that that congressman blew the whistle on these folks, because this is the sort of thing that happens all the time. you can't legislate this completely. you can't guard against it completely but what you can do is shine a light on it every time some new trick comes to light that tries to -- >> i want to emphasize, jonathan, that the law right now doesn't require bonner and associates to disclose what they're doing because they're not talking to members of congress. they're going out into the country to gin up support for legislation, whether or not that

support exists. >> how do you legislate that without trampling on free speech rights some. >> well, that's the challenge. i think if you talk to legal experts it's a very gray area in saying what is -- >> i've got an idea. in addition to open secrets and all the rest, what if we covered congress as a seven or eight-party system, where it's the bank party against the health care party against the energy party against the corn party and against the trial lawyers. >> laughing parties, you know? the bank party and corn party i don't think are that far apart. >> i understand but i feel like the american people who tend to give the wealth of their children and themselves tho these entities who deliver nothing in return and just extract capital as we watch unemployment rise in this country, there's a point where, at the very least, we'd like to see how decisions are really being made in this country because it does not appear that they are being made on behalf of the american people, whether it's health care, banking or anything else, jonathan. >> well, i think -- but, dylan, i think we, as journalists, keep shining the light on these things every time a big piece of

legislation comes up. we talk about the legislation, we talk about the chairman and chairwomen involved in these committees and we also talk about where are they getting their money from? who are the lobbyists who are trying to influence them and the legislation? the thing is that it's cyclical. we're talking about it now. once that health care bill is done, if it ever gets done, then we'll move on to the next. >> i think people feel betrayed by the way the government dealt with the banks and not demanding terms and allowing no call-backs and no discounting to the payments of goldman sachs which goes to lobbying or you watch the health care debate which goes to lobbying. at the very least, it's not about lobbying or from my speaker speculative perspective, it's about lonnieing in sket secret. to do it behind closed doors or to do it by lying, quite simply, is a betrayal of democracy. i got to take a break.

tim, thank you so much. jonathan, i think you have your own morning meeting to get off it. >> yes. >> the next phase in the michael jackson family. a judge about to weigh in on the custody of the kids. courtney is on that beat. we'll take a look at michael jackson as nassim says, another example of overtreatment. does your dad ask stupid video questions? we have a cartoon coming up. come on. [ kissing ] come on. good girl. mollie's never looked better. i really was amazed to see the change in her coat. people stop us when we're walking, and they'll say, "did you shine up her spots?" [ woman announcing ] just another way purina one... unlocks the brilliance of nature... to transform the life of your dog. for us to see the difference in mollie-- we were really excited about it. it just makes you feel wonderful. [ announcer ] it's amazing what one can do.

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cash for clunkers a popular

program. so popular it's out of gas already. question is whether it's an intelligent use of taxpayer money or just another boondoggle to try to make us feel better while we avoed the real problems in our economy is too big to fail financial institutions and incentives that reward people for doing poorly and not for doing well. nbc political director chuck todd live from the white house with a battle brewing specific to cash for clunkers. it's quite popular if only a direct line to consumers and they feel like they're getting something. >> that's exactly right. when you have a stimulus program that is very easy to explain, you get money back if you do x, and you get money directly from the government in this form as far as this cash for clunkers program is. so that's why, i think, you see the white house and democrats in congress scramble to go triple the size of the program. and i think a couple of interesting things about this that we ought to take notice

with. number one, that they are redirecting stimulus dollars in order to triple this program. that they want to take $2 billion already allocated into the stimulus and move it over into this. is this a sign of things to come? could we see instead of, you know, talk of second stimulus, forget that a minute, could we see more programs of redirected stimulus money so that way you're not asking members to actually vote and find more money? you're taking money already al low indicated. number one. two, the -- whether it's republicans are going to -- how hard are they fointh fight this? john mccain is the leading voice against this in the senate this week but is this one of those things that -- that you may see reverberate in a negative by way for them? >> whether it's the bank bailouts, the auto bailouts, the way we do with health care or any of these things, it's a debate about generational theft and whether the wealth of our generation and our children is

being consumed by those that have screwed up before us, either by making bad cars, bad banking models, all of these -- and instead of talking about the systems, they just want to talk about ways to pay for stuff. >> but this goes to a philosophy that i think this white house wants to buy into on health care and you're seeing other businesses, which is reward them for good behavior. reward folks for good behavior. on the medical front, reward, you see safeway wants to reward people for not smoking. reward with lower health care costs. so this is a taste of what you may see -- this may become a more popular way for government to intervene and get involved which is sort of -- >> the incentives. >> incentivizing everything. >> whether tax rebates or incentives redirect you much more behaviorally. robin is a senior writer and columnist at "businessweek" and doing a lot of work on cash for clunkers. nassim made a point earlier we are rewarding people but

rewarding people for bad behavior for cash for clunkers and rewarding automakers for making lousy car and clearing their inventory for them and rewarding people for buying inefficient cars and get themselves out of that situation on the taxpayer's back. the question is not do incentives work. obviously, they do because it got cashed out when they rolled it out. how do you create incentives that help the economy and the country as opposed to incentives that create generational theft? >> absolutely. set the bar higher if you're doing this. get some bang for your stimulative buck and some bang for the green buck. the doctor here was talking about his car being too fuel-efficient to be -- the swan mobile can't get it. meanwhile, some wishy washy -- >> do you drive a giant black swan around? like mother goose? how do you create an incentive

structure that is beneficial as oppose to do one that is expensive and inefficient? >> let's go back to the center of the problem. every time we talk about how to patch things up, okay? it feels -- i feel queasy. it's like we're talking about a cancer patient and with people discussing his headache and let's go to the central of the problem. we are sicker every month, getting sicker. >> sicker by virtue of job losses? >> job losses. and the problem is still there. too much debt. >> how do we end up with too much debt? >> wall street. >> because too big to fail financial institutions that created too much debt because they made money by creating debt? >> exactly. they made money creating debt. >> and stuck the debt with the american people? >> exactly. they made money by issuing paper and they made money by passing on -- it's a money machine, all right? you have huge -- >> i call it a money party.

>> now we have to collapse the debt and restart on better grounds. >> right. >> that's the thing we should be doing right away. >> robin, in your own reporting, i don't understand why our politicians are so afraid to deal with the elephant in the room which is the financial institutions became too big to fail. just as sure as it is not capitalism for me to control what you do with your life every day, me to control your business, government control, it is just as sure not capitalism to allow a monopoly-sized institution to risk national capital and keep that wealth. that is just as much a liability to capitalism as socialism is perceived to be, yet, we cannot deal with the elephant in the room and i do not know why. >> this is invariably wound up in politics. cancer, the government could go in after the tumor, could amputate on a limp limb. >> i think they are more opting to the pain-killers and

hand-hoed holding. that is much easier to do than deleveraging and telling people you binged and time for you to go cold turkey. >> i don't think they're ready to take that pill. >> midterm elections. i have not e seen anybody in the senate get up aside from republicans criticizing the fiscal responsibility. as long as we're in the hawk, as our entire economy as a whole, are we getting max bang for the buck and nobody is talking about that. >> the american people understand or understood what to do after the depression. you know? everyone has a grandmother who knows what to do. money on the side. don't borrow, don't do this, don't do that. the economics establishment doesn't have a clue. >> who -- >> look -- >> the -- summers? >> let's look at them. they don't seem to understand

risk. they don't understand risk. they got blinded about by their model. the first person not to understand risk is larry summers. >> who was the treasury secretary when the laws created too big to fail were instituted in 1999 and now the chief economic adviser to the president some. >> and look at harvard finances, all right? he do to us what he did to harvard? second one, look at geithner. in the rare instance in which you have to look at someone's behavior, the gentleman's house, he couldn't understand the risk of the real estate market? that the house could drop in value? he is stuck with his house. look at the numbers. someone with these mortgages. >> would you have assaulted anybody with the hoover administration going back to the 1930s you need to take a cold shower and deal with this? >> i think we need obama but high hopes when i saw obama i had high hopes, all right? although i'm not a democrat, i'm close to libertarian but i had

high hopes when i saw obama. he did very well with international -- >> great rhetoric. >> in the international scene but here i'm so disappointed and the third person is bernanke. we're giving more power to the fed and who got us here? >> who in the fed to use eliot spitzer's words is the prirptor of the proprietor of the ponzi scheme. i skip the legacy of the ponzi with the federal reserve in the 14 trillion and that bag of garbage that i would pull out. >> circular dealing here. washington practically owns a large swath of detroit and circling taxpayer money back to itself in the end. >> we understand the problems, believe me, we do. but now we need to work on solutions. >> we need what the english are doing. i'm going to london in two weeks. cameron is using the conservative party in the uk is using new platform. how to build second type of

capitalism. >> you mean capitalism with investors and innovators? >> lost more robust to shock and norah o'donnell too big to fail. >> too big to fail is not capitalism is my whole point. too big to fail is vampire capitalism and i'm able to extract capital. capital markets on wall street are designed to push money into businesses and not take money ust economy. >> the second problem is the expert problem is that we, what got us here is the pseudoexpert. i want an economy in which economists can be as incompetent as they want and we're still adaptable enough. >> you can't adapt too big to fail. >> we have a political system two and four-year cycle and everybody is running for office, including ben bernanke. >> if we diminish and amplify bank party and energy party and health care party and try lawyer party and all people party, i think it will make more sense as

to why we don't get the outcomes in the interests of our country. contessa, you have other things going on? >> in about an hour we're looking for a judge to take up the issue who gets custody of michael jackson's children. let's get to courtney hazlett who is outside the courthouse? los angeles. what are you expecting to see today, courtney? >> we're expecting to see the custody issue pretty much get taken of very quickly. last week, they came to an i agreement. today is much more important for the estate overall however. one of the elements katherine jackson's attorneys are exploring if she can argue about the guardianship. i'm sorry, the administrators without contesting the will. she doesn't want to trigger a no contest clause because she could lose everything she was given in michael jackson's will and who is going to shepherd his estate through a financial restructuring as well.

he's worth $5 mun hundred million but only a hundred million is liquid. in fairfax, virginia, you're seeing senator warner. president obama is expected to make remarks at the top of the hour on that post 9/11 g.i. bill that provides our men and women in uniform with comprehensive educational benefits. the department of veterans affairs begins distributing tuition payments to schools participating in the program this month and when we see the president at the top of the hour on msnbc, we will bring that to you live. the obama administration is looking at creating a prison complex in the united states to house suspected terror suspects from guantanamo bay. they are eyeing a soon to be maximum security in prison and the federal penitentiary at ft. leavenworth, kansas. latest edition of the ucla slang book is published this

month and the president is making an appearance. obama adjective meaning cool. you'd use it like this. hey, mike, you so obama. another one is platonic friendship between two guys and presh, meaning cute or precious. all terms you can work into the "morning meeting." >> you are so obama, by the way. >> you are so presh, so fresh. ahead dads who ask stupid computer questions. one guy joins the meeting next. if nothing else, it will be entertaining if it doesn't help your father get a little better at using the computer. i was in the grocery store when i had a heart attack. my daughter was with me. i took a bayer aspirin out of my purse and chewed it. my doctor said the bayer aspirin saved my life. please talk to your doctor about aspirin and your heart. i'm going to be grandma for a long time.

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i drove across the state to stay with you for a few days because i've got some computer questions for you! >> no!

>> based on real computer questions from a real dad. >> can i go on my internet from your computer? >> yeah. it's the same internet all over the world. >> so i didn't have to bring it with me? >> ah the humor. a lot of folks can relate to that for sure no matter what side of the conversation you're on. joining me is josh forback. he is a creator of super news and the animation your dad asks computer questions. josh based this video conversations on conversations with his own father. i should warn you, josh, coming in, whether he receives or whether he is the recipient of these questions or the asker. he says he is the one actually that -- he is the answer man in his house so he has role reversal. >> i was born five years too late. >> how do you figure?

>> yeah. because quarter generation. >> josh, walk us through the reception this has received. in other words, do you feel that america relates to what you're putting out? >> yeah. well, first of all, my dad loves it. yeah, he said it was, i think, quote, embarrassingly accurate. i was surprised. i did a cartoon pretty much about a conversation that i had with my dad when he came down to visit me and he did have a yellow legal notepad filled with computer questions for me. so i just made it, because i thought it was a really funny moment, but, evidently, it's something a lot of people could relate to. >> i actually play the role of dad, even though i don't have children. i would be going to nassim saying how do i make this work? why is it you think that some people are so comfortable at navigating and dealing with technology and other people

everything about it, they are like don't bring that near me. >> the same reason some people are socially extremely, you know, uncomfortable and some are socially incompetent. same reason. negative correlation between computer litter rasy and social literacy. >> if i'm happy talking to everybody? >> you probably will not be as good with computers and you're a lucky person then. >> do you agree with that, josh? >> yeah, i do. once again, it's based on a conversation i had with my dad. he's a brilliant man. he could probably help you figure out how to turn the economy around as you were discussing in that last segment back and forth. but he takes directions to the back of his cell phone. i think unless -- unless you've really just dove into technology and let yourself make mistakes, i think you think it's a strange different thing, but yeah,

unless you just dive in and play around with it, i think you sort of see it as a foreign entity. >> frequently, my laptop is the world's no expensive in a paper weight. >> then you're a lucky man. >> that's true. in the scheme of things. although i would like to get more use out of it if i could figure out how to turn it on half the time. >> i'm trying to live without a laptop. >> how are you managing? >> not very well. >> in time? >> trying. >> push ourselves. josh, thank you very much. congratulates on the cartoon. before i let you go, if somebody at home want to see is what the best way to look at it? >> check it out on current tv or current online. i want to introduce a new term into the vernacular. how about you're on ratigan? >> what does that mean, exactly? >> i think it just means you're rad gwynne. you're ratigan. >> listen as a ratigan, i love

it, but you have to ask somebody else. josh, thank you so much and enjoy your week. we're back with the take-away. jonathan capehart and his facebook page among the things we discussed at today's meeting. his facebook obsession when we come back. change it up a bit. and you're sure to get a reaction. [ motorcycle engine growl ] ♪ don't let erectile dysfunction slow things down. ♪ viva viagra! viagra, america's most prescribed ed treatment, can help you enjoy a more satisfying sexual experience. to learn more, cruise on over to viagra.com. ask your doctor if your heart is healthy enough for sex. don't take viagra if you take nitrates for chest pain... as it may cause an unsafe drop in blood pressure. side effects may include headache, flushing, upset stomach, and abnormal vision. to avoid long-term injury, seek immediate medical help...

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all right. welcome back. earlier in the show we talked about the controversy over facebook and myspace and whether or not it hurts people in their relationships. well, that was motivating. >> yeah. >> jonathan capehart apparently isn't one of those suffering. he is admitting he is obsessed with facebook and while talking about his own addiction he is getting multiple requests on his page. >> that's the way that happens. you say i'm on facebook and all of a sudden, i like that. immediate gratification. >> isn't that part of the problem?

>> it kind of is and the same problem with twitter. i wasn't going to admit to addiction on national television. >> admitting is part of the healing. >> i'll consider it maybe tomorrow. >> that does wrap up today's "morning meeting." carlos with an angry gop politician who says, that article over the weekend pointing out when gis return it's not just about education but that is a huge factor but the mental health and our ability as a society to welcome the people back into our lives. carlos watson is taking care of you after this.

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when i was first diagnosed with diabetes, that first step was more like a giant leap. till i discovered nutrisystem d. in a clinical study people on nutrisystem d lost 16 times more weight and reduced their blood sugar 5 times more than those on a hospital-directed plan. plus a1c was reduced .9%. choose from over 140 menu options, there is no counting carbs, calories or points. i lost 100 lbs. and lowered my blood sugar level. nutrisystem d changed my life. mike is one of many who have lost weight and controlled their diabetes with new nutrisystem d. backed by 35 years of research and low glycemic inx science nutrisystem d works. satisfaction guaranteed or your money back! new! nutrisystem d. lose weight. live better. call or click today. good morning. welcome to a brand-new hour of msnbc live. i'm carlos watson. what a difference six months makes after policemening not to

raise taxes on middle income america. two of president obama's top money men say it may force them to do just that. is the crisis on wall street cooling? the markets have their best july in 20 years. and the question to all of you there is it time to jump back in? and cash for clunkers hits a critical crossroads in the senate. will the program stall out or get another injection of cash to keep it on track? plus what happened to three americans reportedly captured in iran and was michael jackson broke? that's right. breaking developments out of california as the parties head to court this hour to fight for every last dollar and cent. good morning. we have a great hour lined up for you. congressman peter king of new york. senator john cornyn. "the new york times" eric good. "the wall street journal" laura saunders, plus, nbc's chuck todd at the white house.

richard engel in istanbul, turkey and courtney hazlett is live from the jackson hearing in los angeles. first of all, we fast forward through the top headlines. this hour. 26 people were injured and four in serious condition a a flight. michael "scott" speicher have been found, his remains found in iraq. he was the first known qaushlt of the 1991 gulf war and shot down on the first night of combat. iran's president ahmadinejad has received a key endorsement from the country's supreme leader. ayatollah khamenei gave his approval. he is expected to be sworn in on wednesday. henry gates spoke at the book festival this weekend. >> i