health care reform be slip voted during the summer recess. they promised the message that insurance companies are fat cats and afraid of competition will be drilled home to democracy leaders and americans united for change, which just launched this ad today. >> why dot health insurance companies and republicans want to keep president obama's health insurance reform. >> because they like things the way they are now. $12.2 million a year, $5,873 an hour. he makes more in one hour than some make all day long. >> sure. democrats might be able to convince voters that health insurance ceos make too much money, but they are doing

nothing to convince voters to support a specific set of reforms. and that is why health care reform is once again thinking in political quick stand. joining me now is jonathon alter. john has a new piece on health care reform called what's not to like. jonathan, your nigs will news piece is actually pretty funny. you take on the voice of someone who is content with his health care plan even though in your case you tell the true story of your own battle with cancer and within all of that you try to deliver the mind set of someone content with the way things are now. >> lawrence, i've put in a little satire. some people at newsweek.com thought i was being serious. what i was trying to point out is it's really kind of crazy. people need to realize that if

they get sick and then they lose their job, which is helping a lot of people nowadays, because of the pre-existing condition they are not going to get the right treatment for cancer or heart disease, whatever they might have. they are going to sell their house, sell their possessions, do whatever to get the money to pay for that treatment because they are uninsured. so they will actually have to chose between selling their house or dying, basically, and that's the choice that, if god forbid i had a recurrence of cancer, which i had a few years ago in which i lost my job, i would be faced with that. nothing is going to ever happen to me. it does. think about your family, your friends. bad stuff does happen.

and under the current system, were bad things to happen to you or somebody in your family, you're screwed. and people don't get that. they don't get that the status quo, the element is that the insurance companies would be operating at will and cancel their insurance when they get sick like your homeowners insurance gets covered if you have a break-in. that's the way it works on health insurance. if people don't get that and we continue on with the status kwoerks there are going to be more and more people. people need to get out there and tell their members of congress to pass this thing. >> jonathan, when you listen to what nancy pelosi had to say, isn't there a flaw in her attack on the status quo? she goes after the health insurance companies as if they were the worse cell phone companies in the united states of america. and then she championed press

ser reags and keeps them operating in place instead of going in the single payer direction. like what would you say if you were fighting single payer. >> lawrence, you've been there for the senate finance committee. nobody is going to like the bill that goes through. it's going to be a big, hairy, ugly piece of legislation that satisfies nobody. that's not the issue. the issue is an i am perfect bill better from the status quo? and the answer to that question is, you're dam right it is. it almost doesn't matter what the details were. it's so terrible to people who get sick and face bankruptcy on top of their i amness that it must be chased it and all of the bills out there take care of

that problem, a catastrophic illness. none of those bills leave people high and dry should they get very sick. that's the core of this. the rest is all important but we cannot let this opportunity slip through the cracks. and the idea of being no bill, liberals getting too much that they wasn't, that is the disaster. there must be legislation this fall. >> okay. john tan, take a look at this picture, newsweek, what is left not to like. joining me now is democratic senator mark warner of virginia and nobody is going to like this bill. it's going to be a big compromised mess with something that everyone can find a dislike in it. how do you pass a bill like that? >> we also have to acknowledge that we're not going to get it

totally right the first time. you don't change 17% of our gdp and whole health care system perfectly right the first time. this is going to be a growing process, the consequences of doing nothing. if you happen to lose your health insurance or lose your job. but even if you maintain your health insurance, the status quo -- you're going to sigh your profit double over the next decade with the current system in place. the federal deficit is going to go way over the top and explode the nation if we can't drive our costs down around medicare and medicaid. so whether the concern is around coverage or my concern of covering a financially stable system, with we've got to make

sure that we get a reform -- it's not gb to be perfect. chances are we're going to fix it in the next year or the next oofr r after and the year after. j. >> we saw arlen specter in pennsylvania getting shot down and all of that kind of thing. people are going to ask you, what are you going to sell down there? >> lawrence, i was in west virginia virginia this last fall. there were about 4,000 folks. there's a lot of misinformation taking away your health care, some government bureaucrat between you and your doctor. as if there's not kind of insurance bureaucrat between you a he the doctor already.

one of the most egregios is what took place. how do we make sure they have recall of their choices available to them. have a chance to sit down with a minister or rabbi and talk through the issues and then you'll see the outrageous scare tactics replaced by folks out there that somehow health care is going to lead so -- that's behind the pale. i've never seen any kind of statement like that since i've been in politics.

you've got to predict that you won't be able to win the argument over. isn't that the kind of thing that you want to comb out of the bill at this stage to smooth its way through the congress? >> lawrence, i think the american people are way ahead, except for a few folks on the right. they are trying to pick and understand what their options are as you go through this stage of aging. and i've got a bill in that is supported by the aarp and all across america i think it's actually disrespectful to say that. coming up, some democratic senators want to up the mileage standards on cash for clunkers. but will that kill the bill? i'll ask a chairman of the senate committee next.

on "the ed show." undefeated professional boxer floyd "money" mayweather has the fastest hands boxing has ever seen. so i've come to this ring to see who's faster... on the internet. i'll be using the 3g at&t laptopconnect card. he won't. so i can browse the web faster, email business plans faster. all on the go. i'm bill kurtis and i'm faster than floyd mayweather. (announcer) switch to the nation's fastest 3g network

and get the at&t laptopconnect card for free. our democrats from red sticks going to take a beating during recess? i'll ask a kentucky democrat how health care is being reformed. you filter me at home i'm pretty much the same as i am in a plastic bottle? except that you'll save, like, $600 bucks a year. but other than that, we're pretty much the same. pur. good, clean water. home run! (announcer) he's sweet. even with one third less sugar than soda. kool-aid. delivering more smiles per gallon.

one apparent success of the obama's administration to pull the country out of the recession is the cash for clunkers program which gives consumers up to $4500 in credit to trade in old

cars for more fuel efficient ones. it's become so popular that the $1 billion set up for it was used in the first week of the program. on friday the hos passed a bill authorizing $2 million more for the program. now they are passing a bill and senator boxer is the chairman of the new novel "blind trust." your new novel is about a california senator, of all things, is r who is running a confirmation hearing and getting into serious intrigue. >> well, people want a good

story. you know, how the staff relates and i think they are going to learn a lot. i've been told it's a page turner. >> you can only get the inside story from the outsider. and chairman boxer is exactly that. chairman boxer, you've got this coming upon you in the senate and procedurely you have to pass an identical bill to the house and if you change anything they are not here to change it how are you going to 1/2 kbat this? >> well, i have hot off the news press news for you. we looked at the results of the program and both of us are very happy. we both wanted to see more fuel economy. but what happened, 250 thousand

vehicles were traded in and new cars and trucks bought and the average increase in fuel economy is almost 10 miles per gallon. that's really better than we ever thought. it looks like people have really gotten the message that they don't want to be relying on the oil companies to keep prices down. we've been in the works of the great depression. this is working. let's just move forward with it and pay for it by simply taking funds out of the auto retooling money that we had as part of the stimulus which is the way that she was going to pay for it. >> and there have been some noises from the republican side, including possibly senator mccain just trying to

filibuster? it sounds to my like the democrats are coming together on this. is it possible that the road block opposition will slip away under the force of the auto that want to see this thing going forward it's interesting that about 50% of the cars and trucks were the big three. the others were foreign made. but half of those were made in america. it's a good result and the equipment of the last and i wanted it to be written in a stronger way but i have to admit that it's working way better than i thought. >> a popular government program,

popular new government program. it's not necessarily a unlocked thing. they would really want to stand there and block it completely. >> well, i don't know. they have sort of turned into the body of no. a republican colleague asked me about it and i said, i don't want to add to the deficits, to the debt. and i said banning on auto retooling, and he seemed surprise. when we learn, we all learn and we can come together. if you really want to get out of this recession, if you really want to -- >> any word on -- governor, a final word on health care. it doesn't feel like we're coming together on that, either within the democratic party or with the republicans. what you're feeling for how it's going to come back to the senate in september. here's what i predict.

the status quo is horrible. 14,000 lose their insurance. we pay twice as much 29 out of 30 mortal tea. when people look at the status quo, they are going to be angry to folks that don't want to come to the table. >> average ceo in the insurance company say you're a sports team, million and insurance industry has gone up enormously over 400% in the last few years. so this with, i think that the public opinion will be turned towards us. hopefully we can get down with the static particulars and make sure that people have a certain uncertain certainty about their health insurance. they deserve it. >> coming up next, the claim to have a kenyan birth certificate.

we have a map. that's in two minutes.

♪ 'cause now i'm driving off the lot in a used sub-compact. ♪ ♪ f-r-e-e, that spells free credit report dot com, baby. ♪ ♪ saw their ads on my tv

♪ thought about going but was too lazy ♪ ♪ now inste of looking fly and rollin' phat ♪ ♪ my legs are sticking to the vinyl ♪ ♪ and my posse's getting laughed at. ♪ ♪ f-r-e-e, that spells free- credit report dot com, baby. ♪ welcome back toll "the ed show." time to address the latest so-called evidence. that president obama wasn't born in the usa. the people who buy into this

conspiracy theory have come up with they say is a certified copy of a birth certificate that proves that president obama was born in kenya on august 4th, 1961. the certified copy was supposedly issued on february 17th, 1964. a small problem, though, kenya wasn't actually called to the republic of kenya on december 12th, 1964. it did become independent in 1964 but it was known as the dominion of kenya until the following december. that was ten months after the document was supposedly issued. also, the city where the certificate claims obama was born wasn't even part of kenya at the time of his birth. until 1963, which is part of present day.

>> i know with the colonial books and look up basic kenyan history and compare that with a little commonsense with the map and you'll see the truth pretty quickly. >> what's a democrat from kentucky hearing from voters back home about health care? i'll ask next on "the ed show." hi. number two, please. would you like that to hurt now or later? uh, what?

sir,t's a simple question. do you want heartburn pain, now or later? these heartburn medicines make you choose... between hurting now or later. pepcid complete doesn't. it starts to neutralize acid in seconds... and keeps it under control all day or all night. sometimes you gotta make compromises, man. no, you don't... man. pepcid complete, works now and works later. now with a great new taste. five co-workers are working from the road using a mifi, a mobile hotspot

that provides up to five shared wifi connections. two are downloading the nal final revised final presentation. - one just got an e-mail. - what?! - huh? - it's being revised again. the co-pilot is on mapquest. - ( rock music playing ) - and tom is streaming meeting psych-up music from meltedmetal.com. that's happening now with the new mifi from sprint, the mobile hotspot that fits in your pocket. sprint. the now network.

welcome back. house speaker nancy pelosi and democratic law leaders need to correct the misinformation out there. but with different plans emerging in the house and the senate, how does anyone, including a congressman or the president know what they should be trying. >> at a reeft meeting president

obama talked about ration care and another republican talked about it would lead to euthanizing seniors. joining me now is congressman john yarma, a accident krat particular from kentucky. are you in the top three tax brackets that you voted for or are you selling other pieces of it as you move through your district? >> well, the people who are really concerned about what we are doing are the people that are very insecure about the future of the health care coverage. they want to know if something happens to their job they want to know if one of their kids happens to have a medical kpn

and then they lose their coverage. it's the whole dam society that they are concerned about. once i give them that security and peace of mind and health care, and the other is senior citizens and i talked about narrowing the donut hole. we're going to work to eliminate that. things that are forcing them to make choices that they don't like to take, whether to take the medication or not. these are things that the average citizen is concerned about. that's what we need. >> congressman -- >> yep. are you probably voted for a number of things in the final bill. >> right. >> that actually becomes law. you're going to have to find somewhere else in between in the

end? how do you pick what you were fighting and arguing for? >> i don't get too many questions about the tax part of it. i've campaigned about the bush tax cuts for the wealthy for three years now and i'm very comfortable talking about that and defending that. but, again, what we're concerned about, we don't know what is going to be in the final legislation, that's for sure. and what i'm talking about is the making sure that american citizens have peace of mind about the health care and if seniors don't think that they are going to lose their benefits, these are the things that we talk about over and over again. that's what most people don't care about. they want to know what this means for them and their families and that's what we are emphasizing. >> what is the prevailing theory right now among house democrats as to why the popularity for obama health care reform

continues to go down the more president obama campaigns for him. >> i don't think anything president obama is doing or not doing, i've got a very well oiled distract the american public from the essence of these plans. and they don't want the american people to focus on the fact that their stability and security is what we're primarily concerned about. the republicans and many in the industry, health care industry know that the most political industry that they can win is to form health care successfully. they are they've expressed that in documents and soon to be president obamas and

conversations about how they will benefit from what we are trying to do. once we tell that story, and i've had it happen dozens and dozens of times already, people will become very enthusiastic. >> and there is no one who is more of an expert, the staff that you work with everyone day. >> right. >> does chairman and speaker pelosi have them looking for possible radioactive items that should be pulled out no matter what the value might be because they can be ex employeded more easily than who are r others? >> yeah, we probably made a mistake doing that initially. your only fact is that particularly one important is health care. we should have accepted that we would not get an honest debate. we are looking through those provisions again. you never know the breadthis of

distortion that people are capable of. we are looking for other areas because this is much too important, shall and kill us rather than playing games. >> thank you. congressman, for more, let's bring in our panel, bill press, from the national syndicated talk show host. and author of the book, the ten big lies about america. i want to start with you. we're watching a phenomena of a third version and that is, the more the president campaigns for a reform idea, the more unpopular it becomes. we saw this in 1994 with hillary clinton when she started her tour across america.

we are now seeing the same phenomena. you live on the other side of the political world. do you have a feel for what it is that the obama administration and the democrats are getting wrong in the way that they communicated above this to swing voter, independent voters, and the republican? >> yes, i do. i think one of the problems with the obama administration was that they out out swordsed and a little change this and that because there was no specific bill most american people have health insurance and 77% of the people that have health insurance are happy with t they

don't want the thing to change in a radical way. we don't want to pay more. we don't want to see our health care -- the problem that you have right now, even though the merp people are unhappy about the level of spending and the deficit. they don't want to see any of those problems added to adjust something that we are going to care about. frankly, republicans and democrats should be coming together. >> john harwood, this was tricky. when nancy pelosi wants to send the troops out to fight for this bill, it's not like fighting a wage for minimum wage. this is a very complex piece where they don't even know what should be in it.

how doll they go out and sell this thing when they don't have a clear product to sell? >> it's complicated and i think individual members will sell things that they voted for or add advocated. i have got to say that i think it's -- what is the most unpopular thing that the democrats are trying to defend against the rights. who is the biggest asset? they are also trying to defend tax increases on upper income americans. barack obama has a different one than the house agreed to. but he proposed a different method of raising money from people who make more than $250,000 a year. so it's not the outsourcing that is the problem. it's the complexity and difficulty of trying to make the case that this very complicated

set of measures that they are proposing is better than the status quo. >> how worried are the democratics that have particularly risky items in there. but the votes that they've cast already cam be held against him in this campaign? >> because of the cap and trade bill that has passed the house and so many members came home to find themselves catching grief for a vote that their members should really pressure them to hang in on and the house

democratic leadership feels very strongly to go in with the negotiating power of having past the members and that income the final bill, the conservative members, even though you can say the premiums will sustain the plan and it -- the medicare race, it's still easily made into a 30-second commercial. people very, very nervous about already how much the bill might spend. and so this is the fear of house democratic leaders, if they have three bills passed that they have to melt in august and can they find consensus for september. >> bill press, is there a set of compromises that can come out of the senate finance committee or worked through the process generally? such that the final product is what is the liberals would consider so weak that they sim simply walk away from it and no bill gets to the president? is that possible?

>> it's possible. first of all, the senate finance committee, once it comes out that harry reid look at them and say, you've got a lot of work but that's not what we want. we're going to move closer to the senate house committee and come whatever three comes out of the house. i want to come back to your statement about this in august. this doesn't matter what they do in august when they go home. this office is democratic and they are at a disadvantage because the opposition is geared up and it gets lost during the recess. >> all right. panel, stay with us.

coming up, bill clinton is having de ja vu on health care. can president obama avoid that? that's next in the play book. hey, it's me, water. did you know that when you filter me at home i'm pretty much the same as i am in a plastic bottle? except that you'll save, like, $600 bucks a year. but other than that, we're pretty much the same. pur. good, clean water. (announcer) regular kool-aid. goes almost three times further than soda. kool aid. delivering more smiles per gallon.

(groans) a lot of people are gonna be kicking themselves for not buying in this market. (woman) visit remax.com where you can see all the listings in thousands of cities and towns.

where do you want to be? has the fastest serve in the history of professional tennis. so i've come to this court to challenge his speed. ...on the internet. i'll be using the 3g at&t laptopconnect card. he won't. so i can book travel plans faster, check my account balances faster. all on the go. i'm bill kurtis and i'm faster than andy roddick. (announcer) "switch to the nations fastest 3g network" "and get the at&t laptopconnect card for free".

all of this debate about what change will save money about an eriely familiar ring and give aid and comfort to the forces of the status quo, i can

see who the baseball manager sent enough to bat and what they are trying to do to get him to strike out. i don't like it. >> it's been 15 years and president obama is still staring down the face. he's face-to-face with a bitter reality. there is no successful model out there for legislative health care reform. and replicating the hugely successful bus tour of the '92 campaign. so hoil clinton set off on the health security express with hundreds of reform writers. instead, a ground swell the clinton town halls were overwhelmed by protestors who tried to chump down at every stop and polls showed that every

day hillary clinton and the health care reform went down. you should keep in mind, the more the president campaigns the more unpopular reform becomes. two, attempts to reform health care always turn into democrat on democrat dog fights. joining me now is oregon senator ron wyden. you have a health care reform plan that has been unable to get any traction so far and might we end up through a series of

compromises it's going to be important to close the deal with the insured. that wasn't done in 1993, 1994. that's the big job for the summer. we give the opportunity for the republicans and democrats to get that done. we say that everybody can go into a big group like members of congress can. the insurance companies can't discriminate against you. you have a lot of leverage and will be able to get that cash in your pocket. >> so are you hanging on to the idea that might what come of the deliberations and which is the only by partisan support so far?

>> i have never said, larry, that it is my way or the highway. what i do know is that you've got more than 160 million people. i don't think all of them are sitting around with their calculators, by any means, but they want to know how this is going to pencil out for them. and i keep coming back to the fact that, members of congress, if you're in d.c. and signed up with your family, you've got only 20 plans. in 2009 you can in 2010 get a better deal and save money and get more preventative care and mentality health services. let's give people the opportunity to shop wisely and financially win when they do. >> senator, you're not in the room of the finance committee. does it worry you that it's this subset of the committee or even more senators without input to this process?

>> first of all, these are the senior members and i don't feel that we've been left out. those of us that are not by seniority in the room. i think, for example, that when people looked at those early reports that you have to spend over a trillion dollars just to expand the coverage on medicaid people. and they back it up that everybody can have choices like members of congress for the amount of money that we're spending today. so i do think that we've got a chance over the next few weeks to get a lot of second and third looks and numbers of senators come up to me and say you've got a better chance to talk about insurance. they can reject the coverage that they have. if they want to and get a better deal. >> everything that i'm hearing from the democrats and republicans is an echo of what we heard in 1994.

i don't see the root from here to the finish line. i don't see how it's different from 1994. can you tell me now what factors are new in 2009 that can get you across the finish line and actually legislate something here? >> in 1993 and 1994, larry, you remember this, you didn't have a by partisan bill that provided universal coverage that had republican support. i've got republican sponsors. in fact, most of the republican leadership on a piece of legislation that plays hardball with the insurance company. we don't let them cherry pick. we mablg sure that the consumer is protected. you never had that in 1993 and 1994. the business community was in a different place. coming up, the tee partyiers are back. senator arlen specter and

kathleen sa beel yous were ambushed from them during a town hall on health care. they do actually think that they will work themselves back into the majority. we'll put it to our panel next on "the ed show." every head. every bite. every gallon. every shoe. every book. every cereal. well, maybe not every cereal. but every stem. every stitch. every tune. every toy. pretty much everything you buy can help your savings account grow because keep the change from bank of america rounds up every debit card purchase to the next dollar and transfers the difference from your checking to savings account. it's one of the many ways we make saving money in tough times a whole lot easier. (announcer) they make little hearts happy...

...and big hearts happy too. because as part of a heart healthy diet,... ...those delicious oats in cheerios can help naturally lower cholesterol. (cheerios spilling) cheerios. how can something so little... ...help you do something so big. garth, you're up. hold on, i'm at capitalone.com picking a photo... for my credit card. here's one from my prom. oh, what memories. how 'bout one from our golf outing?

( shouting ) i know, maybe one of my first-born son. dad, mom says the boys gotta go. personalize your card by uploading... your own photo at capitalone.com.

tonight's panel, john harwood and michael med ved s. that the kind of protest that will be effective for republicans in terms of starting or stopping health care reform or does it seem over the top? >> the lad latter. clearly we're not going to do this by signs or any of that. what it's going to do is we have to rely on more strong leadership, particularly in the senate. i sort of encouraged john mccain for once speaking out against this and governor pawlenty on the state level and offering positive alternatives, which i think will be crucial. >> john harwood s. that the way that you see republicans strat jazzing this thing, that they have to at least look constructive as they steer through it? >> i think we're at a total war

situation on both sides. democrats are pulling out all of the ammunition, advocacy groups and democrats and they are going to have to live with what is coming from the other side, including people at shouting at town meetings. some of this should not be refuted. there's rumors about a tape that shows obama favored abolishing insurance. that's not true. i think the toughest thing is what you talked about earlier with mark warner, the issue of end of life care and the concerns that people are being told to die. the reason is that there's a grain of truth to it. and i would pay them to do it. i think it encourages them. the republican party today,

let's face it, they are anti-stimulus, anti-health care, anti-cash for clunkers, anti-sonia sotomayor. end of story. >> does it matter whether these protests are organized or spontaneous. isn't it just the video that ends up in the local news that does the damage here? >> it doesn't matter at all. and the fact is that the only goal for the republicans right now is to scare people off of this, to depress voter support for this so when they come back in september it's even harder for the chaos for the democratic party than what we just witnessed the last month. all they have to do is say, this is going to be terrifying. this is the risk of the experiment. remember what happened during midterm elections? >> yeah, i agree. >> okay. young people are not going to turn out, people who carried mashlg nal and it's going to be

a very tough year. >> thanks for tonight. that's "the ed show." i'll see you back here tomorrow at the same time at 6:00 p.m. eastern. hardball with chris matthews starts right now. crazy august. let's play "hardball." good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. leading off tonight, summer in the city. temperatures are rising in this country as town hall meetings on health care are turning into mob scenes. noisy, angry, vengeful crowds are shouting down members of congress who are trying to talk up president obama's health care push. catch this joyful scene surrounding democrat lloyd doggett down in texas when he called a town meeting. >> just say no!

just say no! just say no! just say no! just say no! just say no! >> congressman doggett joins us in a minute. the message there was fairly clear. just say no to the obama health care plan. also, we've been hearing so much crazy talk from the right recently from the know nothing birthers who want to claim the president is a native born kenyan, who claims the government wants to kill old people or at least talk them into killing themselves, but is it just possible, in fact, really possible, really possible that stirring up the far outs on the far right will also gin up the conservative base and get things perking for the republican party come next november with the midterm elections? plus, what about this government program that gives you up to $4,5