call me. >> i got the 1950s look back. >> same here, you're going on "american idol." >> he's so much -- >> what's going on? >> mika looks great today. >> she does look great. >> great dress. wow. >> really quick question here, what is a skank blogger has been exposed. what's the story? >> it's a big story, go ahead. >> you go. >> there was somebody who apparently this is a model from canada but someone on google who started some website for apparently knew her, we don't know who they were but called her a skank.

she said this is beyond free speech. i have a right to know and went to court and won. >> i love it. >> public figures of the world unite. >> the whole privacy issue. i do think this anonymous garbage on the internet has to stop at some point. >> when you were discussing things like health care and the war, i think i contributed this morning by -- >> thank you for coming. >> my local newspaper has a great idea that i think other newspapers should -- you have the stories. and then just the most nthat isy amon nus bloggers after the story, you're going to see nazi commentary, they give them a forum where everybody can go and you can see joe scarborough is a

nazi or marxist or whatever. if you want to fight in the pig pen, go to the forum. the comment sections are just sick. and a lot of people that write in the comment sections are sick, hateful, human beings. do we all agree here? >> we talked about that yesterday, it gets in everybody's mind. you can say anything it doesn't matter. everyone is talking anonymously and doesn't help a true debate. >> let's get to the news, a lot going on. >> what's going on? doesn't mika look great today? >> fabulous. >> you look like you're going in a motorcade later. am i missing something? >> you look presidential. >> no, just a little crisco in the hair. >> i was talking to mika, she looks presidential.

>> are you guys getting an award later? >> what's up mika? >> it's time for a look at today's top stories. we're going to start with senator ted kennedy looking ahead in his bat until brain cancer. the 77-year-old is appealing to state officials to change a massachusetts law to alaw the governor to immediately point an interim successor when his senate seat becomes vacant. a kennedy spokesperson says there is no change in his condition. we'll get a live report from just outside the kennedy compound coming up later in the show. there is a low initial turnout in afghanistan's presidential election this morning. the other big story we're following, reflecting concern over taliban threats of attacks. there are sporadic reports of violence, local media has been ordered not to cover it and nbc's chief foreign correspondent richard engel has the latest.

how is it going so far? >> reporter: good morning, mika, we've toured several voting stations here in kabul and can tell you voter turnout was not very high. we met one man going to vote. we were with him in his house. when he showed up at the voting station while we were there with him, he was the only person casting a ballot. many people are afraid of of the taliban threat and there were several attacks in kabul, three bomb attacks in the morning before the polling stations opened. they were small pipe bomb style designed to intimidate to keep people away and also attacks in southern afghanistan, most of them in kand har. areas that don't have as much taliban influence that are calmer, the polls stay open for about another hour. we won't have official results of the turnout until later today and until an official results or

unofficial result of the outcome at least until saturday. >> thank you very much. >> you know, it's a big story. and you know, the president has a terrible decision that he's going to have to make in the coming months, years. and it's tougher for him than it would be for a republican. we've had foreign policy experts here, your father from the beginning, even before the president was sworn in saying afghanistan is going to be a mess. let me go to you pat buchanan, you've been saying this, afghanistan is going to be a mess. there's no good way out of there. generals are asking for more troops. look at this "washington post" poll, pat. this puts the president in a terrible position. majority of americans now do not believe the war in afghanistan is worth fighting. i suspect the numbers will drop even more the longer we are there. what is a president to do? this president, any president,

when you've got general and foreign policy experts saying afghanistan is the key to beating al qaeda. and yet, you've got the american people who say, enough. >> well, we've got 68,000 american troops either there or will be there in december, joe. crystal is going to say, it's not enough, needs more combat troops. i don't think the president can really start putting 20,000 more americans in there without reigniting the anti-war movement inside his own part. we cannot win with the troops we have. we can stave off defeat. if you pull out, it looks to me like you're seating the country to the taliban. there are no good choices there. my view is that -- i don't see how the president can really go down the road of massive involvement without telling us how many troops, how many years, how many billions until we pass fi that country and make it a

place that is pro-western democratic and where the taliban or al qaeda doesn't have a -- >> john ridley, he can't do that though. he doesn't know what's going to happen. what if he doesn't listen to his general and afghanistan blows up, then suddenly gets slammed by the democrats. the president has no good options here, none. >> i certainly can't think of a good option. i would hate to be an adviser in this circumstance because i think at its heart this is a war to be fought and won but there's fatigue from citizens and also you have so many domestic issues it makes it hard to execute the war -- >> that's the problem, isn't it? >> with so many domestic problems with the dollar potentially collapsing, with health care, these health care

battles, people are worried about what's happening in kansas city town hall meetings not in kand da har or kabul. >> afghanistan was always meant to be this central front. this was what we went to war to. and it's not even ten years on and there's that sense that it's not worth the fight. and it really makes you wonder, is it worth the fight or are we fatigued -- >> joe, the problem is, obama, he said that iraq was a war of choice, not necessity, afghanistan is a war of necessity. this is the right war and the one we got to win. put in 22,000 troops it is his war. i think it could become his vietnam. >> that's what everybody has said, iraq is the war of choice, afghanistan the war of necessity. but ago is now the war that americans want to forget about,

same with iraq. americans are exhausted. they are fatigued. they want the troops to come home, but my god, if you pull out of afghanistan right now, the implications are terrible. >> back to news, a formal announce the is expected this morning on the scottish government's decision to release a lib yan terrorist on compassionate ground. he was convicted in the 1988 pan am bombing over lockerbie that killed 217 people. he is dying from prostate cancer and will return to libya. >> let him die of cancer in scotla scotland. >> i think it's the wording of it. he's probably getting better care in prison. >> maybe what they could do, notify all of the family members -- >> different way of looking at

it. >> of the college students killed by those guys, scotland, if he makes it to the end of the pathway going out of the prison alive, then maybe he can go to the airport. >> there are reports this morning. >> or what's left. >> the cia hired private contractor firm, blackwater us amount as part of the secret program to kill top members of al qaeda. the program was canceled before missions were carried out the contract was awarded millions of dollars in weapons in training. as congress battles over health care reform, a pair of firms, one founded by top adviser david axelrod has been hired by interest groups in a $24 million media campaign. >> that's real money. >> the president continues to push his plan talking yesterday on a conference call with faith

leaders. >> the one thing that you all share is a moral conviction. you know that this debate over health care goes to the heart of who we are as a people. i know there's been a lot of misinformation in this debate. there are some folks out there who are frankly bearing false witness. these are all fabrications that have been put out there in order to discourage people from meeting what i consider to be a core ethical and moral obligation. that is that we look out for one another, that i am my brother's keeper and sister 'keeper. in the wealthiest nation on earth right now we are knee gle neglecting to live up to that call. >> don hewitt, has died of pancreatic cancer. the legendary newsman directed the first tv newscast and originated the use of cue cards

and first to super impose words on the screen. that is one of his many, many accomplishments. i mean, the list is unbelievable. >> he gave willie's dad his first job. and mika, he spent so much time helping you when you first came into the business. he was also just so kind to us with his calls talking to us about this show. >> he helped me track, put my voice to my first "60 minutes" piece. i remember walking home to my car thinking this will be probably the most memorable day of my career, to be able to work with him and learn from him. he truly does know how to bring out a reporter's voice. don hewitt was 86 years old. and he will be missed. i know my many friends at cbs are sort of feeling a little lost this morning. >> your dad's first job. >> my dad was a columnist in the mid '80s in the new york times

and hewitt used to read it and loved it and saw some. called him at home and bill, don hewitt, yes, sir. ever thought of doing that on tv? absolutely not. well, you should. had him come in and dot audition, then my dad has been there from that one phone call from don hewitt. >> one of the best there, too. >> do you know he was edward morrow's director, going all the way back. >> 41 years old. do you know where it ranked last week? >> number two. >> and television in general, thank god that there's still a "60 minutes." that people will look at instead of pat buchanan dancing in a

leotard or -- buchanan, a lot of people disappointed that you're not going to be on "dancing with the stars." a lot of people. i must say i am too. america i believe is a little poorer this morning because of your choice. >> there was a time i would have done it, but i'm a little smarter now. >> he's screaming in our ear. we have a big show this morning. maria bartiromo will be with us and jeffrey sachs and is the economic stimulus working. also, our friend, the congresswoman maxine waters and max taibbi, his new article. plus money party, dylan ratigan and andrea mitchell. after the break, exclusive look at the stories politico is working on this morning.

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why are so many peace protesters so violent? i think it's because they can't control their emotions. >> you're against war? you're against killing? fine. keep it civil. i think the ability to control one's self-to have a sense of akrim nenty -- >> we'll do it live! we'll do it live! >> i missed that. he's waiting for it, waiting for it. good to see that after a few months. >> never gets old. >> true nature of someone's personality. can't hide it after that. >> sort of an even keeled guy. >> nor would i. >> never. >> jim is the executive editor of politico and has a look at

the politico playbook. >> i understand you've got an interview with tim pawlenty one of people talked about as a possible republican nominee in 2012. >> we've been trying to talk to the republicans that want to run in 2012, he's trying to carve out an image being both a conservative but as someone to tackle the problem. he didn't take direct shots at sarah palin but took subtle and clear ones, i'm focused on a broad solution, not just one issue, which was clearly sort of a nod to sarah palin and talked about mitt romney when he was governor of massachusetts, how that health care plan in that state, which has been a model that some people have looked at have said it failed to control costs and he does not like a health care plan that does not control costs. he's trying to become more assertive, trying to become a voice for republicans and trying to talk about the solutions. he'll have to share that part of

the debate with mitt romney who has a similar strategy. who has tried to act as a serious statesman like figure that has idea that's go beyond health care and other issues. are republicans excited by tim pawlenty, i've heard people saying he's a little generic? >> i don't get the sense there's a lot of excitement for him. i think it's a little earl lixt the only time you generate excitement when you say something bomb bass tick. >> evil, evil. >> fascist. >> villains. >> let's call somebody --

>> that's a good one. >> how about someone who has -- >> what does karl rove want an apology for? >> he has an op-ed and wants an apology of those who mischaracterized his role in the firings of the u.s. attorneys during the bush years. the democrats released the documents and tried to portray him in being way too involved in trying to get rid of attorney generals in places like new mexico and alabama. rove said, i testified, proves i did nothing wrong. was i aware of it? was my staff keeping me abreast of it? absolutely. i want an apology. i don't think he's going to get the the apology.

this is rove. >> what's the bottom line on the attorney story with rove? >> rove admitted in the op-ed piece that he was advised, he was told that that ig lashs was not investigating certain things and passed it along. and he said if he hadn't had passed it along, he would have been criticized for that. but ig lash yus, karl rove suggested that he wantig lashs wanted to run for public office, then that would hurt him in the future efforts to run for political office. i don't know if that's true or not. that's the charge he made out there. i will say this though, you can take this case and you can also take the case and jim, remember, every friday a couple of summers ago, we kept being told rove was about to be indicted in the

valerie plame case. i will say karl rove is probably one of the least liked people among editorial writers in washington, d.c., and they haven't always been straight up and fair. they've been predicting his arrest now for two or three years. and i would guess he's pretty ticked off about it. >> he's definitely in the top five republicans that democrats hate the most. up there with cheney and sarah palin. once these documents do show, it shows the ugly side of politics. people should know government officials are always involved in every aspect of governing. this gives us more vivid insight into that. >> the thing is too, the fact that democrats would suggest that these u.s. attorney appointments are not political is just a joke. one of my good friends in pensacola who was appointed by bill clinton was fired the first day that bush came in. why?

because the first day clinton came in he fired all of the republicans. any way, i have to say one more thing when you talk about rove, to put this in proper perspective and we say this with the passing of novemb vak. for years they hammered karl rove saying he was the one november ak released the name to, yet after that came out, nobody said somebody. nobody circled back and apologized to rove. when i was seventeen

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all right, welcome back to -- look at that bug. sorry about that, everybody. >> we're being attacked. >> we need to do a cleaning. >> central park is like a war zone after the hurricane. did you walk around, trees down all over the place? >> richard engel would say the same thing -- >> richard engel has his territory he covers and willie has his territory he covers. >> 96th to 86th street. >> look how pretty. it is a war zone when you walk into central park west. >> yes, it's dangerous. >> thank you. >> trees falling on people. >> time for a look at today's top story riz.

the election appears to be 40% lower than the 2004 vote. taliban suppressed violence may have kept voters from the polls. there are signs of improving relations between the u.s. and north korea meeting with governor bill richardson. the it may help in the path to progress. >> what i sense was one, the temperature has really cooled down in the relationship. it was hostile. i think the clinton visit has helped a lot to release the two americans. i sense for the north koreans they are now prepared to have a dialogue with us. >> and u.s. news and world report has the listing of top universities with some familiar names, marharvard and prince to with yale coming in third.

>> where's williams? >> that's great. >> time to look at the morning papers. >> maybe he went to williams, proud of you going to williams. >> the purple cow, right? >> there's a great line about the purple cow. can i have the papers, please. >> "washington post," cia hired firm for assassin program. missions never began officials say. suicide bombings and explosions kill 95 forcing reassessment of security. "new york times" is talking about two blasts in iraq. no request is made for u.s. help. they have the story on blackwater being hired in 2004 as part of the top secret program to assassinate al qaeda

leaders. and then the war zone that willie spoke of. you have courage. thank god we have a reporter like you. >> deadly day rattles baghdad. on the left column, swiss bank to release data on 4500 clients. u.s. could get names in offshore tax evasion case. >> john ridley sweating now. >> mika's former home town urged to have a plan for swine flu. many state businesses are unprepared for a suspected outbreak. coming up next "washington post" jonathan capehart helps us look at this morning's must-read opinion pages. does your mouthwash work in six different ways? introducing listerine total care. everythi you need... to strengthen teeth, help prevent cavities, and kill germs. introducing 6 in 1 listerine total care. the most complete mouthwash.

i would like the president to produce his birth certificate.

why can't the president of the united states produce a birth certificate? >> are you actively seeking that paper? you want him to produce. you tom delay with your political and professional career history in the u.s. government, questioning this man's -- >> you're questioning it, you want to see his paper? >> the constitution of the united states specifically says -- >> i know t. but i never asked you for yours. >> ask me, i'll give it to you. >> has anybody ever said mr. delay, give me your birth certificate? of course not. because you've got a texas accent and seem home grown. >> chris, can i speak, they have asked me if i'm a residents of texas even sued me about being a resident of texas, how about that? they spent 15 years trying to demonize me and put me in jail. of course they asked if i'm an american citizen. >> oh, my god, i just --

>> thought we moved on. >> we have. >> that's painful. you know what, seriously, i don't know if i would have been able to keep a straight face. chris couldn't keep a straight face either. that's ridiculous. what's wrong with these people? >> so tom delay prepares to be -- >> newt gingrich believes in death panels and sarah palin believes in death panels. >> that's understandable. >> wow. you're looking good gop. >> got a couple of years to turn it around. >> breathe deep. now, in the defense of the republican party -- >> no, no, do not do it. >> can i talk? >> for once. >> for once. will you stop cutting me off?

in defense of the republican party, none of these people are elected officials. that's all i go going for me this morning. when you -- the democrats that are calling people evil, harry reid, un-american, nancy pelosi runs the house, talking about fascist tactics, at least the democrats talking crazy are running washington, d.c. our people are talking about death panels aren't elected. >> the republicans who are elected clearly or not making enough good noise. >> you know what, let's just call them out right now. let's just do it. since i lovemaki making everybo. tim pawlenty has a responsibility to distance himself from death panel talk.

yesterday, we had the chairman of the gop, michael steele, a guy i like very much personally. the next time he believes whether the legislation has death panels in it. he needs to say, no, it does not. the virginia governor, he needs to come out and distance himself from nancy pelosi saying that these tactics are un-american -- >> we tried with michael steele yesterday. >> i'm just saying, there's all of this uncontrolled rage out there, i think leaders of both parties have to be called on the carpet and distance themselves from the crazy rhetoric that's out there, whether it's coming from nancy pelosi or harry reid calling americans evil, or nadler talking about nazi fascist tactics or sarah palin talking about death panels,

which clear, clear, clearly is not in this legislation. >> exactly. >> let's get leaders of the republican party and democratic party showing whether they are true leaders are whether they are going to play to their angriest base. >> here with us now editorial writer for "washington post" and msnbc contributor jonathan capehart. you want to chime in? >> i'm astounded by the tom delay sound byte. good lord. joe, i'm sorry you're one defense of the republican party i think is a little lame. these people used to be the leaders in the republican party. newt gingrich was the speaker of the house. he got the nickname the hammer for a reason. sarah palin was the vp nominee, former governor of alaska, what does it say -- what does it say that these folks were elected? these were people that people

voted for? >> thank you, jonathan. >> the second half -- >> hold on a second. because i want to pick apart what you've just said. you're right, newt gingrich was speaker of the house, tom delay was majority leader or whip. sarah palin was vice president, harry reid -- >> nominee. >> is the leader of the united states senate and calling americans evil. is. he's calling americans evil. nancy pelosi is speaker of the house and she's saying that these people going to town hall meetings are using un-american tactics. >> talking about fascist tactics, so you -- you have people that are running america calling other americans, quote, evil. so don't tell me that -- >> i just wonder what it says

about -- i just wonder what it says of these people once been elected. the second half of what you said i completely agree with. where are the responsible leaders of the republican party now -- >> wait a second, jonathan. don't, no, jonathan. >> jonathan, please, don't try to weasel out of this. don't just talk about -- >> i haven't even finished. >> i didn't get to the democrats yet. >> why don't you do that now because you've already talked about the republicans instead of talking about republicans calling people out, why don't you answer my question, do you think harry reid is right? do you have americans are evil mongers. >> and i don't think people are un-american who go to town hall meetings who try to ask questions. i read the pelosi op-ed she said the tactics of shouting down

people at town hall forums, that those tactics are un-american. >> said two years ago that those tactics were very american two years ago when she was speaking to anti-war protesters. jonathan, does the head of the democratic national committee have a responsibility to call harry reid out when he calls americans evil? >> look, i think the leader of the democratic party and the leaders of the republican party and all of them, not just the heads of the rnc and dnc but responsible leaders need to do what it takes to lower a lost steam and pressure that's happening around this country. you know, to have people on television asking for the president's birth certificate or have people on the other side calling others either evil mongers or un-american or however you want to describe it, doesn't get us anywhere. we're talking about a very

important issue in the country which is trying to get health care for people who don't have it and help people who have health insurance keep what they have. instead, we're talking about all sorts of other ancillary issue, whether the president has a birth certificate or -- >> i agree with you. >> let me ask you a question, mika. i have called out republicans. let me tell you something, i have the hate e-mail from sarah palin supporters to prove t they now hate me, that's fine just because i'm telling the truth. does president obama have a responsibility to do what i have said republicans have a responsibility to do, does president obama have a responsibility to call out -- because he loves calling out people in town hall meetings. does he have a responsibility to call out the leader of the united states senate when he calls americans quote, evil mongers? >> i think he does.

i think there's some sort of this above it all approach that does work for him. it usually takes time. >> he attacks people that go to town hall meetings. he has gotten in there and it hasn't worked. the message has not been sharpened. it is -- actually gotten more muddled. people are more confused. the op-ed i was going to get to, it is the entire atmosphere, there is distrust from wall street to the economy to now health care. people are scared and that's why it's getting ugly. there's an opportunity for it to get ugly. >> when i go out and give speeches and when i went on the book tour, i can tell you people like harry reid on one side and tom delay on the other side, they make most americans roll their eyes. what in the hell are these people talking about? just like jonathan said, why aren't they talking about

universal health care and costs, how do we curb them. why don't we talk about making health care more efficient instead of just calling other people names. we'll be right back. 's my vision. and i'm living it. everyday transitions lenses are there to help care for my sight. announcer: transitions lenses adjust to changing light to reduce glare and help protect your eyes from uv damage, so you can see better today and tomorrow. live your vision. transitions. healthy sight in every light. authentic transitions lenses are available at jc penney optical. it's perfect. (max azria) perfect. ♪ ♪

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but i've still got room for the internet. with my new netbook from at&t. with its built-in 3g network, it's fast and small, so it goes places other laptops can't. i'm bill kurtis, and wherever i go, i've got plenty of room for the internet. and the nation's fastest 3g network. gun it, mick. (announcer) sign up today and get a netbook for $199.99 after mail-in rebate. with built-in access to the nation's fastest 3g network. only from at&t. minnesota fans are going crazy, so excited about brett favre playing for the vikings, norm coleman is demanding a recount so -- >> this is a cbs news special

report, brett favre announced that he is retiring from the minnesota vikings. once again, brett favre has re-retired. this has been a cbs news special report. >> that changes everything. >> re-retired that happened quickly. >> all of these gamesries betwe the red sox and yankees. >> good morning. the red sox offense has been fire on all cylinders not even roy holliday could stop the barrage. david ortiz got things started in the second with a solo blast. third home run in his many games. jason bay added to his misery, two-run homer to left. holliday lasted six inning. twinnings and rangers, fans wondering if brett favre could

throw a baseball. ripped a double to rate, kinsler came around to score and texas was up 4-1. the twins roared back in the sixth, cabrera, play at the plate. rodriguez couldn't handle the throw and twins beat the rangers 5-4. that loss drops texas one game back of boston. if philadelphia, lee took a no-hitter in sixth. improved to 4-0 with the new club. back to back homers in the fifth. phils have won seven of the last eight. after being dismissed in atlanta and cut by the red sox, the st. louis cardinals have signed john smoltz. jamaican sprinter bolt sailed to victory but the story has been south african, officials have

asked them to conduct a gender verification test amid concerns she may be a he. if she doesn't meet the requirements to compete as a woman, she or he will be stripped of the gold medal. >> tennis player sisters have been the latest celebrities to own a stake of the dolphins, there could be more tal ept in the owner's box than in the field in miami. president obama welcomed three-time nascar champ jimmie johnson to the white house. he called it a uniquely american sport. the twitter evolution took a unexpected turn. giving a blow by blow account of

being pulled over and getting sent to jail. a shot you have to see to believe. off the score board, off the floor, nothing but net, a shot that reminds us of the old larry bird michael jordan commercials, no word on how many times it took him to make it. he is definitely a ringer in the game of horse. we'll talk to you tomorrow. >> that is impressive. you have to feel bad for the woman that won the 800 meter and then they need to verify your gender, that just hurts. at vanderbilt. news you can't use. tests are still going to come in. octomom. smackdown with kate of jon and kate. we'll be right back. when i was seventeen

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is it time? >> it is time for news you can't use. i take my marching orders from donald j. trump. >> you should. >> no, you shouldn't. >> what's wrong with you? >> he's an american icon and my personal lord and savior. >> i won't go that far. he is a grade great man, great american. >> he's a great man. >> the miss universe competition sunday night. >> perhaps the greatest competition ever. >> 9:00 eastern time in nbc in

telemundo. sent over some video. shots of girls in intertubes going down the atlantic resort in the bahamas and they are just having fun frolicing in the water and people seem to be getting along. >> we can love completely without completely understanding. >> that's it. >> jonathan, coming together? >> that's what i was trying to tell him, jonathan didn't get it. >> there it is. >> just stop it. get rid of the video now. >> the point is there's no point. the point is from all different cultures, all different countries, and they can get along. why can't we? >> thank you. >> that's what donald is trying

to tell us. >> maybe the republicans could learn a thing or two from them. >> always the republicans. you know, i lincoln what does he always say, a house divided itself cannot band. all of those lovely women are teaching us today. >> we are the world. >> blas femi. he knows how i feel. i've been clear with him. >> we've shown you tom delay earlier in the show. he talked on hardball and this will be the end of the "dancing with the stars" delay coverage. he showed off the dancing shoes literally on "hardball". >> are you one of those texas boys, square dancers, old days, wearing the boots and tux together, that stuff? >> black tie and boots and

dancing the texas two-step, polka and waltz. the only downside, i have to show you, chris. look at this show. a texan doesn't wear a shoe like this. they are making me wear. >> it's a little pump with high heels. >> no, they are not making him wear that. he's choosing to wear that. >> good point. >> looks like the shoes from the witch in the wizard of oz. >> thank you, willie for that. that's great. >> and donald trump. what a great american. you know, jonathan, i've been getting e-mails saying i've been unkind to you. and i apologize to you. the only point i was trying to make the point that the young women are making every day down in atlantis and that is that we've got to come together and we can't just point at one side and say it's all their fault and let our own side off the hook.

>> right. >> some viewers agree with me, chris, you got an e-mail. >> this is from allen in baltimore. if capehart were a dentist his patients wouldn't have teeth on the right side of their mouth. >> that's not nice. that is horrible. you have one being mean to me, chris? >> we could do that. >> shouldn't be a problem finding one. >> that's no problem at all. >> i'm afraid to read that. i don't know which one you want me to read. >> don't be afraid. >> read the really good one. >> have you going to shoot the messeng messenger. joe can't help it he's a partisan. jonathan you should not appear on the show, you seem to upset him every time you're there. >> i'm a partisan for attacking republican gingrich and republican palin and republican delay, democrat pelosi, i'm a partisan, democrat reid.

if anything -- you were not partisan. >> you were kind of aggressive. >> i think it's because my tie is better than his today. >> jonathan is -- >> i think your tie is my tie, you're even wrong on fashion this morning. >> so jonathan capehart stay with us, i have learned from these young women that really are saying, let there be peace on earth and let it begin with me. i'm taking that to heart. donald trump that's taught us a lesson. pat buchanan is with us. we'll talk about the recklessness on the right and left. we'll get him into this conversation. like those young women, take it to a higher level. and we'll also ask him about the high heels tom delay will be wearing on "dancing with the

stars." >> the ones he's so excited about wearing he showed them on television. >> here's mika with the news. let's make this a three-story grind. >> really, kind of a weird terminology. >> look at jonathan. i'm uncomfortable. what did you want again? >> we think -- what were you asking for? >> do you want to explain that because that, i might call human resources? willie and i always did that on the radio show in '87. >> where it all started. >> i'm very -- what we do is edit it down from three hours to one hour then show it live at 9:00. >> time for a look at today's top stories. we're going to begin with senator ted kennedy who is apparently looking ahead in his battle with brain cancer. he is appealing to state

officials to change a massachusetts law to allow the governor to immediately appoint an interim successor when his seat becomes vacant. a kennedy spokesperson says there is no significant change in his condition. we'll get a live report from outside the kennedy compound in just a few moments. this morning the initial turnout in afghanistan's presidential election appears to be 40% lower than in 2004. officials say taliban attacks have kept many voters away from the polls. today's vote is seen as a test for president karzai's government which has been criticized for its inability to stamp out corruption and drug trade. informal announcement expected on the scottish decision to release lib yan terrorist on compassionate grounds. the pan am explosion in

lockerbie scotland that killed 270 people. lawyers say he's dying of prostate cancer. >> let's get you in on the conversation that jonathan and i have been having. tom delay sounds like he's a berther, we talked about newt gingrich and sarah palin, nancy pelosi, un-american tactics, harry reid calling americans evil mongers. is there a parallel. you went through watergate, that was rough. did you have democrats and republicans calling each other nazis and fascists then. >> i don't recall with the attacks and things like that, evil mongers and un-american and fascist and things like that -- >> even during watergate? >> well, let me -- it was bitter

and hostile. i can't recall, joe, from the time i started writing, lbj was under horrible attack from the left in the demonstrations and things like that. when you're talking about people who are public officials, national officials, governors, former speakers and speakers of the house, this kind of talk back and forth, no. i haven't seen it. i can't recall in my lifetime. >> it's terrible, we're not having a real discussion about health care. what, pat, you've been around for a long time. what do you think is causing this reduction of civility that i didn't see during the impeach. or you didn't see during watergate? >> first off, there's really an idea logical war going on inside the democratic coalition. it's astonishing to see liberals ripping away at the blue dogs that have given them mat jort because the blue dogs don't want

this public option. liberals saying we're not going to support barack obama if he doesn't give us the public option. that is a guy that brought them to power. electrifying figure and these folks are fighting with each other over the battle. and quite frankly, joe, if they keep it up, they could so poison the well, i think americans are saying, let me get away from this thing because you can't get something good to come out of all of this bil and bitterness and anger and rage. >> bile and bitterness and anger and rage and it's from both sides. you gave me a poll number that i think is enlightening. >> just came out, 63%, vast majority of americans think obama and the gop, talking about both sides, leaders aren't working together to deal with the important issues facing the nation, not just health care, but everything we're facing. clearly people are tired of it. it's funny during the election everyone was seeing we're tired

of this, we're tired of this partisan back and forth fighting. we'll come together and try to govern in a new fashion. yet we get here and it's gone to the extreme. what everybody everyone is talking about, whether you're saying you think these folks are evil or what have you, i have my own personal opinions about where some of this is going. it's not resonating with the people that have been elected. >> people are sick of it. whether i hang out with republicans or democrats when i'm having dinner, social occasions with my family and kids, people just roll their eyes. they roll their eyes at the harry reid calling people extremists and even republicans are rolling their eye at the newt gingriches that talk about death panels. there's this collective feeling of like, grow up. >> i want to talk to maria

bartiromo, a sense of misplaced trust leading up to the effort of reformed health care. the timing couldn't be worse and the landscape couldn't be worse. >> it is. we tried as a country perhaps, americans thing, maria to do too much before the president got to health care. >> that's one of issues we talked about before. he's taken on so much. health care is a sensitive and personal thing. it's clear the public does not want the government running their health care. i would take issue with what pat said. i give the blue dogs credit for not going along. i would not want them to go along because the president put them in power. >> pat was saying that progressives, liberals are tearing them to shreds for not going along. he was surprised that liberal democrats are attacking moderate to conservative democrats.

>> joe, i happen to agree with the blue dogs and their fear is and this is legitimate, this the cam camel's nose in the tent, this government option of the and dr. dean almost said as much, we want to get the co-opens on the senate bill and stick the government option in there and ram it through both housewise 50% of the vote. this is an ideologue cal war. i understand why the blue dogs are fighting this. i agree with them and agree with the republicans on that issue. >> what about if they were to roll over to republicans and go forward. what kind of implication would that have? >> pat? >> excuse me, if who goes forward? >> if the republicans went for it -- >> went for the government

option. >> i'm talking about harry reid. >> republicans sign on to this bill, they will forfeit the chance they have to get all of those folks who are coming out and folks coming out by and large may be angry, upset on both sides, by and large, they are against it. they don't want it. the people against national health care have at least won the argument with the crowds. i think winning the argument in the country, if you look at obama's polls which are sinking -- >> jonathan capehart, is it fair for conservative republicans and conservative democrats, so-called blue dogs to be concerned as pat said, the camel getting the nose in tent. that this could be the beginning of a single payer health care system down the road? >> well, they've made it clear that that's something they don't want. if they see that this could be the first step, then sure they have every right to raise concerns and try to stop it.

you know, pat raised a very interesting point early on when he first started talking about this. and that was that the progressives in the party are fighting with the blue dogs who are the ones who have brought them into the majority. and i think it's a very good point and it's one that i know progressives in the left wing of the democratic party aren't going to appreciate and aren't going to listen to. but it's one that they really should because if they want to keep majority now and going on into the future, they are going of to to figure out how to work together and to compromise so that they can maintain their majority but also get stuff down. because right now the fighting -- the fighting between democrats and republicans, but right now the real fight is between progressives and those blue dogs and democrats unlike anybody else, certainly know how to beat the hell out of each other. >> that really is the battle that is the most relevant right now. the liberal democratic caucus

versus the moderate to conservative democrat being caucus. that's where the health care bill will be shaped. >> we'll see if we get rereal reform out of it. >> you do have barney frank and barack obama a few years ago talking about a single payer system. we invited anthony back today but he couldn't come back, saying that he wants insurance companies completely wiped out in the health care field and have the federal government fund the entire health care system. people hear things like that and get nervous. >> jonathan capehart thank you and we're sorry. >> jonathan, i am sorry if i called you out on only attacking republicans. just apologize.

>> are you going to be there next week? are you going to be there at 30 rock next week? >> i am, can we hug? >> i'll be there monday and tuesday. i'll see you there. >> can we -- >> i have a present for you actually. >> sure, i'll give you a hug, joe. >> thank you, jonathan. i feel much better. >> we're following major stories and update on senator ted kennedy's health and he's helping to change massachusetts law. >> the terrorist convicted in the 1988 lockerbie bombing is expected to be released from prison today. a full report live from scotland when we come back on that. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. show and tell

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welcome back "morning joe." nbc news has learned ted kennedy has sent a letter to lawmakers asking for a success plan to be put in place. ann, good morning. >> reporter: good morning, mika, the letter senator kennedy sent was addressed to massachusetts governor duval patrick and the leaders of the house and senate. he's asking for a change in the state law to the succession plan for the u.s. senate seat. under current massachusetts law, if a u.s. senator from massachusetts was to resign or die, there would be a special election held. and that special election would have to be held within about a

five-month period. what is not in massachusetts law is the ability for the governor to appoint an interim senator until that special election is held. and senator kennedy is asking that the law be amend so an interim senator can be appointed. in fact, as he wrote to the governor, i can give you a couple of quotes from his letter today. i'm now writing to you about an issue that concerns me deeply. the continuity of representation for massachusetts should a senate vacancy occur. now clearly the issue that is not in the letter but everybody thinks it is obviously thinking about is health care reform. it has been the issue of senator kennedy's life, should he not be able to be there to cast a vote when it comes up for vote in the senate, he wants to make sure that massachusetts has not just one vote but has two votes. in the letter, senator kennedy does not allude to the fact that he is fighting a malignant brain

cancer that he was diagnosed with in may of 2008. he did say at the end of the letter, serving the people of massachusetts in the united states senate has been and still is the greatest honor of my public life. mika? >> nbc's ann thompson on cape cod with that story. now we go to scotland where the government there is expected to release its decision to to release the terrorist on compassionate ground. lawyers say he's dying from prostate cancer and will return to libya. donna friesen is live in scotland with the latest on this. >> reporter: good morning, we're expecting the official announcement from the scottish government within the next hour or so that will allow the release of this convicted mass murderer abdel.

his legal team has team has said he has weeks or months to live and the last wish to go home to libya to die. he has always maintained his innocence, spent eight years in prison, he's 57 now and been appealing his conviction. a few days ago he dropped the appeal and that opened the door to the possibility of compassionate release. it's understood that justice secretary of scotland will agree to that but the secretary here has been under intense pressure, especially from the united states. many of the families of the american victims of the lockerbie bombings do not thing he should be shown any compassion whatsoever and if he dies here so be it. there were pressure from seven u.s. senators, including ted kennedy demanding he be kept in

prison and even secretary of state hillary clinton has something to say about it. she was very blunt as well. >> i knew a lot of these families, i talked with them about what a horror they experienced. and i just think it is absolutely wrong to release someone who has been imprisoned based on the evidence about his involvement in such a horrendous crime. >> reporter: but there are those who think that he is innocent. some that follow the trial from day one and they think he was always a scapegoat any way, the real story of what brought down pan am 103 has never been revealed. we're expecting to see him leave the prison shortly and catch a private jet flown up from libya to take him back home to die.

>> donna friesen, live in scotland, thanks very much. coming up next, the latest headlines out of the white house. savannah guthrie. and "time" magazine unveils its latest cover right here on "morning joe." most for headaches.

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the administration's commitment on the public option

equally as strong as the commitment by the administration -- >> i think i've answered this like 12 times. i will restate again. >> for the 13th time. >> get your pen, ready. the president, i'll go slow. the president believes we should have -- keep writing -- choice in competition. >> choice in competition. >> that option is not a line in the sand, yes or no? >> i'm not going to get into. the president addressed that in here and i'm not going to get into ranking different priorities like the preseason college football poll. >> savannah guthrie goes after giby one day and chuck todd the next, pretty soon they'll put the nbc chair back in the radio booth. >> we were talking to who is it yesterday that said -- >> katherine. >> rally in the nbc booth at the white house. >> heard about that.

>> savannah's office is literally a radio booth. >> has her straightening iron out and doing her hair. >> screaming to gibbs, i can't work under these conditions. >> reporter: i call at the time penalty box. here it is, nbc correspondent savannah guthrie. >> what's the president doing today at 12:30? ? >> reporter: this wasn't on the schedule at 12:30. you know what, trick question. i'm ready for you. okay, ready. >> what about 1:10? >> reporter: 1:10 he'll be on the radio show, a conservative talk show host friendly to oba a obama. >> what about 10:30? >> reporter: i'm not looking down. meeting with senior advisers, questions, who are the senior

adviser as axelrod and rahm emanuel are on vacation. >> she's prepared. >> reporter: in my defense, i got the time right. >> you did not know anything. you're just over there smoking cigarettes outside trying to pick up idle gossip to put on tmz. do your job, savannah. >> reporter: do you have any other scheduling questions? i'm ready. >> no. i don't. you know them today. it's no fun. so what's going on at the white house today? what's the message of the day on health care? >> reporter: i think it's interesting. he's got two audiences, he'll be speaking to conservative radio and at 2:45 talking to liberal members of the party, organizing for america, the obama wing of the democratic party, a conference call and town hall online forum where he wants to

reassure the base. that really illustrates the predicament that he finds himself in. he has to reassure the liberal side, yes, public option is still a possibility, don't worry we're going to do real reform and answering serious concern from the republican side. this is emblem attic of what the president has to do to walk the line. >> is it safe to say it is in the democrat's hands and republicans are ir vel rant and trying to get the base together with the more moderate base? >> i think there is a realization and recognition here that hopes of bipartisanship and deal is growing dimer by the day. by virtue of some things that happened over this august. officials will tell you, it's not we don't want a bipartisan deal. it's just listening to what grassley and others have said, the way the town halls have evolved. they are not sure republicans

are serious about working on a deal. one thing that struck them was no sooner did the public option, the notion that it wouldn't be part of the bill was floated out there and people started talking about the co--op i you had republicans like canter coming out and saying, that's fed into the feeling here at the white house, republicans don't want to do health care reform. they are not going to deal with that. so we're going to have to go it alone. i think there is a realization that that's a more likely outcome than it was perhaps a month ago. >> pat buchanan? this is a democratic game now, right? >> it sure is. what savannah is saying, the game is up to the blue dogs, if they hold out and the liberals say we won't go along with something that doesn't have a government option, you're not going to get anything. i think the liberals will have to cave or they won't get their health care bill. >> that's what i was trying to ask pat earlier, if they go

forward even in the face of all of this skepticism, you're saying we won't get anything if that's the case? >> if the liberals demand the government option and the blue dogs say, i can't go home with a government option, i don't believe in it and these crowds are telling me i wouldn't do it and i'm not going to do it. i don't think the liberals have the votes alone to ram it through both houses. >> there's another danger, we had howard dean on about health care. he said, we'll pass it through the house and then there won't be a public option, then we'll pass it through the senate then in reconciliation we'll get it in there and pass it with 50 votes. there's a danger there because the guy i ran against in 1994 voted for the clinton tax increase the first time but didn't vote for it at the end. that didn't matter. i took the one vote where he voted for the tax increase and helped it pass in the process and that's just what i hammered

over and over again. if a blue dog democrat votes for a bill without a public option and in the end the president signs a public option, politi l politically it's the same thing and these blue dogs are in a horrible position, john ridley. >> yeah, ironically. >> i'm talking about politically -- >> before they were brought in to help the democrats in places where they could be competitive with republicans. >> savannah guthrie, thank you so much. coming up next here on "morning joe," dr. jeffrey sachs coming up i think people want to know when i was seventeen i was not good to my skin. long summer days and not enough sleep. what i wouldn't do for a do-over. (announcer) new neutrogena total skin renewal. gentle exfoliating puffs and micro-vibrations speed surface cell turnover. it's clinically tested to help

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we could say, that's common sense, let's try it. we could do that without costing the taxpayer a lot of money, but

the very fact they won't even have consider it, demands on one conclusion. this is not about health care. it is not about getting people insured. it's about the holy grail of the democrat party and a lot of liberals in this country for 20 years has been the government would run health care. >> all right. director of the earth institute at columbia university and dr. jeffrey sachs the author of "commonwealth, economics for a crowded planet." there are a lot of conservatives like senator demint that the government want to take over all of health care. we had anthony on yesterday. all of the reading i've done and i think all of the reading you've done and all of us have done, we don't know what a

public option would be, what it would mean. because everything, even at this late stage of the debate is so ill-defined. tell me, what would a public option look like at the end of the day. >> i think we can figure out what a public option should be. and i think when -- >> but what would it be? >> the weird thing like you said is the white house has not come out with the plan at this point. so they are trying to defend a proposition that doesn't yet have substance to it. and i think that's where they are losing the politics. but where the substance is is really pretty clear. the private health insurance industry is absolutely broken in this country, not broke, they are making a fortune, but the quality of the health care, what we are getting per dollar is so much less than what we ought to be getting. we need the kind of fixes that we've actually seen on display like the cleveland clinic or mayo clinic, these organized

structured ways to people aren't going doctor to doctor, test to test spending five times what they should be spending, five times the test. we know all of that. the private sector is organized to maximize the tests and duplication, so what a good public option would be, and structure to say the patient is at the center primary care is at the center and use the public option not just to bring the government in as a thing to do, but actually as a way to get a more logical health system. >> we know where we should be according to you, if you support a public option. the question is where we are and this seems like a conversation we had about the stimulus package and all of these things created in committee, in a congress, disorganized and so everybody runs out defending --

>> rushed. >> defending a stimulus plan, which you said recreated a bubble. here we are with health care again, where again, we don't know what a public option would mean because as you said the president hasn't defined it. isn't it time on health care for the president to say, this is what i believe in. this is what a public option is going to look like. this is what is it's going to mean to you. why won't he do it? >> yes, that on climate and health care because this model that they have right now, which is we don't want to put forward a plan like in 1993 when hillary's plan went down to defeat. we want it to be worked out in the back rooms of congress is not working. >> the ambiguity is what is scaring americans, isn't it? >> there's no sense. you watch the president who i believe is incredibly smart and pointed in the right direction, absolutely. but what he's defending? you can't even figure it out

when he gives a press conference, filled with detail but without the basis for -- >> and americans, maria, who don't know what it's actually going to mean to them in the end are scared. i had a lawyer tell me when i first started practicing law, tell them everything because if you give the jury a reason to suspect the worst of your client, they will suspect the worst of your client. >> when you drill down on details, one of the most important things that have come out of places like the cleveland clinic have been focusing on policies in place for preveptive care. to secret that three-quarters of money spent, 70% of the money we spend on health care is for elderly and diseases that are preventible. it's like insurance for cars. if you have a car and get into a lot of accidents, your insurance goes up. you know, why aren't we focused on where the money is spent and

putting policies in place to actually prevent the disease. >> they know these things at the white house -- >> exactly. >> that's what's missing. it's exactly this confusion and it's opened up this whole debate to really the most wild, weird -- >> the death panel talk and all of other nonsense. >> what everybody does know is that with their private plans right now, you go to file a claim, and it's hell and you get denied for reimbursements and spent six months or a year listening to clicks at the other end of the phone. the system is broken, the companies don't have -- there is no system. it is reimbursement when they want to reimburse. >> how do we know that's not going to be the same with the public plan? >> we don't know anything until a plan is put forward. that's what's so strange. we have a president who's the best communicator we've had in

generations, a president who's smart and knows the details but they refuse to make clear policies. the idea is let the congressional committees, which are just absolutely bathed in lobbying funds, do the stuff. the health industry is the number two industry in lobbying in the country. they've spent 3.5 billion of lobbying in the last decade. number one, the banking sector. where we have these disasters on these absolutely unconscionable bank bailouts and on bonuses continuing after we save the banks, it's because we're going to the congressional committees where it's no secret what's going on in the back rooms and the president promised to change that -- >> i think the public is getting smart on that. they are saying, my god, now you want us to take on another one of your big initiatives that we're going to pay for and then we're going to continue to pay for and it will continue to

be -- >> again, it's the accumulation of all of this. we've been talking about the accumulation of debt over six months, on top of george bush's debt for eight years. again, like you've said and thank god somebody is saying it, the stimulus package, ill-defined and not suited for its purpose. cap and trade, the president can come out and say this is what we need to do. instead he turned it over to the house. >> what did we get? >> 1300 pages without a strategy. >> no strategy -- >> beating back criticism by saying this is what it's not. >> in health care, it's almost like americans are saying, you know what, you want to throw money at the economy? fine, we don't need the details. cap in trade makes you feel good, fine, we don't need the details. when you're going to change my health care system, damn it, i want to know specifics. >> and they want a plan and support the change. >> it's too much. you cannot do it effectively all of these things.

>> we'll continue this in a moment. up next, an exclusive look at the new cover of "time" magazine. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. achoo!

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all right, live pictures of dallas, texas. >> big day. >> welcome back to "morning joe." >> moved by that, weren't you? >> i still can't get my arms around. >> you hate middle you. >> with us now to unveil the cover of "time" magazine we have deputy managing editor with us. ramesh, nice to have you in. snoonks for having me. >> what's on the cover of time? >> the cover of "time" this week is -- >> question mark. >> the real cost of cheap food. >> i like it. >> by brian walsh, our environment writer, on the cover a beautiful package of american meat with a warning label. it says "this hamburger may be hazardous to your health. why the american food system is bad for our bodies, our environment, and our economy." >> i love it. >> and what people are doing about it. this story was a real eye opener for me because when you -- when you break it down, so many of

things we worry about -- climate change, even health care costs -- can be traced to the way in which we consume and produce food in this country. >> absolutely. >> the american food industry has become amazingly efficient, and we spend less money today on food than we did at any other time in our history, but there are all these attendant costs. there are environmental costs, economic costs, huge subsidies that are going into unsustainable practices, and of course we have the problem of obesity in this country, which is driving up health care costs every day. and so, this story is about things that people are doing and efforts to change the way in which we go about growing and consuming food and looking at whether we can scale up some of the more sustainable practices and actually become more mainstream. >> doctor? i love it. >> good. >> i love it. we need to be smart about this. >> good story and just right. we learned how to grow corn

basically very cheap, and so corn is everywhere. it's in our sodas, in our meat products and in our bodies. and these refined carbohydrates that we're eating, that's behind the obesity epidemic, behind ill health. but what's not true is that food is cheap overall. you try to get some fresh fruit in a poor neighborhood in new york city, you can't even find it on sale. there are whole areas of queens or brooklyn or the bronx where you can't find fresh vegetables and fresh fruits. so, it's not surprising that people are in bad health. they can't -- it's very hard to live in a healthy way right now. and the fruit and the vegetable pars have gone up in this country over the last 25 years. >> absolutely. >> so, this is a very serious point that you're making. what's also amazing, which, you know, is so paradoxical, food growing and distribution does more climate change than automobiles, than the power sector.

it's actually been -- >> really? >> yeah. >> 20% of our fossil fuels -- >> 20% of the green house gases are producing the food. it's the fertilizer, the energy and that. it's the methane, the nitrous oxide, really weird stuff. >> whether or not we should be using food to energize -- >> that's for sure. >> but it's been put up for debate. >> that biofuels thing would never exist were iowa not the first caucus state in the country. this is pure politics top to bottom. it's an absurdity. >> it's the core to the health care debate. >> yes, it is. >> and the obesity crisis. >> because an obese person will cost a company twice as much as a smoker, unbelievable, because they'll develop diabetes and -- >> you know, the other thing you can say about obesity, there have been a number of studies, not surprising, because we kind of see it, the poorer the population, the more obesity

there is. >> right. >> why? because those calories are the cheapest calories, the refined kratsz, the starches, but not the healthy stuff. so, poor people can't eat a healthy diet right now. it's kind of the opposite of what people think. you know, more wealth and overeating but it's actually poverty and an unhealthy diet. >> are there solutions in here? >> well, only 1% of the american food industry is actually devoted to what we would consider organic or sustainable production. but there are examples, there are places like chipotle, the fast-food place which is all locally grown ingredients. it costs 32% more for them. >> that's the price. >> but they are helping. >> romesh, thank you very much. they did your work for you. >> i know. >> great topic. >> put him on the payroll. >> a great topic. can't wait to read it.

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live shots of los angeles from the jam cam. also dallas, the big "d," as we've showed you before. >> all right. >> also the gateway to the west, st. louis. one of the grim shots. washington, d.c. the white house. >> look at the fog in new york. >> out to new york city. yeah.

>> there's bugs all over the camera. this is gross. now i'm itchy. >> let's bring in right now a guy who's just -- >> i'm nervous. maybe that's why i'm itchy. >> he's crazy. he's the one that itches because he usually comes on the air for medicated than you. >> more medication than me? >> how you doing? >> doing pretty well. >> you look lovely today. very handsome. >> great. >> very sharp. >> we've got a nice place in connecticut for you to run this afternoon. so, "money party," we've been talking to maria and to dr. jeffrey, a fascinating conversation. dr. sax said one of the problems is this administration is not defining what it wants, said it's arguing these concepts like public option without te death fining them and americans are just concerned about turning

over their health care when they just don't know what they're -- >> well, they should be. i mean, it's a huge contrast. didn't hear the totality of the conversation, was the bush administration had an agenda, said this is the agenda, this is the plan, get on the bus or get off the bus. but here comes the bus. and obama is effectively, for better or worse, saying, i'd like to deal with the problem of health care. why don't you discuss it for a while and then i'll come back. and that leaves chaos. and our political system, and i think mike taibbi dawes great job of capturing this in his piece for "rolling stone," our political system is not equipped to solve a problem like this on behalf of the american people. our political system is equipped to accommodate the interests of the health insurers, the interests of the unions, the interest of the drug companies, the combined interest of the drug companies, the unions and the health insurers does not get you a good health care system. it gets you a health care system that provides money to those people. and the reality is if we are so

stupid as to fund -- and i say as a group the taxpayer who as it turns out appears to be the easiest mark in the world right now as to empower a group of people to theoretically accommodate health care for us while looking out for the interests of everybody else except for us -- >> well, it's done. >> so stupid. i think they're showing that they are smart. they are actually saying wait a minute, this doesn't sound right. i don't understand it. there's no detail here. and so, they are, you know -- >> i disagree. i think people are smart to say, listen, i don't like the way this is happening. they're intelligent to say -- you want to talk? it is your show. >> what i'm thinking is usually at the top of the hour we just do a little teaser and say what we're going to talk about. >> sorry. >> you are on crack. you said that to your school this afternoon, they would fire you. they shouldn't say that to the seventh-graders. >> i think, though, listening to the doctor and --

>> how did i get in this? >> be careful, my man. be careful. >> and getting some of the residue from the powder off your face, this may be -- i've been asking the question, dr. sax, for a few days. why the hatefulness on the far left and the far right? all the charges of nazism, fascism, death panels, un-americanism. it may be because the president has left this void and said you guys talk ak it. maybe if he steps into the fray and says this is what i want, this is what i'm willing to fight for, i think it is where we're going, i'm looking at dr. sax, i'm not looking at "money party." >> trying to talk to you right now. >> i hope you come back. after labor day, this is what we need. absolutely. >> well, this is -- this is what he can do -- >> why aren't they doing it now? >> well, they had this strategy. strategy was let it be debated.

but i think it's exactly right. what gets debated in congress is the vested interest and not -- >> not healthy for people. >> not health care reform. >> i got the news. >> we're like two -- yes. i'd like to know what's in the news. >> wow. all right. >> you're being kicked off like out of prep school. >> first of all, i should let everyone know that along with dr. sax, maria bartaromo and "money party," andrea mitchell needs to get a word in edge wiese, d ilan. but first a look at the top stories. senator ted kennedy is apparently looking ahead in his battle with brain cancer. nbc news has learned the 77-year-old is appealing for a change in state law to allow for immediate appointment of an interim successor when his seat becomes vacant. there is no significant change in his condition. officials in afghanistan are

extending voting in the election by at least one hour. initial turnouts appear to be ho 40% lower than in 2004. taliban attacks have apparently kept many voters away from the polls. also, we're watching live pictures from scotland where a formal announcement is expected on a decision to release a convicted libyan terrorist on compassionate grounds. the 57-year-old was convicted in 1988 pan am bombing over lockerbie, scotland, that killed 270 people. lawyers say he is dieing from prostate cancer and will return to libya. there are reports that back in 2004 the cia hired private contractors from blackwater, usa, as part of its then secret program to train hit squads to kill top members of al qaeda. hmm. interesting. meanwhile, you're watching live pictures from washington. it wasn't a program. it was just, you know, sort of a power point. from washington, former cy

director michael hayden and former homeland security security secretary michael chert lauf take part in a panel discussion on the privatization of intelligence services. we'll be watching that. >> job well done. people will line up for that job. as congress battles over health care reform, democratic consulting firms with close ties to president obama are reaping the rewards. a pair of firms, one founded by top adviser david axelrod, have been hired by interest groups in a $24 million media campaign. >> wow. that's a lot of money. >> meanwhile, the president continues to push his plan, talking yesterday on a conference call with leaders. >> the one thing you all share is a moral conviction. you know that this debate over health care goes to the heart of who we are as a people. i know there's been a lot of misinformation in this debate. and there are some folks out there who are frankly bearing false witness. these are all fabrications that

have been put out there in order to discourage people from meeting what i consider to be a core ethical and moral obligation, and that is what that we look out for one another. that i am my brother's keeper and my sister's keep, and in the wealthiest nation on earth right now, we are neglecting to live up to that call. and finally, "60 minutes" producer don hewitt, credited with inventing the tv newsmagazine, has died of pancreatic cancer. the legendary newsman directed the first network television newscast, originated the use of cue cards, and was the first to superimpose words on a screen. don hewitt, a trail blazer, was 86 years old. >> a legend and a guy -- >> and a gentleman. oh. >> a guy that you knew very well and worked with. >> so liked working with him. yes. he will be missed.

>> that is not me. >> don't talk that way. you're still here. oh, my god. >> does anybody at the table think you will ever say she was lucky to work with you? >> not even close. >> no. i absolutely will. >> she will make a memoir of the dark years. >> exactly. >> the blue period. >> the blue period. >> i got a book, believe me. >> maria is working one right now from our time on "the closing bell." >> i've got a book. she's the only one, so. >> i don't know. andrea mitchell, help me out here. >> hi, andrea. >> i'm not sure that anyone can help you with that crowd. >> should i tell my story? >> please tell your story. >> andrea, what are you reporting on today? >> reporter: well, we've been reporting on a number of things, obviously health care. we've been going through all of the traces of the administration trying to explain whether it is, in fact, just going to go it

alone with the democrats or also still try to get a bipartisan plan. as you know, the senate finance committee under max baucus is saying, wait, look at us. we're still there even though we're on conversation. we'll have a conference call at 9:00 eastern tonight and go over where they are. they say they are still in the game, but you can see the president getting pretty impatient. >> yeah. >> and republicans -- i can't get his name right -- radio program today from the white house, a pretty big deal, which we will carry live in our 1:00 program. >> all right. >> yep. and of course looking at the cia now acknowledging officials, at least some officials are acknowledging from government that they did hire blackwater, very controversial firm, to subcontract that assassination program. it was a little bit more than a power point. they did do training. they went in the field. but as someone said to me this morning, we never took anyone

off the streets. so, it was never -- they never actually got to the assassination stage. >> was it a program? >> reporter: well, some people are acknowledging that it was, quote, a program, but that teams did try to find locations. they never actually got into the field. >> unbelievable. >> reporter: and never took anyone out. but at one stage of it, at least, the earlier stage, it was subcontracted to blackwater, which has, you know, been a pretty controversial company. >> very controversial. >> they were trying to figure out whether it was feasible or not, and every director seemed to come back and say this isn't going to work out, it's going to expose us too much in these foreign countries. so, hey, i want to ask you about health care. dr. sax has been talking about how the president needs to step forward with a plan. he decided, like the stimulus package and cap and trade, we're going to throw it out there, you guys talk about it, we'll vote on it, i'll sign it.

that's worked for other bills. it's not working so well for him here. let me show you the latest gallup poll, gallup tracking poll. the president has lost about 15 points since we started talking about health care. >> reporter: right. >> this is the same news that an nbc news/"wall street journal" poll had the president at 51% approved, 41% disapprove. having other people shape the bill and talk about the bill is not working politically for the president. any word that he may step forward and put some more concrete plans out there himself? >> reporter: i think they're going to have to and they're going to have to work on it now with the democrats because this bipartisan approach, they're beginning to realize, has not worked. but the problem they have, of course, is that even within the democratic party, especially within the democratic party, they are at war. it's civil war inside the democratic party. you know, you could argue that letting congress, letting nancy pelosi and the house caucus define the stimulus package worked because it passed. and generally it's believed to,

by economists, at least, to have avoided an even worse catastrophe. but it did define this administration early on on the left and created enormous problems for them with the budget and the way they're proceeding. so, i think that this was -- it was successful in one regard, but they -- you could argue gave up way too much to the house democrats and made it much more difficult to do anything in a bipartisan basis now that they came to the big issue, health care. >> yeah. all right. nbc's andrea mitchell. thank you so much. of course we'll see you at 1:00 eastern time right here on msnbc. and i'm sure that show is stocked already. >> you just agreed, and you said exactly right with that what she said. >> exactly right, because we started out with a grab bag of legislation that has made everybody unhappy. massive deficits, ill defined. it's had perhaps a very, very

slight uptick effect on the economy but not very much. but it did define the administration early on, which is that it's going to spend and not define the plan clearly enough. and i think health care is now a defining moment for them. >> i would even go beyond that to argue this process is a referendum on the u.s. government's ability to function. we have a government to solve problems for the country. we have a health care problem. we spend too much, and we have a 47 million people without health insurance. if we cannot get a government that can address this problem in a way that is remotely sfwel gent or remotely addresses the actual problems, uninsured, lack of minute mandates, too expensive, then why do we have a government? i know -- referendum on the government. >> exactly right what you're saying but it's not obama's fault. >> no, no. >> it's been 30 years. >> right. >> we said we're not going to try to solve things through the government. he's saying they will try, people doubt it. they want to hear how now. >> did we do it with the

stimulus package or is it the same exact thing where we're having the public debate where the money should go, where the weak spots of the economy are? i mean -- >> these are complicated issues that can't be settled by a committee listening to lobbyists from ten different directions. >> right. >> that's the problem. and so, unless we have some leadership that's clear why we're going this way, here's how we have to go, we're not going to get there. >> that's what the public is absolutely hungry for right now. >> i absolutely agree. >> people want health care reform. >> yes. >> they absolutely want it to this moment. they don't want this diffuse back-room lobby-infested process, but they do -- they don't like their current system. >> no. >> whether you have private insurance or whether you're one of the 40 million or 50 million uncovered right now. this system doesn't work, and everybody knows it. >> maria, the problem with the president, also, is he's been talking about cost, cost, cost. we all know around this table, everybody that really knows,

it's not overly ideological knows, the number-one issue with health care is the exploding costs. medicare, medicaid go under within the next decade. health care costs in the private sector drag this economy down. it crushes us. it breaks our backs. >> yeah. >> it bankrupts the federal government. it makes us uncompetitive in private enterprise. and, yet, you've got morality, insured the uninsured en masse. take care of the exploding costs. all the president's talking about now is the morality side of it. let's insure the uninsured. great. no one's talking about the mess. and when one person tried to talk about the math, on the rep ann kahn side, suddenly all we heard, death panels, death panels. >> so, once again, with e need leadership. >> right. >> on where are we spending the money and how do you get that cost down? we're not hearing the details. we're not digging down deep into the detail, and i think this

obesity issue is right there. we need policies in place in order to make people recognize that we're spending three-quarters of the money on that. >> it always ends up being a personal attack on me, doesn't it? >> no. no. >> look. okay. now -- >> let's talk about that. what is clinically obese? >> well, i've heard, and i think, again, this is with a knock on me, but it's 30 pounds overweight. >> it's unhealthy, and she's talking about it being -- >> not unhealthy. i've got a sheen about me. i am a little overweight. >> comes down to this program every time and then they mock me. we're talking about a crisis that's plaguing this country down to our children. you know, we need to have the public understand what is so expected. let's just throw that out there. what is so expensive. let's talk about that. >> known and that's understood. the huge costs and what could be done to reduce them. >> so, where is the leadership?

hello! >> because it's truly been the private industry is not organized to reduce the costs properly. and if they leave it to the lobbyists, we won't get cost reduction. if we have a plan, we could get cost reduction, not through death panel but -- >> if they have a system. >> the government is in the possession of those whose interests are not the interests of the american people. >> well, i'm sorry, but during a crisis that's killing us, it might be in our best interest. >> apparently it's profitable. >> apparently it is. >> that's interesting. >> apparently it is. >> the health system is not broken. the health is broken. the system has taken in a lot of money, and i think it's a big distinction. what that's what the lobbies are there to ensure. >> absolutely. >> we still don't know if it will work. >> if we have the content, it could work. >> matt did great work on this. >> we don't know what a public plan is or a public option would be because the president hasn't stepped in and defined it yet.

>> defined it yet. >> needs to do it. >> all right. we're going to have to take a break. mike taibbi coming up. >> we love you, dylan ratigan. >> and i you, headmaster. when i was seventeen summer days were not good to my skin. (announcer) new neutrogena total skin renewal. it's clinically tested to help undo the look of a year's worth of skin aging in just one week. do-overs do exist. (announcer) total skin renewal neutrogena.

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the public option is too muscular, the insurance companies won't be able to compete. well, if they can't compete, then they're not going to get customers, they're not going to get patients coming to them. isn't that what we want, to give people that choice? and, look, the problem we have here is we're trying to jury-rig this system so the insurance companies continue to make healthy profits. why? the insurance companies don't do a single checkup, a single exam, perform an operation. >> it sounds like you think there is no need for us to have private insurance.

>> well, i've asked you three times. what is the value? what do they bring to the deal? >> okay. good question. reports say democrats and the president could go it alone on a health bill, but at this point, would the efforts be too little, too late? mike taibbi puts this positive spin on health care in the latest edition of "rolling stone "magazine, writing, quote --

>> good morning, cincinnati. >> hello, everybody. that's really sort of -- just makes me feel good all over. what can i say? >> good morning. >> my specialty. feel-good story. >> you're an optimist. >> sorry about that. >> so, it's unfixable. the system is broken. washington can't fix it. >> i mean, it looks like that. i mean, i think this was a real litmus test for whether or not our government can fix an urgent national emergency. they had a president who was elected with a sweeping mandate of change. they had 60 votes in the senate. they had a vast majority in the house. they really could have done pretty much anything here and they ended up really not doing anything. well, that's assuming the public option doesn't pass, but that's the way it looks right now. >> so, if a public option doesn't pass, do you consider health care reform a failure? >> well, there will be some good things in it, sure. not denying people with pre-existing conditions, caps on

co-pays and that sort of thing. that's all good, but it's not meaningful. the health care system, 31% of the cost of our health care system is administrative cost, chafing claim, paperwork, and we didn't do a single thing to fix that or drag down costs. those are the two big things we had to do, and the two options for fixing that were single-payer health care or a public option to drive down costst and neither of those are on the table. >> you've seen the polls that show that a majority of americans are pleased with their health care. >> well, i've seen polls -- you can pretty much make polls say whatever you want. if you ask the pnph, they'll say 50% of not only people but doctors and hospital staff in this country favor single-payer health care. there are polls going both ways in health care. >> excuse me, but if the usa is so bad, why is it that if i were to get sick or god forbid one of my loved ones will get sick, the only reason i get sick is america and the most innovative and the best drugs in the world come from from the united states

of america. >> and the united states isn't even in the top ten of any major category. 13th or 14th in infant mortality? >> we're obese. >> life expectancy -- we spend twice as much per capita as almost any other industrialized country in the world and we have worse health care. >> let's talk about one of the public options out there, uk, for an example. the two best-selling, most important cancer drugs in the world, you shall tux and avastin, you pick up and we'll pay for it. need avastin? not going to pay for it. is that where we're going? >> people are far more satisfied with their health care than we are. most people have bankruptcies in this country, you know, it's because of health care costs and most of those people have health insurance. 8 out of 10 people who go bankrupt because of health care costs in this country have health insurance. that points to a completely broken system. it's impossible to argue that the american system works in any way when 47 million of us don't have insurance and the people who do have insurance aren't really covered. >> i've got lots of criticism

and i'm skeptical of a lot of things on the table, but for you to say america is not the place where you want care if you are sick i have to put my hand up and talk about the innovation coming out of this country. >> would a french person come to the united states to get his health care? a british person? no. most industrialized countries in the world have better health care for us than cheaper. >> we don't know that it's better health care. as i just said, there are certain governments that won't pay for important drugs. yes, the system is broken, it's too expensivexpensive. there's no reason that a 16-week whatever, you know, allotment of drugs will cost you $40,000 or something like that. that's broken. but, you know, there are governments making the decisions about what drugs and what care you're going to get. i don't want the government making the decision of what care i would get. >> maybe you don't, but 47 million people in this country don't have any health insurance at all. >> i have a problem with that number, 47 million americans

uninsured because that's debatable also. >> how is that debatable? >> totally debatable because some are illegal aliens in that number, other people are americans working abroad. you haven't heard that the 47 million is not the real number? >> i can't eve gone to a doctor when i get sick. >> she's very hard to please, matt. don't worry. >> i'm on your side, but when you say america is so bad, i have to raise my hand. >> i can't go to a doctor. i have a trip scheduled to brazil this year to get a medical procedure done, and i have health insurance that pays almost $7,000 a year for health insurance. >> there are also a lot of americans, though, that -- and a lot of people across the globe, because i've seen these lists we're 39th in health care, 18th. i can tell you that, you know, i've seen it for some time. when you have people across the world that can go anywhere for health care, a lot of them do opt for the united states. now, that's because we do have the innovation right. the problem, maybe the problem is, though, that of course you've got, whether it's 47

million or 20 million or 30 million, you've got people -- a large chunk of our population who have to take their children to emergency rooms at midnight because that's their primary care provider. >> why is the question you always say best health care, and i would say we probably do have the best health care, but it's about access. is everyone able to have access? is there preventative care? >> managing director of goldman sachs -- >> i'm not arguing with that. i'm saying, yeah, if i can afford to go, if anyone at this table has a problem, yes, we can probably get the best health care. but if you condition get access, is that the best health care? is that what reduces us down to 39th as an industrialized nation? i'm not arguing with you. but if i can't get it -- >> the problem is -- this is why the president needs to flush out what his plan actually is. will our health care system, if we turn it over to the federal government, look like medicare? or will it look like --

>> what will it look like? >> say veterans affairs where i can tell you va health care is just horrific. >> better than not having any health insurance at all, they say. better than the system in new jersey where half of the hospital administration in bayonne, new jersey, is chasing claims. totally inefficient. doesn't work. >> ta for little bodies with fevers.. and big bodies on high blood pressure medicine. tylenol works with your body... in a way other pain relievers don't... so you feel better... knowing doctors recommend tylenol... more than any other brand of pain reliever.

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well, it is now confirmed. the news out of scotland is the

justice minister there has freed that terminally ill lockerbie bomber. we'll follow this story throughout the day, but it's the former libyan intelligence agent abdel baset al megrahi, who is behind the deaths of 270 people. >> think about all of the college students who were kill ed and there are so many people who know college students who were coming back over christmas vacation and were killed by this man because he put a bomb on their plane. and now the families have to suffer through this. >> can't understand the decision at all. >> walking free. >> all right. we'll follow this. let's get to -- >> weekly unemployment numbers are crossing the wires. let's get a look at business before the bill. who do we have here? >> hey. >> erin burnett. what's it looking like, erin? >> well, we were probably going to open higher. how about that? probably. >> awesome.

>> china has recovered and now the rest of the world rally, we'll see if we do. bottom line, yes, it's volatile but that big sell-off everybody was looking for so far does not appear to have the backing. so, take that as a piece of good news. by the way, a lot of investors would prefer to get a selloff in this perverse world that i live in down here. they'd like to have the market go down 10% because that way some of the bad things fall out. it's like pruning a bush. then the rally can continue. so, we're going to have that fight back and forth today. two other quick headlines, one of the deficit. the obama administration is going to come out and cut their estimate. this is a political process, the whole budget deficit and what the number is, but they're going to say it's $1.6 trillion, $266 billion less than they said in may. now, the deficit is astronomi l astronomical. obviously, the change, you may say what's $266 billion, the reason it's important is because that was money that was going to be used to bail out the banks and they're saying they don't think they need that anymore so it's a sign of stability in the system, one way of looking at

it. mark and i talked about health care. i thought the discussion you all were having was fascinatinfasci. but one thing that doesn't seem to make sense to is us is everyone saying right now the system we have allows you to get whatever you want with your doctor, you and your doctor, and the other way would put the governor as something in between. right now it's our employers and insurance companies that are doing the rationing. we see it in all the systems and we seem to keep putting these strawmen out. that maa rhea made a fantastic point about the uninsured number, put up as a real issue we're facing when those numbers are highly disputable, like maria said. >> exactly. they don't call her an international superstar for nothing. >> that is true. >> not for nothing. >> erin burnett, thank you so much. >> bye, guys. have a good one. >> great talking to you. coming up next -- i can only hear one of two words she says. vo: why spend $5 per person at the drive-thru,

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i would like the president to produce his birth certificate. most illegal aliens in america can't. why can't the president of the united states produce his birth certificate? >> are you actively seeking that paper. >> yes. >> are you, tom delay, with your political and professional and career history in the united states government, questioning this man's bona fide -- >> no, no. i'm not questioning -- >> you' questioning it. you want to see his papers. >> chris, the constitution of the united states specifically says -- >> i know it. >> you have to be a natural-born citizen. >> but i never asked you for yours. >> i'll give it to you. i'll give it to you. >> has anybody ever said, mrmr. mr. delay, give us your birth certificate? >> chris, can i speak? they have asked me if i'm a resident of texas. they even sued me about being a resident of the texas. how about that? they have spent 15 years trying to demonize me and put me in

jail. of course they've asked me if i'm an american citizen. >> now, let me just -- >> i actually think that might be a little bit different, but okay. >> all right. got my picture taken. >> seriously. >> joe, let me ask you a question. these guys, presumably smart guys elected to the congress, national office, do they believe this or are they just stirring something up? do you think he really believes that barack obama is not a resident of the united states? >> come on. >> i don't know. i don't know about tom. when i hear newt talking about death panels, i believe that's more of a political calculation. >> right. >> i can't speak -- i can't speak for all of these people. i do -- there has to be a lot of ground noise for all of nies republicans to be afraid to call out the extreme ksh y-- you knoe nazi charges, the marxist

charges. they're very scared of their own base, and i suspect that's why we hear nancy pelosi and harry reid calling americans evil and calling their tactics un-american, because they're afraid of their base. i think, though, it's something else, john wrigley. you, of course, are a new media guy. i think -- you know, it used to be when i was in congress in the dark ages, we would get phone calls. that's what we got, phone calls or faxes pretty much. now if let's say a progressive democrat decides to team up with a blue dog to come up with a plan, they are immediately killed on liberal websites, their twitter pages burn up and they're not just -- they're not -- people aren't thoughtful about it. they will say you were a traitor to the cause, you are a tool of corporate america, and you want little babies to die. i'm not exaggerating at all. you're a fascist.

and so, these -- the attacks are so immediate that a lot of these politicians clearly on both sides don't have the courage to speak out against the madness. >> yeah. i think one of the worst things that's happened to debate in america is the sin button, because if you had to sit down and write a letter -- people -- that's not to say some of these folks didn't go off the deep end but you would actually proofread what you did and now it's just become this is my first thought, and i think there are a lot of people out there who are not even deep offensive enders, when you say something, you wish you had a second to take it back, and you're absolutely right. when you end up on twitter, end up on blog,s, you see the reaction and typically it's the more negative individuals, if i have a negative reaction i'm more likely to respond. so, those little things -- i think it has been a progression. it starts with talk radio, it goes to cable and a lot of places, certainly not here, but

it ends up then on these posts. >> there's a backdrop for it. >> prime-time cable and talk radio and the blogosphere, i mean, so many outrageous, irresponsible things are said on both sides marx rhea. >> maybe. but you know what? also, i think that for some reason we've become a nation of if you challenge, all of a sudden you're anti-american or you're a racist. it's just not true. you know, you're allowed to put your hand up and say, you know what, i may not agree with that. maybe this is not what would be good for me and for my family. i mean, but the second you have any challenge or all of a sudden you're anti-american, it's just not true. >> i want to underline what pat buchanan said, because pat really is -- we love having pat on because he's got the perspective of 40, 50 years in washington. pat buchanan said watergate, as ugly as watergate was -- and i can say impeachment, as ugly as impeachment was and the 2000 recount, as ugly as the 2000

recount was -- never had the kind of name-calling on both sides that we're getting now. >> it's gotten ugly. >> never. and worse than watergate, the name-calling, on both sides. think about that. i mean, we have -- and again, the responsibility comes from the top. leaders of the republican party, leaders of the democratic party need to step forward and tell their base to take a cold shower, you know, relax, breathe, and debate the issues. that's not happening, though, because everybody's afraid to lose their base. >> i think you're right. >> well, maybe they will find if they will stand up to the extreme elements in their own base they'll find a lot more people, sensible people in middle america. >> we have to -- we have to get to maxine. let's bring her into the conversation, then we'll go to wrigley. here with us now democratic representative maxine waters from california. thank you very much for joining us. >> maxine, how are you doing

today? >> you're so welcome. good morning. i'm in new orleans today. >> oh, my goodness, you are. >> tell us why you're in new orleans. what's going on? >> yes. joe, i'm hosting a hearing this morning four years after katrina. we're trying to find out what's wrong, what's right with the road home program, the money that we sent from washington, d.c., through the city, that is the money to help people restore their homes. there are still a lot of complaints, still a lot of homes that have not been rehabituili d rehabilitated, not basketbaeen . and the housing committee is here to find out what's going on. we didn't want to simply just not pay attention, not leave new orleans and mississippi and alabama and all of these places that were so harmed by the storm without some oversight. it was a lot of people here, as you know, doing and right after

katrina, but we have to follow up and understand whether or not the people here have truly been assisted, and that's what i'm doing today. >> maxine, thank you so much for doing that. my wife and i went over every day for the first month or so, and we found the conditions shameful, absolutely shameful. but i think in -- most americans have forgotten new orleans, have forgotten waveland, mississippi. >> yes. >> have forgotten the gulf coast. >> that's right. >> what's wrong? why have we allowed the ball to drop over the past four years? and what do you think you're going to uncover that can refocus washington on helping new orleans and mississippi recover? >> well, you're absolutely right. there was a lot of volunteerism, a lot of sympathy from all over the world, and particular here in the united states. people came from everywhere. but you know, once it gets off the radar screen, people kind of forget. and some people think, well, they've gotten money, they've gotten resources, they must be

all right. but that's not true. i was here a few months ago over in the pontchartrain park area, and i discovered there were a lot of complaints. people not only have not gotten what they requested and what they were eligible for, some of those complaints are now appeals that have not been addressed. so, the road home program, the statewide program that was supposed to subsidize the citizens here that have received substantial damage up to $150,000, some people got $10, $15, $100, nothing, and we're going to find out what went wrong with the road home program, what should we do now, whether or not there are any resources left, and who's responsible for getting it done. >> that's great. maxine, really quickly, let me ask you -- we've talked about the health care debate. >> yes. >> it's gotten so angry on both

sides. >> oh, yes. >> everybody's calling everybody a nazi or un-american or fascist. it wasn't eve than they when we were fighting over the 2000 election or impeachment or even watergate. why has it gotten so ugly this summer? >> i don't know, but, joe, i really do believe that in the beginning it was organized, that some of our insurance companies have to put up, i believe, resources and targeted certain areas, but then they connected with a lot of dissatisfied people, people who are angry, who are dissatisfied with the way things are going. some people are concerned about this economy. they have been hit hard. they have lost their jobs. they don't know what's happening. and so, between the economic crisis that we've been involved in and then the new uncertainty about health care, you have a connection here between the organized and orchestrated and just people out there who want

some answers. but i've never seen anything like this. and it's very interesting where it's coming from. i have a town hall meeting that's coming up very soon, next saturday. i don't expect this to happen. i would be very surprised if it happened. >> all right. >> i just don't think to have that kind of anger. >> all right, maxine. thank you for being with us. >> nice to see you. >> we want to talk to you next week after your hearings. keep us updated on what's happening. >> absolutely. thank you. i'm racing cross country in this small sidecar, but i've still got room for the internet. with my new netbook from at&t. with its built-in 3g network, it's fast and small, so it goes places other laptops can't. i'm bill kurtis, and wherever i go, i've got pnty of room for the internet.

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what's up, mika? >> nothing. >> you look confused. >> bender just winked at me again. >> what did you learn today? >> i learned a number of things.

i learned that the miss universe competition -- >> no. come on. >> -- is on sunday. >> it is. >> and if you're riding around an inner tube -- ♪ we are the world we are the people ♪ >> look at them. bringing the world together. a there's a great reason to love this. >> yeah. >> abraham lincoln once said -- >> idiot. >> this is what we were talking about. >> exactly. >> this is what he really meant. >> exactly. >> donald trump. make sure we make the inner tubes deep enough. you know he did that. >> this is a great american -- >> you know he planned that. >> america shining once again on the world stage. >> what did you learn today? >> i learned that -- >> totally gratuitous -- >> -- gender identification can be a touchy subject.

>> it is. poor man/woman in south africa. >> difficult to bring it up but important to talk about. >> it is. >> "the new york times" has a picture of him/her. sure looks like a him to me. >> do we have that video? >> is it a her? no one's asking. >> i don't know. >> mika, what did you learn today? >> except for maria that not only are you all pigs but you're a bunch of suck-ups. maria? >> there are 20 million americans that are uninsured, not 47 million. let's get the numbers right. >> okay. >> and i learned that if you're a great man, if you are a hero, people are going to hate you. >> always. >> just -- just -- >> please. >> donald trump, willy and i salute you. >> it is about empowering women. >> it is about empowering women. stop trying to keep them down. willie, what time is it? >> time for the morning meeting

with our friend, dylan ratigan. >> he's crazy! good morning to you. nice to see you. welcome to the "morning meeting." topping our agenda this fine and lovely day some less than lovely events. outraged family members talking as the only man convicted of the lockerbie bombing in scotland is being set free. is this compassion, injustice, or just big business with oil? ted kennedy's urgent new letter. he says he wants his senate seat filled quickly in the event of his death. it's raising new concerns about the state of his battle with brain cancer. and vote and violence. to afghanistan we go once again. the polls have just closed in that country's turbulent presidential election. richard engel on the beat. and america maxed out. new credit card rules to protect consumers today, but it does not protect them from sky-high

interest rates and fees in advance of the new rules. and tens of thousands of people weigh in on michelle obama's shorts. there's actually a new viewer poll on the subject. what do you think of the first lady's casual attire? we'll discuss. what are you going to do. it's 9:00 a.m. pull up a chair and join "the morning meeting." all right. we begin today's program with breaking news. the lockerbie bomber will be released from prison in scotland. to nbc's dawna friesen live there with the very latest. hi, dawna. >> reporter: hi, dylan. a scottish justice minister made the official announcement. it was expected, but he confirmed it just a few moments ago. and he said he knows that there will be many who disagree with him but he has decided to release the convicted mass murder abdel baset al megrahi on

compassionate grounds. >> for these reasons and these reasons alone it is my decision that mr. abdel baset al megrahi, convicted in 2001 for the lockerbie bombing, now terminally ill with prostate cancer, be released on compassionate grounds and allowed to return to libya to die. >> reporter: and those reasons are that under scottish law any prisoner that is suffering from a terminal illness and applies for compassionate -- or to be released on compassion nal grounds has the right for that to be considered. now, we understand that mr. megrahi's health has deteriorated considerably. the justice minister said that he consulted a number of doct doctors, ta