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good afternoon, everyone. i'm tamron hall live in new york. >> and i'm david shuster live in washington. as you can see, live at this hour the kennedy motorcade is on its way to the john f. kennedy presidential library in boston. that's where senator edward m. kennedy will lie in repose until saturday. >> the motorcade left hyannis port, massachusetts, about two ours will go and is expected to arrive in boston any minute now. right now you've pointed out those live pictures of the motorcade making its way to the city. people in their cars slowing down to get a glimpse of this moment. before the motorcade gets to the library, it will drive by some historic sites in boston that had special meaning to senator kennedy. first to st. stevens church where his mother, rose, was baptized. her funeral has also held there.

it will then kroz over the rose fitzgerald kennedy greenway. it was a park created to give mothers and children a little green space. the park sits on the same land kennedy's mother enjoyed as a child. we are looking at the park there now. you can see people standing as we have announced and other news organizations that the motorcade will go past there. they are aware this is their opportunity to see it. it will pass the hall where the mayor of boston will ring a bell 47 times. that represents one for each year the senator served this country in the senate, and then it is on to 122 boden. that's where kennedy opened his first office as an assistant district attorney and is where his brother john f. kennedy lived while running for congress. that was in 1946. keeping an eye on these live puck tours as the motorcade is just outside of the city, i understand, and next they will pass the jfk federal building. that's the site of kennedy's

boston office. and then the motorcade will travel into south boston to jfk presidential library. the entire kennedy family is in that motorcade traveling to the library to say good-bye to the patriarch of the family and the senator's wife, his children, nieces, nephews, as well as his grandchildren we have seen today. >> nbc's anne thompson is live at the john f. kennedy presidential library in boston. i know you have had a chance to talk to people there, ordinary folks who are just looking for a glimpse. what are they telling you about what they expect and what they're hoping to get out of this? >> reporter: well, david, there's a line of several hundred people that goes down one of the parking lots here at the jfk library, and i just walked through that line, and there are men dressed in business suits, there are vacationers in red sox t-shirts. there are -- i ran into a woman from canada, a man from ireland, but the vast majority of the

crowd, as you can imagine, are people who live in the state of massachusetts and, as one person said, i have come to say thank you. he was a great man and he did a lot for massachusetts. i met one man in line who met the senator when he was 18 years old, and he actually got to sit next to the senator and ask him some questions. at that time he said he asked him some questions about nursing because his mother was a nurse, and then 20 years later this man was diagnosed with hiv, and he didn't have health insurance, but he was able to get medication for his hiv condition through the ryan white act which was authored by senator kennedy which provides hiv medication to people without insurance. so those are the kinds of stories that you hear. i ran into another mother and her son who brought her son here. he wants to be a judge, and she wanted him to learn about the life of senator kennedy as a public servant, and as the son

said to me, he wasn't just a politician who took money from people. he actually gave back to people. didn't expect anything but saw his life in service to people. it's a crowd, i think, senator kennedy would enjoy a lot. he would love to hear the stories. he loves hearing stories. it is a crowd that reflects the diversity of this area and of the people who admired him. there are latinos. there are, you know, african-americans. there are caucasians. it's a vi certifies, young, old, people who have come with this overwhelming need to say thank you to a man who they believe has really impacted their lives. >> and as you were speaking there we could see the motorcade, it is now in the heart of downtown boston making this circular route which will end up with anne thompson's location is. anne, thank you very much for the update.

great reporting there and quite a crowd that has gathered at the jfk library. >> it is something to see. senator kennedy was a champion, of course, of the poor and working class. as you mention, as anne mentioned, people from all walks of life are out there looking at the moment. during his nearly half century in the senate, he visited the state of west virginia many times and had a special connection to people there. democratic senator john rockefeller of west virginia joins us on the phone. thank you for joining us. >> thank you. >> let me get your reaction to what we've seen today from the moment where you have the entire kennedy family standing outside the compound watching the casket draped in that american flag to what we're seeing now on the streets of boston. >> what he deserves. >> what he deserves. simple words, powerful moment. what are your feelings right now about he deserves and what he's left behind for all americans?

>> there's so many ways of looking at ted kennedy, and they're all favorable. they're all lucky for america. you know, we've lost him, and he was already a giant, and now i think he becomes even more of a giant and continues to affect american life and make us fight harder and try to work together more as he did in the senate and elsewhere. a joiner of people, a fighter for causes who never talked about himself, was in pain ever since he had that airplane accident in 1961, which is when i met him, and never talked about that, never talked about himself. was only interested in other people and causes and those he fought for with every fiber in his body and would never give up, but nothing was ever

personal. >> senator, i know that -- i mean, you mentioned you and ted kennedy knew each other for a long time. i think so many people can appreciate that there is a special burden or a special challenge when you have a name that's a famous name in the world of politics and anything else. i wonder if you ever talked about that connection that you had and sort of shared anecdotes and stories. >> i'm going to be a little counter cultural to what's been on television a lot. and i certainly know it's true in my own case, but -- everybody is saying that he was carrying on the burden of his brothers, and his brothers were significant in american life, but they were not in american public life for very long, didn't really care about the public policy aspect of working with others except to be president, so they didn't like the senate, they didn't like the house, bobby, jack, et cetera.

teddy wanted to be president and maybe that was when he felt the burden, but when he couldn't be president after carter beat him and he came into the senate, i don't think he's been doing this to uphold the legend of jack and bobby, which were relatively short, and it's ted that's made the great contributions. it's ted kennedy who has been there 42 years and never, never wavering. to me he's the giant, and i don't think he did it out of a sense of burden. i think he did it out of his innate sense of joy of life, his pursuit of cause that is he cared about, and his joy in the fight for achieving his goals, and yet always without personalizing anything. >> well said, and senator john rockefeller of west virginia, we appreciate you coming on, senator.

>> thanks a lot. >> david, we want to bring back neil, he's the nbc news contributor who is the co-author of the book, the last lion, the fall and rise of ted kennedy. neil, you have been sitting here with us. can you give us some perspective on how far we are from the presidential library and where the motorcade is at this point? >> well, tamron, the motorcade is circling around downtown boston now going by some key spots in kennedy's life. the rose kennedy greenway you mentioned before is the site, and many people who have traveled in boston years back will remember the central artery which was an ugly, raised highway that kind of cut through the heart of boston. that was cut down and replaced with an underground tunnel, the big dig, that senator kennedy had a major role in securing the funding for, sometimes controversial government funding for this major project, but that has really not only transformed the boston landscape but has

really restored it but reunited neighborhoods that were cut off by the highway. and then going around through downtown we're seeing it will circle back then again and make its way back to the south to dorchester where the kennedy library is, and just one thing i wanted to pick up on what senator rockefeller had said. i think it is a good point about the legacy of his brothers, but i think this gets missed sometimes. senator kennedy had his hand prints all over the conception that we have of understanding jack and bobby. in his hands both of these figures, these political figures, were sort of remade highlighting the parts of their politics that most matched ted's very liberal politics. so he did use them, not so much as the burden, but in the

service of his view of where the social politics should go for the country. >> neil, as we see the motorcade go by st. stevens church and as the motorcade passes by nathaniel hall, i wonder if you can talk about senator kennedy's reverence and what it means to him. >> history loomed large. history of the kennedy family and the history of massachusetts. the kennedy family, he would tutor the young generation about what the family had done in the service of the country and take them on tours to let them know and to carry on this message, and as michael is referencing earlier nathaniel hall was a very important reason that ted kennedy chose that thank to

announce his presidential run in 1980 was it was a reconnection with the large role that massachusetts politicians had played in the history of the american democracy. ted kennedy plebelieved that, h saw that, and he sought to further that. >> just went right by us. vicki kennedy had tears in her eyes. wiping by tears just saying thank you, thank you, and the people are clapping. look at all these american flags that have come out. it is quite the sight as they go by here. the mayor and the police commissioner paying their respects and it's going right up congress street. it will wrap around government center and just the applause won't stop. right when they turned the corner it happened. i want to show you this american flag. as soon as the motorcade came around here they unfurled this

big american flag off city hall. that brought more applause out. show you the mayor standing still as the motorcade goes by paying their respects and people are clapping nonstop as they have seen history drive by them and the signs it's out here. right now the motorcade is stopped on congress street as they get ready to make the turn on state street down here. one thing we haven't heard yet is the bells. we were told there was going to be some bells going off. we did not hear those as of right now. the motorcade has stopped now. we're wondering if that's going to occur any time soon if the bells will go off. that's a question at this hour, and there they go. the bells are starting to go off. maybe not. we're waiting for that yet. motorcade is going to -- we were told originally they were going to go around twice. maybe we will hear the bells when they go around again. we're not sure yet.

>> we're listening into a local reporter, whdh. the camera pointed on boston's mayor expecting 47 rings of a bell to represent each year senator kennedy was in congress and we're waiting on that moment now. bringing back neil here to see this incredible moment. i believe the motorcade is going to go -- from what that reporter just said, neil, the motorcade will go around twice and at one point an american flag draped over the building was unfurled

and the crowd applauded and that's what you're seeing now. they also referenced at least one of the family members obviously so emotional by this. we saw the window down. i believe that was teddy kennedy iii, the young boy with the blond hair looking out at the crowd in one of the vehicles. >> absolutely, tamron. this is -- it seems prior to getting to the kennedy library this will seem like the epicenter of the place where people can pay their respects to the family in downtown boston. >> and we're waiting, david is of course still with us, and we're waiting for the mayor to ring the bell 47 times. he's being greeted by people. kind of a jovial reaction from the mayor, but that applause says so much, and the people there just cheering on the motorcade. now people are kind of filing into the streets, david. >> and, tamron, it's got to be so powerful for the kennedy family, which is, of course, when you share a member of your

own family with the nation and the public and the public has the opportunity to essentially say thank you. i think they're saying thank you not just to ted kennedy but also his family members who are going by for being part of this man's life and essentially sharing their father, uncle, grandfather, whatever it is with the public. >> yeah, that is incredible, and, you know, david, we talk about the sharing. this is their life. they are accustomed to people wanting to be a part of anything that is kennedy from the interest earlier when many thought that caroline kennedy might try to pursue her political career to where we are now thanking kennedy for the many years of service to this country. this is a part of their culture, a part of who they are, and you see even the young grandchildren kind of holding their composure and waving out of the window greeting and saying thank you to the many people out there as well. we still have michael with us.

you see the crowd applauding. this is sad but a celebration as well. >> it is, and there are two people who would be thrilled to see this day not because of the horrible event but the way this cortege is being received -- >> michael, i'm sorry to interrupt you. let's listen to the bells. >> sure. >> i hear them. i hear them, folks, but it's tough for you. yeah. >> we heard the reporter say that it's hard to hear the bells even from his vantage point right there outside of fan euil

hall. >> ted kennedy's grandfather was the honorable john f. fitzgerald who was mayor of boston almost a century ago. he would love to see his family was still so warmly received in the streets of this city, and ted kennedy as a little boy was very close to his grandfather and as an adult he was famous for doing his imitation of john fitzgerald singing sweet adeline. tom said ted kennedy looked quite a lot like mayor fitzgerald, too. the other person i think in his life who would have liked to have seen this reception is rose kennedy. not only the warmth on the streets of boston, but she worked really hard when ted kennedy was a kid to make sure her children had a sense of history and she took them to lexington and concord, old north church where paul revere was.

i think she would have been delighted to see her history lessons worked. >> for a lot of our viewers who are watching this and may think this is poor ted he doesn't get to see this himself, but when you think become to the 2004 democratic convention in boston where there were so many tributes from the democratic party faithful and there was a tribute by the boston simple symphony, you get a sense he knew how much the city loved him and this is essentially maybe an opportunity for the rest of the nation to see what ted kennedy knew all along, and that is he really did have this special relationship with his constituents. >> yeah, i agree with every word you have said, david. and the other thing, as horrible as his passing is, unlike his brothers, he did have time to prepare and over 16 months not only did he have that time, but people who loved him had the time to express themselves. he sure did know it.

>> well, michael, as we watch the motorcade continue, i wonder if i'm going to give you a little bit of a challenge in terms of u.s. history. in terms of faneuil hall, the state house, st. stevens, which is the most significant when we think about the life of ted kennedy and american history, is there one particular location they will pass by that you think has special resonance? >> jfk, easy answer. jfk presidential library where i'm sitting and where the cortege will get very soon. after john kennedy's assassination, especially jackie kennedy just poured her energy into this library feeling this is one way to try to redeem the horrible things that happened, and ted kennedy and jackie and the other members of the family had a big struggle. john kennedy just before he died came up to cambridge. he wanted the library on the banks of the charles, harvard university, across from the charles right where the harvard

business school is now, and this went into about a ten-year struggle with people in cambridge. they thought there would be too many tourists, too much traffic, maybe it might not be academic enough. finally it was teddy and his siblings and jackie kennedy onassis by then who said, all right, let's give this all up. let's put the library in dorchester. that's where rose kennedy came from, and also it's in a distressed area and maybe the library will improve the neighborhood, and you can't see it today, david, but if you look around here, as i say, i was here 30 years ago on the day this library was dedicated. it was almost a slum. now it is extremely nice and that part of it really worked. >> and we still have with us neil watching this. your a boston man, neil. the people are clapping. what is your reaction to how the folks you know better than anybody right now on this panel are reacting to this american icon? >> well, i think it's interesting, tamron. ted kennedy had a complicated relationship with his

constituents in massachusetts. it wasn't all love and hugs and kisses. going by city hall plaza come people remember from the 1970s ten kennedy, there were hurled mow may to tomatoes in his face during the busing saga there. but what he did have with the constituents, even people who didn't agree with him, was a special bond that they knew that he had an influence in the country and he did have that continuity that he provided with the family and with the history of the country. so even people who were opponents had grudging respect for the work that he had done. you're seeing now the love really. >> and you mentioned senator kennedy taking on the difficult issue of busing when it was not popular and the resistance, but obviously history has shown he was on the right side of history when it came to that particular issue. but you see these people and their flags are above this

building, waving flags. we also saw the police department saluting the motorcade. the reporter on the scene is reporting a number of the kennedy family members have tears in their eyes. you see a woman there just heart broken by this moment in time. >> i think there's so much embedded in this day and in this passing of senator kennedy, and it has so much to do with the role that he played, but also the symbol that he played for this family and for massachusetts politics and for the nation's politics. >> neil, what do you think the impact is on the family? we're getting these reports from reporters on the scene that the family members, of course, have been so touched by the cheers and that the family members have had tears in their eyes inside the motorcade. what do you think it all means for them and do you think this is sort of going perhaps in the way that they thought? is it possible to imagine what this kind of day is like? >> well, for so many years ted

kennedy, a national image, was bifurcated. to liberal democrats he was the true camp pass, the symbol of everything they believed in no matter how out of fashion. but to conservative republicans, he was this symbol of everything they sought to dismantle. what you're seeing today i think is the partnership put aside. the symbolism put aside, and the role of kennedy as a unifying figure coming to the fore. >> i'm going to disagree with you in part because there are parts of our media where the partnership -- partisanship has not been put aside. but we are going to give senator kennedy the respect and the day that he and his family deserve. let's listen in to this woman who is being interviewed by a local reporter. >> yeah. i came here at 10:00 in the morning. >> thank you so much. >> and we're live on channel 7.

tell me about why you came out here. why you came out. >> well, basically to pay my respects. he's done so much for not just our state but the whole entire country, you know, and he knows how to compromise. he knows how -- he just knows how to work with people, and he was so open-minded, you know, and i just want to pay my respects. >> we just lost that, but let's bring in michael. are you still there, michael? >> yeah, i sure am, tamron. >> you see this young woman. she says she's been out there since 10:00 in the morning. my own mother just texted me saying she can't stop crying. she's thinking of this as the last kennedy brother and it makes her think about the history with this family again and in a larger perspective from young, old, black, white, this is the last of that generation of kennedy men, and he blessedly was able to see the age of 77, but all of the men are gone and there's only now one of the immediate family, jean, who survived.

>> you know, you're absolutely right, tamron, and, you know, one effect this has is that as long as ted kennedy was alive and a major figure in the senate, in a way we were all connected to all that history that he was a part of. and this is a guy who in the 1930s, he knew franklin roosevelt. his father worked closely with roosevelt. he had met winston churchill. he knew almost every president from then on all the way up to the time of barack obama whom he had a lot to do with making president. so this is someone who was a part of american history really for 70 years. about one-third of the history of this young country, and while he was still alive in a way we had access to that. we were connected to it directly. now that he's gone, those things seem a little bit more distant. >> michael, how was senator kennedy in terms of from a historians perspective in terms of filling in some of the gaps in our remembrances and our knowledge of so many key points of american history? was he very friendly to

historians like yourself? >> well, he was, and one thing he did do, which is going to be an absolute treasure trove, is that he helped to organize, i was involved a little bit in it in advising it along with some other scholars, an oral history project which was started about four years ago. he was interviewed for about 80 or 90 hours, i believe, and he told his friends, people who worked closely with him, his family, to talk openly to the interviewers. so those oral histories are there, too, and in a small way they were drawn on for the memoir that's going to be published true compass in two weeks under his name. for years to come those things are going to be slowly open. thank god that was all done before he passed, so that's not history that's going to be lost. joolt we a >> we're told about 4:45 the motorcade will arrive at the presidential library bearing the name of his brother.

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welcome back, everyone. i'm tamron hall live in new york. >> and i'm david shuster live in washington, and you're looking at live pictures from downtown boston where the ted kennedy motorcade is headed towards south boston where it will end up in perhaps the next 15 minutes or so at the john f. kennedy presidential library, the place where ted kennedy announced that he would run for president in 1980. it's also a place, of course, as you have been hearing all hour, that is just filled with so many artifacts and films and pictures

from both robert kennedy and john f. kennedy and, of course, there will be so much contributed from the life and memory of senator ted kennedy. joining us is nbc's anne thompson. i wonder if you can set the scene for us at this hour. >> reporter: people are getting ready, as you can imagine, for the arrival of the body of senator edward kennedy and the kennedy family. there is a group of people who have stood out here in the sun for the last 90 minutes. there is a line that stretches way past the point that i can see. there is another line here that is three people deep just lined up to try to catch a glimpse of the family and, of course, the coffin of senator kennedy. this is a show of gratitude. this is a show of appreciation. this is a way for the people of

massachusetts to thank the man who has served them for some 47 years and who has been involved in their lives, whether they know him or not, they feel as if he has been involved in their lives. as i told you, i walked down the line, and i was just struck by the mix of people. there are men in very well tailored business suits and there are people in t-shirts and shorts, and it looked like they just have come off the beach. but they have all come with the same goal, and that is to say thank you to senator kennedy. >> anne, the details that we're getting about who is going to be there to greet the casket, father donald moynahan, the former president of boston college. there will be some members of group model after americorps.

>> the city year people are here. they're actually there for crowd control. they are helping the people in line. there are all kinds of ambulances and emergency medical services people here as well because the heat is just so intense. there are 85 members of the family who are traveling in the motorcade, and as you said, senator kennedy when he arrives here, his body will be greeted outside by the former president of boston college. the family is going to form a greeting line outside the library as the senator is unloaded from the hearse and once inside the senator is going to be moved through a column of more than 100 current and former staffers as the coffin makes its way into the smith center where senator kennedy will lie in repose until saturday morning, and then once inside the smith

center, father moynahan and father mcmillan will lead the family in a prayer. then at 6:00 the doors will open and the public will be invited in to come pay their respects. there will be a military honor guard there of family -- there will be a military honor guard. there will be four members from the military, and then we understand four civilian members, many of whom will be his former staffers. we are now seeing the first police car pull up here, which could be an indication that they are coming. it is a boston college police car, and i believe it is carrying the former president of boston college as he makes his way here. so it's probably five more minutes or so before we get the funeral -- or the procession from hyannis port. family and friends -- members of

the kennedy family will be greeting the public as they make their way through to view the body and to pay their respects today. you know, when i walked down the line, i asked a couple people, i said what are you going to say to the members of the kennedy family, and people were stunned that they were going to be there to greet the public. just two weeks ago when eunice kennedy shriver died, all five of the shriver children and many of the grandchildren greeted the public as they came to her wake in centreville, massachusetts, and i think you're going to see the same again. we are now seeing the former president of boston college. he is here. he is getting in place, and we are seeing people come out of the library to greet him. and so here are -- they have issued a list of participants

for this evening, and through the first hour it will be bobby and natasha shriver, george abrams, who is a college friend of senator kennedy, and jerry dougherty, and then the next four people will be patty -- some friends of the kennedys and you will see this sort of revolving group of people who were close to the senator be part of the honor guard and part of the greeters. >> nbc's anne thompson at the jfk presidential library museum in south boston, and, anne, thank you so much. tamron, the route here at the end goes right past the university of massachusetts boston campus and with classes essentially starting very soon, you can only imagine, tamron, how many college students and people who witness this will now be inspired perhaps to either study political history or political science or government

simply by virtue of having this perhaps cross so close to their campus. >> absolutely, david, and it's incredible when you think about these moments in time, we've talked a lot about the dynasty and the kennedy legacy and the kennedys certainly have been a political dynasty for generations, and the death of senator kennedy has led certainly some to wonder about this dynasty. who is next in line, and senator tom udall of new mexico comes from a family of people who sought and achieved political office, including one run for president and multiple runs for congress. senator udall was 11 years old when his father helped jack kennedy become the president and has been a friend of teddy kennedy ever since. senator, thank you so much for joining us. >> thank you, it's great to be with you. >> we talked a lot this past year about you and your brother and the aspirations and the comparisons with the kennedys. when you see this and you hear the talk of legacies and dynasties and knowing your own history, what do you think?

>> well, there's such a close relationship between the udalls and the kennedys, and i'm very sad on this occasion of losing ted, but he had such a wonderful life. as you said in your introduction, i remember when i was 11 years old my father was working very hard to get jack as president of the united states, and teddy was assigned what wasn't a really great assignment. it was working the west because there wasn't expected to be much support for jack kennedy in the west, and so he came and slept on our floor in tucson, arizona, and he was working and strategizing with my dad. and i have very fond memories of him then and have had since then, and have worked with him on mental health parity, worked with his patrick. we have had a good, solid, close relationship, and i talked to my dad yesterday. he's 89 and lives here in new

mexico, and he just has such fond memories of jack kennedy and bobby kennedy and ted that he just wanted me to tell that to everybody. >> you know, that is amazing. we're watching the motorcade, and you have seen, i'm sure, on the television coverage, the crowds of people from all walks of life there. we're also -- we also know that a memory war wir was one of the priorities for senator kennedy. just looking back, was there ever any advice or discussions about the burden or the helpfulness of being a part of american history but in the sense of a political dynasty as your family can so greatly identify with? >> well, we don't like to use the dynasty word. >> and i understand why it is. >> it pertains more to kings and all that, but it's a close relationship between two families and i look forward to coming to boston and visiting

with the family, and it's a sad occasion for all of us, i think. >> senator udall, as you know so well, the cause of senator kennedy's life was health care reform, and as we've all sort of been talking about the promise that he got from president obama to make that a priority, there's such sort of anticipation and expectation about what these memories of senator kennedy and the body lying in repose and the memories of him as a legislator, what is that going to do to the big challenge facing you and your colleagues when you get back to washington, that is dealing with health care reform? what sort of impact do you think senator kennedy's death will have on the tone and the faye tour of the debate and maybe even on wavering democratic senators? >> well, i think, first of all, it's going to create a big void. i mean, he was such a great leader. he was a great legislator. he pulled people together. he worked with all sides. not having him there is going to be very, very difficult, but what i hope is that we're

inspired by his life and all of the work he did on health care and that we'll take this occasion and the impetus of this occasion to really do something great for the medication. i mean, this current situation is unsustainable as far as health care, and we need to get out there and make sure that we get this done for the american people, and that's what ted kennedy would want us to do. >> senator, thank you so much for your time. greatly appreciate you giving your thoughts and even your perspective on this, and we continue to watch the breaking news out of boston. you see the members of the military standing in front of the presidential library, the jfk presidential library. i was just being told by our producer that they are very close, david, to the library itself and one side of the screen being the motorcade and now a full picture of this military guard there in front of where the senator will lie in

repose, and the family members, the 80-plus kennedy family members, david, will be greeting those people thanking them who have been standing out, as anne thompson described, in the hot sun on this very warm day in boston just to catch a glimpse of what we are all watching play out right now. we've got michael, who is still with us. anne thompson as well as neil swity. neil we haven't heard from you in a minute. we know 45 minutes after the hour is when this motorcade should approach this library. what are your thoughts as we're getting to this point? >> well, tamron, anne had mentioned a few of the family and friends who are going to be there. one she mentioned was jerry dougher dougherty, who was the first campaign manager for ted kennedy's race in 1962. when my colleagues and i were working on the book, we were looking for when this cause of a lifetime, haealth care, really sort of had its spark in ted kennedy. the earliest we could find was

in 1964 after his near-death experience in a plane crash shortly after jack's assassination when he was in a hospital bed immobilized for six months and he would meet with aides and others and he would look around and see the different people suffering, and he talked to jerry dougherty who had dom visadvic come to visit said how did you do it? he was from a working class family, had tuberculosis in college. he said i come from privilege. i can afford anything. here i am coming close to death and i see all these other people. how can people afford it if they have to deal with health care and they have the additional worry of how am i going to pay for it? how do they do it? that began very modestly this cause of a lifetime that we may see the fulfillment of ted

kennedy's dream this year. >> let's bring in anne thompson who is there at the jfk presidential library. ann, you mentioned -- you sort of described a scene. i'm getting messages from people wanting to know how hot is it there? how difficult is it for everybody outside. >> reporter: let me tell you it is very hot. we all are getting sunburned. i don't have a thermometer. i have lots of electronics and lots of devices here, but one of the interesting things is i'm looking inside the library, and there you can see the staffers who are lined up to greet the coffin when it arrives into the library, and out here outside we see an honor guard that is standing at attention and awaiting the arrival of the senator, and now there are truly hundreds of people just within my eyesight who have come to catch a glimpse. many bringing cameras, many

bringing thoughts of memories they have of the senator, perhaps meeting him once or talking to him or perhaps help that he gave them on an issue. the city folks are here, the program the senator helped put together here in boston. they are doing crowd control, and they have an awful lot of work to do. david? >> let's bring in nbc's michael besch beschloff. this scene is so reminiscent, i suppose of gerald ford when his body was lying in repose in the u.s. capitol. i'll never forget talking to his grandchildren who were so intrigued i was a fellow michigan alum and they were so eager to sort of share their memories of their grandfather from their own perspective and his love for the university. it's as if this is a great opportunity for some of the family members, particularly the

grandchildren of ted kennedy, to learn something about how the public viewed their family but also to share a different perspective of their grandfather than a lot of us might seem to have. >> well, i think you're absolutely right. that's a great point, david. something else is that -- we're just beginning to see the hearse and the cortege just come up the driveway to the library right now. >> in fact, at this point since the honor guard is going to be there and is going to remove the casket, we are just going to watch and listen ourselves and let all of you listen to this as well.

>> and so the casket of senator ted kennedy is now in the john f. kennedy library and museum along with more than 80 family members. this is a place that senator kennedy spent decades building for his beloved brother john f. kennedy, president john f. kennedy. the library likes to say that it's a nationa