part of the argument, what does the president do then? >> let me add it's not just republicans. there are moderate members of the president's own party what will make those very same arguments and i think it's something the white house has to take on and the president has to take it on personally. that's why this speech is the beginning of something, not the end of something. if it's the beginning of rehabilitation of this health care reform it means the president has to get in and work this. what's striking to me about the language you just read from the speech, it reflects what people on the left have been telling him. advisers inside and ouz the white house who have said to this president, get tougher, start fighting this thing out. there are elements of this language that go back to the speech in iowa, the j.j. dinner. elements, special interest of the big part of his campaign. a lot of people in his party do not feel the president has been strong enough or fast enough in trying to deal with misinformation about this plan. it's why august went the way it

did. >> we'll see how strong the audience thinks he is tonight on this. thank you david gregory and dee dee myers. join us again in one hour at 7:00 eastern for a live edition of "hardball" and stay with msnbc for the president's address to congress at 8:00 p.m. right now it's time for "the ed show" with ed schultz. good evening, americans, i'm ed schultz and this is "the ed show" coming to you live from the nation's capital in washington, d.c. it's a big night for the president, right? but it's not a make-or-break night for his presidency the way the conservatives are making it out to be. president obama did not create this problem. let's state the obvious. the president has been in office for all of eight months and for the last eight years the republicans, may i remind our viewers tonight, they did nothing for health care. only they did tell you to get a health care savings account. the only play at this point the

republicans have is to drive the narrative of failure. they've done a good job of that. they drove the country into the ditch. they're good at that. they're trying to shift the blame in the president. he's got to come up with a great one tonight. president obama isn't the decider. he's the fixer in all of this. he's trying to be the fixer. he's got to mop up this mess the republicans have made of the economy, two war, the future of the middle class, manufacturing job, they're gone. all along the republicans have taken no responsibility of any of that and they haven't lifted a damn finger to help the president out when it comes to a health care solution in this kun trip the republicans have said no to shoring up the financial system. they've said no to helping out the automobile industry. they've said no to the housing rescue. they were against health care for kids. look out. tonight's the big speech. he better deliver. look, they don't want this

president to have measurable success whatsoever. when it comes to fixing the country's biggest domestic problems they're going to sit on the sideline and obstruct. they've been against every single proposal the democrats have put on the table when comes to health care reform. you can't deny that. democrats want single payer. republicans said no to that and got help from max baucus. democrats came back with a public option, we can't do that either. conservative democrats started pushing this thing which i'm against, this co-op thing because republicans said we might take a look at this and they're saying, we don't want to do that either. it's time to stop trying to work with republicans. it's time to be the two-fisted democrat that we saw in the primary. they have no ideas, period. they want you to fail, mr. president. you deserve credit for trying to fix the problems. no doubt about that. let's remember. you take obama out of this and you know what we're talking

about tonight? iran. and maybe world war iii with john mccain. not doing anything domestically. so about the speech tonight, let's clarify. the president, i agree, needs to show passion and hold it right there, because i remember the president just the other day talking to the unions how passionate he was and what he wants. i got to see that tonight. i think his base needs to see that tonight. mr. president, go to your roots. mr. president, remember where you came from and remember who put you in office and don't forget that. you go back to office again, forget max baucus. the baucus plan is bogus. co-ops, it's a hoodwink. they're not going to work. baucus, you know what he is? he's a democrat. at least he says he is. but he is a sellout to big insurance. that's what he is. he sold lefties on single player, on public option. now all of a sudden he comes out of a meeting today saying i need another week to figure this thing out. you know what he's got to do?

you know what he's got to do? he's got to run it by big insurance. he's going to make sure the big boys who have lined his pockets are okay with this thing coming out of the senate finance committee. as a democrat i a liberal, proud liberal, progressive, i'm sick of this. aren't you frustrated, americans? you know what he has to do tonight? here's what the president has to do. he has to give them a little karl rove talk. we won, you lost, get over it, here's where we're going. by the way, max baucus is now officially part of the september stall. i say -- i do a lot of hunting in the midwest -- kick the republicans to the side of the road like roadkill. kick them under the table. let's do a deal for the american people. that's what i want tonight. i want the president to stand up tonight and say, this is where we're going. we've waited too long. we've got to get there. the republicans are in the way. then you think about this, folks. this summer they've tried to convince americans, the republicans, they've tried to

convince americans that the president's not even american. just this week they said, well, he can't talk to school kids. holy spokes he's a socialist communist, a hitler, everything else. we can't have barack obama talk to school kids. this is what you're dealing with. i want to know what you think. get your cell phones out tonight. how do you feel about the president's speech tonight? "a" hopeful or "b" worried? a for yes, b for no to 622639. i'm passionate about this. i have done my town hall meetings, too. isn't anybody on the congress who has anything on ed schultz. i know what the people are saying. mr. president, the progressive movement put you there, they are with you, the blue dogs, the red dog, yellow dogs, yon what they did? they went along for the ride. they enjoyed that ride to the white house, the ride to the majority. don't worry about ben nelson. ben nelson's an all-american

nobody. he went with bush on the bush tax cuts. look at the economy. we have to deal with that. don't worry about conservative democrats. stay with your base, get it zdoe in the house and let's play hard ball in the senate. joining me, linda douglass, white house communications director for the office of health care reform. linda, maybe, are my expectations a little too high tonight? i'll take the liberty to speak for good lefties across the country. are we expecting too much? >> i think you won't be disapointed. the president is going to make it clear we are in a different phase, we have to move forward and take the pieces of all of the legislation crafted by the various congressional committees and enact health care reform that is going to provide security and stability for people who have insurance, going to make sure people who do not have insurance can find affordable coverage and is going to drive down the sky rocketing oppressive rising cost of health care that is crushing family and

businesses, the economy, the government. he's going to make it very clear where we need to go. >> okay. i respect all of that and i just got a little excerpt of what the president's going to be saying tonight. i want to read it. he's going to offer up a plan tonight and it's going to read "under this plan it will be against the law for insurance companies to deny you coverage because of a pre-existing condition." i am on bended knee tonight for the white house. this is the key issue. is the president going to have any negotiating room whatsoever on this issue or is he going to stick to that because the pre-existing condition, in my opini opinion, from what i hear all over the country, that is the key. how dogmatic is the president going to be on that issue, on that statement in his speech tonight? >> i wouldn't want to characterize the president as being dog maltic. he has made it clear this is legislation that must contain consumer protections for every american. you know, 12 million americans were denied or discriminated

against in health insurance coverage because they had pre-existing conditions. all the time americans are finding suddenly when you have a big medical expenditure it turns out there's a cap on your coverage or the insurance company uses an excuse to take your insurance away, so, for example, we heard a terrible story about a woman who had cancer. the insurance company said you didn't report you had acne so they denied her coverage for the cancer. these are the practices the president says will immediately be illegal. >> linda douglass, i have to point out, this is the very system that the republicans have been protecting. this is the very system the republicans have said, no, we can't reform that. heck, it's tort reform. we're suing too many people. the republicans have been horribly sound. they've tried to tell the american people the president is not born, not an american, can't talk to school kids. there's a long list -- when did the olive branches get cut off? are some of the olive branches

going to get cut off tonight in this speech? i guess i've got too much -- i'm ready to go after this big-time. my point is tonight, are we going to get a cut away from this bipartisan talk and go down the road to do the deal for the american people? >> well, you know, the president made it pretty clear, i think, in his labor day speech to the afl-cio, look, we want to work with republicans. we've been doing this very vigorously over the last several months. whatever legislation is enacted will clearly contain republican ideas. the president's made that clear and will make that clear again tonight. obviously, you know, republicans, he asked them at the labor day speech, what's your idea? what is the proposal you want? because even the republicans who talked about the boisterous town halls, the few town halls they encountered over august, they also came back to washington realizing that doing nothing is not an option. they heard from constituents all

over the country struggling with health care. >> well, it's down to six people, i guess in the senate finance committee. i'm not convinced they're going to get it done. there's one other thing the president is going to say tonight. he says "as soon as i sign this bill it would be against the law for insurance companies to drop your coverage when you get sick or water it down when you need it the most." we're going to hear some things tonight that we haven't heard from president obama and i'm pretty fired up about that and i guarantee you -- i'll make a prediction, linda, you're going to end up having to do this on your own because i don't think the insurance companies are going to go along with a pre-existing condition. i don't think the republicans are going to go along with a mandate you can't drop people because that's how they make money and who lines their pockets. i'll give you the last word. >> the president is going to say tonight, you see that in the excerpts, "the time for bickering is over, the time for action is now." we are going to act. we are going to move forward. he's going to make that very clear in his speech tonight, ed. >> thank you, linda. appreciate your time tonight.

linda douglass from the white house here on "the ed show." for more on this let me turn to congressman jim clyburn, house majority whip. great to have you with us tonight. i've talked to a few people on the house side today. they were telling me that, heck, you guys had a great caucus meeting today. i mean, the democrats came back, went behind closed doors and everybody's roaring about a public option. tell us what was in that meets today. >> thank you so much for having me, ed. you're right. we had a great meeting this morning. i was very pleased, a little bit surprised at how positive so many of our members were. some of whom left here back in august not sure about this public option. coming back very strong for a public option. i think we're going to get a piece of legislation passed very soon that will have your public

option. i think it will have all of those things that you just talked about, making it illegal to discriminate against people because of pre-existing conditions, to make it illegal for insurance companies to drop people when they get sick or have some potential of getting sick, making sure that we get -- make a little bit of an incentive for people to participate in the prevention. so i think it's going to be a good bill that we're going to come up with and with what the president will say tonight. >> what is this pilot program, you, congressman clyburn, have been talking about that you would almost like to incrementally get to a public option if you can't get it in the snous that sounds like major league wiggle room. >> let me explain it.

the bill as currently constituted says the changes will be put in place in 2013. the part of the exchanges will be what we want in public option. what i'm saying is in the three-year period while we are waiting for 2013 to get here, let's put in place some pilot programs, some pilot-exchange programs with the public option and let's work out the kinks during this period of time. i think if you do it the way i'm proposing, when you get to the state of making it a permanent part of the bill, you have some best practices, you have some procedures in -- some data upon which you can make a good, solid decision. what i'm saying to people, what are we going to do in this three-year interrum when we wait for the exchange program to take place? i'm says let's have pilot programs in the interrum. >> i'm all for that. i think the american people would be for that, too.

then we could see if it would work. basically we'd see if it would work, see some return and i don't think the american people can wait another three years to have some type of legislation kick in to fix our biggest problem in this country. jim, there's one other thing i want to ask you. you said -- you characterized this meeting as very positive, where were the blue dogs? were they aggressive in the caucus meeting today? or were the blue dogs just sitting back taking the whole thing in? >> the second person that went to the mike was stephanie stanley, the leader of the blue dogs. she had a very positive statement to make. she talked about us reforming health care. she talked about us doing what was necessary to get rid of all those issues that you just talked about and she was very, very positive and i was very pleased at what she had to say. >> congressman, great to have you with us tonight. i appreciate your time. >> thank you so much for having

me. >> you bet. jim clyburn with us tonight on "the ed show." there's one other thing i want to point out. we've seen a couple things the president is going to talk about. insurance companies, pre-existing conditions, going to be gone. once he signs it, when you get sick an insurance company can't drop you. that's a big deal. they're going to place a limit on how much you could be charged out of pocket expenses. these are three big things that i'm predicting republicans will not go along with and i'm talking about it tonight on msnbc, 11:00, special edition of "the ed show," 8:00 pacific time. join us. we'll do the debrief of exactly where all this is going to shake down. coming up, i'm not the only one drawing a line in the sand over this public option. the leader of one of the biggest unions in the country will join me to explain how much the president stands to lose if he backs off tonight. plus, republican congressman brian bill by will be here. tonight i'm not going to let him get a way with the righty talking points. we're going to have an honest

discussion of what the country is facing at the bottom of the hour. and congresswoman, there she is, mean jean schmidt. she was caught "psycho talking" at a t.e.a. party. i have the tape. on. - enough! you get half and you get half. ( chirp ) team three, boathouse? ( chirp ) oh yeah-- his and hers. - ( crowd gasping ) - ( chirp ) van gogh? ( chirp ) even steven. - ( chirp ) mansion. - ( chirp ) good to go. ( grunts ) timber! ( chirp ) boss? what do we do with the shih-tzu? - ( crowd gasps ) - ( chirp ) joint custody. - phew! - announcer: get work done now. communicate in less than a second with nextel direct connect. only on the now network. deaf, hard of hearing and people with speech disabilities access www.sprintrelay.com. you should know, bayer aspirin is one of most studied, most trusted, anti-fever, anti-inflammatory, and anti-pain medications in the world. from pain killer to life saver, bayer aspirin is the wonder drug that works wonders.

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welcome back to "the ed show." from the nation's capital. the president speaking tonight. organized labor will be closely watching what president obama has to say tonight to the joint session of the congress. unions helped this man get into the white house last fall. big, big effort. now they want to see him deliver quality health care for american workers. let me bring in andy stern, president of the service employees international union. mr. stern, good to have you with us tonight. i understand you're going to be a guest of speaker pelosi at the joint session speech tonight which i think speaks volumes. she wants to know what you think. she wants to keep you close. your employees want to make sure that they don't lose their health care benefits. she's always been for collective bargaining. for you, where do you draw the line? what does the president have to say tonight and what is he --

what does he have to present to the american people to satisfy union and labor in this country? >> well, ed, i think he has to say three things. one, that never again will people have to watch their husband die and give up her 100-year-old ranch. or alberta walker is not going to loserer job, losier health care and get cancer. or dan broadrick's wife is not going to have a pre-existing condition and find out she can't get treated for cancer and dies. that's one. never again in america. two, we gave the insurance industry 50 years to care about our families and our health and all they cared about was their wealth. it's time we make illegal exactly what the president said, no more pre-existing conditions, no more dropping health care because you change your job. we're sick and tired of it. three, it's time to take a vote. you know, debates are great.

america's had a wonderful summer. everybody's gotten their say, but 14,000 people lost health care today and we can't wait any longer. i'm so glad to hear the president say, it's showtime. it's our time and the time is now. in the next 60 days, let's just get this done. america needs it. >> i hear you. let me address one other statement the president has got in his speech tonight. he says "we will place a limit on how much you could be charged for out of pocket expenses because the united states of america, no one should go broke because they get sick." is that strong enough for you, mr. stern? is that strong enough? >> i mean, the words are fine. i think the question is, what does that mean in the bill? because listen, health care reform is meaningless if we tell hard-working americans you have to have insurance and then you can't afford it. so if there aren't the right kind of subsidies -- the real question here, ed, some family making $50,000, $75,000 a year, can they afford their health insurance? i think that's the real test here.

not the words but the deeds. >> okay. if the house passes a bill with a public option, and it's right there and it's everything the president wants, how is he going to waiver from that politically and satisfy his base if the white house gets hung up on the bickering that's going on over in the senate? i mean, if they pass what you want in the house, the president's going to have to stand with that, is he not? >> wow could you think so. in the end it's time to take a vote. leadership is just about making choices. the president says he wants a public option. the house is going to vote for a public option. where are these settlers? let them take a vote. they've been talking and thinking and studying and analyzing. what do we have? a lot of people dying, sick, and financially in trouble. let's take a vote here, ed. >> apparently max baucus doesn't get it. he needs another week. what's your response to him? >> september 17th they said

they're going to start marking up the bill. that's it. put it on the floor, let the finance committee vote, take it to the senate. americans are ready for change. if senator baucus and the committee can't get it done, harry reid should step up and put this bill on the floor. >> mr. stern, great to have you with us tonight. thanks so much. >> thank you, ed. next up, republican congresswoman jean schmidt was caught red handed whispering sweet nothings to a berther at a t.e.a. party. i'll blow the cover on "psycho talk." once you've mastered the complexities of a headache... the rest of the body is a no brainer. doesn't your whole body deserve excedrin strength relief? excedrin back & body. excedrin. what ache? it's tough to reach that five servings a day if you don't always like the taste of vegetables. good thing v8 v-fusion juice gives you a serving of vegetables hidden by a serving of fruit.

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welcome back to "the ed show." "psycho talk" tonight. a repeat. that's right. mean jean schmidt. congresswoman from ohio. she's a tough one, too. last weekend she spoke at a t.e.a. party near cincinnati. that's a red town. afterwards a riled up berther came over to her, started hollering that president obama wasn't born in america! well, our friends that think progress, they caught the congresswoman's response on camera. listen closely. >> ma'am, ma'am? >> ah-ha. i feel like a broken record with this better nonsense. we've established over and over and over again that barack obama was born in the united states of

america. the congresswoman, well, you know, she's just playing to the wackos, though we shouldn't be surprised. mean jean has been spewing heaps of craziness for years. her most notorious offense in 2005 when she took to the house floor to supposedly pass along a message from an ohio state representati representative. >> he asked me to send congressman mertha a message, that cowards cut and run, marines never do. danny and the rest of america and the world watching from his body. we will -- >> now you remember who mean jean schmidt is. you heard the reaction of the house floor. congressman hmertha is a decorated vietnam veteran, he was in the marine corps for years. calling a war hero is not okay. what does that make dick cheney?

the following year the commission reprimanded the congresswoman for having a reckless disregard for the truth. it seemed she lied about having an extra university degree. how fitting? somehow the folks in cincinnati decided to re-elect her anyway. so we have a history of a psycho talker. this congresswoman. her support of the berther nut jobs last weekend is just the latest example in a long string of "psycho talk." next up, senator chris dodd just made a surprising decision not to replace ted kennedy as the chairman of the senate health committee. i'll ask a key member of that committee, senator sharon brown, what does this mean as we move forward? plus, i'm not going to let the righties push these bogus bullet points at us about the president's speech and you know -- you can almost predict what they're going to say. congressman brian bill by is

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welcome back to "the ed show." big news today in the senate. iowa senator tom harkin is going to be taking over as the chairman of the senate health committee. senator harkin will be a great ally in this fight. he's a great progressive from the heartland. he knows what the people want. most of all he gets the landscape. i mean, this is what we told me on this program back in july. >> last fall the american people voted overwhelmingly for barack obama to make some changes. they also voted overwhelmingly for democrats to run the house and the senate and so they've asked to take a leadership position and so we need to lead in this and not be afraid to lead and push the envelope on health care reform. >> well, that's your new chairman of the senate health committee. i'm all about it. i mean, you just got to lead on

this thing. he'll do it. you can't be afraid about doing it. got to be bold. you're going to need to show spine to get this thing done. joining me now is senator sharon brown of ohio, a member of the senate health committee. senator brown, good to have you on tonight. >> thanks. >> this really isn't any major change. you have a couple of seasoned veterans that know this health care thing inside out. chris dodd and now tom harkin. why is everybody focusing so much on the finance committee as if you guys over on the senate health committee, it's like you're dog food? i mean, you know what i'm saying. i mean, everything -- you guys have come out with a great bill with a public option in the senate health committee. how do you -- what's the stall in the senate, in your opinion? >> as you know, ed, we've talked about this on this show before. four committees in congress have passed a good health insurance reform bill with a strong public

option. house, energy and commerce committee, house ways and mean, health education labor pension committee in the senate which chairman dodd and chairman kennedy shared. this committee, this is the right blueprint. i think you're going to hear tonight president obama talking about most of the things we've done on that committee. the other committee is a bit more conservative and i think what's going to ultimately -- ultimately going to get to the president's desk is a strong public option. good health insurance reform. that's the way it's going to be. you know, this committee's taken longer so the media has to cover the story. it's the only game in town even though we did our work back in july. >> i think the president is going to push the envelope tonight to these guys in the senate finance committee. he specifically is going to say in his speech tonight that it will be against the law for insurance companies to deny coverage of a person with a pre-existing condition. does that play well in your opinion, will that get any republicans on board in the

senate? >> no, of course not. you understand, ed, the republicans are on a short leash with the insurance industry. the insurance industry backs republicans. puts huge money into their campaigns. if the insurance company pulls on that leash, the republicans jump back. they mouth the words that they're against pre-existing condition. if they really were pre-existing condition, if they really were against discrimination based on disability or race or gender or age or geography, if they were against these caps that insurance companies put on your plans so that if you get really sick and the costs go way up they rescind or pull your insurance, if the republicans were really against those they'd also support the public option. we need the right rules but we need the public option to help enforce these rules so the insurance companies can't gain the system. that's one of the reasons public option is so important. >> senator brown, good to have you with us tonight. i appreciate your time.

sherron brown from ohio. our panel, democratic strategist todd webster with us, xm radio's joe madison. and john fury who i have been waiting to talk to all day long. john, it's going to be the against the law. against the law to deny somebody coverage with pre-existing conditions. >> republican plan would do the exact same thing. >> the exact same -- which plan? >> all of them are against pre-exists conditions. >> so the insurance companies are going to go along with it? >> the big problems with the insurance companies is there's a state monopoly on insurance companies. harry reid does not want to break state monopolies. allow people to shop across state lines, you have cut costs without a public option ppt the senate democratic leader will not go for it. the republicans have been pushing this plan which would cut costs immediately, get rid of pre-existing conditions. there's a deal to be made. i've said it many times. the senate will not go for it. >> joe, what's going to be the

stumbling block of the three points in the president's speech tonight? these three excerpts that have been released. >> all three. the one major one you know is going to be public option. that's going to be it. here's what i hope the president does. i know the speech is already out there. he's not -- he's not going to change minds in congress. this is not a speech to congress. this is a speech to the american people. he's going to have to take a chapter from reagan's book. he's going to have to use living examples of everyday people. a child who was born or has childhood diabetes. a pre-existing condition. and the impact it's had financially, emotionally. he's got to pull at the heart strings of the american people listening. >> todd, you think that will work on some republicans that are waivering? >> i think he is speaking to the country. that is the audience for this. look, looking at the bills that have been reported out, these are bipartisan bills. h e has gone to them. he has been deaf ren rnl to the

congress, the co-equal branch of government in writing these bills. he has been deferential in republicans in gathering their ideas, republican ideas. if you look at john mccain his policy proposal in the campaign about catastrophic coverage is included in the bill. at the end of the day if the republicans don't vote for this bill out of spite or political gamesmanship, then that's their problem. it will be a strong bill. he's going to be putting steel in the spine of wavering democrats on the hill in the speech tonight. >> at the house, nancy pelosi is holding a lot of cards on all of this. if she gets a bill passed with a public option, how can the president run from that bill? he's going to have to stand up there and tell the senators, hey, i'm going over here. this is where my base is and that could be a tough moment for democrat democrats. >> john? >> as an old house guy, i understand the dynamic of the house. people won't back in august. it was the ugliest august in my political career. people were angry in the blue

dog districts. you hate the blue jobs. >> hate, strong, i just think they need counseling. >> they're the majority makers. they represent a huge bloc that could change this thing. nancy pelosi said one thing. steny hoyer said something else. that's a real conflict. >> it's a math game. i've not worked in the house but it's a math game. i think what nancy pelosi has done along with jim clyburn, the leadership and steny hoyer counted the votes. they know those votes are there. the math is there. >> we've had a public option in this country since 1965. it's called medicare. it's available to every american over the age of 65. for democrats, who in our dna, are programmed to stand up and protect medicare and republicans' dna to undermine it and destroy it, they've been doing it since 1965. for a democrat to be opposed to a public option -- >> i don't get it. great discussion. we'll have you back.

tonight we're going to be back at 11:00 with the special edition of "the ed show." postgame to the president's speech to the joint session. coming up, the republican "playbook." the congressman picked to give the response tonight has questions about where the president was born. and the house minority leader is calling on obama to hit, what? the reset button and start health care reform from scratch? republican congressman brian bilbray is going to be talking to me about that in just a moment. stay with us. but i've still got room for the internet. with my new netbook from at&t. with its built-in 3g network, it's fast and small, so it goes places other laptops can't. i'm bill kurtis, and i've got plenty of room for the internet. and the nation's fastest 3g network. gun it, mick. (announcer) sign up today and get a netbook for $199.99 after mail-in rebate. with built-in access to the nation's fastest 3g network. only from at&t. we're shopping for car insurance, and our friends said we should start here.

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republican "playbook" tonight. today house democrats went behind closed doors, sick ld the wagons on a public option. they're all about it. the only hope that the house republican, i think that they've got right now, the only hope is for the blue dogs to come in and screw this deal up. republican congressman bustani, a doctor is going to be giving the republican response and talking about the doctor/patient relationship. what is this? the dockr. phil show? cut me slack. we need premiums lowered. details. joining me now to give the prebut l to the president's address is congressman brian bilbray of california. good to have you with us tonight. what do the republicans want to hear from president obama tonight? >> well, i think first thing i have heard in my town hall meetings was the bottom line, before you start making promises, how are you going to pay for it? where's the money going to come from?

if waste, fraud and abuse can produce three quarters of the money, why aren't we talking about doing that first to sort of prove to america we can be trusted with this type of effort? >> congressman, the president has said he's in favor of repealing the bush tax cuts. i assume that wouldn't fly with you or the rest of the republicans, correct? >> then do that upfront. i heard him say, there was so much fraud, waste and abuse, so much abuse of the system we could produce huge amounts of money. the question everybody has is, why haven't we done that first? develop the credibility. that's one of the things everybody is missing here. there's a real lack of credibility with washington when you talk to the average citizen out in america. this isn't democrat or republican, this general issue. earn credibility by doing the heavy lifting, the tough stuff. take on our buddies who are ripping off the system first and then talk about promising more services for what you can't afford. >> let me ask you this. the president, tonight, is going to say that it is against the

law for insurance companies to deny people coverage for pre-existing condition. that's kind of a heavy lift, i would say. would you go along with that? >> i think it is a heavy lift. i think there's a possibility we'll do that. he also has to address the other big elephant in the room, the tort issue. that one thing -- in california, actually a legislature controlled by the democratic party has known tort reform wasn't important for health care. >> all right. do we have some wiggle room here? would you give in to the pre-existing condition if the president were to do something about tort reform? how many house republicans do you think that would bring over? >> i think it would be a huge jump if he's brave enough to take on the trial lawyers. they're not talking about that. those in california who are tri trying to save a system back there understands tort reform is a cost reduction part that is not providing health care. >> what about telling insurance companies they can't drop people

when they get sick? what about that? would you go along with that? >> i think that is one of the things we need to continue to do. think the other issue is stop this concept -- >> right now insurance companies are dropping people after their get sick. you don't want to do that, do you? >> they shouldn't be able to drop them if they're insured at the time it came down. what we have to talk about is why does the federal government subsidize or give tax benefits for big labor and big business for their employees but the individual doesn't get the same tax benefit? we should give this tax benefit across the board to every american regardless of where they're employed. that's one of the things we ought to be talking about before we start talking about raising taxes. >> congressman bilbray, you really need the blue-dog democrats to screw this thing up to give president obama failure. that's really where you're at, right? >> no, the fail on this one is the president has to -- he's going to fail if he doesn't explain how he's going to pay

for it. it's not going to be promises of great savings and great revenue that is not on before you. you wouldn't buy a product for your grandchildren you couldn't afford or for them not to afford. that's what it's coming down to. where is the money going to come from to keep these promises before we make the promises? >> i think he's going to try to later on say, let's repeal the bush tax cuts. congressman, appreciate your time. >> thank you very much. >> you bet. next up, the president's got about more than an hour until he delivers what some say is the most important speech of his presidency. what about those on the left? the nation's katrina vanden hufen coming up. an extended conversation with katrina. where does she stand? what does she want to hear about tonight? (announcer) what are you going to miss when you have an allergy attack? achoo! (announcer) benadryl is more effective than claritin at relieving your worst mptoms. and works when you need it most. benadryl.

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welcome back to "the ed show." president obama's big night starts in a little over an hour. he needs to come out and support the public option, in my opinion. the american people want it. they want it. they want some guarantees. the president has got to come through for the folks who put him in office and what would be the political downside if he's not strong enough down the stretch? not just tonight but down the stretch. let me bring in katrina vanden hufen, editor of "the nation." great to have you with us tonight. what do liberals, what does the progressive movement, katrina, have to hear from the president

tonight? how pivotal is this? what do they have to hear? >> they have to hear what they heard during the campaign when barack obama's genius was to speak to americans who sought change in the country, challenging the entrenched interest. if he, tonight, says it is illegal for insurance companies to deny coverage for pre-existing conditions, that's the beginning. we need to see the possibility in obama of a great reform president. the public option is a key element, ed. i think obama needs to speak clearly tonight, passionately, and talk to the american people. those who are insuraned, underinsures and not insured and explain why it is the spirit of american pragmatism, that it is about choice, it is about competition, it is about disciplining the insurance companies and about this cost containment that is so important. it seems to millions of americans. >> what's the downside if he is judged by liberals tonight of

not being strong enough? you know, there's a lot of blog traffic out there. a, b, and c, he has to accomplish this. there's talk of a third party if this issue doesn't go the way the liberals want it to go. i want your response. >> listen, tonight obama needs to stand up and speak with fighting words about how he sees the future of health care. the progressive movement needs to as it -- needs to be as clear eyed and tough and pragmatic about barack obama as he is about us. he talks a lot about how the perfect is the enemy of the good. the danger is that the weak will be the enemy of the good if he doesn't move forward of what he has spoken eloquently in the past. the pub loings lick option. those who elected him stood with him. the public option is the key element of doing that. i think it is way too early to talk about a third party. we are in the final stages of

this game. as you heard from senator sherron brown. you have had four good committees come out with four good plans. let us build on that. let us fight for that and let us mobilize from the low to push a leader at the top as has been the case of all of american history. i think barack obama, by the way, would be wise to invoke american history. at every moment of real change and reform in this country, we have seen megaphones of disinformation as in the past weeks and months. franklin roosevelt challenged by the american liberty league. johnston challenged by those who thought he was a socialist. it is time. it has been 100 years since teddy roosevelt, the republican, put universal health care in the progressive party platform. it is urgent. it is time. >> how is the president, if the house passes a strong public option, that's his base, how is he going to be able to run from

that and go do a deal with somebody in the senate and say, okay, we'll water it down and go along with that? isn't he going to have to make a definitive statement if the house comes out with a strong public option that he's going to have to stand with that? if he doesn't stand with that he's in political trouble. >> absolutely. i think that's when we make clear he's in political trouble. again, i think we have some time here, because, listen, we have one outlier committee. this max baucus finance committee. it is the most conservative of the committees. all of the talk of the gang of six with the three republicans, you cannot allow a decent republican like olympia snowe to define the contours of mayor health care reform. we've seen enzi and grassley, they have no interest in bipartisanship. i think barack obama tonight can speak very clearly and rally his own party around the fact he has tried but bipartisanship with this party, the republican party -- >> and do you think