he reported it for pro publicia. if you're looking for a possible explanation from mike ross' stance against his own party and his own constituents on health reform, consider this -- in 2007 mike ross and his wife had a piece of property to sell. it was a pharmacy that they owned and operated in prescott, arkansas. a small town that's about 100 miles southwest of little rock. at the time the county estimated the value of that property at about $263,000. an independent appraisal done recently puts the current value even lower than that, at about $198,000. but when it came time to sell, mike ross sure did beat the odds. despite that assessment at $263,000, despite the independent appraisal at $198,000, mike ross sold that property for $420,000. cha-ching. the only licensed real estate broker in that town was just as surprised as you are right now.

he told propublica, quote, you can buy half the town for $4250,000. who was the buyer who gave congressman ross such a sweet deal? it was a company called usa drug, the 15th largest drugstore chain in the country. if getting 60% more than estimated value of the property seems a little fishy to you, you may have a future crier in arkansas property assessment because it seemed fishy to the county's assessors as well. when they heard someone was paying $420,000 for that property, they actually called the person buying it, they called the company. they called usa drugs' headquarters essentially to make sure there hadn't been some mistake. there wasn't a mistake. some drugstore chain apparently just wanted to pay this congressman an extra $150,000, $200,000 for his property. and usa drugs' payments to congressman ross and his wife did not stop there. on torch of the $420,000 they paid for the property, usa drug

also paid the rosses between $500,000 and $1 million for the assets of the pharmacy. in addition to that, they paid congressman ross' wife between $100,000 and $250,000 for signing a noncompete agreement. the company also then kept mrs. ross on as an employee at the property after the sale. all-told, mike ross and his wife made between a million and $1.6 million. again, off a piece of property assessed to be worth $260,000. not a bad day's work. and what's more, two weeks after the sale was complete, the owner of usa drug sweetened it even further, made a $2,300 contribution to congressman ross' campaign. that was the most that an individual could give in 2007. congressman ross raked in more than $342,000 from health-related interests overall that year alone, more than he got from any other business sector. since then congressman ross not only opposed the public option,

despite what his constituents say they want, he also pushed for language in the health care bill that would protect drug companies for having to negotiate for drug prices. we invited congressman ross to come on the show tonight to explain all of this, to explain whether there's a connection between the final largeous he has enjoyed from the health industry and his political positions in favor of those interests and against health reform. congressman ross declined our invitation. his office did provide us a statement which reads, in part, quote, instead of having civil dialogue over true and substantive disagreements, outside groups are trying to taint a completely legal and respected small business that my wife and i worked hard for 14 years to establish. i welcome any debate and review on my voting record and my positions on the issue. congressman ross, it should be noted, is not denying the substance of this reporting but he does point out that he disclosed all of this information on his financial statement. he said this is just got you politics. the congressman's full statement has been posted at our website

today, rachel.msnbc.com if you would like to see it. also, congressman ross, if you're watching, i hope you will reconsider your decision not to pear on this show to talk it over. i promise you will get a fair hearing. the stance behind this health care reform is not the least of his political worries but it is one worry among many. the group change congress is hitting the kongman with an ad now highlighting the more than $900,000 in contributions he's received over multiple years from the health industry. the political action committee, fdl action, which is an outgrowth of the group fire dog lake, is running this ad against congressman ross, threatening a primary challenge against him. and today fire dog lake kicked their campaign up a notch, threatening to not only run this ad online, on the internet machine, and in congressman ross' district, but also during this saturday's university of arkansas razorbacks football game against the third-ranked

alabama crimson tide. university of arkansas football is darn close to a religion in arkansas, which is why we were able to tap a proud arkansas ex-pat at a new york city bar today in order to borrow this very, very attractive razorback hat. fire dog lake is trying to raise enough money to run that, hey mike ross support the public option ad, during this weekend's razorback's game and the game is is being played in alabama, which means most arkansas fans will be watching it on the tv. sweet. what's going on here is that the left is flexing its muscles, and as a result it has been a pretty rotten few days for democrats in congress who oppose the public option and other elements of real health reform. but conversely, that also means that democrats who support those things are finding their voices again. >> i'm a firm believer in the public option, because i think it's vital we have greater

competition. >> i'm a strong supporter of a strong public option. >> the bill does not hold insurance companies accountable. the bill does not force insurance companies to compete for our business. real reform, colleagues, is saying you can keep what you have, but it is also saying if you don't like what you have, you can get something better. >> joining us now is that man that you just saw there, democratic senator ron wyden of oregon. he sits on the senate finance committee, which today began the arduous task of marking up the baucus health reform plan and debating about 564 amendments. senator wyden, thanks very much for taking the time to be with us on this busy day. >> thanks for having me back. >> you described real choice, real reform as being able to choose something else if you don't like what you have now. that's the idea behind your free choice act amendment, which is getting a lot of attention. can you explain to us how that would work? >> you've summed it up, rachel, and it sits pretty darn well with the public option.

look, all over america people are carrying these signs, public option, public option or bust. they're wonderful activists but a lot of folks haven't been told that the congressional budget office says only about 12 million people in america would actually get to choose the public option. they are likely to be sicker. they're likely to be folks who haven't had good preventive health care services, to really put the consumer in the driver's seat, to give the consumer clout, to turn the tables on the insurance lobby, you've got to have a really big group. that's what i'm pushing for, and free choice is very compatible with the public option. >> so the idea is that anybody should be able to get into the health exchange? it shouldn't be that if you already have insurance through your employer, that locks you out of the health exchange? that anybody can be able to join, that creates competition, so that not only do we have a choice for people to get insured who can't afford insurance today but people can also hopefully improve on the insurance they have through competition and that sort of an exchange, is that the overall idea?

>> it will send a message on day one to the insurance lobby that if you abuse somebody, if you abuse one of your consumers, you rip them off, give them lousy treatment, jack up the rates, they are going to turn the tables on you. they are going to choose another product. and i think it is so important for folks to understand this is about taking on the insurance lobby with choice rather than tethering somebody to something they don't want, something they don't like with choice. you liberate the consumer. you put them in the driver's seat rather than an insurance ceo. >> the afl-cio today sent a letter to finance committee members against your amendment. they're saying that it would encourage younger, healthier workers to -- to leave, leaving behind in the employer-based health plans older, sicker workers, and that would make those plans too expensive to maintain. what's your reaction to their criticism? >> they are just flat-out wrong, and in fact the congressional budget office put out an

analysis today indicating that the afl-cio is wrong. they do not really understand what the proposal is. the congressional budget does. that our idea would not destabilize the employer system. i also think that the typical union member would be pretty shocked to know that their leadership here in washington, d.c. is lobbying for a public option that would deny more than 200 million americans the opportunity to get it. that's not in line with the public interest. i want everybody to have real choice. i think our free choice proposal worked very well with the public option. and, by the way, we got some very good news today, rachel, because the mayo clinic says that they would support a public option as long as it gave people choices like members of congress get, and i've got legislation to do that, too. >> in terms of thinking about what's ultimately going to happen and how this is going to work for most americans, when you guys are having these negotiations, particularly among

democrats, is there an awareness that if the end result of this bill is that coverage stays as lousy and expensive as it is today, the democrats have changed the law so we're all forced to buy that lousy and expensive coverage, that this would be a huge political disaster? i'm worried politically that, that's going to happen and sink the democratic party for generations but i'm also worried that's going to be what happens to me personally in terms of my health insurance. >> rachel, you're being logical and sometimes logic doesn't break into these political debates. but that's the point that i'm making. i have been saying, folks, choice and competition are magical words in america. they're magical words for progressives, but they resonate all across the country. here is our chance to link real choice, real consumer choice with the public option and tell people, if you're getting hammered today, if you're stuck with a product you don't like, we're going to liberate you. we're going to put you in charge and, you bet, if the congress

passes somehow an anti-consumer, anti-choice, anti-holding insurance companies accountable bill, i think we'll pay dearly for it. >> and i think the other thing we have learned tonight is right now there is a riff between some democratic senators on the senate finance committee and organized labor. and unless that rift closes, it will be hard to make political progress here, so i think that's going to be one of the major topics in the days ahead. senator ron wyden of oregon, good luck with the markup this week and i know it continues tonight. thank you so much for taking the time. >> thank you for having me. at the value voter summit session on masculinism this weekend, we learned this important assertion -- >> homosexuality is inflicted on people. >> homosexuality is inflicted on people. now we can learn who that genius is going to affect who the next governor of virginia is. it's a very ugly story, and it's next. announcer: trying to be good to your heart? so is campbell's healthy request soup. low in fat and cholesterol,

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bomber, is having trouble finding a place to speech at the united nations tomorrow. the town of englewood, new jersey, wanted no part of his visit. his staff also inquired about the rent on an upper east side town house in manhattan. they were told to get lost by a new york real estate broker. but it does seem he found a base camp to pitch his large tent, in the wealthy suburb of bedford, new york, on a 1,300-acre estate that's owned by donald trump. the trump organization said they're looking into the matter and confirmed today, quote, the property was released on a short-term basis to middle eastern partners who may or may not have a relationship to mr. gadhafi. the bedford county attorney called the tent a illegal structure. it's illegal to build it without a permit and officials have issued a stop work order on the tent. a spokesman for the libyan mission said nothing has been decided on where mr. gadhafi will be staying but it would appear that donald trump, the man who brought you so many

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♪ we have a followup for you now on a report last night about senator tom coburn's chief of staff and his theory that pornography, straight pornography, makes people gay. yes, he said it. no, he was not misquoted or taken out of context. and it turns out there is significantly more to this story. here it is. as the republican party searches for a way out of the political wilderness to which they were exiled by the '06 and '08

elections, americans interested in how and when and if the republicans are going to battle their way back to power have been watching two groups, elected republican officials, including the national republican party, and the conservative movement. in the ten months since the election, both have had some successes and some failures. among republican elected officials, the parties galvanizing vice presidential nominee sarah palin, unexpectedly quit as governor of alaska. presumed republican presidential hopeful, south carolina governor mark sanford did not quit but most of the other republicans in south carolina want him to after he confessed to an extra marital affair in argentina and then started to get investigated for misusing state funds. another republican rising star, nevada senator john ensign also confessed to an extramarital affair. concurrent with that affair, the republican reportedly gave a

teenager a job who was the son of his former mistress and then fired the teenager once the affair was over and then paid the mistress off to the tune of nearly $100,000. the national republican party, meanwhile, picked michael steele to be its chairman. mr. steele does get a lot of attention when he speaks as chairman, but often not for the right reasons. >> this change, my friends, is being delivered in a tea bag, and that's a wonderful thing. you have absolutely no reason, none, to trust our words or our actions at this point. crazy nonsense, empathetic. i will give you empathy. empathize right on your behind. >> we still own empathize your mind on this show. and they answered questions whether whether it created job for the son of a senator's mistress, and sent out push poll fund-raising letters claiming that health care reform was a secret plot to deny health care to anyone registered as a

republican and they've now sent out a mailer trying to convince americans that health care reform is a secret plot to deny ir health care based on race. only black people will be able to get health care now or only white people or something. they apologized for the health care for only democrats mailer, no apology yet for the health care for only the master race mailer. but give it time. for some among the republican establishment, it's been a tough ten months. but they have have had community. they all voted no on the budget. they voted no on the stimulus plan. they're on track to all vote no on health care. and frankly the republican party is energized for its chances in the midterm elections next year. that's elected republicans. that's what's going on in their national party. for the conservative movement, which is the other thing we've been watching, this past ten months has been more fun than a bag full of squirrels. their post election game plan, as it turns out, was foreshadowed by the funkier and more outlandish fears and anger that were expressed during the mccain/palin campaign.

>> i can't trust obama. i have read about him, and he's not -- he's a -- he's an arab. >> professional public relations outfits in the beltway conservative movement republican access were able to tap that in coate anger and fear and direct it, channel it into anti-health reform, anti-obama and anti-government tea parties and town hall meetings. the tea party express bus tour, led by a republican activist and failed senate candidate named howard colligen, as well as a republican consultant named sal ruszio, they just announced today following the tea party which was held in washington to coincide with the anniversary of the 9/11 attack, they're now going to start another tea party bus tour to culminate exactly one year before the 2010 elections. so both elected republicans now and the republican conservative movement, the movement that

drives the party, they're trying to focus in on the next elections. 2010 is their big goal. but even before 2010, they've got their sights set on a couple of governor races that happen before then. the new jersey race in which incumbent democrat jon corzine is facing a republican challenger and the race in virginia, in which there isn't an incumbent running. it's democrat kray deeds versus a republican named bob mcdonell. and here's where the conservative movement and the republican establishment smash into each other like bunker cars without bumpers. here's where electoral chances stop being separate from the wild-eyed excesses of the conservative movement. at the values voter summit this weekend republican presidential hopeful mitt romney told the conservative crowd there he thought signs were good that the republican in the virginia governor's race, bob mcdonell, would win. romney this week also raised over $100,000 for mr. mcdonell. but mr. mcdonell has seen his poll numbers shrink recently.

ever since he brought up his master's thesis in an interview with "the washington post." mr. mcdonell did his graduate degree at televangelist pat robertson's liberty university. and after he brought up his thesis with reporters, those reporters went and read it and he repromptly reprinted the parts where it said things like government policy needs to stop with the cohabitaters, homosexuals or foreign caters. fornicators? he also said women shouldn't work outside the home, for what it's worth. after electing two democratic governors in a row, is virginia really going to turn around and elect a republican this year who went to pat robertson's university and who crusaded against fornicators? now it's getting worse for bob mcdonell and his poll numbers show it. while mitt romney was singing mr. mcdonell's praises from the main podium at the values voter summit, another session at the same event has since become famous, and you know it for proclaiming to a hushed audience

that porn makes you gay. not gay porn makes you gay, but all porn, even straight pornography, makes you gay. >> all pornography is homosexual pornography, because all pornography turns your sexual drive inwards. now think about that. and if you -- if you tell an 11-year-old boy about that, you think he's going to want to go out and get a copy of "playboy"? i'm pretty sure he'll lose interest. that's the last thing he wants. >> the man speaking there is chief of staff to senator tom coburn, and he is now and forever famous as the guy who thinks straight porn makes you gay and we should tell 11-year-olds that. activists opposed to bob mcdonell's republican campaign for governor in virginia are also now noting that the straight porn makes you gay guy is cited twice as an authority

by bob mcdonell in that famous thesis that he wrote about the evils of fornication. so now the virginia governor's race, once a shining hope for republicans trying to find their way out of the political wilderness, is going to become a race in which the republican candidate is stuck answering questions about whether he, too, believes that straight porn makes you gay. whether he still believes that fornicators must be opposed actively by the government. part of watching republicans try to return to power is watching their elected officials in action. part of it is watching the conservative movement trying to shape the republican party. and part of it is watching the conservative movement eat the republican party, eat their electoral chances over and over and over again as the things they think they're saying just to fellow conservatives in private keep making their way to a general audience. that could be full of fornicators and people who think that straight porn can do something to you but it really, really, really doesn't make you gay.

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xwxwxwxwxwxwxwxwxwxwxwxwxwxwxwx. call or click today. unlike most days since the obama administration took on the perennial issue of health care, something important, something tactile and measurable happened today. this was it -- >> all those in favor say aye. opposed, no. the ayes have it and the order is adopted. >> the state senate adopted a

law to fill the late ted kennedy's senate seat. since it passed the house last week, it's expected to land on the governor's desk tomorrow and that means by the end of this week, there's every chance that the democrats in the senate, the democrats in the united states senate, will be back up to a theoretically filibuster-proof 60-seat majority. and massachusetts won't have to spend four more months with just one senator. now the question is, of course, who's going to get that seat? joining us now is tom oliphant, former colonist for ""the boston globe"." thank you very much for coming on the show tonight. >> my pleasure, rachel. >> is it senator dukakis do you think? >> well, right now i guess you would have to say that he leads the pack by, what could i say, the margin of one rather large greek american nose. it's almost as big as mine. but also there is somebody who's been with kennedy family people for more than 40 years, paul kirk, former chairman of the

national democratic party, but we keep hearing a little more dukakis pan paul kirk and little about a surprise. >> none of the people who are potential appointees for this four-month term are going to run for the seat in january. that's sort of the part of the deal. >> that's the deal. >> but we've already seen from the folks who are going to be running in january, it looks like it may be a real fight on the democratic side as to who -- who's as liberal as kennedy was. do you think governor patrick feels he has to appoint someone into this interim term who is as reliably liberal as ted kennedy was? >> no, i don't think that will be the criterion. to the extent thehe's thinking about re-election politics, and frankly, i think he would be really stupid to think very much about it. i don't think a year from now anyone is going to remember who the interim senator was except us. but on the margins, i think he's looking for somebody who's going to be that 60th vote. and don't think there's any

question he will find such a person. on the other hand, though, no one knows whether it's mike dukakis or paul kirk or somebody else, how they will vote on these all-important amendments. wyden has a really universal public option. rockefeller has a more traditional one. olympia snowe would use a trigger. i haven't the foggiest idea how any of these front runners would vote on that and i don't think they do either. >> there is some sense that dukakis brings policy area credibility to this issue. i mean, he knows a lot about health care and he's worked on it in academic and political context for a long time, right? >> you could -- i would say without hesitation that mike dukakis probably knows more about this subject than anybody else in the body he might be about to join. now interestingly, some would say that's an argument in his favor. i think from the obama white house perspective, it worries some people a little bit because

of -- to the extent dukakis is independent, his own person, you can't always figure out where he's going to come down. my guess is, though, that this next senator is going to vote with the democrats procedurally. no filibuster. bring the bill to the floor and all of that. but on the question of amendments, it's jump ball really. but i think at the end really, i think they will take their cue from senator kennedy and vote for the best bill that they can get and not be the kind of liberal who would draw a line in the sand and walk away if he doesn't get what he wants. >> tom oliphant, former colonist for "the boston globe," thank you for your insight. thank you for being on the show tonight. it's nice to see you. >> nice to see you. okay, these here are the -- the guy rating body parts of indicted former house majority leader tom delay. a friend of mine walked into my office today while i was watching this clip on my computer. they couldn't see what i was watching. they could just see my face. and they thought from the look on my face i had been crying.

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former vice president dick cheney has recently had surgery on his back. while he is recuperating, condoleezza rice has decided to take over as resident discredited bush administration national security authority. and if that doesn't make you want to smash your forehead into a stack of bricks, we have a very important story at the end of tonight's show that's about a man smashing his forehead into stacks of bricks. kept jones reports. that's coming up. first, it's time for a few holy mackerel stories in today's news. iran's president, ahmadinejad, is expected to address the united states tomorrow in new york city. he will do so in the midst of major protests against him and his government. and unlike the protests back home in iran, there's nothing he can do about those protests here. thousands of iranians ex-pats and exiles from iran to canada are expected to protest outside the building while mr. ahmadinejad speaks within it. they will be protesting the shady presidential election in

june and the severe and violent crackdown that ensued. on thursday, protesters intend to hang a mile-long green banner across the brooklyn bridge, as if to say, if you believe ahmadinejad won the election fair and square, we've got a bridge to sell you or something along those lines. but the symbolic big deal will be the empire state building on thursday night. the empire state building lights up at the top, often in colors that celebrate holidays or anniversaries or sporting events. because green has been the sin bollic cover of the opposition in iran, opposition activists have requested that the empire state building be lit up green during ahmadinejad's visit. that request was denied. however, the fates have aligned for the opposition. the empire state building will be lit up green on thursday because, coincidentally, it's the 70th anniversary of "the wizard of oz." get it, emerald city. the fact the building will be green not for the activists but

for warner brothers has not cooled the activists' excitement about this at all. "the wall street journal" reporting today that activists plan to stand under the building and cheer when it lights up green in the evening, which should be roughly at sunset, 6:45ish on thursday, and the buildings at 34th street and fifth avenue. i'm just saying. and senator john ensign is back in the news. snort has been hard at work trying to seep back into public life after admitting this summer to an affair that then work forward him, whom he then had his parents pay off and whose teenage son mysteriously ended up on the republican party's payroll during his mother's affair with the senator. since then senator ensign has kept a very low profile. he's refused to answer most questions about the affair, the payments or anything else. so it was a surprise this week when senator ensign surfaced. he issued -- he introduced, excuse me, 30 separate amendments to the health care bill. his leaving no gallstone

unturned, getting into the nitty-gritty of law making once again, getting into the important items like this one, replace the word fee with the word tax throughout the bill. congratulations, nevada. your senator's hard at work. opening up the bill as a word document, hitting control-f, clicking the replace button. forgetting the affair, nevada, this man is obviously indispensable. and finally, former house leader tom delay has debuted on abc's "dancing with the stars." good luck. this is not his first encounter with a tv show. a couple years ago with when daytime talk show host and my former colleague jerry springer was a contestant on this show, tom delay sent out an e-mail encouraging fans of the show to back another participant, country singer sarah evans. evans was a big republican

supporter. her husband raised money for republican candidates and in his letter delay said, quote, we need to send a message to hollywood and the media that smut has no place on television. the smut on television being jerry springer dancing. ms. evans herself became famous for being the first woman ever to quits the show abruptly because of a very sudden and public divorce when it was discovered her husband was having an affair of the there's also a pornography part of the story i'm not allowed to or care to describe. now "the rachel maddow show" can present the smut-free television that tom delay promised. ♪ wild thing ♪ you make my heart sing ♪ you make everything groovy ♪ wild thing

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pur. good, clean water. forgive an indulgence for just a moment. nbc news won five emmys at the news and documentary emmy awards last night. it's a recognition of great work that i think deserves a moment of congratulations. specifically, i'd also like to shout out a friend of the show, nbc chief foreign correspondent richard engel, who won three awards, along with his producer madelyne haringer. two of them for his "nightly news" report that's were called tip of the sphere. for tip of the sphere, richard was embedded with soldiers of the viper in remote mountainous region of afghanistan anymore named the valley of death, the corn gal valley near the pakistan border. talk about life during wartime, part of richard's reporting was done on camera right in the middle of a firefight, actually providing at one point multiple simultaneous angles from that

fire fight. richard followed up with the platoon eight months later and found many new faces among the company due to the amount of casualties and injuries and sickness. it's an honor to be remotely associated with journalists like richard engel and madelyne. congratulations to the winners and here's to nbc news for investing in bringing us stories like these from the front lines. and you get to choose any car in the aisle. choose any car? you cannot be serious! okay. seriously, you choose. go national. go like a pro. diarrhea, constipation, gas, bloating. that's me! can i tell you what a difference phillips' colon health has made? it's the probiotics. the good bacteria. that gets your colon back in balance.

one of the most unpleasant surprises of the obama era so far has been the sudden loquaciousness of dick cheney. after eight years of calculated,

mostly silence as vice president, suddenly in the first few months of the administration that succeeded his, dick cheney has been everywhere, except on this show. hmm, he's everywhere except this show, talking about national security. but earlier this month the former vice president checked into the hospital for back surgery, and now while he is recuperating we're getting new, unsolicited national security advice from an even more surprising source, someone who has been effectively invisible since the election. it's former national security adviser and secretary of state condoleezza rice. >> our national security interests are very much tied up in not letting afghanistan fail again and become a safe haven for terrorists. it's that simple. if you want another terrorist attack in the united states, abandon afghanistan. >> the person who was national security adviser when 9/11 happened and for nine months before is now telling us how to avoid a terrorist attack.

>> and i ask you whether you recall the title of that pdb? >> i believe the title was "bin ladern determined to attack inside the united states." >> that's the person from whom we're supposed to take how to avoid a terrorist attack advice now. and her advice is we're supposed to just keep on keeping on into year nine of a war she helped start but never bothered to win. never bothered to win maybe because she didn't notice we hadn't won it. >> the taliban has been defeated. with the taliban eliminated and al qaeda badly damaged, we've moved now into a second stage of our war on terror. >> well taliban defeated? that was june 2002. that was seven years ago that condoleezza rice said we had defeated the taliban. so she was going to go on to say, it would be a great time to start a whole other war. well, now she's got some more advice for us on national security and foreign policy and

war national security and forein policy and war. anybody interested in anybody buying what these folks are selling now? joining us now is sam stein, political reporter for the "huffington post." mr. stein, thank you for coming on the show, nice to see you. >> nice to see you, too. thanks for having me. >> we have sort of gotten used to seeing former vice president dick cheney rubbing his hands together for more terrorist attacks. not hoping for them, but hoping to blame someone if they mapd why do you think condoleezza rice is speaking out now? >> she has been speaking a low profile and it is surprising to see her take these rhetorical steps against the obama administration. it's part of an interview she conducted last week. past administration officials feel it's their duty to defend their policies even, as you pointed out in afghanistan, the

concerns that she's talking about were largely create the by the bush administration's poll spips they could have won this war. you get to the point where you can say we told you so. i know i talked to a bunch of people who were pining for dick cheney to run for the republican nomination in 2012 and were talking about just that scenario. there's a political opportunity here. >> people are hoping for dick cheney to run in 2012? people who aren't democrats? >> exactly. interviewing republican strategists about 2012. they all talked to me about cheney and how he was perfectly positioned to run on a national security platform. largely the arguments he's been discussing we need to use military mite to keep the country safe and anything less is endangering u.s. troops. it is a relevant theme at this juncture. i think there's ample room for

room that condee rice and others are taking. >> i coualmost couldn't hear th end of your statement because of all the champagne corks going off all over the city. they're calling themselves the foreign policy initiative now instead of the project for a new american century. what are they advocating now? >> essentially the same thing. this is the outfit started by many of the intellectual officers of the iraq war. they are former bush administration officials as well as some of the people outside government like william crystal, who laid the foundation for the intervention and war in iraq. right now they're saying you need to essentially follow the advice of the generals in afghanistan or else you risk failure and life's u.s. forces. a senator appear before them today and made the argument that

if obama did not follow the advice, he would be endangering the forces that are already there. they gib rated over afghanistan. there is no problem that doesn't have a military solution. so it's not surprising hearing them advocate for more troops in afghanistan. >> during the whole bush years, that's the big exstential shame-based question that i have. in their discussions with one another. when they talk about what they'the they're advocating now, i don't mean to sound rude, but is there any seps of shame that they might have been wrong about anything that happened during the bush years or do they see them as a success? >> they see it as success. and john mccain made note of this today in his comments. he was talking about what obama needs to do in this new report.

his pivot was well, when i was in the republican primary, i had to face the tough situation myself. i advocated for the surge of forces in iraq and look, it was a huge success. so obama should do the same when it comes to afghanistan. this group of foreign policy thinkers, again, like i said, is really a machismo take on what can be done in afghanistan and their main point of contention was that obama has a vision of america sail failing and he's just trying to shepherd it along to failure. anything that happened in iraq or for that matter in the first few years in afghanistan is sort of swept under the rug. no one really considers it. >> wow. like 9/11 didn't matter, like that didn't happen on their watch and, like, the first eight years of afghanistan is nothing to tell hur current history. thanks for your reporting. thanks for joining us tonight. coming up on "countdown" important news on health care

and politics. what on earth tom delay is thinking being on that show. next on this show, kent jones introduces you to your new favorite marshal artist. sorry, bruce. stay with us. ney," tdd# 1-800-345-2550 he neglected to mention tdd# 1-800-345-2550 he also makes money when i lose money, tdd# 1-800-345-2550 withdraw money or do nothing with my money. tdd# 1-800-345-2550 tdd# 1-800-345-2550 we decide to turn in early. we just know. announcer: finding the moment that's right for you both can take some time. that's why cialis gives men with erectile dysfunction options: 36-hour cialis or cialis for daily use. cialis for daily use is a clinically proven low-dose tablet you take every day, so you can be ready anytime the moment is right.

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>> we turn now to kent jones. >> i've been accused of neglecting sri lankan martial artists on this show, but no longer. please don't do any of this on the show. none of it. none. >> fair enough. i promise. > regardless of what hardships you've faced i'm guessing you've never faced anything like this. ever had fruit chopped in half by a sword while lying on bed of nails? he has.

need someone to break bricks on your forehead. break him. 29 two-inch thick wood bars over the span of 60 seconds. ow. maybe this is a metaphor for defiance or the triumph of mind over matter. maybe the guy just -- what's the word? a kook. but then again, what are words. >> wow. >> he's the real deal. >> i can't do that. i missed up my evangelical universities. i was talking about bob mcdonald and his thesis annes the foreign kay forps and he did do that at pat robertson school, but pat robertson school is not called liberty university. that's the jerry falwell school.

pat robertson's is called regent university. thanks for watching tonight. see you again tomorrow night. "counterdown starts right now. which of these stories will you be talking about tomorrow? markup mania hits the senate finance committee. senator max baucus hits he could support a public option trigger. most republicans continue to object to just about everything. >> i find it utterly and completely appalling. >> this bill is a stunning assault on liberty. >> the stunning letter from big insurance. the big described as the sweetheart deal for insurance apparently not sweet enough for them. and in comedic perfect timing, will ferrell in "funny or die" parody the health insurance companies. >> as the health care debates heat up. >> we need to remember who the

real victims are, health insurance executives. >> meantime, the biggest health care developments happen well outside the beltway. massachusetts is a step closer to naming an immediate successor to ted kennedy's seat. the importance of getting the 60th democratic vote back in the senate for harry reid. the race debate in the health care fight. first, it was former president carter. now it's former president bill clinton weighing in. >> i believe if he were not an african-american, all of the people against him on health care were still against him, because they're all against it, too. >> health care not a big enough obstacle to tackle? president obama also hits climate change and middle east peace today. the u.s. scores a diplomatic win getting the israelis and palestinians not only in the same room but also shaking hands. >> it is past time to talk about starting negotiations. it is time to move forward. and how low will he go? tom delay dons the sequins and takes the floor on "dancing with the stars." >> left, left, left, that way. >> going left for me is absolutely outrageous. >> hammer, don't hurt him.